User:Andrew Linden/Office Hours/2009 09 17

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  • [2009/09/17 16:56] xstorm Radek: hi Simon
  • [2009/09/17 16:56] Ardy Lay: Welcome to your office, Simon. :-)
  • [2009/09/17 16:56] Arawn Spitteler: Hi, Reddot, What's the algorhythm in the script you sent?
  • [2009/09/17 16:56] Simon Linden: Hello everyone
  • [2009/09/17 16:56] Arawn Spitteler: Hi, Simon
  • [2009/09/17 16:57] xstorm Radek: Simon please do not get mad at me but i think i broke support
  • [2009/09/17 16:57] reddot99 Republic: it was cubey terra's
  • [2009/09/17 16:57] Simon Linden: hmm, that sounds ominous
  • [2009/09/17 16:57] Simon Linden: what happened?
  • [2009/09/17 16:57] Neo Nino: Hey Simon
  • [2009/09/17 16:58] xstorm Radek: well at first i was getting the feeling i broke some TOS and got blacklisted
  • [2009/09/17 16:58] Simon Linden: Hello ... andrew is fighting a minor crisis but should be here soon
  • [2009/09/17 16:58] xstorm Radek: :-S
  • [2009/09/17 16:58] reddot99 Republic: k,
  • [2009/09/17 16:58] Arawn Spitteler's been known to crash Crash Me Island, like that: I'm wondering how to set a vehicle, so it returns automatically, where it belongs, rather than being returnd by rangers. I'll probavbly learn something about Landmarks.
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] xstorm Radek: my inventory was not working, stuff got return and then i did try live chat and it did not work
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] reddot99 Republic: get it to move to 4097
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] reddot99 Republic: meters
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] xstorm Radek: so there was not any thing to click on for live chat
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] reddot99 Republic: will return itself
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.791428s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] Simon Linden: also far underground does it, I think
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.791652s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 16:59] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.789744s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Panel 3: Freeze of 1.620326s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Panel 3: Freeze of 2.057796s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.582075s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] reddot99 Republic: yeah, but that can fail easier
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Arawn Spitteler: I want it to return to a location, rather than returning to my inventory
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Meeter: Welcome to Linden office hours
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Twisted Laws: at least the lsl and mono versions seem to say close to the same time all the time
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Morgaine Dinova: Oh great, sitting is broken here too
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Morgaine Dinova: Hiya Simon!
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.933932s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.996275s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] xstorm Radek: so i was getting the feeling LL hated me
  • [2009/09/17 17:00] Simon Linden: hmmm, I don't think the chairs have changed at all
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] Morgaine Dinova: Simon: why is sitting broken all across the grid? Everyone is sitting embedded in their seats
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] xstorm Radek: even land tools had stop working
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] Morgaine Dinova: Everywhere
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] Charlette Proto: no Simon the chairs look as ugly as ever
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] reddot99 Republic: thats veiwerside
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] Arawn Spitteler: Linden Labs doesn't hate you, XStorm; it has a vast computer system to do that for them
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] Simon Linden: Interesting ... there was a roll-out of the 1.30 central servers today, along with the pilot regions
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] xstorm Radek: :-S
  • [2009/09/17 17:01] Simon Linden: THat's the back-end servers plus one rack of regions
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Panic Xenobuilder: +rounding error servers
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] xstorm Radek: O M G NO
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Simon Linden: I think we're still on the old one here, let me check...
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Morgaine Dinova: Well of course the sitting is viewer side, but this affects everyone regardless of viewers used --- and everyone is now sitting embedded
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Charlette Proto: 1.30 is at my home and works OK for me
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Simon Linden: yeah, we're on 1.27 here.
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] reddot99 Republic: i dont see that morgaine
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Charlette Proto: surprised it isn't up here yet
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] reddot99 Republic: only a couple people
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Simon Linden: but you're definitely sitting low today
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] Arawn Spitteler: I don't think I should be sitting like this, with the splinters through my cheeks, so, so something's out of kilter, likely. 1.30.1 coming up
  • [2009/09/17 17:02] xstorm Radek: Simon if LL has to reset my date and info yet again can they please not mess up the billing this time ?
  • [2009/09/17 17:03] Simon Linden: xstorm -- I hope they don't mess up, but I really don't know about that issue
  • [2009/09/17 17:03] Morgaine Dinova: Well it's more obvious on tines, but I assure you, you're all sitting too low. Just hard to see in these chairs. Try a box!
  • [2009/09/17 17:03] Arawn Spitteler: Find which office, and send flowers
  • [2009/09/17 17:03] Simon Linden: Morgaine - do you have any new attachments or anything?
  • [2009/09/17 17:03] Yuu Nakamichi: hi all
  • [2009/09/17 17:03] xstorm Radek: hi yuu
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Patty1 Rosca: hi andwer
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Yuu Nakamichi: oh there's andrew
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.822417s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.848308s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Andrew Linden: I made it
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Morgaine Dinova: Simon: lemme check
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Arawn Spitteler: Hi, Andrew
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Yuu Nakamichi: :0
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Charlette Proto: so what is the best thing on 1.3 Simon?
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Techwolf Lupindo: I"me still using the same viewers, but there was a stange thing happing at hippo at the open source meeting.
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Andrew Linden: whoops, I was going to try to update the release notes. I didn't get to that.
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Andrew Linden: Did we ever release more informative notes?
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Andrew Linden: Anybody know?
  • [2009/09/17 17:04] Arawn Spitteler: Have we a Jira, for sitting too low?
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Charlette Proto: NDA!!!
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Charlette Proto: sorry
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Simon Linden: I don't know, I'd have to look at the release notes (if we have 'em)
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Morgaine Dinova: Simon: the only thing I've changed in months was a new attachment monitoring the freezes. I've removed that, and still sitting low
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Techwolf Lupindo: I tp, sat down. After a while some folks started chattting. I started to type and I literlly floated up about 2m. I though it was wiered client side bug, but everyone else saw it.
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Simon Linden: yeah, that's odd
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Simon Linden: Andrew - any ideas what would change the sit height like that?
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Charlette Proto: wow Tech that is weird
  • [2009/09/17 17:05] Ardy Lay: Happening to us over here too.
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Andrew Linden: No this is the first I've heard of it. Could someone repeate the symptoms?
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Charlette Proto: did you press page up by mistake or one of the ASWD keys
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Simon Linden: Look at how low Morgaine is sitting
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Morgaine Dinova: It's only been happening 2-3 days
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Arawn Spitteler: Look where I'm sitting, and there seems to be a maladjustment
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Techwolf Lupindo: rez a block on the table and someone sit on it.
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Morgaine Dinova: We've noticed it at OHs, and various people have commented
  • [2009/09/17 17:06] Charlette Proto: I bet you were out of the text entry box Tech
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] Andrew Linden: Yes I see.
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] xstorm Radek: hi Andrew
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] Simon Linden: We're on Second Life Server 1.27.2.129782 here
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] Andrew Linden: So the sit position is too low across the board?
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] Andrew Linden: For everyone, I mean?
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] reddot99 Republic: i had no issues
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] Arawn Spitteler: What part of the code is out of whack, but how it got whacked might be more imortant
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] Techwolf Lupindo: I have a feeling it tp from a 1.30 to 1.27 that is triggering it. I was on a 1.30 sim.
  • [2009/09/17 17:07] Simon Linden: The chairs seem OK for full-sized AVs
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Ardy Lay: Seems okay for me now but I fuirst noticed it yesterday.
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Morgaine Dinova: Yes, it's not just tinies. Just more noticeabe on tinies, like the offset is doubled
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] xstorm Radek: ok Andrew what ever you have broken on me can you please fix ;-)
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Charlette Proto: tinies always have sitting troubles
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Simon Linden: Yesterday was before any of the 1.30 rollout, so that shouldn't have done it hten
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Morgaine Dinova: Tinies have always sat perfectly here though
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Charlette Proto: sit on my lap Morgaine and you will see over the table
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Latif Khalifa: andrew, the plot regions that have 1.30 show this for release notes (if you can call them that) http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_Server/1.30
  • [2009/09/17 17:08] Morgaine Dinova: lol
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Andrew Linden: Morgaine, have you noticed correlation? 1.27 still works but 1.30 is consistently broken?
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Morgaine Dinova: Andrew: not correlated, sorry :-(
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Sindy Tsure drops a sheep on simon
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Sindy Tsure: hello
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Ardy Lay: Now that was a hech of a shot on my part. :-)
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Simon Linden: hey, welcome back
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Chair: Press Page Up to move chair up, or Page Down to move chair down
  • [2009/09/17 17:09] Sindy Tsure: hi
  • [2009/09/17 17:10] Andrew Linden: Well, Morgaine if you could give me a copy of your small blue cat avatar I'm willing to look into it next week.
  • [2009/09/17 17:10] Morgaine Dinova: I doubt it's copiable, lemme look
  • [2009/09/17 17:10] Charlette Proto: haha andrew as a cat tiny
  • [2009/09/17 17:10] Arawn Spitteler: It can't be 1.30, since we're in a 1.27 sim
  • [2009/09/17 17:10] Andrew Linden: yeah, those release notes suck
  • [2009/09/17 17:10] Charlette Proto: I'd like to see that
  • [2009/09/17 17:11] xstorm Radek: sorry sindy i removed your sheep
  • [2009/09/17 17:11] Andrew Linden: oh are we? hrm
  • [2009/09/17 17:11] Simon Linden: The timing mentioned on this is odd ... we did do the 1.30 pilot roll today, but I don't think there's been anything else changed in the past few days
  • [2009/09/17 17:11] Andrew Linden: Arawn is right
  • [2009/09/17 17:11] Latif Khalifa: i am noticing nothing different about sitting positions, just tested with a different avatar on my home sim
  • [2009/09/17 17:11] Andrew Linden: well... we did roll all central servers, but I can't see how they would be related to sitting
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] Arawn Spitteler: I've been having a hard time lining up the sit target on my vehicle, mostly having thestern up my spine
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] Morgaine Dinova: No transfer, sorry Andrew. But this isn't specific to any one tiny, we've been seeing all tinies massively affected, and also full height avs --- just less.
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] Simon Linden: There was a configuration file changed for the 1.27 regions as well, but that should have been one minor tweak that wouldn't affect sit height
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] JaneD DeCuir: rezzing
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] Arawn Spitteler: Hi, JAneD
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] xstorm Radek: well our sim is not updated yet
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] JaneD DeCuir: Hello Arawn
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] Sindy Tsure: did you ao off/ao on.. sometimes cycling it makes ao's work better
  • [2009/09/17 17:12] Andrew Linden: Ok so I had a few announcements...
  • [2009/09/17 17:13] xstorm Radek: and lots of odd stuff is going on
  • [2009/09/17 17:13] JaneD DeCuir: this actual serverversion lag a lot... im asking me what the company aims with
  • [2009/09/17 17:13] Andrew Linden: Last week, or maybe it was also Tuesday, we were talking about some "text on prim face" feature ideas
  • [2009/09/17 17:14] Sindy Tsure votes for that
  • [2009/09/17 17:14] Arawn Spitteler: Text Onb A FAce would be wonderful
  • [2009/09/17 17:14] Charlette Proto: I'd love text on prim face, one of my pet subjects
  • [2009/09/17 17:14] Techwolf Lupindo: One thing I forgot to mechined last time is if text on a prim is done, make sure it support more then English.
  • [2009/09/17 17:14] Neo Nino: Oh that would be wonderful, would we be able to specify the font?
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Andrew Linden: I asked one of the other LL developers about it, in context of some "media on a prim" stuff that is going to be part of the new viewer that has been under wraps
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Neo Nino: would it work like css or is it going to be a texture rendition of a font?
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Panel 3: Freeze of 3.061743s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Panel 3: Freeze of 3.105570s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.622722s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Charlette Proto: I believe one should be able to mix fonts too, eg make a whole poster
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Andrew Linden: I think Tom Hale (VP of something here at LL) mentioned the media on a prim stuff at SLCC so I can kinda talk about it now
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Simon Linden: It would probably be using utf-8 text and fonts, with the actual messages set by scripters, so I don't see any problem with languages there
  • [2009/09/17 17:15] Aimee Trescothick: yes, he demonstrated sever media textures at once
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Techwolf Lupindo: llmedia plugin is just about to be comminted to snowglobe trunk.
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.692207s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.692207s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Andrew Linden: So "media on a prim" is a per-prim-face setting, not to be confused with "media on a parcel".
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Andrew Linden: The idea is to get HTML pages on prim faces.
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Aimee Trescothick: \o/ \o/ \o/
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Latif Khalifa: :D
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Arawn Spitteler coud use Cuneiform in his Burning Life Build, if a translator could be found
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Neo Nino: Nice, what sort of time frame are we looking at?
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Aimee Trescothick: that's the answer we've been trying to get since the demo! :D
  • [2009/09/17 17:16] Andrew Linden: It was mentioned that once that is working then it might not be too hard to get LSL scritps to post HTML which could target certain prim faces
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.503298s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Charlette Proto: one could treat prim face text as HTML CSS style references scaled to fit the face of the prim like a web page
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] reddot99 Republic: are you going to make flash run on a prim face? allong with a full keyboard capture?
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Andrew Linden: and that would provide much of the "text on a prim" functionality that we were talking about
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.609176s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.621815s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Aimee Trescothick: thought it was coming as I'd seen comments in the source, but wasn't sure if they were just a "some day maybe"
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Latif Khalifa: great news!
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Andrew Linden: I don't know all the features, bells, and whistles of the media on a prim stuff
  • [2009/09/17 17:17] Sindy Tsure: er..
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Andrew Linden: it was mentioned by Tom Hale, however few people really noticed the significance of his announcement
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Sindy Tsure hates to be the perpetual downer but i remember hearing about html on a prim back when i started..
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Techwolf Lupindo: Oh dear...flash on a prim. I can see it now. Walk into a sim and have a 5 minute frezzes while all the dozons of flash prims load up.
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Andrew Linden: you can find a few blogs about it, but not very many
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Aimee Trescothick did ;)
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.617195s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Andrew Linden: yes Sindy, Callum Linden was talking about media on a prim back in 2007
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Charlette Proto: media/Tube players do it well, but HTML is sourced from outside and it may not beefficient besides limited to one page per parcel
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] reddot99 Republic: lol, that could be an issue,
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Neo Nino: hmmm speaking of Flash, is it coming to the SL web browser any time soon?
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Andrew Linden: it took this long to do it
  • [2009/09/17 17:18] Object: Hello, Avatar!
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Object: Hello, Avatar!
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Aimee Trescothick: hence http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtHO4AtVSwc :)
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Charlette Proto: nobody wants Flash sorry
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Andrew Linden: some of that time was just Callum working on the side without a team
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] reddot99 Republic: it would help,
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Charlette Proto: give us CSS and Javascript
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] xstorm Radek: hellow script in prim
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Morgaine Dinova: Flash on a prim hasn't been mentioned yet, but with the influx of Adobe people into LL, that nightmare is going to come at some point, guaranteed.
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Simon Linden: Actually, lots of people want it, but it's a pain to get right
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Neo Nino: Charlotte, whilst js and css is great, there are some things that are still way cooler with Flash :P
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Rex Cronon: like there is not enough lag here. we really need flash to have more?
  • [2009/09/17 17:19] Neo Nino: Flash in SL Browser won't affect lag
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Neo Nino: it's straight to your viewer
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Simon Linden: It will still burn up some of your CPU power
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Rex Cronon: flash lags my browser:(
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Arawn Spitteler: It could give a wole new sense to Flasher type Griefing
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Techwolf Lupindo: Flash is a client side hog.
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] reddot99 Republic: flash outside the veiwer is slow enough with sl open
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Latif Khalifa: well it will be like a web page, you just don't visit ones with overload of flashy things, it sort of regulates itself
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Charlette Proto: cooler? maybe but JavaScript is better as a language
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Andrew Linden: Actually, the media on a prim (MOAP) will cost some render perfomrance on the viewer, expeciall in places with lots of faces using it
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Sindy Tsure: isn't there already a browser built into the viewer? if that spits out rendered html, you can't map that onto a prim face?
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Aimee Trescothick: but at least each media stream will be in a separate thread with the new plug-in architecture
  • [2009/09/17 17:20] Neo Nino: yeah but the audience won't know that. Youtube can't play with js alone hun.
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Aimee Trescothick: I have 15 cores sat there doing nothing most of the time :D
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Morgaine Dinova: Flash is a total nightmare for a pile of reasons. not the least being security --- there are exploits against it continually.
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Aimee Trescothick: well, 7.5
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Panel 3: Freeze of 1.823158s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Panel 3: Freeze of 1.897248s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Latif Khalifa: Neo, yes it can with html5, try this with crhrome http://www.youtube.com/html5
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Andrew Linden: Aimee, the work you did with VNC, was that using the MOAP code?
  • [2009/09/17 17:21] Charlette Proto: agree with Morgaine FLASH is super lame
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] reddot99 Republic: erm, flash isnt too bad, it used to be regulated with quicktime,
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Aimee Trescothick: that's using the public plugin-api branch
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Neo Nino: Latif, yeah I know of html5... so we're going to wait till html5 becomes standard?
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Andrew Linden: ah ok
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Aimee Trescothick: but will be a lot more useful when moap comes along
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Techwolf Lupindo: malware/spammer wet dream, just take a walk though the welcome areas and pawn dozons of computer with each walk.
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] reddot99 Republic: that got dropped when macromedia got bought out though
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Simon Linden: Flash is a lot like SL content - it's really up to the builder to make it good or not
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Charlette Proto: FLASH in Second Life™ discussion closed for now even if you spend your life commenting on Tube Neo sorry
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Morgaine Dinova: Simon: how can the builder make Flash secure?
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Latif Khalifa: well if the viewer switches over to webkit, you get html5 meia extensions for free
  • [2009/09/17 17:22] Latif Khalifa: media
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Sindy Tsure sees a couple freeze detector thingies.. any news on SVC-4196 / SVC-4619 ?
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-4619
  • [#SVC-4619] unable to teleport
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-4196
  • [#SVC-4196] Avatar entering sim or rezzing object causes sim to freeze for up to 30 seconds - everything stops for everybody there
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Maggie Darwin: I don't think anything from Adobe will ever be secure again.
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Sindy Tsure: * SVC-4619 / SVC-4616
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-4616
  • [#SVC-4616] sim stalls when people who are a bit prim and/or script heavy TP in (or log in or fly in, etc)
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Simon Linden: The same way a web page builder would - cross domain security, or control over what Flash (or HTML, for that matter) is used
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Andrew Linden: The other thing I thought I would mention is that I was going to try to take a swing at SVC-93 today but came in to work with a no-copy permissions exploit on my plate and had to fix that instead.
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-93
  • [#SVC-93] llSetPrimitiveParams PRIM_ROTATION and llSetRot incorrectly implemented for child prims
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Morgaine Dinova: Flash is the reason #1 for all audio lockups on Linux too.
  • [2009/09/17 17:23] Neo Nino: yes... about the freeze... I understand that scripts is part of the reason...
  • [2009/09/17 17:24] reddot99 Republic: flash has gone downhill since adobe bought it
  • [2009/09/17 17:24] Charlette Proto: good that you did andrew, permissions are priority
  • [2009/09/17 17:24] Latif Khalifa: i am really happy just to get plain old html on a prim face
  • [2009/09/17 17:24] Charlette Proto: agree with Latif
  • [2009/09/17 17:24] Morgaine Dinova: Agreed
  • [2009/09/17 17:24] Sindy Tsure: yepo
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Charlette Proto: scale page width to prim width and we are all happy
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Morgaine Dinova: In fact, the entire Internet started going downhill once plain HTML was abandoned, lol
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Maggie Darwin: Except those that enter regions wearing Mono scripts
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Andrew Linden: They were hoping to get the new viewer released this year, but it is not clear now whether that will happen or if it will slip into 2010.
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Latif Khalifa: it will really be a revouliton of what kind of integreted apps you could build in sl, notice boards, informations, etc etc
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Techwolf Lupindo: Leave flash and all that crap to the llmedia plugin and just do a basic html on a face.
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Charlette Proto: agree again - nothing worse than Flash websites
  • [2009/09/17 17:25] Neo Nino: Andrew, does it make a difference whether the avie is wearing a bunch of lso scripts or Mono scripts?
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Neo Nino: ... I mean as it affects teleport time
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Maggie Darwin: Of course it will slip. You named it "2009". Kiss of death.
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Arawn Spitteler: lso?
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Sindy Tsure thought the word from babbage was that it was only bad if the script hadn't already been rezzed on the region
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Rex Cronon: hmm. ll also use flash:)
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Neo Nino: pre-Mono compile
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Andrew Linden: BTW, I was watching the "Back to the Future" movies the other day and they had tabletop fusion and flying cars in 2015. We've only got 5 more years to go.
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Charlette Proto: haha Maggie, I also expect SL09 in 2010
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Latif Khalifa: hahaha
  • [2009/09/17 17:26] Maggie Darwin: Sindy: Make sure you only go places you've already been.
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Latif Khalifa: not gonna happen andrew ;)
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Sindy Tsure: "[8:14] Babbage Linden: it may be caused by verification of the scripts digital signature on load
  • [8:14] Babbage Linden: although that should only happen the first time a script is rezzed in a region
  • "
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Arawn Spitteler: Oh, Linden Scripting Language, as opposed to London Symphony Orchestra
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Latif Khalifa: like we didn't get hal9000 in 2000
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Charlette Proto: we can have fusion reactors and flying cars in Second Life™ for now Andrew
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Maggie Darwin: It absolutely amazes me that at this late date its still "well, it moght be this, or it might be that"
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Neo Nino: Sindy, was that about the sim freeze? Or about TP time, or both?
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Maggie Darwin: Freaking hook up a debiugger and find out what it is,
  • [2009/09/17 17:27] Andrew Linden: Neo, you were asking if LSL vs MONO scripts on avatar attachments affect something? What was that "something"? TP-arrival lag?
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Neo Nino: yes TP-arrival lag
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Neo Nino: or even TP failure
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Sindy Tsure: that was somebody quoting him in SVC-3895 - related to the sim freezes
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-3895
  • [#SVC-3895] Rezzing Mono scripted object cripples sim FPS
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Maggie Darwin: Or borderr crossing
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Charlette Proto: where did the LSO ref for LSL start???
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Andrew Linden: I don't know for sure. Perhaps Simon knows?
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.692320s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.712923s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Neo Nino: it's probably related to sim freezes, but from the avie's perspective
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Panic Xenobuilder: and i expect to see the number of LSL functions double before 2012 , full LSL access to viewer UI and stuff like that
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Simon Linden: I don't know :(
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Andrew Linden: Rumor has it that MONO scripts are more problematic than LSL. I haven't seen the data.
  • [2009/09/17 17:28] Neo Nino: Yes
  • [2009/09/17 17:29] Sindy Tsure: so.. no news about the sim freezes?
  • [2009/09/17 17:29] Neo Nino: What does Panel 3 detect actually?
  • [2009/09/17 17:29] Maggie Darwin: Not a priority, I suppose.
  • [2009/09/17 17:29] Simon Linden: Nothing really concrete, although it's at least reached some exec attention
  • [2009/09/17 17:29] Neo Nino: Sim freeze not a priority?
  • [2009/09/17 17:29] Charlette Proto: sim freezzes neo
  • [2009/09/17 17:30] Sindy Tsure: after only 3 months of people screaming about it..
  • [2009/09/17 17:30] Simon Linden: I'm supposed to get back onto simulator stuff (including performance) after I finish the-project-that-must-not-be-named
  • [2009/09/17 17:30] Meeter: Timecheck : office hours is half over
  • [2009/09/17 17:30] Maggie Darwin: We're busy figuring out how to charge script memory to parcels.
  • [2009/09/17 17:30] Andrew Linden: [17:27] Maggie Darwin: Freaking hook up a debiugger and find out what it is,
  • [2009/09/17 17:31] Arawn Spitteler: Already? We'ven't mentioned SVC-22 or SVC-2931 yet, let alone Scripted Prim Torture
  • [2009/09/17 17:31] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2931
  • [#SVC-2931] llSetLinkPrimitiveParams content breakage, only moves agents 54 meters now
  • [2009/09/17 17:31] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-22
  • [#SVC-22] Vehicles crossing region borders aren't always treated as vehicles and can get incorrectly returned if the destination parcel is no-entry or parcel-full
  • [2009/09/17 17:31] Andrew Linden: Maggie, that is actually pretty funny.
  • [2009/09/17 17:31] Sindy Tsure: well, it is really, really, really easy to reproduce
  • [2009/09/17 17:31] Maggie Darwin: You can't run a region against a debugger?
  • [2009/09/17 17:32] Andrew Linden: The lag block on TP arrival?
  • [2009/09/17 17:32] Object: Hello, Avatar!
  • [2009/09/17 17:32] Sindy Tsure: the whole sim locking up on tp arrival
  • [2009/09/17 17:32] reddot99 Republic: cant have it spit everything into a log?
  • [2009/09/17 17:32] xstorm Radek: what person or server can i blame for all my bugs to day ?
  • [2009/09/17 17:32] Maggie Darwin: Or border crossing.
  • [2009/09/17 17:33] Neo Nino: So it'sI'm surprised Panel 3 only records 1 second of freezing. I've seen more than 15 seconds mostly.
  • [2009/09/17 17:33] Andrew Linden: Well, when the code is complex the debugger scrutiny is also complex. And it can be tough to grok long blocks in debugger step-through timescales.
  • [2009/09/17 17:33] Sindy Tsure too, neo.. on a busy night, i lose about 30 seconds every couple/few minutes
  • [2009/09/17 17:33] Morgaine Dinova: Neo, yeah, up to 15 seconds is every day. Latif has seen 60s though
  • [2009/09/17 17:33] Charlette Proto: maybe give residents a Top Scripts display and someone will find the TP freezze problem
  • [2009/09/17 17:33] Andrew Linden: But yeah, that's what we should do, just hook it up to a debugger.
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Maggie Darwin: Well, debugger use is an art,
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Charlette Proto: really don't see why residents and developers can't see script load
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Andrew Linden: Simon, you're better at the Visual Studio debugger than me. I'll let you do it.
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Neo Nino: Morgaine, 15seconds is everyday?
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Andrew Linden: All I know is GDB anyway.
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Morgaine Dinova: These freeze checkers we're running (all derived from Moon's code on the wiki) just generate max-rate events, and detect gaps between them long than 0.5s.
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Latif Khalifa: i record the freezes, my sim sees about 1 freeze over 30s every day
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] reddot99 Republic: lol andrew
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Neo Nino: I've seen 15 seconds as a minimum.
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Sindy Tsure does not like giving Andrew & Simon a hard time...
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] xstorm Radek: i hope LL know there is a ping problem from the east coast to the west coast of 225 ms
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Sindy Tsure: this bug is really painful, though.. and it's been happening since may
  • [2009/09/17 17:34] Simon Linden: yeah, the big problem I have debugging sims is that I can work well in visual studio, but sometimes the problem is different on our linux servers
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Maggie Darwin: I'd start with strace, actually, just to narrw stuff down
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Sindy Tsure has showed it to the concierge
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Sindy Tsure has shown it to a comsys guy
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Andrew Linden: It's only 100ms xstorm. At least from here to mit.edu
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Morgaine Dinova: LOL, you can't give someone a "hard time" by presenting actual measurements.
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Sindy Tsure has complained in every blog post she could
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Maggie Darwin: Dear Ghoddes......I though you were joking about VS.
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Maggie Darwin: You were serious.
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Latif Khalifa: i have 180ms from this sim to me (Copenhagen, Denmark)
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] xstorm Radek: your only getting 100 ?
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Arawn Spitteler: Tenth of a second is still pretty serious
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Sindy Tsure: the forums are full of people wondering what's going on
  • [2009/09/17 17:35] Simon Linden: I'm a zillion times faster developing on VS than under linux
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] xstorm Radek: im in CT and getting 225
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Andrew Linden: I can work under VS but it gives me a rash.
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Sindy Tsure sighs
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Latif Khalifa: VS is one of the greaest software products ever
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Maggie Darwin: Screw VS. That's a distraction.
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Latif Khalifa: one intellisense to rule them all
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Charlette Proto: weird xStorm, in aus I get 180 to 300 and this is a huge number of hops to get to Sydney
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Panel 3: Freeze of 2.246157s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:36] Panel 3: Freeze of 2.348521s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:37] Morgaine Dinova: It's true, everyone's wondering what's going on. It's not as if the freezes were minor. We get 10-second freezes many times an hour
  • [2009/09/17 17:37] Rex Cronon: vs=visual studio(the one made by ms?)
  • [2009/09/17 17:37] Maggie Darwin: Use a real debugger in the production environment
  • [2009/09/17 17:37] Andrew Linden: Yup, we've got someone working on that (not me).
  • [2009/09/17 17:37] reddot99 Republic: also, what is faster, reset a script or a filtered link message, if theree is just a single thing for a script to do?
  • [2009/09/17 17:37] Maggie Darwin: Which means no VS thenkewveddymuch.
  • [2009/09/17 17:37] Arawn Spitteler: What is Panel 3 talking about the London Symphony Orchestra for?
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] Ardy Lay: That's the old object code runtime.
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] Morgaine Dinova: Arawn: I think "LSO" was named so to distinguish the interpreted VM from the LSL language and scripts.
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] xstorm Radek gave you badping.
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] xstorm Radek: now thats a bad ping
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] Latif Khalifa: xstor, could be your isp
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] Arawn Spitteler: So it's the Linden Scripting Object something?
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] Latif Khalifa: i have 130ms across the atlantic from copenhagen
  • [2009/09/17 17:38] Simon Linden: yeah, somewhere there's a network that's not happy
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] xstorm Radek: no we had the ISP test the lines we have a lvl 3
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] reddot99 Republic: 500+ for me is normal,
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] Andrew Linden: xstorm, do you have a linux machine?
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] Latif Khalifa: which is really good ping for a cross atlantic link
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] xstorm Radek: no i have a graphic server
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] Latif Khalifa: anything under 200ms cross atlantic is good
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] Arawn Spitteler: Ping Sim 441 seconds
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] Morgaine Dinova: Something like that. In effect we have LSL/LSO and LSL/Mono. The same language and scripts run under two different runtimes or VMs.
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] Arawn Spitteler's in Connecticut too
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] Ardy Lay: Mine is usually in the 60 to 220 ms range.
  • [2009/09/17 17:39] xstorm Radek: Processor Quad-Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 1352, 2100 Mhz, 4 Core(s), 4 Logical Processor(s)
  • [2009/09/17 17:40] Panel 3: Freeze of 1.298037s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:40] Panel 3: Freeze of 1.298992s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:40] Arawn Spitteler: Are you on Optimum OnLine, XStorm?
  • [2009/09/17 17:40] Andrew Linden: well xstorm, if you had a UNIX environment you could perhaps run the 'mtr' command to see where your high pingtime is happening
  • [2009/09/17 17:40] xstorm Radek: CDSL
  • [2009/09/17 17:40] Andrew Linden: sometimes an ISP service will lengthen your packet times to reduce your bandwidth. It happend to me on a DSL line once.
  • [2009/09/17 17:41] Maggie Darwin: http://winmtr.sourceforge.net/
  • [2009/09/17 17:41] Maggie Darwin: for folks on Windows.
  • [2009/09/17 17:41] Simon Linden: tracert in the DOS windown can help too
  • [2009/09/17 17:41] reddot99 Republic: oh, thats cruel,
  • [2009/09/17 17:41] Andrew Linden: I had low ping times as long as my data rate was small. When I tried to use more the ping time would increase (but not go lossy) until I had hit the max bandwidth they had assigned me.
  • [2009/09/17 17:41] xstorm Radek: i was getting throttling from one of the SL server and do not know why
  • [2009/09/17 17:42] Simon Linden: open up a command window and enter 'tracert sim3235.agni.lindenlab.com'
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] Latif Khalifa: my mtr from here http://pastebin.ca/1570296
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] reddot99 Republic: oh, andrew, something related to the llsetdamage system, is there ever going to be a function to detect damage from a collision with a object?
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] Ardy Lay: GTS queuing
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] Latif Khalifa: funky that i have better ping from europe than folks in the us
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] Maggie Darwin: So, SVC-3895 has neatly 600 votes, but is still "Workingonit Linden", so lets talk about network lag from EU instead.
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] Maggie Darwin: *nearly
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] Rex Cronon: oh. yes. i would really like to know what kills me at rausch:)
  • [2009/09/17 17:43] Simon Linden: Often the worst lag is the last mile or two, not the big fiber cables connecting the backbone
  • [2009/09/17 17:44] Arawn Spitteler wonders where the Meeter is
  • [2009/09/17 17:44] Rex Cronon: or who do i kill:)
  • [2009/09/17 17:44] Simon Linden: It's that box on the fence
  • [2009/09/17 17:44] Arawn Spitteler: I didn't see the URL for SVC-3895, as expected. I don't think I'm more than 20 meters
  • [2009/09/17 17:44] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.572618s detected (Mono)
  • [2009/09/17 17:44] Panel 3: Freeze of 0.564919s detected (LSO)
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Andrew Linden: reddot99, I wonder how you would get a damage value returned per-collision.
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] reddot99 Republic: well, more for wanting to use a sheild that can tell the damage a bullet is set to,
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Maggie Darwin: Rezzing Mono scripted object cripples sim FPS
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Ardy Lay: Arawn, we already mention that one.
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Simon Linden: It may already have been mentioned earlier
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Maggie Darwin: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-3895
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Meeter: [#SVC-3895] Rezzing Mono scripted object cripples sim FPS
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Simon Linden: Did we get svc-22 yet?
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Ardy Lay: Yes
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Andrew Linden: Yeah, I think it was mentioned.
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] Maggie Darwin: Well, at this point they're related
  • [2009/09/17 17:45] reddot99 Republic: same way the veiwer tells perhaps?
  • [2009/09/17 17:46] Arawn Spitteler: I buzzed it when nobody was looking. is that related to the recent Sail Boat Crisis?
  • [2009/09/17 17:46] Latif Khalifa is wondering if TextureEntry part of object update messages will include media uri from now on
  • [2009/09/17 17:46] Maggie Darwin: I do not find having svc-22 compared to svc-3895 encouraging
  • [2009/09/17 17:47] Simon Linden: There's some relationship with the rez lagging, but there is a fundamental problem (or two+) with the way vehicles cross regions that needs attention
  • [2009/09/17 17:47] Maggie Darwin: I especially don;t like that Babbage seems to thing that SVC-22 being left as long as it does defines a new "correct operation" so he wants to charge script memorty against parcel quotas fpor vehicles.
  • [2009/09/17 17:47] Arawn Spitteler: [17:31] Arawn Spitteler: Already? We'ven't mentioned SVC-22 or SVC-2931 yet, let alone Scripted Prim Torture
  • [17:31] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2931
  • [#SVC-2931] llSetLinkPrimitiveParams content breakage, only moves agents 54 meters now
  • [17:31] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-22
  • [#SVC-22] Vehicles crossing region borders aren't always treated as vehicles and can get incorrectly returned if the destination parcel is no-entry or parcel-full
  • [2009/09/17 17:47] Meeter: [#SVC-2931] llSetLinkPrimitiveParams content breakage, only moves agents 54 meters now
  • [2009/09/17 17:47] Meeter: [#SVC-22] Vehicles crossing region borders aren't always treated as vehicles and can get incorrectly returned if the destination parcel is no-entry or parcel-full
  • [2009/09/17 17:48] Andrew Linden: We've got someone who will be looking into lag (and SVC-3895) for server-1.32
  • [2009/09/17 17:48] Andrew Linden: I would expect some progress there. The various LL brass have got the "we need to do something about lag" bee in their bonnet.
  • [2009/09/17 17:49] Andrew Linden: meanwhile, we should be hiring some new people soon
  • [2009/09/17 17:49] reddot99 Republic: andrew. would a lsl damage detection implementation be difficult? it seems to me like something far overdue
  • [2009/09/17 17:49] Maggie Darwin: They should be up to speed in 3-6 months.
  • [2009/09/17 17:49] Andrew Linden: I'll probably continue working on emergencies and hot potatoes
  • [2009/09/17 17:49] Andrew Linden: So soon? How long does it take Simon?
  • [2009/09/17 17:50] Neo Nino: good to hear that LL is increasing headcount
  • [2009/09/17 17:50] Maggie Darwin: IMHO, it means we need to broaden our definition of Legacy Code.
  • Legacy code is code that developers fear facing. Legacy code does not communicate its intent and has a very convoluted design. It is code with high viscosity which encourages sloppy job by the developers and makes it extremely difficult for them to do the right thing. Abundance of Code Smells, lack of Tests, long feedback cycles, unpredictability, etc : all of these are contributing factors.
  • [2009/09/17 17:50] Simon Linden: Depends on what 'up to speed' means. The old goal was to have new folks fix their first bug in the first week, but it's usually a very easy one
  • [2009/09/17 17:50] Maggie Darwin: http://blogs.agilefaqs.com/2009/09/16/redefining-legacy-code/
  • [2009/09/17 17:51] reddot99 Republic: ol,
  • [2009/09/17 17:51] reddot99 Republic: lol
  • [2009/09/17 17:51] Techwolf Lupindo: What about doing some headhunting of the folks that suplied bugfixes/patches?
  • [2009/09/17 17:51] Arawn Spitteler: Headhunting should be QA Heavy
  • [2009/09/17 17:51] Andrew Linden: interesting xstorm, you gave me a texture showing your ping times broken down by nodes of the path, and half of your 90ms duration is in the first hop
  • [2009/09/17 17:52] Latif Khalifa: its typical for bad isps
  • [2009/09/17 17:52] Simon Linden: The hiring is heavy for QA and core developers these days
  • [2009/09/17 17:52] Ardy Lay: Or broadband routers dealing with bittorrent.
  • [2009/09/17 17:52] xstorm Radek: looks like getting out of CT is the problem
  • [2009/09/17 17:52] Techwolf Lupindo: mtr is not working on my end. But ping works jjust fine.
  • [2009/09/17 17:52] Maggie Darwin: ping sim 97ms
  • [2009/09/17 17:52] Latif Khalifa: tech, mtr only works for root
  • [2009/09/17 17:53] xstorm Radek: my ping out is just 1 NS
  • [2009/09/17 17:53] Techwolf Lupindo: Latif, I have a root shell for that and more.
  • [2009/09/17 17:53] Simon Linden: Unfortunately it's still pretty hard to get good candidates ... the people we want to find usually aren't the one's laid off when the economy slows down
  • [2009/09/17 17:53] Andrew Linden: really? mtr works as my regular user on ubuntu
  • [2009/09/17 17:53] Latif Khalifa: on centos i get cannot use raw sockets as non-root
  • [2009/09/17 17:54] reddot99 Republic: simon, it is a way to get an army of devs quickly though
  • [2009/09/17 17:54] Maggie Darwin: What's it take to get a C++ coder laid off in 2009? :-)
  • [2009/09/17 17:54] Latif Khalifa: perhaps its setuid root on ubuntu
  • [2009/09/17 17:54] Simon Linden: I haven't found out yet, Maggie :)
  • [2009/09/17 17:54] Maggie Darwin: Rigor mortis, I'm guessing
  • [2009/09/17 17:54] Andrew Linden: ah so it is setuid
  • [2009/09/17 17:54] Techwolf Lupindo: I need to check on anther ISP. This one may be messing with it, if they are. File a complaint as teh FCC/FTC has ruled that messing with packets is not allowed.
  • [2009/09/17 17:55] xstorm Radek: Andrew if LL had a office in CT i can work as a mole just about non stop for min wage
  • [2009/09/17 17:55] reddot99 Republic: lol
  • [2009/09/17 17:55] Meeter: Timecheck : office hours is almost over
  • [2009/09/17 17:55] Morgaine Dinova: Andrew: Mtr is showing a continuous packet loss of 7-15% at ae-2.ebr3.Atlanta2.Level3.net --- that's only 3 hops from LINDEN-RESE, on your same backbone provider. Shouldn't you be giving them hell?
  • [2009/09/17 17:55] Andrew Linden: I'll pass that tip on to Michael Linden, xstorm
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] xstorm Radek: do to my CIDP blood disorder i can no longer work out side the home
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Maggie Darwin: Tech: Can you learn to layout roads on top of a sim border?
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Techwolf Lupindo lol
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Latif Khalifa: lolol
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Latif Khalifa: and bridges too lol
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Maggie Darwin: You too can be a Mole.
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Andrew Linden: lol
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Techwolf Lupindo: I've tried. Moles can only be in certion states.
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Latif Khalifa: that was the most moronic build i have ever seen
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Latif Khalifa: they build roads and bridges on zindra right spilt on region borders
  • [2009/09/17 17:56] Maggie Darwin: "Unconcious" seems to be one of them.
  • [2009/09/17 17:57] Techwolf Lupindo: Stupidest thing i've ever heard.
  • [2009/09/17 17:57] reddot99 Republic: you ought to consider a office in the triangle area of nc, tons and tons of devs there its a major software development area
  • [2009/09/17 17:57] Maggie Darwin: Can you colocate an airport and an infohub?
  • [2009/09/17 17:57] Maggie Darwin: You too can be a Mole.
  • [2009/09/17 17:57] Andrew Linden: I thought our legal/HR team was working on liberating all the states for hiring, but don't know the status of that project.
  • [2009/09/17 17:58] xstorm Radek: yes me and my wife are verry skilled at building
  • [2009/09/17 17:58] Simon Linden: I think the status is still 'don't hire in states we don't have an office in'
  • [2009/09/17 17:58] Arawn Spitteler: What isue do we write our congress critters about? I think this might even be a constitutional issue
  • [2009/09/17 17:58] reddot99 Republic: oh really? hows your health insurance plan, if you have one?
  • [2009/09/17 17:58] Latif Khalifa: there is a pilot project for QA right now ( i will particapate from denmark) they are still doing paperwork but so far so good
  • [2009/09/17 17:58] Simon Linden: Yeah, I've heard of some sub-contracting that may work around that restriction
  • [2009/09/17 17:58] Maggie Darwin: There's an office in Tennessee?
  • [2009/09/17 17:59] Andrew Linden: No office in Tennessee that I know of.
  • [2009/09/17 17:59] Maggie Darwin: That's where Prospero was, IIRC.
  • [2009/09/17 17:59] Andrew Linden: Oh right.
  • [2009/09/17 17:59] Latif Khalifa: there was an announcement on the viewer beta group for QA for the new viewer, so they selected 10 people from tha group who applied
  • [2009/09/17 17:59] Ardy Lay: I noticed the list of states got shorter
  • [2009/09/17 18:00] Latif Khalifa: I know that myself, Moon and Aimee are among those picked ;)
  • [2009/09/17 18:00] Meeter: Thank you for coming to Linden office hours
  • [2009/09/17 18:00] Morgaine Dinova: Is anyon else able to run mtr against this sim? ae-2.ebr3.Atlanta2.Level3.net is continuing to give up to 15% packet loss, en route to sim3235
  • [2009/09/17 18:00] Simon Linden: In any case, if you know of good candidates, send 'em to our web site. It does work sometimes
  • [2009/09/17 18:00] Ardy Lay: I have mty running, yes.
  • [2009/09/17 18:00] Ardy Lay: mtr
  • [2009/09/17 18:01] Latif Khalifa: Morg, I have 0% packet loss all across
  • [2009/09/17 18:01] Latif Khalifa: but my trace does not touch level3, its all thrugh above.net
  • [2009/09/17 18:01] Morgaine Dinova: Latif: are you going through ae-2.ebr3.Atlanta2.Level3.net ? It's just one bad router
  • [2009/09/17 18:01] Morgaine Dinova: Ah, there ya go
  • [2009/09/17 18:01] Ardy Lay: http://pastebin.com/d35385018
  • [2009/09/17 18:01] Andrew Linden: I can't help. I'm too close to the backbone, and we've got a devoted T3 link to our SF colo from our office, I think.
  • [2009/09/17 18:01] Latif Khalifa: morg: http://pastebin.ca/1570296
  • [2009/09/17 18:02] Maggie Darwin: I have no packet loss to ae-2.ebr3.Atlanta2.Level3.net
  • [2009/09/17 18:02] Morgaine Dinova: Maggie, through, not to. Different interfaces
  • [2009/09/17 18:02] Morgaine Dinova: Run mtr to sim3235
  • [2009/09/17 18:02] Simon Linden: Me too. We just got fiber to this office and our network got much better :)
  • [2009/09/17 18:02] Maggie Darwin: stand by
  • [2009/09/17 18:02] Latif Khalifa: fiber rulez :)
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] Twisted Laws: i'm going thru 11 64 ms 69 ms 73 ms ae-63-51.ebr3.Atlanta2.Level3.net [4.68.103.30] ... i have between 90 and 100 ms ping time here
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] Latif Khalifa: they offer 100mbps fiber in my neighbourhood but its very expensive still
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] reddot99 Republic: i wish they would force fiber optic to be offered
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] xstorm Radek: ok ok Simon talk our law makers in CT to turn to fiber optics
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] Andrew Linden: I'm going to have to head out now. Thanks for coming.
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] Latif Khalifa: thanks for your time andrew
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] reddot99 Republic: its you telecom xstorm
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] Rex Cronon: tc andr
  • [2009/09/17 18:03] Arawn Spitteler: Thanks for staying
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] reddot99 Republic: not congressmen,
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Rex Cronon: andrew*
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Neo Nino: thanks Andrew
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Ardy Lay: Hehe, the company I quit my position as CTO from was a Fiber ISP.
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Morgaine Dinova: See you Andrew
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Latif Khalifa: simon is your work related with viewer02?
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] reddot99 Republic: see y folks, heading back,
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Simon Linden: No, it's a bit of everything in the sims and back-end databases and stuff. SHould be done by the end of the year
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Maggie Darwin: vwr-8841 crash
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Meeter: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-8841
  • [#VWR-8841] Memory usage goes to 2 gig, graphics frame rate tanks, crash dump taken, viewer not responding
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Rex Cronon: tc
  • [2009/09/17 18:04] Simon Linden: I gotta run too ... thanks all for coming, see you next time
  • [2009/09/17 18:05] Maggie Darwin: Crashed trying to do help/about
  • [2009/09/17 18:05] Latif Khalifa: take care simon :)
  • [2009/09/17 18:05] Morgaine Dinova: Cyu Simon, tc
  • [2009/09/17 18:05] Simon Linden: bye
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