Beta Server Office Hours/Minutes/2010-01-14

This meeting was held on January 14th, 2010

Transcript

Transcript of Oskar Linden's Beta Server Office Hour for January 14th, 2010:

List of Attendees

• Cannot complete
• Cerise Sorbet
• Effy Khandr
• Ezra Rasmuson
• Holger Gilruth
• instead of
• Kaluura Boa
• kizmut Smit
• Lares Carter
• Liandra Ceawlin
• Liisa Runo
• Lil Linden
• Maestro Linden
• Nigma Sterling
• Oskar Linden
• Psi Merlin
• Roberto Salubrius
• Saijanai Kuhn
• sensory Hax
• t change
• Thought Bubble

Transcript

[15:02]	Oskar Linden:	Hi everyone. thanks for coming
[15:02]	Oskar Linden:	we haven't had this many people here in a while
[15:02]	Oskar Linden:	I'm waiting for Lil to get here
[15:02]	Saijanai Kuhn	has entered chat range.
[15:03]	Oskar Linden:	he is moments away
[15:03]	Psi Merlin:	Hi Oskar, Hello everyone.
[15:03]	Liandra Ceawlin:	Hiya Sai. :P
[15:03]	Oskar Linden:	how many people are here for the first time?
[15:03]	Thought Bubble	V2.0 (WEAR ME ) whispers: Techo Kitty Development Thought bubble Initializing...
[15:03]	Roberto Salubrius	has entered chat range.
[15:03]	Lil Linden	has entered chat range.
[15:03]	Effy Khandr:	raises her hand
[15:03]	Kaluura Boa:	On Beta Grid or at this OH?
[15:03]	Lil Linden:	ohai
[15:04]	Psi Merlin:	Hi Lil
[15:04]	Lil Linden:	Hi Psi
[15:04]	Holger Gilruth:	ohai? ohai! :)
[15:04]	Oskar Linden:	hey lil
[15:04]	Oskar Linden:	thanks for coming
[15:04]	Lil Linden:	aw-skar!
[15:04]	Roberto Salubrius:	hello beta world
[15:04]	Ezra Rasmuson:	:))
[15:04]	Saijanai Kuhn:	ohaio
[15:04]	Lares Carter:	its a frist time for me
[15:04]	Roberto Salubrius:	a ohaio
[15:04]	Ezra Rasmuson:	me too
[15:04]	Lil Linden:	we have people from ohio here?
[15:04]	Oskar Linden:	ok guys thanks again everyone for coming
[15:05]	Oskar Linden:	we've got the agenda here
[15:05]	Oskar Linden:	https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Beta_Server_Office_Hours #Agenda
[15:05]	Oskar Linden:	this has been a real busy week for lil and I
[15:05]	Oskar Linden:	crazy busy
[15:05]	Oskar Linden:	seems like we just here yesterday
[15:06]	Lil Linden:	seems like every week's a busy week
[15:06]	Oskar Linden:	the only previous item I have to discuss is getting private regions here on ADITI
[15:06]	Oskar Linden:	I don't have a wiki process in place but if you have a region that you would like copied over just let me know
[15:06]	Oskar Linden:	you can send a message to me on AGNI
[15:07]	Oskar Linden:	I have one or two lined up
[15:07]	Oskar Linden:	(lil. we'll talk after this)
[15:07]	Cannot complete	attachment. An attachment is pending for that spot.
[15:07]	Lil Linden:	(ok)
[15:07]	Oskar Linden:	I'm sure you're all waiting to hear about 1.36
[15:07]	kizmut Smit:	Must it be requested by the region owner?
[15:07]	Oskar Linden:	yeah kizmut
[15:08]	sensory Hax:	yeah
[15:08]
[15:08]	Oskar Linden:	that makes the most sense to me
[15:08]	Oskar Linden:	let's talk about 1.36
[15:08]	Oskar Linden:	lil do you have a release notes link for us?
[15:08]	Lil Linden:	sure do. It's in the agenda if you refresh :)
[15:08]	Lil Linden:	also: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_Beta_Server/1.36
[15:08]	Oskar Linden:	awesome
[15:09]	Oskar Linden:	well there you have it for everyone interested
[15:10]	Oskar Linden:	there are not any real large changes
[15:10]	Oskar Linden:	but a lot has been touched
[15:10]	Oskar Linden:	we got a lot of maintennance level server bugs fixed
[15:10]	Liisa Runo:	oh yay, that one thing is finally fixed, i can finish a project i started 3 years ago ^^
[15:10]	Oskar Linden:	I did a code review with which this week
[15:11]	Oskar Linden:	25,000 lines reviewed
[15:11]	Oskar Linden:	*sigh*
[15:11]	Holger Gilruth:	that is cool with the script on estate
[15:11]	Oskar Linden:	of course there were a lot of little procedural changes on the back side
[15:11]	Oskar Linden:	release scripts and the like
[15:12]	Oskar Linden:	anyone have any questions about what has beena dded?
[15:12]	Lil Linden	grumbles about moving to a new revision control system :P
[15:12]	Holger Gilruth:	can you show us the changes in the topscript estate menu with a picture?
[15:12]	Oskar Linden:	why don't you tell them about that lil?
[15:12]	Lil Linden:	Well!
[15:12]	Lil Linden:	Here in the lab we are in the process of moving from SVN to Mercurial
[15:13]	Lil Linden:	So there has been a lot of work into retooling our .. tools.. to play nice with Hg (mercurial)
[15:14]	Lil Linden:	It's been a bit of a slow down, but in the end we hope it will allow better / faster development cycles
[15:14]	Oskar Linden:	I can try to get you a pic Holger
[15:14]	Oskar Linden:	ask me after the meeting
[15:15]	Holger Gilruth:	is my sim Deutschland Startinsel updated? then i can look myself.
[15:15]	Oskar Linden:	is that sim on aditi?
[15:16]	Oskar Linden:	I'd be welcome to transfer it over
[15:16]	Holger Gilruth:	yes... and of course offer anyone the ability to check by herself
[15:16]	Holger Gilruth:	just IM me then
[15:16]	Oskar Linden:	ok
[15:16]	Oskar Linden:	alright
[15:17]	Cerise Sorbet:	I saw in Andrew's Oh notes that SVC-1945 was a partial fix, any more like that we can expect goof on?
[15:17]	t change	position for small vectors when called in attachments on Havok4 unless interacted with
[15:17]	Nigma Sterling	has entered chat range.
[15:17]	Oskar Linden:	let's talk about the next itemwhat do you mean?
[15:17]	Cerise Sorbet:	that was not quite a sentence but
[15:18]	Cerise Sorbet:	he only sais in oh that it was "not copmoletely fixed"
[15:18]	Cerise Sorbet:	but he probably spelled it right
[15:18]	Oskar Linden:	I don't know any more about it
[15:18]	Oskar Linden:	you'll probably have to ask him
[15:19]	Cerise Sorbet:	bummer, ok, will whack at it, thanks
[15:19]	Oskar Linden:	ok
[15:19]	Oskar Linden:	in the absence of being able to edit the front page of the aditi login screen I created a new page
[15:19]	Oskar Linden:	http://bit.ly/ADITI_notes
[15:19]	Oskar Linden:	that goes to a wiki page where I try to keep the ADITI status up to date
[15:20]	Oskar Linden:	including sim versions and blocking issues
[15:20]	Oskar Linden:	I hope that it will be useful to you guys
[15:20]	Holger Gilruth:	great idea
[15:21]	Oskar Linden:	cool
[15:21]	Oskar Linden:	it is also linked from the MOTD
[15:22]	Oskar Linden:	that I have been trying to keep up to date (but is out of date now)
[15:22]	Oskar Linden:	on my list of things to updatre
[15:22]	Oskar Linden:	unfortunately there is no tool so I have to jump into the sqldb and change it by hand
[15:22]	Oskar Linden:	each time
[15:22]	Oskar Linden:	:-p
[15:22]	Oskar Linden:	the other thing I've heard a lot is how hard it is to know what regions are running what
[15:23]	Roberto Salubrius:	make a php script then give us access to it so we can send greetz to our hommies on the MOTD :)
[15:23]	Oskar Linden:	nice roberto
[15:23]	Holger Gilruth:	haha
[15:23]	Oskar Linden:	I built a tool to help in communicating what servers have what
[15:23]	Oskar Linden:	Maestro helped with the LSL and I wrote the PHP
[15:23]	Oskar Linden:	this page is the simple result of that
[15:23]	Oskar Linden:	http://aditi.99k.org/ADITI/aditi_sims.php
[15:24]	Oskar Linden:	it's pretty straightforward
[15:24]	Oskar Linden:	not too fancy
[15:24]	Oskar Linden:	but gives a list of regions
[15:24]	Lil Linden:	damn lolcow
[15:24]	Oskar Linden:	yeah you gotta click play media
[15:24]	Oskar Linden:	:-p
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	or go to that urkl
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	url
[15:25]	Lares Carter:	whats the red marking about?
[15:25]	Roberto Salubrius:	yes
[15:25]	Roberto Salubrius:	red why ?
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	red means that that region has stopped responding
[15:25]	Roberto Salubrius:	Adult ?
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	it might be down
[15:25]	Roberto Salubrius:	lol
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	no
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	just status
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	region maturity is not defined here
[15:25]	Oskar Linden:	it could be... but I haven't
[15:26]	Oskar Linden:	I have these little towers all over aditi now
[15:26]	Lil Linden:	you should define maturity with an... icon...
[15:26]	Oskar Linden:	they poke my web app once every 5 minutes
[15:26]	Oskar Linden:	to give server statuses
[15:26]	Roberto Salubrius:	btw I've been meaning to ask what happend around the change of 1.34.x the spare time ( at least on the sim I am at ) dissapeared
[15:26]	Oskar Linden:	so at a glance from that url you can see which regions are running which server version
[15:27]	Oskar Linden:	I don't know roberto
[15:27]	Lares Carter:	thats handy, thx Oskar
[15:27]	Oskar Linden:	maybe ask andrew or babbage
[15:27]	Roberto Salubrius:	ok thx
[15:28]	Oskar Linden:	anyone who has a region here I can put one of these towers there and then your region will show on the list
[15:28]	sensory Hax:	http://aditi.99k.org/ADITI/aditi_sims.php
[15:28]
[15:28]	Oskar Linden:	yeah
[15:28]	Oskar Linden:	I'm going to try to create a welcome area with info around the user welcome area west of here
[15:29]	Oskar Linden:	is this kind of thing helpful at all?
[15:29]	Cerise Sorbet:	yes very helpful esp. with the borked snowglobe map
[15:29]	Oskar Linden:	yes, no, maybe? :-D
[15:30]	Holger Gilruth:	why you want to do all by yourself :)
[15:30]	Oskar Linden:	ok.
[15:30]	Oskar Linden:	I'll eventually make the names links as slurls if that helps
[15:30]	Oskar Linden:	what holger?
[15:30]	Lares Carter:	slurls would be a nice addition
[15:30]	Roberto Salubrius:	Slurls work on the beta grid ?
[15:30]	Holger Gilruth:	maybe some people would love to help build the welcome area
[15:31]	Oskar Linden:	oh ok
[15:31]	Oskar Linden:	yeah
[15:31]	Oskar Linden:	knock yourself out
[15:31]	Roberto Salubrius:	won't it just send us to the main grid ?
[15:31]	Roberto Salubrius:	unless we are here to start with
[15:31]	Oskar Linden:	I believe that slurls will send you to aditi if your viewer is logged into aditi
[15:31]	Oskar Linden:	if you have 2 viewers open it will get confused
[15:31]	Oskar Linden:	no viewer open will go to agni for sure
[15:32]	Oskar Linden:	if anyone wants to help build out a qa beta testing specific welcome center I guess ping holger :-)
[15:32]	Roberto Salubrius:	I tought this was the wellcome center
[15:32]	Oskar Linden:	this is just the meeting platform
[15:33]	Roberto Salubrius:	ahhhh ok
[15:33]	Oskar Linden:	we might as well repurpose the actual meeting center to the west of here
[15:33]	Holger Gilruth:	ping :)
[15:33]	kizmut Smit:	Pinging yourself Holger?
[15:34]	Holger Gilruth:	every ping need an answer ping :)
[15:34]	Oskar Linden:	he's eager to help himself
[15:34]	Roberto Salubrius:	and in public how shameful
[15:34]	kizmut Smit:	A pong?
[15:34]	kizmut Smit:	LOL Roberto
[15:34]	Roberto Salubrius:	:)
[15:35]	Oskar Linden:	ok well I've covered all I needed to
[15:35]	Oskar Linden:	Any Other Business ?
[15:35]	Oskar Linden:	so now that 1.36 is on ADITI I expect you all to file lots of bugs
[15:35]	Lares Carter:	is there going to be a aditi mirror update of the agni state anytime soon?
[15:35]	Oskar Linden:	if something seems suspicious just file a bug
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	probably not Lares
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	we can
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	but I don't think there is a pressing need
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	I can copy over inventories if that is what you need
[15:36]	Lil Linden:	oh
[15:36]	Lares Carter:	it was not a request, i would welcome if rather not :D
[15:36]	Lil Linden:	did we mention that $L might not work on 1.34 sims?
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	no
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	hmm
[15:36]	Lil Linden:	Because $L might not work on 1.34 sims
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	I can update that in the status page
[15:36]	Lil Linden:	here on aditi
[15:36]	Oskar Linden:	is that still not fixed?
[15:37]	Lil Linden:	I don't think so
[15:37]	Lil Linden	goes to look
[15:37]	Oskar Linden:	there were some 'interesting' deploy issues
[15:37]	Lil Linden:	yea, I think it's 1.36/1.34 not-play-nice-ness
[15:38]	Holger Gilruth:	how about a wiki site like: please test this and this
[15:38]	Oskar Linden:	hrm. my L$ balance is still "Loading..."
[15:38]	Liisa Runo:	mine was too, but bulk upload made it come visible
[15:38]	Oskar Linden:	that will be here Holger: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_Beta_Server/1.36_Beta_Test
[15:38]	Holger Gilruth:	i see it
[15:39]	Oskar Linden:	I will create a guide for targetted testing
[15:39]	Oskar Linden:	and we do have server test plans that are available
[15:39]	Oskar Linden:	what I'm really hoping is that you can all test the stuff that you use AGNI for
[15:39]	Oskar Linden:	I've got guys running through the sim smoke tests internally
[15:40]	Oskar Linden:	but what I need is the depth and breadth of your unique experiences
[15:40]	Oskar Linden:	heh. thanks lilsa
[15:40]	Oskar Linden:	hey maestro
[15:40]	Maestro Linden:	heya
[15:41]	Liisa Runo:	as you see the numbers spelled "test". did it made your moneys visible?
[15:41]	Lil Linden:	remind me never to buy a skin-toned suit :)
[15:41]	Oskar Linden:	it did lilsa
[15:41]	Liisa Runo:	^^
[15:41]	Oskar Linden:	maestro looks snappy in that
[15:41]	Oskar Linden:	do your nails maestro
[15:41]	Maestro Linden:	let's see, where'd i put it..
[15:41]	Oskar Linden:	this is the radio tower that has your script in it maestro
[15:42]	Maestro Linden:	ah cool
[15:42]	Ezra Rasmuson:	:))
[15:42]	sensory Hax:	lol
[15:42]
[15:42]	Maestro Linden:	Almost like Burj Dubai. Almost.
[15:43]	Oskar Linden:	so like I was saying a minute ago, anything unique you have would be great to test here
[15:43]	Oskar Linden:	it's how we find edge cases that our test plans might be overlooking
[15:43]	Oskar Linden:	we found some real unique stuff in 1.34 that way
[15:44]	Oskar Linden:	some of the linking rules weren't being very clear
[15:44]	Oskar Linden:	some of you guys might remember that
[15:44]	Oskar Linden:	alright, 16 minutes left. Anyone have anything they want to talk about
[15:44]	Liisa Runo:	if you speak about the relink trick to prevent autoreturn, it is still not perfect
[15:45]	Liisa Runo:	silence, i guess not
[15:46]	Oskar Linden:	was that a question?
[15:46]	Oskar Linden:	sorry
[15:46]	Oskar Linden:	:-)
[15:46]	Liisa Runo:	well, yea, not really in question form
[15:46]	Roberto Salubrius:	how was the (???) group name thing solved ?
[15:46]	Holger Gilruth:	there is allways a big bug in this version :) suddenly the max groups are limited to 25
[15:46]	Oskar Linden:	I don't know the specific roberto
[15:47]	Oskar Linden:	I just lead the qa efforts
[15:47]	Oskar Linden:	I'm not at the nitty gritty level
[15:47]	Oskar Linden:	maestro might know
[15:47]	Roberto Salubrius:	he is busy filing his nails
[15:47]	Maestro Linden:	I vaguely recall the bug you're referring to, but I didn't pay attention to it recently
[15:47]	Maestro Linden	searches for the jira
[15:48]	kizmut Smit:	Oh.. before I add something in jira about this.. Am I not supposed to be able to change the group an attachment is set to no matter what group I have active?
[15:49]	Cerise Sorbet:	kizmut yeah that is normal, switch groups then re-wear
[15:49]	Oskar Linden:	:-)
[15:49]	Oskar Linden:	thanks cerise
[15:49]	kizmut Smit:	Well then I think I'd add something to jira anyway since I' d think more people would prefer the attachment be set to whatever group is active.
[15:50]	Maestro Linden:	hm, a fix for that group names bug ( https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-4622 ) should've been in 1.34
[15:50]	instead of	an object's group name
[15:50]	Roberto Salubrius:	we thought it was a network hiccup
[15:50]	Maestro Linden:	that too
[15:51]	Maestro Linden:	but apparently andrew fixed it in some cases, at least
[15:52]	Roberto Salubrius:	ah ok thx
[15:52]	Maestro Linden:	I'm not sure about rules for setting the active group in an attachment, kizmut
[15:53]	Oskar Linden:	too many rules
[15:53]	Maestro Linden:	that might be inherited from your avatar's active group..
[15:53]	Oskar Linden:	:-)
[15:53]	kizmut Smit:	So we don't know if that is working the way it should?
[15:53]	Oskar Linden:	nope :-)
[15:53]	Maestro Linden:	I don't know :)
[15:53]	Oskar Linden:	we usually need to bring up an old simulator
[15:53]	kizmut Smit:	Well it is clearly from whatever group is active from when the agent logged on or attached the object.
[15:53]	Oskar Linden:	check see how it works there and call it expected behaviour
[15:54]	kizmut Smit:	I used to be able to change it while it was attached.
[15:54]	Lil Linden	needs to run
[15:54]	Maestro Linden:	as I recall, if you have land set to only allow scripts from a certain group,
[15:54]	Maestro Linden:	your attachments' scripts will only run if your avatar's active group is set to it
[15:55]	Oskar Linden:	makes sense
[15:55]	Maestro Linden:	does that sound pretty accurate?
[15:55]	Cerise Sorbet:	the attachment - group thing mostly bugspeople when it comes to rezzing
[15:55]	Cerise Sorbet:	already workarounds for no scripts =)
[15:56]	Lil Linden:	adios all :)
[15:56]	Holger Gilruth:	cu lil
[15:56]	Roberto Salubrius:	rc
[15:56]	Roberto Salubrius:	tc
[15:56]
[15:56]	Oskar Linden:	I think Lil got hungry
[15:57]	kizmut Smit:	yeah.. rezzing is a big one.
[15:57]	kizmut Smit:	Rezzing from an attachment is supposed to be a convenience.
[15:58]	Maestro Linden:	yeah, when I try to change the group of my attachment, it instantly reverts
[15:58]	kizmut Smit:	It isn't if you have to go somewhere else to change the object's group.. return and then run the rez.
[15:58]	Maestro Linden:	LSL confirms it heh:
[15:58]	Maestro Linden	shouts: touch_start(integer total_number) {
[15:58]	Maestro Linden	didn't mean to shout
[15:59]	Maestro Linden:	ah, it's 0 if I'm not in any active group. that's probably what llSameGroup() always returns for a NULL group, though
[15:59]	Kaluura Boa:	btw, that is a bit stupid to allow attachments not to have the same group than their owner
[15:59]	Roberto Salubrius:	now what if you drop it with what group will it land on the ground ?
[16:00]	Ezra Rasmuson:	I need to go too. tc all
[16:00]	Oskar Linden:	thanks for coming everyone
[16:00]	Oskar Linden:	find bugs :-)

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