Bug triage/2007-06-18

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Next bug triage - Monday, 3pm at Rob Linden's office in GrasmereD

Stats

Not Resolved: 1195

  • Updated Monday: 117
    • Of those still open: 100
    • Of those being reopened: 6

Triage Queue: 942

  • Blockers: 22
  • Critical: 70
  • Others (votes>=3): 192


Issues Ready for Discussion

  • VWR-893 - Patch to make View Admin Options sticky - Gigs Taggart
    • This one was on last triage, see my comments. (Votes: 5) Dzonatas Sol 12:31, 15 June 2007 (PDT)
    • IMPORT
  • VWR-157 - incorrect line endings in tar.gz source packages - SpacedOut Frye
    • The files with problems keep changing :-/ This problems exists in 1.17.0.12
    • (Votes: 5) Dzonatas Sol 21:30, 17 June 2007 (PDT)
    • IMPORT
  • Topic: "reopened" issues. See talk page - Rob Linden

Discussed

  • VWR-895 - Texture latency - texturing all sides of a prim at once results in one side not being textured, has to be selected individually - Cory Edo
    • I IM'd Cory to see if issue can still be reproduced. Moved old refs out of LLIID and into comments. (Votes: 2) Dzonatas Sol 08:04, 15 June 2007 (PDT)
    • Cory demo'd it to me. All the textures change on all sides, but the one side then reverts back. Dzonatas Sol 09:56, 15 June 2007 (PDT)
    • IMPORT + assign to Soft
  • SVC-171 - Objects in a user's inventory show 00000-00-00-00000 for UUIDs when tried to attach - Montana Corleone
    • IM'd Montana. This was one that has more votes on the issue it marks as duplicate (but misfiled). Objects still exist and can repro. (Votes: 2) Dzonatas Sol 21:18, 14 June 2007 (PDT)
    • IMPORT

New Patches

  • VWR-733 - Change Request: Excess texture buffer memory size resulting in disk thrashing/crashes/virt memory swapping - Nicholaz Beresford
    • IMPORT
  • VWR-1184 - [Linux VWR] Signal 7 (SIGBUS) Error (caused by libtcmalloc) - Alejandro Rosenthal
    • IMPORT
  • VWR-654 - Automatically Scroll output window for Tools / Reset all Scripts - Zi Ree
    • IMPORT
  • VWR-1294 - Possibly threads not fully cleaned up at end of program - Nicholaz Beresford
    • IMPORT
  • VWR-1277 - llround for floats not correctly rounding negative numbers - Blakar Ogre
    • RESOLVE (Incomplete)
  • VWR-1265 - Add option to SConstruct allowing user to specify gcc/g++ version - Stevex Janus
    • RESOLVE (Fixed)
  • VWR-1204 - Add option to SConstruct to enable gcc -pg (profiling) and analysis via gprof - Stevex Janus
    • RESOLVE (Won't fix)
  • VWR-1182 - Remove LL_USE_KDU define which is no longer used from SConstruct - Stevex Janus
    • RESOLVE (Fixed)
  • VWR-1180 - Inappropriate uses of ctype (is*) functions in prevalidate methods for LLLineEditor - Alissa Sabre
    • IMPORT

others

  • VWR-1171 - Velocity interpolation causes weird physical behaviour client-side - Vernes Veranes
    • Reproducible. (Votes: 2) Dzonatas Sol 13:22, 15 June 2007 (PDT)
    • IMPORT
  • WEB-161 - Javascript Error on Transactions History Page (document_load() not defined) - Slip Stringfellow
    • (IM'd) Slip is a web page developer, and there wasn't more we could find why the error occurred except that it called an undefined function. (Votes: 2) Dzonatas Sol 21:07, 17 June 2007 (PDT)
    • IMPORT
  • WEB-159 - Contradictory info for basic accts wanting billing support - Celierra Darling
    • (Votes: 2) Looks importable, as-is. Dzonatas Sol 21:45, 17 June 2007 (PDT)
    • IMPORT


Ran out of time

  • VWR-1153 - Sculpted prims show before their shape is known - Mark Busch
  • VWR-654 - Tools / Reset all Scripts in Selection Window does not Scroll automatically - Zi Ree
    • Re-reviewed, this is actually a new feature. The patch confused me, and the patch can't be used. (Votes: 2) Dzonatas Sol 12:27, 15 June 2007 (PDT)
  • VWR-1162 - Search Land Sales does not clear parcels listed for sale when estate resell is disallowed after parcel is listed - Rudolph Ormsby
    • (Votes: 1) Somewhat major bug if it can be reproduced. Move to SVC? Dzonatas Sol 21:45, 17 June 2007 (PDT)
  • VWR-1172 - SLVoice.exe crash on startup - .111 and .112 - Mosley Jewell
    • I IM'd Mosely, see comments. (Votes: 1) Dzonatas Sol 12:59, 15 June 2007 (PDT)
  • VWR-1109 - Some source files in *.zip source distribution contain lines that end with LF only - Alissa Sabre
    • probably fixed already with 1.17. (NB)
    • Commented & IM'd Alissa. (Votes: 1) Dzonatas Sol 12:38, 15 June 2007 (PDT)
  • VWR-1161 - alignment assumptions bad for stability - Whoops Babii
    • (Votes: 1) Commented. Maybe not importable, yet. Dzonatas Sol 21:45, 17 June 2007 (PDT)
  • VWR-1154 - Particle glitches with PSYS_PART_FOLLOW_SRC_MASK - Helena Lycia
    • (Votes: 1) Does this really need a patch? Dzonatas Sol 21:45, 17 June 2007 (PDT)

Tabled & Not Ready For Today's Triage

Raw transcript

[15:02] Soft Linden: Hey hey Tanoujin
[15:02] Squirrel Wood: I know of at least one player who has a L$ balance of minus one point five millions
[15:02] Hirokii Hyun: Ah, the man of the hour.
[15:02] Dianne's Radio (by BLACK): Sky 70's ---> http://64.236.34.196:80/stream/1076
[15:02] Squirrel Wood: Hello Rob ^^
[15:02] Hirokii Hyun: Greetings, rob.
[15:03] Kizzneth Dieterle gave you 3 Red Candles with Black Glass Holders.
[15:03] Dianne's Radio (by BLACK): Radio Nigel ---> http://stream.radionigel.com:8020/
[15:03] Squirrel Wood: http://www.dream.at/temp/bugs/client_breaking_weapons.jpg <= I'm just curious when this bug will be fixed ^^
[15:03] Rob Linden: hi folks....just getting situated
[15:04] Hirokii Hyun: Not a problem.
[15:04] Squirrel Wood: Take your time ^^
[15:04] Hirokii Hyun: I've been camping for two hours, A few more minutes won't kill me :p
[15:04] Rob Linden: I'll be posting a transcript...so don't say anythign you wouldn't want known publicly
[15:05] Dale Glass: transcripts are good
[15:05] Hirokii Hyun: Oops, I guess I won't be talking about my plans for world domination then.
[15:06] Rob Linden: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Bug_triage/Agenda
[15:06] Rob Linden: let's start with VWR-893
[15:07] Rob Linden: any reason not to import this one?
[15:07] Able Whitman: No, it's a handy thing to fix.
[15:07] Dzonatas Sol: Gigs, we are on your jira issue
[15:07] Dale Glass: well, I'd like the camera constraints setting to persist
[15:07] Squirrel Wood: nope. As long as this also ensures "disable camera constraints" ... ye
[15:08] Soft Linden: There's a question about whether we want to keep that mode at all, but so long as it exists, might as well have that.
[15:08] Gigs Taggart: the patch?
[15:08] Rob Linden: Dale...that means "yes, import" right?
[15:08] Rob Linden: Gigs...correct
[15:08] Dale Glass: yep
[15:08] Able Whitman: Admin Options also disable constraints, except for the one that keeps your camera above ground.
[15:08] Rob Linden: k.....let's not flog this one. I'll import. next...
[15:08] Gigs Taggart: Soft: I'm of the mind all "artificial constraints" in the client should be removed. They just hide issues like our LSL problem the other day.
[15:08] Soft Linden nods.
[15:08] Rob Linden: VWR-158
[15:08] Rob Linden: VWR-157
[15:08] Rob Linden: (sorry)
[15:09] Gigs Taggart: so I'm kinda for removing it too, but only if we make the defaut to bypass most client-side perm checks :)
[15:09] Dzonatas Sol: is the line ending due to the svv:eol-style=native not being set?
[15:09] Dzonatas Sol: svn*
[15:09] Rob Linden: correct. I'll import
[15:10] Dale Glass: I'd say import, if it is a problem for anybody
[15:10] Rob Linden: next...
[15:10] Rob Linden: VWR-895
[15:10] Gigs Taggart: were all other unimported patches already imported?
[15:11] Rob Linden: I only removed items I imported
[15:11] Rob Linden: I didn't keep track of what else might have been removed
[15:11] Gigs Taggart: k, I'll look and see, continue
[15:11] Dzonatas Sol: Cory demo'd 895... My viewer reflected the problem Cory stated, but i couldn't make it happen from my viewer.
[15:11] Dzonatas Sol: Also, it had an invalid import id... so it might have been misplaced
[15:12] Squirrel Wood: 895 never happened to me
[15:12] Able Whitman: From the comments on 895, i get the impression it is inconsistently reproable, is that correct?
[15:12] Dzonatas Sol: From Cory's viewer it happens. Reproducible for her.
[15:12] Soft Linden: Looks like it
[15:13] Dzonatas Sol: And i see the effects
[15:13] Dzonatas Sol: *saw
[15:13] Gigs Taggart: VWR-733, VWR-1184, VWR-1294, VWR-1265, VWR-1204, VWR-1182, VWR-1180
[15:13] Gigs Taggart: those are all unimported patches
[15:13] Able Whitman: Hmm, that really is strange
[15:13] Soft Linden: Would be useful to know if they're applying by dragging the texture on, using the pick tool, or what.
[15:13] Squirrel Wood: I wonder if this could be related to where you'll have the texture selector alternate between two textures repeatedly ?
[15:14] Dzonatas Sol: she tried different ways
[15:14] Gigs Taggart: I've seen it happen when you texture a large number of prims at once
[15:14] Soft Linden: Squirrel, I've seen that when the net's congested for sure. The packets selecting textures arrive out of order.
[15:14] Squirrel Wood: I see it when you just use the arrow keys to move down the texture list while having "apply immediately" checked
[15:15] Rob Linden: ok....I'd like to get some help from people out there with a repro for this one. seems like it's probably a real bug, but there's a lot of work just narrowing down a good repro that needs to happen
[15:15] Soft Linden: Do we have a way to flag issues with a request for more resident input in a way people are likely to see?
[15:16] Gigs Taggart: we use resolve for that Soft
[15:16] Gigs Taggart: incomplete resolution
[15:16] Dzonatas Sol: Ask Cory to demo it for you =)
[15:16] Rob Linden: do we think this is a sim side problem?
[15:17] Rob Linden: (or at least, something that sim side access would help debug?)
[15:17] Gigs Taggart: I think it can probably be compensated for on the client side.
[15:17] Dzonatas Sol: It appears more network related somehow
[15:17] Soft Linden: /softask Ask Cory Edo about VWR-895
[15:17] /softask: Task from Soft Linden accepted by server.
[15:17] Able Whitman: Yeah, it seems more of an issue with communication between sim and viewer, where access to a sim would be helpful.
[15:17] Rob Linden: Soft...should I import and assign to you (at least until you work with Cory)?
[15:18] Soft Linden: Sure
[15:18] Rob Linden: k....that's a plan
[15:18] Rob Linden: next up
[15:18] Rob Linden: SVC-117
[15:18] Rob Linden: sorry SVC-171
[15:19] Dzonatas Sol: My comment explains that unless I wasn't clear enough. ?
[15:20] Rob Linden: Dz...what's your recommendation, then?
[15:20] Rob Linden: does someone at LL need to look at this?
[15:20] Dzonatas Sol: I suggest to import and have a Linden do the lookup for SVC-171 in her inventory. Double-check the UUIDs.
[15:21] Gigs Taggart: some things do have null UUIDs in inventory, like notecards... Objects shouldn't
[15:21] Gigs Taggart: blank notecards that is
[15:22] Soft Linden: Would sure guess these objects exist in the inventory server but not the asset server. Should be looked at by a sim guy.
[15:22] Gigs Taggart: everyone reload the agenda page, I updated it with the new patches
[15:22] Gigs Taggart: 654 can probably be ignored for now though
[15:23] Rob Linden: k....I'll import SVC-171
[15:23] Able Whitman: Yes, I looked at the patch for 654 and it works, but probably not the "right" way to fix the scrolling bug.
[15:24] Gigs Taggart: well we should at least resolve it then
[15:24] Gigs Taggart: so it stops coming up on these lists :)
[15:24] Dzonatas Sol: VWR-1171
[15:25] Soft Linden: 654 looks really low priority either way - would wait on more votes
[15:25] Rob Linden: k....VWR-733. Gigs, can you reorder the list so that the ones we already discussed are at the top? I relyon the agenda being chronologically accurate
[15:25] Gigs Taggart: ok
[15:26] Gigs Taggart: ok it's reordered
[15:26] Rob Linden: k...thanks. VWR-733 looks good to import to me
[15:27] Soft Linden: Big time, ya
[15:27] Rob Linden: how about VWR-1184 ?
[15:27] Gigs Taggart: check for signed contrib agreement
[15:27] Gigs Taggart: he's new
[15:29] Soft Linden: I think Sardonyx is/was looking at libctmalloc replacements - one sec, I'll check my mail
[15:29] Gigs Taggart: it looks valid, maybe...
[15:29] Gigs Taggart: all it does is turn off that lib
[15:30] Dale Glass: what is libctmalloc for? I only get 2 google hits for it
[15:30] Gigs Taggart: looks like a wrapper to track leaks
[15:30] Dale Glass: valgrind?
[15:30] Gigs Taggart: no
[15:31] Dale Glass: as an alternative I mean
[15:31] Rob Linden: ok....it's at least worth looking at. I'll import
[15:31] Gigs Taggart: valgrind does really poorly on the SL client :)
[15:31] Gigs Taggart: it doesn't catch much of anything
[15:31] Rob Linden: it may be that Sardonyx' work renders this moot
[15:31] Dzonatas Sol: Is there any reason why the new patch were not on the list before Friday?
[15:31] Rob Linden: (speak of the devil)
[15:31] Dzonatas Sol: *patches
[15:32] Gigs Taggart: I put new patches on the list earlier this week, a lot of these are new, some of them, who knows.. maybe you took them off the list? :)
[15:33] Dzonatas Sol: Some of these are brand new on the list today. I don't have time to review them and give a decent recommendation. =(
[15:33] Gigs Taggart: that's what we are here for
[15:33] Rob Linden: Sardonyx...we were just discussing VWR-1184 .... is that one that your work renders oot?
[15:33] Laetizia Coronet: sheesh
[15:33] Sardonyx Linden: let me look
[15:34] Rob Linden: (let's look at th enext one fo rth etime being)
[15:34] Sardonyx Linden: wow, no, i had not seen VWR-1184
[15:34] Laetizia Coronet: that better not be you Aric... I can't mute you ;)
[15:34] Aric Linden: nope, not me.
[15:34] Dale Glass: that can be patched
[15:35] Aric Linden: I'm far too polite for such stuff. ;-)
[15:35] Rob Linden: VWR-654
[15:35] Dale Glass: next time I'll tell you who's doing it :-)
[15:35] Dale Glass: I've got a detector for such things
[15:35] Gigs Taggart: 654 I recommend we resolve wontfix if you all don't like the patch
[15:35] Gigs Taggart: don't just leave it hanging
[15:36] Soft Linden: How is autoscroll handled in the chat history?
[15:37] Sardonyx Linden: re VWR-1184, it's now sl-45679 internally
[15:37] Able Whitman: I can look into updating the patch for 654, or I can talk to Zi about helping out with it, if that would help.
[15:37] Rob Linden: thx Sardonyx
[15:38] Gigs Taggart: I say resolve it in the mean time to get it off the list. It can be reopened when there's a suitable patch
[15:38] Rob Linden: I'm not sure what to make of it
[15:38] Rob Linden: I don't entirely understand the feature implemented
[15:38] Gigs Taggart: the reset script list doesn't scroll
[15:38] Gigs Taggart: not correctly
[15:38] Gigs Taggart: the patch fixes it but it's hacky
[15:38] Soft Linden: /softask compare VWR-654 to chat scroll
[15:38] /softask: Task from Soft Linden accepted by server.
[15:39] Soft Linden: I won't claim the task yet, but can peek and see if there's an existing flag or something
[15:39] Rob Linden: ok....so a legitimate bug/fr, but patch is iffy
[15:39] Gigs Taggart: yes
[15:39] Rob Linden: k....I'll import
[15:39] Dzonatas Sol: I re-reviewed 654. It is actually a feature request, not a bug.
[15:39] Rob Linden: could someone note our reservations in a comment?
[15:39] Gigs Taggart: I think it's a bug. That window should scroll
[15:40] Able Whitman: I think it's a bug too.
[15:40] Dale Glass agrees
[15:40] Dzonatas Sol: It scrolls.
[15:40] Gigs Taggart: it doesn't scroll automatically
[15:40] Able Whitman: But it doesn't scroll properly, that's the bug.
[15:40] Rob Linden: doesn't matter....I'll import either way
[15:40] Gigs Taggart: k
[15:41] Rob Linden: next up: VWR-1294
[15:41] Sta Jewell shouts: wse
[15:41] Gigs Taggart: god jira is slow
[15:41] Sardonyx Linden: looks like a familiar bug.
[15:41] Sardonyx Linden: i'll be looking at it today or tomorrow.
[15:41] Dale Glass: Gigs, use the jira client
[15:41] Dale Glass: it's pretty nice
[15:42] Gigs Taggart: it didn't work last time I tried it
[15:42] Dale Glass: except for the lack of auth, that is
[15:42] Sardonyx Linden: SL-45681 now
[15:42] Dzonatas Sol: I vote to table 1294 for chance to review
[15:42] Dale Glass: it does work for reading though
[15:42] Rob Linden: k...next
[15:42] Rob Linden: VWR-1277
[15:43] Able Whitman: I'd really like to see some information on how llRound works now, and how its behavior is incorrect, for completeness sake.
[15:43] Dale Glass: yeah, needs more info
[15:43] Gigs Taggart: resolve incomplete on 1277
[15:43] Rob Linden: agreed.....this type of thing needs a few test cases
[15:44] Dzonatas Sol: test cases, agree
[15:44] Soft Linden nods. "More to it, stuff might rely on the 'wrong' behavior if it's presently incorrect. Not a trivial change."
[15:44] Rob Linden: yup
[15:44] Able Whitman: Plus when I see platform-specific things like "x87 inline assembly code (for compilation on Windows) " I get a little nervous :)
[15:44] Kone Beaumont: hey Aric! what's happening here ?
[15:45] Rob Linden: any volunteers to follow up on 1277?
[15:45] Aric Linden: it's an open source bug triage session Kone
[15:45] Rob Linden: (just close with comment)
[15:45] Rob Linden: (resolve, I mean)
[15:45] Dzonatas Sol: Leave it on the list for turnover.
[15:45] Sardonyx Linden: rob: ball's already in the submitter's court, for comments
[15:45] Kone Beaumont: ho my god. dont know anything about IT !
[15:45] Gigs Taggart: well resolving is how we express that
[15:45] Aric Linden: miles
[15:45] Kone Beaumont: at least its attracting lots of people :)
[15:45] Aric Linden: smiles
[15:46] Sardonyx Linden: rob needs a bigger office :-)
[15:46] Rob Linden: VWR-1265
[15:46] Sardonyx Linden: close it.
[15:46] Gigs Taggart: import 1265 not controversial
[15:46] Rob Linden: nobody is sitting in the chairs....kinda funny
[15:46] Sardonyx Linden: already fixed.
[15:46] Gigs Taggart: oh ok
[15:46] Gigs Taggart: neat :)
[15:46] Rob Linden: woot
[15:46] Rob Linden: next
[15:47] Able Whitman: Hey, that was fast
[15:47] Rob Linden: VWR-1204
[15:47] Dale Glass: why PROFILE, and not just say, CC_ARGS for any random arguments that might be needed?
[15:47] Sardonyx Linden: meh. we could add it, but i'm a bit reluctant. gprof is crap.
[15:48] Sardonyx Linden: people are better off profiling with oprofile.
[15:48] Dzonatas Sol: oprofile doesn't work on virtualized platforms
[15:48] Sardonyx Linden: i've closed it as wontfix.
[15:49] Rob Linden: k...."resolved" not "closed" right?
[15:49] Gigs Taggart: you shouldn't be profiling on a virtual instance anyway :)
[15:49] Sardonyx Linden: people run the viewer in virtualised linuxes?
[15:49] Sardonyx Linden: yes, resolved.
[15:49] Rob Linden: cool
[15:49] Rob Linden: next...
[15:49] Dzonatas Sol: mmhmm
[15:49] Rob Linden: VWR-1182
[15:49] Gigs Taggart: 1182 looks straightforward
[15:50] Sardonyx Linden: already gone.
[15:50] Dzonatas Sol: Is it worthwhile?
[15:50] Sardonyx Linden: i just resolved it as fixed.
[15:50] Rob Linden: Sardonyx...this is gone in maintenance...or has it made it into a release yet?
[15:50] Sardonyx Linden: in maintenance.
[15:50] Dzonatas Sol: ah!
[15:51] Sardonyx Linden: i spent half a day decrappifying the sconstruct file last week :-)
[15:51] Rob Linden: k....more reason for me to do a maintenance svn push sooner than later
[15:52] Sardonyx Linden: yep, we're going through opensource patches like a buzzsaw :-)
[15:52] Rob Linden: VWR-1180
[15:52] Gigs Taggart: is 1180 going to break international character support?
[15:53] Gigs Taggart: I don't know it's all over my head :)
[15:53] Sardonyx Linden: ooh, 1180 definitely looks like a bug.
[15:53] Gigs Taggart: cool
[15:53] Rob Linden: I'm with Gigs.... (woosh)
[15:54] Sardonyx Linden: is now SL-45684
[15:54] Soft Linden: I'm glad it's not just me, but Sardonyx seems to have a handle :)
[15:54] Gigs Taggart: yeah my alphabet only has 26 characters and that's the way I likes it
[15:54] Rob Linden: lol
[15:54] Sardonyx Linden: alissa has fixed several other i18n bugs recently
[15:54] Able Whitman: This is a good bug, Alissa is really on the ball with the i18n issues.
[15:54] Sardonyx Linden: yes, definitely.
[15:55] Rob Linden: k....VWR-1171
[15:55] Rob Linden agrees about Alissa
[15:55] Dzonatas Sol: 1171 is reproducible.
[15:55] Sardonyx Linden: nice, a bug with a repro
[15:56] Rob Linden: I'll import then
[15:56] Rob Linden: next...
[15:56] Sardonyx Linden: is now SL-45685
[15:56] Sardonyx Linden: oop, sorry rob.
[15:56] Rob Linden: WEB-161
[15:56] Rob Linden: no worries...thx for import
[15:57] Gigs Taggart: 161 looks trivial, import
[15:57] Dzonatas Sol: Someone just needs to check if there was an intention for document_load()
[15:57] Dzonatas Sol: (internally)
[15:57] Rob Linden: fair enough....marking for import
[15:57] Sardonyx Linden: looks like a piece of dead code.
[15:58] Gigs Taggart: import 159 too
[15:58] Gigs Taggart: WEB-159
[15:58] Rob Linden: to speed things up....Dz...you've looked at everything in this section?
[15:58] Dzonatas Sol: yes
[15:58] Sardonyx Linden: nice, thanks!
[15:59] Rob Linden: anything controversial or something we shouldn't import?
[15:59] Dzonatas Sol: 1153 maybe linked to another issue... i just saw it... one sec
[15:59] Gigs Taggart: VWR-1153 I object to.
[15:59] Gigs Taggart: It's normal to render prims before their textures are loaded.
[16:00] Dale Glass: problem is sculpties look rather weird until loaded
[16:00] Soft Linden: I like the idea of being a transparent sphere before loading, so a sculpie with a missing texture isn't forever phantom
[16:00] Rob Linden: k...well, in the interest of time, I think we should stop going through the list here
[16:01] Gigs Taggart: VWR-1042 is alread imported
[16:01] Dzonatas Sol: I have it somewhere, but Torley is on a related issue.
[16:01] Able Whitman: I agree that the way sculpties are displayed before their shape texture loads isn't ideal, but I don't think that (as 1153 sugggests) that the prim shouldn't be displayed at all before the texture loads.
[16:01] Squirrel Wood: Meep. https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/MISC-317 <= If you hate being orbitted and forced to relog... give it a vote ^^
[16:01] Gigs Taggart: close 1153 duplicate of 1042
[16:01] Rob Linden: from a process perspective, it sounds like we've still got some kinks to work out on agenda setting
[16:02] Soft Linden: Squirrel - where did you see the orbiting weapon for sale ya showed a picture of earlier?
[16:02] Soft Linden: Could be helpful to pick up a copy for testing.
[16:02] Gigs Taggart: Soft I can hook you up with Ownage :)
[16:02] Soft Linden: Hee - kay
[16:02] Gigs Taggart: Actually I can tell you all about the physics bug in question
[16:02] Squirrel Wood: I know two places where you can get that one. One if in the Furnation Mall. South border at the center
[16:02] Gigs Taggart: I know how Ownage works
[16:02] Rob Linden: here's a new process I'd like to have:
[16:03] Soft Linden: /softask Orbiter weapon - furnation mall, south border at the center
[16:03] /softask: Task from Soft Linden accepted by server.
[16:03] Able Whitman: Gigs, I'm curious about the physics bug that's being exploited, too
[16:03] Gigs Taggart: hehe, for the protection of my friend's commercial interest, I'd rather only talk to Lindens about it :)
[16:03] Squirrel Wood: matter of fact, that bug is a definite showstopper if you get hit with it
[16:04] Able Whitman: Ah, no worries then :)
[16:04] Rob Linden: if you have an opinion about an item that you've looked at, put it in a comment under the item
[16:05] Rob Linden: Gigs: sorry for not getting a transcript of Friday posted....it's sitting on my desktop in Seattle, and I'm in SF now
[16:05] Gigs Taggart: np
[16:05] Rob Linden: Gigs & Dz...I'm particularly interested in your opinions on making agenda setting go smoother
[16:06] Rob Linden: if there are obvious things to import...I'd rather they show up on an "import" list rather than something we need to discuss
[16:06] Dzonatas Sol: I'm inclinded the standard... Robert's Rules of Order
[16:06] Dzonatas Sol: good book =)
[16:06] Rob Linden: did Robert havea wiki?
[16:06] Gigs Taggart: yeah we could do that, an import category
[16:06] Dzonatas Sol: mmhmm
[16:06] Rob Linden: :-P
[16:07] Rob Linden: :)
[16:07] Dzonatas Sol: =)
[16:07] Wyn Galbraith: I think Robert rules were around before the internet ;)
[16:07] Gigs Taggart: a lot got imported before the triage this week
[16:07] Gigs Taggart: so we actually accomplished more than might be immediately apparent
[16:07] Rob Linden: oh...sure.
[16:07] Able Whitman: I think it would help if we had a more structured Agenda template, with categories like "For Import" and "For Discussion" (for example), and a standard list of info to include, like number of votes, etc.
[16:08] Gigs Taggart: well we have the triage.pl script, that can add the number of votes as a column
[16:08] Able Whitman nods
[16:08] Gigs Taggart: rob will have to hack it though
[16:08] Gigs Taggart: I don't know perl and XML and I have a hate-hate relationship
[16:08] Rob Linden: I put the source out there ;-)
[16:08] Dzonatas Sol: Let's agree on the friday. Get it reviewed before or on friday.
[16:08] Soft Linden: I'd love to see more votes to help highlight hot items as well. Any chance we could do a public-facing Vote-o-Matic operating off the PJIRA?
[16:09] Gigs Taggart: Dz I'd rather get patches in ASAP even if they are posted over the weekend
[16:09] Dzonatas Sol: Dangerous Gigs.
[16:09] Gigs Taggart: it's not dangerous, all importing means is that a linden will look at it, they aren't automatons
[16:09] Able Whitman: Actually, I'd rather move the triage to wednesday or friday afternoon, so that issues that come in over the weekend can be considered for that week.
[16:09] Rob Linden: I kinda agree with Gigs on that, actually.
[16:10] Able Whitman: I'm speaking as one who has more time on weekends to devote to viewer stuff, so my opinion is biased :)
[16:10] Dzonatas Sol: Hmm... I wonder why they made the Brown Act. =)
[16:10] Gigs Taggart: Rob's wednesday hours are imcompatible with my sleep :)
[16:10] Squirrel Wood: wednesdays are bad... remember the downtime and usual problems afterwards?
[16:10] Rob Linden: the value of the triage meeting is for discussing controversial issues
[16:10] Rob Linden: let's keep Monday, 3pm for now
[16:11] Gigs Taggart: that's a nonsequitor Dz, these triages are open
[16:11] Rob Linden: ok....hmmm, this is a pretty big can o worms here
[16:11] Dzonatas Sol: And, how does that reflect the final product?
[16:12] Rob Linden: let's do this:
[16:12] Rob Linden: take this discussion to the sldev mailing list
[16:12] Rob Linden: if we don't resolve it there, we can use it as an agenda item on Wed or Fri
[16:13] Rob Linden: however, the mailing list is where we actually resolve the issue
[16:13] Gigs Taggart: k
[16:13] Able Whitman: Sounds good.
[16:13] Stevex Janus: Dam was really late
[16:13] Stevex Janus: Hey you are all stillhere
[16:14] Rob Linden: those of you that disagree the most should try to hash it out in realtime if you have the opportunity, and then perhaps send mail to the list with what your consensus is
[16:14] Rob Linden: (or isn't)
[16:14] Hirokii Hyun: LL Phone service makes me want to choke infant kittens.
[16:14] Gigs Taggart: meet me on IRC at high noon dz :)
[16:14] Able Whitman: lol
[16:15] Dzonatas Sol: There seemed to be a concern about popular and wortwhile issues. That is what I have on mind now since it was pushed on me.
[16:15] Rob Linden: I'll try to send my thoughts on the subject to the list later myself
[16:15] Rob Linden: anyway...thanks everyone for coming....this is really becoming quite a productive venue
[16:15] Hirokii Hyun: Rob, just a quick, likely unrelated question.
[16:15] Rob Linden: k..
[16:15] Hirokii Hyun: When does LL plan to start open sourcing the server?
[16:16] Hirokii Hyun: I know they announced it a while back.
[16:16] Squirrel Wood: Mmm. Open Sauce ^^
[16:16] Rob Linden: long topic for another time
[16:16] Dzonatas Sol: I gotta go. Thank you everyone from attending. =)
[16:16] Hirokii Hyun: Got cha.
[16:16] Able Whitman: Take care, Dz!
[16:16] Wyn Galbraith: Squirrel
[16:16] Squirrel Wood: ^^
[16:16] Rob Linden: gotta go myself. thanks everyone!
[16:17] Soft Linden: Be good, y'all!
[16:17] Squirrel Wood: Rawr :p
[16:17] Wyn Galbraith has a few hours till dinner, have mercy.