Beta Server Office Hours/Minutes/2014-08-21

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[2014/08/21 14:59]  Inara Breen: Hi, Whirls, Rex, Maestro
[2014/08/21 14:59]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Ave Maestro
[2014/08/21 14:59]  Rex Cronon: hi yuzuru
[2014/08/21 14:59]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Hello, Maestro.
[2014/08/21 14:59]  Rex Cronon: hi hexapoda
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Rex Cronon: hi inara
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Jenna Felton: hello all
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Hi guys
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Hello, Jenna.
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Rex Cronon: hi everybody
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Whirly Fizzle: Heya Maestro
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Hello, Caleb.
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Hexapoda: Hia April
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Ave Caleb
[2014/08/21 15:00]  April Linden: Eeeep dark
[2014/08/21 15:00]  rcdsQueChatLog: State changed.{click me to get the url}
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Silver (kerry.giha): Hellos Maestro
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Rex Cronon: hi jenna
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Rex Cronon: hi maestro
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Chrispizz Kish: oh !!! party :)
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): It's for ambience, April :)
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Caleb Linden: hiya
[2014/08/21 15:00]  Jenna Felton: sim beta party :)
[2014/08/21 15:01]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): both april and claeb seem to be missing parts.
[2014/08/21 15:01]  Chrispizz Kish: nice to meet you all
[2014/08/21 15:01]  Whirly Fizzle: Mesh?
[2014/08/21 15:01]  Margithe: kalebs upper body doesn't bake for me
[2014/08/21 15:01]  Margithe: calebs*
[2014/08/21 15:01]  Caleb Linden: ah
[2014/08/21 15:01]  Whirly Fizzle: Mesh fetch is a bit buggered for me here. Lots missing
[2014/08/21 15:02]  Caleb Linden: i just change my outfit too
[2014/08/21 15:02]  Margithe: Actually, thats been the story of my Sl in the past 2 days- bakefails
[2014/08/21 15:02]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Ok april is all there
[2014/08/21 15:02]  Pretzel ( wear ): whispers: MMMmmmm pretzels !
[2014/08/21 15:02]  Jenna Felton: ah
[2014/08/21 15:02]  Rex Cronon: nice meeting u 2 chrispizz
[2014/08/21 15:02]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): So is caleb
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Silver (kerry.giha): Hellos April :)
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Hi wolfy
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Ave simon
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Hello, Simon.
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Hexapoda: Use bright facelight around April, se do not like the darkness.
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Lindens almost outnumber us.
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Simon Linden: Hello everyone
[2014/08/21 15:03]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Hello, April. Nice to meet you.
[2014/08/21 15:03]  April Linden: Hi ya'll. :)
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Psi Merlin: Hi April
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Rex Cronon: hi april
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Inara Breen: Hi, April, Caleb, Simon!
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Caleb Linden: *waves*
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Whirly Fizzle: Hum... is that new mesh fetch thingy on this region?
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Rex Cronon: april. u came a little late. its already august:)
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Whirly Fizzle: Its not agreeing with my viewer heh
[2014/08/21 15:04]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Not this region Whirly
[2014/08/21 15:04]  April Linden: hehe I can't help it my name is a month. :)
[2014/08/21 15:05]  Whirly Fizzle: Hmm maybe its me. Gonna relog
[2014/08/21 15:05]  Caleb Linden: or the month is your name
[2014/08/21 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Let's get started... we have a pretty action-packed agenda today https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Server_Beta_User_Group#Agenda
[2014/08/21 15:05]  Silver (kerry.giha): Hehe
[2014/08/21 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): so.. first the updates
[2014/08/21 15:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): this week was pretty quiet regarding that
[2014/08/21 15:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): nothing for the main channel, but the RCs all got a hotfix update for a certain crash mode
[2014/08/21 15:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): which we can maybe discuss after it goes to the main channel (next week, probably)
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): There's another upcoming maintenance project next week though, which does have some visible changes...
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): That bad eh?
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): more crash fixes, and some bug fixes
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Margithe: Something in here is failtastic, i blackscreened and crashed
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): SVC-2262 Incorrect height value in postcard which sent from above 256m.    is one fix..
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Rex Cronon: sometimes mesh clothes crash viewers:(
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and also there's a re-fix for BUG-6466 “Numbers expressed in scientific notation and include a plus sign in the exponent are not parsed as json numbers by LSL”
[2014/08/21 15:07]  Hexapoda: Postcards?
[2014/08/21 15:08]  Zenith Subchair final p: whispers: Hi Margithe Resident! Touch me for Menu. Say /1a to Adjust.
[2014/08/21 15:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): which originally got rolled back due to BUG-6657 "Valid JSON numbers like 0e0 no longer valid after 14.06.26.291532"
[2014/08/21 15:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Yep, postcards
[2014/08/21 15:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): snapshots sent to an email address
[2014/08/21 15:08]  Hexapoda: I has missed to test that :(
[2014/08/21 15:09]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): the bug was that the postcard-sending script did a modulo 256 on all three region coordinate components to clamp them
[2014/08/21 15:09]  Duckie Dickins: I was going to ask the same thing..I have never used the postcard feature. :D
[2014/08/21 15:09]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): but while that's fine for X and Y coordinates, you can be >256m elevation :)
[2014/08/21 15:09]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): It's kinda fun to use
[2014/08/21 15:09]  Rex Cronon: it would be good if we could send postcards to flickr/instagram/twitter...
[2014/08/21 15:10]  Whirly Fizzle: You can post direct to Flickr & Twitter and failbook now
[2014/08/21 15:10]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/STORM-2040  this viewer, right Whirly?
[2014/08/21 15:10]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): er, that change
[2014/08/21 15:10]  Whirly Fizzle: Ya
[2014/08/21 15:11]  Rex Cronon: interesting
[2014/08/21 15:11]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): it redid the snapshot UI
[2014/08/21 15:11]  Whirly Fizzle: But default release has the post to flickr/twitter/failbook feature
[2014/08/21 15:11]  Whirly Fizzle: The new UI is nice
[2014/08/21 15:11]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): /me never uses that feature :)
[2014/08/21 15:12]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Okay, are there any questions about that upcoming maintenance project?
[2014/08/21 15:12]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): The next 'update' is pretty big
[2014/08/21 15:12]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 'A new texture/mesh asset fetching service is up on Aditi for testing'
[2014/08/21 15:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): as in, I wrote a lot of text for that
[2014/08/21 15:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and it's a pretty big performance improvement
[2014/08/21 15:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): April has been working on it, and we've had a chance to benchmark it in the past few days
[2014/08/21 15:14]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): basically, it changes out the backend for mesh and texture asset fetches
[2014/08/21 15:14]  Techwolf Lupindo: I want to play with that and see if I can get squid proxy to work with it.
[2014/08/21 15:14]  Whirly Fizzle: "Maximum bandwidth set to 10000kbps" Why? The server caps at 3k. Montys smokie for that says max bw on 500 btw
[2014/08/21 15:15]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): OH, that's just how I always have it.  Just in case it ever changes to a higher cap
[2014/08/21 15:15]  Techwolf Lupindo: 1TB drive and the viwer can only use 2GB of it.
[2014/08/21 15:16]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): I guess you can ignore that directive if you feel like it, Whirly
[2014/08/21 15:16]  Rex Cronon: hmm. u could run the viewer from a flash card?
[2014/08/21 15:16]  Techwolf Lupindo: er...2to 10GB depending on viwer.
[2014/08/21 15:16]  April Linden: Test either way? :)
[2014/08/21 15:16]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): anyway, the viewer currently fetches all meshes and textures through the sim
[2014/08/21 15:16]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): which gets them from the asset server
[2014/08/21 15:16]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and the sim gives the viewer a 'capability' URL, which the viewer uses for fetching
[2014/08/21 15:17]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): however, with this change to use the CDN, the sim instead gives the viewer the URL of the CDN
[2014/08/21 15:17]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and the CDN has hosts all over the world
[2014/08/21 15:17]  Silver (kerry.giha): Sounds like a modern internet way of doing it.
[2014/08/21 15:18]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Yep.. it's good for two reasons:
[2014/08/21 15:18]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 1) the sim isn't burdened with texture/mesh transfers
[2014/08/21 15:18]  Techwolf Lupindo: Don't forget to use static URL so as not to break transparnt proxies caches and CDNs.
[2014/08/21 15:18]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 2) you'll often have lower latency to the CDN than the sim, which means more speed
[2014/08/21 15:18]  Rex Cronon: cdn stands for what maestro?
[2014/08/21 15:18]  Techwolf Lupindo: Content Distrubtion Network.
[2014/08/21 15:19]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): without the typo ^ :)
[2014/08/21 15:19]  Rex Cronon: ok. thank u
[2014/08/21 15:19]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Canadaian eh?
[2014/08/21 15:19]  Caleb Linden: lol
[2014/08/21 15:19]  April Linden: That's right, Maestro. Because your client is establishing a connection to a server that's (odds are) is closer to you than our data centers, you'll get a faster response.
[2014/08/21 15:20]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): We got pretty good results in the office...
[2014/08/21 15:20]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_delivery_network
[2014/08/21 15:20]  April Linden: Yup. I was pretty impressed... and we have a decent Internet connection here. :)
[2014/08/21 15:21]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): from our office, for texture fetching, using the CDN has about double performance compared to the classic way
[2014/08/21 15:21]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Is it?
[2014/08/21 15:21]  April Linden: Yes, Yuzuru. That's what we mean by CDN. :)
[2014/08/21 15:21]  Techwolf Lupindo: April, like 100Mb/s? Like the rest of the world? ;-)
[2014/08/21 15:21]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): like, I measured 43 seconds with the CDN and 105 seconds with the usual way
[2014/08/21 15:22]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): to fully load a region with many many textures after login
[2014/08/21 15:22]  Techwolf Lupindo: I still gets connections that max out at 1.5Mb/s.
[2014/08/21 15:22]  Silver (kerry.giha): Anything to help my 1Mb/s connection at home would be very nice
[2014/08/21 15:22]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): we have those regions set up on Aditi - the agenda has the details
[2014/08/21 15:22]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Will Viewer  fetch only mesh's texture?
[2014/08/21 15:22]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): by CDN?
[2014/08/21 15:22]  Lucia Nightfire: what content types are currently being fetched?
[2014/08/21 15:23]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Ah no Yuzuru, it will fetch any texture asset
[2014/08/21 15:23]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and any mesh asset
[2014/08/21 15:23]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Good info!
[2014/08/21 15:23]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): for textures, it doesn't matter where the texture is, inworld (or if it's just in your inventory)
[2014/08/21 15:23]  April Linden: Textures and Meshes. Everything else uses the traditional pipeline.
[2014/08/21 15:23]  Silver (kerry.giha): .
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): we expect the most dramatic performance improvements to happen outside of the US
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Hexapoda: Yay!
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Lucia Nightfire: or in busy sims, heh
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): since the CDN has nodes there, while the SL sim is only in the US
[2014/08/21 15:24]  April Linden: Yes, both. :)
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Rex Cronon: u guys made your own cdn or u renting?
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): very true, Lucia
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Whirly Fizzle: Do these CDN have a tie in with Monty's HTTP pipelining viewer? As in does the region know if you're using the pipelining viewer and serve the mesh and textures differently?
[2014/08/21 15:24]  April Linden: We are using a commercial one, Rex.
[2014/08/21 15:24]  Whirly Fizzle: *CDN regions
[2014/08/21 15:25]  April Linden: Whirly: Nope. We've been testing with the mainline viewer.
[2014/08/21 15:25]  Duckie Dickins: amazon s3?
[2014/08/21 15:25]  April Linden: (And the pipelining viewer, too)
[2014/08/21 15:25]  Simon Linden: Whirly - the region only serves texture or mesh as the viewer requests them.   So if the setup points the viewer to the CDN, that's where the viewer goes
[2014/08/21 15:26]  Whirly Fizzle: ahhh okay
[2014/08/21 15:27]  Jenna Felton: can it happen that people will see mesh or avatars differently in respect of in what place of the RL world they live? I think because they use different CDN that may happen
[2014/08/21 15:27]  Rex Cronon: i guess u guys could make an app for editing our invetories using cdn:)
[2014/08/21 15:27]  Techwolf Lupindo: CDN uses dymtic DNS servers so when the client does a DNS lookup, the DNS server will return the closeest CDN server based on IP.
[2014/08/21 15:27]  Duckie Dickins: or maybe Akamai...most popular ones.
[2014/08/21 15:27]  Lucia Nightfire: I'd be weary with scripts or inventory on CDN, heh
[2014/08/21 15:27]  April Linden: Jenna: Shouldn't, no.
[2014/08/21 15:27]  Jenna Felton: ok
[2014/08/21 15:28]  Techwolf Lupindo: Every CDN server will have the same info.
[2014/08/21 15:28]  Jenna Felton: is there something implemented that verify you got the correct content?
[2014/08/21 15:28]  Techwolf Lupindo: That what distrubution mean, serving the same content from different areas.
[2014/08/21 15:28]  Jenna Felton: ok
[2014/08/21 15:28]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): The easiest way to tell if you're using the CDN is to have the viewer log show the capability URLs:    Develop -> Consoles -> Capabilities Info To Debug Console.  If you're using the CDN, the GetMesh, GetMesh2, and GetTexture URLs will all be  http://asset-cdn.aditi.lindenlab.com/ , with the current setup
[2014/08/21 15:30]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and if not, it'll give you some URL pointing at the sim host
[2014/08/21 15:30]  Rex Cronon: how do user changes to their content propagates across the cdn?
[2014/08/21 15:30]  Rex Cronon: how fast
[2014/08/21 15:30]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Well, assets can't be edited
[2014/08/21 15:30]  Techwolf Lupindo: Will the URL still have cap/aee17605-a7f0-682d-d1ab-7de8aa1b17e0 on it?
[2014/08/21 15:30]  Lucia Nightfire: those are assets
[2014/08/21 15:30]  April Linden: Rex: Changes create a new asset. There should be no difference.
[2014/08/21 15:30]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): nope, none of that Techwolf
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): literally "http://asset-cdn.aditi.lindenlab.com/"
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Techwolf Lupindo: and use port 12046?
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Techwolf Lupindo: /me grins
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Rex Cronon: so, each time i change an inventory itme from no-copy to copy a new version is made?
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Rex Cronon: item*
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Lucia Nightfire: thats inventory asset data
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): It's port 80 for now.. and will probably stay that way I guess
[2014/08/21 15:31]  Techwolf Lupindo: Getting rid of cap/aee17605-a7f0-682d-d1ab-7de8aa1b17e0 will help squid proxy.
[2014/08/21 15:32]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): that's different, Rex
[2014/08/21 15:32]  Techwolf Lupindo: /me Jumps for hoy.\
[2014/08/21 15:32]  Lucia Nightfire: not the original mesh asset or texture asset
[2014/08/21 15:32]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): so for textures and meshes, the asset is created at upload time
[2014/08/21 15:32]  Techwolf Lupindo: That mean transparent proxy install at every major ISP will cache the assests.
[2014/08/21 15:32]  April Linden: I wouldn't assume that, Techwold
[2014/08/21 15:32]  Simon Linden: That's an interesting point, Techwolf ... you might see even more caching now in the pipeline
[2014/08/21 15:33]  April Linden: Techwolf, sorry.
[2014/08/21 15:33]  Simon Linden: but the url for the same texture would be the same now between 2 login sessions, right?
[2014/08/21 15:33]  April Linden: Yup
[2014/08/21 15:34]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Rex: object assets aren't sent to the viewer, just the prim parameters of objects (which reference the texture IDs etc.)
[2014/08/21 15:34]  Techwolf Lupindo: And could use cookies if session support is needed.
[2014/08/21 15:34]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): But an object asset is created when you take something into your inventory
[2014/08/21 15:35]  April Linden: We're only talking about textures and meshes. Objects and everything else don't chane. :)
[2014/08/21 15:35]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and gets fetched by the sim from the asset server when you rez an inventory item referencing that object asset
[2014/08/21 15:35]  Rex Cronon: ok.
[2014/08/21 15:35]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and when an object is rezzed, the sim will tell you, "here's a box, with textures X, Y, Z" on it
[2014/08/21 15:35]  Techwolf Lupindo: I've allway believed that if LL would made the texture assests compatiable with the transparent caches/proxy that every major ISP uses, LL bandwitth would drop drashtelly.
[2014/08/21 15:36]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and if the viewer doesn't already have those textures downloaded, it'll ask the sim for those asset files of X, Y, and Z
[2014/08/21 15:36]  Whirly Fizzle: So if someone disables HTTP textures on a CDN region, do they fall back to the old method of fetching that texture?
[2014/08/21 15:36]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and that's where the changes come into play
[2014/08/21 15:36]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): that's right, Whirly
[2014/08/21 15:36]  Margithe: sounds like a reasonable failsafe.
[2014/08/21 15:36]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): they will no longer be touching the HTTP method, which uses the GetTexture capability
[2014/08/21 15:37]  Techwolf Lupindo: Fallback would be UDP except for meshes that will just fail.
[2014/08/21 15:37]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and UDP texture fetching is rather slow :)
[2014/08/21 15:38]  April Linden: I tried it for a test in our TextureTest region! It was so slow I got bored. o.o
[2014/08/21 15:38]  April Linden: (the UDP method)
[2014/08/21 15:38]  Techwolf Lupindo: But was more reliable due to one connection. Phaze one of the http project exposed just how crappy home routers was. :-)
[2014/08/21 15:38]  Silver (kerry.giha): hehe
[2014/08/21 15:39]  Whirly Fizzle: Testing UDP texture fetch is a good excuse to go make a coffee and snack. You won't need to hit stop on the timer till way after you came back :P
[2014/08/21 15:39]  Techwolf Lupindo: Will SSA fetches work with this CDN?
[2014/08/21 15:39]  Chrispizz Kish: with CDN way to obtain mesh and texture , is there the same ability to use memory cache on hard disk ?
[2014/08/21 15:40]  Techwolf Lupindo: Chrispizz, no change to how the viewer stores it. Just changes how fast it can get it.
[2014/08/21 15:40]  Chrispizz Kish: ok , nice
[2014/08/21 15:40]  Rex Cronon: u know. its possible to compress textures...
[2014/08/21 15:40]  Techwolf Lupindo: Textures are allready compressed.
[2014/08/21 15:40]  Rex Cronon: even more
[2014/08/21 15:41]  Techwolf Lupindo: jpeg2000
[2014/08/21 15:41]  Jenna Felton: textures are probably compressed on the upload to asset servers
[2014/08/21 15:41]  Techwolf Lupindo: Oh, ziping a zip file will compress it down even more untill you get to size of 1?
[2014/08/21 15:41]  Lucia Nightfire: too bad textures don't look like what you upload, heh
[2014/08/21 15:41]  Lucia Nightfire: esp low res textures
[2014/08/21 15:41]  Rex Cronon: there r other programs besides zip:)
[2014/08/21 15:41]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Anyway, we should probably get moving on - are there any questions about where to find it on Aditi?
[2014/08/21 15:42]  Simon Linden: lol Techwolf ... at some point they start getting larger, I think
[2014/08/21 15:42]  Techwolf Lupindo: /me girns
[2014/08/21 15:42]  Jenna Felton: i tried to zip my texture cache, the result was a file that is almost the same size and once even larter size than the texture cache. I only benefit of it by backing up the texture cache (one file instead of 16.000)
[2014/08/21 15:42]  Whirly Fizzle: Nope, says where on your doc
[2014/08/21 15:42]  Jenna Felton: larter - larger
[2014/08/21 15:43]  April Linden: There's two regions. One is a mesh stress test and one is a texture stress test.
[2014/08/21 15:43]  Techwolf Lupindo: Pet peeve of mine: rar files in bittorrents.
[2014/08/21 15:43]  April Linden: (Both are in the meeting agenda!)
[2014/08/21 15:43]  Rex Cronon: i don't use bittorrents so i have no idea what is wrong with them techwolf
[2014/08/21 15:43]  Techwolf Lupindo: Will be trying out those regines after this meeting.
[2014/08/21 15:44]  Margithe: Anything specific to look out for?
[2014/08/21 15:44]  Jenna Felton: big ageda :)
[2014/08/21 15:44]  April Linden: Good question! The biggest thing would be textures and meshes not working right. :)
[2014/08/21 15:45]  Lucia Nightfire: another question
[2014/08/21 15:45]  Rex Cronon: how do u define "not working right"?
[2014/08/21 15:45]  Lucia Nightfire: do mesh LOD's load only for the LOD setting you have in the viewer liek they do currently? or does the entire asset get downloaded
[2014/08/21 15:45]  Whirly Fizzle: Are the test regions locked down to 1 avatar limit? So results don't get messed up by other avies?
[2014/08/21 15:45]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): not loading I suppose
[2014/08/21 15:45]  April Linden: Humm. Maestro?
[2014/08/21 15:45]  April Linden: Yeah
[2014/08/21 15:45]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): they are not right now, whirly
[2014/08/21 15:46]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): but that seems like a good idea
[2014/08/21 15:46]  Whirly Fizzle: hey yep, just no one go afk there :P
[2014/08/21 15:46]  Jenna Felton: I thought the viewer downloads all the LOD levels of the mesh and just decides which to render while you are seeing at the object
[2014/08/21 15:47]  Margithe: Hmm, i also got a question.. lets say the textures and meshes in fact don't come out right, and something is up with the closest CDN region- how will this be troubleshooted, and will live chat/ ticket people know about it? How is the risk of both parties ( LL and CDN) blaming eachother for hiccups dealt with, and mitigated especially on customer side? Since now it won't be a matter of rebooting the sim .
[2014/08/21 15:47]  Lucia Nightfire: if that was teh case they'd pop right in when you raise the LOD renderfactor
[2014/08/21 15:47]  Lucia Nightfire: but they don't
[2014/08/21 15:47]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): The test regions are strictly no-build so that people don't rez extra things that would skew results
[2014/08/21 15:48]  Chrispizz Kish: what about the idea to load only the better load and compute the other low LOD by the viewer ? only 1 texture to load will cost less time
[2014/08/21 15:48]  Techwolf Lupindo: TPV new feature: Ability to select witch CDN server to download from in case default one goes down/hickups.
[2014/08/21 15:49]  arton Rotaru: Auto LOD sucks
[2014/08/21 15:49]  Margithe: Well even with the ability to select CDN, you will have people who will come and say " Your sim is busted, you got to do something" because selecting CDN will go over mosts heads.
[2014/08/21 15:49]  arton Rotaru: How many of these server locations are in europe, and where?
[2014/08/21 15:50]  Jenna Felton: Lucia, i can test it again but i beleive they did. You can also try to do this, set the LOD factor to low, than disconnect by puling the cable when the viewers should have download only low level, than before the viewer notices disconnection increase your LOD factor. As far i have seen, the viewer display the high LOD, although they should not have them
[2014/08/21 15:50]  Techwolf Lupindo: arton, that varies.
[2014/08/21 15:50]  April Linden: arton: I'm not sure where they are. I'd have to ask the engineers at the CDN.
[2014/08/21 15:50]  Jenna Felton: but i ont have viewer interesting code in the viewer
[2014/08/21 15:50]  arton Rotaru: ok
[2014/08/21 15:50]  Chrispizz Kish: blur + resize = good LOD computation
[2014/08/21 15:51]  Lucia Nightfire: I'm talking about initial render of the mesh asset at low viewer LODRenderFcator setting, then turning it up later
[2014/08/21 15:51]  Techwolf Lupindo: I don't have intesting in my viewer. I can't use it due to texture poping/blurry.
[2014/08/21 15:51]  Lucia Nightfire: if it was already rendered fully then of course dropping LOD in the viewer then back up wiould load already cached data
[2014/08/21 15:52]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Okay guys, we have two more topics and only 8 minutes
[2014/08/21 15:52]  Margithe: Lucia, i think we've been told before that we only download the LoD we are seeing... imo that seems to be the case, sometimes i get hit by high LoD when zooming in on someone and the differance is pretty noticable (blackscreen)
[2014/08/21 15:52]  Simon Linden: So I have one of those ... some of you have seen the announcement about new gaming regions in SL
[2014/08/21 15:52]  Jenna Felton: i logged in with low lod, after cleaning cache... but i will test it with intersting viewer viewer, too. :) that probably is different now
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Simon Linden: These will have limited access due to gaming regulations
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Techwolf Lupindo: Ill have to try to get in.
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Lucia Nightfire: yes, Marg, I'm just curious if we get LOD data as we need it over the CDN or teh entire mesh asset data
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Lucia Nightfire: all LOD levels
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Simon Linden: There is one up now on the main grid named "Crunchy"
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Whirly Fizzle: My alt can't get on skill game regions and I havnt been able to work out why. Whiirly can get in.
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Lucia Nightfire: hopefully current behaviour is maintained otherwise distance mesh laoding is goign to consume a crap ton of bandwidth
[2014/08/21 15:53]  Techwolf Lupindo: Got any one arm bandits on Crunchy?
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Lucia Nightfire: for data I may nto even use
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Jenna Felton: why you disclosed half USA from game gambling regions?
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Whirly Fizzle: Is https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SEC-1458 fixed on Crunchy ntw?
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Jenna Felton: hehe
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Whirly Fizzle: *btw
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Simon Linden: it's all legal issues, Jenna
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Jenna Felton: ok
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Simon Linden: yes Whirly
[2014/08/21 15:54]  Whirly Fizzle: Cools
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Simon Linden: hmm, I should go turn off scripts there so nobody sets up any games either
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Silver (kerry.giha): hehe
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): Because various groops of kleptocrats whant their share of the booty.
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Lucia Nightfire: I think its more legal "auditing" costs, heh
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Silver (kerry.giha): One arm bandits are a skill game right ;)
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Simon Linden: lol I'm not going near the "what is skilled" discussion ... I can't understand it myself
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Lucia Nightfire: no one is going near it
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Margithe: it would be neat if there was a writeup about who is eligible to play, in plain text, so one could rule out bugs vs ineligibility
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Lucia Nightfire: even the person that is supposed to be fielding the questions
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Motor Loon: takes skill to put the coins in the machine, especially if you're really drunk...
[2014/08/21 15:55]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Yes Whirly that SEC is fixed
[2014/08/21 15:56]  Rex Cronon: its weird. how can u code something u don't understand;)
[2014/08/21 15:56]  Lucia Nightfire: the FAQ does not address all teh questions and they have not been answered in weeks on teh forum that LL started
[2014/08/21 15:56]  Margithe: i mean, it would be good if people could see what the exact restrictions were for exactly who
[2014/08/21 15:56]  Simon Linden: See http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Second_Life_Skill_Gaming_Approved_Participants#Authorized_Participants for access info
[2014/08/21 15:56]  Techwolf Lupindo: I see more vpn comming into use for SL use.
[2014/08/21 15:56]  Rex Cronon: lol. that forum thread is huge. who can read it all?
[2014/08/21 15:57]  Lucia Nightfire: also see no registered gamign regions or owners or creatoers, heh
[2014/08/21 15:57]  Whirly Fizzle: Is there some way to work out why one of your avatars can't access a skill gaming region? None of the listed reasons appear to apply to my alt.
[2014/08/21 15:57]  Jenna Felton: Techwolf, that was i thinking too
[2014/08/21 15:57]  Simon Linden: We need to get a few details in there ... but if you're in those listed states, you are blocked
[2014/08/21 15:57]  Simon Linden: you also need to be 19+ and have valid payment info with LL
[2014/08/21 15:58]  Margithe: that "country" list looks very slim
[2014/08/21 15:58]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): with billing address (to verify your location I suppose)
[2014/08/21 15:58]  Jenna Felton: /me thinks so
[2014/08/21 15:58]  Whirly Fizzle: Hmmm actually I didn't fill out RL address for that alt. Thats maybe why. Ill add that and test again
[2014/08/21 15:59]  Whirly Fizzle: It has PIOF and has bought L$ though
[2014/08/21 15:59]  Lucia Nightfire: is that PIOF exploit still present if you just buy anything on mp? heh
[2014/08/21 16:00]  Whirly Fizzle: Nah, been fixed
[2014/08/21 16:00]  Lucia Nightfire: I'm sure they never went back and fixed all the acct's that exploited that too
[2014/08/21 16:00]  Margithe: technically you got to request proof of age from anyone in sweden, for skill games that pay out.
[2014/08/21 16:00]  Chrispizz Kish: when you will have free time , should you insert me in "Beta Participant" please ?
[2014/08/21 16:00]  Simon Linden: Margithe - those are _restricted_ areas in that list.  RIght now it's just those states, so outside the USA should be allowed in
[2014/08/21 16:00]  Jenna Felton: i think your IP can tell what country you are accessing from, but billing addres tells in what country you live
[2014/08/21 16:00]  Rex Cronon: u could buy anything for free on mp? i missed that
[2014/08/21 16:01]  Margithe: Hm, so if i understand it right, LL will not police it for other countries except the US?
[2014/08/21 16:01]  Lucia Nightfire: Rex, most of my store is freebies on mp, heh
[2014/08/21 16:01]  Rex Cronon: u lucy
[2014/08/21 16:01]  Rex Cronon: r lucky
[2014/08/21 16:01]  Lucia Nightfire: why?
[2014/08/21 16:01]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Right now, that list is correct, Margithe
[2014/08/21 16:01]  Margithe: ok, thank you :)
[2014/08/21 16:02]  Jenna Felton: outher countries may contact LL for disclosing their citizens i think, when the internet games are not legal there
[2014/08/21 16:02]  Simon Linden: ... with no promises about the future, of course
[2014/08/21 16:02]  Jenna Felton: (in future)
[2014/08/21 16:02]  Lucia Nightfire: so what is the last item on teh agenda?
[2014/08/21 16:02]  Simon Linden: last item was another group chat test
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Simon Linden: if we could get a few minutes of chat in "Group Chat Chat" and "Group Chat Test", that would be great
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Simon Linden: or SL Beta
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Rex Cronon: another spam session:)
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Simon Linden: the real test is to close and re-open the chat window, and watch the members lists
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): do you want us joining and leaving the chats?
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Lucia Nightfire: same as last time, heh
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Whirly Fizzle: secondlife:///app/group/19e6bef4-74bc-242c-e49f-94815cb3b494/about secondlife:///app/group/fa943583-23f5-3242-da23-52024f1e05c4/about
[2014/08/21 16:03]  Simon Linden: yes please, Kallista
[2014/08/21 16:04]  Simon Linden: These are set so the updates for members lists will be delayed and queued
[2014/08/21 16:04]  Rex Cronon: i don't think there r enough of us
[2014/08/21 16:04]  Simon Linden: Normally this wouldn't happen for smaller groups, since the benefit is less as there are fewer people entering and leaving
[2014/08/21 16:04]  Rex Cronon: u need something over 100
[2014/08/21 16:04]  Motor Loon: certainly almost instant for me to load the list
[2014/08/21 16:06]  Motor Loon: Ouch... got the first error trying to open the groupchat now
[2014/08/21 16:06]  Simon Linden: you jinxed it, Motor
[2014/08/21 16:07]  Motor Loon: yep... i broke it ;-(
[2014/08/21 16:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Fortunately we now have group ban to take care of troublemakers  >:)
[2014/08/21 16:07]  Simon Linden: ok ... I think that should be enough ... thanks!
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Psi Merlin: On a different subject - I've had a couple of reports recently where authorized group members are unable to return a non-group object.
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Phew
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Caleb Linden: phew
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): from a group-owned parcel, Psi?
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Caleb Linden: Ain't nothing gonna breack'a my stride
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Whirly Fizzle: Uh ohs... error http://i.imgur.com/JMPwmn8.png
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Motor Loon: I got two instances of "unable to start a new chat session with Second Life Beta. The session initialization is timed out." but otherwise it was superfast
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Rex Cronon: i just start to type and u guys say test is over. lol
[2014/08/21 16:08]  Psi Merlin: YEs- Magnum region 'Snark'
[2014/08/21 16:09]  Kallista Arliss (kallista.destiny): OK, next week
[2014/08/21 16:09]  Psi Merlin: "Removal of the object 'foo' from the simulator is disallowed by the permissions system."
[2014/08/21 16:09]  Chrispizz Kish: when you will have free time , should you insert me in "Beta Participant" please ? I have try to enter in group [FREE] but doesn't work
[2014/08/21 16:09]  Simon Linden: I had it not open chat once but it might have been a viewer/focus issue and not gotten my double-click
[2014/08/21 16:09]  Whirly Fizzle: Its unusual to get the initialisation errors on Aditi heh
[2014/08/21 16:09]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Hm, that's curious - do their other usual group abilities work?
[2014/08/21 16:10]  Margithe: Wonder if that was the error i got, trying to return an object i had edit rights to?
[2014/08/21 16:10]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Chrispizz: The "Second Life Beta" group?
[2014/08/21 16:10]  Psi Merlin: I haven't heard of any other problems. three memebers have seen the same thing
[2014/08/21 16:11]  Rex Cronon: is testing over?
[2014/08/21 16:11]  arton Rotaru: lol Rex
[2014/08/21 16:11]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Yes Rex
[2014/08/21 16:11]  Rex Cronon: just checking?
[2014/08/21 16:11]  Chrispizz Kish: ok , that works now
[2014/08/21 16:11]  Chrispizz Kish: I'm in , and the tag on my head
[2014/08/21 16:12]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): cool
[2014/08/21 16:12]  Simon Linden: Thanks everyone - see you next time
[2014/08/21 16:12]  Whirly Fizzle: Ty Lindens
[2014/08/21 16:12]  Rex Cronon: tc simon
[2014/08/21 16:12]  Jenna Felton: i can not remember now if i did it on main grid or beta, entering this group
[2014/08/21 16:12]  April Linden: Bye bye y'all!! :) Thanks for the testing. :)
[2014/08/21 16:12]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Thank you, Simon, Maestro and April.
[2014/08/21 16:12]  Rex Cronon: tc april
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Rex Cronon: tc all those leaving
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Margithe: byeeee
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Thank you, Caleb.
[2014/08/21 16:13]  rcdsQueChatLog: State changed.{click me to get the url}
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Thanks for coming, everybody!
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Rex Cronon: tc maestro
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Jenna Felton: thank you for meeting, Lindens and have a god weekend all )
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): and if you're curious about your latency to the CDN we mentioned earlier, you can try pinging asset-cdn.aditi.lindenlab.com
[2014/08/21 16:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): or do a traceroute to see where it is :)
[2014/08/21 16:13]  arton Rotaru: alright
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Rex Cronon: by all and have a nice day:)
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Chrispizz Kish: bye rex
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Bye
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): TTL=58
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Whirly Fizzle: ooo 33 ms
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Chrispizz Kish: llCastRay was an other point to speak about ?
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): 20ms
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Lucia Nightfire: I got stuck on kitten pics, damnit
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Motor Loon: 20ms for me nice!
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): fast!
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Whirly Fizzle: 9 33 ms 32 ms 33 ms map2.hwcdn.net [205.185.216.10]
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Psi Merlin: rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 10.304/13.017/15.013/1.982 ms
[2014/08/21 16:14]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): cool
[2014/08/21 16:15]  Lucia Nightfire: whats wrong with llCastRay() now, heh
[2014/08/21 16:15]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Maybe you can add it to the agenda ( https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Server_Beta_User_Group#Any_Other_Items ) next week?  I have to get going..