User:Enkidu Linden/Office Hours/2010-06-10

List of Attendees

Transcript

Morgaine Dinova: Wooohooo!!!!
Enkidu Linden: hey there
Morgaine Dinova: Hiya Enki --- glad you're still with us :P
Your object 'Object' has been returned to your inventory lost and found folder by you from parcel 'Which Land' at Beaumont 148, 45.
Enkidu Linden: thanks!
Enkidu Linden: i am also glad!
Enkidu Linden: well, maybe not glad
Enkidu Linden: half-relieved?
Enkidu Linden: anyway.. i see i left my shared media attempt sitting here
Enkidu Linden: how are you all?
Morgaine Dinova: Well, dunno what to think. But as long as there are tech Lindens still doing OHs, then at least there's a focus for AW Groupies :-)
Morgaine Dinova: Awww Enki, and I was so enjoying the plywood ...
Morgaine Dinova: Hi lone :-)
Enkidu Linden: hey there's more where that came from
lonetorus Habilis: heyhey
Morgaine Dinova: Haha
lonetorus Habilis: so sl is to become the new farmville? XD
Enkidu Linden: i hope not!
lonetorus Habilis: well, thats the public fear currently
lonetorus Habilis: we are in a information vacuum
Morgaine Dinova: Do you know anything about WebGL, Enki? Seeing as browser-based UI was part of the announcement
Enkidu Linden: i know a guy at zynga and i'm pretty sure i'd not like linden lab becoming zynga
Attica Bekkers: it better not i do fville with my 14 yo untilhe grows out of it
Enkidu Linden: i know a little bit about webgl but i'm not a gl dev so.....
lonetorus Habilis: so sl on a web page will be an additional way to access sl, hopefully
Enkidu Linden: i've always thought that would be a good thing
lonetorus Habilis: most likely with the sl in a browser thing IBM made?
Attica Bekkers: willit be like an interface to chat from work with folks inworld
Morgaine Dinova: I think the opposite. All the hassle and flakiness and restrictions and bloat of web browsers, with none of the benefits of dedicated apps.
Enkidu Linden: i have no idea what it will look like, support, do, require, etc
lonetorus Habilis: well, running a dumbed down v2 inside a browser window should not be so bad
lonetorus Habilis: for the facebook crwd that is
lonetorus Habilis: enkidu, of course not, but we can speculate
lonetorus Habilis: :)
Enkidu Linden: then let's speculate!
Enkidu Linden: as long as you know i'm only speculating as well, it's party time
Attica Bekkers: parenting has made me shameless about things like fb:P Only problem is none of my friends will join
Morgaine Dinova: lone: agreed, but that's the only place for a browser-based interface I think. It would have to be so dumbed down that you couldn't do much beyond look and chat and listen to music.
lonetorus Habilis: morg, and buy stuff for your av ;)
lonetorus Habilis: seems fine enough for the facebook crowd
Morgaine Dinova: True
lonetorus Habilis: some of them will want to do more of course
lonetorus Habilis: and they could then switch to stand alone client
Enkidu Linden: i'm reminded of google docs
Enkidu Linden: vs ms office
Morgaine Dinova: Well that's a possibility. But it's not a future that's easy to square with mass firing of techs.
Robin CorneliusRobin Cornelius curses the NDA
Attica Bekkers: thefb crowd is very intolerant of some things, games lose masses of people if they put a step wrong, watch mafia wars die
lonetorus Habilis: morg, well, they have also hired many new ppl
Morgaine Dinova: It will take massive development effort to get something like that written. M's not gonna program it himself in Excel.
lonetorus Habilis: well, use the ibm code?
lonetorus Habilis: or the 3Di cleient
lonetorus Habilis: client
lonetorus Habilis: http://3di-rei.org/
lonetorus Habilis: but if the goal is to remove the "install some browser plugin" then there will be a need for massive rewrite of a client
lonetorus Habilis: something i belive will fail badly
Morgaine Dinova: Wanting an FB-like future squarely well with LL abandoning interop, sadly.
Morgaine Dinova: squares*
lonetorus Habilis: if they want to get anywhere near the functionality of current client
lonetorus Habilis: yeah, but the altrustic large vw interop goals have been exchanged for short term money grabs
Morgaine Dinova: There's no free lunch in the browser. If they rewrite the client in WebGL, there will STILL be a massive download of client code (Javascript), and it will happen on every single login.
lonetorus Habilis: morg, indeed, also means massive amounts of new code i would think
Enkidu Linden: i think it would be more interesting if we didn't design a web client, but designed everything such a client might need to operte
Enkidu Linden: and i wonder how far away from that we are today
Robin Cornelius: not that far at all
Morgaine Dinova: If you mean an interop protocol ... about a million miles away, Enki
Attica Bekkers: but sl could get zynga like addiction and following really easy
Attica Bekkers: byintroducing medals
Robin Cornelius: reward points for bug fixing ;-p
Enkidu Linden: hey dragon!
Robin Cornelius: your next medal is for resolving 250 jira reports
Attica Bekkers: ts your 500th teleport hers the medal of x and graphic goes on up your avatars medal site whichis optionally able to be made public
Attica Bekkers: the old approval system without the chance for a negative review..
Attica Bekkers: it doesnt need muchtech to get fb-ey
lonetorus Habilis: lol
Enkidu Linden: would implementing such a rewards system require linden help?
Attica Bekkers: robinyes
Attica Bekkers: thered defntielyhave tobe ajira ward
Attica Bekkers: one for for your first jira
Attica Bekkers: one for your fiftieth
lonetorus Habilis: dont forget medals per X amount of lindens spent
lonetorus Habilis: XD
Attica Bekkers: somepoor linden would have to ok those, to save it from spam
Attica Bekkers: ohyes
Attica Bekkers: those ar ein every fb game
Attica Bekkers: plus experience points
Attica Bekkers: make your own clothes.. 200 xp
Morgaine Dinova: Robin, what did you mean by "not that far at all" ?
Attica Bekkers: so long as itwas opt in and hideable people do love brownie points
Robin Cornelius: i was not refering to interop, but rather the peices coming together to make a web type client
Attica Bekkers: i want an ward for 6000th texture upload
Enkidu Linden: what sort of pieces?
Robin Cornelius: i could spell it out but i would be sued
lonetorus Habilis: or medals for number of sims visited
Morgaine Dinova: Robin: yeah, but how are they coming together? There is no Javascript/WebGL client in the works AFAWK, and turning the current renderer into a plugin is apparently off the cards because they publicly said "no download".
Robin Cornelius: yep thats correct
Robin Cornelius: i have to be as vague as a linden about this, sorry
Morgaine Dinova: Well your choice to take NDA. But it sucks, and you know it.
Enkidu Linden: aw
lonetorus Habilis: well, "no download" could have a different meaning to m than it has to you morg
Morgaine Dinova: lone: you mean server-side rendering?
Robin Cornelius: Morgain, sorry i've got bills to pay ;-(
lonetorus Habilis: perhaps a browser like plugin download does not count as "a real download" :)
lonetorus Habilis: enkidu, wanna move this oh over to blues chair, yoz has a oh starting in a few min
Morgaine Dinova: lone: installing a Firefox extension is certainly a download. In SL's case, it would be a huge one.
Attica Bekkers: no download like runescape? which does dload (but runs at slow modem speed)
Enkidu Linden: i love yoz
Morgaine Dinova: I don't know Yoz. Does he do tech stuff?
Enkidu Linden: yoz also works in my group
lonetorus Habilis: morg, yes, but its less technical to complete than a seperate dl and installation, a browser plugin is mostly a "click next" experience
lonetorus Habilis: "Yoz Linden: Web engineering: social apps, wiki, JIRA, identity, new tech"
Morgaine Dinova: Aha
tsurunari Toki: ahaha
Enkidu Linden: yoz does a lot of third party integration
lonetorus Habilis: third party?
lonetorus Habilis: can you give examples?
Enkidu Linden: i mean third party applications, like the wiki
lonetorus Habilis: ahh
lonetorus Habilis: or the blog
Enkidu Linden: yeah
Enkidu Linden: so, i think i'll stay here and continue, but feel free to join yoz's OH if you like. give him any inappropriate gesture for me!
lonetorus Habilis: im going to station a alt over at his oh ;)
lonetorus Habilis: perhaps a lsl based chat relay? ;)
Enkidu Linden: by the way, sorry about last week. i couldn't seem to log in until about 11:25am and no one was around
Enkidu Linden: haha
Enkidu Linden: i had a chance to mess with babbage's oauth lsl last week
Enkidu Linden: it was pretty neat posting to twitter in world
Qiyuan Anton: /kiss
Robin Cornelius: its times like these you need an orbiter
hong Yeu: Get lost!
tsurunari Toki: hola
Qiyuan Anton: /
tsurunari Toki: JeBonjour
Attica Bekkers: hola tsurunari would you like to sit down
lonetorus Habilis: enkidu, i actually made a in world thing for this
lonetorus Habilis: just rez it on the ground here
tsurunari Toki: Sure
Enkidu Linden: no kidding?
Enkidu Linden: mind if i look under the hood?
Attica Bekkers: just click on the empty couch and sit here
Qiyuan Anton: c ya guys gtg
Attica Bekkers: be well Quiyuan
Enkidu Linden: does it also receive status updates, lone?
Enkidu Linden: hey ghengis
Morgaine Dinova: Hiya Ghengis :-)
Ghengis Linden: Hi Morgaine
Morgaine DinovaMorgaine Dinova imagines an influx of Facebook-type newbies griefing every tech OH
Enkidu Linden: that was exciting
Attica Bekkers: dont give awards for social tech? only have special awards granted from above?
Enkidu Linden: oh man! i forgot
Enkidu Linden: apparently jack's been talking about search in his OH
Enkidu Linden: which are, sadly, at the same time as mine
Enkidu Linden: i'm not sure where, though
Attica Bekkers: but you are a cephalapod
ATechwolf Foxclaw: Hi all . Finally got my alt going.
Enkidu Linden: Linden Estate Services (213,107,49)
Enkidu Linden: jack's OH
Enkidu Linden: not that i think anyone should go there instead of here!
ATechwolf Foxclaw: Jack getting fried there.
Enkidu Linden: poor guy
Enkidu Linden: nobody likes fried jellyfish, so i'm safe
Attica Bekkers: I was thinking that
Enkidu Linden: so, robin, as someone familiar with snowglobe, do you think a web client could be written in webgl by someone other than linden lab/?
Enkidu Linden: i'm still curious about the difference between you and morgaine's assessments
Robin Cornelius: i was not thinking a webgl solution
Morgaine Dinova: Enki: the only way the two PoVs can be reconciled is by the huge amount of work it takes having been started long ago.
Robin Cornelius: or you relax the assumptions about the implementation
Enkidu Linden: seems reasonable since we're still just speculating
Morgaine Dinova: Robin is under NDA, so let's not go there. But if it's not WebGL then it's a browser plugin/extension, so you don't avoid the huge download like the press release said.
Robin Cornelius: can i quickly ask an unrelated question, Enkidu, you don't know anything about the mime type handing in the viewer do you?
Enkidu Linden: i don't but i can ask around for you. what do you want to know?
Robin Cornelius: i'm trying to serve a file with a custom mime type, its on my apache, curl says its good, the viewer says mime_type=
Robin Cornelius: i want to use it to trigger a custom plugin
Robin Cornelius: i once saw the correct type, but never again
Enkidu Linden: how are you issuing the request? llhttprequest?
Robin Cornelius: no i'm putting it on prim media
Robin Cornelius: ty Attica
Enkidu Linden: ok, i know who to ask then!
Morgaine Dinova: Haha, Attica, tnx :-)
Attica Bekkers: ghengis went to sleep
Attica Bekkers: hope twasnt him you had to ask
Enkidu Linden: robin, is there a wiki on setting up customer plugins?
Enkidu Linden: er, custom
Ghengis Linden: haha sorry, catching up on some reading
Enkidu Linden: (my grammar is slowly becoming predictive text)
Attica Bekkers: wb
Ghengis Linden: thx
Robin Cornelius: there is info on the protocol, which i've hacked around with loads of times, but something is amiss here for some reason
Enkidu Linden: what's the url?
Attica Bekkers: lsls is very good thing for people who dont program
Enkidu Linden: i've piqued some curiosity
Robin Cornelius: the url is http://127.0.0.1/test.rfb, apache is set to serve that with a custom mime type of remove/rfb (which it does)
Robin Cornelius: er remote/rfb
Robin Cornelius: then i have that mime type in mime_types.xml which lists my plugin as the library to handle that
Enkidu Linden: callum is wondering what curl -i shows you
Enkidu Linden: and i'm wondering what on earth you're up to
Enkidu Linden: but we're out of time and i have a meeting starting
Robin Cornelius: it gives me the http headers including "Content-Type: remote/rfb "
Robin Cornelius: and then my content
Robin Cornelius: i just want to trigger a custom plugin
Enkidu Linden: he's not sure but he'd like to think about it more. i think you just handed him a rubik's cube
Enkidu Linden: and i've got to run. thank you all for coming!
Attica Bekkers: grins thanks
Ghengis Linden: by all
Attica Bekkers: bye
Ghengis Linden: thanks attica for the snapshot, it's not my new profile pic!
Enkidu Linden: it's not?
Attica Bekkers: tell them the fb gamer stickines is awards/medals if it come sup
Attica Bekkers: not tech
Enkidu Linden: nothing says 'i love you' like 'i don't love you', ghengis
Attica Bekkers: Iwant an ward for spending 5000000 lindens lol
Enkidu Linden: thanks again, all. see you next week

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