Mesh/Archive/2012-03-19

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Agenda

  1. I know the collision box is an elipsoid shaped sphere. But, I don't understand how it related to the Collision Skeleton. What is the avatar collision skeleton found in Develop->Avatar->Show Collision Skeleton? Nalates Urriah 14:41, 17 March 2012 (PDT)
  2. Mesh import formats roadmap and need to update import mesh formats already in use (DAE only at the moment)
  3. Status of the usergroup
  4. Status of the mesh clothing parametric deformer
  5. How to cut down your prim equivalency cost? Are people supposed to cut repeating parts as separate mesh objects and then copy+link them in world? Also cut simple mesh parts that could be replaced with prims? Because this is what it looks like when i was creating a medieval tower. FadeOut Razorfen
  6. Any mesh stats? Nalates Urriah
  7. Will we be getting hinges back? CrystalShard Foo
  8. When non attached rigged mesh is going to be scheduled ? FadeOut Razorfen
  9. Thank you Nyx for getting the UG back on the UG list. Nalates Urriah


Meeting Notes

Transcript for Monday March 19, 2012

[12:01] Nyx Linden greetings all
[12:01] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) yea, but BVH doesn't have those bones animated
[12:01] CrystalShard Foo But your substring implementation looks right in a fast look
[12:01] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Hello, Nalates.
[12:01] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Hello, Nyx.
[12:02] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) greetings Vir
[12:02] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Hey Vir.
[12:02] CrystalShard Foo Heys
[12:02] DrFran Babcock greetings all
[12:02] Vir Linden Howdy folks
[12:02] DrFran Babcock hope I don't sit on anyone
[12:02] Vincent Nacon naa you're good
[12:02] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Hello, Vir.
[12:03] Nyx Linden we don't have many topics yet today: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Content_Creation/Mesh_Import_User_Group
[12:03] CrystalShard Foo I'm guessing it's too late to add?
[12:03] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) no
[12:04] Nyx Linden nope, feel free to add more
[12:04] CrystalShard Foo What do we call the stretchy mesh thing again?
[12:04] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) rigged mesh
[12:04] Vincent Nacon some people don't bother using the wiki as much anymore, thanks to Andrew and Simon Linden for not enforcing it
[12:04] Vincent Nacon and Kelly I think
[12:04] CrystalShard Foo Not rigged mesh, the stretchy one that goes around body fat and so on
[12:04] CrystalShard Foo Rather than just bone
[12:04] CrystalShard Foo mesh deforms
[12:04] CrystalShard Foo smething
[12:05] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) the parametric deformer
[12:05] Nyx Linden alright let's jump into it
[12:05] CrystalShard Foo That'sthe one, thanks
[12:05] Nyx Linden first topic: "I know the collision box is an elipsoid shaped sphere. But, I don't understand how it related to the Collision Skeleton. What is the avatar collision skeleton found in Develop->Avatar->Show Collision Skeleton? Nalates Urriah 14:41, 17 March 2012 (PDT)"
[12:05] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Hey Runitai.
[12:05] davep (runitai.linden) howdy
[12:05] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) hi Runitai
[12:05] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Hello Runitai.
[12:06] Nal (nalates.urriah) ?
[12:06] CrystalShard Foo Nix, added!
[12:06] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) i always thought those were bones nal
[12:07] Nal (nalates.urriah) The word collision in collision skeleton throws me...
[12:07] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) oh, also question about the prim equivalency. for example if i have this tower... am i supposed to cut down its PE cost by linking repeating parts, or replacing some stuff with tubes ? because otherwise its VERY prim costy
[12:07] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) seems to me that collision skeleton would be used for inverse kinematics than anything
[12:07] Nyx Linden please add other topics to the agenda so we can stay on topic, thanks :)
[12:07] davep (runitai.linden) the shapes shown in "show collision skeleton" are used for alt-zooming on your avatar
[12:07] davep (runitai.linden) or right clicking on your avatar
[12:07] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) ah
[12:07] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) interesting
[12:08] davep (runitai.linden) see the raycast info display
[12:08] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) that makes so much sense
[12:08] Nal (nalates.urriah) So, they are more like pick points?
[12:08] davep (runitai.linden) yup
[12:08] davep (runitai.linden) the simulator just uses a single ellipsoid for the whole avatar
[12:08] davep (runitai.linden) (simulator doesn't have a skeleton for each avatar, doesn't do animation)
[12:09] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) it would be nice if there was an info display for that ellipsoid
[12:09] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) I would have guessed a capsule, but nifty
[12:09] davep (runitai.linden) could probably add that to the physics shape display "someday maybe" :-p
[12:09] Nal (nalates.urriah) I found Andrews old 2009 stuff where he talks about the collision box/eleipse. But, nothing much on what this skeleton thing is.
[12:09] Nal (nalates.urriah) collision skeleton^
[12:10] CrystalShard Foo I remember Jeffrey Ventrella briefly working at LL to work out a collision mesh that was skeleton shaped, but that was aborted.
[12:11] Nal (nalates.urriah) There is a big discussion in oneof the non-LL forums about what mesh avatars do to the collision target area for weapons.
[12:11] davep (runitai.linden) yeah, ventrella tried using the collision skeleton for making flexis not go through your avatar, but it never worked right
[12:11] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) would it have been easier if flexis were done via a shader versus their current implimentation?
[12:11] Nyx Linden that's a surprisingly tough problem to solve
[12:11] davep (runitai.linden) when the mouse cursor hover code came in, we had to replace the old pixel-perfect pick render raycast with a CPU based one for performance reasons, and the avatar collision skeleton happened to be left in the code, so it was a natural choice for raycasting
[12:11] Nal (nalates.urriah) So, far the best test is to drop a prim on the avatar's head.
[12:12] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) That stuff is hard even in SFX in high budget movies...
[12:12] CrystalShard Foo Ahh.
[12:12] Nyx Linden next topic: "Mesh import formats roadmap and need to update import mesh formats already in use (DAE only at the moment)"
[12:13] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) r8
[12:13] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) the latest RL softwares are moving to newer DAE versions
[12:13] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) and they aren`t supported by SL
[12:13] Nyx Linden We will certainly review and possibly accept patches to accept other file formats, DAE works most places currently :)
[12:14] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) maybe we could have one or more formats
[12:14] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) i think she is just asking for a dae version picker or something
[12:14] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) some for non-rigged meshes and others for rigged meshes
[12:14] CrystalShard Foo The new DAE version is making things somewhat more complex.
[12:14] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) very
[12:14] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) most exporters should retain some degree of compatibility with 1.4.1
[12:14] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) but newer RL software versions too
[12:14] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) mostly because most game engines don't even support newer versions (yet)
[12:14] davep (runitai.linden) COLLADA is *supposed* to be backwards compatible, if it's not and you've got a 3D modelling tool that can't export to second life through COLLADA, please open a jira and include sample content
[12:15] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) 1.40 is not supported by SL atm, i think
[12:15] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) the textures cerated in RL are not fiting the imported models in DAE 1.41
[12:15] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) 1.4.0 should work with SL
[12:15] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) 1.4.1 should work as well
[12:15] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) sorry, i wanted to say that 1.41 is not supprted by SL atm
[12:16] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) 1.40 is
[12:16] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) they both should work, I've imported content with both of them; sounds more like a bug if it's not working for you
[12:16] Vincent Nacon that can be a big problem for people who just brought Max 3Ds/Maya 2012
[12:16] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) and there is a difference in prims countings between 1.40 and 1.41
[12:16] Nyx Linden if you have sample content that doesn't import correctly due to versioning, send it our way and we'll take a look
[12:16] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i am having a problem with softimage 2012
[12:17] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) but softimage 2011 looks good exporting collada
[12:17] Motor Loon I use Softimage 2012, havent seen issues
[12:17] Vincent Nacon and I do say big problem, even though there's a work around by using FBX but.. the problem is with the Maxscripts that needed for exporting such a large project
[12:17] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) softimage 2011 collada exporter is V5.0
[12:17] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) and softimage 2012 collada exporter is v.2012.0
[12:18] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) Motor: and textures generated by rendermap, do they fit well?
[12:18] Motor Loon yep
[12:18] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) can you explain me later how you do it?
[12:18] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i mean teh procedures
[12:18] Nyx Linden package up an exported collada file in a JIRA with what you get when you try to upload it, we'll take a look. We want to support collada, any other formats other devs are welcome to patch in and we'll review them :)
[12:19] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) Motor: can i add you?
[12:19] Motor Loon sure
[12:20] Nyx Linden next topic: "Status of the usergroup"
[12:20] Nyx Linden as you might see here, we're continuing the usergroup *celebrate*
[12:20] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) we are also facing recalculation of prims counts by mesh prims uploaded monthes ago, but that needs another topic and i will not add it today
[12:20] CrystalShard Foo :D
[12:20] Motor Loon yaay we're still here
[12:20] Nyx Linden if you have any questions about what topics are appropriate, feel free to send them my way
[12:20] Latif Khalifa /me wonders how hard would it be to add option to to uploader to upload ll mesh asset format? then external converters could be scripted to make it. perhaps easier than make them inside the viewer
[12:20] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) for now i just say that more people are finding that older uploads have now bigger prims countings
[12:21] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) i just updated the agenda and put there my topic
[12:21] DrFran Babcock yikes, I will have to check
[12:21] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) ty Motor
[12:22] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) and put the demo inworld
[12:22] Nyx Linden next topic: "Status of the mesh clothing parametric deformer"
[12:22] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) oh
[12:22] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) cool
[12:22] Nyx Linden Oz is the linden working with Qarl, he would have more up to date status than we would
[12:22] Motor Loon Dont think there's any news on the deformer yet
[12:22] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) there are betas around
[12:22] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) like Zen viewer
[12:23] CrystalShard Foo There was a code sample out awhile back but I haven't heard anything new since.
[12:23] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Last Oz said was that the code didn't merge cleanly into v-d.
[12:23] Nal (nalates.urriah) A couple of TPV Dev said the same.
[12:23] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i think taht the latest Zen and snowglobe my have a beta with mesh clotehs parametric deformer, i am not sure
[12:23] Motor Loon so it likely back on Karls table
[12:23] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) Nyran`s viewer too
[12:24] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Oz mentioned it needs someone who knows the rendering engine to deal with it.
[12:24] Vincent Nacon I might be a bit out of loop on deformer deal but... is there a way or even talk about flagging a prim to use deform or not?
[12:25] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) there's been talk
[12:25] Geenz Kitten (geenz.spad) but that's about it
[12:25] CrystalShard Foo My guess is that it would be better off disabled by default.
[12:25] Nal (nalates.urriah) The one in Niran's is slow on the initial attach of a mesh. If you play with it give it a couple of minutes to start working before changing avatar shape to test or expecting it to render right.
[12:25] Vincent Nacon yeah
[12:25] Nyx Linden next topic: "How to cut down your prim equivalency cost? Are people supposed to cut repeating parts as separate mesh objects and then copy+link them in world? Also cut simple mesh parts that could be replaced with prims? Because this is what it looks like when i was creating a medieval tower. FadeOut Razorfen"
[12:26] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) good i just rezzed this jeep i am working on
[12:26] Vincent Nacon I'm sure people who already uploaded their rigged mesh avatar or clothes would be upset if it become too small
[12:26] Nyx Linden complex topic, but lets see if we can break it down a bit
[12:26] Vincent Nacon ok
[12:26] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i reduced so far from 120 prims to 57 and still will go down
[12:26] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) here is the tower model i'm talking about
[12:26] Nyx Linden first of all, prims are still useful, if there are very simple parts of your object that are more easily done in prims, by all means use prims
[12:26] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) above us
[12:27] Nyx Linden secondly, how you break apart a mesh will definitely have an impact on the cost as well as how LODs are handled
[12:27] Motor Loon LOD really is the key to low LI on mesh
[12:27] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) i've did everything i could on LOD
[12:27] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) doesn't help
[12:27] Nyx Linden its a tradeoff - smaller objects will have lower land impact because the lower LODs will be displayed at larger distances
[12:27] Vincent Nacon /me cringes to see the physic weight of that tower....
[12:28] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Isn't it the other way around?
[12:28] Nyx Linden which means that if you break things up into smaller pieces, it can save on land impact cost, but it will make individual pieces change LOD at different points
[12:28] Nyx Linden larger ranges/areas, sorry
[12:28] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i used what Runitai and more people told me
[12:28] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) both wheels are identical
[12:29] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) the left one i lowered the most i could the low and lowest lods in import
[12:29] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) oh i see, but thats how its should be done... this is quite logical
[12:29] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) the right one i just uploaded as it came out
[12:29] Nyx Linden also, land impact is whatever the highest weight is - some objects have a high streaming weight, others have high physics cost
[12:29] Vincent Nacon wait... you made two different textures for it?
[12:29] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) thee prims counts are different
[12:29] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) yes, a texture for each
[12:29] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) I made a chain Link, got it down to 5 LI. But if I were to make the same thing with sculpts, and make it opt into I think it would end up at 16 something.
[12:29] Vincent Nacon ...why?
[12:29] Nyx Linden so check the details floater for each object and see which wieght is causing the most problem.
[12:29] Vincent Nacon just flip the UV map on other one
[12:29] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) or the characters would look like in a mirror
[12:30] Vincent Nacon you still can reuse it
[12:30] Vincent Nacon just flip UV map for the other side
[12:30] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) display 9000? physics 240
[12:30] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) 2012-03-19T19:29:33Z llrender/llrendertarget.cpp(407) : error
[12:30] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) What the hell does that mean? :/
[12:30] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Nyx, that chain link I mentioned, it's more efficient than a sculpt, no?
[12:31] Nyx Linden can you rez it off to the side? its helpful to look at actual examples
[12:31] davep (runitai.linden) Koli: that means you tickled the viewer in a way that it tried to use a render target that's not initialized
[12:31] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) i've rezzed it already
[12:31] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) its above us
[12:31] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) o_O
[12:31] davep (runitai.linden) probably some combination of deferred rendering and wireframe
[12:31] davep (runitai.linden) ?
[12:31] Nyx Linden the tower for example has a complex physics cost, even though its streaming cost is fairly low
[12:31] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Ah, I had that mesh selected and was camming around it.
[12:31] davep (runitai.linden) or the render target failed to initialize and we tried to use it anyway
[12:32] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Why did you choose such a complex physics shape?
[12:32] Motor Loon a fairly lowpoly cylinder should do the trick
[12:32] Nyx Linden keep in mind physics triangles are a lot more costly than render triangles
[12:32] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) still its not the problem, display is 9000, physics is just 240
[12:32] Anthonys Republic yeah i noticed that
[12:32] Nyx Linden linking it with an invisible cylinder to use as a physics representation would probably suffice
[12:32] davep (runitai.linden) display doesn't hit your land impact
[12:33] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) oh, thats great idea
[12:33] davep (runitai.linden) it's just a metric for reference
[12:33] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) CAn you get the land impact down by making a physics shape of prims and and set the Mesh to none?
[12:33] Nyx Linden yes!
[12:33] CrystalShard Foo o.o
[12:33] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i also would like to show an example that Talin Sands called me the attention to
[12:33] CrystalShard Foo /me marks the center of her bingo card
[12:33] davep (runitai.linden) brb, lost my caps
[12:33] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) I made a chain Link, got it down to 5 LI. But if I were to make the same thing with sculpts, and make it opt into I think it would end up at 16 something.
[12:33] Nyx Linden it is absolutely fine and encouraged to use attached prims as a physics shape, and set the mesh shape to none.
[12:33] Latif Khalifa but then prims can count twice or 3 times as much ;)
[12:33] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Nyx, that chain link I mentioned, it's more efficient than a sculpt, no?
[12:34] Anthonys Republic is that better then a box physics nyx?
[12:34] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) check teh prims counts of does two objects
[12:34] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Latif, not if you use untortured prims.
[12:34] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) teh white ones
[12:34] Anthonys Republic say a box physics uploaded
[12:35] Nyx Linden comparing whether a sculptie or a mesh is more efficient is....not an easy question :)
[12:35] Vincent Nacon also it's depends on the side of it
[12:35] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) the difference between does two objects is big in prims count
[12:35] Motor Loon physics again
[12:35] Vincent Nacon but no matter how small it goes... it's gonna be 0.5
[12:35] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) one is 181 pme and the other is 2 pme
[12:35] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) I guess I need to know, because this is just one link in the necklace and belt I am wearing at the moment.
[12:36] Motor Loon 2.4 physics vs 181.4
[12:36] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) one is much less only because has one more side so SL can treat it as a box for physics
[12:37] Nyx Linden I'd really hesitate to call any chain where each link was modeled "efficient" by any stretch of the imagination, whether prim or sculptie
[12:37] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) so, a mesh shape should always be closed enough for SL finds a base for give it a box shape physics
[12:37] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Ooops.
[12:37] Latif Khalifa breaking a big mesh into several smaller peaces to achieve lower PE inworld just tells you how "logical" PE formulas are ;)
[12:37] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) So much more easy to fit that way though.
[12:38] Latif Khalifa (streaming cost/scale one is totally out of whack)
[12:38] Vincent Nacon you just need to know the right scale for that piece of the chain and make another chain in the same mesh object till it reach 0.5 in that scale
[12:38] Nyx Linden you can probably get more efficient if you create the whole chain in your modeler, though yes it will take more tweaking to size right
[12:38] Vincent Nacon then build the whole set of the chain with it
[12:39] davep (runitai.linden) er, I'm confused
[12:39] davep (runitai.linden) I don't see those links on the chain you're wearing
[12:39] TheyCallMeDick Cheney /me coughs ... Instancing
[12:39] Vincent Nacon he's just showing one piece of the chain link itself
[12:39] Vincent Nacon it's one of those typical necklace chain kind
[12:39] davep (runitai.linden) what is that box around the link?
[12:39] Vincent Nacon not the construction chain kind
[12:40] Vincent Nacon I think he made it for touch
[12:40] Anthonys Republic yeah i see that box to hmm was wondering, looks like a poly cube with trans
[12:40] Vincent Nacon to make it easier ot touch when it's smaller?
[12:40] Vincent Nacon to*
[12:41] Second Life Entering god mode, level 150
[12:41] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) So, eh, It would be more efficient to make them in sets of three, even if the LODs are the same?
[12:41] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) For example?
[12:41] Second Life Now leaving god mode, level 150
[12:41] davep (runitai.linden) depends
[12:41] Vincent Nacon 3 or more... till you reached 0.5 weight in normal size
[12:42] davep (runitai.linden) the trade off is object overhead vs instancing overhead
[12:42] TheyCallMeDick Cheney true
[12:42] Nyx Linden it should allow you to eliminate some redundant triangles that way possibly
[12:42] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) And can someone tell me the difference between those two wheel that have different land impact, because I can't figure it out...
[12:42] Nyx Linden especially for the lower LODs
[12:42] davep (runitai.linden) instancing each link the way you have it is good for mesh streaming overhead, but it adds object overhead
[12:42] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i told already but i repeat, Alve
[12:43] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Davep, that terminology was over my head
[12:43] Vincent Nacon the thing is... you're using 8 sides, best to use 5 sides when it's going to be small
[12:43] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) jr, tahnks, and sorry!
[12:43] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) one i uploaded as it came out, is teh right one, the left one i lowered all way down the low and lowest LOD levels in uploading so the PME is much lower
[12:43] Nyx Linden since they're all the same model, you only have to download one mode, but then you have to track the position & orientation of each individual link instead of each set of 3
[12:43] Vincent Nacon but that's just another typical videogame making rules
[12:43] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) np, Alve, yw
[12:44] CrystalShard Foo /me updates wiki agenda~
[12:44] Nyx Linden alright ready for the next topic?
[12:44] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) sure
[12:44] Nyx Linden next topic: "Any mesh stats? Nalates Urriah"
[12:45] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) jr, so you neglected to make less complex LODS for the high LI one, basically?
[12:45] Nyx Linden I don't have the report on hand that generated those stats, I'll ask around for next week
[12:45] Nyx Linden new stats: most regions have meshes. yay! :)
[12:45] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) no, i maintained the highest and middle lods as default
[12:46] Nyx Linden next topic: "Will we be getting hinges back? CrystalShard Foo"
[12:46] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) i just lowered the maximum it was allowed the LOW and LOWEST LODS at the upload
[12:46] Motor Loon in our dreams ;-)I
[12:46] CrystalShard Foo Shh~
[12:46] CrystalShard Foo I just figured, with all the recent changes to physics and the introduction of physics mesh..
[12:47] Vincent Nacon by hinges, you mean constraints that Havok's library source have?
[12:47] Nyx Linden getting them back? did we used to have hinges? *searches his memory banks*
[12:47] CrystalShard Foo Heck yea we did :D
[12:47] Motor Loon looong ago
[12:47] Vincent Nacon and you should ask Falcon or Andrew for that
[12:47] CrystalShard Foo Up to 2006 I think
[12:47] CrystalShard Foo I used to use them on swing doors i 2004.
[12:47] CrystalShard Foo *in
[12:47] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Aaah.
[12:47] Nyx Linden aaah ok
[12:47] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) they were called joints
[12:48] Vincent Nacon yup
[12:48] CrystalShard Foo Oh right, thanks
[12:48] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) i actually have a few in my inventory they don't work anymore
[12:48] Vincent Nacon and a stupid name for t
[12:48] Anthonys Republic hinges as in pivot points on mesh, pleaseeeee. been using a single face poly to offset the pivot
[12:48] Vincent Nacon it*
[12:48] CrystalShard Foo I have atleast one broken build that used them
[12:48] Vincent Nacon I doubt it would work soon as you rez it
[12:48] Motor Loon yeah custom pivots on mesh would be reaaal nice
[12:48] CrystalShard Foo Nope, the door remains static on the joint
[12:48] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) I have been toying with the idea of just having a convex surface that I put a texture of the high LOD on for the lowest LOD.
[12:48] CrystalShard Foo Support was removed sim side entirely. The client function was removed about a year later.
[12:49] Nyx Linden we're currently working on trying to stabilize the features we already have over getting new features for the time being, so sounds like a nice feature request, but I don't think we have it on our schedules currently
[12:49] Anthonys Republic pivots are a big deal to me anyways lol plus when coems to physics it would be cheaper if the object was pivoted correctly
[12:50] Nyx Linden which brings me to my next topic: "When non attached rigged mesh is going to be scheduled ? FadeOut Razorfen"
[12:50] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Would I need a hidden triangle with that texture on on the other LODS?
[12:50] Nyx Linden I don't know when :) most of our teams are focused on fixing the things that are broken right now
[12:50] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) like, any idea
[12:50] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) That material on I mean.
[12:50] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) so absolutely no ideas ?
[12:51] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) next year or a couple of months ?
[12:51] Nyx Linden its a great feature, would love to see it. I personally do not know when we will have cycles to work on it.
[12:51] –ü–æ—Ä–≤—É –ü—É—Ç–∏–Ω–∞ –∑–∞ –æ—á–∫–æ (fadeout.razorfen) allright
[12:51] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) I have been toying with the idea of just having a convex surface that I put a texture of the high LOD on for the lowest LOD.
[12:51] Motor Loon /me adds more cycles
[12:51] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Would I need a hidden triangle with that texture on on the other LODS?
[12:52] Motor Loon yes davido
[12:52] Nyx Linden one more topic and 10 minutes to go, "Thank you Nyx for getting the UG back on the UG list. Nalates Urriah"
[12:52] Vincent Nacon yup
[12:52] Nal (nalates.urriah) Yes... hooray for you. :)
[12:52] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) UG?
[12:53] Anthonys Republic ugggg
[12:53] Nal (nalates.urriah) user group
[12:53] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Yeah, thanks! As you can see, we need it!
[12:53] Anthonys Republic oh
[12:53] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) cool, thanks
[12:53] Vincent Nacon underground, like the cool kids do!
[12:53] Vincent Nacon :P
[12:53] Nal (nalates.urriah) :p
[12:53] Latif Khalifa So since mesh project shipped before 2027, what other project is occupying that coveted time slot? :P
[12:53] Anthonys Republic can a mesh hold multiple uv sets in sl?
[12:53] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) npc, i think
[12:53] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Yes.
[12:54] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Up to six, is it?
[12:54] Vincent Nacon that would be nice but no.... it does?
[12:54] Nyx Linden /me was thinking the give nyx a vacation project might be a good one to work on before 2027 :D
[12:54] Vincent Nacon unless you're talking about materials?
[12:54] Anthonys Republic no i dont mean materials up to 8 that is, i mean for 1 material can it hold multiple uv sets
[12:54] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Oh. I am. Doh.
[12:54] davep (runitai.linden) Anthony: no, just one
[12:54] Nyx Linden but currently focused on avatar rezzing issues
[12:54] Anthonys Republic k
[12:55] CrystalShard Foo You should ask to be alloted research money for the project in order to run a localized regional experiment. Specifically, Hawaii.
[12:55] Nal (nalates.urriah) Any news on that front? More logs still needed?
[12:55] Vincent Nacon yeah, just one. although it would be nice to have more for better landscaping with repeatable textures
[12:55] Anthonys Republic whos in hawaii?
[12:55] Nyx Linden more logs are always appreciated! there's a lot of points where things can break
[12:55] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Oh, about that physics tests thing on Aditi for Path finding. CanI have a space for a simball court that won'
[12:55] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) t get returned?
[12:56] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) We really need to be able to see if it will break the game in any way.
[12:56] Anthonys Republic really appreciate all the hard work lindens thanks bunch :)
[12:57] Vincent Nacon aye
[12:57] Anthonys Republic get those pivots in and i may send ya a mesh chocolate cake :)
[12:58] Nyx Linden So I think that's going to wrap us up for this week :)
[12:58] davep (runitai.linden) /me runs away to fight the sculpt crash monster.
[12:58] davep (runitai.linden) later, folks!
[12:58] Vincent Nacon take care
[12:58] Nyx Linden thanks everyone for coming out!
[12:58] Nal (nalates.urriah) bye
[12:58] Koli Melune (sahkolihaa.contepomi) See you, Lindens.
[12:58] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) k, thanks all
[12:58] Latif Khalifa laters
[12:58] Nal (nalates.urriah) Thx Nyx
[12:58] draconis.neurocam (draconis.neurocam) thanks
[12:58] jr (jr4201.kruyschek) see ya guys
[12:58] Nyx Linden come back next week and don't forget to add new topics!
[12:58] Vir Linden btw, pathfinding requests should go to lorca
[12:59] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) See you, next week.
[12:59] Vir Linden bye all
[12:59] Latif Khalifa bye
[12:59] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Lorca, Lorca@lindelab.com?
[12:59] Vir Linden yup
[12:59] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) +n
[12:59] ÄlveKatt (davido.chrome) Ok. thanks!