User:Benjamin Linden/Office Hours/2008-03-27

Transcript of Benjamin Linden's office hours:

[15:05]	Squirrel Wood:	Wheee!
[15:05]	McCabe Maxsted:	greetings jacek
[15:05]	Jacek Antonelli:	Woohoo, new chair for Malbers
[15:05]	Squirrel Wood:	Hello Benjamin!
[15:05]	Benjamin Linden:	hi folks!
[15:06]	McCabe Maxsted:	ahoy benjamin
[15:06]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hi Benjamin!
[15:06]	Benjamin Linden:	wow mccabe look at you
[15:06]	Malbers Linden:	There are no chairs here that I look good sitting in.
[15:06]	Jacek Antonelli rezzes as fast as she can
[15:06]	Nomad: You are in error. You are a biological unit: You are imperfect.
[15:06]	Benjamin Linden:	hey Malbers, how'd you get that chair here, this is a no-build area! :-)
[15:06]	Jacek Antonelli:	Heh heh hehh
[15:07]	McCabe Maxsted:	HAX!
[15:07]	Malbers Linden:	o, um, I, um...
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	XD
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	Magic.
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	Its magic!
[15:07]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yep! The magic of Malbers
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	pure, natural magic
[15:07]	Benjamin Linden:	light crowd today
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	Indeedy
[15:07]	Jacek Antonelli:	They're probably downloading the new RC, hehe
[15:07]	Benjamin Linden:	was the open source meeting busy?
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	Pretty much
[15:07]	McCabe Maxsted:	RC4's out already?
[15:07]	Malbers Linden:	could be that RL Spring Break is affecting our attendence?
[15:08]	Squirrel Wood:	rc3 was released just yesterday
[15:08]	Squirrel Wood:	or so
[15:08]	Jacek Antonelli:	Nah, RC3
[15:08]	McCabe Maxsted:	I love my new av XD
[15:08]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehehe
[15:08]	Squirrel Wood:	undazzled rc3 :(
[15:08]	Jacek Antonelli:	Blinky buttons
[15:09]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hey Harleen
[15:09]	Malbers Linden:	Hi Harleen
[15:09]	McCabe Maxsted:	hello biological unit harleen
[15:09]	Harleen Gretzky:	Howdy :)
[15:09]	Benjamin Linden:	so I have good news about dazzle
[15:09]	Harleen Gretzky:	Hi McCabe, neat avatar
[15:09]	Jacek Antonelli:	Woo, news
[15:09]	Squirrel Wood:	Hello, battery-dependant mechanical thing :)
[15:09]	Benjamin Linden:	it's being released in the next release!
[15:09]	Jacek Antonelli:	\o/
[15:10]	Benjamin Linden:	after 1.19.1
[15:10]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehe
[15:10]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yay
[15:10]	McCabe Maxsted:	oooh, that's awesome benjamin
[15:10]	Squirrel Wood:	Goodie!
[15:10]	Benjamin Linden:	I'm bracing myself for the feedback :-)
[15:10]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hehe. Pakka's law says 20% of the people will hate any change when it's announced
[15:10]	Squirrel Wood:	judging from the usual blog posts the majority of the minority will bitch, moan and whine about it :p
[15:10]	Benjamin Linden:	I've been working with Yukiko to get some documentation for how people can make their own skin
[15:11]	Jacek Antonelli:	Great, Ben
[15:11]	McCabe Maxsted:	awesome
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	it will still be an annoying manual process to switch skins in the near term
[15:11]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hey Nock
[15:11]	McCabe Maxsted:	skin switching will be part of the release too then? *hopeful eyes*
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	but we do have a team working on the ability to switch skins, but that's coming later
[15:11]	Malbers Linden:	Hi Nock
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	not too much later though
[15:11]	Harleen Gretzky:	I tried to make a classic colr scheme colrbase.xml file but it doesn't seem lik everything maps back the same
[15:11]	Nock Forager:	Hi!
[15:12]	McCabe Maxsted nods. That's fantastic
[15:12]	Jacek Antonelli:	Great. Make sure to say that in the announcement -- that skin switching in coming soon
[15:12]	McCabe Maxsted:	ahoy nock
[15:12]	Benjamin Linden:	the colors should work the same, Harleen
[15:12]	Benjamin Linden:	oh I am, Jacek :-)
[15:12]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe, good
[15:12]	Benjamin Linden:	which colors did you have problems with Harleen?
[15:12]	Harleen Gretzky:	Like checkboxes take on the color of buttons in Dazzle
[15:12]	Squirrel Wood:	Mayhaps one Linden could provide us with a "skin" changer tool ?
[15:13]	Jacek Antonelli:	I'm sure the community will come up with changers shortly after it's released
[15:13]	Nock Forager:	(Newbie of UI, learing it -> Nock :)
[15:14]	McCabe Maxsted nods
[15:14]	Jacek Antonelli:	Probably also a "classic" skin
[15:14]	Benjamin Linden:	ah, Harleen, the colors file doesn't change the art itself
[15:14]	Roof Doors:	Malbers Linden is at the door.
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	you will also need to get the old art file from a previous release
[15:15]	Harleen Gretzky:	ahh
[15:15]	McCabe Maxsted:	will there be a skinning forum, or a skinning section on the website?
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, that's my hope, McCabe, is to have some documentation on the wiki
[15:15]	Jacek Antonelli:	great
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	Yukiko is working on a draft
[15:16]	Harleen Gretzky:	http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Skinning
[15:16]	Jacek Antonelli:	And there it is :D
[15:16]	McCabe Maxsted:	documentation's great, but we need some place where we can download other people's skins and talk about skinning. I'm just thinking of how easy it is to find winamp skins on their website
[15:17]	Jacek Antonelli:	Oh, that's some older stuff
[15:17]	Malbers Linden:	Would a Skin trading post work better in SL or RL?
[15:17]	Malbers Linden:	RL == some web site
[15:19]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hrmmm. It would be cool to have the ability to trade/sell skins in SL itself...
[15:19]	McCabe Maxsted:	oooh an old western style trading post inworld you could visit inworld would be fun. RL would prolly be easier for me, though
[15:19]	Benjamin Linden:	McCabe, do you think we could just use the wiki for that?
[15:19]	McCabe Maxsted:	no, I don't think so
[15:19]	Benjamin Linden:	It would be cool to do it in-world
[15:19]	Jacek Antonelli:	but RL downloading would be easier to program at first
[15:19]	Benjamin Linden:	The Windlight team has been talking about making sky settings tradeable assets in SL
[15:19]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yes :D
[15:19]	Benjamin Linden:	McCabe, why won't the wiki work?
[15:20]	McCabe Maxsted:	we need a place where we can discuss skinning problems, share stuff in progress, talk about various skinning problems and ask advice, and receive feedback on our skins
[15:20]	Jacek Antonelli nods
[15:20]	Jacek Antonelli:	Almost like... a forum :D
[15:20]	Jacek Antonelli grins
[15:20]	Squirrel Wood:	forum might be the best place at the beginning
[15:21]	McCabe Maxsted:	*nods* a forum would be great, hehe. A skinning section on the SL website where people can dl and rate skins would be a good extension of that
[15:21]	Jacek Antonelli:	Ooh, yeah. Like how blog engines have pages that show thumbnails and download links for skins
[15:22]	Jacek Antonelli:	e.g. http://themes.wordpress.net/
[15:24]	Jacek Antonelli:	One of the.. er, "challenges" of trading skins in-world would be uploading and downloading all the different bits and pieces -- images
[15:24]	Benjamin Linden:	are the forums currently shut down?
[15:24]	Benjamin Linden:	would some combination of forums and the wiki work?
[15:24]	Benjamin Linden:	I doubt we'll get much web developer support to set up a special page on secondlife.com for skin trading
[15:24]	Jacek Antonelli:	Wiki is great for documentation, forums are good for people discussing and so on
[15:25]	McCabe Maxsted:	yes, agreed
[15:25]	Squirrel Wood:	I guess discussion threads with screenshots and links to files may have to do in the beginning
[15:25]	Jacek Antonelli:	yep, forum threads would be an acceptable way to share skins
[15:25]	McCabe Maxsted:	also, if we just leave it to the forums, what about people who can't access them? how will they get their skins?
[15:26]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hm
[15:26]	Jacek Antonelli:	Who can't access the forums? *doesn't know*
[15:26]	McCabe Maxsted:	non verified accounts
[15:26]	Squirrel Wood:	That's why I think that anyone should at least get read access to the forums
[15:27]	Squirrel Wood:	because, yes, nonverified accounts or rather nonpaying accounts cannot access the forums *at all*
[15:27]	Jacek Antonelli:	Wow o_O
[15:27]	McCabe Maxsted:	yeah, heh
[15:27]	Jacek Antonelli:	Not even read-only? O_o
[15:27]	Squirrel Wood:	nope
[15:27]	Benjamin Linden:	really, I didn't know that
[15:27]	Jacek Antonelli boggles
[15:28]	Squirrel Wood:	at least they can access the support pages now without having to log in :)
[15:28]	Jacek Antonelli:	That's good
[15:29]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, that was a big step forward
[15:29]	Jacek Antonelli:	Still, an official forum would be a good start. Eventually there will be third-party skinning sites, I'd guess
[15:30]	Benjamin Linden:	so, in a few weeks we'll have dazzle and windlight together :-)
[15:30]	McCabe Maxsted:	yeah, some will pop up. It seems odd that the web development team wouldn't support something like that though
[15:30]	Benjamin Linden:	what should we work on next? :-)
[15:30]	Jacek Antonelli:	woohoo, Dazzle and Windlight
[15:30]	McCabe Maxsted:	w00t
[15:30]	McCabe Maxsted:	hmm
[15:30]	Jacek Antonelli:	Picks/Favorites :D
[15:30]	Jacek Antonelli:	Favorite landmarks, favorite people, favorite pictures...
[15:30]	Jacek Antonelli:	Share with friends :D
[15:30]	Benjamin Linden:	haha, I guess I sort of gave that one away :-)
[15:31]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehe just a bit :)
[15:31]	McCabe Maxsted:	plus it's in the survey
[15:31]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yeah, there were a few "subtle" hints ;)
[15:31]	Benjamin Linden:	which survey, McCabe?
[15:31]	Squirrel Wood:	What is there for you to work on? I'm sure you have a bowl full of paper slips with ideas written on them that you could use ?
[15:32]	Squirrel Wood:	just draw three paper slips and see what they tell you :)
[15:32]	McCabe Maxsted:	oh the user survey I was sent a few days ago. It had a couple of questions about it and I thought, "Dazzle's done, bet Benjamin's going to be working on the picks now"
[15:32]	Benjamin Linden:	a lot of our focus right now is on new users, and it can be tricky to get input on those ideas, since none of us qualify as the target audience :-)
[15:33]	Jacek Antonelli:	First slip drawn from the bowl says... "You will meet a new person today. Your lucky numbers are 3, 7, 14, and 21"
[15:33]	McCabe Maxsted:	are there any specific areas of feedback you're looking for?
[15:33]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehe
[15:33]	Squirrel Wood:	venture to newbie island anonymously and ask around what the new people would like to know/see/do ?
[15:33]	Malbers Linden:	How many of you played a lot of FPShooters before SL?
[15:34]	Jacek Antonelli:	Oh, another possible project -- clean up and organize the menu at the top!
[15:34]	Squirrel Wood still plays fps shooters.
[15:34]	McCabe Maxsted:	oh, tons
[15:34]	McCabe Maxsted:	from the original quake on
[15:34]	Squirrel Wood:	doom, doom2, hexen, and up to the latest good ones :)
[15:34]	Jacek Antonelli:	I've played a fair share of FPS games. Not so recently, though
[15:35]	Nock Forager:	not many hours palyed -> Nock.
[15:35]	Jacek Antonelli:	I guess I played the new Metroid Prime, that's a shooter, hehe
[15:35]	Squirrel Wood:	team fortress 2 ^^
[15:35]	Malbers Linden:	But it is fair to say that many of you are gamers.
[15:35]	Squirrel Wood:	Aye
[15:35]	Jacek Antonelli:	yep, Malbers
[15:35]	McCabe Maxsted:	yarr
[15:35]	McCabe Maxsted beeps in agreement
[15:35]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:35]	Malbers Linden:	I think a lot of our assumptions are that residents will understand gamer metaphors
[15:36]	Squirrel Wood:	thou shalt not beep, mechanical thing. That drains your battery even faster :p
[15:36]	Malbers Linden:	that could be trouble if we want to attract a broader range of residents
[15:36]	Benjamin Linden:	haha Jacek, did Malbers tell you about the work we're doing to clean up the menus?
[15:36]	Jacek Antonelli:	No, he didn't!
[15:36]	Malbers Linden:	No, I did not lead the witness
[15:36]	Benjamin Linden:	well, that's on our radar!
[15:36]	Jacek Antonelli stares at Malbers with grazy eyes
[15:36]	Jacek Antonelli:	*crazy
[15:36]	Benjamin Linden:	lol
[15:36]	McCabe Maxsted:	haha
[15:36]	Malbers Linden:	yeah, I'm working on a menu reorganization
[15:36]	McCabe Maxsted cheers
[15:36]	Jacek Antonelli:	That's very good to hear
[15:36]	Jacek Antonelli:	\o/
[15:37]	Squirrel Wood:	Provide different views/instruction manuals on SL which look at SL from different points of view?
[15:37]	Jacek Antonelli:	Oh, was one of your team responsible for the Debug -> Advanced menu rename? *gives thumbs up*
[15:37]	Squirrel Wood:	one for gamers, one for the casual gamer, one for business people, one for computer newbies, ...
[15:37]	Jacek Antonelli waves to Jurin :)
[15:37]	McCabe Maxsted:	malbers, what aspects of SL would you consider to be heavily relying on gaming metaphors?
[15:38]	Squirrel Wood:	I am still missing the "Give Squirrel Acorns" menu option :p
[15:38]	Nock Forager:	different menu for each person is little bad dream for Mentoring newbies, hehe.
[15:38]	Malbers Linden:	Interesting idea, squirrel
[15:38]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehehe
[15:38]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, we prompted the change to the debug menus
[15:38]	Malbers Linden:	McCabe, a lot of the movement controls (WASD, flying, notions of camera) are gamer-ish notions.
[15:38]	Squirrel Wood:	business people have different interests and expectations on SL than gamers
[15:38]	Jacek Antonelli:	lol Squirrel
[15:38]	Malbers Linden:	to be good a lot of games, you have to master these
[15:39]	Jacek Antonelli:	True, true.
[15:39]	Benjamin Linden:	speaking of games, I checked out EVE last night
[15:39]	Benjamin Linden:	talk about small fonts!!
[15:39]	Jacek Antonelli:	Oh -- there was one really good comment someone made on Twitter the other day
[15:39]	McCabe Maxsted nudges for the environment editor shortcut back sneakily
[15:39]	Squirrel Wood:	McCabe, the ctrl-a-t-e one ?
[15:39]	Jacek Antonelli:	That there should be an easier way to walk around to things, turn to face people, and so on
[15:39]	Malbers Linden:	I heard Eve had supertiny fonts...
[15:39]	Squirrel Wood:	err.. ctrl-alt-e
[15:40]	McCabe Maxsted nods
[15:40]	Squirrel Wood:	No.
[15:40]	Malbers Linden:	Ah, Jacek, easier controls for "social niceties"
[15:40]	Squirrel Wood:	ctrl-alt-e is used to type the € symbol on german keyboards for example
[15:40]	McCabe Maxsted:	I was really shocked to learn we can take baby steps
[15:40]	Jacek Antonelli:	He said that... I think maybe it was There, or Kaneva, or one of the others, that had a little button above people's heads, and when you clicked it, it had options for "move to", "hug", "turn to" etc.
[15:40]	McCabe Maxsted:	I had no idea until someone told me how
[15:40]	Squirrel Wood:	remappable shortcuts and keys would be a BLAST
[15:41]	Jacek Antonelli:	Oh, yes!
[15:41]	Squirrel Wood:	more queryable keys in LSL as well
[15:41]	Jacek Antonelli:	yes yes yes
[15:41]	Jacek Antonelli:	A thousand times yes
[15:41]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehe reaching for the stars
[15:41]	Malbers Linden:	Optimizing the builder experience is a whole different huge task
[15:41]	Jacek Antonelli:	aye
[15:42]	Jacek Antonelli wants to tackle that. And pound it into dust. Candy dust! Yum.
[15:42]	Malbers Linden:	do you think it is better to do better inworld tools or make beeter ways to work in RL?
[15:42]	Malbers Linden:	(wow, too many "better"s)
[15:42]	Benjamin Linden:	what's the difference Malbers?
[15:42]	McCabe Maxsted:	for building?
[15:42]	Benjamin Linden:	hi Chance
[15:42]	Chance Abattoir:	Hi, there.
[15:43]	Malbers Linden:	Should we work more with external tools vendors for LSL support, for example.
[15:43]	Benjamin Linden:	oh hi Jurin, I didn't even see you sneak in
[15:43]	Jurin Juran:	would be good to allow imports
[15:43]	Malbers Linden:	Hey Chance.
[15:43]	Jacek Antonelli:	I think the focus should be on inworld tools. But it would be great if there was a better _support_ for external tools. Like a format for exporting and importing prims, or a way to reload a script from disk
[15:43]	Chance Abattoir:	She's a sneaker like that.
[15:43]	Jurin Juran:	yeah, i'm sneaky like that :0
[15:43]	Chance Abattoir:	Hi, Malbers.
[15:43]	Squirrel Wood:	upload of .txt files...
[15:43]	Benjamin Linden:	all these floaty avatars
[15:43]	Squirrel Wood:	into notecards...
[15:43]	McCabe Maxsted:	agreed, agreed, agreed
[15:43]	Squirrel Wood:	copy/paste can be tedious
[15:43]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yes, upload text files into notecards. Or .lsl files into scripts
[15:44]	Jacek Antonelli:	(Hopefully for free, no L$10 fee ;) )
[15:44]	McCabe Maxsted:	and save them back to disk in turn
[15:44]	Jacek Antonelli:	Indeed
[15:44]	Jacek Antonelli:	Especially if the scripts "remembered" where they were loaded from disk, so you could "save" it in SL, edit it externally with SL closed, then later log in and "reload from disk"
[15:45]	Malbers Linden:	Do any of you heavily use 3D rendering tools in RL?
[15:45]	Squirrel Wood:	hardly ever
[15:45]	Jacek Antonelli:	Although it wouldn't be too bad if you had to choose where to save/load from each time
[15:45]	McCabe Maxsted:	someone has a patch to do something similar to this in the JIRA right now, it's worth looking into
[15:45]	McCabe Maxsted:	no, I don't
[15:45]	Jacek Antonelli:	I'm trained as a computer animator. I used to do a lot of heavy 3D stuff. I still use Blender for sculpties and animations
[15:46]	McCabe Maxsted:	I found SL's far more intuitive to using RL tools, at least for me
[15:46]	Jurin Juran:	I know alot of people using Maya, Mudbox, etc
[15:46]	McCabe Maxsted:	when I first opened blender I tried to find the camera controls, hehe
[15:46]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yes, I haven't seen any external tools that match the ease-of-use of the in-world ones
[15:46]	McCabe Maxsted:	SL's the first place I've encountered 3D building
[15:46]	Benjamin Linden:	interesting Jacek
[15:46]	Jacek Antonelli:	Heh, Blender's user interface is.... complicated
[15:46]	Benjamin Linden:	what about Sketchup?
[15:47]	Nock Forager:	I sometime try to copy objects with SHIFT , at PowerPoint...
[15:47]	Jacek Antonelli:	I've heard Sketchup is comparable to SL in that way, but I haven't had the opportunity to use it myself
[15:47]	Chance Abattoir:	Just learned Sketchup a week ago.
[15:47]	Chance Abattoir:	Sketchup seems to create via planes though
[15:47]	Benjamin Linden:	right
[15:48]	Benjamin Linden:	it's not quite the same thing
[15:48]	Chance Abattoir:	Which would make bounding boxes a problem
[15:49]	Jacek Antonelli:	As far as external tools go -- if there was better support for importing and exporting prims, more tools would start popping up
[15:49]	Jacek Antonelli:	Right now, the only real tools for that are LSL-based, and a bit of a kludge to use
[15:49]	McCabe Maxsted:	my biggest gripe about the building tools inworld is the space they takeup at times. I'd like to be able to hide portions then make them appear via mouseover, or some other system where I don't have to keep clicking the more less button
[15:50]	Malbers Linden:	Jacek, do you think this is mostly for prims/building or also for LSL/scripting?
[15:50]	Jacek Antonelli:	Both, Malbers. I know a lot of scripters who would love to have loading from disk. And they'd kill for the ability to check LSL script in and out of version control repositories from directly in SL
[15:51]	Malbers Linden:	Interesting.
[15:51]	Benjamin Linden:	you guys need a VS plug-in :-)
[15:52]	Chance Abattoir:	I'd love to load scripts in and out to lsleditor.
[15:52]	Jacek Antonelli:	Pretty much, no serious professional scripter writes scripts (of any significant length) in SL's editor -- it's all written externally, version controlled, and copy+pasted into LSL for testing
[15:52]	Chance Abattoir:	Yep.
[15:52]	McCabe Maxsted nods
[15:52]	Benjamin Linden:	Squirrel, I liked your earlier suggestion of hanging out on Help island and talking to newbies
[15:53]	Benjamin Linden:	how do you guys find out about events to go to in-world, places to hang out, etc?
[15:53]	Chance Abattoir:	Jurin.
[15:53]	Jurin Juran:	lol
[15:53]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hehe, yep. Word of mouth, mostly.
[15:53]	Chance Abattoir:	Hehe.
[15:53]	McCabe Maxsted:	I join groups for events, and use search or blogs to find places
[15:54]	Benjamin Linden:	so Jurin knows where all the hotspots are?
[15:54]	Jacek Antonelli:	Twitter is good for that. "Going to concert in SL, IM me inworld for a TP" is a common occurance there
[15:54]	Chance Abattoir:	Entirely word of mouth for me. Or twitter.
[15:54]	McCabe Maxsted:	http://npirl.blogspot.com/ is a fav
[15:54]	Squirrel Wood:	word of mouth, group IMs, group notices, ..
[15:54]	Chance Abattoir:	I don't read NPIRL, I just ask bettina what there is to see.
[15:54]	Chance Abattoir:	XD
[15:54]	McCabe Maxsted:	haha
[15:55]	Chance Abattoir:	She likes it, you should all do it.
[15:55]	Malbers Linden:	of course, there's a bootstrapping issue here
[15:55]	McCabe Maxsted:	okay from now on I'll just ask you or her hten
[15:55]	Malbers Linden:	gotta know people to find people
[15:55]	Jurin Juran:	i get tons of notecards and im's with invites announcements
[15:55]	Malbers Linden:	gotta be in groups to find events
[15:55]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:55]	McCabe Maxsted:	it's very hard to find these sort of things when you first join
[15:55]	McCabe Maxsted:	a lot of the stuff i do inworld is the result of just being here for a while
[15:55]	Jacek Antonelli:	yeah. The more friends you have, the more likely one of them will tell you about an event going no
[15:56]	Jurin Juran:	true
[15:56]	Jacek Antonelli:	When you're new, you don't have the contacts built up
[15:56]	Squirrel Wood:	ad friends....
[15:56]	Benjamin Linden:	just like the real world :-)
[15:56]	Jacek Antonelli:	indeed!
[15:56]	Benjamin Linden:	interesting that so many of you use twitter
[15:56]	McCabe Maxsted:	or any mother's house to go do laundry at ;)
[15:56]	Jurin Juran:	the things to do group is good for newbies
[15:56]	Squirrel Wood:	I would like to see names in my friend list in a different color when they have not been on SL for 3 months plus
[15:56]	Malbers Linden:	yeah, but it is hard to figure out how to help newbies get that critical mass quickly without overwhelming them
[15:56]	Benjamin Linden:	would you like to see some sort of SL-twitter integration
[15:56]	Benjamin Linden:	or more twitter-like features built-in to SL?
[15:56]	Jacek Antonelli:	Oooh
[15:56]	Malbers Linden:	Ooo, interesting idea!
[15:56]	Squirrel Wood:	makes it easier to sort them out
[15:57]	Jurin Juran:	like the metahud thing?
[15:57]	Nock Forager:	:)
[15:57]	Jacek Antonelli:	There are scripted HUDs that interface with Twitter
[15:57]	Jurin Juran:	ywa
[15:57]	Benjamin Linden:	is that what metahud does?
[15:57]	Jurin Juran:	yes
[15:57]	Jacek Antonelli:	It might be neat to have something similar in SL for your friends? But maybe that would be redundant, when we already have twitter
[15:58]	Jurin Juran:	and also lets you landmarks, follow people, read their rec's etc
[15:58]	McCabe Maxsted:	it would be nice to have something like twitter that's just SL focused though
[15:58]	Jacek Antonelli:	ooh
[15:58]	Jacek Antonelli:	yeah
[15:58]	Benjamin Linden:	rec's is recommendations?
[15:58]	Jurin Juran:	yes
[15:58]	Benjamin Linden:	k
[15:58]	Nock Forager:	I use wassr.com too. it can handle slurl, photo with landmarks.
[15:58]	Jacek Antonelli:	One very important thing there would be -- accessing (at least reading) it from outside SL. Web page, really
[15:59]	Jacek Antonelli:	One of the key features of Twitter is how convenient it is. Web, cell phone, desktop clients -- there are lots of ways to get to it
[15:59]	Jurin Juran:	yes twitter is awesome
[15:59]	Squirrel Wood:	McCabe.... Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity. ^^
[15:59]	Jacek Antonelli:	Logging into SL just to see what's up with your friends would be inconvenient
[15:59]	Nomad: Nonsequiter. Your facts are uncoordinated.
[15:59]	Jurin Juran gave you metaHUD (wear me) 5.0.
[15:59]	Jacek Antonelli:	lol
[15:59]	metaHUD: metaHUD Initialization Successful
[15:59]	metaHUD: Start Your Search Any Time, Use Channel 8 ( For example type in: '/8 FUN' )
[15:59]	metaHUD: Public Timeline
[15:59]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks Jurin
[15:59]	Chance Abattoir:	heh
[16:00]	Jacek Antonelli follows @SecondLife on Twitter to get blog updates right in her feed ^_^ so handy!
[16:00]	Benjamin Linden:	I just found out about b-places recently
[16:00]	McCabe Maxsted:	you're on /b/?
[16:01]	McCabe Maxsted:	sorry, my first thought went to 4chan *is shamed*
[16:01]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[16:01]	Squirrel Wood:	/b/? sucks. \d\ is MUCH cooler :p
[16:01]	Jacek Antonelli:	lol
[16:01]	Chance Abattoir:	/i/ is the coolest
[16:01]	Chance Abattoir:	But I didn't say that.
[16:02]	Benjamin Linden:	what are you guys talking about? lol
[16:02]	Jacek Antonelli:	Aww, 4pm already?
[16:02]	Squirrel Wood:	Yikes! Where did the time run off to?
[16:02]	McCabe Maxsted:	we really need a mailing list!
[16:02]	Benjamin Linden:	yep, looks like we're out of time. I'd like to continue this discussion of third-party tools you use
[16:03]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yes. User Experience mailing list please :D
[16:03]	Chance Abattoir:	A group of us social media and VW enthusiasts have started using Chatterous which is a real-time chat with limited archival functionality, can be RSSed, and you can access via gtalk or web. I'll post the password to our room in a sec.
[16:03]	Benjamin Linden:	McCabe, we talked about creating an in-world group. a mailing list is a good idea too
[16:03]	Chance Abattoir:	http://www.chatterous.com/landing/slers/ and password virtual
[16:03]	McCabe Maxsted:	I'd prefer a mailing list, honestly. Longer comments and discussions
[16:03]	Jacek Antonelli:	In-world group has a problem -- no one has the free slot, lol
[16:03]	Jurin Juran:	yeah, my alts and I are too grouped out
[16:03]	McCabe Maxsted:	and that too, hehe
[16:03]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yes, mailing list is best
[16:04]	Squirrel Wood:	ingame groups... yes. no slots and large groups like to fail at group chat sessions
[16:04]	Squirrel Wood:	as seen with AW Groupies
[16:04]	McCabe Maxsted:	plus I can go on a random off on one of my tangents without feeling bad
[16:04]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yeah, and you have to be online at the same time to participate in group chats
[16:05]	McCabe Maxsted tipes gud
[16:05]	Benjamin Linden:	right, I wasn't thinking the group would replace a mailing list
[16:05]	Benjamin Linden:	just supplement
[16:05]	Benjamin Linden:	ok folks gotta run
[16:05]	McCabe Maxsted:	well, group IM hasn't worked for me in ages
[16:05]	Jacek Antonelli:	Would be nice for reminders and stuff
[16:05]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks for your comments today
[16:05]	McCabe Maxsted:	thanks for your time benjamin
[16:05]	Jacek Antonelli:	Take care Ben and Malbers!
[16:05]	Malbers Linden:	Thanks all. Great ideas as always.
[16:05]	McCabe Maxsted:	take care you two
[16:05]	Nock Forager:	thanks for meeting.
[16:05]	Benjamin Linden:	see you next week!
[16:05]	Squirrel Wood:	Have a great day, yes!