User:Andrew Linden/Office Hours/2008 06 26

Transcript of Andrew Linden's office hours:

[17:00]	Sindy Tsure:	hiya simon!
[17:00]	Arawn Spitteler:	Hi, Simon
[17:00]	Simon Linden:	Hi everyone, how's things?
[17:00]	Original Prim:	hi Simon :)
[17:00]	Sindy Tsure:	possibly a good question for the windlight hour.. unless simon knows..
[17:01]	Sindy Tsure:	things are good, simon!
[17:01]	Sindy Tsure:	hi rex
[17:01]	Arawn Spitteler:	These chairs don't like us to move our cameras about. Is there a windlight hour?
[17:01]	Rex Cronon:	hi sindy
[17:01]	Rex Cronon:	hi everybody
[17:01]	Simon Linden:	I don't know if there's a specific office hour for Windlight ... lemme search for a sec...
[17:01]	Sindy Tsure:	hm.. apparently there's only a teen grid windlight hour..
[17:02]	Rex Cronon:	pastrami linden
[17:02]	Arawn Spitteler:	I don't recall anything after the Fry The Developer Marathon
[17:02]	Sindy Tsure:	maybe benjamin? he's got an hour listed..
[17:03]	Sindy Tsure:	bigpapi does too but only on the TG
[17:03]	Simon Linden:	Q would probably be good - he's a developer and close to the WL people
[17:04]	Sindy Tsure:	monday at 7:30AM! that's just evil...
[17:04]	Arawn Spitteler just discovered the Camera Smoothing Issue's been closed, due to lack of interest in nauseous newbies
[17:04]	Sindy Tsure:	the question was if the rendering pipeline stuff spends time on 100% transparent textures
[17:05]	Simon Linden:	So ... no big news, but I did have a discussion today about llSetLinkPrimitiveParams() and limiting how far it can move an AV
[17:05]	Arawn Spitteler would assume so
[17:05]	Sindy Tsure assumed it doesn't, event tho the avatar rendering cost takes a big hit on them
[17:05]	Arawn Spitteler now has a vested interests.
[17:05]	Sindy Tsure:	you might be right, arawn
[17:05]	Carricre Wind sorry I'm late :)
[17:05]	Simon Linden:	We're not going to clamp it to the link limit (which it should have from the start) but set it to the max build height
[17:05]	Rex Cronon:	that is good news simon
[17:06]	Simon Linden:	It's a bit odd, but since it's used for local teleporters, we don't want to break them
[17:06]	Heather Goodliffe:	have we had office hours the past two weeks?
[17:06]	Sindy Tsure:	so.. tp anywhere in a sim with one call?
[17:06]	Heather Goodliffe:	er, past week
[17:06]	Arawn Spitteler:	In Spirit City, we had a build I was worried about, at only 600 meters
[17:06]	Carricre Wind:	oh, on the subject of links, what about grandchildren in link sets? ever going to happen?
[17:06]	Simon Linden:	It's not quite a TP - the AV has to be sitting
[17:06]	Heather Goodliffe:	looks like the person who posts them on the wiki ison vacation
[17:06]	Sindy Tsure:	yepyep
[17:07]	Simon Linden:	Currently you can move a sitting AV off into oblivion - 2 million or more meters up or down (it's dark down there) which isn't very good
[17:07]	Arawn Spitteler:	I know avies can be spun about, that way, but only until they stand. I have had a problem, at 1600 meters, where I had to map down, since I was linked unsitting
[17:08]	Saijanai Kuhn:	torley has been part of WIndlight team he might now
[17:08]	Saijanai Kuhn:	know
[17:08]	Sindy Tsure nods
[17:08]	Arawn Spitteler's had train rides, as deep as 100,000 meters
[17:08]	Simon Linden:	But it was also being used to move AVs up to skyboxes, etc, so there are useful
[17:08]	Simon Linden:	err, they're
[17:08]	Carricre Wind:	can the sit target not be made to check it's own position and not violate wolrd or region boundaries(sp)
[17:08]	Sindy Tsure:	the old warppos stuff built a big rules list to move somebody 10m at a time.. that's not going to be needed now, right?
[17:08]	Rex Cronon:	it is also used to hide people underground as protection from lots of weapons:)
[17:09]	Carricre Wind:	wow, horrid spelling that
[17:09]	Arawn Spitteler:	At a mile, it got wonky, but I hadn't set an unlink or unsit command
[17:09]	Rex Cronon:	so i can move 4k, with one function call?
[17:09]	Simon Linden:	yeah, there's probably a lot of odd stuff that can be done with it. Anyway the max distance will be 4096m after the limit is imposed
[17:09]	Arawn Spitteler:	How's that compare, with the Physics Engine Cost, of Sim Crossings?
[17:09]	Simon Linden:	At least that blocks totally wild distances
[17:10]	Rex Cronon:	u mean 4k from the center of the object u r sitting?
[17:10]	Simon Linden:	yes, 4k from the root object that's being sat on
[17:10]	Sindy Tsure:	so you can go to 8k if you're already at 4?
[17:11]	Rex Cronon:	can that object can also move the same diestance with one single function call
[17:11]	Rex Cronon:	?
[17:11]	Simon Linden:	yes, but I think that's outside the area covered by the physics engine, so I'm not sure what's going to happen to you
[17:11]	Arawn Spitteler:	I think objects are still limited to 10 meters
[17:11]	Simon Linden:	No, it's only the position of the sitting avatar
[17:11]	Carricre Wind:	heh, not to pick nits, but wouldn't that be 4kibi not 4k? ;)
[17:11]	Sindy Tsure:	any thoughts on limiting the destination to 0-255 on x & y and 0-4k on z?
[17:12]	Sindy Tsure:	ga! stupid lightbulb
[17:12]	Heather Goodliffe:	does that mean you can use sit to sit 16 sims away?
[17:12]	Arawn Spitteler:	Why limit?
[17:12]	Heather Goodliffe:	I'm guessing no ;P
[17:12]	Simon Linden:	Sindy - that's probably a good idea
[17:12]	Arawn Spitteler:	It'll be great, for Time Tunnels
[17:12]	Sindy Tsure:	it's sorta being used to grief now, sending people up to orbit
[17:12]	Carricre Wind:	why not increase the link distance of objects also? say, to 40 or 50, having to make a house in multiple chunks only makes it hard for the residents to edit them
[17:12]	Simon Linden:	Arawn - because it's not good to have some object be able to stuff you a million meters below ground
[17:13]	Arawn Spitteler:	StarGates, would be able to form local stargate networks.
[17:13]	Sindy Tsure:	if it's limited to an absolute 4k max, they couldn't do a script that just jumps you up 4k at a time,over and over
[17:13]	Rex Cronon:	no horizontal limit is even a better idea:)
[17:13]	Simon Linden:	yeah, but I'm trying to fix a simple bug report and not open Pandora's box :)
[17:14]	Arawn Spitteler:	A colleague has a VR Theatre, textured with troop ship flooring, in Spirit City, 80X80, and the neighbors don't tend to like it.
[17:14]	Simon Linden:	Why's that?
[17:14]	Carricre Wind:	or, no limit at all, and the function does does a bit of math on the interpreter side and doesn't place you outside the "world" space, that seems more efficient
[17:15]	Arawn Spitteler:	Spirit City tends to the Meieval Elfin Decor, and the original Holodeck Design doesn't really fit
[17:15]	Sindy Tsure:	that's sorta how llSetPos acts, carricrc.. give it something more than 10m and it just moves 10m..
[17:15]	Arawn Spitteler:	Skies of Spirit City get cluttered, but at 4k, we should be able to fit something in.
[17:16]	Simon Linden:	Yeah, keeping an area within a theme is tough if you give everyone freedom to build what they want
[17:16]	Arawn Spitteler:	Well, later developments of that product cost L$5,000 more
[17:17]	Arawn Spitteler:	Poison 1¢, Antidote U$4,000
[17:17]	Carricre Wind:	no, that's not what I mean Sindy, I mean, lets say an object is at 128,248 and you tell it to offset the AV at +0,123, it would stop you at 256, but if the same object was at 128,2, it would place you at 128,125
[17:17]	Carricre Wind:	just do the math on the interpreter side, the server knows where things are, should be dead simple
[17:18]	Sindy Tsure:	sorta what i meant, though i didn't say it well.. we're on the same page :)
[17:18]	Simon Linden:	Keeping the AV inside the current sim is probably a good idea
[17:18]	Carricre Wind:	oh :) good good then :)
[17:18]	Carricre Wind:	or, at least inside the current connected sims :)
[17:18]	Arawn Spitteler:	The older TPs never had to, but could cross two borders.
[17:18]	Simon Linden:	Would they cross one?
[17:19]	Simon Linden:	We don't want to break some useful object
[17:19]	Arawn Spitteler:	SL5B could really use the SLPP TPs. Yes, no problem, but I didn't see anything on OI, when I tried
[17:20]	Arawn Spitteler:	300 meters to an axis, you could potentially cross four borders
[17:20]	Arawn Spitteler:	I'm wondering if this is better or worse, for the physics engine, than just crossing on foot
[17:21]	Rex Cronon:	aren't avatars static objects once they sit?
[17:21]	Carricre Wind:	what does physics have to do with this? is there a physical object involved?
[17:21]	Sindy Tsure:	i'd be happy to limiting it to within the region but i don't have any scripts that use this stuff...
[17:21]	Arawn Spitteler:	Teleporteing people out of sim isn't pretty, but I've never crashed so
[17:21]	Simon Linden:	I'm not sure - possibly worse, given the large distances that can be involved. A slow approach to the edge is easiest
[17:21]	Arawn Spitteler:	Physics calculates collisions, and static objects can still be collided with.
[17:21]	Simon Linden:	physics gets involved all the time - it's used with avatar movement, not just physical objects
[17:23]	Arawn Spitteler:	One feature I'd like, is BoundingBox_Exit() with the sims as default, so we can shut down vehicle physics, until the changed event
[17:23]	Sindy Tsure has a hard time picturing this. if you crossed multiple sim lines in one call, would you have to go thru all the sims or just go to the destination?
[17:23]	Arawn Spitteler has same question
[17:23]	Simon Linden:	I think you're on your own if you try that, Sindy :)
[17:23]	Sindy Tsure:	lol.. fair enough
[17:24]	Sindy Tsure:	just seems a bit much to do in a set LINK prim params call...
[17:24]	Sindy Tsure:	imo, of course
[17:24]	Simon Linden:	It's very likely to get confused ... I"m not sure what would happen. I'm pretty sure the region can only do sim crossings to the adjacent regions, not one off on the other side
[17:24]	Arawn Spitteler:	At Lummerland, I used SLPP to tp to Omega Concern
[17:24]	Simon Linden:	Is that adjacent?
[17:24]	Sindy Tsure:	looks like it
[17:24]	Carricre Wind:	hehe, my plugin for the mystitool has on more than a few occasions crossed me through multiple sims (max so far 3) in one exicution, not always did I bounce, and yes, each sim collected me, I got changed events on each
[17:24]	Arawn Spitteler:	Yes, the Folda GAp seemed less friendly
[17:25]	Carricre Wind:	^execution even
[17:25]	Carricre Wind:	sheesh.....
[17:25]	Arawn Spitteler:	I've lag-walked multiple sims, but that usually sent me back to the border.
[17:26]	Arawn Spitteler:	SLPP across sim-borders is no problem, at this time.
[17:26]	Arawn Spitteler:	I'll have to try a Mauve to Purple TP
[17:26]	Carricre Wind:	oh, when I say it crosses the sims, I mean in under 1 second
[17:26]	Carricre Wind:	well, 2 perhaps
[17:26]	Simon Linden:	The lag-walk effect is totally done on the viewer ... it keeps moving you while waiting for an update from the simulator. When one finally arrives, you're rubber-banded back to where you 'really' are
[17:26]	Simon Linden:	I wish it would quit after a few seconds
[17:27]	Simon Linden:	... quit moving you off into oblivion, that is
[17:27]	Arawn Spitteler:	I think that would be a suitable Viewer Hack
[17:27]	Sindy Tsure:	are there products that currently need being able to cross sim lines with llSetLinkPrimParams, Arawn?
[17:28]	Carricre Wind:	why not put a partial physics engine in the client itself, and it can keep going with a "best guess" till the new sim tells it otherwise, and precach the nearby sims, not unlike sims do with child agents?
[17:28]	Heather Goodliffe:	I'd think lots
[17:28]	Heather Goodliffe:	anything that uses warp and crosses a sim boundary
[17:28]	Arawn Spitteler:	At Mystic Academy, my TP is available to copy.
[17:29]	Simon Linden:	Carricre - yes, there are lots of good reasons to put a physics engine in the viewer. Camera movement is another area
[17:29]	Saijanai Kuhn:	interesting thought. DOes the Intel free license for Havok apply to the client side?
[17:29]	Arawn Spitteler:	I know WarpPos would be handy, on the railroad.
[17:29]	Sindy Tsure doesn't want to break other peoples products but that sounds dangerous.. i again vote for clamping slpp to the current region :)
[17:29]	Sindy Tsure:	dangerous = likely to break in the future
[17:29]	Arawn Spitteler:	Why just one region?
[17:29]	Heather Goodliffe:	on the railroad?
[17:30]	Sindy Tsure:	no.. this is llSet_LINK_PrimParams.. setting one prim in a link set..
[17:30]	Simon Linden:	I'm inclined to just do 4096m - it's easy to implement, and it's better to add more restricions later (if needed) than doing too much at once
[17:30]	Sindy Tsure:	er.. isn't it?
[17:30]	Carricre Wind:	let me guess Simon, the code is really poorly commented? ;P
[17:30]	Arawn Spitteler:	Jubata, the railroad is interrupted by a ban line,, with protected land continuing a few sims over
[17:31]	Rex Cronon:	if is abused too much, than it makes sense to add restriction
[17:31]	Simon Linden:	Not really ... it was brain-dead simple before, just used whatever number was passed in.
[17:31]	Sindy Tsure:	but once it's abused rex, LL has a harder time changing it because products depend on it
[17:31]	Arawn Spitteler:	It's been unlimited? I only tested to amile
[17:32]	Carricre Wind meant the code you the LL end.... as to imply it's easier to just that figer out what the last developer did :)
[17:32]	Carricre Wind:	^the code on the LL end.....
[17:32]	Simon Linden:	It's also abused vs. used ... the limit is being imposed to avoid the crazy big numbers, but trying not to break the useful stuff
[17:32]	Carricre Wind:	sheesh, I need more coffee before I type in public
[17:32]	Carricre Wind:	the abuse is really that rampant?
[17:33]	Carricre Wind:	haha, thanks Sindy :)
[17:33]	Sindy Tsure:	:)
[17:33]	Simon Linden:	Sit on a box with this script:
[17:33]	Simon Linden:	default { state_entry() { llSetRot(llEuler2Rot(<0,-1,-PI/4>)); } touch_start(integer total_number) { llSetLinkPrimitiveParams(2,[PRIM_POSITION,<3.402823466E+38,3.402823466E+38,3.402823466E+38>]); } }
[17:33]	Rex Cronon:	u can put like a warning in the wiki that says something along the lines: "if u abuse we r going to chop it off":)
[17:33]	Arawn Spitteler:	No abuse that I've heard of.
[17:33]	Simon Linden:	You'll go far :)
[17:33]	Sindy Tsure will pass on that ty, simon
[17:33]	Carricre Wind:	ah, so the abuse requires me to be stupid, and yeah, you're right, that's rampent :)
[17:33]	Rex Cronon:	actually i did that simon:)
[17:34]	Arawn Spitteler:	SL is poorly documented, probably because the features weren't decided on, before marketing
[17:34]	Sindy Tsure:	lol.. ty, carricre
[17:34]	Carricre Wind:	:D
[17:34]	Simon Linden:	yes, the system has grown organically, with more of a 'let's try it' approach than a 'design it perfectly' one
[17:34]	Arawn Spitteler:	What's the record, for avatar altitude?
[17:35]	Simon Linden:	They never came back to tell us ... :)
[17:35]	Sindy Tsure:	lol
[17:35]	Arawn Spitteler:	I think a Gigameter's been done
[17:35]	Sindy Tsure:	they're still falling.. should be back by around 2012
[17:35]	Simon Linden:	Probably got lost in a rolling restart
[17:35]	Carricre Wind:	what about a notion of letting sim owners and estate managers have backend access, so for example, we could just write our own functions link apache modules?
[17:36]	Carricre Wind:	s/link/like
[17:36]	Sindy Tsure thinks that opens privacy and content issues..
[17:36]	Saijanai Kuhn:	spoof asset server requests...
[17:36]	Arawn Spitteler:	Linden Labs still has to distinguish Server Host Powers from Estate Host Powers.
[17:37]	Simon Linden:	It's a good idea, but there are lots of complications and it would require a rock-solid API to prevent stuff like that
[17:37]	Carricre Wind:	well, sure, it opens issues, but the owner's name is on file, there is accountability
[17:37]	Sindy Tsure:	hiya teravus
[17:37]	Simon Linden:	Part of the company would just say we should open-source the sim, but that's another discussion I'd like to avoid
[17:38]	Sindy Tsure changes the subject and asks about the status of avatars on physical/phantom objects..
[17:38]	Arawn Spitteler:	Open Grid is held largely at Zero Hour, for that discussion.
[17:38]	Sindy Tsure:	think i heard a week or so ago that you had fixes for stuff there, fixes i'm drooling after..
[17:38]	Arawn Spitteler:	Sitting Avatars take the properties of the object they're linked to, until we get Het-Links
[17:39]	Simon Linden:	Yep, that's the place to push them. But if you do have simulator LSL function or feature requests, definitely write up a jira and see if you get public support
[17:39]	Sindy Tsure:	not recently, arawn..
[17:39]	Arawn Spitteler:	No?
[17:39]	Arawn Spitteler:	Phantom Prims should turn us as phantom as any linden
[17:40]	Simon Linden:	I think there was push-back on that - it was an easy way to avoid collisions in combat sims
[17:40]	Rex Cronon:	really arawn? than everybody will just have to sit in a damage enabled area:)
[17:40]	Sindy Tsure:	http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2485
[17:41]	Sindy Tsure:	push back? you mean it may not go in?
[17:41]	Carricre Wind:	so what? there are always people who want to cheat, why stop them? the people who want to play fair waaaay out number them, let the community police itself
[17:41]	Simon Linden:	That should be in the next simulator update
[17:42]	Sindy Tsure:	do you know when it'll be on the beta grid?
[17:42]	Arawn Spitteler wonders, if a space would make it easier to open http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2485
[17:42]	Simon Linden:	I'm guessing next week, but not sure
[17:42]	Sindy Tsure:	k!
[17:42]	Sindy Tsure:	ty
[17:42]	Carricre Wind:	Damage Area, sheesh, since the non-phys bullets came out does anyone even use those anymore? I'm not seen a damage area in a year at least I think
[17:42]	Teravus Ousley:	they do use them :D
[17:42]	Simon Linden:	Arawn - did that not open? I clicked on both and the SL viewer opened OK (I'm using the latest RC)
[17:43]	Sindy Tsure too
[17:43]	Carricre Wind:	why? it's pointless, the damage system is at this poit, puff you're dead, using a scripted combat system is much more fun and realistic at this point
[17:43]	Arawn Spitteler:	I'm on RC-11, and it opened after I added the space
[17:43]	Simon Linden:	Hmm, odd - Windows?
[17:43]	Sindy Tsure watches carrirce argue 'realistic' with the purple talking dragon
[17:44]	Sindy Tsure:	:)
[17:44]	Carricre Wind smirk
[17:44]	Arawn Spitteler:	Windows, my click to open's been hit or miss, lately
[17:44]	Sindy Tsure:	in a suit..
[17:44]	Carricre Wind:	at least he's got good wings :)
[17:44]	Sindy Tsure giggles
[17:44]	Teravus Ousley:	why thank you.
[17:44]	Teravus Ousley:	:D
[17:44]	Sindy Tsure:	have a question on temp prims, which came up in the forums...
[17:44]	Simon Linden:	ok...?
[17:45]	Sindy Tsure:	there was discussion on how many could be used - do they come out of the 15k that sims get for 'stuff in the sim' or are they in the attachment/vehicle pool?
[17:45]	Sindy Tsure:	or is there just 15k total for everything. period.
[17:46]	Arawn Spitteler also has question, if monitoring their life expectancy is a burden, or just replacing: Temp On Rez is suppposed to be from the Vehicle Pool
[17:46]	Simon Linden:	There's some headroom above 15000 for temp prims - I think it's 256 extra are allowed, but not sure of the exact number
[17:47]	Sindy Tsure looks at her 166-prim hair..
[17:47]	Teravus Ousley notes that the max value for total sim prims is 45000. After 45000, the value becomes negative.
[17:47]	Arawn Spitteler:	I recall 1000 for temp and vehicle, in the Sims, and a quarter that in null sims, but am less of an expert
[17:47]	Arawn Spitteler:	Prim Hair is another issue, but doesn't burden the 16,000 limit
[17:47]	Sindy Tsure:	45k???
[17:47]	Simon Linden:	Yes, pretty much everything is 1/4 on OpenSpace sims
[17:48]	Heather Goodliffe:	seems like resources are a lot less than 1/4 on open spaces
[17:48]	Simon Linden:	I'd have to double-check, but I think attachments on AVs don't count
[17:48]	Teravus Ousley was testing the max value that you could possibly send from a simulator to a client.
[17:48]	Sindy Tsure:	oh.. 256 for temp prims, above the 15k..
[17:48]	Sindy Tsure:	does trying to rez more than that cause older temp prims to poof or does it eat into other pools?
[17:49]	Simon Linden:	I'm pretty sure it will start zapping old temp prims to make space
[17:49]	Sindy Tsure:	almost done.. :) there was also talk about having to have free prims on the parcel before you could make temp prims. is that true?
[17:50]	Sindy Tsure had never heard of that one.
[17:50]	Simon Linden:	Hmm, I'm not sure, but if you're really hitting the limit that often or staying that close to it, you're likely to hit some problem sooner or later
[17:51]	Sindy Tsure nods
[17:51]	Harleen Gretzky:	Strife Onizuka commented this on VWR-1048, don't know if it is true: Sims currently support 30,000 prims (just that 15000 of them are reserved for attachments).
[17:51]	Simon Linden:	It very well might block you at 15000 - it may not know the prim is temp until it rezzes it, so there's a chicken vs. egg problem here
[17:52]	Sindy Tsure:	hm..
[17:52]	Arawn Spitteler posits Maxwell's Demon of the Second Life Kind
[17:52]	Simon Linden:	Well, before Andrew did some of the fixes enforcing prim limits, we had some that were 40,000 and more
[17:52]	Sindy Tsure:	don't have the forums thread handy but i'm pretty sure they said it was somehow limited by what you had free on the parcel, regardless of what the sim had free
[17:52]	Teravus Ousley has also played with the client at 45,000 prims in a sim before.. the client generally renders at 0.5fps :P
[17:53]	Simon Linden:	Before you could get around some of the limits by using the prim bouns value
[17:53]	Simon Linden:	Yes, that many objects is a lot to draw
[17:53]	Carricre Wind wonders if the render issue is caused by poor caching on the client side
[17:53]	Teravus Ousley:	nah, it's a lot to draw, like Simon says.
[17:53]	Sindy Tsure:	last question.. anybody mind if i quote this specific part of the conversation in the LL forums?
[17:54]	Carricre Wind:	well, hardware is getting better, much better than it was 5 years ago for certain
[17:54]	Carricre Wind:	not at all Simon :)
[17:54]	Original Prim:	I liked the image with millions of prims on a sim. What was that about?
[17:55]	Arawn Spitteler wonders if that Crae Fellow will operate his own simulator...
[17:55]	Simon Linden:	Sindy - it's probably going to be posted on Andrew's transcripts anyway
[17:55]	Sindy Tsure:	good point - i'll point people there.. :)
[17:55]	Sindy Tsure:	less work for me
[17:55]	Teravus Ousley isn't sure if the question is for him or someone else from Original Prim
[17:55]	Carricre Wind:	ack, Sindy I meant, sheesh, moar cafe......
[17:55]	Arawn Spitteler:	You might want to do exerpts, to point out what you think relevant
[17:56]	Original Prim:	it was a general question. I remember a while back someone at LL released a picture of a sim with millions of prims
[17:56]	Original Prim:	I'm not sure if it was real or conceptual
[17:56]	Sindy Tsure:	either way, i bet it was slow..
[17:57]	Simon Linden:	yeah, I can only imagine the amout of network traffic and updates that would generate
[17:57]	Carricre Wind has always wonders, if the difference in vertice counts of a cube v. a tube v. a sculptie is concidered in the render issue
[17:57]	Teravus Ousley:	yeah, I bet it was slow.. It might be possible by dedicating a full server with extra processors and memory to it... and removing the block on the limit.
[17:57]	Arawn Spitteler:	So, a linden could do it, by isolating the sim from Updates and Networks
[17:57]	Simon Linden:	I'm not sure what you mean by considered, but triangle count is definitely an issue
[17:58]	Carricre Wind:	why update constantly? why not only when something changes?
[17:58]	Sindy Tsure:	apparently it was here, original.. pictures are gone, tho :( http://forums.secondlife.com/showthread.php?p=441441
[17:58]	Arawn Spitteler has heard of Triangles, but doesn't know what they're about.
[17:58]	Teravus Ousley:	each prim is made up of a group of triangles
[17:58]	Teravus Ousley:	.. and each avatar is made up of a group of triangles
[17:58]	Simon Linden:	Our sims currently don't use multiple processors very well ... it's something I want to work on. I'd love to make it so we could put a popular region on a computer by itself and get significantly better performance
[17:58]	Carricre Wind:	I meant considered by them that bitch about prim limits ;)
[17:59]	Teravus Ousley:	the triangles represent a part of the face of a prim/avatar
[17:59]	Simon Linden:	Yes, all prims are not equal :)
[17:59]	Teravus Ousley:	.. an un-cut cube, for example, has 6 sides, but those six sides are split into triangles
[17:59]	Simon Linden:	A twisted torus is definitely a lot more to draw (and calculate in physics) than a simple box
[18:00]	Teravus Ousley:	.. two triangles..
[18:00]	Simon Linden:	OK, I have to run folks .... have a meeting with The Boss next.
[18:00]	Simon Linden:	Thanks to everyone for coming
[18:00]	Sindy Tsure:	M??
[18:00]	Sindy Tsure:	get me a bear!!
[18:00]	Rex Cronon:	bye simon
[18:00]	Sindy Tsure:	:)
[18:00]	Simon Linden:	No, a few levels down
[18:00]	Teravus Ousley:	k, take care :D hehe. M
[18:00]	Sindy Tsure:	cya, simon! ty!
[18:00]	Carricre Wind:	bye Simon, and everyone :)