HCI/ Benjamin Linden OH Transcript

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[15:08] Gloria Caudron: maybe we'll start now

[15:08] Jacek Antonelli: (No video, just texture)

[15:08] Benjamin Linden: yes let's get started

[15:08] Gloria Caudron: ok sure

[15:08] Gloria Caudron: We are team of 5 graduate students

[15:08] Gloria Caudron: as the slide mentions, we are working with Linden Lab

[15:09] Gloria Caudron: to help enrich the user experience

[15:09] Gloria Caudron: we can go to the next slide

[15:09] Benjamin Linden: now we can wait another five minutes :-)

[15:09] Marilyn Undercroft: this may take a minute :(

[15:09] Gloria Caudron: :)

[15:09] Ara Ember: -0-

[15:09] Tomiko: LOL

[15:10] Marilyn Undercroft: ooo... alittle faster!

[15:10] Ara Ember: it rezzed for me

[15:10] Gloria Caudron: Ok

[15:11] Gloria Caudron: so three main features in our system are these

[15:11] Gloria Caudron: Mainly the Recommendations system, where the system

[15:11] Gloria Caudron: can recommend events, places, and groups for Residents

[15:11] Gloria Caudron: specific to their personal interests

[15:11] Gloria Caudron: The second feature is the Rating system

[15:12] Gloria Caudron: where Residents can rate events and places

[15:12] Gloria Caudron: if they enjoy it or not

[15:12] Gloria Caudron: and also post comments

[15:12] Gloria Caudron: for other Residents to read

[15:12] Gloria Caudron: The Rating system will feed into the Recommendations system

[15:13] Lars Donardson sees major potential for abuse of these points

[15:13] Gloria Caudron: to help contribute to recommendations

[15:13] Jacek Antonelli is jotting some feedback in a notecard for after Gloria's done :)

[15:13] Ara Ember: :D thanks :)

[15:13] Gloria Caudron: yes thanks for jotting feedback

[15:13] Gloria Caudron: we will definietly be interested in hearing it in a moment

[15:13] Gloria Caudron: The third main compenent is the Interests/Tagging feature

[15:14] Gloria Caudron: where each event/place/group will have keywords

[15:14] Gloria Caudron: associated with it

[15:14] Gloria Caudron: also called categories/tags/interests

[15:14] Gloria Caudron: So for example if you like a place called "Karen's Karaoke"

[15:14] Gloria Caudron: certain keywords will be associated with this place

[15:15] Gloria Caudron: like karaoke, singing, music, etc

[15:15] Gloria Caudron: so if you have told the system you like these things

[15:15] Gloria Caudron: it will recommend you event/places/groups

[15:15] Gloria Caudron: with these same keywords

[15:15] Tomiko: And other people? With similar interests? : )

[15:16] Gloria Caudron: These are the main concepts this system

[15:16] Marilyn Undercroft: ben get the next slide ready please :)

[15:16] Ara Ember: hmm.. we were thinking about that.

[15:16] Gloria Caudron: It will not recommend people, mainly events, places, groups

[15:16] Kippie Friedkin: Ben seems to have crashed a couple of minutes ago :\

[15:16] Jacek Antonelli: ruh roh

[15:16] Ara Ember: but people found it much less useful than events places and groups

[15:16] Gloria Caudron: we'll go to the last slide

[15:16] Tomiko: I think that would be a good feature, to be able to search for people in Second Life who have similar interests etc. :)

[15:16] Marilyn Undercroft: uh oh!

[15:16] McCabe Maxsted: doh

[15:17] Gloria Caudron: doh!

[15:17] Marilyn Undercroft: the last slide just says the aspects we'd like feedback on

[15:17] You: I think all of the other things Gloria has mentioned are Existing features in the Client, and why make new when Linden Lab can and should improve the current features?

[15:17] Marilyn Undercroft: we can get it up when ben gets back

[15:17] You: Key words into Land description etc.

[15:17] Gloria Caudron: There are three main things we would like your feedback on

[15:17] Gloria Caudron: 1 - what you find useful about our system

[15:18] Gloria Caudron: (we will show you a prototype)

[15:18] Ara Ember: hmm... somewhat different from existing features, cuz now it's tailored to you.

[15:18] Gloria Caudron: what aspects you might find confusing

[15:18] Gloria Caudron: and what features you would or would not use

[15:18] Gloria Caudron: Before we go into the prototype, it sounds like there is some feedback already

[15:19] Joeseph Albanese: Need a focus/test group

[15:19] Marilyn Undercroft: however they are only accessible to a small group of experienced Residents

[15:19] Trinity Coulter: How would you protect it from abuse?

[15:19] Marilyn Undercroft: it's very difficult for new and regular uses to access

[15:19] Ara Ember: yes :) we are going to do the user testing soon.. and we are hoping this session will turn out to be like a focus group :)

[15:19] Lars Donardson: exactly..the rating feature calls for "flame wars"/abuse

[15:19] Gloria Caudron: there are certain things we would have in place for abuse

[15:19] Trinity Coulter: which would be what/

[15:19] Trinity Coulter: ?

[15:20] Gloria Caudron: it might be more clear once we show you

[15:20] Gloria Caudron: the prototype

[15:20] Kippie Friedkin: How are keywords determined for places and events?

[15:20] McCabe Maxsted: is the rating both positive and negative, or just positive?

[15:20] Trinity Coulter: Second Life differs from Social Networking in that it has a strong commerce base and therefore a strong incentive to abuse the system

[15:20] Marilyn Undercroft: negative and positive

[15:20] Trinity Coulter: abuse becomes cash

[15:20] Lars Donardson nods at Trinity

[15:20] Aimee Trescothick: as was seen in the old profile ratings

[15:21] Gloria Caudron: We thought alot about this since there are alot of things such as campers

[15:21] Gloria Caudron: so one of the things is that we make the person's profile more public

[15:21] Gloria Caudron: the person who posts the comment

[15:21] Gloria Caudron: so there is more accountability to posting misleading comments

[15:21] Joeseph Albanese: here come the alts indroves

[15:22] Trinity Coulter: accountability means alts

[15:22] Marilyn Undercroft: determining the initial functionality was our first goal, but we are continuing to try and assure that it is gamed as little as possible

[15:22] Jacek Antonelli: let's let her explain, okay?

[15:22] Lars Donardson already hears the "fould· "breach of privacy" cries

[15:22] Lars Donardson: *foul

[15:22] Benjamin Linden: sorry folks, SL crashed my computer

[15:22] Trinity Coulter: I think its a good idea, but it is VERY open to abuse

[15:22] Nine Moulliez: Prototype Link: http://www.sjstevewon.com/sl/SL_hifi_iter1.html

[15:22] McCabe Maxsted: wb ben

[15:22] Gloria Caudron: why don't we show you now

[15:22] Benjamin Linden: who builds this app anyway?

[15:22] Gloria Caudron: Nine just posted the URL

[15:22] Tomiko: Also, Second Life currently has all this; Search for Places, Groups, Events, Ratings etc.

[15:22] Tomiko: So why make a new system?

[15:22] McCabe Maxsted: hehe

[15:22] Nine Moulliez: Prototype Link: http://www.sjstevewon.com/sl/SL_hifi_iter1.html

[15:22] Aimee Trescothick: it wasn't built Ben, it evolved lol

[15:22] You: People can already search what they want, and their matches come up

[15:23] Marilyn Undercroft: our user studies showed that search failed many users

[15:23] Benjamin Linden: can someone send me a chat transcript from the past 10 minutes?

[15:23] Marilyn Undercroft: it also doesn't expose new users to the possibilities in SL

[15:23] Grant Linden: yes ben

[15:23] Trinity Coulter: Linden Lab once had a thing called "dwell"... it was abused

[15:23] Benjamin Linden: thanks Grant

[15:23] Trinity Coulter: Linden Lab once had a thing called "ratings", they were abused

[15:23] Marilyn Undercroft: they have to come up with what to search for themselves

[15:23] Trinity Coulter: Linden Lab right now has a thing called traffic and it IS abused

[15:24] Jacek Antonelli: Guys -- let them finish describing the system before you start bashing on it with a hammer?

[15:24] Trinity Coulter: so anything new should be airtight as much as possible upfront

[15:24] Marilyn Undercroft: yes we know about traffic, it's one of the reasons we took this direction

[15:24] Lars Donardson: pfttt...*kicks server*

[15:24] Benjamin Linden: thanks Lars

[15:24] Gloria Caudron: We feel this is different from the Search in that it gives you tailored

[15:25] Gloria Caudron: recommendations to you based on ratings and your interests

[15:25] Marilyn Undercroft: are people able to see the prototype?

[15:25] Dakota Schwade: YEs.

[15:25] Jingidy Dumpling: please keep in mind the prototype is a work in progress

[15:25] Gloria Caudron: you have to maximize the browser window

[15:25] Marilyn Undercroft: if you missed it:

[15:25] Marilyn Undercroft: http://www.sjstevewon.com/sl/SL_hifi_iter1.html

[15:25] Garn Conover: this sounds like that LM sharer that was talked abotu a while back

[15:25] Jingidy Dumpling: some features are not implemented yet

[15:26] Jingidy Dumpling: for example, the "why is this recommended" and "options" links take you to something and gets stuck there

[15:26] Jingidy Dumpling: you will have to refresh to be able to go back

[15:28] Lars Donardson: how is this "you know 999 people here" determined?

[15:28] Marilyn Undercroft: it was for correct design spacing

[15:28] Marilyn Undercroft: it should have updated

[15:29] Jacek Antonelli: Could you explain the "Wander" button for us?

[15:29] Gloria Caudron: the Wander button will take you to a "random" place

[15:30] Garn Conover: if this can somehow eliminate abuse i dont see why it cant be joined w/ the exisiting system

[15:30] Marilyn Undercroft: please explain

[15:30] Marilyn Undercroft: do you mean in Search, or...

[15:30] Ara Ember: the wander button is like i feel l ucky button

[15:30] Ara Ember: it sends you to random place that matches your interest

[15:30] Gloria Caudron: also by "random" I mean it would be based on your interests to some degree

[15:31] Jacek Antonelli: Sounds good

[15:31] Marilyn Undercroft: it's like going to a recommended place, witht the same algorythm behind it

[15:31] Jacek Antonelli thinks the "I'm bored" button ^_^

[15:31] McCabe Maxsted: hehe

[15:31] Kippie Friedkin: heh..yep!

[15:31] Ara Ember agrees

[15:31] McCabe Maxsted was thinking the same

[15:31] Aimee Trescothick: bit like StumbleUpon

[15:31] Jacek Antonelli: yeah :)

[15:32] Kippie Friedkin: yep

[15:32] Garn Conover: did we loose Ben again?

[15:32] Marilyn Undercroft: inspiration identified!

[15:32] Kippie Friedkin: we sure did

[15:32] Malbers Linden: Bn has left the building

[15:32] Aimee Trescothick: :D

[15:32] Marilyn Undercroft: yup, ben seems to be having some problems

[15:32] Garn Conover: too many av's! lol

[15:32] McCabe Maxsted: hamsters got lose

[15:32] McCabe Maxsted: someone has to chase 'em down

[15:32] Jacek Antonelli: hehe

[15:32] Gloria Caudron: :)

[15:33] Dakota Schwade: So in some ways this is related to Jeska Linden's "LL Traffic Future" activities, yes?

[15:33] Jacek Antonelli: This circle "refresh"-looking arrow comes up with a random listing (weighted for your preferences) for you to look at? And then you have the back and forward history buttons?

[15:33] Aimee Trescothick volunteers for hamster chasing duties

[15:33] Lars Donardson: is the "X people you know like this" and "you know XXX people here" linked toy your friendslist ?

[15:33] Gloria Caudron: yes linked to your friends list

[15:34] Jingidy Dumpling: yes

[15:34] Marilyn Undercroft: we have recently reworked that butoon (refresh)... it's outta there!

[15:34] Marilyn Undercroft: needs spell check ;)

[15:34] Dakota Schwade: And initially, everything in SL will be un-rated, with ratings building over time?

[15:34] Gloria Caudron: not sure about "LL Traffic Future" activities

[15:35] Marilyn Undercroft: yes though we hope to devise a way to increase the speed at which things will be rated

[15:35] Lars Donardson: now..that for example is not a feature I'd like all the time to be honest..did you consider building a "hide" function into it?

[15:35] Dakota Schwade: Traffic = Popularity in many eyes.

[15:35] Marilyn Undercroft: do you mean the bar or the big window?

[15:35] Marilyn Undercroft: to hide

[15:35] Lars Donardson: I don't need to tp into a region and be automatically seen to all my friends on the list

[15:35] Gloria Caudron: yes good point

[15:36] Gloria Caudron: you could opt out of it

[15:36] Gloria Caudron: it's only if you were open to ppl contacting you at that time

[15:36] Marilyn Undercroft: like 'find on map'

[15:36] Jacek Antonelli: Cool

[15:36] Jacek Antonelli: wb Ben

[15:36] Benjamin Linden: thanks

[15:37] Benjamin Linden: clearly RC13 not so lucky for me

[15:37] Lars Donardson hands Benjamin some superglue to glue his bum to the grid

[15:37] McCabe Maxsted: hehe

[15:37] Kippie Friedkin: lol

[15:37] Benjamin Linden: heh thanks Lars

[15:37] Marilyn Undercroft: tee hee

[15:37] McCabe Maxsted: so will this be strictly an inworld tool?

[15:37] Ara Ember: lmao

[15:37] Marilyn Undercroft: there's been some discussion on that point but we haven't developed anything for the web yet

[15:38] Kippie Friedkin is taking lots of notes :)

[15:38] McCabe Maxsted: okay, because there's a lot of text here; I don't know how patient I'd be sitting and reading through it with the 3D world to look at

[15:38] Marilyn Undercroft: great thanks!

[15:38] Trinity Coulter: rather than a dedicated new addition to the Viewer, why not develop a web-based HUD framework for the Viewer and people can build their own solutions into this same sort of structure?

[15:38] Marilyn Undercroft: that's very isolating to new users

[15:39] Marilyn Undercroft: though a good idea :)

[15:39] Jingidy Dumpling: or do you mean providing a way to easily customize it?

[15:39] Dakota Schwade: Yes, HUD to me was a movie title for a long time.

[15:39] Jingidy Dumpling: and still have a default

[15:39] McCabe Maxsted assumes it'll be skinnable ;)

[15:39] Jacek Antonelli: hehehe

[15:39] Trinity Coulter: I agree with McCabe about the text overload there

[15:39] Trinity Coulter: might need to be streamlined some

[15:40] Marilyn Undercroft: we are developing a thumbnail preview/list before all these details, would that help with all the text?

[15:40] Jacek Antonelli: thumbnail/preview list would be good

[15:40] Trinity Coulter: your typical SL'er will have chat on the bottom, chat in an IM window, and then this added in as well

[15:40] Trinity Coulter: not much screen space left for a 3D world

[15:40] Jacek Antonelli: Especially with pictures :D

[15:40] Marilyn Undercroft: we did leave the bottom left as clear as possible on purpose

[15:41] Jingidy Dumpling: and we're trying to leave the middle open too

[15:41] Marilyn Undercroft: and you are looking to go to a new place so.....

[15:41] Marilyn Undercroft: but i hear ya

[15:41] Marilyn Undercroft: in any event, it's still smaller than search

[15:41] Trinity Coulter: this could just be part of the place name at the top

[15:42] Dakota Schwade: If it is built in to the viewer, images could be a Preference setting.

[15:42] Gloria Caudron: It's possible but sometimes we are recommendting groups and events

[15:42] Jingidy Dumpling: or maybe whether or not to show that much text could be a preference too

[15:42] Trinity Coulter: Gloria, could you explain what you mean by recommending a group?

[15:42] Gloria Caudron: yes this would be based on your interests

[15:43] Gloria Caudron: So if you have rated thing "thumbs up" which have certain keywords

[15:43] McCabe Maxsted: how do you gather our interests?

[15:43] Jacek Antonelli likes having a recommendation, instead of having to think of a specific thing that I want to do

[15:43] Gloria Caudron: associated with them, similar groups would be recommended to you

[15:43] Trinity Coulter: where are the ratings stored?

[15:43] Marilyn Undercroft: McCabe- we have several methods.... one is to have you input them directly via your profile

[15:43] Gloria Caudron: for example it might recommend a karaoke group if you like Karen's Karaoke place

[15:43] Marilyn Undercroft: another is to gather them from your ratings

[15:43] Nine Moulliez: can you clarify trinity?

[15:44] Marilyn Undercroft: and then another is from the option 'show more like this'

[15:44] Nine Moulliez: Ratings would be stored in the database and used in the future for things like recommendations

[15:44] Trinity Coulter: well we have data for ratings.... is this stored locally on the user's computer, or is it in the SL database?

[15:44] Marilyn Undercroft: in addition, you can browse other people's profiles and add them from there

[15:44] Nine Moulliez: Not locally.

[15:45] Ara Ember: the ratings are like a property of the land/event/group

[15:45] Ara Ember: it's within the information of these

[15:45] McCabe Maxsted: hm, okay. I think a lot of people will be worried this will be one of those "track everything you buy" kind of systems

[15:45] Trinity Coulter: yes

[15:45] Trinity Coulter: giant marketing database

[15:45] Marilyn Undercroft: every interest defaults to private and there is no rating of objects

[15:46] Jingidy Dumpling: or people

[15:46] Ara Ember: oh yeah please join the group if you are interested in helping us further

[15:46] Ara Ember: that's what tomiko is sending right now

[15:46] Joeseph Albanese: Yeah but essentially you are saying so and so shops here a lot?

[15:46] Tomiko: Please join 'HCI - Project Participants' : )

[15:46] Gloria Caudron: also, we would want to make it clear to users at which points

[15:46] McCabe Maxsted: what was that? benjamin's offering us a 16th group place just for this?

[15:46] Gloria Caudron: we are gathring informaton from them

[15:46] McCabe Maxsted: that's so nice of linden labs

[15:46] Marilyn Undercroft: hahahha

[15:46] McCabe Maxsted: *26th, rather

[15:46] Jacek Antonelli: lol

[15:46] Trinity Coulter gives McCabe 16 group slots

[15:46] Jingidy Dumpling: haha

[15:47] Kippie Friedkin: lol

[15:47] McCabe Maxsted: hehe

[15:47] Lars Donardson waves the "we need more groups" flag

[15:47] Kippie Friedkin is going to have to pick a group to leave to join this one

[15:47] Gloria Caudron: lol :)

[15:47] Dakota Schwade: After a while of gathering "likes" another button could be used to recommend places wildly outside of your interests, as a diversion, perhaps.

[15:47] Ara Ember: oops..

[15:47] Marilyn Undercroft: hmmm... intersting!

[15:47] Gloria Caudron: yes interesting :)

[15:47] Ara Ember: ya :)

[15:48] Dakota Schwade: I'm not just another pretty avatar.

[15:48] Ara Ember: lol

[15:48] Jacek Antonelli: What's the group called? I can't find any HCI - Project Participants...

[15:48] Gloria Caudron: lol

[15:48] McCabe Maxsted wishes they hadn't turnkated the group search functionality

[15:48] Trinity Coulter: if you are going to build something like this idea into the Viewer, you might get more participation from the community by simply creating a set of standards for web-based HUDs or widgets and adding that to the Viewer instead of this... people can develop this system independently

[15:48] Jacek Antonelli hates this useless new group search

[15:48] McCabe Maxsted: used to be so easy to find groups

[15:48] McCabe Maxsted: now, god

[15:49] McCabe Maxsted: they don't even show you how many members half the time

[15:49] Lars Donardson: Homeless...nope...humanistic...hmmmmm

[15:49] Kippie Friedkin: You can click on my profile to find that group. I found it :)

[15:49] Jingidy Dumpling: we could consider that as a next step, a web-based HUD

[15:49] Jacek Antonelli grumble grumble grumble.... "loco poco" didn't turn up the "loco pocos" group this weekend.. grumble grumble

[15:49] McCabe Maxsted: HCI founders?

[15:49] Jingidy Dumpling: could be useful

[15:49] Aimee Trescothick: Human Computer Interaction? What about Cat Computer Interaction

[15:49] Jacek Antonelli: thank you Ara

[15:49] Ara Ember: yw

[15:50] Marilyn Undercroft: i know they've done dog computer interaction

[15:50] Ara Ember: hot cats interaction

[15:50] Aimee Trescothick: :D

[15:50] McCabe Maxsted: aha thanks kippie

[15:50] Jacek Antonelli: "Cat Like Typing Detected!"

[15:50] McCabe Maxsted: hehe

[15:50] Kippie Friedkin: :)

[15:50] Jacek Antonelli: cat-computer interaction = sitting on my keyboard

[15:50] McCabe Maxsted: I considered getting that for my cat

[15:50] McCabe Maxsted: he loves to hop up and type secret messages

[15:50] Jei Desoto: i think as it might have been already said that a system like this integrated in the viewer would allow new players to find it sonner then HUDs.

[15:51] Jei Desoto: sooner even.

[15:51] Kippie Friedkin: agreed

[15:51] Trinity Coulter: this is a HUD

[15:51] Aimee Trescothick: it's just a built in one

[15:51] Trinity Coulter: i'm suggesting a new type of HUD/widget

[15:51] Jingidy Dumpling: like a LL hud that you have by default?

[15:51] Trinity Coulter: that is open to user-driven creations

[15:51] Trinity Coulter: yes

[15:52] Jei Desoto: And i'm giving a reason as to being part of the native UI whould make it easier to new people.

[15:52] Trinity Coulter: and could accept web based interfaces, etc

[15:52] Ara Ember is Online

[15:52] Trinity Coulter: right, but this is a HUD nontheless... built in or not

[15:52] Trinity Coulter: certain things will have to be added to the viewer for this to function

[15:53] Jei Desoto: Then your previous statement answers itself.

[15:53] Jacek Antonelli: Aye, it's a HUD -- rather than a HUD Attachment

[15:53] Trinity Coulter: why not just establish a standard for such new things

[15:53] Marilyn Undercroft: what types of things trinity?

[15:53] Trinity Coulter: and extend content creation to the Viewer itself

[15:53] Trinity Coulter: HUD 2.0

[15:53] Ara Ember: 0.0

[15:53] Jingidy Dumpling: Like the toolbar would be a HUD instead

[15:53] Jingidy Dumpling: ?

[15:53] Aimee Trescothick: Viewer plugins have been talked about a lot in the past

[15:53] Lars Donardson points to the open viewer /Dev meetings

[15:54] Jacek Antonelli thinks that's probably a teensy bit beyond the scope of their project...

[15:54] Trinity Coulter: you're already halfway there with this project

[15:54] Jei Desoto: Sounds like a major jump in viewer code though... Might be better to wor toward something like that in steps.

[15:54] Jingidy Dumpling: Yeah, we don't really have the resources to accomplish that, for the project

[15:55] Dakota Schwade: When are you contemplating testing this ratings system?

[15:55] Trinity Coulter: i'm actually just suggesting a simplification :)

[15:55] Marilyn Undercroft: asap

[15:55] Lars Donardson: RL asap or SL asap

[15:55] Ara Ember: we are going to test the design no tthe system itself

[15:55] Lars Donardson snickers

[15:55] McCabe Maxsted: distribute a hud inworld for us to try out?

[15:55] Jei Desoto: Even in simplicity some things take to much code differance if it's function is very differant then current function. So this emediate plan seems like a good step in the right direction for now.

[15:56] Gloria Caudron: unforutnately we don't have the resources to do that

[15:56] Ara Ember: when Lindens actually make these... ;)

[15:56] Jacek Antonelli: hehe

[15:56] Ara Ember: so.. we are the designers, not coders

[15:56] Aimee Trescothick: problem is the viewer needs a major overhaul to make that possible, but everytime a new feature gets added it makes that task a little more complicated

[15:56] Trinity Coulter: yes, exactly my point, Aimee

[15:57] Lars Donardson already braces himself for the whining orgy on the blog when this feature will be announced

[15:57] Marilyn Undercroft: indeed, we considered reworking this into search but it's, again, outside of our scope

[15:57] Tomiko: I'm sure it would go through beta stages and bug testing before it got made the main viewer

[15:57] McCabe Maxsted nods

[15:57] Trinity Coulter: well, it needs to be rock solid against abuse

[15:57] Tomiko: Yes, and it'd all be part of testing and improving

[15:57] Marilyn Undercroft: yes, that's our main focus now (abuse)

[15:58] Dakota Schwade: Is this system, for lack of my understanding, "bot" proof then?

[15:58] Lars Donardson nods..the abuse potential is enormous

[15:58] Jingidy Dumpling: depends on how it is implemented? =)

[15:58] Jacek Antonelli: I think this system would be a useful addition to the viewer. Benefit well beyond the cost of the added code.

[15:58] Jei Desoto: Nothing is rock solid. There are always ways around any abuse free system. So whatever is planned to help keep the abuse down will be enough to suffice... This -is- still in the works.

[15:58] Ara Ember: yes. we are spending a lot of time thinking about abuse.

[15:59] Grant Linden: We are drawing close to the end of the hour. I want to let everyone know that next week (July 17) Jacek Antonelli will present their design for the viewer contest

[15:59] Aimee Trescothick: The was some useful discussion on sl-dev about ways of preventing gaming in the past

[15:59] Ara Ember: just tho' if we could find abuse proof way of doing the reputation system.. we definitely will earn a lot of money from amazon ;)

[15:59] Jei Desoto: Yeah... Abuse is big thing and all, but i don't wanna see fear of it ruining a potentially good system to find your way around the maze we have now.

[15:59] McCabe Maxsted: the potential for abuse is limited by how much effect this will have on SL™ lives, too; you won't be able to ruin someone's business with it, or shouldn't be able to

[15:59] Jacek Antonelli: whee :D

[15:59] McCabe Maxsted: oooh

[15:59] Trinity Coulter: you could limit rating strength on "no payment info" people

[15:59] Lars Donardson: I may sound crazy but I can picture estate/club owners actually paying ppl to cast negative votes for competitors

[15:59] McCabe Maxsted expects dressing up and laser pointers

[15:59] Squirrel Wood: that is definitely going to happen

[15:59] Kippie Friedkin: lol

[15:59] Jacek Antonelli: Not crazy at all, Lars

[16:00] Gloria Caudron: yes were were thinking of Lars' point

[16:00] Trinity Coulter: Jei, abuse has to be a serious concern because it is about money here

[16:00] Lars Donardson: well..I didn't want to sound too discouraging..lol

[16:00] Ara Ember: heh

[16:00] Squirrel Wood: create alt, vote negative, dispose of alt....

[16:00] Trinity Coulter: i think these ideas are wonderful

[16:00] Trinity Coulter: i love their suggestions

[16:00] Trinity Coulter: but it WILL get abused

[16:00] Ara Ember: yes.

[16:00] Marilyn Undercroft: we are considering some way to dissassociate the rating from the av so you couldn't tell if the person you paid actually did what you asked

[16:00] Lars Donardson: and stop this "no payment info talking pls"..not my fault that I can't get one on file grmmph..unless LL changes their policy that is

[16:00] Jingidy Dumpling: yup, these are great ideas to try to minimize the abuse

[16:00] Tomiko: There could always be banned words for cxomments etc.

[16:01] Jei Desoto: Serious yes, and that's my point... as it was stated, they are working on things to keep it to minimum. There fore it shouldn't be a fear to stop something like this being implimneted if they have ways to minimise that risk.

[16:01] Grant Linden: Thanks to everyone for coming, one more time I want to let everyone know that next week (July 17) Jacek Antonelli will present their design for the viewer contest

[16:01] Gloria Caudron: yes and hopefully since your profile is more public

[16:01] Gloria Caudron: there would be more accountability for your posts

[16:01] Gloria Caudron: yes thank you

[16:01] Nine Moulliez: thank you everyone for all the feedback. they were ery helpful!

[16:01] Jingidy Dumpling: thank you so much for all the suggestions and feedback

[16:01] Marilyn Undercroft: thank you all so much for your great feedback!

[16:01] Ara Ember: lmao

[16:01] Jingidy Dumpling: =D

[16:01] Jei Desoto: See ya' : 3

[16:01] McCabe Maxsted looks forward to hearing more about this

[16:01] Nine Moulliez: ^ ^

[16:01] Tomiko: Wow ery helpful!

[16:01] Jacek Antonelli: Thanks for presenting, guys! Best luck with the project :)

[16:01] Kippie Friedkin: Thank you for the great presentation.

[16:02] Tomiko: That's even better than very! : D

[16:02] Ara Ember: thank you everyone and err.. feedbacks..

[16:02] Ara Ember echos

[16:02] Jacek Antonelli: hehe

[16:02] Nine Moulliez: =]

[16:02] Squirrel Wood: POKE!!!!

[16:02] Marilyn Undercroft: :D

[16:02] Gloria Caudron: thanks!

[16:02] Tomiko: Sorry Ara to be sat on you

[16:02] Ara Ember: no prob

[16:02] Ara Ember: seriously.. they should let default action to make us be able to pet furry avatars

[16:03] Jacek Antonelli: hee

[16:03] McCabe Maxsted: haha

[16:03] Squirrel Wood: ^^

[16:03] McCabe Maxsted could get behind that

[16:03] Aimee Trescothick purrs

[16:03] Benjamin Linden: thanks for coming everyone

[16:03] Benjamin Linden: great crowd today!

[16:03] Ara Ember: :D

[16:03] McCabe Maxsted: must be cause all the UI stuff lately :D

[16:04] Jacek Antonelli: yeah, I think everyone wanted to come say thanks for the skin switching xD

[16:04] Aimee Trescothick: yup, lots of UI stuffing

[16:04] Aimee Trescothick: and that too :D

[16:04] Malbers Linden: thanks all. see you next week.

[16:04] Benjamin Linden: you're quite welcome!

[16:04] McCabe Maxsted cheers for that

[16:04] Benjamin Linden: :-)

[16:04] Jacek Antonelli: take care Malbers

[16:04] McCabe Maxsted: :)

[16:04] Squirrel Wood: Have a grrrrrrrrrrrrrreat weekend!

[16:04] McCabe Maxsted: take care malbers

[16:04] Ara Ember: thank you all! and thank you tomiko for the group :)

[16:04] Kippie Friedkin: cya Malbers!

[16:04] Tomiko: It's OKI Ara!

[16:05] Benjamin Linden: McCabe, if you have time it would be great to get the skinning wiki pages update to reflect recent changes

[16:05] Lars Donardson: let's all say a prayer to the asset gods before we leave *grins*

[16:05] Tomiko: : D

[16:05] McCabe Maxsted: will do ;)

[16:05] Jacek Antonelli: lol

[16:05] Garn Conover: that still works

[16:05] Garn Conover: test #3

[16:05] Jingidy Dumpling: bye everyone =)

[16:05] Joeseph Albanese: rofl I donated a few thousand items to them last week they should be good

[16:05] Benjamin Linden: thanks again for the classic skin. you're in the list of resident contributors in "About Second Life"

[16:05] Benjamin Linden: or will be in the production viewer

[16:06] McCabe Maxsted: XD hehe

[16:06] Benjamin Linden: ok everyone, I have to run. see you next week!

[16:06] Jacek Antonelli: There he is! :D

[16:06] Jacek Antonelli: ciao Ben!

[16:06] Kippie Friedkin: Awesome. Congrats. McCabe!

[16:06] Kippie Friedkin: Cya Ben

[16:06] Benjamin Linden: thanks Ara and CMU team

[16:06] Benjamin Linden: for presenting today

[16:06] Benjamin Linden: great job

[16:06] Squirrel Wood: Eeeep!

[16:06] Benjamin Linden: let's talk about feedback tomorrow