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  1. In public viewer are still 2 bugs: 1- Cannot upload partially rigged mesh 2- Cannot upload custom physics. Is it possible to remove these bugs cause both have worked fine in earlier mesh viewers. (I can't be at meeting)[Marcthur Goosson]
  2. When I upload single faced mesh, it shows well on preview, but after uploaded, it was inside out. When I upload same collada file by beta viewer, it is no problem.[Yuzuru Jewell]
  3. Any news from the Lab's side on how the Firestorm uploader is working? Nalates Urriah

Meeting Notes

Transcript for Monday December 5, 2011

[12:00] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Hey'll we'll start in a couple minutes
[12:00] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Linux does well when both the game and SL use OpenGL. :p
[12:01] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) im rocking a Xeon w3750, GTX 470, 20GB ram
[12:01] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) SL can only use 3GB though
[12:01] Cube Republic lol chaos
[12:01] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Koli Contepomi has an AMD X4 @ 3.4GHz, GTX 560 Ti and 8GB RAM.
[12:01] Cube Republic n
[12:01] Cube Republic nice
[12:01] Nal (nalates.urriah) I'd like to get people to add to this thread:
[12:01] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) hey Runitai.
[12:01] davep (runitai.linden) howdy
[12:01] Cube Republic i have a asus 580, its a superb card
[12:01] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) the dev viewer 3's have been running super fast for me with all shadows on
[12:01] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Hello Runitai!
[12:01] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) I've got the Asus one.
[12:02] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Although, the dual-fan cooler is setup a bit too agressively.
[12:02] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) (Revs up to 50% when reaching 60C)
[12:02] Cube Republic yes the dev viewers have been good for me, but the main viewer crashes my graphics drivers when i log in
[12:02] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Runitai fixed that in the beta.
[12:02] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) i stopped using the main viewers months ago, dev viewers are my main viewer
[12:02] Nal (nalates.urriah) I've got a 560 but a duel core2 and V3's suck for performance.
[12:02] Cube Republic it only happens on my laptop
[12:03] Cube Republic 555m
[12:03] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) na i find V3's the fastest SL viewer, faster than the old 1.x viewers
[12:03] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) I went from a Core 2 Duo to this AMD X4. Runitai's viewer ran well, but then I'm also on Linux, which I find runs the viewer faster anyway.
[12:03] davep (runitai.linden) those fixes are in beta now, so not long for release
[12:03] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) there is one thing that bothers the hell outa me though
[12:03] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) and that the water, it looks so different under shadows than none shadow
[12:04] davep (runitai.linden) yeah... I need to fix that
[12:04] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Heh...
[12:04] davep (runitai.linden) the sun shine on the water is a lot darker with L&S enabled
[12:04] Nal (nalates.urriah) I ran into rally dark render using Firestorm and shadows,
[12:04] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) is there a way you can reduce the glowy shine under none-shadow as well, as that shine is really unrealistic, or at least a way to control it
[12:04] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) I thought the sun shined more realistically when deferred is on.
[12:04] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) thats not the only issue, the other issue is fog does not effect water
[12:05] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) yeh it is more realsitic with shadows on, but fog doesn't affect the water, so certain sky presets look wrong
[12:05] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Ahh.
[12:05] Nal (nalates.urriah) Is there any UG or forum section where we can discuss viewer issues with the Lab?
[12:05] Mumbles (charlar.linden) one more minute...
[12:05] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) to be honest i preferred the old water (the one before windlight)
[12:06] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) the normal map on this water has visible tiling, and the water generally looks unrealistic
[12:06] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Koli Contepomi still needs to poke Runitai here about the saw tooth bug, considering people have been mentioning it now.
[12:06] Nal (nalates.urriah) Saw tooth bug?
[12:06] davep (runitai.linden) was going to look at that today
[12:07] davep (runitai.linden) SH-2652
[12:07] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Nal - in the beta and Runitai's build, there's a bug that when the GPU hits full load, it causes stalls (a 'saw tooth' like graph in fast timers).
[12:07] davep (runitai.linden)
[12:07] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Ah, cool.
[12:07] Nal (nalates.urriah) Thx
[12:07] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Hello Ra!
[12:07] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) also what about the solid edge alpha, it was working really well for my tree's, and Runitai's build makes the alpha soft again :(
[12:08] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Heya Yuzuru :)
[12:08] davep (runitai.linden) chaos: people were complaining about the hard edge alpha making too many things hard edge
[12:08] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) That'll be FXAA on Linden trees I guess.
[12:09] davep (runitai.linden) so the "test" for whether or not it should be hard edged got less aggressive
[12:09] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) can we have a setting to turn it on/off. having soft alpha only is a proper ballache
[12:09] Mumbles (charlar.linden) I'm going to wait for Vir to return and then I swear we'll start
[12:09] davep (runitai.linden) (fewer things get turned hard edge)
[12:09] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Oh, automatic alpha masks I guess.
[12:09] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Koli Contepomi is tired.
[12:09] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) yeh some of my trees (which use the same texture) go soft, and some dont, same with the windows on my bar
[12:09] davep (runitai.linden) yeah, some day (maybe) we might get a parameter per texture entry
[12:10] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) i would say per-object would be better
[12:10] davep (runitai.linden) chaos: it will always be soft if "transparency" in the texture entry is greater than 0
[12:11] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) also what is happening about LL's license to Speedtree? will that ever see the light of day, or will we be stuck with making our own trees?
[12:11] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) yes LL has a Speedtree License it's listed on the speedtree website
[12:12] Mumbles (charlar.linden) ok, now we start
[12:12] Motor Loon 3 2 1 go
[12:12] Mumbles (charlar.linden) #1 In public viewer are still 2 bugs: 1- Cannot upload partially rigged mesh 2- Cannot upload custom physics. Is it possible to remove these bugs cause both have worked fine in earlier mesh viewers. (I can't be at meeting)[Marcthur Goosson]
[12:13] Vir Linden What's the most recent build you have tried these with?
[12:13] Medhue Simoni partially rigs don't work for me either
[12:13] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) I think it is public viewer. 3.2.1 2444864.
[12:14] Vir Linden Some changes went down recently that are in beta 3.2.4, would be worth trying there.
[12:14] Medhue Simoni coool
[12:14] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) When 3.2.4 will be released?
[12:15] Vir Linden It's the latest beta, release schedule depends on how testing goes.
[12:16] Mumbles (charlar.linden) ok, moving to next one...
[12:16] Mumbles (charlar.linden) #2 When I upload single faced mesh, it shows well on preview, but after uploaded, it was inside out. When I upload same collada file by beta viewer, it is no problem.[Yuzuru Jewell]
[12:16] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) it happend on 3.2.1.
[12:17] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 3.2.1 is bad...
[12:17] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) So I made my tutorial on 3.2.4.
[12:17] davep (runitai.linden) Can you open a jira and attach the .dae file?
[12:18] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) OK I will do. But it is well by 3.2.4.
[12:18] davep (runitai.linden) hooray, we fixed it!
[12:18] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Please check diff between 3.2.1 and 3.2.4.
[12:18] FURIJA (sltrosjed) hi there
[12:18] Mumbles (charlar.linden) ok, moving on...
[12:18] Mumbles (charlar.linden) #3 Any news from the Lab's side on how the Firestorm uploader is working? Nalates Urriah
[12:19] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) oh yeh the "avatars head goes up avatars ass" bug is back
[12:19] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Nal, why do you ask questions about someone elses code? We don't know.
[12:19] Medhue Simoni I tried Firestorm on this rigged avatar and it crashed.
[12:19] Mumbles (charlar.linden) :-)
[12:19] Motor Loon I had issues on Firestorm too
[12:19] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) actualy i can kind of answer that one charlar
[12:19] Nal (nalates.urriah) ..I was curious if you were seeing more problems or none...
[12:20] Mumbles (charlar.linden) great wolfpup, thanks
[12:20] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) why do u guys use unofficial viewers that aren't supported by LL. of course ur gonna get problems on 'em
[12:20] Dan Linden Chaos, if you have a repro for that bug, please enter it. :)
[12:20] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) it just happens after being logged in a while sometimes, it happened years ago a lot, then it went away now its back, i dont know the cause
[12:20] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) it fixes itself then happens agian, i could be doing nothing or walking around
[12:20] Motor Loon Because LL are sooo slow to put in features that have been proved extremely useful in 3rd party viewers for a long time °͜°
[12:21] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) FireStorm is useing HACD to replace tyhe havok lib for complexdecomposition
[12:21] Motor Loon No.1 3rd party mesh uploader for me has been Kirstens S21 based ones
[12:21] Mumbles (charlar.linden) ahh, so this question was just a way for someone to complain about us, eh Motor? :-)
[12:22] Motor Loon Sounds likely Charlar °͜°
[12:22] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Folks, we don't have any other agenda items...
[12:22] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) also my friend upon tping to me tp'd in naked with all her attachments up her arse, everyone saw her naked but she saw herself clothed and normal, i think LL put that bug in on purpose for the lulz
[12:22] Medhue Simoni lol
[12:22] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Motor - lol
[12:22] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) and there is currently a project to get that code properly implamented for use in all viewer-development based TPV's
[12:22] Nal (nalates.urriah) :p no... but you gotta no it is the national pass time for Sl resies
[12:23] Medhue Simoni Personally, I think V3 is looking way better than any tpv
[12:23] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) motor that viewer is useing an extreamly outdated lib
[12:23] Motor Loon but it works
[12:23] Motor Loon atleast for what I'm using it for
[12:23] Medhue Simoni If I could only get voice to work, lol
[12:24] Motor Loon If I could only get my kid to clean up her room
[12:24] Mumbles (charlar.linden) OK, we're technically done here...
[12:24] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) but i give kudo points for LL finally working on these awesome things for LL (Linden Realms, MEsh, new ui etc)
[12:25] Mumbles (charlar.linden) ahhh, you're making us blush
[12:25] Nyx Linden :)
[12:25] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Will this be the location of future meetings?
[12:25] Motor Loon always kudos to LL
[12:25] Mumbles (charlar.linden) let's talk about this meeting for a minute (thanks Asha for the segue)
[12:25] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) :)
[12:26] Mumbles (charlar.linden) We want to widen the focus here to be more about general content creation (even sculpties :-P)
[12:26] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) na 2008 to mid 2010 was really bad for LL, SL was going on a downward spiral. since the new CEO joined this place has been improving, now we just need stable region crossings, more realistic trees/grass/sky/water, viewable distant terrain and weather
[12:26] Mumbles (charlar.linden) I'd like to have it here, Nyx has a nice place...
[12:27] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) those 2 pictures, i made those with mesh in SL
[12:27] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Chaos, you know I joined at the same time
[12:27] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) are there any OpenSource devs here?
[12:27] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) hehe yea, I remember this place from the old content meetings.
[12:27] Nyx Linden its permanently under construction, but that's part of the charm
[12:27] Medhue Simoni Well, the timing is bad for me
[12:27] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Koli Contepomi gets flash backs from Nyx's old office hours where he got attacked by questions.
[12:27] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Asha nods with a chuckle.
[12:28] Medhue Simoni usually i have to pick my son up from school
[12:28] Nyx Linden questions are fine, they're fun to answer :)
[12:28] Mumbles (charlar.linden) We can re-open the discussion of UG time... <gulp>
[12:29] Motor Loon pls earlier if anything, not later
[12:29] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Are you guys still planning a materials project?
[12:29] Medhue Simoni yes
[12:29] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) Nyx ju7st so you know if i can ever get my eyes uncrossed and the code that FS is useing reworked in to a proper LL versiond lib HACD will be functional
[12:30] Mumbles (charlar.linden) We're interested in doing the Materials project, but we're focused right now on stability and quality.
[12:30] Nyx Linden whoo! look forward to it - sorry I haven't had cycles to review the code yet
[12:30] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) whats the materials project?
[12:30] Nal (nalates.urriah) ACUG is an hour before this one. So, it can't too far forward.
[12:30] Motor Loon god.. I'd kill for a chrome/mirror material °͜°
[12:31] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Would the materials project happen after mesh is mostly completed?
[12:31] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) I think mirror would be quite a performance hit. :o
[12:31] davep (runitai.linden) materials == extra texture entry parameters
[12:31] davep (runitai.linden) (specular maps, normal maps, etc)
[12:31] Motor Loon not any more than water currently is?
[12:31] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) Water is low resolution.
[12:31] Nal (nalates.urriah) normals.... mmmmmm
[12:31] Medhue Simoni Yeah, but mirrors are super cool in games
[12:31] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) ohh thta'd be really kool
[12:31] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) mirrors are impossible in opengl
[12:31] davep (runitai.linden) mirrors are super slow
[12:32] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) About 1bit alpha?
[12:32] Medhue Simoni just put them inside a small room
[12:32] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) i know you are Nyx my problem right now is trying to straighten out the way that NickyD has HACD working for FS so that i can Code it into the lib im working on
[12:32] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) They'd have to hope someone wouldn't do stupid things with a mirror material.
[12:32] Medhue Simoni I would pay extra for mirrors, lol
[12:33] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) can we get a blog post about materials or some more info/pics
[12:33] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) There is a post already in the mesh forum Chaos.
[12:33] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) and thise 2 pics there i made with mesh
[12:33] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) can i get a link please
[12:33] Phadrus Karu Will there be any future support for double-sided materials (i.e. a leaf on a tree can be seen from both normal directions)?
[12:33] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Well, a wishlist pne anyway
[12:33] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) *one
[12:34] Motor Loon hm.. doublesided might be good in some cases
[12:34] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) could i get a link to the forum post about materials
[12:34] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Chaos, we generally don't talk about projects publically until we have it scheduled to start.
[12:34] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) I don't have it off hand. Do a search for Materials Wishlist
[12:35] Mumbles (charlar.linden)
[12:35] Medhue Simoni but double sided is just a poly saver really
[12:35] Mumbles (charlar.linden) i think that's it
[12:35] Medhue Simoni would help with tree tho
[12:35] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) kool, yeh materials would be awesome. i still want to know about speedtree
[12:35] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Double sided would be handy for hair
[12:35] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) i know LL has a license
[12:35] Medhue Simoni ah yes that too
[12:36] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) it'd be nice to have trees blowing in the wind without costing 200 million prims
[12:37] Medhue Simoni really tho, trees and environmental object should get their own system
[12:37] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) basically trees, grass, bushes and a proper way to make rivers/water body
[12:38] Medhue Simoni Yeah, more like in the Cryengine
[12:38] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) having SL look really beutiful would pull more people in, especially if newbs could make awesome looking environments
[12:38] Motor Loon oh a water material would be aweesome
[12:38] Mumbles (charlar.linden) I have another UG question - how can I help get good agenda items for the meeting? More details on the UG page, etc?
[12:39] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) Char, the best way would be to have people add reasons from within SL
[12:39] Motor Loon Just posting the meeting log after the meeting would be a good start °͜°
[12:39] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) the wiki only lets me log in some times
[12:39] Medhue Simoni What about sprites, I know the CryEngine has them, but I know nothing about them?
[12:39] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) we can do sprites now with particles
[12:39] Motor Loon sprites = particles ?
[12:39] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) i made a particle/sprite tree ages ago
[12:39] davep (runitai.linden) avatars automaticallly turn into sprites with the impostoring system
[12:39] Mumbles (charlar.linden) motor - I've been good about posting that. Recently...
[12:39] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Yes, I think there need to be a good explanation of how the focus has chaged and what kinds of questions are appropriate.
[12:40] Nal (nalates.urriah) You might want to consider discussing agenda on the Forum. That would get some coverage out there.
[12:40] Mumbles (charlar.linden) thanks Asha and Nal
[12:40] Motor Loon Motor Loon pads Charlars head
[12:40] Nal (nalates.urriah) A blog post on the change in nature of this group....
[12:40] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Mumbles thinks of ways to get Motor back for that...
[12:40] Motor Loon hehe
[12:41] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Particles in SL don't rotate with camera angle as far as I know.
[12:41] davep (runitai.linden) particles always face the camera
[12:41] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) Asha particles always 'face' the camera
[12:41] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Ahh, so why are people always crying about sprites?
[12:42] Motor Loon people like to cry
[12:42] Nal (nalates.urriah) They make a cat with a particle face that is spooky 'cause it looks at you all the time
[12:42] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) lol
[12:42] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Ok, I don't work with them. I assumed they whine about it because of rotation.
[12:42] davep (runitai.linden) I gotta run, thanks for the discussion, folks
[12:43] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Bye Dave
[12:43] Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi) See you, Runitai.
[12:43] Motor Loon have fun!
[12:43] Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) tc dave
[12:43] Nal (nalates.urriah) bye Thx davep
[12:43] Medhue Simoni cya
[12:43] Mumbles (charlar.linden) Ok, it seems like we're wrapped for this week. Thanks for making it to the new place. See you next week.
[12:43] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Adios Charlar.
[12:43] Motor Loon Not if we see you first
[12:43] Motor Loon °͜°
[12:44] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Thanks for the meeting
[12:44] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) See you next week.
[12:44] Nal (nalates.urriah) tc
[12:44] Nyx Linden thanks all!
[12:44] Vir Linden bye all!
[12:44] Medhue Simoni bye every1
[12:44] Squirrely Wrath (squirrel.wood) new, old place :p
[12:44] Mumbles (charlar.linden) I'll start a thread about scope and agenda on the forums.
[12:44] Mumbles (charlar.linden) cheers
[12:44] Nal (nalates.urriah) post a link in UG
[12:44] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) un poco lol
[12:45] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) Charlar, please show us the URL of thread of forum.
[12:45] Asha (ashasekayi.ra) Bye Yuzuru, take care ^^
[12:45] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) See you Asha
[12:47] uoɹʇoʞɹoq soɐɥƆ (chaos.borkotron) cheers guys
[12:48] Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) OK It will be on Thank you Charlar.
[13:05] Drongle McMahon Hi. I missed it again. Must give up work!
[13:05] Mumbles (charlar.linden) ahhh, sorry
[13:06] Nal (nalates.urriah) It would have been nice to have you here Drongle. I appreciate your posts in the foum