Second Life Wiki - User contributions [en]

LlAttachToAvatarTemp

2015-06-25T16:48:11Z

Soft Linden: Caveat about agent with maximum number of attachments (BUG-7702, not currently marked public-visible)

{{LSL_Function
|inject-2={{Issues/SCR-395}}
{{LSL_Function/permission|PERMISSION_ATTACH|temp=*}}
|func = llAttachToAvatarTemp
|func_desc = Follows the same convention as [[llAttachToAvatar]], with the exception that the object will not create new inventory for the user, and will disappear on detach or disconnect.
|func_footnote = It should be noted that when an object is attached temporarily, a user cannot 'take' or 'drop' the object that is attached to them.
The user DOES NOT have to be the owner of the object for it to attach properly. In fact giving the object, or having the user take the object in order to transfer ownership, negates most of the usefulness of this function.
|p1_type = integer
|p1_subtype = attach_point
|p1_name = attach_point
|p1_desc = ATTACH_* constant or valid value (see the tables below)
|constants = {{LSL_Constants_Attachment}}
|caveats =
* All permissions granted prior to actually attaching appear to dumped when successfully attached via this method, including PERMISSION_ATTACH (possible security measure).
** Until successful attachment via this method, previously granted permissions are retain as normal.
* If you use llAttachToAvatarTemp in an object that you do not have permission to transfer, the function will fail with a script error ''No permission to transfer'', even if you are trying to attach it to yourself.
* Temporary attachments cannot request the permission [[PERMISSION_TELEPORT]], the following error will be returned: ''"Temporary attachments cannot request runtime permissions to teleport"''
*Attach points can be occupied by multiple attachments.{{Footnote|Multiple attachments per attach point were added as result of {{Jira|SCR-277}}|Multiple attachments per attach point were added as result of SCR-277}}
**This was not always the case, previously if {{LSLP|attach_point}} was occupied, the existing object was detached and the new attachment took it's place.
*Objects attached to the head (and any attachment position within the head) will not be visible in First Person view (aka [[Mouselook]]) if "show attachments in mouselook" is disabled.
*If {{LSLP|attach_point}} is zero but the object was never previously attached, it defaults to the right hand ({{LSL Const|ATTACH_RHAND|integer|6|c=right hand}}).
*If the object is already attached the function fails silently, regardless if the {{LSLP|attach_point}} is a different {{LSLGC|Integer/attach_point|attach point}}.
*If attached via a Land Scope Experience script, the object will be forced detached by the server if the owner enters a parcel that does not have the Experience allowed.
*If the target agent is already wearing the maximum number of attachments, the object will remain on the ground with the target agent as owner. Scripters may wish to check for successful attachment and llDie() after a timeout or if the object is manipulated while unattached.
|examples = <source lang="lsl2">//-- rez object on ground, drop in this script, it will request permissions to attach,
//-- and then attach to the left hand if permission is granted. if permission is denied,
//-- then the script complains.
default
{
state_entry()
{
llRequestPermissions( llGetOwner(), PERMISSION_ATTACH );
}

run_time_permissions( integer vBitPermissions )
{
if( vBitPermissions & PERMISSION_ATTACH )
{
llAttachToAvatarTemp( ATTACH_LHAND );
}
else
{
llOwnerSay( "Permission to attach denied" );
}
}

on_rez(integer rez)
{
if(!llGetAttached())
{ //reset the script if it's not attached.
llResetScript();
}
}

attach(key AvatarKey)
{
if(AvatarKey)
{//event is called on both attach and detach, but Key is only valid on attach
integer test = llGetAttached();
if (test) {
llOwnerSay( "The object is attached" );
} else {
llOwnerSay( "The object is not attached");
}
}
}
}</source>

<source lang="lsl2">//-- This example can demonstrate ownership transfer of an object on a temporary basis using llAttachToAvatarTemp()
//-- Whoever touches will be asked for permission to attach, and upon granting permission will have the item attach,
//-- But not appear in Inventory.
default
{
touch_start(integer num_touches)
{
llRequestPermissions( llDetectedKey(0), PERMISSION_ATTACH );
}

run_time_permissions( integer vBitPermissions )
{
if( vBitPermissions & PERMISSION_ATTACH )
{
llAttachToAvatarTemp( ATTACH_LHAND );
}
else
{
llOwnerSay( "Permission to attach denied" );
}
}

on_rez(integer rez)
{
if(!llGetAttached())
{ //reset the script if it's not attached.
llResetScript();
}
}
}</source>

<source lang="lsl2">// This example illustrates how to handle permissions before and after llAttachToAvatarTemp has been called. Because ownership
// changes when the object is attached, the initial PERMISSION_ATTACH is revoked and new permissions need to be requested.

integer gAttach = TRUE;

default
{

touch_start(integer num)
{
if (gAttach) // Object has not been attached yet
{
llRequestPermissions(llDetectedKey(0),PERMISSION_ATTACH);
gAttach = FALSE;
}
else // Object has been attached, but you still need PERMISSION_ATTACH in order to detach the object
{
if (llGetPermissions() & PERMISSION_TRIGGER_ANIMATION | PERMISSION_ATTACH)
{
llDetachFromAvatar(); // Note that the object vanishes when detached, so there is no need to set gAttach = TRUE again
}
}
}

attach(key id)
{
if (id) // Object has been attached, so request permissions again
{
llRequestPermissions(id,PERMISSION_ATTACH | PERMISSION_TRIGGER_ANIMATION);
}
}

run_time_permissions (integer perm)
{
if (!gAttach) //First time
{
if (perm & PERMISSION_ATTACH)
{
gAttach = TRUE;
llAttachToAvatarTemp(ATTACH_HEAD); // Initial PERMISSION_ATTACH is revoked at this point
}
}
else // Second time
{
if (perm & PERMISSION_ATTACH | PERMISSION_TRIGGER_ANIMATION)
{
llStartAnimation(llGetInventoryName(INVENTORY_ANIMATION,0));
}
}
}
}</source>
An alternative solution:
<source lang="lsl2">
// Because ownership changes when the object is attached, the initial PERMISSION_ATTACH is revoked and new permissions need to be requested.

default
{
touch_start(integer num)
{
if (!llGetAttached()) llRequestPermissions( llDetectedKey(0), PERMISSION_ATTACH);
else if ( llGetPermissions() & PERMISSION_ATTACH) llDetachFromAvatar();
}
attach(key id)
{
if (id) llRequestPermissions( id, PERMISSION_ATTACH | PERMISSION_TRIGGER_ANIMATION);
}
run_time_permissions (integer perm)
{
if (!llGetAttached() && (perm & PERMISSION_ATTACH)) llAttachToAvatarTemp( ATTACH_NOSE);
if (perm & PERMISSION_TRIGGER_ANIMATION) llStartAnimation( llGetInventoryName( INVENTORY_ANIMATION, 0));
}
}</source>

|also_functions = {{LSL DefineRow||[[llDetachFromAvatar]]|Detaches the object from the avatar}}
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llGetAttached]]|Gets the attach point number}}
|cat1 = Attachment
|cat2 = Avatar
|history = Date of Release [[ Release_Notes/Second_Life_Server/12#12.07.24.262437 | 24/07/2012 ]]
|haiku={{Haiku|Embrace me. I'm yours|If only for a short time|Rejected, we part.}}
}}

File:UnitTests.jpg

2015-06-08T16:38:34Z

Soft Linden: Unit testing in a nutshell

Unit testing in a nutshell

User talk:Strife Onizuka

2015-01-22T15:30:08Z

Soft Linden: /* linking keywords with */

{{:User:Zai_Lynch/Award}}You found my talk page... Find old discussions take a look at the archives: [[User:Strife_Onizuka/Talkpage_Archive_01|1]] [[User:Strife_Onizuka/Talkpage_Archive_02|2]]

== JIRA issues on LSL function pages ==

Okay, as I've made no headway deciphering your templates (not that I'm familiar in the least with the more complex wiki functions in the first place...) I decided just to cut my losses and ask! Basically I was wondering if there's a reason why [[Template:LSL_Generic/Issues]] doesn't appear to list all issues, but instead seems to just list bugs only in the same way as [[Template:LSL_Generic/Caveats]]?

I just think it'd be nice if function pages would also summarise popular proposals relating to them in the deep notes section, which is what I believed was intended but it doesn't appear to do this right now.

For example, if you go to the [[LlStartAnimation]] page, in the deep notes you'll notice that there are zero issues listed, however, clicking the "Search JIRA for related Issues" link returns quite a few. It might be nice to see the deep notes tweaked to display these, but perhaps with a limit on how many are shown (though llStartAnimation is a fairly popular one to see JIRA issues for and only has 17 issues listed). Anyway, just though I'd ask/request, please poke my talk page if you respond to be sure I remember and look! --[[User:Haravikk Mistral|Haravikk Mistral]] 15:26, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

:The template is not automatic. Take for example [[llBreakLink]], it lists a single issue in the article, it does this by including the template [[Template:Issues/SVC-3510]]. There are many stub templates like [[Template:Issues/SVC-3510]] that work this way, they contain the information about the issue and pass it along to a template that does the heavy lifting. The value of this method is that a single template exists for the Issue and if the issue is sited on multiple pages, they can all be quickly updated by modifying the template. From an organizational standpoint, it also makes it possible to see what all pertains to a particular issue.

:The thing is, if you want all the issues on the wiki, they need to be imported to the wiki, and regularly updated as changes are made... but that could all be done with a bot. Wonder if [[User:Gigs Taggart|Gigs]] could be enticed to incorporate it into [http://www.sljirastats.com SLJiraStats]?

:The goal of the Deep Notes: Issues section was to contain dead bugs and interesting feature suggestions. I never intended it to contain all issues pertaining to a feature. We don't add any value by duplicated the JIRA search engine results; the value we can add is by filtering them. Some of the bugs aren't bugs, and some of the feature suggestions are unworkable; I don't think these should be given screen space. Considering the resources required to manually include and update the issues, triage has to happen.

:Unfortunately I do not have the free time to work on this, work and other responsibilities eat all my time. *wonders just how true that is* -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 03:10, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

::Ah yeah, seems I've completely misunderstood what it was doing! I wasn't thinking to list everything, just an automatic, and hopefully useful summary of say...the top ten bugs and issues? It sounds like way more work than it's likely to be worth though so probably better just to forget about it, unless there's some way to just embed an iframe with a portion of a JIRA search or something similar? But that would probably cause an unacceptable increase in JIRA page requests from people just popping over to look something up. But now I know how it does work I can at least pop useful relevant issues on manually, thanks! -- [[User:Haravikk Mistral|Haravikk Mistral]] 12:36, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

:A related problem, I've tried to add a few top issues of interest to me onto my user page under Key Issues, however, I've tried to create two [[Template:IssueTable]] instances, but they both have the same content, despite the value of #issues being different for both. Is this some peculiarity in using this template more than once? If you could take a look at let me know it'd be handy, as IssueTable doesn't have any documentation =( -- [[User:Haravikk Mistral|Haravikk Mistral]] 11:36, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

::You are hitting one of the caveats/bugs of the new parser engine. I forget how to get around it. I beleive the issue is intermediate caching, and the way around it is to make the template call dynamic or something like that. Without spending a bunch of time debugging the problem, I just don't remember how to work around it. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 14:37, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

::It just struck me what the problem is, it's caching IssueTable. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 18:27, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

:::Aha! The "subst:" keyword seems to be for this (e.g - <code><nowiki>{{subst:User:Haravikk_Mistral/JIRA/Issues/SVC}}</nowiki></code>), as I believe it fetches the pre-processed contents of a page rather than the source. In any event, this works in my case as I created sub-pages for each category, I don't believe it would help for a page with multiple IssueTable instances though, as using subst: for any of them would just create a blank gap, but it solves my problem at least! -- [[User:Haravikk Mistral|Haravikk Mistral]] 11:29, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

== [[Ghost Detector]] ==
Thanks. I discovered that property of [[llKey2Name]] by accident. It's odd because, for instance, [[llDetectedName]] gives a non-empty string for ghosted avatars. -- [[User:Something Something|Something Something]] 05:21, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

== Friendly greetings ==
You seem to have found a "fix" for my horrible script and....messed it up. Please compare my original to yours and do some testing. They are different in the result. I would appreciate you fixing your "fix". Best regards --[[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 02:42, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

:I'm sorry you took the edit personally it was not intended that way. The example you contributed is valuable and nontrivial, however examples are held to high standards and it didn't meet them. I was faced with two options: rewriting it or deleting it, I felt it had merit so I rewrote it. My goal as always is to provide the most useful content to our users, and in this case down compatibility needed to be sacrificed. The script as it was designed required every prim to have at least one face have full glow, that didn't sound entirely useful, so I changed it to accept some glow (I notice that I also changed it to require every face have glow... which doesn't sound useful, so I'm going to revert that).
:Examples have one major goal: Be educational, teach good coding practices and problem solving. Here is where the script went awry:
:# Names should be descriptive. The function names were a bit generic but single letter variables are definitely not descriptive, especially when they are globals, they really should describe the purpose they fulfill.
:# Using globals instead of locals & parameters may be efficient, but it degrades readability and adds a new vector for script bugs. This sort of optimization has no place in examples (except in an article on optimization techniques). The situation is made even worse by using non-descriptive variable names.
:# The script contained code that complicated it without aiding readability or improving functionality. Examples need to be streamline, having it meander requires the reader to needlessly keep track of more things.
:# I felt that the functionality provided had too narrow an audience, that by changing how it functioned that it would be more useful to more people. Down compatibility is a secondary consideration for examples, not a primary consideration.

:P.S. I take it you didn't noticed there is a bug in your script: A single prim object with at least one avatar sitting on it could return the wrong result. IMO examples should not be attributed in the script text, it's what the history page is for after all, but I know the community and I don't always agree so I don't fight it. Personally I don't want my name associated with buggy code, so if you really want the script to be 100% compatible I'll have to remove my name and give you all the credit.

:P.S.S. I think we may have different notions of wiki content ownership. When I post content on the wiki, I do so with the full expectation that it will be edited, that it will mutate into something I did not envision, into something I may not entirely agree with. We do not control the content after we have posted it. It's why there is the text below the edit box: "If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly and redistributed at will, then don't submit it here." Wiki culture is different. I may own my contributions but I don't control their fate. They are my children, being changed and influenced by the people around them, being made stronger in the process. But I digress

:P.S.S.S. In the future if you want to convince someone they should do something, don't insult them first, it's counter productive. A better way to approach this situation would have been to say: "I disagree with some of the changes you made, specifically blah blah blah, could you please look into it? I did not appreciate your tone and I am quite insulted." It's a mistake to mix the two messages, people are prone to take offense and not do what you want out of spite. In a situation like this being snarky just isn't productive (though it does blow off a bit of steam which can feel good in the moment). Just FYI, nothing more. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 07:43, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

::I didn't take it personally and was just trying to make you aware of your rewrite not doing the same like my script. Maybe you don't read in-world messages, as I had sent you a message thanking you for your rewrite and trying to point out the differences between the two. The script I had provided would check a link-set on whether or not it has glow. And yes, that would return a false result if avatars sit on it, but I thought nobody would use the script to check if a link-set is glowing while sitting on it, but I might be wrong and should have pointed that out in the description. So I see your point there and support your critique on that. However my script would return "glowing" for a prim if ANY number of faces have SOME glow (not 1.0, as you said it would do). Maybe you now understand my view when I see your rewrite as being more streamlined and easier to read, however you limit the script down in its original ability of detecting glow by forcing it to return positive only with all faces of a prim glowing. Anyway, I'm not up for a fight and to be quite frank just too lazy for it, a builder inside of SL asked me if it's possible to detect whether or not there's a bit of glow on all prims inside a link-set of his build and I just felt like sharing my approach of writing a script for that. If that script doesn't meet wiki standards in terms of streamlining it towards being absolutely foolproof and readable for just about anybody, I'll have to refrain from doing so in future.--[[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 18:13, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

:::First I need to apologize, when I wrote my last comment I hadn't carefully reread your script, if I had I would have noticed your use of llCeil, which does as you point out return true for some glow. So my argument on that point is baseless. Between work and other obligations, I had forgotten about that aspect of the script and just went on my memory of what I thought the script was doing. As to fighting, I agree it's a waste of time and effort. However I hope you do continue to contribute to the wiki, every contribution is valuable as they grow the understanding and knowledge base of the community. Standards evolve and the content does as well, content has to be nurtured, given room to grow. Immature content just needs to mature is all; the only time stuff gets deleted is if it's factually inaccurate or needlessly repetitive. If I thought the contribution was trivial and obvious I would have stripped your name from it (attribution on one liners is blatant self ego boosting and makes the wiki look unprofessional). The only reason I attached my name was so that you wouldn't be forced to shoulder the costs of supporting code that you did not write. Please don't take away from this that your contribution was without value, or that I had no respect for it or you.

:::I should mention the reason for my terse comment in the edit was for a simple reason: I couldn't be verbose with the text limits of the field.

:::As to messaging me, all my IMs get sent to an email account I rarely check, I only ever go inworld to keep my accounts active and go to meetings (pretty rare) because my internet connect is total suckage. I had no idea you IMed me; for all correspondence I use the wiki and email.

:::You would be quite ticked at me if I were to describe my scripting habits with regards to code I post. I know I was when I saw people do what I do, but I don't really have the option. It's an ROI equation, should I make possibly buggy contributions or make no contributions at all? I wish I weren't forced to make the choice. If I weren't here doing this who would take up the mantel? Who would look after the templates? It would avoid problems like this maybe but would the community be better off? I honestly don't know but I suspect not.

:::If you're still reading, what changes or improvements would you like to see made to the documentation? An upcoming project is to incorporate collapsible sections into the documentation, I'm just not sure yet how to do so, I could do with some input. I haven't called for input from the community yet because I haven't rolled out the new Constants template yet (which will revolutionize the {{LSLGC|PrimitiveParams}} documentation). Given the potential of collapsible sections we are at a point in time where we should consider redesigning the documentation from the ground up. Maybe a contest? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:33, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

:::P.S. Does it work as it did before now? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:48, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

::::Hi, no it doesn't. The first problem is your thing with the double exclamation mark, that always returns 1 for me. And the second being you're still stuck with [PRIM_GLOW,ALL_SIDES], you don't do a loop through the sides. I will post a re-do of mine again, if you find a way to do what you wanted to do with the double exclamation mark thing, let me know.[[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 21:16, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

:::::<code>!![[llGetLinkNumber]]()</code> returns 1 for multiprim objects or 0 for single prim objects; It's logically equivalent to <code>llGetLinkNumber() != 0</code> however it requires less bytecode to express (you would not be without base to berate me for perpetrating this optimization/shorthand in an example script). You shouldn't need to loop through the sides, by using [[ALL_SIDES]] it should return a list containing the glow values for every side of the prim (not a very useful feature, in most cases uses it's better to loop through the sides). We then feed that list to the list stat function to get the max. I'll see if I can log in later to test it but right now I really need to fix the LSL documentation templates (the wiki upgrade broke at least one template, which in turn broke a lot of the LSL documentation; I'm trying to both find and fix the broken templates; and I don't know the precise cause). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:37, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

::::::Fixed it finally, thanks again for the ideas and the input. <code>!![[llGetLinkNumber]]()</code> doesn't seem to work, I know exactly what you're trying to do by writing it that way, but that always returns 1. Have tested it. And your return was a bit too fast to return a result, wouldn't wait until the end. If you can simplify it even further, go ahead. That's as far as I could get.[[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 21:12, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

:::::::Is <code>!![[llGetLinkNumber]]</code> returning one for a single prim object with no avatars sitting on it? That is the only time it should return zero. A single prim object with a seated avatar should return one. As to the early exit, once we find a prim with no glow, we can exit without checking the other prims. Logically speaking, we do not need to know precisely what the minimum is, just if it is less than or equal to zero. So instead of calculating the minimum we can exit as soon as we know the minimum is going to be less than or equal to zero. We know it will be less than or equal to zero if we have a value that is zero or less. The code should exit as soon as it knows the answer so as to not waste simulator resources (after all we need to encourage responsible coding). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 05:08, 25 December 2010 (UTC)
::::::::Personally, I would prefer that examples intended to educate and demonstrate functionality NOT have obfuscating optimizations in them, unless the purpose of the example is to demonstrate such. It makes it harder for non-gurus to understand what is going on in the script, thus limiting the "educational value" of the example and obviating the purpose which it was intended. That said, I do believe it is important for people to know about them as well as how/when to use them, but I also believe teaching good programming habits is also valuable. (I don't know if the script in question qualifies as such; just wanted to point this out since it came up as an ancillary issue) [[User:Talarus Luan|Talarus Luan]] 07:35, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

== Help with template issue ==

Hi Strife,
I'm hoping you can help to shed some light on a problem we have just discovered that has started to occur since we redployed the wiki yesterday. The symptom is that SOME pages, e.g. [[LlKey2Name]] display differently when you are not logged in versus logged in. Compare
* Logged in: http://screencast.com/t/e3K85IGni
* Not logged in: http://screencast.com/t/4OwWfihvhi
I ''think'' that this may be happening due to issues around templates, which is why I am contacting you. However, I don't really know the cause. The strange thing is that most other LSL function pages appear to display just fine when you are logged out; so there must be something in that page causing an issue. We would greatly appreciate any help! P.S. Here is the whole list of known issues: [[Second Life Wiki Known Issues]].

Thanks
--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 17:15, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

:I think it was generated before the extensions were installed. I purged the page (?action=purge) and it now renders properly for me (though I did see it the way you described but only when i was not logged in). It's weird. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:22, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

::Maybe the cache just needs to be invalidated? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:24, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

::Some triangulation: <nowiki>|constants={{LSL Constants/PrimitiveParams|get}}</nowiki> does ''not'' cause trouble on a test copy of llSetLinkPrimitiveParams, <nowiki>|constants={{LSL Constants/PrimitiveParams|set}}</nowiki> triggers the bug. Off to try on simpler stuff to see if there is a consistent pattern of some kind ... --[[User:Cerise Sorbet|Cerise Sorbet]] 21:47, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

::The cache is not invalidating or refreshing. Check the mod date at the bottom of [[http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlSetLinkPrimitiveParamsFast]] and [[https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlSetLinkPrimitiveParamsFast]]. They are different. If you go into the history page and look at a previous version it will displays properly because it doesn't have a cached version but if you look at the current version (even with the version number, it does not display properly). Not even action=purge can budge it. A possible explanation is that the PrimitiveParams article is causing it to time out during rebuild. The new version of the template I'm hoping to get done by new year should be more sane and less time consuming (we hope). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:00, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

:: I thought it was only cache too but more appears to be going on. [[llKey2Name]] is displaying OK with a pair of Issue templates commented out. --[[User:Cerise Sorbet|Cerise Sorbet]] 22:22, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

:::The time issue I was seeing was caused by me having my account report the times in GMT+5 (which is weird seeing as i'm GMT-5) -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:31, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

:I've had a thought, I think it might have something to do with how bugs are duplicated (in both Issues and Important Issues). It looks to be the difference between the Get and Set primitive Params functions (Get are too new to have any flag bugs). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:42, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

::It's not [[Template:Issues]] that is doing it, it's something about [[Template:Issue]]. I have this terrible feeling it's a problem with how #switch is parsed. When are we getting the new parser function extension? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:55, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

:::Oh it's definitely [[Template:Issue]]. I can't access it when logged out. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:55, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

::::I've disabled the code that detects if an issue is a bug, which appears to have fixed [[llKey2Name]]. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:14, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

: #switch is not the cause, just the trigger. Maybe it's content duplication that is the problem? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:28, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

: Mediawiki 1.14 added a |link= option for Image: tags. This would let you skip the imagemap for most uses that don't really need coordinates. --[[User:Cerise Resident|Cerise]] 03:38, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

:: There is a god ^_^ thanks for the tip. I'll deploy it post hast. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 03:40, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

::: Thanks so much for tracking this down, Strife and Cerise! This move/upgrade has certainly been more problematic than we expected.... :-(
:::--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 19:05, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

:::: They always are more problematic than anticipated. I'm sorry I didn't pay more attention to it earlier, I did notice the blanking on the test wiki briefly but not the common factor (since I spend all my time logged in, the first thing I always do when I connect is log in). I spent my time looking at differences between the highlighting. Never thought to look for differences between HTTP & HTTPS. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 19:30, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

== Different versions of UTF-8 libraries ==

Hi Strife, it seems that there are two different versions of both UTF8ToUnicodeInteger() and UnicodeIntegerToUTF8() at [[Combined_Library#Unicode_functions]] and [[UTF-8]]. Maybe those could be moved to a template - or just manually synced as you feel appropriate. --[[User:Opensource Obscure|oobscure]] 03:17, 2 May 2011 (PDT)

There is a good point. Will do. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 09:12, 12 May 2011 (PDT)

== Issues/SCR-137 ==

Sorry for [[Template:Issues/SCR-137]], force of habit since most of the time I'm suggesting new functions that aren't on the wiki, rather than changes to existing ones ;) -- -- '''[[User:Haravikk_Mistral|Haravikk]]''' ([[User_talk:Haravikk_Mistral|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Haravikk_Mistral|contribs]]) 01:43, 9 July 2011 (PDT)

:No need to apologize. In my diminished capacity these days (being cut off from SL due to network restrictions for such a long time) there is little I can do besides act as editor, and theoretical scripting. So you gave me something to do. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 09:10, 9 July 2011 (PDT)

== llCastRay Docs ==

Thanks, Strife. Your improvement to the llCastRay docs look great.

[[User:Falcon Linden|Falcon Linden]] 11:57, 1 September 2011 (PDT)

== User Functions ==

Heya Strife,
Could you give me a headsup how the wiki format for Mode=User LSL Functions are meant to be used like?

https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Interpolation/Linear/Float

I'm not sure why I can't get rid off the "Deep Notes" section, which seems sorta empty and useless?

[[User:Nexii Malthus|Nexii Malthus]] 11:48, 17 September 2011 (PDT)

:Sure -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 13:36, 18 September 2011 (PDT)

== Video Documentations / Tutorials ==
forgot who the king of confirming stuff on this wiki is, I haven't been an editor for like a year or two if you remember me or not, but I thought I might add video documentations and tutorials on functions that could be confusing on the wikis page, so I guess the question is how should I add the videos, should I add a new category or just put it in the examples category, and if video documentation is a good idea toward you, since you are the #1 editor on this wiki haha, and I know nothing about style D:
----[[File:Uglehsig.png|53px|link=User:Ugleh_Ulrik]]([[User_talk:Ugleh_Ulrik|talk]]) 19:45, 11 October 2011 (PDT)

:I'm tickled that you would consult me but I really have no idea on this one. I think it's a great idea and until we get more of them to get a feel as to how they can be best incorporated into the documentation, they can be included any way you see fit. I might suggested posting the question to the script forums and mailing list (if you do, maybe post a link so I can follow along?). I can imagine putting them in See Also, Examples, Deep Notes, Helpers, Specification (maybe?), Newbie Notes, Notes. I have trouble seeing them in the Summary/Description, Caveats or Constants. Maybe float them on the right (like in [[PRIM_MATERIAL]])? Keep up the good work. ^_^ -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 12:21, 12 October 2011 (PDT)

== Hi ==

Just caught the comment over on the blog and wanted to say hi. I haven't left, just withdrawn from the official forums. Actually I hopped over to SLU, although their scripting forums are dead as doornails, so I've been amusing myself in their PRS section. Sent in an NDA for the latest inworld beta review project, no reply yet ::shrug:: hope all is good on your end, and was pleasantly surprised you stopped by. Cheers -- '''[[User:Void_Singer|Void]]''' ([[User_talk:Void_Singer|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Void_Singer|contribs]]) 07:52, 22 December 2011 (PST)

: Things are going well here. beta? do they have a page describing it anywhere? I always loved betas. I stay mostly here on the wiki, wish I could get in world more, I hate writing documentation without being able to test the functionality. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:22, 22 December 2011 (PST)
:P.S. You are a braver soul than I to go into PRS.

No wiki page that I'm aware of, e-mail invitation letters (which seem to have been dispersed to many forumites, and turned down by a few) describe it as pre-release feedback review, of what specifically, I couldn't say (even if I knew yet). I'll ask if they'll bounce you a late entry since you seem interested. and yeah PRS is madness, but I'm largely word-proof so the invective is more like warm glow instead of singing flame for me, something to kill break time. happy new years and all that jazz -- '''[[User:Void_Singer|Void]]''' ([[User_talk:Void_Singer|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Void_Singer|contribs]]) 10:00, 26 December 2011 (PST)

:Thank you for offering but It's better if you don't. I wish I could thou I have no time (nor the internet connection) for it. If they sent me an invitation I'd feel obliged to accept and then not be able to do it justice. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:55, 26 December 2011 (PST)

Understood, I'll try to remember to ping ya when it goes live then, could be a bit, dunno quite how far they are out on it. -- '''[[User:Void_Singer|Void]]''' ([[User_talk:Void_Singer|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Void_Singer|contribs]]) 16:22, 27 December 2011 (PST)

== http_response event only be triggered for the originating script or triggered for all scripts ==

Hello Strife,

I just read the [http://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LlHTTPRequest&diff=1157547&oldid=1157508 note] you added concerning [[llHTTPRequest]].
Although this is of course a sane behavior, I was a bit surprised when I read it because I knew it wasn't the case before, I also have some script that depends on the old behavior and I didn't received any complaints concerning them.
So, I've just checked and I can confirm that, at least on my home sim which use the main server version, the event is still triggered on all scripts of the object which made the request.

By pure curiosity, I wonder if you have any additional information about this change.

Many thanks,
[[User:Elena Bouscario|Elena]] 11:45, 11 February 2012 (PST)

:I have no information on this unfortunately. My edit was a rewrite of the [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LlHTTPRequest&diff=1157508&oldid=1153608 previous edit] so that everything would read more clearly. Sounds like both edits should be reverted. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 10:45, 12 February 2012 (PST)

== capturing caveats in constants pages? ==

I'm trying to figure out the proper way to include a caveat in the [[DEBUG_CHANNEL]] and [[PUBLIC_CHANNEL]] pages, so that it properly inserts into articles referencing those two pages. The caveat is as follows
* Messages on channel_name are throttled to a rate of <200/2sec, per region, per owner/user.
** Once the rate is exceeded, all messages on channel_name will be dropped until the send rate is again below 200/2sec for the previous 2 sec.
not quite sure how to go about it though? -- '''[[User:Void_Singer|Void]]''' ([[User_talk:Void_Singer|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Void_Singer|contribs]]) 23:27, 21 August 2012 (PDT)

:I'd be inclined to work it into [[Template:LSL_Function/chat]] as well. No time now (and likely won't be able to see later, going to the eye doctor). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 08:30, 22 August 2012 (PDT)

:Arrg it's a rats nest. I'll work on it later. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 08:31, 22 August 2012 (PDT)

:I've put it in the template so now it's now everywhere... but still needs some tweaking. back later -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]])

Thanks, didn't mean to give you headaches over it =( I'll take a look at how you did it so maybe next time I can sort it myself -- '''[[User:Void_Singer|Void]]''' ([[User_talk:Void_Singer|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Void_Singer|contribs]]) 21:47, 22 August 2012 (PDT)

:It wasn't as bad as I thought it would be, no worries. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 08:48, 23 August 2012 (PDT)

== llGetTime/llResetTime ==
I saw you made a distinction between Mono and LSO for whether or not it's affected by dilation. However, empirical evidence doesn't seem to support this. While this may have been true in the past, it doesn't seem to be anymore. [[User:Darien Caldwell|Darien Caldwell]] 11:08, 13 September 2012 (PDT)

:That is great. :) I'll revert it. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:20, 13 September 2012 (PDT)

== Another world, another wiki ==

I don't suppose you have any tips for a budding documentor? I'm just learning mediawiki, and started function documentation over at Cloud Party (I didn't create the templates) http://wiki.cloudpartytime.com
BTW, do you use avisynth, or work on wiki docs for it? Still enjoy tinkering with avisyth scripts! [[User:Phate Shepherd|Phate Shepherd]] 16:43, 16 September 2012 (PDT)

:I'm sorry it's been taking me so long to respond, I'm working on articulating the my thoughts. I haven't forgotten you. I want to do the questions justice. Watch this space for an update soon. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 20:29, 19 September 2012 (PDT)

::No worries... So much to do and learn here! Thanks![[User:Phate Shepherd|Phate Shepherd]] 22:06, 21 September 2012 (PDT)

:I had a partial response all ready written and then my computer crashed. Here is a reconstruction:
:# Find some documentation you really like, and copy it's good features. Find some bad documentation and figure out what you don't like.
:# Write a mission statement for you wiki based documentation project. It should be short and concise. Then write a longer description after it as to what it means. As a matter of course your project will attract people sooner or later who won't share your vision. Having something in writing you can beat them over the head with will help reduce the toll the drama will have upon you. I'd give you more advise along these lines but it might be too specific and never crop up (it's the subtle difference between keeping a loaded gun and keeping a loaded cross bow that shoots wooden stakes). Be sure to have a well spelled out contribution policy, specifically content must be licensed under a wiki specified license but that doesn't mean the author cannot dual license it under another license if they so choose (they just can't choose to not license it under the wiki license).
:# Don't feel you need to do everything. You are a volunteer. You volunteer. You do it for free. You aren't obligated to do anything. It's not like they are paying you. So when you feel stressed, that it is going to hell, remember this, take a deep breath and relax, if they want to avert catastrophe they can spend money. If the catastrophe can't be averted with money then there is nothing you could do about it, so there is no reason for you to be stressed about it. It's not your problem.
:#* I have many wiki projects, in various states of completion. Some have been in the works for years, that is to say, I haven't really done anything with them for a considerable amount of time.
:# If you want something done, you will probably have to do it yourself. You won't be able to convince anyone else to do it. {{LSLGC|Needs_Example}} grows, it doesn't shrink.
:# Engage your community. Ask them what they want out of the documentation. Ask them how to make it better. This will encourage them to help you. Be prepared to hold their hands and show them how to edit the documentation. This is how you cultivate contributors. This is how you cultivate a contributor community.
:# The quality of documentation is determined by the audience. You should choose an audience to server and put that in your mission or goal statement. Serving a diverse audience is going to require negotiating some very complex tradeoffs.
:#* The LSL documentation have [[LSL_Portal_Guidelines|mission and goal statements]] that are at odds with each other. The type of help a beginner needs is not the same as that of an expert. A beginner needs it simple, an expert needs it precise. The solution is a layout that tries to divide the problem into manageable chunks. However getting that solution realized has been difficult.
:# If you have an issue tracker, add links in your documentation to pertinent issue in the tracker. Update them on a regular basis. If you can make it auto-update.
:P.S. Those templates are cool. I've been trying to mimic some of those features for years (not impossible but I run the risk of killing the wiki).
:-- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:10, 27 September 2012 (PDT)
::Thanks for taking to the time to write that out... I'll try and take it to heart. As for the "Find a wiki you like...." Well, that's why I came to you ;-) [[User:Phate Shepherd|Phate Shepherd]] 12:58, 28 September 2012 (PDT)

== [[Hierarchics]] Reboot ==
Yeah, well, I had tested a modern slaveless version several times over. But each time I still hit significant performance issues.
I had instead started using newer techniques for achieving realtime high performance animated skeletons, see:
http://youtu.be/mZvV-1Ghxt0
http://youtu.be/KwFdahxZp7M
Unfortunately it is hard to document the scripting process, as it means using global variables for each part in the skeleton and using batched input-process-render stages. --[[User:Nexii Malthus|Nexii Malthus]] 08:05, 7 October 2012 (PDT)

== LSL Tip ==
Hiya, so what about the [[Template:LSL Tip]] template? Are you gonna keep the warning text? We could use the [[Template:KBcaution]] or [[Template:KBtip]] templates instead. -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 03:27, 18 October 2012 (PDT)

:I like both of those. Lets go with [[Template:KBcaution]] for now. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:14, 18 October 2012 (PDT)

:P.S. Added bonus: those templates were internationalized already.

== Any idea why embedded video (youtube or vimeo) is not showing? ==

Hiya Strife. Hope this finds you well :-)

On [[User:Fred_Gandt/Tuition|Fred_Gandt/Tuition]] and even [[Torley]]'s pages, embedded videos are not showing up for me. Is it just me (using Chrome on Win7)?  [[User:Fred_Gandt|'''fredgandt''']] 00:54, 2 November 2012 (PDT)

:Seems to be working for me. Even the one on my user page. It's probably something to do with chrome. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 01:58, 2 November 2012 (PDT)

::Meh. I'll try clearing some cookies and stuff. Thanks for checking and confirming it's at my end.  [[User:Fred_Gandt|'''fredgandt''']] 02:31, 2 November 2012 (PDT)
::Chrome is flagging all youtube vids embedded using <nowiki><videoflash></nowiki> tags as "insecure". Can someone get at the parser and set it to use https instead of http?  [[User:Fred_Gandt|'''fredgandt''']]

::I was about to ask Torley to take a look at the issue, but found he is off doing something else. I'm assuming you can act as an admin around here. Shit! You pretty much run the place :-)
::So when viewing the wiki under https, all videoflash is regarded as insecure. The issue is in [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:VideoFlash the mediawiki extension]. All the protocols are hard wired to http, so on a secure page, they are poop. I'd suggest (if possible) relative protocols or at least selective rewriting to allow https where available. YouTube is definitely available secure, and I think vimeo is too. Obviously hard wiring them (so to speak) as https would mean that https wiki pages would be happy and http wikipages wouldn't care one way or the other.
::Why does it matter? Videos are missing if a viewer's browser blocks the content. I took the time to find it, whilst others might not. Also: insecure content on a secure site is just poor practice. [[User:Fred_Gandt|'''fredgandt''']] 10:32, 4 November 2012 (PST)

== Request from inworld teacher ==

Would it be possible to encourage new users to append "better" versions at the bottom on users pages? Recently many of the pages I use for teaching classes have been "improved" which results in material which doesn't match our class notes, and in one case totally wiped out homework we give to see if students understand the concepts just taught! I am not talking about the LSL-101 pages which are in the shared userspace of the wiki. I am talking about my own user pages. I can see that we have a new enthusiast who wishes to fix everything all at once, but can I beg for discussion instead of reversions to user pages? Different people use their pages for different reasons. I am sure that many if not all of these script changes are excellent, but without an explanation to student users it's like changing a telegraph to a cellphone. It's "better," but incomprehensible.

In reviewing all my pages, I found a part where you changed things like ''for (i = 0; i < c; i = i + 1)'' to ''for (; i < c; ++i)'' which is fabulous, but without an explanation that the two are the same, most of the free scripts in SL just became incomprehensible to someone trying to teach themselves without a formal scripting background. My classes are aimed at the non-scriptor. Please when you make higher level changes on my user pages, please leave both versions and maybe explain why they are same/different? We have avid learners, but most of this wiki is like trying to read ancient Greek with a Russian translator.

I always thought in a wiki that "user" pages were allowed to the users to edit, with the "talk" or "discussion" pages being where to argue out the fine points. Maybe I'm wrong, but I would appreciate it if people would do what you do, make small changes at each edit, else append changes instead of wiping out whole scripts which match inworld classnotes, some of which date back to Eric Linden. [[User:Toady Nakamura|Toady Nakamura]] 09:39, 4 November 2012 (PST)

:I and [[User:Daemonika Nightfire|Daemonika Nightfire]] had our user pages defiled too. I recommend reverting and asking Kireji to back the F**k off. But then I'm not very political.  [[User:Fred_Gandt|'''fredgandt''']] 09:51, 4 November 2012 (PST)

::I'm thinking a conversation about the semi-sanctity of userpages is in order. It's gone further then I would have gone with it. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 10:10, 4 November 2012 (PST)

:I try to not mess with code unless I'm fixing a (logical) bug in the code or a gross inefficiency. Programming style is something I view as a personal preference and I would only mess with if I were fixing something major. People are attached to their user pages and take particular interest in controlling them so I try to turn a blind eye to them.

:As to the public tutorials, they are public and subject to change. Positive change is a good thing, negative change is not. The only thing I can offer is to use the permanent link button so you always get the same revision. As you say without an explanation somewhere that ''for (i = 0; i < c; i = i + 1)'' to ''for (; i < c; ++i)'' are often the same, how are people to know. This is precisely the sort of thing that needs to go in the tutorials. Or at least in the article on [[for]].

:I do recognize that most of the language of the wiki is technical. There are places (entire sections) for less technical language but they aren't documented and the project lacks a champion. History has demonstrated that while I am open to the concept of having it in the documentation, I cannot write that aspect of the documentation. Find me someone who is driven to write readable documentation and I'll bend over backwards to find space for it in the documentation (You might want to look at [[llSetColor]]) -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 10:10, 4 November 2012 (PST).

:P.S. Maybe we need a list of pages that are too opaque and in need of improvement.
:P.S.S. Remember this is a wiki, if we agree, we can change everything. Nothing is sacred. The only limits are our imagination (and what the wiki can handle before it implodes). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 10:13, 4 November 2012 (PST)

::I am inclined to defer to Wikipedia etiquette for no lesser reason than Wikipedia is the daddy of wiki's and gets it done (however anal it may be). See [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:User_pages#Ownership_and_editing_of_user_pages guidelines on ownership] and (same page)[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:User_pages#Editing_of_other_editors.27_user_and_user_talk_pages common practices specific to editing userspace pages]. Clearly if "the project" is the SL wiki, userspace pages would therefore feature in much the same way as they do on Wikipedia. Where tuition (especially) is concerned, scripts and examples are difficult to regard in the normal sense. Scripts written to show poor or extremely simplified methods may be valid. Large amounts of comments would also be perfectly acceptable.
::More importantly; scripts on user pages here are copied and used by people inworld, and how well (or badly) they perform reflects on the writer. I (for example) state that I do my best to make sure the scripts function correctly (although I don't get inworld much anymore and there may have been significant changes that cause some of my scripts to go wronger than they used to). I can't claim to have made every effort to ensure the workingnessability of a script if someone has come along and changed it!!
::Moreover; It's a matter of common courtesy. Sure we don't own the pages, but seriously?!?
::If you visit a public building and another visitor comes along and pulls the rug out from under you, is that acceptable? It doesn't really matter who owns the pages. It's what they are that matters. They are predominantly used as a repository for user created content that is being given away or as examples. As [[User:Daemonika Nightfire|Daemonika Nightfire]] said when discussing [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]]'s edits, she doesn't want to have to learn how her scripts work if someone asks her about them.
::I get emails now and then from people who want me to change features of some of my scripts for custom projects. If I came to grab a copy and found it wasn't what I wrote, but the other user though it was, I would have to either learn the new version or explain that someone else wrote it.
::If someone else wrote it, why the f**k is it on my user page with a heading exclaiming that I did?!
::<s>If it's decided that user pages (other than talk pages) can be freely edited by all and sundry, then I will ask that all my pages be deleted. Sounds precious? Try again.</s> [[User:Fred_Gandt|'''fredgandt''']] 10:58, 4 November 2012 (PST)

My two cents are on the topic are on [[User talk:Kireji Haiku|my user page]]. -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 12:10, 5 November 2012 (PST)

== Table within table?! ==

Hi, I wanted to put a side-by-side comparison table:

{| class="sortable" width="100%" {{Prettytable}}
|- {{Hl2}}
! '''Method one: returns float within (5.0, 10.0]'''
! '''Method two: returns float within (5.0, 10.0]'''
|-
||<lsl>
default
{
state_entry()
{
float randomFloat = 10.0 + llFrand(-5.0);

llSay(PUBLIC_CHANNEL, randomFloat);
}
}
</lsl>
||
<lsl>
default
{
state_entry()
{
float randomFloat = 10.0 - llFrand(5.0);

llSay(PUBLIC_CHANNEL, randomFloat);
}
}
</lsl>
|}

into the example section on the [[llFrand]] page. As far as I understand, that would be a table within a table, yes? Is it possible, if so how? -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 10:19, 9 November 2012 (PST)
:Ok, I can rip the html code off the template. Any other way with the wiki markup? -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 11:52, 9 November 2012 (PST)

::To do tables within tables I think you need to escape the pipes. Or that is how we use to do it when it was called for (they may have fixed that bug in mediawiki ages ago). Use <nowiki>{{!}}</nowiki> it's a specalized template for this exact purpose. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 20:27, 19 November 2012 (PST)

== Entry level information on LSL wiki pages ==

Hello again. I spent time over the last month looking at the "newbie Notes" as the example you provided on llSetColor. While I have the skill set to edit for this wiki at that level, I have found myself hesitating to start anymore "newbie Notes" because:

*"Newbie" is not necessarily a nice word. I feel that people seeking entry level material should not be categorized with a pejorative.

*The extra set of pages eg: llSetColor Main Page and llSetColor Basic Notes would create a parallel and confusing architecture.

I would like to suggest that instead of erecting a duplicate set of pages for all of the nearly 300 Linden Library functions and some dozens of events, that a section at the bottom of each function page be started for "entry level notes." After scrolling through the first page or two, any new user would rapidly find the "expert section" and the "entry level section" tucked at the bottom of the main page.

If that would be agreeable to you, I would be happy to undertake entry level editing of functions and events pages as time permits. [[User:Toady Nakamura|Toady Nakamura]] 09:48, 7 December 2012 (PST)

:I'm not exactly sure what notes are "newbie notes" (can't recall ever seeing any) but I partially agree with your apprehension about the pejorative.
:I personally don't find the word anything but honest, although I can imagine some feeling it derogatory or exclusive.
:Regarding "Entry level" notes: I feel that every page should start out (top to bottom) with entry level information, leading through examples to higher level notes.
:I don't think a generic technical description should be then followed by notes for people who (by implication) didn't understand it, then notes for people who understood it but need more.
:I'd be all in favour of pages being custom built to suit the subject, utilizing an info-box for the technical break-down, whilst the rest of the page is lane out in a less uniformed, and more uniquely useful style.
:Consider the difference between e.g. [[llSay]] and [[llHTTPResponse]]. Anyone reading the wiki to learn about llSay, will almost certainly need the subject explained in simple non-technical terms, than someone reading the entry for llHTTPResponse. Both should contain all the same (relative) information, but the style and flow of how that information is presented should reflect the individual case at hand.
:The difficulty in deciding to make special notes for special people is, who decides who is special?
:An expert programmer in another language would need a completely different set of "newbie notes" to someone who knew jack shit about programming. The former would need the technical details about this weird language explained (such as arbitrary delays), whereas the later wouldn't know why that needs explaining (they'd more likely just accept it). They would however need to know what comma separating function arguments is all about.
:What would probably work best, is something that is unlikely to be done. If every page was rewritten two more times, and supplied alongside the original, users could choose to read the "simple", "standard", or "advanced" page of each subject.
:*The "Simple" could be written as if talking to someone with little technical knowledge of programming. Lane out as a step by step tutorial.
:*The "Standard" would remain pretty much as they are now.
:*The "Advanced" could be written in a more terse tech heavy way, nailing the specifics and leaving out the fluff.
:Anyway; I'm not really around so much these days, so my input isn't perhaps very suitable (but I was basically invited to comment). [[User:Fred_Gandt|'''fredgandt''']] 18:31, 7 December 2012 (PST)

::As an aside: Newbie Notes was a compromises, we had an editor who wanted to write notes for new users, name the section after himself, and maintain strict editorial control over it. It didn't go anywhere after that.
::My issue with customized layouts is that it makes finding information within the articles more difficult. Instead of jumping to the content your interested in, you have to read all of it and it's not in the same place between articles.
::As you say, deciding which content goes where is difficult when you don't know where anything about your reader. A solution could be to query the user. You would go down a list of radioboxes self reporting your knowledge in a set of compatible disciplines and it would include the required prerequisites and choose the shortest route to understanding, if not attained you could tell the system to broaden it's scope and include more information from the parallel paths. It sounds like it would be really interesting to build. Not really doable with mediawiki :(

::We are doomed to fail if we can't automate the problem, this solution just doesn't scale. We can't personalize the documentation enough. People are too unique. We risk bloating the documentation too much or making it too large to manage.

::I don't consider it insulting but I'm not attached to the name. Can't please everyone. Maybe name it something like "The Basics"?

::As to [[User:Toady Nakamura|Toady Nakamura]]'s suggestion I'm all for it. If you want dedicated sections, give me an idea as to where and I'll put them in and add the variables to the template.

::The wiki creates an environment for breeding ideas. We need to foster that, it's why '''I'm in favor of giving [[User:Toady Nakamura|Toady Nakamura]] the go ahead'''. Without new ideas coming in, all we have is stagnation. Our audience is ever changing, if we don't change we will become more and more irrelevant to our target audience. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:24, 7 December 2012 (PST)

:::I think it would be fine to put entry notes at the top, as that is the first place one would look - and newer users tend to only look at the top... on the other hand... telling new users to look at the bottom of each page for detailed information would have the additional benefit of not changing the top of page layout for users who are familiar with the pages as they are now. So I vote for bottom of page, "Expert notes" and "Basic notes" on each page. And it would be lovely to have it in the template, then I could just go around and fix each page as I get to it. And yes, Fred, great idea to start with llSay and the easy ones! I will have more time for this project starting after Christmas and would be delighted to get going on it then! [[User:Toady Nakamura|Toady Nakamura]] 11:22, 19 December 2012 (PST)

::::With the expert/basic modifier, this sounds like a forking of the Notes Section, that the notes section should be retired and born anew as these two sections. I'll work on the templates tonight. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 13:00, 19 December 2012 (PST)

== llHTTPResponse: ==

Hey Strife,
your last edit on [[LlHTTPResponse]] didn't turn out as expected. The hover text doesn't show. I'd have changed it, but not sure how. -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji]] 08:11, 9 December 2012 (PST)

:It's working for me. What browser are you using? Are we talking about the hover in the description or for the wikipedia link? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 08:24, 14 December 2012 (PST)

::I'm on Firefox 17.0.1 on Windows 7 x64 Ultimate. -- '''[[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji]]''' ([[User talk:Kireji_Haiku|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Kireji_Haiku|contribs]]) 08:20, 1 January 2013 (PST)

:::I'll take a look at it down stairs (I have the same setup down there) tomorrow if I have the time -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:17, 1 January 2013 (PST)

==IM via Wiki?==
Hello Strife. Is there any private Instant Messaging facility in SL Wiki? [[User:Omei Qunhua|Omei Qunhua]] 03:13, 27 December 2012 (PST)

:Nope but you can always IM me on [http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/members/strife.html SL Universe] or email my gmail address blindwander. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 20:42, 27 December 2012 (PST)

== Caveats in page LlGetAlpha are wrong. ==

Hi,
can you maybe correct the Caveats in https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlGetAlpha
It says "If face indicates a face that does not exist the return is 0.0" which is incorrect, it always returns 1.0, see also https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/BUG-1256
I couldn't find out how to change it myself: )

: I've fixed it. I'll add it to the work queue to write some documentation for the [[Template:LSL Function/face]]. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:39, 5 January 2013 (PST)

== New version of file not showing for me... ==

Hiya, so I uploaded a new version of <code>File:Lsl_syntax_for_notepad_plus_plus.png</code> and it doesn't show on [[User:Kireji Haiku/Notepad++_Syntax_Highlight|the page where I put it]]. What did I do wrong? -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 09:59, 6 March 2013 (PST)

:Maybe it's your browser cache? The wiki likely isn't telling your browser that the image is stale. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 11:34, 11 March 2013 (PDT)

::I moved the content to Github. To answer your question, the old version stayed even after clearing cache. Not sure why, though. [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 07:52, 2 May 2013 (PDT)

== GeSHi for LSL on the wiki: ==

Ok, I'll try to keep the story short. I tried contacting Torley, but he [http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Project:About?diff=1173232&oldid=1146125 is not on the wiki team anymore], then I tried contacting Jeremy who seems to [[User_talk:Torley_Linden|have chosen to ignore the issue for more than half a year]]. I'm talking about the LSL syntax highlight on this wiki. I've found that this works over GeSHi and the mediawiki plugin. I contacted them there and provided a fix. Then was told I should provide the fix to GeSHi directly since it's third party software from their point of view. I provided the GeSHi team with a fix, too. Nobody really seems to be responsible for anything. So how do I get [https://github.com/buildersbrewery/lsl-for-geshi this up-to-date] file wherever so that syntax highlight is up-to-date on this particular wiki rather tomorrow than next year. [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 07:53, 2 May 2013 (PDT)

:Yeah I don't have a good answer for you, years ago I decided to just use a greasemonkey script to add the missing coloring. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 19:20, 7 May 2013 (PDT)

::Ok, so...what do we do now? I've got a couple of highlighting files for LSL on [https://github.com/buildersbrewery?tab=repositories this github project page], which should all be up-to-date AFAIK. Do you want to work on this, or should I? If you want me to do it, let me know what I need. Maybe a copy of that greasemonkey script? [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 02:32, 8 May 2013 (PDT)

:::It's a client side thing. http://userscripts.org/scripts/review/28162 -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:54, 9 May 2013 (PDT)

::::I'll take a look and see what I can do, thanks. [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 00:13, 15 May 2013 (PDT)

:::::This is what I got now. I removed the lslwiki parts, though. Could you test this?

<javascript>// ==UserScript==
// @name LSL Highlighter
// @namespace http://home.comcast.net/~mailerdaemon
// @include http://wiki.secondlife.com/*
// @include https://wiki.secondlife.com/*
// @version 1
// ==/UserScript==

(function(){
var GM_addStyle = function(css){
style = document.createElement("style");
style.type = "text/css";
style.innerHTML = css;
document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(style);
return style;//default GM_addStyle doesn't return the new style element
};

var search = "";
var prefixed = false;

if (($X("//meta[@name='generator' and starts-with(@content,'MediaWiki ')]")))
{
GM_addStyle("table.diff td div {overflow:visible;} pre.code a{ text-decoration:none; }");
GM_addStyle(".pBody { padding:0pt 0.8em 0.3em 0.5em; border:1px solid #AAAAAA; } .portlet h5 {background: transparent;}");
prefixs = ["", "/wiki/Special:Search?search="];
search = "//pre[@class='code' or @class='lsl']";

if ((breadcrumbs = $X("//div[@id='contentSub']")))
{
if (!(title = unsafeWindow.realTitleText))
if (title = $X("//div[@id='ReatTitleBanner']/span[@id='RealTitle']"))
title = title.textContent;
if (title && unsafeWindow.wgTitle)
$Z(".//text()[contains(.,'"+unsafeWindow.wgTitle+"')]",function(r,i,p){
r.data = r.data.replace(unsafeWindow.wgTitle, title);
}, breadcrumbs);
}

GM_addStyle([
".lsl a {font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;}",
".lsl .imp {font-weight: bold; color: red;}",
".lsl .lsl_states {color: #801A4D;}",
".lsl .lsl_events {color: #004D80;}",
".lsl .lsl_builtin_functions {color: #820124;}",
".lsl .lsl_builtin_constants_integer {color: #1A1A80;}",
".lsl .lsl_builtin_constants_string {color: #1A4D80;}",
".lsl .lsl_builtin_constants_float {color: #4D1A80;}",
".lsl .lsl_builtin_constants_compound {color: #663366;}",
".lsl .lsl_illegal_invalid {font-weight: bold; color: #FFFFFF; background-color: #FF0000; text-decoration: line-through;}",
".lsl .lsl_illegal_deprecated {font-weight: bold; color: #FFFF00; background-color: #FF0000; text-decoration: line-through;}",
".lsl .lsl_control {color: #0000CD;}",
".lsl .lsl_types {color: #003300;}",
".lsl .co1 {color: #CD4D26;}",
".lsl .es0 {color: #CD4D26;}",
".lsl .br0 {color: #66CC66;}",
".lsl .st0 {color: #003300;}",
".lsl .nu0 {color: #cc66cc;}",
".lsl .me1 {color: #006600;}",
".lsl .me2 {color: #006600;}",
""].join("\n"));
}
else
return;

function Group(className, prefix, expression, captures, processor){ this.c = className; this.v = prefix; this.r = expression; this.captures = captures || 0; this.processor = processor;}
Group.prototype = { toString: function(){ return "("+this.r+")"; }, };

var groups = [ //{
new Group("nu0", -1, "0[xX][0-9a-fA-F]+|\\.[0-9]*[Ee][+-]?[0-9]*|[0-9]+[Ee][+-]?[0-9]*"),
new Group("lsl_illegal_deprecated", 0, "ll(?:Cloud|CollisionSprite|GodLikeRezObject|Make(?:Explosion|Fountain|Smoke|Fire)|(?:Stop)?PointAt|(?:(?:Refresh|Set)Prim)URL|(?:Take|Release)Camera|RemoteDataSetRegion|RemoteLoadScript|SetInventoryPermMask|SetObjectPermMask|Sound(?:Preload)?|XorBase64Strings)|AGENT|ATTACH_[LR]PEC|CHARACTER_MAX_ANGULAR_(?:ACCEL|SPEED)|OBJECT_ATTACHMENT_(?:GEOMETRY_BYTES|SURFACE_AREA)|DATA_RATING|LAND_(?:LARGE|MEDIUM|SMALL)_BRUSH|PERMISSION_(?:CHANGE_(?:JOINTS|PERMISSIONS)|RELEASE_OWNERSHIP|REMAP_CONTROLS)|PRIM_(?:CAST_SHADOWS|MATERIAL_LIGHT|PHYSICS_MATERIAL|TYPE_LEGACY)|PSYS_SRC_(?:(?:INNER|OUTER)ANGLE|OBJ_REL_MASK)|VEHICLE_FLAG_NO_FLY_UP"),
new Group("lsl_illegal_invalid", 0, "event|print"),
new Group("lsl_states", 0, "(?:state)\\s+\\w+|default"),
new Group("lsl_control", 0, "@|do|else(?: if)?|for|if|jump|return|while"),
new Group("lsl_types", 0, "float|integer|key|list|quaternion|rotation|string|vector"),
new Group("lsl_events", 0, "(?:state_(?:entry|exit)|touch(?:_(?:start|end))?|(?:land_)?collision(?:_(?:start|end))?|timer|listen|(?:no_)?sensor|control|(?:not_)?at_(?:rot_)?target|money|email|run_time_permissions|changed|attach|dataserver|moving_(?:start|end)|link_message|(?:on|object)_rez|remote_data|http_re(?:sponse|quest)|path_update|transaction_result)"),
new Group("lsl_builtin_constants_integer", 1, "FALSE|TRUE|(?:JSON_APPEND|STATUS_(?:PHYSICS|ROTATE_[XYZ]|PHANTOM|SANDBOX|BLOCK_GRAB(?:_OBJECT)?|(?:DIE|RETURN)_AT_EDGE|CAST_SHADOWS|OK|MALFORMED_PARAMS|TYPE_MISMATCH|BOUNDS_ERROR|NOT_(?:FOUND|SUPPORTED)|INTERNAL_ERROR|WHITELIST_FAILED)|AGENT(?:_(?:BY_(?:LEGACY_|USER)NAME|FLYING|ATTACHMENTS|SCRIPTED|MOUSELOOK|SITTING|ON_OBJECT|AWAY|WALKING|IN_AIR|TYPING|CROUCHING|BUSY|ALWAYS_RUN|AUTOPILOT|LIST_(?:PARCEL(?:_OWNER)?|REGION)))?|CAMERA_(?:PITCH|DISTANCE|BEHINDNESS_(?:ANGLE|LAG)|(?:FOCUS|POSITION)(?:_(?:THRESHOLD|LOCKED|LAG))?|FOCUS_OFFSET|ACTIVE)|ANIM_ON|LOOP|REVERSE|PING_PONG|SMOOTH|ROTATE|SCALE|ALL_SIDES|LINK_(?:ROOT|SET|ALL_(?:OTHERS|CHILDREN)|THIS)|ACTIVE|PASSIVE|SCRIPTED|CONTROL_(?:FWD|BACK|(?:ROT_)?(?:LEFT|RIGHT)|UP|DOWN|(?:ML_)?LBUTTON)|PERMISSION_(?:RETURN_OBJECTS|DEBIT|OVERRIDE_ANIMATIONS|SILENT_ESTATE_MANAGEMENT|TAKE_CONTROLS|TRIGGER_ANIMATION|ATTACH|CHANGE_LINKS|(?:CONTROL|TRACK)_CAMERA|TELEPORT)|INVENTORY_(?:TEXTURE|SOUND|OBJECT|SCRIPT|LANDMARK|CLOTHING|NOTECARD|BODYPART|ANIMATION|GESTURE|ALL|NONE)|CHANGED_(?:INVENTORY|COLOR|SHAPE|SCALE|TEXTURE|LINK|ALLOWED_DROP|OWNER|REGION(?:_START)?|TELEPORT|MEDIA)|OBJECT_(?:(?:PHYSICS|SERVER|STREAMING)_COST|UNKNOWN_DETAIL|CHARACTER_TIME|PHANTOM|PHYSICS|TEMP_ON_REZ|NAME|DESC|POS|PRIM_EQUIVALENCE|RETURN_(?:PARCEL(?:_OWNER)?|REGION)|ROO?T|VELOCITY|OWNER|GROUP|CREATOR|ATTACHED_POINT|RENDER_WEIGHT|PATHFINDING_TYPE|(?:RUNNING|TOTAL)_SCRIPT_COUNT|SCRIPT_(?:MEMORY|TIME))|TYPE_(?:INTEGER|FLOAT|STRING|KEY|VECTOR|ROTATION|INVALID)|(?:DEBUG|PUBLIC)_CHANNEL|ATTACH_(?:AVATAR_CENTER|CHEST|HEAD|BACK|PELVIS|MOUTH|CHIN|NECK|NOSE|BELLY|[LR](?:SHOULDER|HAND|FOOT|EAR|EYE|[UL](?:ARM|LEG)|HIP)|(?:LEFT|RIGHT)_PEC|HUD_(?:CENTER_[12]|TOP_(?:RIGHT|CENTER|LEFT)|BOTTOM(?:_(?:RIGHT|LEFT))?))|LAND_(?:LEVEL|RAISE|LOWER|SMOOTH|NOISE|REVERT)|DATA_(?:ONLINE|NAME|BORN|SIM_(?:POS|STATUS|RATING)|PAYINFO)|PAYMENT_INFO_(?:ON_FILE|USED)|REMOTE_DATA_(?:CHANNEL|REQUEST|REPLY)|PSYS_(?:PART_(?:BF_(?:ZERO|ONE(?:_MINUS_(?:DEST_COLOR|SOURCE_(ALPHA|COLOR)))?|DEST_COLOR|SOURCE_(ALPHA|COLOR))|BLEND_FUNC_(DEST|SOURCE)|FLAGS|(?:START|END)_(?:COLOR|ALPHA|SCALE|GLOW)|MAX_AGE|(?:RIBBON_|WIND|INTERP_(?:COLOR|SCALE)|BOUNCE|FOLLOW_(?:SRC|VELOCITY)|TARGET_(?:POS|LINEAR)|EMISSIVE)_MASK)|SRC_(?:MAX_AGE|PATTERN|ANGLE_(?:BEGIN|END)|BURST_(?:RATE|PART_COUNT|RADIUS|SPEED_(?:MIN|MAX))|ACCEL|TEXTURE|TARGET_KEY|OMEGA|PATTERN_(?:DROP|EXPLODE|ANGLE(?:_CONE(?:_EMPTY)?)?)))|VEHICLE_(?:REFERENCE_FRAME|TYPE_(?:NONE|SLED|CAR|BOAT|AIRPLANE|BALLOON)|(?:LINEAR|ANGULAR)_(?:FRICTION_TIMESCALE|MOTOR_DIRECTION)|LINEAR_MOTOR_OFFSET|HOVER_(?:HEIGHT|EFFICIENCY|TIMESCALE)|BUOYANCY|(?:LINEAR|ANGULAR)_(?:DEFLECTION_(?:EFFICIENCY|TIMESCALE)|MOTOR_(?:DECAY_)?TIMESCALE)|VERTICAL_ATTRACTION_(?:EFFICIENCY|TIMESCALE)|BANKING_(?:EFFICIENCY|MIX|TIMESCALE)|FLAG_(?:NO_DEFLECTION_UP|LIMIT_(?:ROLL_ONLY|MOTOR_UP)|HOVER_(?:(?:WATER|TERRAIN|UP)_ONLY|GLOBAL_HEIGHT)|MOUSELOOK_(?:STEER|BANK)|CAMERA_DECOUPLED))|PRIM_(?:TYPE(?:_(?:BOX|CYLINDER|PRISM|SPHERE|TORUS|TUBE|RING|SCULPT))?|HOLE_(?:DEFAULT|CIRCLE|SQUARE|TRIANGLE)|MATERIAL(?:_(?:STONE|METAL|GLASS|WOOD|FLESH|PLASTIC|RUBBER))?|SHINY_(?:NONE|LOW|MEDIUM|HIGH)|BUMP_(?:NONE|BRIGHT|DARK|WOOD|BARK|BRICKS|CHECKER|CONCRETE|TILE|STONE|DISKS|GRAVEL|BLOBS|SIDING|LARGETILE|STUCCO|SUCTION|WEAVE)|TEXGEN_(?:DEFAULT|PLANAR)|SCULPT_(?:TYPE_(?:SPHERE|TORUS|PLANE|CYLINDER|MASK)|FLAG_(?:MIRROR|INVERT))|PHYSICS(?:_(?:SHAPE_(?:CONVEX|NONE|PRIM|TYPE)))?|(?:POS|ROT)_LOCAL|SLICE|TEXT|FLEXIBLE|POINT_LIGHT|TEMP_ON_REZ|PHANTOM|POSITION|SIZE|ROTATION|TEXTURE|NAME|OMEGA|DESC|LINK_TARGET|COLOR|BUMP_SHINY|FULLBRIGHT|TEXGEN|GLOW|MEDIA_(?:ALT_IMAGE_ENABLE|CONTROLS|(?:CURRENT|HOME)_URL|AUTO_(?:LOOP|PLAY|SCALE|ZOOM)|FIRST_CLICK_INTERACT|(?:WIDTH|HEIGHT)_PIXELS|WHITELIST(?:_ENABLE)?|PERMS_(?:INTERACT|CONTROL)|PARAM_MAX|CONTROLS_(?:STANDARD|MINI)|PERM_(?:NONE|OWNER|GROUP|ANYONE)|MAX_(?:URL_LENGTH|WHITELIST_(?:SIZE|COUNT)|(?:WIDTH|HEIGHT)_PIXELS)))|MASK_(?:BASE|OWNER|GROUP|EVERYONE|NEXT)|PERM_(?:TRANSFER|MODIFY|COPY|MOVE|ALL)|PARCEL_(?:MEDIA_COMMAND_(?:STOP|PAUSE|PLAY|LOOP|TEXTURE|URL|TIME|AGENT|UNLOAD|AUTO_ALIGN|TYPE|SIZE|DESC|LOOP_SET)|FLAG_(?:ALLOW_(?:FLY|(?:GROUP_)?SCRIPTS|LANDMARK|TERRAFORM|DAMAGE|CREATE_(?:GROUP_)?OBJECTS)|USE_(?:ACCESS_(?:GROUP|LIST)|BAN_LIST|LAND_PASS_LIST)|LOCAL_SOUND_ONLY|RESTRICT_PUSHOBJECT|ALLOW_(?:GROUP|ALL)_OBJECT_ENTRY)|COUNT_(?:TOTAL|OWNER|GROUP|OTHER|SELECTED|TEMP)|DETAILS_(?:NAME|DESC|OWNER|GROUP|AREA|ID|SEE_AVATARS))|LIST_STAT_(?:MAX|MIN|MEAN|MEDIAN|STD_DEV|SUM(?:_SQUARES)?|NUM_COUNT|GEOMETRIC_MEAN|RANGE)|PAY_(?:HIDE|DEFAULT)|REGION_FLAG_(?:ALLOW_DAMAGE|FIXED_SUN|BLOCK_TERRAFORM|SANDBOX|DISABLE_(?:COLLISIONS|PHYSICS)|BLOCK_FLY|ALLOW_DIRECT_TELEPORT|RESTRICT_PUSHOBJECT)|HTTP_(?:METHOD|MIMETYPE|BODY_(?:MAXLENGTH|TRUNCATED)|CUSTOM_HEADER|PRAGMA_NO_CACHE|VERBOSE_THROTTLE|VERIFY_CERT)|STRING_(?:TRIM(?:_(?:HEAD|TAIL))?)|CLICK_ACTION_(?:NONE|TOUCH|SIT|BUY|PAY|OPEN(?:_MEDIA)?|PLAY|ZOOM)|TOUCH_INVALID_FACE|PROFILE_(?:NONE|SCRIPT_MEMORY)|RC_(?:DATA_FLAGS|DETECT_PHANTOM|GET_(?:LINK_NUM|NORMAL|ROOT_KEY)|MAX_HITS|REJECT_(?:TYPES|AGENTS|(?:NON)?PHYSICAL|LAND))|RCERR_(?:CAST_TIME_EXCEEDED|SIM_PERF_LOW|UNKNOWN)|ESTATE_ACCESS_(?:ALLOWED_(?:AGENT|GROUP)_(?:ADD|REMOVE)|BANNED_AGENT_(?:ADD|REMOVE))|DENSITY|FRICTION|RESTITUTION|GRAVITY_MULTIPLIER|KFM_(?:COMMAND|CMD_(?:PLAY|STOP|PAUSE|SET_MODE)|MODE|FORWARD|LOOP|PING_PONG|REVERSE|DATA|ROTATION|TRANSLATION)|ERR_(?:GENERIC|PARCEL_PERMISSIONS|MALFORMED_PARAMS|RUNTIME_PERMISSIONS|THROTTLED)|CHARACTER_(?:CMD_(?:(?:SMOOTH_)?STOP|JUMP)|DESIRED_(?:TURN_)?SPEED|RADIUS|STAY_WITHIN_PARCEL|LENGTH|ORIENTATION|ACCOUNT_FOR_SKIPPED_FRAMES|AVOIDANCE_MODE|TYPE(?:_(?:[ABCD]|NONE))?|MAX_(?:DECEL|TURN_RADIUS|(?:ACCEL|SPEED)))|PURSUIT_(?:OFFSET|FUZZ_FACTOR|GOAL_TOLERANCE|INTERCEPT)|REQUIRE_LINE_OF_SIGHT|FORCE_DIRECT_PATH|VERTICAL|HORIZONTAL|AVOID_(?:CHARACTERS|DYNAMIC_OBSTACLES|NONE)|PU_(?:EVADE_(?:HIDDEN|SPOTTED)|FAILURE_(?:DYNAMIC_PATHFINDING_DISABLED|INVALID_(?:GOAL|START)|NO_(?:NAVMESH|VALID_DESTINATION)|OTHER|TARGET_GONE|(?:PARCEL_)?UNREACHABLE)|(?:GOAL|SLOWDOWN_DISTANCE)_REACHED)|TRAVERSAL_TYPE(?:_(?:FAST|NONE|SLOW))?|CONTENT_TYPE_(?:ATOM|FORM|HTML|JSON|LLSD|RSS|TEXT|XHTML|XML)|GCNP_(?:RADIUS|STATIC)|(?:PATROL|WANDER)_PAUSE_AT_WAYPOINTS|OPT_(?:AVATAR|CHARACTER|EXCLUSION_VOLUME|LEGACY_LINKSET|MATERIAL_VOLUME|OTHER|STATIC_OBSTACLE|WALKABLE)|SIM_STAT_PCT_CHARS_STEPPED)"),
new Group("lsl_builtin_constants_string", 1, "(?:EOF|JSON_(?:ARRAY|DELETE|FALSE|INVALID|NULL|NUMBER|OBJECT|STRING|TRUE)|NULL_KEY|TEXTURE_(?:BLANK|DEFAULT|MEDIA|PLYWOOD|TRANSPARENT)|URL_REQUEST_(?:GRANTED|DENIED))"),
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Cheers! [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 11:49, 22 May 2013 (PDT)

:I had to make all the sub-expressions use non-capture groups (which was how it was originally). I also made some minor tweaks that should do nothing but are for style correctness (I've learned better JS habits since I wrote that). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 14:44, 22 May 2013 (PDT)

:I've added support for custom post-processing for groups and for them capture information from the expression. If we decide to merge bad numbers into a single node, that code would be a post-processor. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 00:18, 23 May 2013 (PDT)

::Whatever works I'd say. Not sure why you chose purple for numbers, though. Did you test it? Where to put this now? [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 13:27, 23 May 2013 (PDT)

:::Purple because that's the color they are now and it makes highlighting look right on pages like [[float]]. I usually post these to [UserScripts.org] (which I have just [http://userscripts.org/scripts/review/28162 done]) and let people find them on their own. Sometime I'll post a forum thread about them, but I haven't done that in ages. I'm hoping that is what you meant. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:52, 23 May 2013 (PDT)

::::No, I meant are you going to upload it to the wiki here so the highlighting here is fixed. Or how does this work? Have a nice weekend [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 08:17, 24 May 2013 (PDT)

:::::Oh dear, I was afraid of this at the last. It's a script for {{Wikipedia|Greasemonkey|w=n}}, it's not a server script. It probably will work in Chrome as well (not tested). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 10:33, 24 May 2013 (PDT)

::Ok, so this brings us back to GeSHi? How to update that? [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 12:19, 27 May 2013 (PDT)

:::The only way to do so is likely to be pestering LL. At this point I don't know who you would start with. Couldn't hurt to open a new bug on Jira, something along the lines of "LSL Syntax highlighting on the wiki needs updating" and see which linden is foolish enough to update the jira. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 19:22, 27 May 2013 (PDT)

== kwdb ==

By the way, there's a LSL keywords database that generates output for various syntax highlighters including GeSHi [http://code.google.com/p/kwdb/ here]. -- [[User:Sei Lisa|Sei Lisa]] 09:12, 4 June 2013 (PDT)

:Thanks for the info. It's not that I don't have a file, I don't know where to put it so the syntax highlighting works on this wiki. I've got a copy I'm working on myself on [https://github.com/buildersbrewery/lsl-for-geshi github.com/buildersbrewery/lsl-for-geshi]. -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 09:40, 5 June 2013 (PDT)

::LL has to install it in some directory on the server (they will know if they look for where the old one is), it's not something we can do. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 11:14, 5 June 2013 (PDT)

:You may be interested in https://github.com/pclewis/lslint/commits/23c3fb11226249f633bed1f0b077435e58f80781/wiki_builtins.pl it's a script to walk the wiki to get functions, events and constants. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 11:14, 5 June 2013 (PDT)

::Thank you. That script generates some "false positives" and lacks some constants. Currently the generator provides also lslint output, by the way. Most other collections of keywords I've evaluated are incomplete and sometimes incorrect, and I try to keep it up to date. For example, Kireji's list misses some OBJECT_* constants and has other problems. -- [[User:Sei Lisa|Sei Lisa]] 12:51, 7 June 2013 (PDT)

:::I know it lacks some constants, I don't always remember to add them to the signature section. False positives? That is surprising. Could you give me an example? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:23, 7 June 2013 (PDT)

::::I wouldn't be surprised if it comes up with a few functions that it shouldn't. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:48, 7 June 2013 (PDT)

:::::Sorry, false positive, singular. CLICK_ACTION_ZOOM doesn't exist. Some constants come out duplicated, some list wrong values. Here's a diff if interested. http://pastebin.ca/2393166 -- [[User:Sei Lisa|Sei Lisa]] 05:23, 8 June 2013 (PDT)

::::::That diff really helps. It suggests we have several wrong values here on the wiki and gives us a good place to start fixing things. However I don't think it's a good idea for the wiki to move away from hex notation just so that we match the source code, not all of the LSL Portal's readers know their powers of two. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:40, 8 June 2013 (PDT)

::::::P.S. I consider the duplicates a bug in the script. Yes some constants appear in multiple articles signature section, it's a <strike>hack</strike> feature.

:::::::I'm not going to login to test this are you sure there is no CLICK_ACTION_ZOOM? https://bitbucket.org/lindenlab/viewer-release/src/41898042294e4c48d9fc8bbc327f0926ed6b6712/indra/lscript/lscript_compile/indra.l#cl-644 If it's not valid than you have found a bug. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:00, 8 June 2013 (PDT)

::::::::I'm completely sure. What do you mean about hex notation? In the database, my criterion is to write in hex the numbers that are supposed to be bitfields, as that's the closest to binary that LSL supports. Nothing to do with the source code. That generates some differences between wiki and kwdb that are not real differences, you can just ignore them. I processed the files in order to make them comparable, including removing the arg names and removing leading zeros from hex numbers, but not transforming them to a common base, thus differences in radix are expected. -- [[User:Sei Lisa|Sei Lisa]] 08:19, 9 June 2013 (PDT)

:::::::::I just meant some integer constants had values like 0x80 or 128. I hadn't considered parameter name changes but we do use different names for the parameters (some of the original parameter names are confusing or poorly chosen). As you say not real differences. I'll file a bug about CLICK_ACTION_ZOOM, they must have forgotten to put it in the server side compiler. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 00:12, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

::::::::::{{JIRA|BUG-2827}} -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 01:15, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

:::::::::::Thanks for the link, but it's useless for mortals. -- [[User:Sei Lisa|Sei Lisa]] 07:49, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

::::::::::::Ah I forgot about that problem. It's basically a duplicate of {{Jira|SCR-236}}. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 11:25, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

:::::::::I'll also start working on the real conflicts. Thanks for taking the time. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 01:21, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

::::::::::I figured you meant 0xNNN but I don't understand why you said it's not a good idea to move away from hex notation, as I didn't remotely suggest that. Some constants that are in decimal in the wiki are in hex in kwdb, like some RC_* ones, and vice versa, like CONTENT_TYPE_*. There are a few where it can be debatable whether they are flags, like ESTATE_ACCESS_* (which is not specified to support multiple flags, though the header says "action flag") and PSYS_SRC_PATTERN_* of which you can't combine several, to my knowledge, so I considered they should not be regarded as flags. -- [[User:Sei Lisa|Sei Lisa]] 04:54, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

::::::::::PSYS_SRC_PATTERN_* was probably built rather than designed (that is to say, they hadn't entirely decided what they were doing when they did it). It will require some testing but it makes sense to allow the combining of (ALLOWED_AGENT_ADD | BANNED_AGENT_REMOVE) or (ALLOWED_AGENT_REMOVE | BANNED_AGENT_ADD), LL may have laid out the constants with that in mind even if they never added support for it. Or the number correspond with internal constants the server uses, and the server combines them. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 11:25, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

::::What about the "other problems"? -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 10:35, 8 June 2013 (PDT)

I've updated the float constants to use the values from https://bitbucket.org/lindenlab/viewer-release/src/41898042294e4c48d9fc8bbc327f0926ed6b6712/indra/llmath/llmath.h?at=default#cl-56 -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 12:09, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

:KFM_CMD_SET_MODE what is it used for? PSYS_SRC_OBJ_REL_MASK is a dead constant. Used for nothing.
:I can see why you would be confused, most of those where the radix differs is in the direction of more obscure.
:-- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 13:52, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

::I don't know what it's used for. I know it's defined, as it passed the constant values test. If it's unused, its status in the database should be marked as unimplemented. PSYS_SRC_OBJ_REL_MASK was already marked as such. Output modules for LSL2dfg/kwdb can choose to skip these or put them in a separate section of the generated output if they wish, based on the status field. I'm pondering whether it would make sense to define a new status, "unknown", for KFM_CMD_SET_MODE. -- [[User:Sei Lisa|Sei Lisa]] 15:57, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

:::I'll have to spend some time figuring out how I'm going to document these (and those PRIM_MEDIA_* flags I never documented because I thought LL would remove them {{JIRA|VWR-24413}}). I think we need a category for useless and nearly useless constants constants. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:31, 10 June 2013 (PDT)

:::P.S. [[Release_Notes/Second_Life_RC_BlueSteel/13]]

== [edit][edit][edit] ==

Hello strife,
I recently made changes on the Lag-page, and today I noticed that the "Cache" section (which I've added) shows the [edit] link three times!
Could you please help me fixing this, I have no clue what I did wrong (again) https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Lag :D Thanks!

:You didn't do anything wrong per se. It's a design defect of how CSS "float" works (more preciesly the defect is with the scope of "clear"). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:06, 14 June 2013 (PDT)

::Just leaving a thank you! --[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 10:29, 15 June 2013 (PDT)

== Pathfinding categories ==

I've found that the pathfinding categories are somewhat messed up. There's [[:Category:Pathfinding]] and [[:Category:LSL Pathfinding]]. [[llGetSimStats]] is only in the latter, as is the case for some <code>CHARACTER_*</code> constants. I think there should be a "single stop" page (category) for them. Do you agree? If so, which one do you think it should be? --[[User:Pedro Oval|Pedro Oval]] 12:47, 29 August 2013 (PDT)

:I do in deed agree but I also don't like to break the naming tradition or trash a Linden category. But since you suggested it, we should probably do away with one of the categories. Any thoughts as to which one? -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 14:37, 29 August 2013 (PDT)

::The description in [[:Category:Pathfinding]] reads: "Articles related to new pathfinding feature and related LSL API." Maybe the LSL API part should be moved to its own [[:Category:LSL_Pathfinding]] and leave '''Pathfinding''' for articles only (and include '''LSL_Pathfinding''' as a subcategory of it). I think that makes the most sense. People who linked to '''Pathfinding''' will find the link to the LSL one. --[[User:Pedro Oval|Pedro Oval]] 17:03, 29 August 2013 (PDT)

:::Works for me. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 20:33, 29 August 2013 (PDT)

::::Done. Please review what I've done, I'm not too confident to have gotten it right. I used the template name <nowiki>{{Pathfinding LSL alpha}}</nowiki> to switch the template while respecting the original intention. The name has Pathfinding at the start (as opposed to LSL Pathfinding Alpha) for emphasis on Pathfinding. While on it, I also renamed Template:LSL_Constants/llWanderW'''I'''thin to the right case. --[[User:Pedro Oval|Pedro Oval]] 08:41, 30 August 2013 (PDT)

:::::Good catch. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 09:50, 30 August 2013 (PDT)

== [[Template:LSL_Header]] ==
I believe it could use a link to [[LSL_Alternate_Editors]]. Whatcha think? -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 10:16, 8 October 2013 (PDT)

:See [[Template_talk:LSL_Header]] for my reply. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 14:37, 8 October 2013 (PDT)

== Broken links: ==
On [[User:Strife Onizuka|your user page]] in the Scite/ESL section all links to your comcast account are broken. Oh yeah and...it was C++. -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 07:43, 16 October 2013 (PDT)

:yes they are. I'll look into finding a place to host them. I knew C had changed a lot since I learned it but I didn't think they added member functions. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 11:15, 16 October 2013 (PDT)

::I've just updated my links and uploaded everything. I've even published the most up to date and complete lsl.api (it's an an export of kwdb). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 17:31, 16 October 2013 (PDT)

== German translation of llList2Json ==

Hiya Strife,
I just made an attempt to start translating the JSON functions to German,
but this page shows me a weird error message, could you please tell me what I did wrong :P
[[LlList2Json/de]] {{Unsigned|MartinRJ Fayray}}

:'n Abend, ich denke ich hab den Fehler behoben, Du hattest wohl einen senkrechten Strich ganz am Anfang zu viel. And yeah, Strife... I think I fixed it, there was a pipe too many. Not sure about the fix though, so if the fix needs a fix, have a go at it, LOL. Anyhow, enjoy the weekend you two. -- [[User:Kireji Haiku|Kireji Haiku]] 15:06, 18 October 2013 (PDT)

::Oops, thanks Kireji : ) --[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 15:32, 18 October 2013 (PDT)

:I'll work on updating the [[Template:LSL Function/de]] (I generally do not update the templates for other languages). My view on the entire thing has to do with knowing your audience, each language represents a group of distinct cultures, who each have different cultural norms rooted deep in history. I would not presume to force the same layout on everyone (only English speakers). Also some of the template features for example do not work for Japaense. But to get back on topic. I don't want people to feel that English is the only language. I really want the international community to come and own their part of the wiki, figure out what works and doesn't. My goal is only to provide a framework, give them something to start from. There is no reason the articles need to be literal translations, and we gain nothing by having them be so.

:As to what is wrong with the template, it never got updated beyond the point where LL stopped adding functions to LSO. It assumes all functions have ids. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 20:53, 18 October 2013 (PDT)

:I'm going to update the template but someone will need to go through and translate it. It hasn't been updated in 5 years so it's going to be a bumpy ride but hey you get 5 years worth of template insanity all at once instead of gradually. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:20, 18 October 2013 (PDT)

::Thanks, that's great =) --[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 22:31, 18 October 2013 (PDT)

:::There are a few templates that need translating, here is what i've got so far (I'll add more as I find them): - '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 22:46, 18 October 2013 (PDT)
:::[[Template:LSL_Bug_Icon/en]] -> [[Template:LSL_Bug_Icon/de]]
:::[[Template:LSL_Generic/Issues]] -> [[Template:LSL_Generic/Issues/de]]
:::[[Template:LSL_Generic/Caveats]] -> [[Template:LSL_Generic/Caveats/de]]

:::Discovered the header template was broken. Was just easier to port. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:21, 18 October 2013 (PDT)

:::There are likely other templates that need updating to work with the newer version of the template. Let me know if you encounter a broken template. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:24, 18 October 2013 (PDT)

::::I translated the 3 above templates, but on the article page [[LlList2Json/de]] the "Caveats" and "Jira Search" sections are still using the English template. Thanks so far, though : ) Also these headlines should also be translated: "Specification" = "Beschreibung", "Caveats" = "Anmerkungen", "Examples" = "Beispiele", "See Also" = "Siehe auch", "Deep Notes" = "Erweitert" --[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 14:48, 19 October 2013 (PDT)

:::::That oddly had more to do with which template was being used. For whatever reason multilang wasn't working right and so you were getting the english version of the template (my new keyboard arrived, it's so nice to have a Z key again). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 20:38, 19 October 2013 (PDT)

:::One more thing, can you please point me to the "specifiers does not support negative indexes." template - it's being used here: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlJsonSetValue/de - Thanks! --[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 14:36, 20 October 2013 (PDT)
:::Yet another thing: How do I translate the template that shows a 'Contents' nav-box at the top right of each page, e.g. https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/JSON_APPEND/de - it should be translated from "Contents" to "Inhalt". Thank you much! PS: found out how to use the multilang template. --[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 18:19, 20 October 2013 (PDT)
:::I'm done with the translation of LSL_JSON so far, if you find any errors, please let me know. --[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 19:48, 20 October 2013 (PDT)

::::Nothing I can do about "Contents". That is Media Wiki. Unless we write our own. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:16, 21 October 2013 (PDT)
:::I don't speak German but it all looks good. However don't use multilang directly unless you have to. There is secondary categorization that multilang does which doesn't get setup if you use it directly. The LSL templates all have it set so you don't need to do anything. And you don't need to worry multilang gets called before everything else in the lsl templates.
:::I've updated the Constant template (bug fixes). -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:11, 22 October 2013 (PDT)
:::P.S. I'm surprised you haven't asked me about the haiku. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:11, 22 October 2013 (PDT)
::::What does it?--[[User:MartinRJ Fayray|MartinRJ Fayray]] 23:18, 22 October 2013 (PDT)
:::::Project to be revealed next April. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 23:20, 22 October 2013 (PDT)

== Thanks ==

Thank you for your apreciation. The [[Second Life Geography]] project is going on. Just hope the Lindens will not ban me for the high number of articles I created and I want to create. And best wishes for you. Your (and others') articles halped me learn to script and now I use scripted objects for my survey tasks.

--[[User:Anaimfinity Resident|Rays of green light. Bright and proud to be a Circassian]] 05:26, 30 November 2013 (PST)

:LL may work in mysterious and counter intuitive ways, but they won't ban you for what you are doing (and you haven't created as many articles as I have... yet). What you are doing has obvious value and is interesting, and most importantly you aren't rocking anyones boat. I have some thoughts:
:* You need to categorize the articles. One general category like [[:Category:Second Life Geography]] or [[:Category:SL Geography]] then lots of subcategories like [[:Category:Continents]] then [[:Category:Linden Continents]] etc.
:* You need to figure out if you want this to be part of the another Portal or you want this to be it's own Portal. I'm inclined to say it should be it's own portal. Something like [[Geography Portal]]. By doing so you could absorb some of the content left after the KB move (like [[Second Life Railroad]]).
:* You should probably have some header that helps identify your project pages from the average random wiki pages. Like [[Template:Help]] or [[Template:LSL Header]].
:I wish you luck and I hope you can find some folks to help you with it. Beyond template wrangling I can't do much to help. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 21:41, 30 November 2013 (PST)

== Use of [[Template:LSL_Function/Head]] on [[LSL_HTTP_server]] ==

Hiya,
I've run into problems using [[Template:LSL_Function/Head]] on [[LSL_HTTP_server]]. The function description from the '''llHTTPResponse section''' is automatically copied to the '''llGetHTTPHeader section''' and the '''llGetFreeURLs section''' which both in turn don't actually have a description. Plus the p1_desc of the '''llGetHTTPHeader''' is there twice. Not sure if one's a copy of '''llHTTPResponse''', but that'd be my guess. Any idea how to fix this?
Cheers -- '''[[User:Kireji_Haiku|Kireji Haiku]]''' ([[User talk:Kireji_Haiku|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Kireji_Haiku|contribs]]) 12:00, 9 January 2014 (PST)

:I never thought of using the template this way. FYI: T:Head is not mature, so there may be other problems. My only concern of using it here is that it may not be the best layout for this and that we don't have a matching template for events. I liked the different style of information presentation, precisely because it was different. I don't have a strong opinion on this yet as the work isn't really done yet. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 17:31, 9 January 2014 (PST)

::First of all, thansk for the fix. I changed it because the structure and formatting made it difficult to see where one sections started and ended in that wall of text. Any other idea regarding that page? I kinda liked that function header template though. -- '''[[User:Kireji_Haiku|Kireji Haiku]]''' ([[User talk:Kireji_Haiku|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Kireji_Haiku|contribs]]) 04:38, 11 January 2014 (PST)

:::I am someone who is self conscious about being resistant to change. It's growing on me. I don't have a big problem with it. My only concern is information duplication and desyncronization. I've got an idea on how to fix this but I need to do some experiments etc (hopefully it won't bring the wiki to it's knees). This would be a low priority project. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 16:35, 11 January 2014 (PST)

== LSL syntax highlighting on Github ==

Happy friday,

I'm working on an LSL lexer for [https://github.com/tmm1/pygments.rb Pygments] to get LSL syntax highlighting support on [https://github.com Github]. I'd appreciate some feedback on this if you have some spare time:

https://github.com/buildersbrewery/lsl-for-pygments

-- '''[[User:Kireji_Haiku|Kireji Haiku]]''' ([[User talk:Kireji_Haiku|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Kireji_Haiku|contribs]]) 16:26, 14 February 2014 (PST)

== Template:Hl3 ==

I have no clue why I made that. As you can see it was 4 years ago. If you know why, let me know lol.

----[[File:Uglehsig.png|53px|link=User:Ugleh_Ulrik]]([[User_talk:Ugleh_Ulrik|talk]]) 22:22, 6 March 2014 (PST)

== I try my best ==

The article about private land Geography is a research that is in progress, together with other researches. It requires about 1000 sims to be surveyed. I want to treat private sims with the respect they deserve. We have now articles for small map structures, even for single sims, but still nothing for those so many [[Unassociated Sims]] on the grid. Please wait me to finish it. And if you have better ideas, feel free to tell me. Hope it will be done until August 1st.

--[[User:Anaimfinity Resident|Rays of green light. Bright and proud to be a Circassian]] 14:02, 14 July 2014 (PDT)

:Sounds good. Keep up the good work. -- '''[[User:Strife_Onizuka|Strife]]''' ([[User talk:Strife_Onizuka|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Strife_Onizuka|contribs]]) 19:11, 14 July 2014 (PDT)

== linking keywords with <nowiki><syntaxhighlight></nowiki> ==

Looks like keyword linking is a [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:SyntaxHighlight_GeSHi#Default_Links_for_Keywords server side variable], don't know if LL will want that enabled or not this time. --[[User:ObviousAltIsObvious Resident|ObviousAltIsObvious Resident]] ([[User talk:ObviousAltIsObvious Resident|talk]]) 21:42, 21 January 2015 (PST)
* If that works differently than it did before (no first hand knowledge here), please create a JIRA with how things worked before and now, and maybe drop a link to the JIRA on the open source list or raise it at Oz's meeting. A lot of work was done on shedding a lot of special case dependencies related to the old auth mechanism and enhancing our security posture. It would be unsurprising if something were lost in the transition. --[[User:Soft Linden|Soft Linden]] ([[User talk:Soft Linden|talk]]) 07:30, 22 January 2015 (PST)

User:Soft Linden

2014-10-06T02:22:13Z

Soft Linden:

User:Soft Linden/foo.css

2014-10-06T01:44:28Z

Soft Linden: Created page with "body { font-family: arial; }h1 { background-color:#CCC; border: 1px solid; color:#39F; text-align: center; }table { background-color: #F60; border:…"

body { font-family: arial; }h1 { background-color:#CCC; border: 1px solid; color:#39F; text-align: center; }table { background-color: #F60; border: 1px solid #39F; width: 100%; }td { border: 0px; text-align: center; }p { color:#09F; text-indent: 20px; }

User:Soft Linden

2014-09-26T14:36:47Z

Soft Linden: Created page with "."

User talk:ObviousAltIsObvious Resident

2013-12-10T20:57:38Z

Soft Linden: Created page with "Thank you for the many useful wiki edits. I run across yours now and again when I'm using the wiki as a reference myself. --~~~~"

Thank you for the many useful wiki edits. I run across yours now and again when I'm using the wiki as a reference myself. --[[User:Soft Linden|Soft Linden]] 12:57, 10 December 2013 (PST)

LlGetEnv

2013-06-18T20:10:54Z

Soft Linden:

{{LSL_Function
|func_id=362|func_sleep=0.0|func_energy=0.0
|func= llGetEnv |sort=GetEnv
|return_type=string
|p1_type=string|p1_name=name|p1_desc=The name of the data to request
|func_footnote=Note that the value returned is a string, you may need to cast it to an integer for use in calculations.
|func_desc
|return_text=with the requested data about the [[region]].
|spec
|caveats
|constants=
<div style="margin-bottom:1em;">
{{{!}} class="sortable" {{Prettytable|style=margin:0;}}
{{!}}+ Table of valid {{LSLP|name}} values.
{{!}}-{{Hl2}}
! {{!}} Name
! class="unsortable" {{!}} Description
! {{!}} {{HoverText|Type to typecast to|To make the value returned more useful, you will want to typecast it to this type}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "dynamic_pathfinding"
{{!}} Get the region's effective dynamic_pathfinding status, "enabled" or "disabled". This option is configured in the [[SimConsole|Region Debug Console]]
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "estate_id"
{{!}} Numerical index identifying which estate a region belongs to. Main grid mainland is "1"
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "frame_number"
{{!}} Get the frame number of the simulator, for example "42042".
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "region_idle"
{{!}} Get the region's [http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Second-Life-Server/Region-Idling-FAQ/m-p/1535497 idle] status, "1" or "0".
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]] [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boolean_algebra_%28logic%29 boolean]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "sim_channel"
{{!}} Get the region's [[Het-Grid_FAQ#What_is_a_channel.3F|channel]] string, for example "Second Life Server".
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "sim_version"
{{!}} Get the region's [[Version numbering#Second_Life_Server_Versioning|version number]] string, for example "{{HoverText|10|[2-digit year]}}.{{HoverText|11|[2-digit month]}}.{{HoverText|30|[2-digit day]}}.{{HoverText|215699|[build number]}}".
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}}
</div>
|examples=<lsl>
default
{
touch_start(integer total_number)
{
string version = llGetEnv("sim_version");
llOwnerSay("Region " + llGetRegionName() + " is running "
+ llGetEnv("sim_channel") + " version " + version );

list ver = llParseString2List(version, ["."], []);

llOwnerSay("Build: "+llList2String(ver, 3));
llOwnerSay("Build Date: "+llList2String(ver, 2)+"-"+llList2String(ver, 1)+"-20"+llList2String(ver, 0));
}
}
</lsl>
|helpers
|also_functions=
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llRequestSimulatorData]]|}}
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llGetSimulatorHostname]]|}}
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llGetRegionFlags]]|}}
|also_tests
|also_events
|also_articles
|notes=* Region idling lowers a region's framerate when no avatars are currently on or looking into the region. Scripts measuring time dilation with [[llGetRegionTimeDilation]] may report significant time dilation if the region is idle.
|history=* {{Jira|SVC-4874}}
*Introduced in [[Release Notes/Second Life RC LeTigre/10#10.11.30.215699|Second Life RC LeTigre 10.11.30.215699]], deployed on 2010-12-01.
*Deployed to rest of Agni with Second Life Server 10.11.30.215699, Second Life RC BlueSteel 10.12.06.216207, Second Life RC Magnum 10.11.30.215699
*"frame_number" option added in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.01.03.247042
**Returns an integer that represents the current 'frame' of the simulator. Generally only useful for specific debugging cases.
*Removed (temporarily?) in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.01.06.247303
|cat1
|cat2=Region
|cat3
|cat4
}}

LlGetEnv

2013-06-18T20:09:34Z

Soft Linden:

{{LSL_Function
|func_id=362|func_sleep=0.0|func_energy=0.0
|func= llGetEnv |sort=GetEnv
|return_type=string
|p1_type=string|p1_name=name|p1_desc=The name of the data to request
|func_footnote=Note that the value returned is a string, you may need to cast it to an integer for use in calculations.
|func_desc
|return_text=with the requested data about the [[region]].
|spec
|caveats
|constants=
<div style="margin-bottom:1em;">
{{{!}} class="sortable" {{Prettytable|style=margin:0;}}
{{!}}+ Table of valid {{LSLP|name}} values.
{{!}}-{{Hl2}}
! {{!}} Name
! class="unsortable" {{!}} Description
! {{!}} {{HoverText|Type to typecast to|To make the value returned more useful, you will want to typecast it to this type}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "dynamic_pathfinding"
{{!}} Get the region's effective dynamic_pathfinding status, "enabled" or "disabled". This option is configured in the [[SimConsole|Region Debug Console]]
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "estate_id"
{{!}} Numerical index identifying which estate a region belongs to
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "frame_number"
{{!}} Get the frame number of the simulator, for example "42042".
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "region_idle"
{{!}} Get the region's [http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Second-Life-Server/Region-Idling-FAQ/m-p/1535497 idle] status, "1" or "0".
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]] [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boolean_algebra_%28logic%29 boolean]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "sim_channel"
{{!}} Get the region's [[Het-Grid_FAQ#What_is_a_channel.3F|channel]] string, for example "Second Life Server".
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "sim_version"
{{!}} Get the region's [[Version numbering#Second_Life_Server_Versioning|version number]] string, for example "{{HoverText|10|[2-digit year]}}.{{HoverText|11|[2-digit month]}}.{{HoverText|30|[2-digit day]}}.{{HoverText|215699|[build number]}}".
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}}
</div>
|examples=<lsl>
default
{
touch_start(integer total_number)
{
string version = llGetEnv("sim_version");
llOwnerSay("Region " + llGetRegionName() + " is running "
+ llGetEnv("sim_channel") + " version " + version );

list ver = llParseString2List(version, ["."], []);

llOwnerSay("Build: "+llList2String(ver, 3));
llOwnerSay("Build Date: "+llList2String(ver, 2)+"-"+llList2String(ver, 1)+"-20"+llList2String(ver, 0));
}
}
</lsl>
|helpers
|also_functions=
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llRequestSimulatorData]]|}}
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llGetSimulatorHostname]]|}}
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llGetRegionFlags]]|}}
|also_tests
|also_events
|also_articles
|notes=* Region idling lowers a region's framerate when no avatars are currently on or looking into the region. Scripts measuring time dilation with [[llGetRegionTimeDilation]] may report significant time dilation if the region is idle.
|history=* {{Jira|SVC-4874}}
*Introduced in [[Release Notes/Second Life RC LeTigre/10#10.11.30.215699|Second Life RC LeTigre 10.11.30.215699]], deployed on 2010-12-01.
*Deployed to rest of Agni with Second Life Server 10.11.30.215699, Second Life RC BlueSteel 10.12.06.216207, Second Life RC Magnum 10.11.30.215699
*"frame_number" option added in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.01.03.247042
**Returns an integer that represents the current 'frame' of the simulator. Generally only useful for specific debugging cases.
*Removed (temporarily?) in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.01.06.247303
|cat1
|cat2=Region
|cat3
|cat4
}}

LlGetEnv

2013-06-18T20:08:05Z

Soft Linden: sort, add estate_id

{{LSL_Function
|func_id=362|func_sleep=0.0|func_energy=0.0
|func= llGetEnv |sort=GetEnv
|return_type=string
|p1_type=string|p1_name=name|p1_desc=The name of the data to request
|func_footnote=Note that the value returned is a string, you may need to cast it to an integer for use in calculations.
|func_desc
|return_text=with the requested data about the [[region]].
|spec
|caveats
|constants=
<div style="margin-bottom:1em;">
{{{!}} class="sortable" {{Prettytable|style=margin:0;}}
{{!}}+ Table of valid {{LSLP|name}} values.
{{!}}-{{Hl2}}
! {{!}} Name
! class="unsortable" {{!}} Description
! {{!}} {{HoverText|Type to typecast to|To make the value returned more useful, you will want to typecast it to this type}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "dynamic_pathfinding"
{{!}} Get the region's effective dynamic_pathfinding status, "enabled" or "disabled". This option is configured in the [[SimConsole|Region Debug Console]]
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "estate_id"
{{!}} Numerical index identifying which estate a region belongs to
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "frame_number"
{{!}} Get the frame number of the simulator, for example "42042".
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "region_idle"
{{!}} Get the region's [http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Second-Life-Server/Region-Idling-FAQ/m-p/1535497 idle] status, "1" or "0".
{{!}} {{Yes|[[integer]] [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boolean_algebra_%28logic%29 boolean]}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "sim_channel"
{{!}} Get the region's [[Het-Grid_FAQ#What_is_a_channel.3F|channel]] string, for example "Second Life Server".
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}-
{{!}} "sim_version"
{{!}} Get the region's [[Version numbering#Second_Life_Server_Versioning|version number]] string, for example "{{HoverText|10|[2-digit year]}}.{{HoverText|11|[2-digit month]}}.{{HoverText|30|[2-digit day]}}.{{HoverText|215699|[build number]}}".
{{!}} {{No|N/A}}
{{!}}}
</div>
|examples=<lsl>
default
{
touch_start(integer total_number)
{
string version = llGetEnv("sim_version");
llOwnerSay("Region " + llGetRegionName() + " is running "
+ llGetEnv("sim_channel") + " version " + version );

list ver = llParseString2List(version, ["."], []);

llOwnerSay("Build: "+llList2String(ver, 3));
llOwnerSay("Build Date: "+llList2String(ver, 2)+"-"+llList2String(ver, 1)+"-20"+llList2String(ver, 0));
}
}
</lsl>
|helpers
|also_functions=
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llRequestSimulatorData]]|}}
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llGetSimulatorHostname]]|}}
{{LSL DefineRow||[[llGetRegionFlags]]|}}
|also_tests
|also_events
|also_articles
|notes=* Region idling lowers a region's framerate when no avatars are currently on or looking into the region. Scripts measuring time dilation with [[llGetRegionTimeDilation]] may report significant time dilation if the region is idle.
|history=* {{Jira|SVC-4874}}
*Introduced in [[Release Notes/Second Life RC LeTigre/10#10.11.30.215699|Second Life RC LeTigre 10.11.30.215699]], deployed on 2010-12-01.
*Deployed to rest of Agni with Second Life Server 10.11.30.215699, Second Life RC BlueSteel 10.12.06.216207, Second Life RC Magnum 10.11.30.215699
*"frame_number" option added in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.01.03.247042
**Returns an integer that represents the current 'frame' of the simulator. Generally only useful for specific debugging cases.
*Removed (temporarily?) in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.01.06.247303
|cat1
|cat2=Region
|cat3
|cat4
}}

User talk:Uzume Grigorovich

2011-09-14T02:35:21Z

Soft Linden: Thanks!

== Thanks! ==

I just happened to see you edit the custom names redirect. Thanks for pitching in! --[[User:Soft Linden|Soft Linden]] 19:35, 13 September 2011 (PDT)

User:Soft Linden/Office Hours/Thursday

2010-09-20T19:21:36Z

Soft Linden: Blanked the page

User:Soft Linden/Office Hours/Monday

2010-09-20T19:17:51Z

Soft Linden: Blanked the page

User:Merov Linden/Office Hours/Thursday

2010-03-18T16:29:45Z

Soft Linden:

{{hCalendar event/Office Hours
|mode={{{mode|}}}
|Resident=Merov Linden
|weekday=Thursday
|start=2pm {{SLT}}
|end=3pm {{SLT}}
|location=[http://slurl.com/secondlife/Hippotropolis/239/28/24/?&title=Hippotropolis Hippotropolis]
|description=The [[Open Source Meeting]] is a weekly discussion of [http://secondlifegrid.net/programs/open_source open source] issues. Unless there are urgent blocking issues, it's good form to raise issues on the [[SLDev|SLDev mailing list]] before bringing them to live discussion. Anyone may edit the meeting [[Open Source Meeting/Agenda|agenda]] in advance of the meeting.
}}

User:Soft Linden/Office Hours/Thursday

2010-03-18T16:29:03Z

Soft Linden: moved User:Soft Linden/Office Hours/Thursday to User:Merov Linden/Office Hours/Thursday

#REDIRECT [[User:Merov Linden/Office Hours/Thursday]]

User:Merov Linden/Office Hours/Thursday

2010-03-18T16:29:03Z

Soft Linden: moved User:Soft Linden/Office Hours/Thursday to User:Merov Linden/Office Hours/Thursday

{{hCalendar event/Office Hours
|mode={{{mode|}}}
|Resident=Soft Linden
|weekday=Thursday
|start=2pm {{SLT}}
|end=3pm {{SLT}}
|location=[http://slurl.com/secondlife/Hippotropolis/239/28/24/?&title=Hippotropolis Hippotropolis]
|description=The [[Open Source Meeting]] is a weekly discussion of [http://secondlifegrid.net/programs/open_source open source] issues. Unless there are urgent blocking issues, it's good form to raise issues on the [[SLDev|SLDev mailing list]] before bringing them to live discussion. Anyone may edit the meeting [[Open Source Meeting/Agenda|agenda]] in advance of the meeting.
}}

Snowglobe

2010-02-05T21:03:40Z

Soft Linden:

{{multi-lang}}[[Image:Snowglobe-snowflake-captioned.svg|right|192px|]]
'''Snowglobe''' is an experimental viewer for Second Life.

* '''Downloads'''
** {{snowglobe-installers}}
** {{snowglobe-installers-trunk}}
** Very latest installer downloads: look for the most recent build on the [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits sldev-commits mailing list].
** Look at [[Version control repository]] for information about how to checkout the source code with SVN.
* The [[Get source and compile]] page gives general information about how to compile the source.
* '''[[Snowglobe Current Cycle|Current Release Cycle]]''' - information on features and patches pending for the current release cycle
* Here's a list of documents on the main features in Snowglobe 1.2 that are not available in the Second Life 1.23 viewer:
** [[Media Rendering Plugin Framework Technical Overview]] - New Plugin architecture allowing media of all kinds to render in Snowglobe
** [[User:Pixel_Gausman/Interop_Viewer|Interop Viewer Open Grid Protocol]] - Documents how OGP (now VWRAP) is implemented in Snowglobe
** [[HTTP Texture]] - Project to transition from custom UDP-based protocol to HTTP for texture delivery
** [[S3 based viewer map]] - Utilizing HTTP Texture for the in-viewer map
* Commit mail and build system notifications: [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits sldev-commits mailing list].
* Developers discussion: [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensource-dev opensource-dev mailing list].
* [[Snowglobe Committer List]] - List of people with direct commit access who are working to build this viewer
* [[Snowglobe Development Process]] - Development practices for everyone working on the Snowglobe viewer
* [[Snowglobe QA]] - More details on the process we'll use to maintain high quality releases
** [[Snowglobe Test Plans]]
* Browse source: [http://svn.secondlife.com/trac/linden/browser/projects/2009/snowglobe snowglobe branch in Trac] - browse the source code we're working on

For an introduction to the goals of the Snowglobe viewer, see [https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/technology/blog/2009/03/30/intensifying-open-source-efforts Philip's blog post: "Intensifying Open Source Effort"] which describes our new approach to open source. See [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/2009-May/013879.html Philip's mail to sldev] for a little bit more about the name.

[[Category:Open Source Portal]]
[[Category:Snowglobe|*]]
[[Category:Glossary]]

About AWG

2010-02-05T21:02:53Z

Soft Linden: Rename sldev to opensource-dev

== About ==

The [[Architecture Working Group]] mission is to develop the protocols that will open up the Second Life Grid from something operated solely by Linden Lab to where others can run parts of the grid.

The timeframe for this work is short. Linden Lab is committed to implementing and deploying the protocols over the next two years. In this time frame, the AWG must focus on those aspects of the protocol that enable the opening up of the grid while primarily keeping the remaining feature set of Second Life constant.

Since we all hope that this work forms a stable base for years to come, the AWG should endeavor that its designs support a variety of implementation strategies, and are amenable to future extension. There is a tension between an agile strategy of implementing only what you need today vs. the approach of designing for a range of future possibilities. Linden Lab has heavily leaned toward the agile approach. The AWG needs to lean mostly this way as well, with of course some thought given to making the protocol evolvable.

The AWG isn't meant as a wholesale redesign of the Second Life platform. While we realize that there are many possible design choices, and that there are many possible approaches, the goal here is to take what is clearly a workable design and make it open. Think HTML 1.0 and HTTP 0.9 - Neither were perfect, and there were many things that couldn't be done with them. But they were functional, open and had enough extensibility to support future HTML versions, CSS, JavaScript, etc.... making the web what it is today. The AWG must aim to do the same for virtual worlds, and realize it within the next two years.

== Getting started ==
Membership in this group is open. Start contributing to the work, and you become a member.
* What you can do:
** Join the [http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev opensource-dev mailing list] and use the tag [AWG] in the subject line of mail you send.
** Read the documents in your area of expertise and comment on them in the AWG wiki or on [http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev list].
** Join the [[AW_Groupies|in-world discussion group]].
** [[Architecture_Working_Group#Meetings|Attend meetings]] (see below).
** Help keep the community organized: triage agenda items for meetings, post work items, etc.

== Process ==
* Use opensource-dev and meetings to discuss ideas and organize work.
* Develop documents (designs, use cases, etc.) in user space of wiki. Move to main sections below after community vetting.
* Use discussion tab in wiki to provide feedback on documents.

== Best Practices ==
''' Community Standards '''
* Participate: in a friendly, helpful and constructive way.
* Distracting or disruptive behavior may be grounds for loss of AWG membership.
* Out-of-scope and off-topic discussions should be held outside of the main AWG wiki area, e.g., in your user space or [[The Incubator]].

''' Wiki editing and documents '''
* Documents should begin as working drafts in your wiki user space.
* When making wiki pages please take care to choose page names that will not cause confusion. Developing proposals in user space will help keep high-level page names free for seasoned documents and avoid ambiguity about what's a proposal and what's official.
* Documents should be vetted by the community for technical quality and clarity. After vetting by the community, they can be moved into the main document categories below.
* Collaboration is as valuable and appreciated as authorship.
* Linden Lab reserves the right to edit this wiki as needed.

''' OpenSource-Dev '''
* Follow the [http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev list guidelines].
* Flag AWG-related posts by using the [AWG] tag in the subject line.
* Responses should be on topic and collegial.
* If the content of a thread changes, please change the subject line.
* Please do NOT use the list as an IRC/chat stand-in. One-line responses and snarky asides clutter the list and make it less readable.

[[Category: Architecture Working Group]]

Developer communication tools

2010-02-05T21:00:32Z

Soft Linden:

{{Languages}}
{{OSWikiContribBox}}

Let us know what you think on email, on the forum, or in-world. If it's not working for you, try to get help there. If it is working for you, try helping someone who isn't having as much luck as you are.

== Mailing List ==

[[OpenSource-Dev|OpenSource-Dev Mailing List]] ([https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensource-dev subscribe]) - mailing list for discussing the development of the Second Life viewer. This is a high-traffic mailing list (as many as 30-40 messages/day on a busy day). For a weekly summary of this mailing list, see [[SLDev Traffic]]. You may also want to search the [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/opensource-dev/ OpenSource-Dev archives].

== Forum ==

If you are having issues getting things built, and you just want to ask a quick question, please ask it in one of the "[http://forums.secondlife.com/forumdisplay.php?f=296 Technical Talk]" forums.

== JIRA ==

If you run into issues, look through the bug database and see if a bug has been filed. If so, vote for the issue to be fixed. If not, file the bug.

[http://jira.secondlife.com Second Life JIRA] is the place to submit bug reports, reproductions and patches for issues relating to the open source viewer.

== Wiki ==
You're soaking in it...

This is the place to post documentation, more indepth discussions, and various projects

== IRC ==
Internet Relay Chat - your instant way to communicate, using the EFNet IRC network

<nowiki>#opensl</nowiki> - irc://irc.efnet.org/opensl
General open source viewer discussion and development channel

<nowiki>#opensl-jira</nowiki> - irc://irc.efnet.org/opensl-jira
Real time tracking of all Jira entries

== In-World Groups ==
=== Resident-Run Groups ===
: AW Groupies : In-world discussion of [[Architecture Working Group]] plus [[AW_Groupies|wiki webpages]]
; Aware of the SL Issue Tracker : To promote awareness of the Second Life [[issue tracker]].
; Hack SL : "Whether you're a good hacker or a bad hacker, or simply a chaotic-neutral hacker, the undenyable fact is that the source is now open, and whether or not you have good intentions, you have full access to the code and the client. Come join us and figure out new and exciting ways to either fix or break SL so we can strengthen the community through fire and aloe!"
; JIRA and SLDev Fanclub : "For all thoses techno-nerdo-geeky of SLDev enjoying the public secondlife JIRA, meta-issueing, bug-triage and much more... Trying to organize unofficial bug-triage and bogus-bug hunting party!"
; OpenSL : "Open Second Life viewer #opensl on efnet [[Open Source Portal]]"
; Second Life Source Developers : A group who use their real life programing skills to make SL a better place with open source releases from Linden Lab.

== In-World Locations ==
The [[Hippotropolis]] region is a gathering place for developers and residents interested in improving the Second Life Viewer. [http://slurl.com/secondlife/Hippotropolis/190/65/38/ Teleport] to the Linden Open Source Project headquarters.

== Weekly In-world Meeting ==

Each week, there's an [[Open Source Meeting]] to discuss open source issues.

SLDev

2010-02-05T17:52:09Z

Soft Linden:

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

Disambiguation:

*[[OpenSource-Dev | opensource-dev - Open Source Developers' Mailing List (formerly SLDev)]]
*[[SLDev Forum Transcripts | SLDev Forum Transcripts for SLDev Solution Providers' program]]

OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-05T17:51:37Z

Soft Linden: opensource-dev instead of os-dev

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com] - mailing list for discussing open source development issues related to Second Life. This is a high-traffic mailing list (as many as 30-40 messages/day on a busy day).

* '''[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensource-dev Subscribe to opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com]''' (or [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/options/opensource-dev unsubscribe])
* [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/opensource-dev/ Browse the archive] ([https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/ prior to SLDev rename])
* [http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=001010425210852223575%3Aogwhgz5_tue Search the archive prior to SLDev rename]

'''IMPORTANT''': Please be sure to read the Posting Policies and Guidelines below before posting to this mailing list.

== Posting Policies and Guidelines ==

The opensource-dev mailing list is for development issue related to Second Life open source code. The following policies are meant to ensure we can keep conversation civil and on-topic. "Policies" are rules that need to be followed to ensure continued posting privileges. "Guidelines" have more wiggle room, but should be considered before posting.

=== Policies ===

* This mailing list is for discussing problems and ideas that software developers can directly address and for collaboration on solutions and improvements, not for turning Linden Lab development staff into proxies to reach other parts of Linden Lab (e.g. legal, executive, human resources, etc).
* Please adhere to the [https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2009/02/25/guidelines-for-the-sl-blogs guidelines for blog.secondlife.com]. Since we can't delete comments that are in violation, we're going to instead preemptively set the "moderated" bit for repeat violators.
* Constructive criticism is welcome, but general complaints which only serve to discourage use of Second Life or discourage cooperation with Linden Lab should be taken elsewhere.
* If you have auto-reply email software (such as out-of-office notification), please make sure that it's configured correctly. Failure to do so will cause you to receive moderated access until you assure us it's fixed. See the Autoreply Software section below for more details.
* If someone else is violating mailing list policy, do not reply to them on the list. Reply to them offlist if you feel you need to engage them. If you feel disciplinary action is required, send mail to the list administrator (<opensource-dev-owner@lists.secondlife.com>). Engaging with them on-list may result in the moderation bit being set on your account.

=== Guidelines ===

In addition to the policies above, here's some guidelines. These aren't hard-and-fast rules, but rather, good etiquette. There are a lot of people on this list (800+ as of this writing), so please follow these guidelines when you post:

* Please remember the old mantra "praise in public, criticize in private". On-list reprimands are rarely of interest to the general mailing list.
* If you are asking a question to the list, either [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/opensource-dev/ browse the archives] or do a [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=POT&q=site%3Alists.secondlife.com%2Fpipermail%2Fopensource-dev%2F&btnG=Search keyword search of the archives] first to check if your question has already been responded.
* Keep threads on topic. If you want to talk about something unrelated to the subject of a thread, change the subject line. If the new topic is something that doesn't belong on opensource-dev@, please strongly consider posting it elsewhere.
* If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum.
* If the topic is not specifically a Second Life development-related topic (e.g. mailing list policy or a licensing discussion), it should be redirected to the wiki, the bug tracker, or the appropriate forum immediately. One post per 48 hours should be sufficient to bring it to everyone's attention.
* If after 48 hours, the topic seems to have died out on the alternate forum, it's ok to reraise the issue on this mailing list, summarizing the offlist conversation thus far, and calling for further comment in the alternate forum.
* Please use the keywords below (in the "Subject Line Keywords" section) when posting, especially the "strongly recommended" keywords.
* Most LSL scripting issues are better addressed on the [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters secondlifescripters mailing list].

These guidelines try to balance between making sure that people have a large forum to raise and discuss a broad spectrum of issues, while at the same time ensuring that the list doesn't become overwhelmed with discussion on a single topic that may not be of interest to everyone on the list.

== Subject Line Keywords ==

When posting to the list, please take your best guess at the right subject line keyword to put on your email. Some of the keywords below are strongly recommended, while some are purely optional. However, all of them will help people organize

Strongly recommended (since they are arguably a little off-topic):
* [POLICY] issues about policy and etiquette on wiki, jira, and the mailing list, some licensing/legal logistics issues NOTE: licensing issues should be directed to licensing@lindenlab.com
* [META] repositories, creating inworld meeting places, getting and keeping the community organized, product cycle processes
* [WEB] questions/complaints about the website, jira, wiki, etc

Optional:
* [ANN] announcements
* [VWR] questions about viewer releases. Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR the "VWR" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [SVC] questions about the Second Life service (simulators, login servers, web apis, general grid questions). Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC the "SVC" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [IDEA] for new features ideas and proposals
* [VOICE] about voice activation features
* [HELP] for topic about building the viewer or other support request
* [I18N] for internationalization and localization problems
* [EVENTLET] eventlet questions
* [MULIB] mulib questions
* [PATCH] for patchy patches! For feedback on a patch, or just to let people know it exists so they can try it.
* [AWG] [[Architecture Working Group]]

If you have suggested changes for these keywords, please put your suggestion on [[Talk:OpenSource-Dev|the talk page]].

== Autoreply Software ==

If you have autoreply software to notify people that you are out of the office, please make sure that the software complies with the "Personal Responder" guidelines defined in [http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3834.txt RFC 3834 - Recommendations for Automatic Responses to Electronic Mail]. In particular:

: ''Personal and Group responses whose purpose is to notify the sender of a message of a temporary absence of the recipient (e.g., "vacation" and "out of the office" notices) SHOULD NOT be issued unless a valid address for the recipient is explicitly included in a recipient (e.g., To, Cc, Bcc, Resent-To, Resent-Cc, or Resent-Bcc) field of the subject message. Since a recipient may have multiple addresses forwarded to the same mailbox, recipient SHOULD be able to specify a set of addresses to the responder which it will recognize as valid for that recipient.''

If your autoreply software sends mail to the opensource-dev mailing list, you will be marked as a moderated member of the mailing list, meaning that all messages you send to the mailing list will need to be approved by a list moderator. You may request to be switched to an unmoderated member only after you can assure the list moderators that your autoreply software has been upgraded to comply with RFC 3834.

== Second Life <-> mailing list name mapping ==

Editing on this wiki is done using Second Life names, but posting on the mailing list is often done using another name (real name or non-Second Life alias). We don't ask anyone to reveal any information they don't want to, but we do encourage those who don't use their Second Life names on the mailing list to put their name in the [[SLDev Resident Names]] table.

== SLDev Traffic ==

Old copies of [[SLDev Traffic]], a weekly summary of this mailing list, are still available, but are no longer being written. Volunteers to help revive this useful service would be greatly appreciated.

== Related mailing lists ==

=== sldev-commits ===

This is for automated notices of activity on svn.secondlife.com. See https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits for more information

Talk:OSDev

2010-02-05T17:49:35Z

Soft Linden: moved Talk:OSDev to Talk:OpenSource-Dev

#REDIRECT [[Talk:OpenSource-Dev]]

Talk:OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-05T17:49:35Z

Soft Linden: moved Talk:OSDev to Talk:OpenSource-Dev

{{Open Source Talk Page}}

== Mailing list etiquette? ==

As of this moment, there are 387 subscribers to the sldev mailing list. As you would expect with a big public mailing list, most of those people don't post to the list. Of course, a handful of people post a ''lot''. That's ok; if you have something to say, you should say it. However, I also want to make sure that if someone has something to say that everyone needs to read, that it gets read. If there's too much to sort through, that might not happen.

We've discussed the idea that we should split off separate mailing lists. In particular, there are two different proposals:
* {{Jira|MISC-30|alt=sldev-contributors - for those that have signed contribution agreements (MISC-30)}}
* {{Jira|MISC-44|alt=sldev-policy - for legal and policy issues (MISC-44)}}

I've resisted going down that path, because I think that the groupings we want are going to be more fluid than is practical to keep up with (one day we'll want to split off policy, the next day we'll want to split off caching discussions, etc).

I'd like to keep things almost the way that they are, but introduce new guidelines:

* If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki or the bug tracker.
* If the topic is not specifically a Second Life development-related topic (e.g. this email, or a licensing discussion), it should be redirected to the wiki or the bug tracker immediately. One post per 48 hours should be sufficient to bring it to everyone's attention.
* If after 48 hours, the topic seems to have died out on the alternate forum, it's ok to reraise the issue on this mailing list, summarizing the offlist conversation thusfar, and calling for further comment in the alternate forum.

I think this policy strikes a good balance between making sure that people have a large forum to raise and discuss a broad spectrum of issues, while at the same time ensuring that the list doesn't become overwhelmed with discussion on a single topic that may not be of interest to everyone on the list.

Thoughts? -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 10:26, 23 March 2007 (PDT)

:As for the the topics that have done this (moved to the wiki or jira), they have been very successful. I second. [[User:Dzonatas Sol|Dzonatas Sol]] 21:31, 23 March 2007 (PDT)

:Email is obviously a bad idea, but jira/wiki is worse. Forums are the obvious answer to anyone - unless your goal is to put road blocks up before discussion (which certainly makes sense when you want to keep the community from organizing), in which case I suppose this all make sense.

:Jira is for bug reports. Wiki pages are great for documents detailing focused ideas, such as wikipedia entries. But having a dialogue between participants is not what they are meant for. There are no threads, no way to filter, rate participants and find new discussion. The only goal seems to be, as I said above, to keep the community from discussing coherently among themselves.

:What LL is looking for here, let's face it, are people to contribute to their open source project without giving up some kind of control to the community. I'm sure that makes sense to some people around here, but it makes zero sense to me.

:I (and I am sure many others) have avoided contributing to opensim simply because we've been waiting for LL to come around and realise that they need to work with us as a community and not as people to do their singular bidding. In some ways, opensl is becoming a threat to us all, not the opportunity LL wants to make it out to be. The only way to deal with that threat seems to be to work with the opensim crowd and wrench control away rather than work with Linden Lab.

:Is this really what you guys wanted? It certainly isn't what I want. It puts at risk everything I (and everyone else) have tried to build (and we've built a lot for SL. Far more than 95% of your so called open source developers) in secondlife.. but so is the whole direction you're going with OpenSL.

:It's a question of picking our masters - the freedom BSD folks or the "you must GPL everything and you can only talk in jira or wiki folks."

:Pick your poison, I guess. -- {{User|Iron Perth}}

::I don't know why you feel that way so strongly. It is obvious that as an outside developer that communication won't be as easy as being an internal employee. However, there are still features like the [http://forums.secondlife.com/forumdisplay.php?f=296 Technical Talk] area on the forums. Jira issues can easily have forums attached to them; however, the forums are limited to premium users.
::E-Mail is great. The best forum is the modern threaded e-mail unless you are stuck with hotmail or yahoo.
::I'm on a dozen of mail-lists for different projects. SLDev is actually pretty quiet compared to the others, yet the others have "user" lists for the various discussions. [[User:Dzonatas Sol|Dzonatas Sol]] 21:28, 23 March 2007 (PDT)

::----
::I would not object to adding forums as an acceptable conversation redirect target. The reason for directing this conversations to the wiki or jira is to ''help'' the community organize. There is no conspiracy here. I prefer using a wiki talk page so the discussion for a topic is attached directly to the topic itself. So, when newcomers read about a new topic (such as a feature design or these guidelines), they can quickly access the debate about what went into shaping the content of the main page.

::However, if you feel more strongly about using a forum instead, that's fine too. I personally don't think it'll be as effective as the wiki, but I don't mind seeing different experiments. The point is to avoid having huge conversations on the mailing list where no one tries to summarize or capture key ideas. If the goal is discussion for discussion's sake, the status quo would have been just fine. However, I'm assuming that the community wants to accomplish something, so I'm trying to help.

::As I also said before, I think it's fine to raise a topic after a couple of days if the conversation died down before reaching a resolution. I would hope that before reraising it to 380+ people, that someone take the time to actually summarize the conversation and document forward progress. I don't think it's exclusively Linden Lab employees that would appreciate the courtesy. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 23:49, 23 March 2007 (PDT)

:----
:I'm not sure if I like this change all that much so far. Moving conversations to the wiki makes things less convenient to discuss, IMO. Now instead of watching my inbox, I've got to use a RSS reader, and subscribe to the feed, but that includes not only the sldev discussion, but also completely unrelated changes such as LSL stuff, and typo corrections. That makes it more effort to keep up with, not less.

:Additionally, there's a loss of functionality in that editing a wiki is less convenient than email. Quoting is harder, formatting requires knowing the wiki syntax with all its conventions, the [[Help:Editing|Editing help]] link leads to a page that's nearly blank, the option of CCing people or not sending a message to the discussion list doesn't exist anymore (maybe userpages, but that's public), and adding something to a wiki requires previewing it first to make sure formatting came out right. There's also the potential problem of conflicting changes to the same page. Also, for some reason, my RSS reader keeps telling me about new entries from yesterday (what's up with that?) that don't appear as the more recent entry, but somewhere in the middle of my list. RSS also slows discussions down, as checking it too frequently places extra load on the server, while IMAP has new mail notification.

:IMO, all of these things are great when they're used for their intended purpose. Mailing lists are good for discussions, keep them for that. Wikis are good for collaborative documetation, but not all that great for discussing. Jira is definitely the right place for bug reporting, but I don't like the idea of discussing anything there. Jira is currently slow, requires logging in, has usability problems (login bug) and doesn't seem to have any sort of reply notification that I can see. -- {{unsigned|Dale Glass}}

::Just had such a 'potential conflict'. Having to merge when wanting to discuss, is, ... well, ... kinda odd. -- [[User:Boroondas Gupte|Boroondas Gupte]] 16:21, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

== Deep linking to conversations ==

Summaries are a fine thing. But, even if a discussion has died out for some while and so was replaced by its summary, you might sometimes wish to search for some single contribution and, once you found it, refer to it. Doing so by links to wiki-diffs of the discussion page's history will be a pain. Is there some better way to do it? I know the question is rather hypothetical right now and could be asked when the problem actually arises, but I think its relevant for the decision of what topic to redirect to what media. -- [[User:Boroondas Gupte|Boroondas Gupte]] 16:16, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

:One way to do it is how I've just done it. Split the conversation into its own thread (with title) and link to it. That means potentially redirecting the context of a quote (admittedly dangerous), but you get a link you can use (e.g. https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Talk:SLDev#Deep_linking_to_conversations ) -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 17:59, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

== Can things stay organized on a wiki? ==

Although I see the problems of a high traffic mailing list, I share Iron's concerns. Up to now, people discussing on the wiki were very persistent in keeping things formatted and signing their contributions, so you can still see the threads in some way. But can we keep this up as the community is growing? Perhaps someone's got a good idea how this can be made easier, by e.g. a wiki-template generating some thread/tree-like structures with some easy way to answer to a single node.

To ease tracking all discussions on the wiki derived from the mailing list, we could put them in a common category. Any ideas how to name such category? Can someone think of an equivalent for the forums, for jira and the other media where discussions might be redirected to? -- [[User:Boroondas Gupte|Boroondas Gupte]] 16:16, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

:I took the liberty of breaking this into it's own thread, too. I remember hearing about threaded discussions for MediaWiki last year at the Wikimania Hacking Days. I'm not sure if any production-quality software emerged. If someone finds a plugin we can use, I'll look into it (no promises, since I want to make sure I'm introducing something I can commit to support for a while).

:Even without dedicated software, I think the answer is "yes, we can stay organized", or perhaps "yes, we need to stay organized to be effective". It's one thing to make it easy for people writing; more importantly, we all need to make things easy for whoever is going to write the code. I suspect that a lot of people here have the best intentions, and all have valuable opinions of how it should be done, but it won't matter if this dies down a month from now ''unless'' this conversation is in a format that can be easily read and digested. I think what we've created here so far is far more readable than a long mailing list thread.

:Re: category for discussions, I've created a template that I added to this page (<nowiki>{{Open Source Talk Page}}</nowiki>). Please add this talk page to any page you think the group should keep track of this way. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 18:32, 25 March 2007 (PDT)
::I'm starting to doubt that. Honestly, the more I use this, the less I like it. Strife has just put Paula's name on something I wrote for some reason, for instance. I'm sure it's a mistake, but really all of this is extra inconvenience for pretty much no gain. Monitoring it is inconvenient. I'm seeing my RSS reader report the same change multiple times now. Now I'm also seeing that I've got to keep watching the page where I wrote something to make sure that what I said isn't misattributed or misrepresented, and that I didn't forget to sign it. Such things aren't a problem for say, documenting LSL, where there shouldn't be such a thing as content ownership in the first place, but it's not good for having a discussion. I can't even be sure that if I decide to forget about this for a few weeks I'll be able to find what I said in the place where I left it. For all I know it might be moved to another section, be archived somewhere, deleted, or moved to another page.

::None of these problems even existed on the mailing list. What I say there will stay in the same place where I wrote it, in the same context, in my exact wording, signed with my GPG key. And there's no reason why I a link to my post from the archive today shouldn't remain valid several years later. Besides, this moving around clearly means that we're already starting to compensate for the deficiencies of the Wiki when used for this purpose. And why are we using a tool that creates extra work instead of avoiding it? [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 19:08, 25 March 2007 (PDT)
:::I don't agree with this use of ":" to thread discussion on the talk page. I only use it if it is how the page flows. I suggest to use a template for talk pages that would reformat someones message to look similar to the SL forums "boxed" style. Then we could just wrap our messages up in the template and direct people to use that. [[User:Dzonatas Sol|Dzonatas Sol]] 19:25, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

== Easier for writers vs. easier for readers ==

Okay, I guess things aren't as peachy as I'd hoped. However, I'd like to keep this experiment going for a couple of weeks. In spite of the extra overhead, I think that the result will be something that people will be much more likely to read down the road. I'm assuming that everyone here is writing because they want others to read what they've written (rather than for some therapeutic purpose). In that regard, I believe this method is more effective than the old way. If after two weeks, if I'm the only one who likes this way of doing things, we'll figure out something new.
:::I'm scanning down this text.. and I cannot figure out who wrote the preceding paragraph. This is an example of why I hate wikis for discussion purposes. Later editors can fragment the text of previous editors, and unless people sign each and every paragraph as if it were a separate post, then the threading becomes lost and confused. [[User:Scalar Tardis|Scalar Tardis]] 06:38, 12 June 2008 (PDT)

:Well, it's easier to read, the problem is that it's making it much harder to write, and especially much harder to actively participate. It takes me more time and effort to follow a conversation here. I'm writing here because you asked me to. Obviously, it wouldn't have been much good if I had decided to be a jerk and ignore you completely, or started whining "I don't like it, take it back!" without providing any good reason for it. The longer I post here the more ammunition I can come up with ;-) [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 03:29, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

I have to make clear, though, I really don't think the old status quo was working. I think there was probably a couple dozen really keeping up, and a lot of people who would only read selected messages. I got the sense that some people were trying to dominate the conversation by being the fastest to respond, rather than the most deliberative.
:::I'm scanning down this text.. and I cannot figure out who wrote the preceding paragraph. This is an example of why I hate wikis for discussion purposes. Later editors can fragment the text of previous editors, and unless people sign each and every paragraph as if it were a separate post, then the threading becomes lost and confused. [[User:Scalar Tardis|Scalar Tardis]] 06:38, 12 June 2008 (PDT)

:I'm not sure this is going to help any with that problem. I can still easily post quickly here trying to dominate the conversation, as everybody is slowed down accordingly. I'm not sure that's a good thing either. Why slow things down so that it takes a day to settle an argument when it could be settled in an hour? The longer it takes to discuss, the longer it delays actual coding. [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 03:29, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

Using the wiki as a talk mechanism, I think others a month or two down the road will be much more willing to read the entire [[Talk:Texture cache]] page from start to finish, and absorb the arguments. Whatever replacement we have for this mechanism needs to have similar characteristics. I'm not suggesting we abolish the mailing list for discussion altogether, but rather, just use the wiki when dealing with a hot topic. Let's channel the energy and passion that people have toward the topic to make sure that we end up with a document of lasting value, instead of an endless thread tucked away in a mailing list archive that someone ''may'' find when they plug "texture cache" into their favorite search engine (and, which, even if they find it, they may have no desire to read because it's just too much).
:::I'm scanning down this text.. and I cannot figure out who wrote the preceding paragraph. This is an example of why I hate wikis for discussion purposes. Later editors can fragment the text of previous editors, and unless people sign each and every paragraph as if it were a separate post, then the threading becomes lost and confused. [[User:Scalar Tardis|Scalar Tardis]] 06:38, 12 June 2008 (PDT)

:I see your point, however I don't think this is the right way of dealing with it. If you want to make it easier for newcomers to read, why not try to use some better mailing list archiving software? For example I like Gmane ([http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.kernel/| example here]). Alternatively, use a forum. If going that way, I'd like to see something that supports threads and makes posting code easy.

:The main problem I see with moving active discussions to the wiki is that active discussions are actually more difficult on it. It's strange when we're having a lively discussion on the list, then suddenly we hit the limit, and have to move over to the wiki. It also takes extra effort and slows things down.
:'''<nowiki>[</nowiki>The rest of this answer was moved to its own [[Talk:SLDev#Inworld_discussion_of_hottest_of_hot_topics | subtopic]]<nowiki>]</nowiki>'''

Re: Dale's concern about PGP signatures. I agree that mailing lists are much more effective for PGP sigs. The wiki does at least have the advantage of a complete audit log, but PGP sigs are better. Nonetheless, I think you'll find that getting in the habit of signing comments isn't that tough -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 22:58, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

:It's not PGP signatures per se that concern me, rather, the difficulty of keeping the integrity of the conversation. If I stay something stupid on the list (which I already have a couple times ;-) it'll stay eternally archived, signed with my key to boot, in the way I said it. But that is fine. I '''did''' say that after all. Meanwhile, here something I said might over time end up somewhere else entirely, and in another context. There's no way to refer to the original and pristine post here, so it can't be 100% sure that what everybody seems to have written is in the context and exact wording it was intended. If we can't be sure that everybody is being represented correctly, having a serious discussion becomes a lot harder [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 03:29, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

===Inworld discussion of hottest of hot topics===
Let me try to propose something new, however: How about we actually use SL for discussions? ;-)
When it becomes clear that the discussion is becoming so heated that we'll end up with a huge long thread people won't want to read, or we're about to start flaming each other, how about we decide to hold an in-world meeting right that moment, discuss whatever needs getting discussed in person and without any delays due to email checking intervals, RSS, etc, reach an agreement (or not), and post a condensed version of the result on the wiki, then link to the full log of the conversation for those who want the gory details? In essence, like SLDev-traffic, but done by the participants (I '''really''' appreciate Soft Noel's contribution here, but I'm not sure how long she'll be able to keep up. This would seem to scale better)

Thus, instead of a 50 posts thread, or a 10 page wiki talk page, we'd have something like this:
After a long in-world discussion (link to full log) between Dale Glass, Strife Onizuka and Paula Innis, consensus was reached that texture caching should be done this way:
(10 lines detailing the mechanism, with links to the appropiate parts of the full talk)
Only thing that might be a problem is that this could seem to exclude people from the discussions, but I'd like to make it clear that my intention here is to take heated disputes between a few participants somewhere they'll get done faster, and when that is settled somebody can always argue with the conclusion. [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 03:29, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

:As inworld discussions lack threads even more than the wiki does and as they tend to move fast, there would be a problem for people who need some time to answer, like me, not being a native speaker (writer?) of English and so needing quite some time to formulate and producing lots of typos that I use to correct before committing my posts. Doing so in a real-time conversation will often lead to the talk having moved to other (sub)topics by the time I have my answer ready. As someone like me you'll have the following options:
:*Keep the answer for yourself, and though not actively participate in the conversation. If the answer is relevant, this might not be a good option.
:*Answer when you got your answer ready, even if the conversation has moved on, and so confusing the other participants and making the log harder to read.
:*Answer right away, not minding formulation and typography, again confusing others and making the log harder to read.
::In-world discussions lack threads, but it's not my intention to say that we should debate everything in-world. But IMO, 20 posts arguing about whether the cache should be stored in one big file or not aren't nearly as interesting as the end result of the discussion. To somebody new, "we agreed on X" is almost certainly more useful. The Wiki seems to me like a great place for documenting things like the results of a discussion, but not nearly as good for actually having one.

::I perfectly understand what you're saying about needing time, btw. English is my third language, and of course some time ago it took me considerable effort to type anything coherent in it. But I'm sure that's not a new thing for people in SL, where there are people from everywhere. Simply say that you need some more to come up with an answer, I'm sure we're not so inconsiderate that we can't wait a bit. I don't know about other people, but when I see people typing I usually wait to see what they say before continuing. [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 06:06, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

:Inworld discussions might be good if only some few want to discuss/flame who preferably already know each other well and so can adapt to every one's typing abilities. But as soon as there are more than -- let's say five -- people wanting to participate in a hot discussion who only know each other from their respective wiki and mailing list posts, some slower ones will either be left behind or be forced to (although they might not want to) dominate the discussion to get said what they wanted to say.

::IMO, every medium has good and bad uses. Wikis are good for documenting. Mailing lists are good for long, well thought discussions. If it's the sort of thing where I'd have to read source code, research, etc, or I'm going to announce an idea, a list is the right place. On the other hand, when you get a thread with 2 or 3 people discussing a single subject, and talking to each other, then that's pretty much a conversation, and probably would be best done in-world.

::So, resuming, my overall suggestion would be: Discuss development on the list. If it starts to turn into a long argument between a few people, have them to in-world and argue that there. When a consensus, decision, or interesting point of some sort is made, document it on the wiki. [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 06:06, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

:::/me agrees. -- [[User:Boroondas Gupte|Boroondas Gupte]] 07:55, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

:I already experienced that kind of problem in inworld discussions of less relevant (non-Dev) topics, where it normally doesn't matter much which of those (equally bad) options you keep to. And I also know that problem from a reader's POV, having read quite some of the logs of Lindens' office hours I didn't attend.-- [[User:Boroondas Gupte|Boroondas Gupte]] 04:51, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

:Dale Glass's suggestion of utilising in-world conversations to make some level of decisions is probably unworkable as SLDev expands, on the grounds of timezones (let alone diaries!) and lack of wide-spread input due to probably few people being aware of the discussion topic in advnace. Similarly, the use of ":" and multiples for threading is something that clearly works on the large discussions on Wikipedia, etc so can work well for medium-busy discussions, also having the great advantage that everyone will see new ideas pop up on ''recent changes''. Email lists often suffer from subject-lag, but are still useful though tracking back a topic may prove impossible, as are forums with threaded conversations, where at least there is a full record of the discussion. Overall, it is going to depend on the topic, its immediacy-for-decision, and how widespread that discussion needs to reach in terms of interested people, which will make the selection of which communication method to use, not some pre-determined 'all this way or not at all' approach. --[[User:Alison Wheels|Alison Wheels]] 08:57, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

* [[User:Dzonatas Sol|Dzonatas Sol]] writes on 12:16, 26 March 2007 (PDT):
The above conversation with all the mixed levels of tab discussion has just made it harder to read. When you start to insert your paragraph in between the paragraphs of the one before you, it gets much harder to follow. That is what makes wiki's hard to follow. If people follow reply etiquette to thread discussions nicely, it is not that hard. Here, don't interrupt someones reply. Quote and summarized if needed.

As for in-world discussion, main concerns is timezones, reply speed (foreign speakers or office workers), and those that are actually actively coding aren't in-world because they are testing the client.

== The problem: discussion for entertainment purposes ==

I guess this discussion is starting to make me figure out what the real problem is. Here's a couple of totally valid reasons for a long thread:
* Person A, who is committed to write code, asks for discussion about a topic. Much debate ensues, guided by Person A, who is ultimately tasked with writing the code. This may result in Person B and C arguing, but as long as Person A finds the discussion interesting, that's ok.
* Person A, who is committed to write code, states that they are going to do something. Person B doesn't like the approach. Until Person A cuts off the conversation, the thread is probably useful.

Here's what gets tedious:
* Person A, who is not committed to write code, throws out an idea for the list to consider. This provokes much debate among Person B and Person C, neither of whom is interested in committing to the code. So, there's a long debate where Person B and Person C go back and forth, but no one is committed to write code or even document an idea. Nobody is clear on who the audience is.

Most of the arguments about why taking things off list don't work center on the wiki being a poor medium for debate. I suppose it might be, but the question in my mind is "why are we having a debate?" If someone can actually tell me why a debate is important, then I can get behind actually leaving debate open (on the mailing list) on that topic. However, the debates that I've seen lately don't seem to have that characteristic.

So, if directing discussions offlist isn't the answer, what is? Moderate the mailing list? -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 22:19, 26 March 2007 (PDT)

Tough call. As I said on the list, "If it's not interesting in the absence of immediate feedback, it's probably not worth spending time on... that's a sign you're involved in the discussion rather than the topic." On the other hand, a certain amount of noise on the list probably shouldn't be seen as automatically counterproductive (for example, one thing that I've found immensely useful in following lists and ignoring noise is to subscribe to the list as a digest). On the gripping hand it's the productive individual who gets to make that call as to what's counterproductive.

Partial answer, for people thinking of reading the list: subscribe to a digest, and simply skip digests completely that don't contain any subjects that interest you.

Partial answer for the list manager: can you chunk digests by subject, to make the above easier?

One project I started several years ago was a mailing list archive that dumped each message into a wiki. At the time there wasn't a lot of easily hackable wiki software that could be fed into, so it stalled out. The idea was that you could go in and turn a message into a wiki page, with wiki links between the message and thread and some clever way to add to the page with tags in the email. -- [[User:Argent Stonecutter|Argent Stonecutter]] 10:19, 27 March 2007 (PDT)

:I agree it's a tough call. Part of the reason why I'm making this drive to increase list traffic quality is that I'd like to start heavily advocating more Linden Lab use. One precondition of that is that I have to be able to say, with a straight face, "yes, involvement in this mailing list is a good use of your time". Sure, the [[SLDev Traffic]] summaries are fantastic, but reading that is not the same as being involved with the mailing list. The guidelines I've chosen aren't too different than our own internal communication guidelines, so I believe they will foster the type of involvement I'm hoping for.

: We can put the burden of wheat/chaff sorting on the reader, but given the size of the list, I think it's fair to ask a little more of writers. In exchange for getting a bigger audience, you have to be more considerate of that audience. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 10:42, 27 March 2007 (PDT)

:I don't understand how the wiki is supposed to fix that problem. There's absolutely no reason why the tedious exchange you describe above can't happen on the wiki. The only reason I think we're not seeing this sort of thing on the wiki yet is because you step in after it happens on the list, so it stays there. Eventually somebody will start one of those on the wiki. [[User:Dale Glass|Dale Glass]] 12:43, 27 March 2007 (PDT)

::It doesn't solve the problem entirely. It makes it so that the discussion is limited to only those that are interested in it. For example, I worried about sending the message above to the mailing list, because the meta discussion was already starting to take a toll on subscribers (net subscribers is back in negative territory after a positive weekend). I'm sure that more people would have read my message had I put it to the list, but it might have pushed more people to say "I really don't need this in my inbox". For you as an active developer, that may not matter to you, but as someone whose job responsibility is to expand this community, I consider it pretty serious when people start dropping out.

::For wiki conversations, if they are really tedious or off-topic, one person can move or delete the conversation (though there's always a history of who did what). On the mailing list, it's up to the 380 individuals to deal with it. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 14:31, 27 March 2007 (PDT)

== FYI, I'm personally responding to people who post about these guideines on-list ==

I had asked that conversation about the new guidelines occur here, which, unfortunately has caused a discussion to break out on list. Please don't use the list, and please don't reply on-list to those people. I have been (and will continue to) personally reply to those people, rather than replying on list. The people who are interested and/or need to participate in this conversation are right here. I suspect that most people did not sign up for sldev to keep abreast of tedious mailing list policy questions, so please be courteous to those people. Thanks -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 11:22, 27 March 2007 (PDT)

== Conversations that span years ==

One thing that people who don't have a lot of wiki experience may not understand about conversations on wikis is that, unlike mailing list conversations, they can span weeks, months or even years, as opposed to mailing list conversations that rarely live past a week or so of inactivity. For design discussions, this is a really important attribute. It helps us develop a better collective memory of what we've discussed and what we haven't, and makes it much quicker for people to come up to speed.

Because this benefit isn't immediately apparent, I really need to call this out. Please be patient. A few months from now, when everyone here is sick of the current topic, and when someone asks "has anyone considered using Berkeley DB for texture caches?", you'll be able to say "[[Talk:Texture cache|yes we did]]", and redirect the conversation to the wiki -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 11:28, 27 March 2007 (PDT)

== What's the point of SLDev? ==

I've been following mailing lists and participating in open source projects for years. There are two hurdles to overcome with an open source project: building a community and maintaining a community. A mailing list keeps the conversation going. People get to recognize familiar names after a while. They intuit personas to tie to the names. They get to "know" each other. Anything you can do to foster community is good for the project. Anything you do to disperse the community is counterproductive.

I know you guys at LL are busy, but I imagine that once in a while you exchange conversations that are not directly related to the work you are currently assigned. Suppose you were told to take those conversations somewhere else or we'll have to have a moderator watch over you to make sure you keep on task.

You have the JIRA for cataloging bugs and requested features. You have the wiki for documentation. What do you see as the role for SLDev? [[User:Mm Alder|Mm Alder]] 08:07, 28 March 2007 (PDT)

P.S. If you reply and ask me a question, I'll get back to you next time I drop by this page. Don't know when that will be.

:With a very slight amount of flippancy, ''"I'll get back to you next time I drop by this page. Don't know when that will be."'' is exactly why a wiki-based conversation recording method works better than an email one: it is archived, linkable and searchable far easier than a threaded email one can be, and - as noted above - it has a far greater level of permanency and long-time-after refer-ability to the discussions. Even better, using [[Special:Recent Changes|Recent Changes]] and [[Special:Watchlist|Your Watchlist]] mean that you can 'catch up' with all the changes made since you last checked in far easier than searching for which emails or forum threads have been updated (plus you don't get so much copy/re-copy of content with each post as it is directly visible above the newer responses.) But then I'm biased in favour of wikis given my position ;-P --[[User:Alison Wheels|Alison Wheels]] 15:33, 28 March 2007 (PDT)

OK, so I finally checked back, and the only answer I got is that the wiki can do it all. That is, there is no role for SLDev. I wonder if I'd get the same response if I asked on SLDev, but I won't because that would be metadiscussion there. :-) [[User:Mm Alder|Mm Alder]] 16:51, 20 April 2007 (PDT)

:It's for talking about development. Sorry if I wasn't clear before, but its also ok to ''raise'' a meta issue on the mailing list, but not very cool to let that conversation dominate the mailing list.

:The guidelines are just guidelines. The idea of 5 posts for dev conversations before going to the wiki, and 1 post on a meta topic before going to wiki seemed reasonable to me, because that seems like roughly the right ratio. If a thread is going on for too long, it should go somewhere else.

:While this isn't conventional among open source projects, I have yet to see entirely consistent norms, and I've seen lots of unsolved problems on other fora. I've seen mailing lists where there's no guidelines like this, but instead, the core members just get uncivil and snarky enough that people discussing meta-issues feel unwelcome. I'm trying to come up with a system that both maintains civility but keeps the signal-to-noise ratio high enough that most people interested in the topic feel i's a good use of their time to keep up. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 23:51, 20 April 2007 (PDT)

::Rob: "It's for talking about development."
::Question: Up to now, non-developers and not-yet-developers playing around with the source and having problems compiling it (or getting it to run, once compiled) where redirected to the SLDev mailing list when they asked according questions on the fora, HelpRequest or other places. Where is now the appropriate place to ask such questions? Will we need a new, separate list or forum for those? (Suggestion: ''SL Forums > Resident Forums > Technical Talk > '''Source Client Users''''')
::I myself am now having such a question, and - as it isn't actually development related - will hold it back until I get some feedback on this. --[[User:Boroondas Gupte|Boroondas Gupte]] 04:02, 21 April 2007 (PDT)

:::Compilation problems are in scope (trying to develop is "development" as far as I'm concerned). As long as you've put in a reasonable effort to find your answer in the appropriate places in the documentation, that's fine.

:::If there get to be too many help requests, we'll set up the forum like you suggest, but I'm worried that it won't get the attention necessary if it goes to a new forum. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 10:30, 21 April 2007 (PDT)

== Transcript from last [[Open Source Meeting/2007-08-23]] ==

We had a long conversation about this topic at the last office hour:
[[Open Source Meeting/2007-08-23]]

== Message labeling ==

Suggestion [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/2007-August/thread.html#4293 was made] on the sldev mailing list to start labeling messages. This led to the creation of this issue in JIRA:
* {{Jira|MISC-642}} - Come up with list of subject line keywords for sldev mailng list

-- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 11:08, 31 August 2007 (PDT)

----
: "[SVC] questions about the service" Help desk service? Servicing hardware interrupts? Religious service? Could you be more specific? Have we had any of these discussions before? If so, could you indicate a thread? And "SVC" is still cryptic even if I knew what "service" meant. [[User:Mm Alder|Mm Alder]] 09:39, 10 September 2007 (PDT)
----
:: Sorry for the confusion. Check out the new description and see if it makes more sense. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 09:58, 10 September 2007 (PDT)
----
::: Ah! Good idea using the JIRA classifications! [[User:Mm Alder|Mm Alder]] 11:59, 10 September 2007 (PDT)
----

== TrackBack linking ==

Suggestion: When a discussion moves from one place to another (from one forum to another, from the wiki to jira, from the mailing list to a forum, etc) please do not only link forward (from the old to the new place) but '''also backward''' (from the new to the old place), so that the beginning of a discussion can be found easily any time later. -- [[User:Boroondas Gupte|Boroondas Gupte]] 05:23, 2 September 2007 (PDT)

== Does taking things off list during discussions make sense? ==

So it says: "If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum. ". Taking only the amount of messages generated is IMHO no good criteria to move it off-list. This just basically stops discussion (and as we see also does not really work). What should more likely happen is that results of discussions will be directed to the wiki, not the discussion itself. It probably is more a question of a healthy vs. unhealthy debate. The originator of that thread should then have the responsibility to record the outcome on the wiki or JIRA (can one actually put a changelist of a jira ticket into the wiki, would help to just need to look at one place).

In general using wikis or bugtrackers for discussion purposes is a bad idea, that's what mailing lists are for (and now I forgot again how to sign my posts here, another advantage of mailing lists esp. taking the speed into account I work with this instead of with the wiki or bugtracker).

[[User:Tao Takashi|TaoTakashi]] 04:48, 14 June 2008 (PDT)

:Tao, I think you're right about healthy vs. unhealthy debate. Honestly, though, when that guideline is broken, 95% of the time, it's not a healthy debate. Furthermore, 99.99% of the time, the result of healthy debates fails to get documented on the wiki, JIRA, or any place other than the mailing list. A lot of energy gets spent chewing over an issue, only to have it pretty much disappear deep into a date indexed mail archive. The nice thing about wiki discussions is that they're good for both "cooling off" a debate, and getting something more durable written up. Unlike a mailing list, healthy wiki debates can span months if not years, just like this exchange. :)

:I do think a better guideline can be written though. Often times, a single person will reply on the same thread more than five times, not to be bothered to even change the subject line if the conversation drifts. I'm hoping we can find some rule of thumb that gets people to direct more of their energy to places that make more of a difference than solely posting to sldev@. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 22:28, 10 September 2008 (PDT)

== Per person/thread limit on conversation? ==

This mailing list guideline is pretty roundly ignored these days: "If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum."

I have to admit that I ignored it myself on a recent thread. It strikes many as too severe. However, it still seems like there's a good rule of thumb that can help keep conversations healthy. I'm going to propose this: "It's good form to redirect heated conversations to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum, rather than continuing them indefinitely on the mailing list." Additionally, I do think that asking everyone to curb their input on a particular thread to five messages is a reasonable personal per-thread limit. Thoughts? -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 02:17, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

OSDev

2010-02-05T17:49:34Z

Soft Linden: moved OSDev to OpenSource-Dev

#REDIRECT [[OpenSource-Dev]]

OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-05T17:49:34Z

Soft Linden: moved OSDev to OpenSource-Dev

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev OSDev@lists.secondlife.com] - mailing list for discussing open source development issues related to Second Life. This is a high-traffic mailing list (as many as 30-40 messages/day on a busy day).

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== Posting Policies and Guidelines ==

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=== Policies ===

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=== Guidelines ===

In addition to the policies above, here's some guidelines. These aren't hard-and-fast rules, but rather, good etiquette. There are a lot of people on this list (800+ as of this writing), so please follow these guidelines when you post:

* Please remember the old mantra "praise in public, criticize in private". On-list reprimands are rarely of interest to the general mailing list.
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* Keep threads on topic. If you want to talk about something unrelated to the subject of a thread, change the subject line. If the new topic is something that doesn't belong on os-dev@, please strongly consider posting it elsewhere.
* If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum.
* If the topic is not specifically a Second Life development-related topic (e.g. mailing list policy or a licensing discussion), it should be redirected to the wiki, the bug tracker, or the appropriate forum immediately. One post per 48 hours should be sufficient to bring it to everyone's attention.
* If after 48 hours, the topic seems to have died out on the alternate forum, it's ok to reraise the issue on this mailing list, summarizing the offlist conversation thus far, and calling for further comment in the alternate forum.
* Please use the keywords below (in the "Subject Line Keywords" section) when posting, especially the "strongly recommended" keywords.
* Most LSL scripting issues are better addressed on the [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters secondlifescripters mailing list].

These guidelines try to balance between making sure that people have a large forum to raise and discuss a broad spectrum of issues, while at the same time ensuring that the list doesn't become overwhelmed with discussion on a single topic that may not be of interest to everyone on the list.

== Subject Line Keywords ==

When posting to the list, please take your best guess at the right subject line keyword to put on your email. Some of the keywords below are strongly recommended, while some are purely optional. However, all of them will help people organize

Strongly recommended (since they are arguably a little off-topic):
* [POLICY] issues about policy and etiquette on wiki, jira, and the mailing list, some licensing/legal logistics issues NOTE: licensing issues should be directed to licensing@lindenlab.com
* [META] repositories, creating inworld meeting places, getting and keeping the community organized, product cycle processes
* [WEB] questions/complaints about the website, jira, wiki, etc

Optional:
* [ANN] announcements
* [VWR] questions about viewer releases. Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR the "VWR" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [SVC] questions about the Second Life service (simulators, login servers, web apis, general grid questions). Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC the "SVC" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [IDEA] for new features ideas and proposals
* [VOICE] about voice activation features
* [HELP] for topic about building the viewer or other support request
* [I18N] for internationalization and localization problems
* [EVENTLET] eventlet questions
* [MULIB] mulib questions
* [PATCH] for patchy patches! For feedback on a patch, or just to let people know it exists so they can try it.
* [AWG] [[Architecture Working Group]]

If you have suggested changes for these keywords, please put your suggestion on [[Talk:OSDev|the talk page]].

== Autoreply Software ==

If you have autoreply software to notify people that you are out of the office, please make sure that the software complies with the "Personal Responder" guidelines defined in [http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3834.txt RFC 3834 - Recommendations for Automatic Responses to Electronic Mail]. In particular:

: ''Personal and Group responses whose purpose is to notify the sender of a message of a temporary absence of the recipient (e.g., "vacation" and "out of the office" notices) SHOULD NOT be issued unless a valid address for the recipient is explicitly included in a recipient (e.g., To, Cc, Bcc, Resent-To, Resent-Cc, or Resent-Bcc) field of the subject message. Since a recipient may have multiple addresses forwarded to the same mailbox, recipient SHOULD be able to specify a set of addresses to the responder which it will recognize as valid for that recipient.''

If your autoreply software sends mail to the os-dev mailing list, you will be marked as a moderated member of the mailing list, meaning that all messages you send to the mailing list will need to be approved by a list moderator. You may request to be switched to an unmoderated member only after you can assure the list moderators that your autoreply software has been upgraded to comply with RFC 3834.

== Second Life <-> mailing list name mapping ==

Editing on this wiki is done using Second Life names, but posting on the mailing list is often done using another name (real name or non-Second Life alias). We don't ask anyone to reveal any information they don't want to, but we do encourage those who don't use their Second Life names on the mailing list to put their name in the [[SLDev Resident Names]] table.

== SLDev Traffic ==

Old copies of [[SLDev Traffic]], a weekly summary of this mailing list, are still available, but are no longer being written. Volunteers to help revive this useful service would be greatly appreciated.

== Related mailing lists ==

=== sldev-commits ===

This is for automated notices of activity on svn.secondlife.com. See https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits for more information

SLDev

2010-02-02T19:56:21Z

Soft Linden:

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

Disambiguation:

*[[OSDev | OSDev - Open Source Developers' Mailing List (formerly SLDev)]]
*[[SLDev Forum Transcripts | SLDev Forum Transcripts for SLDev Solution Providers' program]]

OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-02T15:46:01Z

Soft Linden: remove SLDev usage stats - not automated & not updated in a year

OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-02T15:44:39Z

Soft Linden:

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev OSDev@lists.secondlife.com] - mailing list for discussing open source development issues related to Second Life. This is a high-traffic mailing list (as many as 30-40 messages/day on a busy day).

* '''[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/os-dev Subscribe to os-dev@lists.secondlife.com]''' (or [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/options/os-dev unsubscribe])
* [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/os-dev/ Browse the archive] ([https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/ prior to SLDev rename])
* [http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=001010425210852223575%3Aogwhgz5_tue Search the archive prior to SLDev rename]
* View [[SLDev Usage Stats]]

'''IMPORTANT''': Please be sure to read the Posting Policies and Guidelines below before posting to this mailing list.

== Posting Policies and Guidelines ==

The os-dev mailing list is for development issue related to Second Life open source code. The following policies are meant to ensure we can keep conversation civil and on-topic. "Policies" are rules that need to be followed to ensure continued posting privileges. "Guidelines" have more wiggle room, but should be considered before posting.

=== Policies ===

* This mailing list is for discussing problems and ideas that software developers can directly address and for collaboration on solutions and improvements, not for turning Linden Lab development staff into proxies to reach other parts of Linden Lab (e.g. legal, executive, human resources, etc).
* Please adhere to the [https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2009/02/25/guidelines-for-the-sl-blogs guidelines for blog.secondlife.com]. Since we can't delete comments that are in violation, we're going to instead preemptively set the "moderated" bit for repeat violators.
* Constructive criticism is welcome, but general complaints which only serve to discourage use of Second Life or discourage cooperation with Linden Lab should be taken elsewhere.
* If you have auto-reply email software (such as out-of-office notification), please make sure that it's configured correctly. Failure to do so will cause you to receive moderated access until you assure us it's fixed. See the Autoreply Software section below for more details.
* If someone else is violating mailing list policy, do not reply to them on the list. Reply to them offlist if you feel you need to engage them. If you feel disciplinary action is required, send mail to the list administrator (<os-dev-owner@lists.secondlife.com>). Engaging with them on-list may result in the moderation bit being set on your account.

=== Guidelines ===

In addition to the policies above, here's some guidelines. These aren't hard-and-fast rules, but rather, good etiquette. There are a lot of people on this list (800+ as of this writing), so please follow these guidelines when you post:

* Please remember the old mantra "praise in public, criticize in private". On-list reprimands are rarely of interest to the general mailing list.
* If you are asking a question to the list, either [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/os-dev/ browse the archives] or do a [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=POT&q=site%3Alists.secondlife.com%2Fpipermail%2Fos-dev%2F&btnG=Search keyword search of the archives] first to check if your question has already been responded.
* Keep threads on topic. If you want to talk about something unrelated to the subject of a thread, change the subject line. If the new topic is something that doesn't belong on os-dev@, please strongly consider posting it elsewhere.
* If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum.
* If the topic is not specifically a Second Life development-related topic (e.g. mailing list policy or a licensing discussion), it should be redirected to the wiki, the bug tracker, or the appropriate forum immediately. One post per 48 hours should be sufficient to bring it to everyone's attention.
* If after 48 hours, the topic seems to have died out on the alternate forum, it's ok to reraise the issue on this mailing list, summarizing the offlist conversation thus far, and calling for further comment in the alternate forum.
* Please use the keywords below (in the "Subject Line Keywords" section) when posting, especially the "strongly recommended" keywords.
* Most LSL scripting issues are better addressed on the [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters secondlifescripters mailing list].

These guidelines try to balance between making sure that people have a large forum to raise and discuss a broad spectrum of issues, while at the same time ensuring that the list doesn't become overwhelmed with discussion on a single topic that may not be of interest to everyone on the list.

== Subject Line Keywords ==

When posting to the list, please take your best guess at the right subject line keyword to put on your email. Some of the keywords below are strongly recommended, while some are purely optional. However, all of them will help people organize

Strongly recommended (since they are arguably a little off-topic):
* [POLICY] issues about policy and etiquette on wiki, jira, and the mailing list, some licensing/legal logistics issues NOTE: licensing issues should be directed to licensing@lindenlab.com
* [META] repositories, creating inworld meeting places, getting and keeping the community organized, product cycle processes
* [WEB] questions/complaints about the website, jira, wiki, etc

Optional:
* [ANN] announcements
* [VWR] questions about viewer releases. Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR the "VWR" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [SVC] questions about the Second Life service (simulators, login servers, web apis, general grid questions). Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC the "SVC" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [IDEA] for new features ideas and proposals
* [VOICE] about voice activation features
* [HELP] for topic about building the viewer or other support request
* [I18N] for internationalization and localization problems
* [EVENTLET] eventlet questions
* [MULIB] mulib questions
* [PATCH] for patchy patches! For feedback on a patch, or just to let people know it exists so they can try it.
* [AWG] [[Architecture Working Group]]

If you have suggested changes for these keywords, please put your suggestion on [[Talk:OSDev|the talk page]].

== Autoreply Software ==

If you have autoreply software to notify people that you are out of the office, please make sure that the software complies with the "Personal Responder" guidelines defined in [http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3834.txt RFC 3834 - Recommendations for Automatic Responses to Electronic Mail]. In particular:

: ''Personal and Group responses whose purpose is to notify the sender of a message of a temporary absence of the recipient (e.g., "vacation" and "out of the office" notices) SHOULD NOT be issued unless a valid address for the recipient is explicitly included in a recipient (e.g., To, Cc, Bcc, Resent-To, Resent-Cc, or Resent-Bcc) field of the subject message. Since a recipient may have multiple addresses forwarded to the same mailbox, recipient SHOULD be able to specify a set of addresses to the responder which it will recognize as valid for that recipient.''

If your autoreply software sends mail to the os-dev mailing list, you will be marked as a moderated member of the mailing list, meaning that all messages you send to the mailing list will need to be approved by a list moderator. You may request to be switched to an unmoderated member only after you can assure the list moderators that your autoreply software has been upgraded to comply with RFC 3834.

== Second Life <-> mailing list name mapping ==

Editing on this wiki is done using Second Life names, but posting on the mailing list is often done using another name (real name or non-Second Life alias). We don't ask anyone to reveal any information they don't want to, but we do encourage those who don't use their Second Life names on the mailing list to put their name in the [[SLDev Resident Names]] table.

== SLDev Traffic ==

Old copies of [[SLDev Traffic]], a weekly summary of this mailing list, are still available, but are no longer being written. Volunteers to help revive this useful service would be greatly appreciated.

== Related mailing lists ==

=== sldev-commits ===

This is for automated notices of activity on svn.secondlife.com. See https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits for more information

OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-02T15:43:53Z

Soft Linden:

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev OSDev@lists.secondlife.com] - mailing list for discussing open source development issues related to Second Life. This is a high-traffic mailing list (as many as 30-40 messages/day on a busy day).

* '''[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/os-dev Subscribe to os-dev@lists.secondlife.com]''' (or [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/options/os-dev unsubscribe])
* [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/os-dev/ Browse the archive]
* [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/ Browse the archives prior to SLDev rename]
* [http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=001010425210852223575%3Aogwhgz5_tue Search the archive prior to SLDev rename]
* View [[SLDev Usage Stats]]

'''IMPORTANT''': Please be sure to read the Posting Policies and Guidelines below before posting to this mailing list.

== Posting Policies and Guidelines ==

The os-dev mailing list is for development issue related to Second Life open source code. The following policies are meant to ensure we can keep conversation civil and on-topic. "Policies" are rules that need to be followed to ensure continued posting privileges. "Guidelines" have more wiggle room, but should be considered before posting.

=== Policies ===

* This mailing list is for discussing problems and ideas that software developers can directly address and for collaboration on solutions and improvements, not for turning Linden Lab development staff into proxies to reach other parts of Linden Lab (e.g. legal, executive, human resources, etc).
* Please adhere to the [https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2009/02/25/guidelines-for-the-sl-blogs guidelines for blog.secondlife.com]. Since we can't delete comments that are in violation, we're going to instead preemptively set the "moderated" bit for repeat violators.
* Constructive criticism is welcome, but general complaints which only serve to discourage use of Second Life or discourage cooperation with Linden Lab should be taken elsewhere.
* If you have auto-reply email software (such as out-of-office notification), please make sure that it's configured correctly. Failure to do so will cause you to receive moderated access until you assure us it's fixed. See the Autoreply Software section below for more details.
* If someone else is violating mailing list policy, do not reply to them on the list. Reply to them offlist if you feel you need to engage them. If you feel disciplinary action is required, send mail to the list administrator (<os-dev-owner@lists.secondlife.com>). Engaging with them on-list may result in the moderation bit being set on your account.

=== Guidelines ===

In addition to the policies above, here's some guidelines. These aren't hard-and-fast rules, but rather, good etiquette. There are a lot of people on this list (800+ as of this writing), so please follow these guidelines when you post:

* Please remember the old mantra "praise in public, criticize in private". On-list reprimands are rarely of interest to the general mailing list.
* If you are asking a question to the list, either [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/os-dev/ browse the archives] or do a [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=POT&q=site%3Alists.secondlife.com%2Fpipermail%2Fos-dev%2F&btnG=Search keyword search of the archives] first to check if your question has already been responded.
* Keep threads on topic. If you want to talk about something unrelated to the subject of a thread, change the subject line. If the new topic is something that doesn't belong on os-dev@, please strongly consider posting it elsewhere.
* If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum.
* If the topic is not specifically a Second Life development-related topic (e.g. mailing list policy or a licensing discussion), it should be redirected to the wiki, the bug tracker, or the appropriate forum immediately. One post per 48 hours should be sufficient to bring it to everyone's attention.
* If after 48 hours, the topic seems to have died out on the alternate forum, it's ok to reraise the issue on this mailing list, summarizing the offlist conversation thus far, and calling for further comment in the alternate forum.
* Please use the keywords below (in the "Subject Line Keywords" section) when posting, especially the "strongly recommended" keywords.
* Most LSL scripting issues are better addressed on the [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters secondlifescripters mailing list].

These guidelines try to balance between making sure that people have a large forum to raise and discuss a broad spectrum of issues, while at the same time ensuring that the list doesn't become overwhelmed with discussion on a single topic that may not be of interest to everyone on the list.

== Subject Line Keywords ==

When posting to the list, please take your best guess at the right subject line keyword to put on your email. Some of the keywords below are strongly recommended, while some are purely optional. However, all of them will help people organize

Strongly recommended (since they are arguably a little off-topic):
* [POLICY] issues about policy and etiquette on wiki, jira, and the mailing list, some licensing/legal logistics issues NOTE: licensing issues should be directed to licensing@lindenlab.com
* [META] repositories, creating inworld meeting places, getting and keeping the community organized, product cycle processes
* [WEB] questions/complaints about the website, jira, wiki, etc

Optional:
* [ANN] announcements
* [VWR] questions about viewer releases. Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR the "VWR" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [SVC] questions about the Second Life service (simulators, login servers, web apis, general grid questions). Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC the "SVC" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [IDEA] for new features ideas and proposals
* [VOICE] about voice activation features
* [HELP] for topic about building the viewer or other support request
* [I18N] for internationalization and localization problems
* [EVENTLET] eventlet questions
* [MULIB] mulib questions
* [PATCH] for patchy patches! For feedback on a patch, or just to let people know it exists so they can try it.
* [AWG] [[Architecture Working Group]]

If you have suggested changes for these keywords, please put your suggestion on [[Talk:OSDev|the talk page]].

== Autoreply Software ==

If you have autoreply software to notify people that you are out of the office, please make sure that the software complies with the "Personal Responder" guidelines defined in [http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3834.txt RFC 3834 - Recommendations for Automatic Responses to Electronic Mail]. In particular:

: ''Personal and Group responses whose purpose is to notify the sender of a message of a temporary absence of the recipient (e.g., "vacation" and "out of the office" notices) SHOULD NOT be issued unless a valid address for the recipient is explicitly included in a recipient (e.g., To, Cc, Bcc, Resent-To, Resent-Cc, or Resent-Bcc) field of the subject message. Since a recipient may have multiple addresses forwarded to the same mailbox, recipient SHOULD be able to specify a set of addresses to the responder which it will recognize as valid for that recipient.''

If your autoreply software sends mail to the os-dev mailing list, you will be marked as a moderated member of the mailing list, meaning that all messages you send to the mailing list will need to be approved by a list moderator. You may request to be switched to an unmoderated member only after you can assure the list moderators that your autoreply software has been upgraded to comply with RFC 3834.

== Second Life <-> mailing list name mapping ==

Editing on this wiki is done using Second Life names, but posting on the mailing list is often done using another name (real name or non-Second Life alias). We don't ask anyone to reveal any information they don't want to, but we do encourage those who don't use their Second Life names on the mailing list to put their name in the [[SLDev Resident Names]] table.

== SLDev Traffic ==

Old copies of [[SLDev Traffic]], a weekly summary of this mailing list, are still available, but are no longer being written. Volunteers to help revive this useful service would be greatly appreciated.

== Related mailing lists ==

=== sldev-commits ===

This is for automated notices of activity on svn.secondlife.com. See https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits for more information

OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-02T15:43:05Z

Soft Linden:

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev OSDev@lists.secondlife.com] - mailing list for discussing software development issues related to Second Life. This is a high-traffic mailing list (as many as 30-40 messages/day on a busy day).

* '''[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/os-dev Subscribe to os-dev@lists.secondlife.com]''' (or [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/options/os-dev unsubscribe])
* [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/os-dev/ Browse the archive]
* [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/ Browse the archives prior to SLDev rename]
* [http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=001010425210852223575%3Aogwhgz5_tue Search the archive prior to SLDev rename]
* View [[SLDev Usage Stats]]

'''IMPORTANT''': Please be sure to read the Posting Policies and Guidelines below before posting to this mailing list.

== Posting Policies and Guidelines ==

The os-dev mailing list is for software development issue related to Second Life open source code. The following policies are meant to ensure we can keep conversation civil and on-topic. "Policies" are rules that need to be followed to ensure continued posting privileges. "Guidelines" have more wiggle room, but should be considered before posting.

=== Policies ===

* This mailing list is for discussing problems and ideas that software developers can directly address and for collaboration on solutions and improvements, not for turning Linden Lab development staff into proxies to reach other parts of Linden Lab (e.g. legal, executive, human resources, etc).
* Please adhere to the [https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2009/02/25/guidelines-for-the-sl-blogs guidelines for blog.secondlife.com]. Since we can't delete comments that are in violation, we're going to instead preemptively set the "moderated" bit for repeat violators.
* Constructive criticism is welcome, but general complaints which only serve to discourage use of Second Life or discourage cooperation with Linden Lab should be taken elsewhere.
* If you have auto-reply email software (such as out-of-office notification), please make sure that it's configured correctly. Failure to do so will cause you to receive moderated access until you assure us it's fixed. See the Autoreply Software section below for more details.
* If someone else is violating mailing list policy, do not reply to them on the list. Reply to them offlist if you feel you need to engage them. If you feel disciplinary action is required, send mail to the list administrator (<os-dev-owner@lists.secondlife.com>). Engaging with them on-list may result in the moderation bit being set on your account.

=== Guidelines ===

In addition to the policies above, here's some guidelines. These aren't hard-and-fast rules, but rather, good etiquette. There are a lot of people on this list (800+ as of this writing), so please follow these guidelines when you post:

* Please remember the old mantra "praise in public, criticize in private". On-list reprimands are rarely of interest to the general mailing list.
* If you are asking a question to the list, either [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/os-dev/ browse the archives] or do a [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=POT&q=site%3Alists.secondlife.com%2Fpipermail%2Fos-dev%2F&btnG=Search keyword search of the archives] first to check if your question has already been responded.
* Keep threads on topic. If you want to talk about something unrelated to the subject of a thread, change the subject line. If the new topic is something that doesn't belong on os-dev@, please strongly consider posting it elsewhere.
* If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum.
* If the topic is not specifically a Second Life development-related topic (e.g. mailing list policy or a licensing discussion), it should be redirected to the wiki, the bug tracker, or the appropriate forum immediately. One post per 48 hours should be sufficient to bring it to everyone's attention.
* If after 48 hours, the topic seems to have died out on the alternate forum, it's ok to reraise the issue on this mailing list, summarizing the offlist conversation thus far, and calling for further comment in the alternate forum.
* Please use the keywords below (in the "Subject Line Keywords" section) when posting, especially the "strongly recommended" keywords.
* Most LSL scripting issues are better addressed on the [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters secondlifescripters mailing list].

These guidelines try to balance between making sure that people have a large forum to raise and discuss a broad spectrum of issues, while at the same time ensuring that the list doesn't become overwhelmed with discussion on a single topic that may not be of interest to everyone on the list.

== Subject Line Keywords ==

When posting to the list, please take your best guess at the right subject line keyword to put on your email. Some of the keywords below are strongly recommended, while some are purely optional. However, all of them will help people organize

Strongly recommended (since they are arguably a little off-topic):
* [POLICY] issues about policy and etiquette on wiki, jira, and the mailing list, some licensing/legal logistics issues NOTE: licensing issues should be directed to licensing@lindenlab.com
* [META] repositories, creating inworld meeting places, getting and keeping the community organized, product cycle processes
* [WEB] questions/complaints about the website, jira, wiki, etc

Optional:
* [ANN] announcements
* [VWR] questions about viewer releases. Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR the "VWR" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [SVC] questions about the Second Life service (simulators, login servers, web apis, general grid questions). Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC the "SVC" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [IDEA] for new features ideas and proposals
* [VOICE] about voice activation features
* [HELP] for topic about building the viewer or other support request
* [I18N] for internationalization and localization problems
* [EVENTLET] eventlet questions
* [MULIB] mulib questions
* [PATCH] for patchy patches! For feedback on a patch, or just to let people know it exists so they can try it.
* [AWG] [[Architecture Working Group]]

If you have suggested changes for these keywords, please put your suggestion on [[Talk:OSDev|the talk page]].

== Autoreply Software ==

If you have autoreply software to notify people that you are out of the office, please make sure that the software complies with the "Personal Responder" guidelines defined in [http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3834.txt RFC 3834 - Recommendations for Automatic Responses to Electronic Mail]. In particular:

: ''Personal and Group responses whose purpose is to notify the sender of a message of a temporary absence of the recipient (e.g., "vacation" and "out of the office" notices) SHOULD NOT be issued unless a valid address for the recipient is explicitly included in a recipient (e.g., To, Cc, Bcc, Resent-To, Resent-Cc, or Resent-Bcc) field of the subject message. Since a recipient may have multiple addresses forwarded to the same mailbox, recipient SHOULD be able to specify a set of addresses to the responder which it will recognize as valid for that recipient.''

If your autoreply software sends mail to the os-dev mailing list, you will be marked as a moderated member of the mailing list, meaning that all messages you send to the mailing list will need to be approved by a list moderator. You may request to be switched to an unmoderated member only after you can assure the list moderators that your autoreply software has been upgraded to comply with RFC 3834.

== Second Life <-> mailing list name mapping ==

Editing on this wiki is done using Second Life names, but posting on the mailing list is often done using another name (real name or non-Second Life alias). We don't ask anyone to reveal any information they don't want to, but we do encourage those who don't use their Second Life names on the mailing list to put their name in the [[SLDev Resident Names]] table.

== SLDev Traffic ==

Old copies of [[SLDev Traffic]], a weekly summary of this mailing list, are still available, but are no longer being written. Volunteers to help revive this useful service would be greatly appreciated.

== Related mailing lists ==

=== sldev-commits ===

This is for automated notices of activity on svn.secondlife.com. See https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits for more information

SLDev

2010-02-02T15:40:13Z

Soft Linden:

SLDev

2010-02-02T15:39:01Z

Soft Linden:

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

Disambiguation:

*[[SLDev Forum Transcripts]]
*[[OSDev | OSDev Mailing List (formerly SLDev)]]

Talk:SLDev

2010-02-02T15:38:00Z

Soft Linden: moved Talk:SLDev to Talk:OSDev: SLDev mailing list is being renamed

#REDIRECT [[Talk:OSDev]]

Talk:OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-02T15:38:00Z

Soft Linden: moved Talk:SLDev to Talk:OSDev: SLDev mailing list is being renamed

SLDev

2010-02-02T15:37:59Z

Soft Linden: moved SLDev to OSDev: SLDev mailing list is being renamed

#REDIRECT [[OSDev]]

OpenSource-Dev

2010-02-02T15:37:59Z

Soft Linden: moved SLDev to OSDev: SLDev mailing list is being renamed

{{Open Source Portal|parent=Developer communication tools}}

Disambiguation:

*[[SLDev Forum Transcripts]]
*[[SLDev | SLDev Mailing List (this page)]]

[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev SLDev@lists.secondlife.com] - mailing list for discussing software development issues related to Second Life. This is a high-traffic mailing list (as many as 30-40 messages/day on a busy day).

* '''[https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev Subscribe to SLDev@lists.secondlife.com]''' (or [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/options/sldev unsubscribe])
* [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/ Browse the archive]
* [http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=001010425210852223575%3Aogwhgz5_tue Search the archive]
* View [[SLDev Usage Stats]]

'''IMPORTANT''': Please be sure to read the Posting Policies and Guidelines below before posting to this mailing list.

== Posting Policies and Guidelines ==

The sldev mailing list is for software development issue related to Second Life. The following policies are meant to ensure we can keep conversation civil and on-topic. "Policies" are rules that need to be followed to ensure continued posting privileges. "Guidelines" have more wiggle room, but should be considered before posting.

=== Policies ===

* This mailing list is for discussing problems and ideas that software developers can directly address and for collaboration on solutions and improvements, not for turning Linden Lab development staff into proxies to reach other parts of Linden Lab (e.g. legal, executive, human resources, etc).
* Please adhere to the [https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2009/02/25/guidelines-for-the-sl-blogs guidelines for blog.secondlife.com]. Since we can't delete comments that are in violation, we're going to instead preemptively set the "moderated" bit for repeat violators.
* Constructive criticism is welcome, but general complaints which only serve to discourage use of Second Life or discourage cooperation with Linden Lab should be taken elsewhere.
* If you have auto-reply email software (such as out-of-office notification), please make sure that it's configured correctly. Failure to do so will cause you to receive moderated access until you assure us it's fixed. See the Autoreply Software section below for more details.
* If someone else is violating mailing list policy, do not reply to them on the list. Reply to them offlist if you feel you need to engage them. If you feel disciplinary action is required, send mail to the list administrator (<sldev-owner@lists.secondlife.com>). Engaging with them on-list may result in the moderation bit being set on your account.

=== Guidelines ===

In addition to the policies above, here's some guidelines. These aren't hard-and-fast rules, but rather, good etiquette. There are a lot of people on this list (800+ as of this writing), so please follow these guidelines when you post:

* Please remember the old mantra "praise in public, criticize in private". On-list reprimands are rarely of interest to the general mailing list.
* If you are asking a question to the list, either [https://lists.secondlife.com/pipermail/sldev/ browse the archives] or do a [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=POT&q=site%3Alists.secondlife.com%2Fpipermail%2Fsldev%2F&btnG=Search keyword search of the archives] first to check if your question has already been responded.
* Keep threads on topic. If you want to talk about something unrelated to the subject of a thread, change the subject line. If the new topic is something that doesn't belong on sldev@, please strongly consider posting it elsewhere.
* If a topic generates more than five replies in less than 24 hours, it's time to redirect that conversation to one of our other tools, either the wiki, the bug tracker, or a thread in the appropriate forum.
* If the topic is not specifically a Second Life development-related topic (e.g. mailing list policy or a licensing discussion), it should be redirected to the wiki, the bug tracker, or the appropriate forum immediately. One post per 48 hours should be sufficient to bring it to everyone's attention.
* If after 48 hours, the topic seems to have died out on the alternate forum, it's ok to reraise the issue on this mailing list, summarizing the offlist conversation thus far, and calling for further comment in the alternate forum.
* Please use the keywords below (in the "Subject Line Keywords" section) when posting, especially the "strongly recommended" keywords.
* Most LSL scripting issues are better addressed on the [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters secondlifescripters mailing list].

These guidelines try to balance between making sure that people have a large forum to raise and discuss a broad spectrum of issues, while at the same time ensuring that the list doesn't become overwhelmed with discussion on a single topic that may not be of interest to everyone on the list.

== Subject Line Keywords ==

When posting to the list, please take your best guess at the right subject line keyword to put on your email. Some of the keywords below are strongly recommended, while some are purely optional. However, all of them will help people organize

Strongly recommended (since they are arguably a little off-topic):
* [POLICY] issues about policy and etiquette on wiki, jira, and the mailing list, some licensing/legal logistics issues NOTE: licensing issues should be directed to licensing@lindenlab.com
* [META] repositories, creating inworld meeting places, getting and keeping the community organized, product cycle processes
* [WEB] questions/complaints about the website, jira, wiki, etc

Optional:
* [ANN] announcements
* [VWR] questions about viewer releases. Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR the "VWR" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [SVC] questions about the Second Life service (simulators, login servers, web apis, general grid questions). Analogous to [https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC the "SVC" project on jira.secondlife.com]
* [IDEA] for new features ideas and proposals
* [VOICE] about voice activation features
* [HELP] for topic about building the viewer or other support request
* [I18N] for internationalization and localization problems
* [EVENTLET] eventlet questions
* [MULIB] mulib questions
* [PATCH] for patchy patches! For feedback on a patch, or just to let people know it exists so they can try it.
* [AWG] [[Architecture Working Group]]

If you have suggested changes for these keywords, please put your suggestion on [[Talk:SLDev|the talk page]].

== Autoreply Software ==

If you have autoreply software to notify people that you are out of the office, please make sure that the software complies with the "Personal Responder" guidelines defined in [http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3834.txt RFC 3834 - Recommendations for Automatic Responses to Electronic Mail]. In particular:

: ''Personal and Group responses whose purpose is to notify the sender of a message of a temporary absence of the recipient (e.g., "vacation" and "out of the office" notices) SHOULD NOT be issued unless a valid address for the recipient is explicitly included in a recipient (e.g., To, Cc, Bcc, Resent-To, Resent-Cc, or Resent-Bcc) field of the subject message. Since a recipient may have multiple addresses forwarded to the same mailbox, recipient SHOULD be able to specify a set of addresses to the responder which it will recognize as valid for that recipient.''

If your autoreply software sends mail to the sldev mailing list, you will be marked as a moderated member of the mailing list, meaning that all messages you send to the mailing list will need to be approved by a list moderator. You may request to be switched to an unmoderated member only after you can assure the list moderators that your autoreply software has been upgraded to comply with RFC 3834.

== Second Life <-> mailing list name mapping ==

Editing on this wiki is done using Second Life names, but posting on the mailing list is often done using another name (real name or non-Second Life alias). We don't ask anyone to reveal any information they don't want to, but we do encourage those who don't use their Second Life names on the mailing list to put their name in the [[SLDev Resident Names]] table.

== SLDev Traffic ==

Old copies of [[SLDev Traffic]], a weekly summary of this mailing list, are still available, but are no longer being written. Volunteers to help revive this useful service would be greatly appreciated.

== Related mailing lists ==

=== sldev-commits ===

This is for automated notices of activity on svn.secondlife.com. See https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev-commits for more information

Snowglobe Committer List

2010-01-07T18:29:05Z

Soft Linden:

Here's the list of active committers for the [[Snowglobe]] viewer, who have opted-in to be reviewers for new patches:

* [[User:Aimee Trescothick|Aimee Trescothick]]
* [[User:Aleric Inglewood|Aleric Inglewood]]
* [[User:Robin Cornelius|Robin Cornelius]]
* [[User:Thickbrick Sleaford|Thickbrick Sleaford]]

* [[User:Merov Linden|Merov Linden]]
* [[User:Philip Linden|Philip Linden]]
* [[User:Q Linden|Q Linden]]
* [[User:Soft Linden|Soft Linden]]
* [[User:Tofu Linden|Tofu Linden]]

Other developers with commit access to svn.secondlife.com should feel free to opt-in to being listed here (please add yourselves).

[[Category:Snowglobe]]

All keyboard shortcut keys

2009-10-25T18:29:50Z

Soft Linden: Well, hell. I may have spoken too soon. Coco put shift-enter in, but I'm not finding it in a current branch.

{{Help|Viewer=*}}
This page contains a comprehensive list of keyboard shortcut keys in the Second Life Viewer, even ones that are rarely used.

For a list of only the most commonly-used keyboard shortcut keys, see [[Keyboard shortcut keys]]. For consideration of new shortcuts, look at [[Shortcuts SL-UX]] to minimize trouble in different operating systems.

== Menus ==

=== File ===

Ctrl-U --> File > Upload Image...
Ctrl-W --> File > Close Window
Ctrl-Shift-W --> File > Close All Windows
Ctrl-Shift-S --> File > Take or Refresh Snapshot
Ctrl-` --> File > Snapshot to Disk
Ctrl-Q --> File > Quit

=== Edit ===

Ctrl-Z --> Edit > Undo
Ctrl-Y --> Edit > Redo
Ctrl-X --> Edit > Cut
Ctrl-C --> Edit > Copy
Ctrl-V --> Edit > Paste
Del --> Edit > Delete
Ctrl-F --> Edit > Search...
Ctrl-A --> Edit > Select All
Ctrl-E --> Edit > Deselect
Ctrl-D --> Edit > Duplicate
Ctrl-G --> Edit > Gestures...
Ctrl-Shift-F --> Edit > Friends...
Ctrl-P --> Edit > Preferences...

=== View ===

M --> View > Mouselook
B --> View > Build
Alt-Shift-F --> View > Joystick Flycam
Esc --> View > Reset View
Ctrl-\ --> View > Look at Last Chatter
Ctrl-H --> View > Local Chat
Ctrl-T --> View > Communicate
Ctrl-I --> View > Inventory
Ctrl-M --> View > World Map
Ctrl-Shift-M --> View > Mini-Map
Ctrl-Shift-1 --> View > Statistics Bar
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-P --> View > Property Lines
Ctrl-Shift-T --> View > Hover Tips > Show Tips
Ctrl-Alt-T --> View > Highlight Transparent
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-N --> View > Beacons
Alt-Shift-H --> View > Show HUD Attachments
Ctrl-0 --> View > Zoom In
Ctrl-9 --> View > Zoom Default
Ctrl-8 --> View > Zoom Out
Alt-Enter --> View > Toggle Fullscreen

=== World ===

Enter --> World > Chat
Ctrl-R --> World > Always Run
Home --> World > Fly
Ctrl-Shift-H --> World > Teleport Home

Ctrl-Shift-Y --> World > Environment Settings > Midday
Ctrl-Shift-N --> World > Environment Settings > Sunset

=== Tools ===

Ctrl-1 --> Tools > Select Tool > Focus
Ctrl-2 --> Tools > Select Tool > Move
Ctrl-3 --> Tools > Select Tool > Edit
Ctrl-4 --> Tools > Select Tool > Create
Ctrl-5 --> Tools > Select Tool > Land

G --> Tools > Snap to Grid
Shift-X --> Tools > Snap Object XY to Grid
Shift-G --> Tools > Use Selection for Grid
Ctrl-Shift-B --> Tools > Grid Options...
Ctrl-L --> Tools > Link
Ctrl-Shift-L --> Tools > Unlink
H --> Tools > Focus on Selection
Shift-H --> Tools > Zoom to Selection

=== Help ===

F1 --> Help > Second Life Help

=== Advanced ===

Ctrl-Shift-2 --> Advanced > Consoles > Frame Console
Ctrl-Shift-3 --> Advanced > Consoles > Texture Console
Ctrl-Shift-4 --> Advanced > Consoles > Debug Console
Ctrl-Shift-9 --> Advanced > Consoles > Fast Timers
Ctrl-Shift-0 --> Advanced > Consoles > Memory

Ctrl-Shift-F2 --> Advanced > Reload personal settings overrides

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-1 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Simple
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-2 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Alpha
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-3 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Tree
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-4 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Character
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-5 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > SurfacePatch
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-6 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Sky
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-7 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Water
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-8 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Ground
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-9 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Volume
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-0 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Grass
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-- --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Clouds
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-= --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Particles
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-\ --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Bump

Ctrl-Alt-F1 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > UI
Ctrl-Alt-F2 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Selected
Ctrl-Alt-F3 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Highlighted
Ctrl-Alt-F4 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Dynamic Textures
Ctrl-Alt-F5 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Foot Shadows
Ctrl-Alt-F6 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Fog
Ctrl-Alt-F7 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Palletized Textures
Ctrl-Alt-F8 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Test FRInfo
Ctrl-Alt-F9 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Flexible Objects

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-T --> Advanced > Rendering > Selected Texture Info
Ctrl-Shift-R --> Advanced > Rendering > Wireframe
Ctrl-Shift-O --> Advanced > Rendering > Object-Object Occlusion

Ctrl-Alt-F --> Advanced > UI > Dump Focus Holder
Ctrl-Shift-P --> Advanced > UI > Print Selected Object Info
Shift-P --> Advanced > UI > Print Agent Info
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-M --> Advanced > UI > Memory Stats

Ctrl-Alt-R --> Advanced > Character > Rebake Textures

Ctrl-Alt-L --> Advanced > Network > Drop a Packet

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-U --> Advanced > Show Updates ''(* Shortcut removed in SL 1.21)''
Ctrl-Alt-V --> Advanced > View Admin Options
Ctrl-Alt-G --> Advanced > Request Admin Status
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-G --> Advanced > Leave Admin Status

=== Admin ===

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-O --> Admin > Object > Take Copy
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-Del --> Admin > Object > Delete
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-L --> Admin > Object > Lock
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-I --> Admin > Object > Get Asset IDs

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-C --> Admin > Parcel > Set to Linden Content

== Other ==

A and Left --> Turn left
Shift-A and Shift-Left --> Move left
C and PgDown --> Crouch / Fly down
D and Right --> Turn right
Shift-D and Shift-Right --> Move right
E and PgUp --> Jump / Fly up
F and Home --> Fly on/off
S and Down --> Walk backward
W and Up --> Walk forward
Ctrl-Alt-D --> Toggle "Advanced" Menu on/off
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-H --> Hippos!
Ctrl-Enter --> Shout
Ctrl-Up --> Recall previous chat/IM input line.
Ctrl-Down --> Recall next chat/IM input line.
Ctrl-S --> Save notecard/script.

=== Login Screen ===

<pre>Ctrl-Shift-G --> Grid selection pulldown
Ctrl-T --> Test floater
F2 --> TOS window</pre>

All keyboard shortcut keys

2009-10-25T18:25:53Z

Soft Linden: shift-enter applies to newer LL viewers as well

{{Help|Viewer=*}}
This page contains a comprehensive list of keyboard shortcut keys in the Second Life Viewer, even ones that are rarely used.

For a list of only the most commonly-used keyboard shortcut keys, see [[Keyboard shortcut keys]]. For consideration of new shortcuts, look at [[Shortcuts SL-UX]] to minimize trouble in different operating systems.

== Menus ==

=== File ===

Ctrl-U --> File > Upload Image...
Ctrl-W --> File > Close Window
Ctrl-Shift-W --> File > Close All Windows
Ctrl-Shift-S --> File > Take or Refresh Snapshot
Ctrl-` --> File > Snapshot to Disk
Ctrl-Q --> File > Quit

=== Edit ===

Ctrl-Z --> Edit > Undo
Ctrl-Y --> Edit > Redo
Ctrl-X --> Edit > Cut
Ctrl-C --> Edit > Copy
Ctrl-V --> Edit > Paste
Del --> Edit > Delete
Ctrl-F --> Edit > Search...
Ctrl-A --> Edit > Select All
Ctrl-E --> Edit > Deselect
Ctrl-D --> Edit > Duplicate
Ctrl-G --> Edit > Gestures...
Ctrl-Shift-F --> Edit > Friends...
Ctrl-P --> Edit > Preferences...

=== View ===

M --> View > Mouselook
B --> View > Build
Alt-Shift-F --> View > Joystick Flycam
Esc --> View > Reset View
Ctrl-\ --> View > Look at Last Chatter
Ctrl-H --> View > Local Chat
Ctrl-T --> View > Communicate
Ctrl-I --> View > Inventory
Ctrl-M --> View > World Map
Ctrl-Shift-M --> View > Mini-Map
Ctrl-Shift-1 --> View > Statistics Bar
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-P --> View > Property Lines
Ctrl-Shift-T --> View > Hover Tips > Show Tips
Ctrl-Alt-T --> View > Highlight Transparent
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-N --> View > Beacons
Alt-Shift-H --> View > Show HUD Attachments
Ctrl-0 --> View > Zoom In
Ctrl-9 --> View > Zoom Default
Ctrl-8 --> View > Zoom Out
Alt-Enter --> View > Toggle Fullscreen

=== World ===

Enter --> World > Chat
Ctrl-R --> World > Always Run
Home --> World > Fly
Ctrl-Shift-H --> World > Teleport Home

Ctrl-Shift-Y --> World > Environment Settings > Midday
Ctrl-Shift-N --> World > Environment Settings > Sunset

=== Tools ===

Ctrl-1 --> Tools > Select Tool > Focus
Ctrl-2 --> Tools > Select Tool > Move
Ctrl-3 --> Tools > Select Tool > Edit
Ctrl-4 --> Tools > Select Tool > Create
Ctrl-5 --> Tools > Select Tool > Land

G --> Tools > Snap to Grid
Shift-X --> Tools > Snap Object XY to Grid
Shift-G --> Tools > Use Selection for Grid
Ctrl-Shift-B --> Tools > Grid Options...
Ctrl-L --> Tools > Link
Ctrl-Shift-L --> Tools > Unlink
H --> Tools > Focus on Selection
Shift-H --> Tools > Zoom to Selection

=== Help ===

F1 --> Help > Second Life Help

=== Advanced ===

Ctrl-Shift-2 --> Advanced > Consoles > Frame Console
Ctrl-Shift-3 --> Advanced > Consoles > Texture Console
Ctrl-Shift-4 --> Advanced > Consoles > Debug Console
Ctrl-Shift-9 --> Advanced > Consoles > Fast Timers
Ctrl-Shift-0 --> Advanced > Consoles > Memory

Ctrl-Shift-F2 --> Advanced > Reload personal settings overrides

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-1 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Simple
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-2 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Alpha
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-3 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Tree
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-4 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Character
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-5 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > SurfacePatch
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-6 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Sky
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-7 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Water
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-8 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Ground
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-9 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Volume
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-0 --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Grass
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-- --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Clouds
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-= --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Particles
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-\ --> Advanced > Rendering > Types > Bump

Ctrl-Alt-F1 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > UI
Ctrl-Alt-F2 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Selected
Ctrl-Alt-F3 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Highlighted
Ctrl-Alt-F4 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Dynamic Textures
Ctrl-Alt-F5 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Foot Shadows
Ctrl-Alt-F6 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Fog
Ctrl-Alt-F7 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Palletized Textures
Ctrl-Alt-F8 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Test FRInfo
Ctrl-Alt-F9 --> Advanced > Rendering > Features > Flexible Objects

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-T --> Advanced > Rendering > Selected Texture Info
Ctrl-Shift-R --> Advanced > Rendering > Wireframe
Ctrl-Shift-O --> Advanced > Rendering > Object-Object Occlusion

Ctrl-Alt-F --> Advanced > UI > Dump Focus Holder
Ctrl-Shift-P --> Advanced > UI > Print Selected Object Info
Shift-P --> Advanced > UI > Print Agent Info
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-M --> Advanced > UI > Memory Stats

Ctrl-Alt-R --> Advanced > Character > Rebake Textures

Ctrl-Alt-L --> Advanced > Network > Drop a Packet

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-U --> Advanced > Show Updates ''(* Shortcut removed in SL 1.21)''
Ctrl-Alt-V --> Advanced > View Admin Options
Ctrl-Alt-G --> Advanced > Request Admin Status
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-G --> Advanced > Leave Admin Status

=== Admin ===

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-O --> Admin > Object > Take Copy
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-Del --> Admin > Object > Delete
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-L --> Admin > Object > Lock
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-I --> Admin > Object > Get Asset IDs

Ctrl-Alt-Shift-C --> Admin > Parcel > Set to Linden Content

== Other ==

A and Left --> Turn left
Shift-A and Shift-Left --> Move left
C and PgDown --> Crouch / Fly down
D and Right --> Turn right
Shift-D and Shift-Right --> Move right
E and PgUp --> Jump / Fly up
F and Home --> Fly on/off
S and Down --> Walk backward
W and Up --> Walk forward
Ctrl-Alt-D --> Toggle "Advanced" Menu on/off
Ctrl-Alt-Shift-H --> Hippos!
Ctrl-Enter --> Shout
Shift-Enter --> Whisper
Ctrl-Up --> Recall previous chat/IM input line.
Ctrl-Down --> Recall next chat/IM input line.
Ctrl-S --> Save notecard/script.

=== Login Screen ===

<pre>Ctrl-Shift-G --> Grid selection pulldown
Ctrl-T --> Test floater
F2 --> TOS window</pre>

Talk:Main Page/Archive 1

2009-10-21T15:30:29Z

Soft Linden: Nothing to do with main page

== request for categories to be added to the "About this Wiki" box ==

Would it be possible to have the [[:Category:Articles in need of updating|Articles in need of updating]] and [[:Category:Articles in need of expansion|Category:Articles in need of expansion]] categories added to the About this Wiki box so as to direct people towards articles in need of some wiki-love ?

[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 23:14, 8 January 2007 (PST)
== Headline ==

I would very strongly suggest that (a) directly under the page name ('Main Page' - which could do with being changed anyway) is a statement along the lines of '''''"This wiki relates to the Open Source client and protocols for Second Life only. If you are looking for assistance regarding Second Life please refer to '''(whatever page is felt best)"'' as it is clear from the comments on the announcement thread on the SL Blog that there are an awful lot of people who do not understand what this is all about and it will probably scare some of them! If I had sysop status I'd add it myself ... --[[User:Alison Wheels|Alison Wheels]] 07:31, 9 January 2007 (PST)

:The wiki isn't just for the client though.
:[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 09:19, 9 January 2007 (PST)

::Indeed, however I do believe ''something'' is needed there to make it clear to the neophyte SL-standard-user who has no interest at all in these 'behind the scenes' activities but clicks on the link here because it is there that there is nothing for them to get worried about. --[[User:Alison Wheels|Alison Wheels]] 13:26, 9 January 2007 (PST)

:::Heh, yeah, it is really in need of a title and some introductory text.
:::[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 14:14, 9 January 2007 (PST)

::::Could someone mock up what they think the homepage should look like? Sorry that the homepage has to be protected, but I figured it's such a vandalism target that I couldn't avoid that. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 14:20, 9 January 2007 (PST)

:::::[[User:SignpostMarv Martin/Sandbox/Main Page|Done]]
:::::[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 03:25, 10 January 2007 (PST)

=== Removed Main Page title ===
Since the title "Main Page" doesn't add anything, it's just deadwood. So, I made a change to the stylesheet to make the Main Page title invisible. This will not affect any other pages. If anyone has an issue with this, please discuss or ping me directly.

Thanks,
Rand

--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 18:20, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

== What is this wiki for ? ==

What is this wiki for? Is it a general purpose wiki, where information like the old support wiki had? Would it be appropriate for someone to start a page on Groups, and Land, and Animations, etc.? A page similar to the LSL wiki for the main page would be logical, providing a list of topics, categories, etc. to guide people in the right path. A search box doesn't help if you don't know the right term to search for. Was this wiki's creation announced? If this is a general help wiki, might it make sense to put the F1 help in here to be used and worked on? If this is supposed to be a general help reference shouldn't it be listed on the support page: http://secondlife.com/community/support.php and have a separate item in the dropdown box to make it a simple as humanly possible for people to find this?
 [[User:SuezanneC Baskerville|SuezanneC Baskerville]] 08:26, 11 January 2007

:The wiki currently seems to be being used for the OSSL (Open-Source Second Life) project, and for Volunteers.
:However, with some of the work being done in [[:Category:Linden Lab Employees]], it's slowly expanding into other areas.
:With regards to improving the main page, I invite you to take a look at the wiki-code I've used on my demo, copy it over to [[User:SuezanneC Baskerville|your user-space]], and showing off your ideas.
:[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 09:57, 11 January 2007 (PST)

I agree with SuzanneC that this wiki needs to be much more accessible to the average user/newbie, and that the link to this wiki needs to be MUCH MORE visible on www.secondlife.com. People want to find information, and that's what a wiki is for. Do I have permission to create a "General Knowledge" Portal? Any "general knowledge" for the average user does not seem to fit into any current portals. Please advise! [[User:Oryx Tempel|Oryx Tempel]] 21:51 08 August 2007

:The [[Volunteer Portal|Volunteer wiki]] was announced on the 8th, and Pathfinder is due to make another announcement soon, in case anyone missed the first one. Below is a copy of the original announcement (modified for wikification purposes):
<blockquote style="font-style:italic;font-size:120%;font-weight: bolder ;">
::Greetings!

::I'd like to announce that our [[Volunteer Portal|Volunteer Wiki]] is now open and ready to go. It primarily contains [[:Category:Text from In-world Notecards|information collected from inworld notecards]], but this is *your* resource to contribute to and organize however you feel works best. Feel free to experiment, edit existing content, or add some completely new pages!

::Just log into the wiki with your SL username and password, and feel free to start adding or reorganizing. [[User:Amber Linden|Amber]] and [[User:Pathfinder Linden|I]] will also continue to watch it and add whatever resources we find.

::I noticed that a few of you have already started editing and contributing to it, having discovered it via the new [[Open Source Portal|Open Source wiki]] (both wikis are on the same server). Outstanding initiative, and thank you.

::Also, please be sure to visit the new [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/slvolunteers Volunteers mailing list page] and subscribe yourself to it. I will be using this list as a key way to communicate directly with Volunteers. I also think it will be a great way for all of you to communicate with each other and share ideas without being interrupted by Group IM's inworld.

::'''Volunteer Wiki'''
:::http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Volunteer_Portal

::'''Volunteer Mailing List'''
::https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/slvolunteers

::Onward and upward!
::-[[User:Pathfinder Linden|Pathfinder]]
</blockquote>

::*--If the Volunteer Portal is supposed to be the answer to SuezanneC Baskerville & Oryx Tempel posts about thinking we need more general help available in this wiki, then I'd have to say that the the Volunteer portal is not good as a resource for newbies, and not really even for vets either (because it's too hard to find and too sparse). I know about the newbie side, because I'm a newbie, I never thought to look in the Volunteer Portal, I doubt anyone else does either. I've spoken to other newbies in-world, they've visited this wiki too, and also thought there was absolutely nothing here of any value to newbies. Because they couldn't find it.
:::--And we need more stuff for newbies. After talking with Jeremy & Jon Linden Friday during office hours, it's clear LL offers next to nothing in the way of documentation for newbies. There is nothing good for newbies on secondlife.com or in-world. The 1 thing LL offers, is when you first login to the Second Life Support Center there's a link titled "New to Second Life? Find out how to get started." But the info offered there is WAY too brief!!!
:::--LL doesn't give a dictionary. LL doesn't give a browse-able overview of the client, so you could just poke through a table of contents and read-up about the features in the viewer. LL gives no intro for newbies (though there are some pretty good, outdated, & disorganized notecards kicking-around that do this...but how many newbies ever find/read those?).
:::--If LL, or this wiki, offered better docs for new users, Mentors might be less overwhelmed handling basic problems, Help Island would probably be less crowded, and other citizens might spend less time hand-holding newbies and more time doing more advanced, satisfying activities. I bet SL loses confused newbies in droves over the lack of docs.
:::--Since newbies don't know what questions to ask, the stuff at secondlife.com/support isn't too useful...because they don't know what search terms to type in. Lots of people don't even like to search. Why not a table of contents? What this wiki could offer is ONE point for ALL newbies to click..."Help with Second Life". From that ONE click, it should be possible to browse to EVERY article of interest to newbies. Just by browsing from ONE point they should get an overview of SL, FAQs, dictionary, info on the viewer, more in-depth info, etc. Perhaps something like this:
:::https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Jaszon_Maynard/Proposed_Second_Life_Help_Portal
:::--Jeremy said I should look again in the wiki for docs that are good for new users. And there are some...but they're only linked to the Volunteer portal. If the Volunteer portal is supposed to be helpful to newbies, well, first of all, it's called the "Volunteer" portal (!!!). I wasn't looking to be a volunteer, or to find one...I was looking for help text. The description on the main wiki page says "Learn more about our Resident Volunteer program and access shared Volunteer resources. Resident Volunteers are participants in our Official Volunteer Program, providing guidance and assistance to Residents blah blah blah....". By the time any newbie reads 2 lines in, it seems pretty clear that the volunteer portal does not offer what they're looking for. It doesn't say "general help in here!".
:::--And the Volunteer portal is, for newbies, not organized well at all for them, and is missing all kinds of things it would have to have. I'll post about that in the Volunteer portal talk page.
:::http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Talk:Volunteer_Portal
:::--And what if I don't want to join any organization (I don't, yet), but I do want to add/edit articles in the Volunteer portal? Am I allowed to? The descriptions & posts I've read implies I should not. There needs to be a freely-editable help wiki or people aren't going to edit it.
:::--Also, as a computer veteran, programmer, gamer, & user of many products...it is WAY weird to have to login to a support system before being allowed to read basic help info (which is what you have to do at secondlife.com). I am accustomed to only logging into anything if I want to make posts (forums) or submit tickets. But not just read help!!! Probably 2 kinds of people come to SL Support...those, like me, who aren't used to logging-in just to read basic help...and those who aren't used to logging into anything at all ever. Either kind of person will be confused by SL Support. They're just looking for basic help. They're asked to login to something?!? I wonder how many of them are annoyed & confused.
:::--LL is offering nothing for newbies, and I'm pretty shocked. It's probably losing them lots of potential customers. But the community could take up that slack. We can do their work for them, and maybe even do it better. We can be pretty responsive to comments from actual newbies. And we're the ones doing the most socializing, buying/selling, role-playing, setting-up businesses, etc. So we'll have a different perspective than LL. It's a user-created world, there probably should be a user-created guide to it. And hey, it's the internet, users SHOULD have a robust wiki, and LL should take advantage of that interest. I've already got some great notecards to start with and some great ideas to add in. But this wiki needs some changes first. I would start putting some of my ideas in, but there's no point unless we either make changes to the Volunteer portal, or make a new portal. Otherwise newbies will have a hard time finding what I add-in, even if they're given the URL to this wiki. I'm willing to WRITE the 1st draft of the intro for newbies, I'm willing to setup the structure for the dictionary and make the first entry in it, I'm willing to setup the structure so others can fill in the details about the client (menus, dialogs, etc), and I'm willing to setup the structure so others can write about everything else in SL (socializing, avatar customization, sight-seeing, classes, Events, money, land, building, scripting, role-playing, businesses, etc) and it'll be find-able easily in a browse-able format to newbies.
:::--I really think we need either a NEW portal called "Second Life Help", or the Volunteer portal needs a new name, new description, and new layout.
:::--If what people want is a new portal, I'd try making one myself. It would need a lot of helpful edits from others though.
:::--[[User:Jaszon Maynard|Jaszon Maynard]] 21:56, 25 February 2008 (PST)
::::To point this out: the Volunteer Portal is '''not''' the help resource for newbies. It is supposed to provide information for '''Second Life Mentors'''. But yes, I would like to see an official Help Category for newbies on the wiki. As far as I know, there are just articles in the users namespace such as the very helpful newbies guide by [[User:Tid_Kidd|on Tid Kidds Userspage]] or the growing subpages on [[User:Lum_Pfohl|Lum Pfohl]]s site. If newbies are searching for in-world help they can have a look at the official public orientation and help islands or the well made private ones like the [http://slurl.com/secondlife/Scholar/111/85/26 Orientation Station in Scholar] or the [http://slurl.com/secondlife/NMC%20Orientation/128/128/0 NMC Orientation Island] (to just name two of them). We could name and link them there as well. The problem might also be that there are not many people aware of the wiki. So i would like to see a ''Tip of the week'' and/or Video Tutorial ([[User_talk:Torley_Linden#VidTut_Request|like requested by Marv here]]) on it to make it public. But it would be nice to see this help category put up first so newbies can actually find help. By now, it might only be interesting for scripters or volunteers. Greetings, --[[User:Zai Lynch|Zai Lynch]] 15:17, 26 February 2008 (PST)

:::::*--Ok, thanks for the reply. So I gather I can create my own portal, that's allowable? Will it automatically end up on the Main Page or would I have to request someone to put it there?
::::::--[[User:Jaszon Maynard|Jaszon Maynard]] 16:14, 26 February 2008 (PST)

:::::::I ''think'' you can create your own one but it won't be added automatically nor can you add it since the main page can only be edited by wiki moderators (Lindens only?) at the moment. So I would recommend to check back with [[User:Rob_Linden|Rob]] on this. --[[User:Zai Lynch|Zai Lynch]] 20:01, 26 February 2008 (PST)

== upload directory needs chmod ==

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The upload directory (/shared/mediawiki_prod/wiki.secondlife.com/w/images) is not writable by the webserver.

will someone please chmod 777 the directory??? ([[User:Ina Centaur|Ina Centaur]] 05:11, 1 June 2007 (PDT))

== Translation ==
I plan on translating this page to Dutch (Main_Page/nl) objections anyone? --[[User:Aidamina Hunt|Aidamina Hunt]] 00:03, 30 August 2007 (PDT)

Plan on finishing the [[Main_Page/nl]] soon --[[User:Aidamina Hunt|Aidamina Hunt]] 07:06, 11 April 2008 (PDT)

== secondlife.com/support no longer links to the wiki? ==

*--secondlife.com/support used to have a link to the wiki...not anymore?
:--[[User:Jaszon Maynard|Jaszon Maynard]] 16:56, 26 March 2008 (PDT)

::There is a link in the footer but I know what you mean. :/ -- [[User:Strife Onizuka|Strife Onizuka]] 08:54, 28 March 2008 (PDT)

== Queries ==

*Where can I ask technical queries about Second Life? The email address support@ secondlife.com has disappeared. I was directed to http://secondlife.com/support/ , which does not seem to have anywhere to send messages and queries. There is a Yahoo email group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Second_Life , but it is moderated and its moderator seems to be on holiday or AWOL.

I was given two USA phone numbers, but I am in England.

I was told to go to https://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/security.asp , which displayed only "Insufficient Account Information deptID is empty!".

[[User:CaptainJack Grauman|CaptainJack Grauman]] 05:40, 1 April 2008 (PDT)

:I would say it depends on what your question is related to. If it is a support question for ''your'' SL, then https://support.secondlife.com/ is the page to look at. The portal got a revision [http://blog.secondlife.com/2008/03/17/support-navigation-changes-coming-tomorrow/ lately] so that might be the reason why the link mentioned above is out-of-date. In case your problem isn't listed there, you might file a support ticket (service varies for account type basic/premium). If it is a bug report or the request of a new feature, have a look at Second Lifes public issue tracker at [http://jira.secondlife.com http://jira.secondlife.com]. If it is a question about SL in general, you might want to visit an [[Office_Hours|in-world office hour]] with a Linden who is responsible for that specific technical field where your question is related to. Greetings, --[[User:Zai Lynch|Zai Lynch]] 06:25, 1 April 2008 (PDT)

== Where is the Teen Grid Section? ==

Would it be possible to add the Teen Grid Wiki on the Main Page of the Second Life Wiki? {{Unsigned|Daniel Voyager|13:54, 7 May 2008}}
:This might be something to ask a TSL VTeam Linden. I would recommend [[User:Lexie Linden|Lexie]] since she seems to be the VTeam-Wiki Linden or [[User:Blue Linden|Blue]] as allrounder. I got the feeling that the links are missing to not make it ''to easy'' for adult Residents to contact TSL Residents (via talk pages etc.) since it's some kind of intergrid communication. But well, TSL Portal and TSL Blog aren't really hidden, just unmentioned. So if you got the O.K. for the legal stuff, you could create a [[Template:Main Page/TSL Portal]] that fits the design of the other involved templates and ask Lexie/Blue to add it to the [[Main Page]] since they should have SysOp status and would know that they gave you the previous O.K. (so you wouldn't have the same discussion with [[User:Rob Linden|Rob]] again). If you got problems by creating the template, please provide the links you'd like to see displayed and poke [[User:SignpostMarv Martin|Marv]], me or one of the other [[:Category:SL Mentor Scribes|Scribes]] to this.
:Greetz, [[User:Zai_Lynch|Zai Lynch]]([[User_talk:Zai_Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai_Lynch|contribs]]) 09:14, 7 May 2008 (PDT)

== Making the Main Page portal "boxes" more compact ==

Most of the portal "boxes" (templates) on the main page have a title (with the light blue background) and then a link to the portal as the first words in the body of the box (white background). In most cases, the text of the two is the same or very similar. I'd like to eliminate the redundancy by making the link be the title. For example, see the "Web Services Portal" box at lower right. I also modified the "Help Portal" box to be along these lines.

In general, screen real estate on the Main Page is a valuable commodity and should be used parsimoniously.

Does anyone have an objection?

--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 07:34, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Talk:Main Page/Archive 1

2009-10-21T15:29:34Z

Soft Linden: Reverting - edits had nothing to do with this page

== request for categories to be added to the "About this Wiki" box ==

Would it be possible to have the [[:Category:Articles in need of updating|Articles in need of updating]] and [[:Category:Articles in need of expansion|Category:Articles in need of expansion]] categories added to the About this Wiki box so as to direct people towards articles in need of some wiki-love ?

[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 23:14, 8 January 2007 (PST)
== Headline ==

I would very strongly suggest that (a) directly under the page name ('Main Page' - which could do with being changed anyway) is a statement along the lines of '''''"This wiki relates to the Open Source client and protocols for Second Life only. If you are looking for assistance regarding Second Life please refer to '''(whatever page is felt best)"'' as it is clear from the comments on the announcement thread on the SL Blog that there are an awful lot of people who do not understand what this is all about and it will probably scare some of them! If I had sysop status I'd add it myself ... --[[User:Alison Wheels|Alison Wheels]] 07:31, 9 January 2007 (PST)

:The wiki isn't just for the client though.
:[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 09:19, 9 January 2007 (PST)

::Indeed, however I do believe ''something'' is needed there to make it clear to the neophyte SL-standard-user who has no interest at all in these 'behind the scenes' activities but clicks on the link here because it is there that there is nothing for them to get worried about. --[[User:Alison Wheels|Alison Wheels]] 13:26, 9 January 2007 (PST)

:::Heh, yeah, it is really in need of a title and some introductory text.
:::[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 14:14, 9 January 2007 (PST)

::::Could someone mock up what they think the homepage should look like? Sorry that the homepage has to be protected, but I figured it's such a vandalism target that I couldn't avoid that. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 14:20, 9 January 2007 (PST)

:::::[[User:SignpostMarv Martin/Sandbox/Main Page|Done]]
:::::[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 03:25, 10 January 2007 (PST)

=== Removed Main Page title ===
Since the title "Main Page" doesn't add anything, it's just deadwood. So, I made a change to the stylesheet to make the Main Page title invisible. This will not affect any other pages. If anyone has an issue with this, please discuss or ping me directly.

Thanks,
Rand

--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 18:20, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

== What is this wiki for ? ==

What is this wiki for? Is it a general purpose wiki, where information like the old support wiki had? Would it be appropriate for someone to start a page on Groups, and Land, and Animations, etc.? A page similar to the LSL wiki for the main page would be logical, providing a list of topics, categories, etc. to guide people in the right path. A search box doesn't help if you don't know the right term to search for. Was this wiki's creation announced? If this is a general help wiki, might it make sense to put the F1 help in here to be used and worked on? If this is supposed to be a general help reference shouldn't it be listed on the support page: http://secondlife.com/community/support.php and have a separate item in the dropdown box to make it a simple as humanly possible for people to find this?
 [[User:SuezanneC Baskerville|SuezanneC Baskerville]] 08:26, 11 January 2007

:The wiki currently seems to be being used for the OSSL (Open-Source Second Life) project, and for Volunteers.
:However, with some of the work being done in [[:Category:Linden Lab Employees]], it's slowly expanding into other areas.
:With regards to improving the main page, I invite you to take a look at the wiki-code I've used on my demo, copy it over to [[User:SuezanneC Baskerville|your user-space]], and showing off your ideas.
:[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 09:57, 11 January 2007 (PST)

I agree with SuzanneC that this wiki needs to be much more accessible to the average user/newbie, and that the link to this wiki needs to be MUCH MORE visible on www.secondlife.com. People want to find information, and that's what a wiki is for. Do I have permission to create a "General Knowledge" Portal? Any "general knowledge" for the average user does not seem to fit into any current portals. Please advise! [[User:Oryx Tempel|Oryx Tempel]] 21:51 08 August 2007

:The [[Volunteer Portal|Volunteer wiki]] was announced on the 8th, and Pathfinder is due to make another announcement soon, in case anyone missed the first one. Below is a copy of the original announcement (modified for wikification purposes):
<blockquote style="font-style:italic;font-size:120%;font-weight: bolder ;">
::Greetings!

::I'd like to announce that our [[Volunteer Portal|Volunteer Wiki]] is now open and ready to go. It primarily contains [[:Category:Text from In-world Notecards|information collected from inworld notecards]], but this is *your* resource to contribute to and organize however you feel works best. Feel free to experiment, edit existing content, or add some completely new pages!

::Just log into the wiki with your SL username and password, and feel free to start adding or reorganizing. [[User:Amber Linden|Amber]] and [[User:Pathfinder Linden|I]] will also continue to watch it and add whatever resources we find.

::I noticed that a few of you have already started editing and contributing to it, having discovered it via the new [[Open Source Portal|Open Source wiki]] (both wikis are on the same server). Outstanding initiative, and thank you.

::Also, please be sure to visit the new [https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/slvolunteers Volunteers mailing list page] and subscribe yourself to it. I will be using this list as a key way to communicate directly with Volunteers. I also think it will be a great way for all of you to communicate with each other and share ideas without being interrupted by Group IM's inworld.

::'''Volunteer Wiki'''
:::http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Volunteer_Portal

::'''Volunteer Mailing List'''
::https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/slvolunteers

::Onward and upward!
::-[[User:Pathfinder Linden|Pathfinder]]
</blockquote>

::*--If the Volunteer Portal is supposed to be the answer to SuezanneC Baskerville & Oryx Tempel posts about thinking we need more general help available in this wiki, then I'd have to say that the the Volunteer portal is not good as a resource for newbies, and not really even for vets either (because it's too hard to find and too sparse). I know about the newbie side, because I'm a newbie, I never thought to look in the Volunteer Portal, I doubt anyone else does either. I've spoken to other newbies in-world, they've visited this wiki too, and also thought there was absolutely nothing here of any value to newbies. Because they couldn't find it.
:::--And we need more stuff for newbies. After talking with Jeremy & Jon Linden Friday during office hours, it's clear LL offers next to nothing in the way of documentation for newbies. There is nothing good for newbies on secondlife.com or in-world. The 1 thing LL offers, is when you first login to the Second Life Support Center there's a link titled "New to Second Life? Find out how to get started." But the info offered there is WAY too brief!!!
:::--LL doesn't give a dictionary. LL doesn't give a browse-able overview of the client, so you could just poke through a table of contents and read-up about the features in the viewer. LL gives no intro for newbies (though there are some pretty good, outdated, & disorganized notecards kicking-around that do this...but how many newbies ever find/read those?).
:::--If LL, or this wiki, offered better docs for new users, Mentors might be less overwhelmed handling basic problems, Help Island would probably be less crowded, and other citizens might spend less time hand-holding newbies and more time doing more advanced, satisfying activities. I bet SL loses confused newbies in droves over the lack of docs.
:::--Since newbies don't know what questions to ask, the stuff at secondlife.com/support isn't too useful...because they don't know what search terms to type in. Lots of people don't even like to search. Why not a table of contents? What this wiki could offer is ONE point for ALL newbies to click..."Help with Second Life". From that ONE click, it should be possible to browse to EVERY article of interest to newbies. Just by browsing from ONE point they should get an overview of SL, FAQs, dictionary, info on the viewer, more in-depth info, etc. Perhaps something like this:
:::https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Jaszon_Maynard/Proposed_Second_Life_Help_Portal
:::--Jeremy said I should look again in the wiki for docs that are good for new users. And there are some...but they're only linked to the Volunteer portal. If the Volunteer portal is supposed to be helpful to newbies, well, first of all, it's called the "Volunteer" portal (!!!). I wasn't looking to be a volunteer, or to find one...I was looking for help text. The description on the main wiki page says "Learn more about our Resident Volunteer program and access shared Volunteer resources. Resident Volunteers are participants in our Official Volunteer Program, providing guidance and assistance to Residents blah blah blah....". By the time any newbie reads 2 lines in, it seems pretty clear that the volunteer portal does not offer what they're looking for. It doesn't say "general help in here!".
:::--And the Volunteer portal is, for newbies, not organized well at all for them, and is missing all kinds of things it would have to have. I'll post about that in the Volunteer portal talk page.
:::http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Talk:Volunteer_Portal
:::--And what if I don't want to join any organization (I don't, yet), but I do want to add/edit articles in the Volunteer portal? Am I allowed to? The descriptions & posts I've read implies I should not. There needs to be a freely-editable help wiki or people aren't going to edit it.
:::--Also, as a computer veteran, programmer, gamer, & user of many products...it is WAY weird to have to login to a support system before being allowed to read basic help info (which is what you have to do at secondlife.com). I am accustomed to only logging into anything if I want to make posts (forums) or submit tickets. But not just read help!!! Probably 2 kinds of people come to SL Support...those, like me, who aren't used to logging-in just to read basic help...and those who aren't used to logging into anything at all ever. Either kind of person will be confused by SL Support. They're just looking for basic help. They're asked to login to something?!? I wonder how many of them are annoyed & confused.
:::--LL is offering nothing for newbies, and I'm pretty shocked. It's probably losing them lots of potential customers. But the community could take up that slack. We can do their work for them, and maybe even do it better. We can be pretty responsive to comments from actual newbies. And we're the ones doing the most socializing, buying/selling, role-playing, setting-up businesses, etc. So we'll have a different perspective than LL. It's a user-created world, there probably should be a user-created guide to it. And hey, it's the internet, users SHOULD have a robust wiki, and LL should take advantage of that interest. I've already got some great notecards to start with and some great ideas to add in. But this wiki needs some changes first. I would start putting some of my ideas in, but there's no point unless we either make changes to the Volunteer portal, or make a new portal. Otherwise newbies will have a hard time finding what I add-in, even if they're given the URL to this wiki. I'm willing to WRITE the 1st draft of the intro for newbies, I'm willing to setup the structure for the dictionary and make the first entry in it, I'm willing to setup the structure so others can fill in the details about the client (menus, dialogs, etc), and I'm willing to setup the structure so others can write about everything else in SL (socializing, avatar customization, sight-seeing, classes, Events, money, land, building, scripting, role-playing, businesses, etc) and it'll be find-able easily in a browse-able format to newbies.
:::--I really think we need either a NEW portal called "Second Life Help", or the Volunteer portal needs a new name, new description, and new layout.
:::--If what people want is a new portal, I'd try making one myself. It would need a lot of helpful edits from others though.
:::--[[User:Jaszon Maynard|Jaszon Maynard]] 21:56, 25 February 2008 (PST)
::::To point this out: the Volunteer Portal is '''not''' the help resource for newbies. It is supposed to provide information for '''Second Life Mentors'''. But yes, I would like to see an official Help Category for newbies on the wiki. As far as I know, there are just articles in the users namespace such as the very helpful newbies guide by [[User:Tid_Kidd|on Tid Kidds Userspage]] or the growing subpages on [[User:Lum_Pfohl|Lum Pfohl]]s site. If newbies are searching for in-world help they can have a look at the official public orientation and help islands or the well made private ones like the [http://slurl.com/secondlife/Scholar/111/85/26 Orientation Station in Scholar] or the [http://slurl.com/secondlife/NMC%20Orientation/128/128/0 NMC Orientation Island] (to just name two of them). We could name and link them there as well. The problem might also be that there are not many people aware of the wiki. So i would like to see a ''Tip of the week'' and/or Video Tutorial ([[User_talk:Torley_Linden#VidTut_Request|like requested by Marv here]]) on it to make it public. But it would be nice to see this help category put up first so newbies can actually find help. By now, it might only be interesting for scripters or volunteers. Greetings, --[[User:Zai Lynch|Zai Lynch]] 15:17, 26 February 2008 (PST)

:::::*--Ok, thanks for the reply. So I gather I can create my own portal, that's allowable? Will it automatically end up on the Main Page or would I have to request someone to put it there?
::::::--[[User:Jaszon Maynard|Jaszon Maynard]] 16:14, 26 February 2008 (PST)

:::::::I ''think'' you can create your own one but it won't be added automatically nor can you add it since the main page can only be edited by wiki moderators (Lindens only?) at the moment. So I would recommend to check back with [[User:Rob_Linden|Rob]] on this. --[[User:Zai Lynch|Zai Lynch]] 20:01, 26 February 2008 (PST)

== upload directory needs chmod ==

DOWNTIME NOTICE: we'll be performing maintenance on wiki.secondlife.com on Thursday, May 31 at 10pm for up to two hours. The site may be unavailable during this time.
Upload file
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The upload directory (/shared/mediawiki_prod/wiki.secondlife.com/w/images) is not writable by the webserver.

will someone please chmod 777 the directory??? ([[User:Ina Centaur|Ina Centaur]] 05:11, 1 June 2007 (PDT))

== Translation ==
I plan on translating this page to Dutch (Main_Page/nl) objections anyone? --[[User:Aidamina Hunt|Aidamina Hunt]] 00:03, 30 August 2007 (PDT)

Plan on finishing the [[Main_Page/nl]] soon --[[User:Aidamina Hunt|Aidamina Hunt]] 07:06, 11 April 2008 (PDT)

== Network Configuration & Ports ==

Hello,

I am a newbie and am trying to get access to S/L at work, IT has asked me to find out the network config, the ports used and what types of packets are being used. Is there anyone that can help me or point me to the documentation?

:See [[Help:Firewall Configuration]]
:[[User:SignpostMarv Martin|SignpostMarv Martin]] 06:36, 28 March 2008 (PDT)

== secondlife.com/support no longer links to the wiki? ==

*--secondlife.com/support used to have a link to the wiki...not anymore?
:--[[User:Jaszon Maynard|Jaszon Maynard]] 16:56, 26 March 2008 (PDT)

::There is a link in the footer but I know what you mean. :/ -- [[User:Strife Onizuka|Strife Onizuka]] 08:54, 28 March 2008 (PDT)

== Queries ==

*Where can I ask technical queries about Second Life? The email address support@ secondlife.com has disappeared. I was directed to http://secondlife.com/support/ , which does not seem to have anywhere to send messages and queries. There is a Yahoo email group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Second_Life , but it is moderated and its moderator seems to be on holiday or AWOL.

I was given two USA phone numbers, but I am in England.

I was told to go to https://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/security.asp , which displayed only "Insufficient Account Information deptID is empty!".

[[User:CaptainJack Grauman|CaptainJack Grauman]] 05:40, 1 April 2008 (PDT)

:I would say it depends on what your question is related to. If it is a support question for ''your'' SL, then https://support.secondlife.com/ is the page to look at. The portal got a revision [http://blog.secondlife.com/2008/03/17/support-navigation-changes-coming-tomorrow/ lately] so that might be the reason why the link mentioned above is out-of-date. In case your problem isn't listed there, you might file a support ticket (service varies for account type basic/premium). If it is a bug report or the request of a new feature, have a look at Second Lifes public issue tracker at [http://jira.secondlife.com http://jira.secondlife.com]. If it is a question about SL in general, you might want to visit an [[Office_Hours|in-world office hour]] with a Linden who is responsible for that specific technical field where your question is related to. Greetings, --[[User:Zai Lynch|Zai Lynch]] 06:25, 1 April 2008 (PDT)

== Where is the Teen Grid Section? ==

Would it be possible to add the Teen Grid Wiki on the Main Page of the Second Life Wiki? {{Unsigned|Daniel Voyager|13:54, 7 May 2008}}
:This might be something to ask a TSL VTeam Linden. I would recommend [[User:Lexie Linden|Lexie]] since she seems to be the VTeam-Wiki Linden or [[User:Blue Linden|Blue]] as allrounder. I got the feeling that the links are missing to not make it ''to easy'' for adult Residents to contact TSL Residents (via talk pages etc.) since it's some kind of intergrid communication. But well, TSL Portal and TSL Blog aren't really hidden, just unmentioned. So if you got the O.K. for the legal stuff, you could create a [[Template:Main Page/TSL Portal]] that fits the design of the other involved templates and ask Lexie/Blue to add it to the [[Main Page]] since they should have SysOp status and would know that they gave you the previous O.K. (so you wouldn't have the same discussion with [[User:Rob Linden|Rob]] again). If you got problems by creating the template, please provide the links you'd like to see displayed and poke [[User:SignpostMarv Martin|Marv]], me or one of the other [[:Category:SL Mentor Scribes|Scribes]] to this.
:Greetz, [[User:Zai_Lynch|Zai Lynch]]([[User_talk:Zai_Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai_Lynch|contribs]]) 09:14, 7 May 2008 (PDT)

== Making the Main Page portal "boxes" more compact ==

Most of the portal "boxes" (templates) on the main page have a title (with the light blue background) and then a link to the portal as the first words in the body of the box (white background). In most cases, the text of the two is the same or very similar. I'd like to eliminate the redundancy by making the link be the title. For example, see the "Web Services Portal" box at lower right. I also modified the "Help Portal" box to be along these lines.

In general, screen real estate on the Main Page is a valuable commodity and should be used parsimoniously.

Does anyone have an objection?

--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 07:34, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

LlLoadURL

2009-08-24T18:24:50Z

Soft Linden:

{{LSL_Function/avatar|avatar|sim=*}}{{LSL_Function
|func_id=297|func_sleep=10.0|func_energy=10.0
|func=llLoadURL|sort=LoadURL
|p1_type=key|p1_name=avatar
|p2_type=string|p2_name=message
|p3_type=string|p3_name=url
|func_footnote=The '''url''' is truncated to 255 characters and '''message''' is truncated to 254 characters. The protocol for the '''url''' must be specified, currently only "https://" and "http://" are supported. The URL should be rfc1738 compliant with proper escapes.
|func_desc=Shows dialog to '''avatar''' offering to load web page at '''url''' with '''message'''. If user clicks yes, launches the page in their web browser, starting the browser if required.
|return_text
|spec
|caveats=*This function should not be called from group deeded objects{{Footnote|This was not always the case, see [[#History|History]] for details}}, it will silently fail.
|constants
|examples=
<lsl>// Display URL Dialog
default
{
touch_start(integer num_detected)
{
key gAvatarKey = llDetectedKey(0);
llLoadURL(gAvatarKey, "View the offical Second Life website.", "http://www.secondlife.com");
}
}</lsl>
<lsl>
//Compact Script by Alessandro Spires to SecondBits and Second Life
default
{
touch_start(integer num_detected)
{
llLoadURL(llDetectedKey(0), "Visit the Second Life", "http://www.secondlife.com");
}
}</lsl>
<lsl>//Emmas Seetan
//21 September 17:06

string text = "Visit the Second Life Wiki!"; //Floating text
string url = "https://wiki.secondlife.com/"; //must include 'http://'

default
{
touch_start(integer num_detected)
{
llLoadURL(llDetectedKey(0), text, url); //Loads the URL
}
}</lsl>
|helpers
|also_functions
|also_events
|also_articles
|also_tests=
{{LSL DefineRow|[[llLoadURL Test]]|}}
|notes
|history=
*Introduced in version 1.6, no support for group deeded objects.
*As of version ~1.9, support for group deeded objects was added (possibly by accident).
*In the server upgrade released on 2007-03-14, support for group deeded objects was removed.
|cat1=Dialog
|cat2
|cat3
|cat4
}}

Talk:GetTimestampOffset

2009-08-10T00:58:25Z

Soft Linden: Created page with 'Nice! But that automatic Pacific logic is going to be wrong for the last hours of a Pacific day. You'll want to subtract 24hrs if wall clock > GMT clock. --~~~~'

Nice! But that automatic Pacific logic is going to be wrong for the last hours of a Pacific day. You'll want to subtract 24hrs if wall clock > GMT clock. --[[User:Soft Linden|Soft Linden]] 00:58, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

User:Zai Lynch/Talkpage Archive 04

2009-07-11T00:26:19Z

Soft Linden: /* Double checking on WEB-1194 */

{{:User:Zai Lynch/TalkpageNav}}

== Vimeo widget problems ==

Zai, Thanks for fixing the videos in the KB articles.

I just put a little navigation template in some of the articles, but it seems to break the vimeo widget and I can't imagine why. See [[Why do textures sometimes look messed up? - Video Tutorial]] for an example.

I'd like to create some more navigation boxes to group related articles and make navigation easier. But this is a real problem.

Any ideas?

--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 19:28, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

:Heyas!
:It's not your template interferring but appearently a problem with the widgets extension. I faced the same problem with the Blip.tv one. Every time I make an edit to such a page, I need to perform a null edit after saving, in order to clear the cache. Otherwise, the widget isn't kicking in correctly...
:You can make null edits by editing and saving without making a change, or adding ''?action=purge'' at the end of the link.
:It's a little annoying... So when you know the work around, it's not hurting to much.
:Greetz :-)
:--[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 19:32, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

::Great, thanks for the tip. Very strange, and a bit annoying, but at least there's a workaround. Thanks again!

::--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 22:37, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

== CT-405 ==

Hi Zai,
I have a question or two about "das Polygonnetz des Avatars".

*I have no idea how but do you think it´s possible to simplify this even more? Even with it being inaccurate, maybe we could call it something like "Oberfläche" and if needed add "(ein Polygonnetz)" with the link to wikipedia?

*Just for my understanding: Is it all baked into one texture (like skin and clothes)?
--[[User:Torben Trautman|Torben Trautman]] 21:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

:Hey Torben! :-)
:@1: Yeah, "Polygonnetz" sounds a lil bumpy and maybe even frightening for non-techie's... I think we can go with the suggested "Oberfläche" in case we provide the right technical term together with the link.
:@2: Yes, skin and all layers of clothing are baked into the same texture so that every avatar just got 3 of them (face, upper and lower body). (Well and the standart hair...) That is the reason why you're becoming all blurry although you just change one single piece of clothing. Cause it's a whole new texture. It's then distributed to other clients which is also the reason for some strange phenomena that occurs when a graphics card driver bitches and messes up the texture during the baking process. People often say "it can't be my driver, since my friend is seeing me too this way!". Though they got to, since they're receiving the distorted texture from them...
:Greetz, [[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 22:44, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:Oh btw: Did you save the chatlog from Simone's OH? Could you publish it? I had a con lost, restarted and thought: '''d'oh!'''
:Didn't have logging of open chat enabled either... --[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 22:53, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

I believe it doesn´t look too bad with "Oberfläche" :)
I added the transcript, for some obscure reason I had it saved hehe
*waves* --[[User:Torben Trautman|Torben Trautman]] 11:37, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

:Great, thx!! :-) --[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 11:51, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

== Double checking on WEB-1194 ==

Hi Zai - just wanted to check in with you on {{jira|WEB-1194}}, as well as just want to use this as an excuse to edit a heavily edited page as a test of my own. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 23:50, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

:Seems to be fixed, thx! :-) --[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 23:56, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

== Oh hi there ==
Zai officially rocks the wiki. That is all. --[[User:Soft Linden|Soft Linden]] 00:25, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

User:Zai Lynch/Talkpage Archive 04

2009-07-11T00:25:58Z

Soft Linden:

{{:User:Zai Lynch/TalkpageNav}}

== Vimeo widget problems ==

Zai, Thanks for fixing the videos in the KB articles.

I just put a little navigation template in some of the articles, but it seems to break the vimeo widget and I can't imagine why. See [[Why do textures sometimes look messed up? - Video Tutorial]] for an example.

I'd like to create some more navigation boxes to group related articles and make navigation easier. But this is a real problem.

Any ideas?

--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 19:28, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

:Heyas!
:It's not your template interferring but appearently a problem with the widgets extension. I faced the same problem with the Blip.tv one. Every time I make an edit to such a page, I need to perform a null edit after saving, in order to clear the cache. Otherwise, the widget isn't kicking in correctly...
:You can make null edits by editing and saving without making a change, or adding ''?action=purge'' at the end of the link.
:It's a little annoying... So when you know the work around, it's not hurting to much.
:Greetz :-)
:--[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 19:32, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

::Great, thanks for the tip. Very strange, and a bit annoying, but at least there's a workaround. Thanks again!

::--[[User:Rand Linden|Rand Linden]] 22:37, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

== CT-405 ==

Hi Zai,
I have a question or two about "das Polygonnetz des Avatars".

*I have no idea how but do you think it´s possible to simplify this even more? Even with it being inaccurate, maybe we could call it something like "Oberfläche" and if needed add "(ein Polygonnetz)" with the link to wikipedia?

*Just for my understanding: Is it all baked into one texture (like skin and clothes)?
--[[User:Torben Trautman|Torben Trautman]] 21:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

:Hey Torben! :-)
:@1: Yeah, "Polygonnetz" sounds a lil bumpy and maybe even frightening for non-techie's... I think we can go with the suggested "Oberfläche" in case we provide the right technical term together with the link.
:@2: Yes, skin and all layers of clothing are baked into the same texture so that every avatar just got 3 of them (face, upper and lower body). (Well and the standart hair...) That is the reason why you're becoming all blurry although you just change one single piece of clothing. Cause it's a whole new texture. It's then distributed to other clients which is also the reason for some strange phenomena that occurs when a graphics card driver bitches and messes up the texture during the baking process. People often say "it can't be my driver, since my friend is seeing me too this way!". Though they got to, since they're receiving the distorted texture from them...
:Greetz, [[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 22:44, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:Oh btw: Did you save the chatlog from Simone's OH? Could you publish it? I had a con lost, restarted and thought: '''d'oh!'''
:Didn't have logging of open chat enabled either... --[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 22:53, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

I believe it doesn´t look too bad with "Oberfläche" :)
I added the transcript, for some obscure reason I had it saved hehe
*waves* --[[User:Torben Trautman|Torben Trautman]] 11:37, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

:Great, thx!! :-) --[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 11:51, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

== Double checking on WEB-1194 ==

Hi Zai - just wanted to check in with you on {{jira|WEB-1194}}, as well as just want to use this as an excuse to edit a heavily edited page as a test of my own. -- [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]] 23:50, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

:Seems to be fixed, thx! :-) --[[File:Zai_signature.png|45px|link=User:Zai Lynch]] ([[User talk:Zai Lynch|talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Zai Lynch|contribs]]) 23:56, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Zai officially rocks the wiki. That is all. --[[User:Soft Linden|Soft Linden]] 00:25, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

User:Soft Linden/Quarterly Goals

2009-07-11T00:22:06Z

Soft Linden: Ancient/not maintained. Man, I wish we used the same wiki internally and externally. :/

LSL Protocol/Restrained Living Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay

2009-07-04T17:23:50Z

Soft Linden: Edited without the governance editorial

{{Restrained Life Relay Specs TOC}}

__NOTOC__

== Introduction ==

You can get this relay in MSM Restraints shop in Stonehaven: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Stonehaven%20Island/155/79/301

Note: The object and all the relay scripts are modifyable so you can easily pick it apart. Only the Help notecard and the update check script (which contains a password) are no-mod. Because of this the whole relay object may wrongly show no-mod. Please drag it into the world to work on it.

Found a bug or incompatiblitly? Please [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=Talk:LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/Maike_Short%27s_Relay&action=edit&section=new tell me].

== Code ==

=== Multi Object Support ===

* Root Prim
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Manager|Relay Manager]] (delegates to the relay units)
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Extended Controller|Extended Controller]] (optional additional functionality)
* Child Prims named "Relay Unit ''n''"
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Unit|Relay Units]]
* !vision Prim
** [[LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/Think_Kink_Restrained_Life_PBA#The_GPU|!vision]] (by Chloe1982 Constantine and Ilana Debevec)

=== Old Single Object, Single Script version ===

* [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Simple|Relay Simple]]

== Changes ==

=== 1.040.e ===

* workaround for a security issue causing the permission request dialog to be skipped or displayed twice because of a multi threading vulnerability. This issue did not occur in old versions of the Second Life Server software because processing of listen events used to be very slow compared to linked messages.
* [http://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short's_Relay%2FRelay_Manager&diff=422682&oldid=341282 my change]

=== 1.040.d ===
* added a filter option to ignore auto granting of permission. If you are sitting while under @acceptpermission a griefer who is not involved at all can get your animation permission while being several hundred meters away

=== 1.040.c ===
* fixed a !handover permission bug

=== 1.040.b ===
* added additional options to the filter (im, vision, windlight, avatar sex)
* included permissionless tp in tp filter
* included new rlv-commands in strip filter
* clean up windlight settings on release if they have been messed with (does not reset daytime on every released, just when it is required)
* some code cleanup

=== 1.040.a ===
* added support for multiple world objects
* show world map with tp destination if force-tp is disabled

=== 1.040 ===
* added support for !who which allows world objects to tell who controls them
* added support for !handover to support inter-sim kidnappers leading directly into a trap and processing facilities that hand over the victim from one step to the next
* added support for [[LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/The_Think_Kink_PBA#The_GPU|!vision script]] from the Think Kink PBA by Ilana Debevec and Chloe1982 Constantine)

=== 1.030.c ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=262273&oldid=255372 Diff]
* fixed group check on parcels not set to a group (which matched objects set to (none), too (reported by Kitty Barnett)
* fixed <0, 0, 0> pseudo object position in distance check (reported by Kitty Barnett).

=== 1.030.b ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=255362&oldid=253182 Diff]
* fixed two faked avatar chat problems

=== 1.030.a ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=190172&oldid=181383 Diff]
* Fixed the compatibility code for world objects that send @clear instead of !release broken by the security fix in 1.020.b

=== 1.030 ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=181353&oldid=95277 Diff]
* added "Temp Mute" in the ask dialog which will mute the object until the next time you login (in the extended controller script)
* tell world objects if an active session is canceled by the relay.

=== 1.020.c ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=95274&oldid=91741 Diff]
* Display position and distance in permission dialog

=== 1.020.b ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=91723&oldid=89853 Diff]
* This is based on 1.015 and has all the fixed made there missing in Marine's 1.020 which is based on a very early version of 1.014
* Filter automatic RLV replies on public chat channel 0 so that people cannot be tricked to say some foreign text out loud
* Added "this-is-a-script-generated-message-beyond-the-control-of-the-agent/" at the beginning of @getstatus-replies on all channel
* '''Note''': Relays which do not add any restriction on their own (like @detach=n) may be abused using @gestatus to trigger dialog responses, gag talk or other scripts like "to buy as gift, say the name of the receiver on channel /''x''". Any version of the reference implementation smaller than (not including) 1.015 (but including 1.020 which is based on 1.014) are affected by this.

=== 1.015 ===

* see [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Change_History#1.014_to_1.015.a|Changes to the reference implemenation 1.014 to 1.015.a]]

LSL Protocol/Restrained Living Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay

2009-07-04T17:15:29Z

Soft Linden:

{{Restrained Life Relay Specs TOC}}

__NOTOC__

== Introduction ==

You can get this relay in MSM Restraints shop in Stonehaven: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Stonehaven%20Island/155/79/301

Note: The object and all the relay scripts are modifyable so you can easily pick it apart. Only the Help notecard and the update check script (which contains a password) are no-mod. Because of this the whole relay object may wrongly show no-mod. Please drag it into the world to work on it.

Found a bug or incompatiblitly? Please [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=Talk:LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/Maike_Short%27s_Relay&action=edit&section=new tell me].

== Code ==

=== Multi Object Support ===

* Root Prim
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Manager|Relay Manager]] (delegates to the relay units)
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Extended Controller|Extended Controller]] (optional additional functionality)
* Child Prims named "Relay Unit ''n''"
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Unit|Relay Units]]
* !vision Prim
** [[LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/Think_Kink_Restrained_Life_PBA#The_GPU|!vision]] (by Chloe1982 Constantine and Ilana Debevec)

=== Old Single Object, Single Script version ===

* [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Simple|Relay Simple]]

== Changes ==

=== 1.040.c ===
* fixed a !handover permission bug

=== 1.040.b ===
* added additional options to the filter (im, vision, windlight, avatar sex)
* included permissionless tp in tp filter
* included new rlv-commands in strip filter
* clean up windlight settings on release if they have been messed with (does not reset daytime on every released, just when it is required)
* some code cleanup

=== 1.040.a ===
* added support for multiple world objects
* show world map with tp destination if force-tp is disabled

=== 1.040 ===
* added support for !who which allows world objects to tell who controls them
* added support for !handover to support inter-sim kidnappers leading directly into a trap and processing facilities that hand over the victim from one step to the next
* added support for [[LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/The_Think_Kink_PBA#The_GPU|!vision script]] from the Think Kink PBA by Ilana Debevec and Chloe1982 Constantine)

=== 1.030.c ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=262273&oldid=255372 Diff]
* fixed group check on parcels not set to a group (which matched objects set to (none), too (reported by Kitty Barnett)
* fixed <0, 0, 0> pseudo object position in distance check (reported by Kitty Barnett).

=== 1.030.b ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=255362&oldid=253182 Diff]
* fixed two faked avatar chat problems

=== 1.030.a ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=190172&oldid=181383 Diff]
* Fixed the compatibility code for world objects that send @clear instead of !release broken by the security fix in 1.020.b

=== 1.030 ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=181353&oldid=95277 Diff]
* added "Temp Mute" in the ask dialog which will mute the object until the next time you login (in the extended controller script)
* tell world objects if an active session is canceled by the relay.

=== 1.020.c ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=95274&oldid=91741 Diff]
* Display position and distance in permission dialog

=== 1.020.b ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=91723&oldid=89853 Diff]
* This is based on 1.015 and has all the fixed made there missing in Marine's 1.020 which is based on a very early version of 1.014
* Filter automatic RLV replies on public chat channel 0 so that people cannot be tricked to say some foreign text out loud
* Added "this-is-a-script-generated-message-beyond-the-control-of-the-agent/" at the beginning of @getstatus-replies on all channel
* '''Note''': Relays which do not add any restriction on their own (like @detach=n) may be abused using @gestatus to trigger dialog responses, gag talk or other scripts like "to buy as gift, say the name of the receiver on channel /''x''". Any version of the reference implementation smaller than (not including) 1.015 (but including 1.020 which is based on 1.014) are affected by this.

=== 1.015 ===

* see [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Change_History#1.014_to_1.015.a|Changes to the reference implemenation 1.014 to 1.015.a]]

Open Source Meeting/Agenda

2009-06-24T15:06:14Z

Soft Linden:

Open source meeting - Thursday, 2pm PT.

[http://slurl.com/secondlife/Hippotropolis/248/15/25/ Teleport] to the Linden Open Source Project headquarters.

Please try to add your items as early as possible in the week to give Rob a chance to round up any Lindens that may be appropriate to the discussion. Please also bring large or contentious items up on [[SLDev]] before or concurrently with adding them as agenda items.

== Agenda ==

2009-06-25

* Your item here
* Next...

Default agenda (after agenda above):
* Update from the Lindens (standing item) - [[User:Rob Linden|Rob Linden]]
* [http://jira.secondlife.com/secure/IssueNavigator.jspa?reset=true&&pid=10003&resolution=-1&version=10435&sorter/field=issuekey&sorter/order=DESC&sorter/field=customfield_10020&sorter/order=DESC Triage list of issues with the SLDev Viewer]
* [http://jira.secondlife.com/secure/IssueNavigator.jspa?mode=hide&requestId=11240 Triage of "Source Code" issues]

[[Category:Open Source Meeting]]

LSL Protocol/Restrained Living Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay

2009-06-20T14:23:05Z

Soft Linden:

{{Restrained Life Relay Specs TOC}}

__NOTOC__

== Introduction ==

You can get this relay in MSM Restraints shop in Stonehaven: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Stonehaven%20Island/155/79/301

Note: The object and all the relay scripts are modifyable so you can easily pick it apart. Only the Help notecard and the update check script (which contains a password) are no-mod. Because of this the whole relay object may wrongly show no-mod. Please drag it into the world to work on it.

Found a bug or incompatiblitly? Please [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=Talk:LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/Maike_Short%27s_Relay&action=edit&section=new tell me].

== Code ==

=== Multi Object Support ===

* Root Prim
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Manager|Relay Manager]] (delegates to the relay units)
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Extended Controller|Extended Controller]] (optional additional functionality)
* Child Prims named "Relay Unit ''n''"
** [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Unit|Relay Units]]
* !vision Prim
** [[LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/Think_Kink_Restrained_Life_PBA#The_GPU|!vision]] (by Chloe1982 Constantine and Ilana Debevec)

=== Old Single Object, Single Script version ===

* [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Other Implementations/Maike Short's Relay/Relay Simple|Relay Simple]]

== Changes ==

=== 1.040.c ===
* fixed a !handover permission bug

=== 1.040.b ===
* added additional options to the filter (im, vision, windlight, avatar sex)
* included permissionless tp in tp filter
* included new rlv-commands in strip filter
* clean up windlight settings on release if they have been messed with (does not reset daytime on every released, just when it is required)
* some code cleanup

=== 1.040.a ===
* added support for multiple world objects
* show world map with tp destination if force-tp is disabled

=== 1.040 ===
* added support for !who which allows world objects to tell who controls them
* added support for !handover to support inter-sim kidnappers leading directly into a trap and processing facilities that hand over the victim from one step to the next
* added support for [[LSL_Protocol/Restrained_Life_Relay/Other_Implementations/The_Think_Kink_PBA#The_GPU|!vision script]] from the Think Kink PBA by Ilana Debevec and Chloe1982 Constantine)

=== 1.030.c ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=262273&oldid=255372 Diff]
* fixed group check on parcels not set to a group (which matched objects set to (none), too (reported by Kitty Barnett)
* fixed <0, 0, 0> pseudo object position in distance check (reported by Kitty Barnett).

=== 1.030.b ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=255362&oldid=253182 Diff]
* fixed two faked avatar chat problems

=== 1.030.a ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=190172&oldid=181383 Diff]
* Fixed the compatibility code for world objects that send @clear instead of !release broken by the security fix in 1.020.b

=== 1.030 ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=181353&oldid=95277 Diff]
* added "Temp Mute" in the ask dialog which will mute the object until the next time you login (in the extended controller script)
* tell world objects if an active session is canceled by the relay.

=== 1.020.c ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=95274&oldid=91741 Diff]
* Display position and distance in permission dialog

=== 1.020.b ===
* [https://wiki.secondlife.com/w/index.php?title=LSL_Protocol%2FRestrained_Life_Relay%2FOther_Implementations%2FMaike_Short%27s_Relay&diff=91723&oldid=89853 Diff]
* This is based on 1.015 and has all the fixed made there missing in Marine's 1.020 which is based on a very early version of 1.014
* Filter automatic RLV replies on public chat channel 0 so that people cannot be tricked to say some foreign text out loud
* Added "this-is-a-script-generated-message-beyond-the-control-of-the-agent/" at the beginning of @getstatus-replies on all channel
* '''Note''': Relays which do not add any restriction on their own (like @detach=n) may be abused using @gestatus to trigger dialog responses, gag talk or other scripts like "to buy as gift, say the name of the receiver on channel /''x''". Any version of the reference implementation smaller than (not including) 1.015 (but including 1.020 which is based on 1.014) are affected by this.

=== 1.015 ===

* see [[LSL Protocol/Restrained Life Relay/Change_History#1.014_to_1.015.a|Changes to the reference implemenation 1.014 to 1.015.a]]