Open Source Meeting/2009-11-12

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  • [14:01] Q Linden: hi, all
  • [14:01] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: you were at scott's meeting as well
  • [14:01] Sebastean Steamweaver: Hello Q, Merov :)
  • [14:01] Fury Rosewood: hi Q
  • [14:01] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: hello merov!
  • [14:01] Merov Linden: hi guys
  • [14:01] Twisted Laws: hello's
  • [14:01] Sebastean Steamweaver: Hey Rob
  • [14:01] Merov Linden: full house today...
  • [14:01] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Hey Rob.
  • [14:01] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: hey rob!
  • [14:01] Ilse Artful: hellos's i want sex
  • [14:01] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: lol
  • [14:01] Ardy Lay: Hello
  • [14:01] Rob Linden: hi all
  • [14:01] Questar Utu: 0_o
  • [14:01] Fury Rosewood: hey rob
  • [14:02] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: dotn mind ilse, she keeps harrasing LL OH's i guess
  • [14:02] Fury Rosewood: boot to the arse in order?
  • [14:02] Fury Rosewood: just does a mute to make certain
  • [14:02] Ilse Artful: sex please?
  • [14:02] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Fury = UK?
  • [14:02] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: no sex here
  • [14:02] Fury Rosewood: nope
  • [14:02] Fury Rosewood: michigan
  • [14:03] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Darn, you said arse, and I say that due to being British. :(
  • [14:03] Fury Rosewood: muted tho
  • [14:03] Fury Rosewood: i have alot of british friends, they rub off on me :(
  • [14:03] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: LOL
  • [14:03] Questar Utu: Hah.
  • [14:03] Ardy Lay: I say dustbin but I live in Illinois.
  • [14:03] Sebastean Steamweaver: It's a Techwolf :D
  • [14:03] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: oh rob, got some pics of you on my blog :)
  • [14:03] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: adding a new one soon :)
  • [14:03] Techwolf Lupindo: made from another SL event where they was discussing SLE
  • [14:03] Fury Rosewood: amount 2
  • [14:03] Fury Rosewood: amount 1
  • [14:04] Fury Rosewood: i wish this thing did stuff on a channel...
  • [14:04] Techwolf Lupindo: waves to Rob
  • [14:04] Ilse Artful: you guys suck what's the meeting for?
  • [14:04] Fury Rosewood: target Johannason Scarborough
  • [14:04] Rob Linden: so....I'd like to spend most of this meeting talking about the future of open source at Linden Lab
  • [14:05] Rob Linden: as most of you know, this is my last meeting as a Linden
  • [14:05] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: interresting
  • [14:05] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: aww, new job?
  • [14:05] Rob Linden: before we do that, though...just some quick updates on Snowglobe 1.2
  • [14:05] Sahkolihaa Contepomi:  :(
  • [14:05] Rob Linden: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Open_Source_Meeting/Agenda
  • [14:06] Rob Linden: the only issue that's really blocking is SNOW-345
  • [14:06] JIRA-helper: http//jira.secondlife.com/browse/SNOW-345:
  • [#SNOW-345] isn't used: in Snowglobe 1.2.1.2976 on Windows
  • [14:06] JIRA-helper (left: hip): [1]
  • [#SNOW-345] isn't used: in Snowglobe 1.2.1.2976 on Windows
  • [14:06] Merov Linden: working on it...
  • [14:06] Rob Linden: Merov: quick update on that?
  • [14:07] Merov Linden: I tried to build llkdu.dll with the correct msvcrt but didn't succeed
  • [14:07] Merov Linden: yet
  • [14:07] Nentres Glas: lise
  • [14:07] Nentres Glas: your mic is on
  • [14:07] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: your a smart man merov, im sure you will find a way to succeed :)
  • [14:07] Merov Linden: that's not something I can import from the internal branch
  • [14:08] Disconnected from: in-world Voice Chat
  • [14:08] Merov Linden: they're not using llkdu and linking to it the same way
  • [14:09] Merov Linden: anyway, I also hope this is not s red hearing since, as of today, this is just an idea of why loading does fail on some Windows machine
  • [14:09] Merov Linden: I mean: loading of the packaged llkdu.dll
  • [14:10] Merov Linden: Thickbrick said he'd test my new lib as soon as I build one
  • [14:10] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: on vista it would be easy, blaim vista! :p
  • [14:10] Techwolf Lupindo:  :-)
  • [14:10] Thickbrick Sleaford: nods
  • [14:10] Merov Linden: that should give us a reading on whether or not we're on the right track
  • [14:10] Rob Linden: well, fingers crossed :)
  • [14:11] Rob Linden: assuming we don't discover any other blockers, once we get that, then we'll build an RC4, and hopefully be done very soon after that
  • [14:11] Twisted Laws: without llkdu, i crash pretty fast in the sandboxes... crash in openjpeg
  • [14:11] Ardy Lay: Me too.
  • [14:12] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: i havnt been touching snowglobe much lately, im back to the last nighty
  • [14:12] Ardy Lay: OpenJPEG does radically increase my crash rate from virtually never to several times a day.
  • [14:12] Techwolf Lupindo: I use a patched openjpeg
  • [14:12] Merov Linden: hmmm... having a better openjpeg is also something we should, as a group, work on
  • [14:12] Techwolf Lupindo: One line patch that is
  • [14:12] Rob Linden: Twisted: yeah, part of the problem is with the version of OpenJPEG we ship. The main OpenJPEG project leaders are off on an expedition of some sort, and so it seems it's time for a fork
  • [14:12] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: last nighty seems to be the most stable on my pc
  • [14:12] Rob Linden: maybe they're back now. has anyone heard from them?
  • [14:13] Techwolf Lupindo: Rob Linden, is the patches that LL uses for there openjpeg aviliabe anywhere?
  • [14:13] Rob Linden: I don't believe our version has much (anything?) in the way of patches, but if we do, they should be made available
  • [14:13] Merov Linden: doesn't know about that patch
  • [14:14] Merov Linden: anyone around keeping tab on openjpeg? what's that expedition you're talking about Rob?
  • [14:14] Rob Linden: it's a long story....probably shouldn't get sidetracked on that
  • [14:14] Techwolf Lupindo: edit libopenjpeg/image.c in the first function opj_image_create0(void) refore the return image; add image->comps=NULL; is the patch I use that fixed my crash rate from severl a day to zero a day.
  • [14:15] Rob Linden: Robin has a handful of patches that we should probably apply at some point
  • [14:15] Merov Linden: good to knwo
  • [14:16] Rob Linden: well, let's talk about ideas for whoever takes over for me
  • [14:16] Rob Linden: first off: what are some of the things that are going right that Linden needs to keep doing?
  • [14:17] Twisted Laws: these meetings!
  • [14:17] Thickbrick Sleaford: communicate!
  • [14:17] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: meetings for starters
  • [14:17] Rob Linden: what do you all get out of them?
  • [14:17] Pixel Gausman: openly taking patches from the community, and quickly integrating them
  • [14:18] Twisted Laws: a feeling of community is one that we get. having a couple of Lindens that listen is another requirement
  • [14:18] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: communication to and with the residents is the ONLY way LL has to talk about bugs they cant fix or need a little more help on. also its a great tool to keep the residents happy and get the residents and lindens closer to each other
  • [14:19] Sebastean Steamweaver: I second what Youri said. The communication is something the residents value very highly.
  • [14:19] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: everyone here loves to help out or loves to attend the meetings in general, so basicly it would not be smart to loose the free help
  • [14:19] Tillie Ariantho: Yah, and we love to give feedback about what annoys us most. :P
  • [14:19] Thickbrick Sleaford: having someone like Merov and you who is present at both sides of the LL firewall is the major change SG brought, I think. A lot less guesswork for us.
  • [14:20] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: I'm not a programmer but I come to these meetings because I enjoy hearing what's happening regarding the viewer.
  • [14:20] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: currently a lot of OH's are cancelled already, not smart at all and its really making residents feel unworthy of helping out to a sertain degree
  • [14:20] Tillie Ariantho: Yah, feedback whats going on is good.
  • [14:20] Rob Linden: k...going back to something Pixel said ^^^ : "openly taking patches from the community, and quickly integrating them"
  • [14:21] Rob Linden: that's perhaps a recent development ;-)
  • [14:21] Sebastean Steamweaver: I think the patch import process could be streamlined.
  • [14:21] Techwolf Lupindo: "both side of the firewall", there more then one?
  • [14:21] Q Linden: our firewall is a moebius strip
  • [14:21] Rob Linden:  :)
  • [14:21] Tillie Ariantho: oi
  • [14:21] Thickbrick Sleaford: not a Klein bottle?
  • [14:22] Merov Linden: the award for the geekiest comment goes to... Q!
  • [14:22] Sebastean Steamweaver: Q, is your name at all related to the all-powerful race from star-trek? ;)
  • [14:22] Techwolf Lupindo: considering he can nuke our accounts, yes. :-)
  • [14:22] Sebastean Steamweaver: lol
  • [14:23] Q Linden: mwoo hah hah
  • [14:23] Rob Linden: so: anything more on the "what's right" side, or should we move on to the obvious counterpart?
  • [14:24] Merov Linden: takes cover...
  • [14:24] Jacek Antonelli: Here's a very obvious "what's right" -- keep releasing the source. :)
  • [14:24] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: tech, thats just playing the cheat card on us, isnt it :p cant handle the truth, lets delete the truth :p
  • [14:24] Opensource Obscure: jacek+ : )
  • [14:24] Techwolf Lupindo: Something on both sides i've seen. Linden that are more recitive to helpfull residents. I've also seen the oppisite also. :-/
  • [14:24] Tillie Ariantho: Just seeing that there are some 'people' on the other side is good, too. ^^
  • [14:24] Techwolf Lupindo: receptive
  • [14:25] Opensource Obscure: public appreciation of open source approach by LL is also relevant and should continue
  • [14:25] Tillie Ariantho: And it is always nice to get a look 'behind'.
  • [14:25] Opensource Obscure: ( i meant LL's statements re: open source development)
  • [14:26] Rob Linden: ok...let's talk about what should be different
  • [14:26] Techwolf Lupindo: When viewer 2.0 comes out...going to be fun day for me pointing out my name in the help box to some friends of mine. So pulic appreaciation is appreated. :-)
  • [14:26] Thickbrick Sleaford: Rob: another thing I think should be important ot your replacment: SG really feels like a community open source project, and not just an LL project that is willing to take out patches. That's very important for motivation.
  • [14:27] Rob Linden: and....be brutally honest, but I think direct that honesty toward what someone in my role should do, rather than the general Linden approach
  • [14:27] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: well, perhaps add a OH of possible new feature discussions
  • [14:27] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: should be a interresting discussion
  • [14:27] Sebastean Steamweaver: Personally, though I understand the dark wall that sits behind most lindens and the reason for it, I think we need more information.
  • [14:27] Sebastean Steamweaver: And, definitely, more feature discussion.
  • [14:27] Ardy Lay: I was about to suggest additional inworld meeting time for those interested.
  • [14:28] Rob Linden: (general Linden approach is also helpful, but I suspect we'll learn more new info focused on this role, since Linden is figuring out who to hire next)
  • [14:28] Sebastean Steamweaver: And More -hope- that said features are considered.
  • [14:28] Techwolf Lupindo: A second or longer OSOH would be nice due to some topics take quiet a bit of time.
  • [14:28] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: agreed techwolf
  • [14:28] Ardy Lay: And certanly keep the IRC channel going.
  • [14:28] Tillie Ariantho: yup, about possible new features. to avoid that stuff gets added of which LL thinks its great, but community does, not. :P
  • [14:28] Rob Linden: (i.e. think of this feedback as "open letter to the hiring manager")
  • [14:28] Sebastean Steamweaver: And there are some features which really would greatly improve user and linden experience.
  • [14:29] Techwolf Lupindo: Someone that is not a "yes" man to upper managment.
  • [14:29] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: manager? as in what way rob?
  • [14:29] Sebastean Steamweaver: You can ask several of the people here who've heard me do monologues on the subject of needed features.
  • [14:29] Rob Linden: Youri: to the person hiring my replacement
  • [14:29] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: ah okay
  • [14:29] Opensource Obscure: i'd like to see more updated tech documentation. Some wiki docs about the viewer, compiling etc. are out of date. maybe the lindens who work on documentation could collaborate with some viewer developer - and update relevant paged?
  • [14:29] Thickbrick Sleaford: Encurage Lindens that are not directly involved in open source to move more documentation and bug tracking to PJIRA/wiki
  • [14:29] Ardy Lay: I had expected your replacement to come from within the organization.
  • [14:30] Pixel Gausman: finishes her meeting and comes back to a very interesting Snowglobe mtg
  • [14:30] Opensource Obscure: s/paged/pages
  • [14:30] Rob Linden: Ardy: that might very well happen...it's still TBD
  • [14:30] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: think you should ask a good linden that can decide that propperly
  • [14:30] Techwolf Lupindo: Oh, someone is isn't freaked out by the sigh of me and other crazy avatars.
  • [14:31] Techwolf Lupindo: sigh=sight
  • [14:31] Q Linden: opensource, shouldn't the community update the iwki?
  • [14:31] Q Linden: wiki
  • [14:31] Pixel Gausman: the outreach to the community can't be stressed enough. your replacement needs to advocate for us non-lindens inside the Lab
  • [14:31] Q Linden: techwolf, anyone who's freaked out by crazy avatars doesn't get far at LL. :)
  • [14:31] Tillie Ariantho: There should be a rethought about community patches when it comes to "will break content / usability" or something. LL did many changes that did break usability a lot, but small things what are needed much are not going to be added. Simple stuff like "click to wear" and tons other. or the small "crotch uv map patch".
  • [14:31] Tillie Ariantho: what -> that
  • [14:32] Thickbrick Sleaford: Q: a lot of the documentation could be reverse engineered by the community, but a Linden could just copy and paste intot he wiki
  • [14:32] Jacek Antonelli: Community updates on the wiki only go so far. Sometimes an "inside voice" is necessary, to tell the difference between "how it is" and "how it was supposed to be".
  • [14:32] Sebastean Steamweaver: The llTextBox patch is a great example.
  • [14:32] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: the wiki should be updated to my opinion, the thing that may need a change is a clear view on WHO is attending as Linden and WHAT the topic is
  • [14:32] Merov Linden: copy paste from where?
  • [14:32] Rob Linden: is it more important to get someone who is really seasoned on open source practice, and less seasoned in Second Life, or vice versa?
  • [14:32] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: currently the OH pages are rarely taken care of unfortunately
  • [14:33] Tillie Ariantho: Rob: best of both worlds. :P
  • [14:33] Thickbrick Sleaford: Merov: the mythical complete documentation I assume LL keeps...
  • [14:33] Sebastean Steamweaver: I think it's easier to season someone to second life than it is to season them to opensource.
  • [14:33] Techwolf Lupindo: Open source first, SL experence will come naturlly.
  • [14:33] Sebastean Steamweaver: If forced to take an option, I'd do open source first.
  • [14:33] Pixel Gausman: and the couple of OpenSim specific patches in Snowglobe have been really nice, so please have robla+1 continue to allow those
  • [14:33] Ardy Lay: Rob, I think maybe seasoned on open source practice and community management.
  • [14:34] Pixel Gausman: Robla: really seasoned in Open SOurce
  • [14:34] Jacek Antonelli: Agree with Ardy
  • [14:34] Aimee Trescothick: (with just a dask of salt and pepper)
  • [14:34] Aimee Trescothick: *dash
  • [14:34] Jacek Antonelli: Mmmmm
  • [14:34] Fury Rosewood: desk o.o
  • [14:34] Rob Linden: fears you're thinking of stewing my replacement
  • [14:34] Fury Rosewood: funny thats how i read it...
  • [14:34] Techwolf Lupindo: Community management is going to be a big part. We will be making the patches in most cases, we just need someone that can herd cats. :-)
  • [14:35] Rob Linden: I may have gotten out just in time o.O
  • [14:35] Pixel Gausman: meow
  • [14:35] Questar Utu: .. Desk of salt wouldn't be able to hold much.
  • [14:35] Latif Khalifa: lol rob
  • [14:35] Fury Rosewood: desks can have drawers
  • [14:35] Jacek Antonelli: hides the Rob-sized bubbling cauldron of soup broth.
  • [14:35] Questar Utu: I mean in terms of durability. :p
  • [14:35] Aimee Trescothick: no, we leave the Linden roasting to certainbloggersthatshallremainnameless
  • [14:36] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: out just in time rob? what then? :p
  • [14:36] Techwolf Lupindo: Someone that can understand code, but should be a given I hope.
  • [14:36] Latif Khalifa: lol, the hitlist
  • [14:36] Sebastean Steamweaver: lolol Aimee
  • [14:36] Wut Moorlord: Aimee xD
  • [14:36] Techwolf Lupindo: Aimee, LOLOLOLO
  • [14:36] Sebastean Steamweaver: Certainbloggersthatshallremainnameless are very proficient at roasting lindens and anyone in their path.
  • [14:36] Latif Khalifa: rob, so you got your non-linden avatar prepped and all? :D
  • [14:36] Rob Linden: how much coding should my replacement do on a day-to-day basis, you think?
  • [14:36] Q Linden: turns the other cheek so he can roast more evenly
  • [14:37] Pixel Gausman: rob: how much coding do u do?
  • [14:37] Jacek Antonelli: But anyway. There are a lot of people at LL and in the community who understand SL. It seems to me that your successor needs to be skilled at managing the community and acting as an in-between.
  • [14:37] Q Linden: nice cauldron
  • [14:37] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: well, enough needs to be done
  • [14:37] Questar Utu: Steamy.
  • [14:37] Tillie Ariantho: Rob, jump in. :P
  • [14:37] Latif Khalifa: lol
  • [14:37] Tillie Ariantho: ^^
  • [14:37] Rob Linden: Pixel: not as much as I like, and you probably wouldn't want me doing much iwth the c++
  • [14:37] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: rob is leaving, dont boil him instead :p
  • [14:38] Rob Linden: *with
  • [14:38] Techwolf Lupindo: The ability to reconized and forgive folks for makiing huge typos or foopass due to what they ment and what was type was different.
  • [14:39] Latif Khalifa: Rob, I guess what sort of person your replacement is, he/she should be allowed to do a lot of coding methinks if that's their thing
  • [14:39] Sebastean Steamweaver: Just not so much coding that it prevents them from keeping a grasp of what the other people are doing.
  • [14:39] Latif Khalifa: (if they're hard code coder), but i know a lot of OS project leads/evangelist that do ot code much
  • [14:39] Sebastean Steamweaver: Coding is difficult to do while herding cats :)
  • [14:39] Latif Khalifa: and they are very good at what they do
  • [14:40] Tillie Ariantho: And he/she should be heard to. Doesnt help if community comes with stuff, replacement guy/gal collects it and then the other Lindens turn it down. :P
  • [14:40] Jacek Antonelli: I'd say they should be knowledgeable about coding so they can be effective, e.g. having some idea of what's possible and what's not, whether a patch is a good one or not, etc.
  • [14:40] Twisted Laws: i think you need a good coder that doesn't want to be coding anymore and is good at getting others to do it instead. a good manager without coding experience may not be right
  • [14:40] Jacek Antonelli: But they don't need to be doing a lot of coding on SL themselves.
  • [14:40] Pixel Gausman: Tillie: yeah, robla+1 needs to be able to advocate for non-Linden patches inside Linden
  • [14:40] Latif Khalifa: Jacek, agreed, knowlegable, but not necessarily a full time coder
  • [14:41] Sebastean Steamweaver: Yes, it is important that he be able to "stand up to" other lindens about what needs to be done. Not that I see all other lindens as hard-faced folk who don't listen at all, mind you.
  • [14:41] Tillie Ariantho: We may be a small group of people here, but much stuff we talk about is important stuff for many people.
  • [14:41] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: Rob: so your leaving, have any plans for after LL ?
  • [14:42] Rob Linden: Youri: nothing I can talk about yet, other than to say that I'm going to stay in open source
  • [14:42] Pixel Gausman: well, robla has to manage the wrath of the community and weight it against Linden's bizness plans. never an easy task.
  • [14:42] Aimee Trescothick: he's graduating from cat herder to fully fledged zoo keeper
  • [14:42] Latif Khalifa: lol
  • [14:42] Sebastean Steamweaver: srs bsnss
  • [14:42] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: oh okay, would love to hear when you can tell :)
  • [14:43] Latif Khalifa: Pixel, yes, rock and the hard place job position ;)
  • [14:43] Rob Linden: yup....I'll send an sldev mail about it when I can
  • [14:43] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: sure! love to hear about that! Mind if i add a blog about it when you sended it?
  • [14:43] Rob Linden: feel free
  • [14:43] Opensource Obscure: we also hope to see you again inworld
  • [14:44] Wut Moorlord: nay, we demand to see you again inworld.
  • [14:44] Tillie Ariantho: haha
  • [14:44] Rob Linden: yeah, I'll probably stop by now and then
  • [14:44] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: okay, ill make sure you will receive the finished page as soon as its done with link :)
  • [14:44] Rob Linden: I'll definitely still be on IRC as robla
  • [14:44] Thickbrick Sleaford: suggestion for robla+1: have an occasional meeting at non working hours (US time)
  • [14:45] Pixel Gausman: i missed the first part of the meeting... did robla have advice for us as well?
  • [14:45] Rob Linden: hmmm.....advice for you all. wow, I shoulda been ready for that one
  • [14:45] Ardy Lay: Pixel, I'll be posting a transcript after the meeting concludes.
  • [14:45] Merov Linden: listen...
  • [14:45] Pixel Gausman: focuses the beam on robla
  • [14:46] Thickbrick Sleaford: Rob: any root passwords you'd like to share?
  • [14:46] Rob Linden: I think the big thing is to make it fun, and really try to work together
  • [14:46] Wut Moorlord: hehe
  • [14:46] Techwolf Lupindo: "GOD"
  • [14:46] Pixel Gausman: his sweating anim is playing now
  • [14:46] Aimee Trescothick: lol
  • [14:46] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: here a link for those that are interrested in my blog, lots of Linden pictures on there as well, lots of my products and visits to great places :) [2]
  • [14:47] Pixel Gausman: i think we can try to do that.
  • [14:47] Pixel Gausman: eyes the room and smiles
  • [14:47] Rob Linden: there's a *lot* of viewers out there....that can be a good thing (like lots of different LInux distros for different niches) or it can be a bad thing (like lots of different *BSDs that got eclipsed by Linux)
  • [14:47] Sebastean Steamweaver: puts a red filter over the spotlight on Rob, for fun.
  • [14:48] Sebastean Steamweaver: Que vampiric laugh!
  • [14:48] Jacek Antonelli: nods.
  • [14:48] Questar Utu: blinks.
  • [14:48] Pixel Gausman: linux has a benevolent dictator.
  • [14:49] Tillie Ariantho: test
  • [14:49] Aimee Trescothick: passed
  • [14:49] Tillie Ariantho: woot, release then. :)
  • [14:50] Wut Moorlord:  :)
  • [14:50] Rob Linden: I think that's the extent of what I'd have to say here about my advice. keeping it short and sweet :)
  • [14:50] Sebastean Steamweaver: Not to change the subject, but would it be possible to discuss VWR-8759 before the end of the meeting?
  • [14:50] JIRA-helper: http//jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-8759:
  • [#VWR-8759] in client: Non-Functional - Functionality Patch Attached
  • [14:50] Merov Linden: is trying to put together the figure of this mysterious leader after all this feedback
  • [14:51] Ardy Lay: Rob, one of the things that may be holding up serious effort on behalf of some potential contributers is the looming cloud of LL new client that we don't get to look at yet. Not sure what can be done about that though.
  • [14:51] Sebastean Steamweaver: Aye, the dark wall.
  • [14:51] Tillie Ariantho: Yah, annoyance by obscurity. :P
  • [14:51] Geneko Nemeth: nudges Jacek.
  • [14:51] Techwolf Lupindo: Yea, why dubecate codeing a new feature?
  • [14:52] Pixel Gausman: and will viewer 2.0 changes be merged into snowglobe?
  • [14:52] Techwolf Lupindo: Or coding up a new feature that obselated by the new viewer.
  • [14:52] Latif Khalifa: it would be really helpful to the community if there was clarity about that... if behind closed doors model of 2.0 is just a one-off for 2.0, or something permanent
  • [14:52] Latif Khalifa: i do not know who could bring clarity on that point
  • [14:52] Morgaine Dinova: Woot, I made it back before it's over. /me waves at Rob. :-)))
  • [14:52] Sebastean Steamweaver: Wb Morg
  • [14:52] Thickbrick Sleaford: also, will the Enterprise client be open source?
  • [14:52] Pixel Gausman: thick: +100000
  • [14:52] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: viewer 2.0 is currenly unknown, so hard to discuss :)
  • [14:53] Q Linden: latif, I think we'll see much less secrecy in the future, but it won't be all the way to zero
  • [14:53] Rob Linden: refers everyone to Q's answer :)
  • [14:53] Latif Khalifa: Q, so days where we had trunk synced externally are past?
  • [14:53] Techwolf Lupindo: Zero Linden has been zero info as of late i've heard.
  • [14:54] Tillie Ariantho: Viewer 2.0 is what will be used almost 24/7 by the community, so it should be not hidden and unknown and problably bring lots stuff that could have been different if it was discussed with the community before. :)
  • [14:54] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: viewer 2.0 isnt created in secret to make all of us curious, its done like that because its sensitive since lots of companies love to copy the ideas into their own things
  • [14:54] Morgaine Dinova: What companies? There's no competition in this area.
  • [14:54] Techwolf Lupindo: What company? ;-)
  • [14:54] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: sure is
  • [14:55] Sebastean Steamweaver: There's been suspicion that Zero attempted to divide something by himself and disappeared because he resulted in null :(
  • [14:55] Tillie Ariantho: Or done to avoid that stuff is in community clients before it's even completed. Like shadows. :P
  • [14:55] Bronson Blackadder: the sims online
  • [14:55] Bronson Blackadder: lol
  • [14:55] Bronson Blackadder: lol
  • [14:55] Latif Khalifa: I don't think you can hope to expand the commiters lists and really have an OS project going with the 2.0 dev model
  • [14:55] Rob Linden: anyway....I'm going to suggest that topic be handled by my successor :)
  • [14:55] Bronson Blackadder: ol
  • [14:55] Bronson Blackadder: lol
  • [14:55] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: there are a lot of companies that love to ride on the same wave so to say
  • [14:55] Geneko Nemeth: At leat, no ompetiion that can eaningy copy the changes introduced in viewer 2.0.
  • [14:55] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: lol, smart move rob :p
  • [14:56] Sebastean Steamweaver: Are there any Snowglobe devs willing to write a patch for llTextBox? :) Or to use the patch in the JIRA? :)
  • [14:56] Questar Utu: O_o
  • [14:56] Morgaine Dinova: Well judging by Alexa's email, any company wanting an advantage would to well to AVOID copying Viewer2.0.
  • [14:56] Latif Khalifa: I don't think the question of 2.0 dev model and the future ones, 2.1 etc is something robla+1 can answer alone... it's a policy question and would be nice to get clarity on that at some point
  • [14:56] Rob Linden: Sebastian: I suggest creating an issue in SNOW in JIRA that's a pointer to VWR-8759
  • [14:56] Tillie Ariantho: Morgaine: :P
  • [14:56] Rob Linden: that'll get it on the Snowglobe triage list
  • [14:57] Sebastean Steamweaver: I'll be sure to do that Rob
  • [14:57] Tillie Ariantho: wants fome fixes for snapshots, not seen any for months... but probably that stuff will get removed, like video recording. O.o
  • [14:57] Tillie Ariantho: some
  • [14:58] Pixel Gausman: so robla, thanks for being our fearless leader, and hope to see you around
  • [14:58] Q Linden: oh, fwiw, we're going to be making our patch import process more transparent; give us a week or so to get organized
  • [14:58] Rob Linden: ok...well, thanks again everyone for everythign!
  • [14:58] Q Linden: we're going to miss having you inside the firewall,
  • [14:58] Sebastean Steamweaver: Thank you Rob
  • [14:58] Morgaine Dinova: Thanks Rob, you made it fun.
  • [14:58] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: you thanks as well rob! thanks for having this OH all the time!
  • [14:58] McCabe Maxsted: wishes you well, Rob
  • [14:58] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: hope i can get the info soon for the blog :)
  • [14:58] Techwolf Lupindo: Good Luck Rob
  • [14:59] Jacek Antonelli: salutes Rob
  • [14:59] Latif Khalifa: I wish you all the best Rob as well :D
  • [14:59] Rob Linden: Q :) I'll miss you all too!
  • [14:59] Thickbrick Sleaford: Rob: it was fun!
  • [14:59] Twisted Laws: thank you for everything you've done, Rob and good luck with the future
  • [14:59] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: good luck and best wishes!
  • [14:59] Latif Khalifa: And you will be missed for sure.
  • [14:59] Wut Moorlord: tc Rob!
  • [14:59] Ardy Lay: Thanks a lot Rob. I look forward to seeing "the new you" in the future.
  • [14:59] Fury Rosewood: take care rob
  • [14:59] Morgaine Dinova: It's not an end, just a change. :-) When do we see you next, Rob?
  • [15:00] Rob Linden: like I said before, I'll be around from time to time...and yeah, keep an eye out for "the new me" later
  • [15:00] Rob Linden:  :)
  • [15:00] Ellla McMahon: Good luck Rob, have FUN !!!!
  • [15:00] Tillie Ariantho: =)
  • [15:00] Morgaine Dinova: waves
  • [15:00] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Good luck, Rob.
  • [15:00] Rob Linden: bye all!
  • [15:00] Latif Khalifa: and thanks for all the hippos :D
  • [15:00] Tree Kyomoonri: Ashton: bye rob!
  • [15:00] Twisted Laws: bye Rob
  • [15:00] McCabe Maxsted: haha
  • [15:00] xstorm Radek:  :-(
  • [15:00] Sebastean Steamweaver: Btw, does Snowglobe have the Hippos! shortcut key? >.>
  • [15:00] Jacek Antonelli: heads over to UXIG for some fun speculating about SL 2.0. Whee!