User:Babbage Linden/Office Hours/2008 10 01

Transcript of Babbage Linden's office hours:

[8:19]	Cale Flanagan:	oh i smell him:)
[8:19]	Twisted Laws:	yeah
[8:19]	Nock Forager:	:)
[8:19]	Nock Forager:	Hi Babbage
[8:19]	Babbage Linden:	sorry i'm late
[8:20]	Babbage Linden:	hi all
[8:20]	Babbage Linden:	i'm using SL over wifi from JAOO
[8:20]	Fake Fitzgerald:	hi Babbage
[8:20]	Cale Flanagan:	hi, coffee trouble?:)
[8:20]	Babbage Linden:	and needed to steel a PSU from someone before i could run SL
[8:20]	Twisted Laws:	cool
[8:20]	Cale Flanagan:	not steel, organize
[8:21]	Babbage Linden:	how are things?
[8:21]	Babbage Linden:	(i'm actually a bit out of the loop having spent the last few days at a conference with no laptop power)
[8:21]	Babbage Linden:	at least here
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	it looks like 1.24.7 has been rolled out
[8:22]	Twisted Laws:	you got voice on, babbage?
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	which contains a fix for touching with the 1.21. viewer
[8:22]	Twisted Laws:	garbled noises
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	no, no voice
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	let me turn it off in preferences though
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	that better?
[8:22]	Twisted Laws:	might speed up now on wifi :) yes
[8:23]	Babbage Linden:	ok, good
[8:23]	Babbage Linden:	thanks for the tip
[8:23]	Babbage Linden:	so, we were hoping that we wouldn't need 1.24.7
[8:23]	Twisted Laws:	/btw, i'm a sandbox scripter and just here to listen to what happens in this meeting. all is well with me.
[8:23]	Babbage Linden:	and that we could fix the remaining mono bugs in 1.22
[8:24]	Babbage Linden:	sorry 1.25
[8:24]	Babbage Linden:	are there any outstanding bugs that any of you think we need to fix more urgently?
[8:25]	Nock Forager:	I'm not sure it is related to them but since last rolling restart I saw SIM FPS dropping sometime.
[8:26]	Nock Forager:	for while. in some unrelated regions.
[8:26]	Babbage Linden:	i think there was an issue where our security fixes confused some bots
[8:27]	Babbage Linden:	that may have been what you were seeing
[8:27]	Babbage Linden:	which ended up spamming regions
[8:27]	Nock Forager:	hmhm
[8:27]	Babbage Linden:	if you find a simple repro please let us know
[8:27]	Nock Forager:	Yes I will.
[8:27]	Nock Forager:	thanks
[8:27]	Babbage Linden:	thanks for that
[8:28]	Babbage Linden:	i got your invitation too nock
[8:28]	Nock Forager:	ah :)
[8:28]	Babbage Linden:	i'll check my schedule when i get back home
[8:28]	Nock Forager:	I forgot to mention about timezone difference bitween UK and Japan.
[8:29]	Babbage Linden:	one issue that we're aware of is that our mono updates have caused problems with some opensim lsl extensions
[8:30]	Babbage Linden:	which is a symptom of opensim and linden extending scripting independently
[8:30]	Twisted Laws:	but their scripts are server side only anyway
[8:30]	Babbage Linden:	i've been talking to tedd maa and melanie milland about the future of scripting unofficially
[8:31]	Babbage Linden:	and talking internally about how we can start talking officially about the future of scripting
[8:31]	Hidenori Glushenko:	interesting
[8:31]	Babbage Linden:	the last thing i want to see is the two platforms diverging needlessly
[8:31]	Babbage Linden:	i'd like to see the steering wheels stay the same
[8:31]	Babbage Linden:	even if the engines underneath are different
[8:32]	Twisted Laws:	:)
[8:32]	Babbage Linden:	so hopefully we can sort out a process to talk about these things
[8:32]	Babbage Linden:	it's becoming more important with us starting to think about c#
[8:32]	Babbage Linden:	which we both have an interface for
[8:32]	Babbage Linden:	but we haven't made our interface public yet
[8:33]	Babbage Linden:	which makes it particularly hard for the interfaces to be compatible
[8:33]	Babbage Linden:	it's slow progress, but hopefully we can make our c# interface public ahead of making it available
[8:33]	Babbage Linden:	so we can at least discuss it in the open
[8:34]	Babbage Linden:	and talk about how to make it compatible
[8:34]	Cale Flanagan:	babbage, i put the topscript-thingie now into a jira entry, which u can catch if u wanto (svc-3140)
[8:34]	Babbage Linden:	before we do all the work needed to support c#
[8:34]	Babbage Linden:	great, thanks cale
[8:34]	Twisted Laws:	good thinking :)
[8:35]	Babbage Linden:	i will do a triage with periapse when i'm back in blighty
[8:35]	Babbage Linden:	to see where were are and what needs doing next
[8:36]	Babbage Linden:	so, that's where i think we are at the moment
[8:36]	Babbage Linden:	i will have more news next week when i get back
[8:36]	Arawn Spitteler:	How different is C# from C++? I've only had an intro course in the latter
[8:36]	Babbage Linden:	and have a chance to go through the issues
[8:37]	Babbage Linden:	c# is very close to Java
[8:37]	Twisted Laws:	easier to learn as a new language arawn
[8:37]	Babbage Linden:	simpler than C++
[8:37]	Babbage Linden:	but with some of the same concepts
[8:37]	Babbage Linden:	classes, objects, inheritance, composition etc
[8:37]	Arawn Spitteler:	I never got a handle on the User Defined Libraries
[8:37]	Babbage Linden:	plus some useful basic features missing from lsl like arrays
[8:38]	Arawn Spitteler:	So, if we're playing frequently, with Position and Rotation, we should be able to make our own data type?
[8:39]	Cale Flanagan:	are there pointers in c# (i am c man:) ) ?
[8:39]	Babbage Linden:	arawn, yes, you might want to make a class called LinkedPrim which keeps track of the linked prim index
[8:39]	Babbage Linden:	and passes it to llSetLinked* functions
[8:40]	Babbage Linden:	or you might want to make a RemotePrim object which defines a SetPosition method and remembers a chat channel
[8:40]	Babbage Linden:	which it uses to send messages to a Remote scripted object
[8:40]	Arawn Spitteler:	It's usually Primatars getting juggled, but LinkedPrim would also include the prim's current link number
[8:41]	Babbage Linden:	so your script can just call methods on an object
[8:41]	Babbage Linden:	instead of having to send messages an build strings
[8:41]	Twisted Laws:	/ sounds excellent :) 2 months, 6 months, .... ?
[8:41]	Babbage Linden:	which is done by the RemotePrim class
[8:41]	Babbage Linden:	or whatever
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	well, my team is working on a stability project next
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	which will probably take until the end of the year
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	and also we need to get a new version of our server os
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	to get us a newer version of mono
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	then we can start on it
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	hopefully early next year
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	and get it done by next summer
[8:43]	Arawn Spitteler:	Andrew's playing with 64 bit servers, if that's what you mean
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	but we haven't decided on this yet
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	yes, part of the reason that the os upgrade is taking a while
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	is that we're moving the simulator to be a 64 bit app at the same time
[8:44]	Babbage Linden:	currently it's a 32 bit app on a 64 bit host
[8:44]	Twisted Laws:	understand, it would be great tho but i also wonder what will happen to servers when really powerful scripts/programs get to run on them.
[8:44]	Arawn Spitteler:	Is there a Wiki, on 64 v 32 bit apps?
[8:44]	Babbage Linden:	which works, but adds complications
[8:45]	Babbage Linden:	you can probably find stuff on it on wikipedia
[8:45]	Babbage Linden:	it's an implementation detail really
[8:45]	Arawn Spitteler:	Last night, someone had a script malfunction, that had llResetSCript() as the first command of state_entry()
[8:45]	Babbage Linden:	but moving everything to 64 bit will make development easier
[8:45]	Babbage Linden:	oh? what happened arawn? is it in jira?
[8:46]	Arawn Spitteler just thinks that's a powerful application, that might test the system: It was just mentioned in a NCI Scripters debug session
[8:47]	Arawn Spitteler:	It might be interesting, to see how that script would lag a sim
[8:47]	Babbage Linden:	yes
[8:47]	Babbage Linden:	it should work in theory
[8:47]	Babbage Linden:	but it might be a strange edge case
[8:48]	Arawn Spitteler:	Noirmal sort of bug.
[8:48]	Nock Forager:	I wonder Script time is what standing for especially in such heavy load situatinon.
[8:50]	Nock Forager:	it seems showing different depend on situatioin.
[8:50]	Babbage Linden:	it sounds like we need to look in to it
[8:50]	Babbage Linden:	there are a number of issues which talk about strange script time
[8:50]	Babbage Linden:	we need to check it's reporting the correct times
[8:51]	Babbage Linden:	to find out whether the bug is in the scripts or in the measuring tools
[8:51]	Babbage Linden:	ok, i've had the PSU i borrowed stolen back
[8:51]	Nock Forager:	hehe
[8:51]	Babbage Linden:	and people are packing up here
[8:52]	Cale Flanagan:	maybe we get a profiler for scripts? (i know im dreaming)
[8:52]	Babbage Linden:	so i'm going to have to go
[8:52]	Babbage Linden:	thanks again for coming everyone
[8:52]	Nock Forager:	have a safe trip!!
[8:52]	Arawn Spitteler:	Does anyone know, how to find the instructions for adding Mono to legacy Clients?
[8:52]	Twisted Laws:	bye, have fun!
[8:52]	Babbage Linden:	and hopefully i'll see you all with power and a wired net connection next week
[8:53]	Babbage Linden:	bye
[8:53]	Babbage Linden:	thanks everyone
[8:53]	Fake Fitzgerald:	bye
[8:53]	Cale Flanagan:	bye