Doc Team/2008-03-28

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Becky Pippen: :-)
You: Hi Becky, welcome back!
You: Hello, Green Lantern!
Jon Linden: i ... i tried to sit on something that created a problem
You: Probably the second prim on that ottoman.
Jon Linden: so this is what it looks like when an actual humanoid sits on this thing as opposed to a hermit crab!
You: I think I have more chairs if you want to try a different one.
Jon Linden: that's cool, i like this guy
You: You know, I think Cogsworth is a Lantern, too... Nobody better mess with this dimension of reality while you guys are around.
Jon Linden: i would make a Parallax joke here but that's perhaps going too far
You: Hi Simon, welcome to Documentation Office Hours.
Jon Linden: hello, Simon (and Becky)!
Simon Kline: hi Jeremy! thanks!
WidgetHUD v1.1: Simon Kline has pinged you.
Simon Kline: hi Jon
Simon Kline: hi Becky! :D
Becky Pippen: Hi y'all
Simon Kline: the new support portal looks great
Jon Linden: hooray!
Becky Pippen: yes, it's wonderful!
Simon Kline: has it increased traffic since the changes?
You: In a way... we can definitely tell that more people are finding the proper channels for contacting Support :-)
Jon Linden: there appear to have been demonstrable increases in ticket and live chat -- i can only assume the same is true for KB articles viewed
Jon Linden: although i'm still waiting to hear back from Parature about wiping clean the stats on KB article views and ratings
Simon Kline: ahh fantastic.. its a good sign that people are finding the help they need
Jon Linden: i would like to see what gets the most views now that more people can access the KB more easily
Simon Kline: yeah would be interesting
Simon Kline: has there been any articles that stood out in the past?
You: I happened to notice during some of my KB cleaning lately that some articles have hundreds of votes while others have almost note.
You: er, none.
Simon Kline nods
Jon Linden: the top five most-viewed articles are probably no surprise (they're visible on the front page of the KB)
Simon Kline: one i came across which i'm not sure is right is... https://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=4417
You: That may or may not be indicative of views, though. The votes are more for deciding whether or not an article is useful.
You: Hm.
You: Simon, on the right side of the article, there should be an ID number...
Simon Kline: haha oops that's just the main page..
Jon Linden: simon, unfortunately, copy/pasting from the address bar doesn't work with KB articles because they're viewed in frames
Simon Kline: i'll get the id number hehe
Jon Linden: btw, Parature is going to be working on getting rid of the frames relatively soon
You: Hooray!
Simon Kline: 4051-4582
You: http://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=4417&task=knowledge&questionID=4582
Jon Linden: the IM FAQ
Jon Linden: what appears to be inaccurate?
Simon Kline: yeah iin the msg cap is says you get capped after 100?
Simon Kline: is that right?
You: I don't know for a fact the exact number, but 100 sounds about right.
Jon Linden: the number of IMs that get STORED is 100
Jon Linden: you can obviously send as many IMs as you like, but only the last 100 will be stored
You: Hi Arawn.
You: Hi Tiny, welcome to Documentation Office Hours.
Simon Kline: cuz when i've been capped before it felt like 30 or so but haven't been cappped in a while
Tiny Jodra: hi
You: 30 people, or 30 messages?
Simon Kline: 30 msgs
You: Hm. That's something for us to research :-)
Simon Kline: hehe tis no biggie tho
Becky Pippen: yeah, it sure feels like it gets capped way before 100
Simon Kline: but just though i'd ask
You: Jon, Kate and I went over a plan to have our internal Subject Matter Experts review the whole KB. There's some stuff we, as writers, just don't know.
Simon Kline: hehe good
Jon Linden: there are (if my calculations are correct) 526 articles in the knowledge base
You: Wow.
Jon Linden: that's what i said!
Simon Kline: heheh good work guys!
Arawn Spitteler: Tiny is young enough, to still be getting his second legs
Jon Linden: i'm still working on the email that'll be sent out to everybody alerting them of the review effort
Jon Linden: greetings, Guardian
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: Hi jon
You: Hi Servicos8mercenarios, welcome to Documentation Office Hours!
You: Do you have.... a shorter name we can call you?
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: Merc
You: Cool!
Jon Linden: works for me
You: Feel free to have a seat and chat about the Knowledge Base :-)
You: Hi Julie! Welcome to Documentation Office Hours.
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: ok, I relog my cliente, just a minute
Julie Lowenhart: Hello people.. what informations do you delivery?
Julie Lowenhart: *deliver
Jon Linden: heh
You: Knowledge Base articles, mostly.
Jon Linden: and blog posts about Knowledge Base articles!
Julie Lowenhart: ooh, cool!
Arawn Spitteler: Welcome to Second Life, Julie.
Julie Lowenhart: and .. what's that? :D
You: http://support.secondlife.com
Jon Linden: you can think of it as a vast library of articles that tell you how to do things inworld
You: Well said...
Julie Lowenhart: Oh, I see. Will come in handy.
Jon Linden: although we're constantly working on expanding it and keeping it accurate
Julie Lowenhart: Just one thing on my mind... is there going to be any.. interactivity here sometimes? Like hugging, for example?
Arawn Spitteler recommmends Neiun, for that.
Jon Linden: hugging probably takes place here when we're not around
You: Actually... Residents of Second Life can create a lot of customized items and programs... some of which enable avatars to hug each other :-)
Arawn Spitteler: /hug julie
Julie Lowenhart: was that... supposed to do anything?
Jon Linden: i wonder if that would make for a decent knowledge base article, now that i think about it
You: Hi John, welcome to Documentation Office Hours.
You: Hugging?
Simon Kline: hehe welcome to Second Life John!
Jon Linden: yeah, actually
Julie Lowenhart: shh... wise old men have spoken... :D
You: Heh. Check out this old New World Notes article: http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2004/08/permission_to_h.html
Simon Kline loves how the browser opens in the viewer now
Simon Kline: will make opening kb ariticles easier for ppl in world
You: Indeed. We're even working toward making that work better than it does now.
Julie Lowenhart: So you guys basically .... fly and sit around here and make articles for us n00bz, so we're not lost after first five minutes? That's .. cool! :D
Jon Linden: the flying and sitting aroudn here only takes up one hour of the week
You: John and Julie, in case you're a bit lost, Jon and I work on the Knowledge Base for Second Life. Anyone with the last name "Linden" is an employee of Linden Lab, the company that created Second Life.
Jon Linden: the rest of the week we're working on improving or creating new articles
Julie Lowenhart: So you actually are some kind of a big family, right?
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: the translator not funtional here ?
Jon Linden: an enormous, globe-spanning family
You: In a manner of speaking!
You: I'll enabled scripts, Merc. One moment.
You: er, enable
You: My typing is terrible today.
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: ok
You: Try now?
Julie Lowenhart: and.. this is the Lucky Hour when we can see you here?
Jon Linden: i've been messing around with a spreadsheet most of the day
Jon Linden: it is indeed, Julie!
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: thanks
Jon Linden: we do this every week at the same time
Simon Kline: hehe that's a great new name for office hours.. make them lucky hours i like it
You: Heh. True enough, Julie. We meet here weekly, and we send out reminders in our Knowledge Base Article of the Week blog posts: http://blog.secondlife.com
Jon Linden: there are other Lindens who have office hours related to their particular areas of expertise
Simon Kline: so as a new resident what do u think the thing you need the most help understandign at the moment is julie?
You: Great question, Simon!
Jon Linden: agreed
Arawn Spitteler: Or disrelated; they might prefer to talk about bicycling or recycling
Simon Kline: hehe thanks :D
Jon Linden: here's a list of inworld office hours: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Office_Hours
Julie Lowenhart: I actually gathered most of the things. But people keep talking about these... what are they called? Some.. balls. Pose balls?
You: Ah. They're kind of like Second Life-specific pieces of furniture, or additions to furniture. If you sit on one, it will anchor you to that space and make your avatar perform an animation.
You: Such as sitting, lying on a bed, or doing less-PG things.
Arawn Spitteler has n't tried the kiss balls yet, so they're open to experimentation
Jon Linden: we don't have any here
Jon Linden: but they're a pretty common sight inworld
Simon Kline: i've got to get going to rl work... but nice to see everyone! thanks for the office hour jon and jeremy
WidgetHUD v1.1: Simon Kline has pinged you.
Becky Pippen: Bye Simon
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: it has a way to discover who returned prims? in the island where I inhabit this comes happening some times, and needs to know who makes this (nop was the owner). Exists a way to discover?
Jon Linden: as far as i know, nobody's ever asked for one, but i wonder if an article about poseballs belongs in the KB; it's an interesting question because it's not technically Linden Lab-created content
You: Most well-constructed furniture has animations built directly into it, making poseballs unnecessary... but for activities like dancing where partners need to be synchronized, poseballs can be a great help.
Julie Lowenhart: Nice talking to you, Simon.. have a lovely weekend
Simon Kline: i hope you really enjoy SL Julie!
You: Thanks for coming, Simon!
Simon Kline: tc Becky :D
Jon Linden: thanks for stopping by, Simon!
Jon Linden: Merc, stand by
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: ok
Jon Linden: that's a good question, actually
You: Merc, you should get a message when someone returns your prims, and the message should contain the name of the person who returned them. If they *delete* the prims, there is no way to know who did it.
You: (I think this information is in one of our Missing Inventory articles)
Julie Lowenhart: whoa, this is freaking me out.. I want to get to the beginning of the chatbox and I start flying :D
Jon Linden: i think we put a fix in that made it impossible for a landowner to DELETE objects on land they own, but they can return them
You: Heh!
Jon Linden: PageUp on the keyboard, Julie?
You: Jon, unless that's very recent, landowners can choose to do either.
Julie Lowenhart: I actually pressed Home
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: in the message really nop exists the name of who returned it and I and the owner want to discover who made it
Arawn Spitteler: That's what sent her flying. First, give the focus to Chat History
You: (click the chat box)
You: Uh oh.
Jon Linden: i see!
Jon Linden: just checking
You: Heh. It's funny how people who learn one way often forget that there are two ways to move.
Jeremy Linden never uses the arrow keys or Ins/Del/Home/End/PgUp/PgDn
Jon Linden: back to merc's question -- you want to discover the creator of an object that was on your land, but that was returned?
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: just minute
Jon Linden: jeremy, i think we made it so that landowners can't delete objects that they don't want on their land, but they can return them
WidgetHUD v1.1: Jon Linden has pinged you.
You: Heh. Well, there's a way to test this right now...
Becky Pippen: can you delete that?
Jon Linden: i'm right-clicking on some objects around here, and the Delete option is grayed out, but I can Return them if i want
You: Well, we've got admin powers active, but Jon owns this land even without admin powers.
Becky Pippen: got it.
Jon Linden: we did this to help with inventory loss
You: Hi Ricken, welcome back to Documentation Office Hours.
Ricken Flow: hey everyone
Jon Linden: sometimes people would leave things on other peoples' land by mistake, and the landowners would delete those objects instead of just returning them
Jon Linden: which was probably not optimal
You: Whoa, you appear to be correct.
You: Ok, time to update that article.
You: (This is why we're arranging that technical review!)
Arawn Spitteler: Winding up with a lot of forgotten Object, in your inventory, is basic training for newness.
Jon Linden: but so then:
Jon Linden: if there's an object on my land, and i return it, can i subsequently view who created it?
Jon Linden: i think this is the question merc was asking?
Ricken Flow: I am in a high traffic area I find things newbies leave all the time
Ricken Flow: yes
Arawn Spitteler: I don't see how you'd focus on it, unless you retained the key
Ricken Flow: you can see who created it
You: I don't think so... you could check those things before returning it, but once it's returned, you have no access to it.
Ricken Flow: who owns it and who created it
Jon Linden: this is what i'm thinking too, jeremy
WidgetHUD v1.1: Jon Linden has pinged you.
You: Hm... interesting point about the object key, but you'd still need to get that before the object was returned :-)
Jon Linden: before you return it, you should check out who owns and/or created it
Ricken Flow: if you own the land you can see what items are on there and who created them
Jon Linden: also true
Arawn Spitteler: I check owner, adn press teleport
You: Ricken, we're talking about a situation where an object has already been returned, though.
Ricken Flow: okay yes once its returned thats it
Becky Pippen: after it's returned, it's even removed from the sim's data and exists only in the asset and inventory servers, so only the owner can get to that information.
Arawn Spitteler: Linden Powers might exist, to review editing of an area, but that might not be cheap to implement
Jeremy Linden whistles tunelessly.
Jon Linden: i'm just glad we got that cleared up
You: And poor Merc isn't here to hear the answer!
Jon Linden: perhaps he will stumble on the transcript in the wiki
You: Any new concerns you regular attendees this week? :-)
You: er. add "from" in there
Ricken Flow: I love the new layout of the knowledge base whoo hoooo
Arawn Spitteler filed a Jira, today, and wants all the deaf people to comment: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-574
You: Excellent!
Becky Pippen: we're all afraid(TM) to say anything(R) that might be trademarked(XXX)
Arawn Spitteler: I still think OI should count as Documentation. It's an experiential primer
Ricken Flow: I do not use Se... Li..... anymore
You: Heh. I can't really comment on that, except to ask you to make sure you read the whole policy. It's not as bad as some of the backlash would have you think!
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: this the returned object message that I received: The object ' Second Life ' has sent you message from Second Life: Your 17 objects have been returned you your inventory lost and found to folder by BRAZIL NORTH to near parcel ' BRAZIL ISLAND NORTH ' at Brazil North 9
Ricken Flow: just easier not to
Jon Linden: merc, that looks like a message saying you had some objects on someone else's land that were returned to you
You: It also looks abnormal for a return message...
Jeremy Linden looks for one of his own.
Arawn Spitteler: They might still be at the top, of you r lost and found folder
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: I and the owner of the this island want to know who being resident
Jon Linden: you want to know who performed the returning action?
You: This is what mine look like: The object 'Second Life' has sent you a message from Second Life: Your 2 objects have been returned to your inventory lost and found folder by Governor Linden near parcel 'Brampton Linden Stage' at Brampton 106.106, 153.32 due to parcel auto return.
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: yes jon
You: Oh, I think I see what happened.... is BRAZIL NORTH a group?
Arawn Spitteler: YEah, Jeremy's tells who the miscreant is.
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: yes
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: Brasil Norte
You: I bet it's group-owned land... if it autoreturns, no individual person triggered it.
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: whit S
Jon Linden: group-owned land can be set to return objects automatically, in which case no individual Resident is responsible for the objects being returned
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: Unable to connect to translation service; please try back later.
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: understand
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: I understand
Jon Linden: i hope that helps!
You: Did we answer your question?
Jon Linden: "who returned my objects?" might make for a good KB article if we don't have something on it already
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: yes, for that I understood objects had been returned for one guilt configuration in the land for autoreturn, correct?
You: Maybe. I think there's a blurb on it in Frontier's big article on missing inventory, but it should be its own article.
Becky Pippen: is there one about consolidated objects?
Jon Linden: there's definitely at least one article on the coalesce feature
You: Yes, becky. "Coalesced objects"
You: Merc, I don't understand your translation.
Becky Pippen: yes, that's it :-)
You: "guilt"... wrong?
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: I go to verify configuration of the land of the island to know if everything well this
You: Ok, I hope we provided useful help!
Arawn Spitteler: Probably. Wrong config of Autoreturn, returning residents' objects?
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: yes
Jon Linden: i found an orphaned article on the coalesce feature that i'm putting in the inventory management folder
You: On group land, you can set the OBJECTS to the same group, and they will not be autoreturned.
Arawn Spitteler: Coalesced Objects?
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: ok
Jon Linden: arawn: http://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=4417&task=knowledge&questionID=4581
You: Arawn, when more than one object is returned to you at once, they show up as a single object in your inventory, with a different icon. When you rez it inworld again, all the returned objects appear.
You: Actually, you can do this without needing to return. If you select more than one object at once and "take" it, you'll get the same thing.
Arawn Spitteler: Is there a way to do that intentionally? I've seen a table so
Arawn Spitteler accepted your inventory offer.
Time Minder: You have been online for 1 hours.
You: It's useful for taking large builds, like big buildings, without having to link it all together.
Jon Linden: folks, we may need to wrap this up just slightly early -- jeremy and i have another meeting at 3, and i have to take care of some items in between
WidgetHUD v1.1: Jon Linden has pinged you.
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: ok
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: thanks for help
Becky Pippen: Thanks guys!
Arawn Spitteler: Thanks for coming, guys.
You: If you own the island, Merc, and you still have trouble, please contact Concierge support! :-)
You have offered a calling card to Servicos8mercenarios Yalin
Your calling card was accepted.
Jon Linden: everybody have an excellent weekend
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: ok
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: I have this
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: thanks
Servicos8mercenarios Yalin: bye
Becky Pippen: bye all
You: Bye all, thanks for coming!