User:Benjamin Linden/Office Hours/2007 Jul 26

Transcript of Benjamin Linden's office hours:

[15:02]	Benjamin Linden:	hello friends!
[15:02]	Benja Kepler:	hi Benjamin
[15:02]	Wyn Galbraith:	Afternoon Benjamin :)
[15:02]	Benjamin Linden:	whew, I'm glad to see things cleared out here
[15:02]	Benjamin Linden:	it was pandemonium earlier
[15:02]	Wyn Galbraith took Squirrel's place ;)
[15:02]	Benja Kepler:	oh?
[15:02]	Squirrel Wood:	/ao off
[15:02]	Rex Cronon:	what happened?
[15:02]	Wyn Galbraith can share though ;)
[15:02]	Squirrel Wood:	protestees
[15:03]	Benja Kepler:	hi Rex
[15:03]	Wyn Galbraith:	I heard something was going on here. They're so silly.
[15:03]	Benjamin Linden:	there was a crowd of about 40 protesters here
[15:03]	Rex Cronon:	hi
[15:03]	Wyn Galbraith:	They hit Pooley too.
[15:03]	Benjamin Linden:	big signs, the works
[15:03]	Squirrel Wood:	big, silly signs
[15:03]	Benjamin Linden:	it was definitely interesting
[15:03]	Wyn Galbraith:	They are protesting up the wrong tree.
[15:03]	Rex Cronon:	isn't that called freed of expression:)
[15:03]	Rex Cronon:	freedom*
[15:03]	Rex Cronon:	hi everybody
[15:04]	Benjamin Linden:	yep, Rex, that's one of the things I think is so exciting and powerful about second life
[15:04]	Benja Kepler:	some people just want to be able to lose money
[15:04]	Benjamin Linden:	I took lots of pictures :-)
[15:04]	Wyn Galbraith:	I'd like to see that.
[15:04]	Wyn Galbraith:	Did any RL news groups show up?
[15:04]	Rex Cronon:	oh, it was with regards to the banning of gambling in sl?
[15:04]	Benja Kepler:	cool - flickr'd them yet?
[15:04]	Benjamin Linden:	I'll see about uploading to flickr
[15:04]	Benja Kepler:	gr8
[15:05]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, Rex, it was regarding the recent policy change
[15:05]	Wyn Galbraith will miss SLingo.
[15:05]	Wyn Galbraith:	They could still have the game, just can't bet. Correct ;)
[15:05]	Squirrel Wood:	without betting it's not even half the fun.
[15:06]	Wyn Galbraith:	I guess that's true.
[15:06]	Rex Cronon:	i think it is kind of harsh. lots of things use random number generators and give away money:(
[15:06]	Benjamin Linden:	I'm actually not the best person to ask questions about the new policy. Robin Linden has office hours Tuesday at 11am. She would be the right person to ask.
[15:06]	Squirrel Wood:	Well, I shall rename my sploder to Money Redistributor. :p
[15:06]	Benjamin Linden:	We're very close to launching voice - I'm excited!
[15:06]	Wyn Galbraith:	You know what will happen. Remember Proabtion?
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	I concur that all ingame lotteries are history now too?
[15:07]	Wyn Galbraith had a great experience with voice this afternoon.
[15:07]	Benjamin Linden:	probation wyn?
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	^^
[15:07]	Rex Cronon:	i guess everybody will have the opportunity to express their feelings about gabling with their new voice:)
[15:07]	Wyn Galbraith:	Proabition. After WWI they outlawed liquir.
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	lots of crazy ponies ^^
[15:07]	Benjamin Linden:	oh that's Prohibition, Wyn
[15:08]	Wyn Galbraith:	So what happened? Bars when underground, speakeasies, bathtub gin LOL
[15:08]	Squirrel Wood:	My Name's Al. Al Cohol
[15:08]	Wyn Galbraith:	I'm not the worlds best speller ;)
[15:08]	Rex Cronon:	the mob took over:)
[15:08]	Benjamin Linden:	that's ok, I rely on MS Word to spell for me :-)
[15:08]	Wyn Galbraith:	The Ponies, they made want to go out to the studio and try to fix my headset!
[15:08]	Benjamin Linden:	maybe we'll get mobsters in SL :-)
[15:08]	Benjamin Linden:	oh wait, I think we already do
[15:09]	Squirrel Wood:	Wyn, just buy a new headset :)
[15:09]	Benja Kepler:	lol
[15:09]	Wyn Galbraith lives at dictionary.com. "I'm much better now, after about 5 years roleplaying in textbased games with college students.
[15:09]	Wyn Galbraith:	I am, there now, got credit card, trying to choose.
[15:09]	Squirrel Wood:	logitech.
[15:09]	Wyn Galbraith:	It's such a waste Squirrel, the headset was only 2 months old when the kittens ate the cords.
[15:09]	Benjamin Linden:	what about the ponies?
[15:10]	Wyn Galbraith:	The ponies use voice a lot.
[15:10]	Rex Cronon:	please hand over all your virtual good this is a robbery in progress. if u don't i am going to fire this banana gun:)
[15:10]	Wyn Galbraith:	It was so neat, cute... I loved it hearing them.
[15:10]	Wyn Galbraith:	They laugh a lot. It's very refreshing.
[15:11]	Wyn Galbraith had a great time, thanks Squirrel.
[15:11]	Wyn Galbraith:	LOL@Rex
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	so what should we talk about today?
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	any thoughts on the new UI triages?
[15:11]	Wyn Galbraith:	I don't know, what do _you_ want to talk about?
[15:11]	Benja Kepler:	it's good
[15:11]	Ryozu Kojima:	I wanted to throw some suggestions out about the Voice interface
[15:11]	Wyn Galbraith missed it.
[15:11]	Benja Kepler:	(the triages)
[15:12]	Wyn Galbraith has some observations about voice formed today.
[15:12]	Benjamin Linden:	sure, go ahead Ryozu
[15:12]	Benjamin Linden:	And Wyn
[15:13]	Rex Cronon:	nice i think the orientation island would be a better place
[15:13]	Ryozu Kojima:	I keep finding myself going to click the "Friends" button, that doesn't exist anymore. What do you think about taking the Communicate panel and ripping off the "Groups" and "Friends" part into it's own window "Contacts"
[15:13]	Ryozu Kojima:	Maybe even add a pane in that window for "Calling Cards"
[15:13]	Benja Kepler:	is this because the term 'friend' is over-used?
[15:13]	Nice Slade:	hallo
[15:14]	Ryozu Kojima:	Nah, just because I"m used to having m friends list as a seperate window anyways
[15:14]	Rex Cronon:	how about contact
[15:14]	Benja Kepler:	ok
[15:14]	Rex Cronon:	contacts*
[15:14]	Ryozu Kojima:	That, and having "Communicate" and "Chat" as seperate buttons seems redundant. They do different things, but the wording has the same meaning
[15:14]	Benjamin Linden:	I think there's going to be some discomfort for people who are used to using the old interface initially
[15:14]	Ryozu Kojima:	Honesty, the lack of the Friends button is the one thing I've had any real issue with
[15:14]	Benjamin Linden:	but for new users the streamlined UI should be an improvement
[15:14]	Benjamin Linden:	hi Alexa
[15:15]	Benja Kepler:	are Calling Cards on the way out ?
[15:15]	Wyn Galbraith:	Hello Nice, hi Alexa.
[15:15]	Ryozu Kojima chuckles.
[15:15]	Alexa Linden:	Hi Benjamin :)
[15:15]	Alexa Linden:	Hi Wyn
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	Ryozu, I agree about the Communicate and Chat buttons, that's a toughie
[15:15]	Ryozu Kojima:	Seems to me like "Calling Cards" were never really on the "In"
[15:15]	Benja Kepler:	lol
[15:15]	Wyn Galbraith:	I give out calling cards a lot.
[15:15]	Katrus Bauhaus:	Hi there.
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	we want to change the visual appearance of the Chat button to indicate what it does
[15:15]	Ryozu Kojima:	One other issue I have is that when you rip off the "Near by" tab, it doesn't stay seperate
[15:16]	Wyn Galbraith:	So Benjamin, put an icon on it of two lips moving fast.
[15:16]	Benjamin Linden:	that's a good question about calling cards
[15:16]	Benjamin Linden:	Wyn said she uses them. others?
[15:16]	Ryozu Kojima:	I use them
[15:16]	Wyn Galbraith:	I usually offer my calling card because I don't want to force friendship on anyone.
[15:16]	Ryozu Kojima:	But for a rather archaic purpose: Conference chats
[15:16]	Benja Kepler:	they are there in Inventory - I wouldn't say I use them
[15:17]	Benjamin Linden:	personally I think it's confusing to have both Friends and calling cards
[15:17]	Ryozu Kojima:	It's not really documented anywhere that you can put them into a folder and use them to start a conference chat
[15:17]	Wyn Galbraith:	with my calling card they can get to my profile and my picks.
[15:17]	Benja Kepler:	(there because of Friends List )
[15:17]	Kitty Barnett:	I use calling cards to see the date I friended someone
[15:17]	Benjamin Linden:	what do you use a calling card for that you dont' use friends for?
[15:17]	Ryozu Kojima:	I don't know of any other way to do that
[15:17]	Ryozu Kojima:	Can you select multiple friends and click IM to start a conference?
[15:17]	Benjamin Linden:	Ryozu, you can multi-select friends and start an IM
[15:17]	Ryozu Kojima:	Never tried
[15:17]	Nice Slade:	gebt bitte wieder alles frei bitte
[15:17]	Babbler3.17: give please again everything freely please
[15:17]	Wyn Galbraith:	I use calling cards to recall someone I met who had interesting picks I want to explore later.
[15:17]	Benjamin Linden:	I didn't know you could do that with calling cards! lol
[15:17]	Ryozu Kojima:	Also, an existing conference chat allows you to drag a calling card into it to add a person
[15:17]	Benjamin Linden:	interesting
[15:18]	Ryozu Kojima:	Is that also available by another method?
[15:18]	Benjamin Linden:	all these hidden features :-)
[15:18]	Benjamin Linden:	I don't believe it is, Ryozu
[15:18]	Ryozu Kojima:	Ah
[15:18]	Kitty Barnett:	what would be great is if you could use calling cards to organize friends into folders and have the friends list follow the same hierarchy :o
[15:18]	Ryozu Kojima:	One thing I'd like to see is that same functionality for an existing 1on1 IM session
[15:18]	Benjamin Linden:	I'd like to see the functionality combined
[15:18]	Wyn Galbraith:	But I don't really want those people on my friends list, you see?
[15:18]	Ryozu Kojima:	That too
[15:18]	Benjamin Linden:	why is that Wyn?
[15:19]	Benjamin Linden:	it's almost like what you want is to be able to bookmark a person's profile
[15:19]	Ryozu Kojima:	Sorting "Friends"/"Contacts" into folders has been a big feature of most IM software, would probably be a big benefit to SL as well
[15:19]	Wyn Galbraith:	Maybe I don't want them to know when I'm online, etc. Though I know you can set that if the person is on your friends list.
[15:19]	Ryozu Kojima:	That's another little thing, a preference toggle that changes the default behaviour when adding a friend so that they don't see you online initially
[15:20]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, I agree we need better organizing abilities for the friends list
[15:20]	Ryozu Kojima:	My default state is to not let anyone see me online unless I want them to. Kind of a result of having hundreds of "friends" and running a business
[15:20]	Nice Slade:	wir wollen doch nur spass haben,verbiet kindersex
[15:20]	Babbler3.17: we want to have nevertheless only fun, let us forbid kindersex
[15:20]	Ryozu Kojima:	...
[15:21]	Wyn Galbraith:	Babbler should say waht language it's translating.
[15:21]	Kitty Barnett:	German
[15:21]	Ryozu Kojima:	Pretty easy to guess there -_-;;
[15:21]	Benjamin Linden:	it's so fun reading the translations!
[15:21]	Squirrel Wood:	Nice, du bellst den falschen Baum an. Dienstag. Robin Lindens Plauderstunde ist eher geeignet dafür. Ausserdem ist spielen ohne geldeinsatz nach wie vor legal.
[15:22]	Ryozu Kojima:	?
[15:22]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks Squirrel!
[15:22]	Squirrel Wood:	^^
[15:22]	Ryozu Kojima:	I have no idea what you just siad
[15:22]	Alexa Linden:	:)
[15:22]	Wyn Galbraith had enough of that doing major account tech support for telxs from Japan.
[15:22]	Squirrel Wood:	I do
[15:22]	Benjamin Linden:	I didn't know you spoke German
[15:22]	Squirrel Wood:	^^
[15:22]	Benjamin Linden:	cool
[15:22]	xWyn hatte genug dieser tuenden Hauptkonto Techunterstützung für
	telxs von Japan.
[15:23]	Wyn Galbraith:	Wow Squirrel I'm impressed, I only speak English and Geek.
[15:23]	xWyn: Wimmern-Eichhörnchen werde ich beeindruckt, spreche ich nur Englisch
	und Geek.
[15:23]	Benjamin Linden:	Ryozu, you mentioned that you're having trouble with the Near Me tab staying separate
[15:23]	Benjamin Linden:	it's supposed to remember where you left it
[15:23]	Benjamin Linden:	are you talking about between sessions?
[15:24]	Ryozu Kojima:	It's mostly me trying to make it behave more like the way it used to
[15:24]	Benja Kepler:	I think it works
[15:24]	Wyn Galbraith:	If you close the Near Me after it's separated it goes back to the Communicate bundle.
[15:24]	xWyn: Wenn Sie das nahe ich schließen, nachdem es getrennt ist, geht es
	zurück zu dem in Verbindung stehen Bündel.
[15:24]	Ryozu Kojima:	CRTL+H bring up near me, and closing it
[15:24]	Squirrel Wood:	that bug has been reported and imported by torley
[15:24]	Ryozu Kojima:	Of course, when it gets closed, it reattaches itself
[15:24]	Wyn Galbraith:	Coolness.
[15:24]	xWyn: Kühle.
[15:24]	Benjamin Linden:	I see. Ok thanks Squirrel
[15:25]	Squirrel Wood:	https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1839
[15:25]	Kasiopee Chantilly:	http://www.thekonstrukt.com/protest.asp
[15:25]	Benjamin Linden:	Squirrel, I love having you as my assistant!
[15:25]	Benjamin Linden:	:-)
[15:25]	Squirrel Wood:	XD
[15:25]	Benjamin Linden:	are you able to make the bug triages, Squirrel? do you find them useful?
[15:26]	Squirrel Wood:	mondays yes.
[15:26]	Squirrel Wood:	tuesdays too
[15:26]	Squirrel Wood:	and they are *very* informative ^^
[15:27]	Benjamin Linden:	ok good
[15:27]	JayR Cela:	wooo I made the TP in 1 piece this time
[15:27]	JayR Cela:	lol
[15:27]	Ryozu Kojima:	So, did you feel there was any merit to making the Contacts tab a seperate window?
[15:27]	Benjamin Linden:	for those of you that don't know, we've been running bug triages every Tuesday on UI bugs from the public issue tracker
[15:28]	Benjamin Linden:	Ryozu, I've thought about that a few times, because I too got used to having that button down there
[15:28]	Benjamin Linden:	but now that I've trained myself to go to the contacts window I'm used to it
[15:28]	JayR Cela:	I have been useing the nIcholaz SL client for the past 3 weeks / very impressive
[15:28]	Benjamin Linden:	oops we lost him
[15:28]	Benjamin Linden:	oh do tell, JayR!
[15:28]	Benjamin Linden:	what's different with it?
[15:29]	JayR Cela:	yes / very few crash's / runs a bit faster / and virtually no memory leaks
[15:29]	Ryozu Kojima:	I think peolple would like it, it would be more in line with other IM software behaviour, IE: AIM/AIM Pro having a contact list, and seperate chat window(s)
[15:29]	JayR Cela:	and textures load faster as well
[15:29]	Benjamin Linden:	Nicholaz is great. he's fixed a ton of bugs
[15:29]	Benja Kepler:	The Mad Plumber, I call him
[15:29]	Benjamin Linden:	do you have a link, JayR?
[15:29]	JayR Cela:	he sure has / he's doing a great job
[15:30]	JayR Cela:	yeah hold on I'll get it for you
[15:30]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks! this is very exciting for me to hear, because I would love to have more people in the open source community doing UI development work
[15:31]	Ryozu Kojima:	Another thing occured to me. You can't move between tabls with CRTL+[ and CRTL+] anymore, is this intentional? I kind of liked it
[15:31]	Kitty Barnett:	it's alt and the arrows now
[15:31]	Ryozu Kojima:	Ah, didn't know that
[15:31]	Benjamin Linden:	Ryozu, yes Kitty got it...
[15:31]	Ryozu Kojima:	Thanks!
[15:31]	Benjamin Linden:	did that other combo use to work Ryozu?
[15:31]	JayR Cela:	here is the link to Nicholaz /// http://nicholaz-beresford.blogspot.com/
[15:31]	Ryozu Kojima:	Used to
[15:31]	Benjamin Linden:	hmm I wonder why it stopped
[15:31]	Kitty Barnett:	you can't make the ctrl + [ combination on some European keyboards.. they're a few of them that won't work :|
[15:31]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks JayR!
[15:32]	JayR Cela:	NP ~ give it a try / I think you will like it
[15:32]	Kitty Barnett:	if you can edit the xml files to make the viewer do something it's not supposed to do... would that make an actual bug or a won't fix? the fix is kind of trivial.. just don't want to post a repro on JIRA if it's a won't fix
[15:32]	Ryozu Kojima:	eep, and I get stuck on the "Contents" tab going between friends and groups
[15:32]	Benjamin Linden:	I will definitely check it out JayR!
[15:33]	Benjamin Linden:	what's the question Kitty?
[15:33]	Benjamin Linden:	Contents tab, Ryozu?
[15:33]	Camber Front Door: Holdthe Yifu is at the door.
[15:33]	Ryozu Kojima:	Contacts, sorry
[15:33]	Camber Front Door: Holdthe Yifu is at the door.
[15:34]	Kitty Barnett:	if changing the xml files to get non-full permission to work with "Save Texture As" is a bug that would get fixed or not... VWR-1845... I didn't put a repro in detail because I don't want to let everyone know and then it doesn't get fixed :)
[15:34]	Ryozu Kojima:	With no IM tabs open, alt+left arrow goes to Contacts, but once there, you can't alt+arrow out of contacts, just between groups/friends
[15:34]	Benjamin Linden:	can you file a bug for that, Ryozu? it sounds like a keyboard navigation problem
[15:34]	BA Tomsen:	Script run-time error
[15:34]	BA Tomsen:	Stack-Heap Collision
[15:34]	Wyn Galbraith waves at the newcommers.
[15:34]	Ryozu Kojima:	Ah, the ability to save non-full perm textures, I'd say that deserves a fix
[15:35]	Benjamin Linden:	wow BA Tomsen is gettin down!
[15:35]	Kitty Barnett:	I put the fix in the entry, just not the repro
[15:35]	Multi Gadget v1.52.0 by Timeless Prototype
[15:35]	Squirrel Wood:	Oh My. How much script time is that bling stuff wasting? ^^
[15:35]	BA Tomsen:	hi all
[15:35]	Rex Cronon:	hi
[15:35]	Benjamin Linden:	hi, you're a dancing fiend!
[15:35]	Rex Cronon:	have u been attacked recently, that might be the cause of your errors
[15:35]	BA Tomsen:	:)
[15:36]	Wyn Galbraith:	Interesting dance.
[15:36]	Benjamin Linden:	Kitty, you come to my UI bug triage right?
[15:36]	Ryozu Kojima:	Looks like it comes from Sine Wave
[15:36]	JayR Cela:	I would just like to see the problem with attachments not being where they are supposed to be after some Teleports issue addressed
[15:36]	Kitty Barnett:	yesh, when I can make it
[15:36]	Kitty Barnett:	but I missed this tuesday
[15:37]	Wyn Galbraith:	You have to admit, there's never a dull moment in SL.
[15:37]	Benjamin Linden:	could you add that bug to the list to be discussed?
[15:37]	Kitty Barnett:	okies, will do :)
[15:37]	Benjamin Linden:	it's true, Wyn
[15:37]	Benjamin Linden:	I think I'm being hypnotized by BA's bling
[15:38]	Wyn Galbraith has some Sine Wave dances.
[15:38]	JayR Cela:	are we discussing any particular issue today ??
[15:38]	Wyn Galbraith thinks she's already hypnotized.
[15:38]	BA Tomsen:	.+*^*+. **** WE ARE GERMAN *** GERMAN **** .+*^*+.
[15:38]	BA Tomsen:	.+*^*+. **** HOPE YOU LIKE GERMANS TOO **** .+*^*+.
[15:39]	Ryozu Kojima:	o_o
[15:39]	BA Tomsen:	;)
[15:39]	Benjamin Linden:	we love Germans!
[15:39]	Wyn Galbraith:	We love Germans!
[15:39]	Squirrel Wood:	for brekkers? ^^
[15:39]	Benja Kepler:	gott im himmel
[15:39]	Rex Cronon:	bye everybody
[15:39]	Wyn Galbraith:	Oh geeze.
[15:39]	Ryozu Kojima sighs.
[15:40]	Wyn Galbraith:	You know protesting here won't change a thing.
[15:40]	Ryozu Kojima:	Why in the world are they showing up here? Did they show up at the OS hour too?
[15:40]	Squirrel Wood:	If you wish to protest, talk to George W. Bush.
[15:40]	Wyn Galbraith:	You're just wasting time.
[15:40]	BA Tomsen:	ok ladies and gentelmen had fun in sl bye
[15:40]	Wyn Galbraith:	Squirrel's right, go talk to the US government.
[15:40]	Kitty Barnett:	Benjamin's parcel has too much traffic... it shows up at the top for linden village :)
[15:40]	Benjamin Linden:	it's ok guys, everyon'es entitled to their opinion
[15:40]	Benjamin Linden:	haha really, Kitty?
[15:40]	Benjamin Linden:	that's cool!
[15:40]	Ryozu Kojima chuckles.
[15:40]	Kitty Barnett:	well, just under the balloon too
[15:40]	Kitty Barnett:	tour
[15:41]	Rex Cronon:	if u really want people to know about it, get hold of a few reporters from real life, and/or post on flickr or youtube
[15:41]	Ryozu Kojima:	Opinions are fine by me, but we do have a topic after all
[15:41]	Benjamin Linden:	that's true Ryozu but so far no one has interrupted us
[15:41]	Ryozu Kojima:	Not as much as we interupt ourselves anyways ;)
[15:41]	Benjamin Linden:	Tao sometimes comes and transmits the office hours onto the web
[15:41]	Wyn Galbraith just gets a little annoyed. "I'm sure LL wouldn't do this if they weren't over a legal barrel.
[15:41]	Benjamin Linden:	ok what were we discussing before I got mesmerized
[15:42]	Ryozu Kojima:	Hmm, UI? =D
[15:42]	Benjamin Linden:	lol indeed
[15:42]	Ryozu Kojima:	You were looking for feedback on the UI bug Triage, and I was pestering you about the Contacts being a seperate window
[15:42]	Benjamin Linden:	right
[15:42]	Benja Kepler:	the only problem I have is the lack of a button that says CLOSE
[15:42]	Wyn Galbraith:	Nice thing about SL is you can move your camera and get less annoyed ;)
[15:42]	Benjamin Linden:	you don't like the little close button on the upper right, Benja?
[15:42]	Ryozu Kojima:	Used to be one, but I don't really miss that
[15:43]	Benja Kepler:	oh, but it's so little
[15:43]	Benja Kepler:	oh, ok
[15:43]	Jewella Jewell:	I think this day changes a lot in sl. shouldn`t we talk about that concerns,too?
[15:43]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, we need to make those buttons easier to see
[15:43]	Wyn Galbraith:	This isn't the meeting for that.
[15:43]	Benja Kepler:	with multiple IMs, you know, GFs calling when you're somewhere else, like a meeting....
[15:43]	Ryozu Kojima:	Something a little more obvious
[15:43]	Squirrel Wood:	have them blink, flash, spin, jump, wiggle.... ? ^^
[15:43]	Benjamin Linden:	Jewella, if you have concerns about the recent policy change please attend Robin Lindens office hours Tuesday at 11am
[15:43]	Wyn Galbraith likes the wiggle idea.
[15:44]	Jewella Jewell:	a lot of people lost their rl investigations their jobs and don`t know hoew to go on
[15:44]	Benjamin Linden:	you want more blinking and wiggling, Squirrel?
[15:44]	Ryozu Kojima:	How about adding an X to each tab, similar to what Firefox does?
[15:44]	Jewella Jewell:	I can understand the urgency as the fbi investigated
[15:44]	Wyn Galbraith would like that too, Benjamin.
[15:44]	Benjamin Linden:	jumping and wiggline?
[15:44]	Benjamin Linden:	wiggling?
[15:44]	Jewella Jewell:	but couln`d t it be possible to give us a liittle more time?
[15:44]	Wyn Galbraith:	wiggline
[15:44]	Benjamin Linden:	I like that idea, Ryozu, we may do something like that in the future
[15:45]	Wyn Galbraith:	Tihs isn't the meeting for that Jewella.
[15:45]	Ryozu Kojima:	It seems to work pretty well for Firefox anyway
[15:45]	Jewella Jewell:	I heard that already today some people have been teken their slots..
[15:45]	Benjamin Linden:	oh I remember one thing I wanted to bring up
[15:45]	JayR Cela:	I would like to see a minimize button for inventory added
[15:45]	Ryozu Kojima:	Oh, yeah
[15:45]	Jewella Jewell:	I got the e mail concerning this just a few hours ago
[15:45]	Benjamin Linden:	how do people feel about the overall visual appearance of the Viewer?
[15:45]	Ryozu Kojima:	Actually, speaking of minimize, how likely would it be to turn those little minimized tabs into something we can move?
[15:45]	JayR Cela:	instead of haveing to open and close the inventory / sometimes it looses it place
[15:46]	Kitty Barnett:	you have a workaround for that JayR, you can fix it yourself
[15:46]	Wyn Galbraith:	It's a legal issue and nothing can be done until you get someone to change the law. I'm done.
[15:46]	Ryozu Kojima:	Ben: I think it could be easily skinnable
[15:46]	Jewella Jewell:	if I weren`t online they would have taken me my expensive roulette. it`s hard, too hard I think
[15:46]	Kitty Barnett:	although I would like the minimize back too :p it used to be there
[15:46]	JayR Cela:	Benjamin / how do I do that
[15:46]	Benjamin Linden:	why do you want to minimize inventory?
[15:46]	Benjamin Linden:	do what JayR?
[15:46]	Ryozu Kojima:	Actually, what I'd -like- to see
[15:46]	Ryozu Kojima:	Is something like "Roll up" windows
[15:46]	Wyn Galbraith:	What Ryozu?
[15:46]	Wyn Galbraith:	Oh
[15:46]	Benjamin Linden:	like Macs
[15:47]	Wyn Galbraith:	Hey, that's a interesting idea.
[15:47]	Ryozu Kojima:	Let us move the rolled up titlebar around, click to unroll it
[15:47]	Ryozu Kojima:	etc
[15:47]	Benjamin Linden:	right
[15:47]	JayR Cela:	because I do a lot of building / and work with lots of textures / sometimes when I am opening and closing the inventory it will loose its place
[15:47]	Benjamin Linden:	window management is definitely something I want to improve. but that's a big project
[15:47]	Wyn Galbraith builds a lot too, "Benjamin actually has a screenshot of how my view is usually set... blocked ;)
[15:47]	Benjamin Linden:	my earlier question was about the visual appearance/color scheme. do people like it?
[15:48]	Jewella Jewell:	benjamin we are all human beeings. can``t we talk like that?
[15:48]	Ryozu Kojima:	You also lose your placement of your inventory when you have mutliple inventory windows open
[15:48]	Wyn Galbraith:	How about dual montors ;)
[15:48]	Ryozu Kojima:	It's alright
[15:48]	Kitty Barnett:	http://forums.secondlife.com/showthread.php?t=175021 <- do it yourself minimize button for Inventory :)
[15:48]	Ryozu Kojima:	I'm pretty used to it, so I don't pay much attention to it
[15:48]	Ryozu Kojima:	Heh
[15:48]	JayR Cela:	oh I have no problem with the color scheme / perfectly legible on my monitor
[15:48]	Wyn Galbraith:	*monitors
[15:48]	Squirrel Wood:	You protesters are all barking up the wrong tree here. Robin Linden is the one to talk to. Every tuesday. At 11AM SLT.
[15:48]	Benja Kepler:	it's fine
[15:48]	Jewella Jewell:	or at least give us a place or a person we can talk to. we lost real life money and time
[15:48]	Benja Kepler:	I'd like a Wii interface too
[15:49]	Benja Kepler:	he he
[15:49]	Ryozu Kojima:	I do think the whole UI could be more easily skinnable, but then, I made that suggestion back in 2003
[15:49]	Squirrel Wood:	http://slurl.com/secondlife/Ambleside/88/30/26/?title=Linden%20Village
[15:49]	Ryozu Kojima:	Heh
[15:49]	Jewella Jewell:	wow you are hard, really
[15:49]	Benja Kepler:	and a wall screen - like Minority Report
[15:49]	Benjamin Linden:	Ryozu, skinning is high on the list
[15:49]	Jewella Jewell:	thank you
[15:49]	Wyn Galbraith:	We really don't wat to talk about that here now. Won't do any good.
[15:49]	Squirrel Wood:	Wiinterface ^^
[15:49]	Benjamin Linden:	later this year it will be much easier to skin the client
[15:49]	Benja Kepler giggles
[15:49]	Ryozu Kojima:	I hear there's a new UI engine on the horizon
[15:50]	Benjamin Linden:	and we're working on a new look and feel that will modernize the appearance of the viewer
[15:50]	Jewella Jewell:	later this year maybe there is nobodya to skin the client
[15:50]	Benjamin Linden:	hopefully make it less dreary and intimidating
[15:50]	Ryozu Kojima:	Dreary?
[15:50]	Ryozu Kojima:	Hehe
[15:50]	Squirrel Wood:	give it a vista like touch ^^
[15:50]	Wyn Galbraith:	Well, SL will be nicer without ugly casinos everywhere :D
[15:51]	JayR Cela:	may i sujest if you make the client UI skinnable / be sure to include an easy go back to normal feature
[15:51]	Lexi Oppewall:	but cutting out slingo and sploders? that's just silly
[15:51]	Kitty Barnett:	I'd like more consistency in the UI really :o menu items move from one update to another sometimes
[15:51]	Very Susanti:	Are casinos history?
[15:51]	Ryozu Kojima:	Also on the subject of the inventory window, it used to be you could move the scrollbar while dragging items in inventory, err, the scrollbar would hot-track the mouse cursor, making it a lot faster to sort things. Doesn't work anymore, how ocme?
[15:51]	Wyn Galbraith:	Ok, I'm going to mute everyone who is not here for this meeting.
[15:51]	Lexi Oppewall:	i'm here for this meeting and to protest the ban on gambling.
[15:51]	Kitty Barnett:	that works for me, Ryozu? :o
[15:51]	JayR Cela:	some of the FireFox skins are horrible and early on once you loaded the skin you were stuck with it
[15:51]	Yun Niangao too
[15:52]	Ryozu Kojima:	:o
[15:52]	Benja Kepler:	good idea, Wyn. That'#s easier to do with FL and Particpants List
[15:52]	Squirrel Wood:	Gambling is still legal as long as there is no money involved.
[15:52]	Very Susanti:	ah
[15:52]	JayR Cela:	dont want that to happen
[15:52]	Lexi Oppewall:	lol... what's the point of gambling without money??
[15:52]	Wyn Galbraith blesses the Mute button.
[15:52]	Ryozu Kojima:	This is a UI discussion please, let's keep it that way
[15:52]	Very Susanti:	well people will no doubt find ways arround it
[15:52]	Benja Kepler:	or Mute checkbox in FirstLook
[15:52]	Benjamin Linden:	Ryozu, what was the question about the inventory scrollbar?
[15:53]	Lexi Oppewall thought this was a more important meeting about keeping censorship and us law out of sl
[15:53]	Ryozu Kojima:	Used to be, if I clicked and draggged something in inventory, I could move the cursor over the inventory scrollbar, and it would hot-track, IE go to the position of my mouse cursor, making it a lot faster to scroll a long inventory list
[15:53]	Yun Niangao agrees with Lexi
[15:53]	Ryozu Kojima:	Doesn't seem to work for me anymore
[15:53]	Squirrel Wood:	http://slurl.com/secondlife/Ambleside/88/30/26/?title=Linden%20Village - Every tuesday at 11AM SLT. Robin Linden is the one you want to complain to.
[15:53]	Very Susanti:	no it is about keeping bad UI paradigms out of the browser
[15:53]	Ryozu Kojima:	Is that just me? If not, any chance we can see that come back?
[15:54]	Benjamin Linden:	let me try it Ryozu, I'm not sure I've seen this before
[15:54]	Lexi Oppewall:	thanks squirrel
[15:54]	Kitty Barnett:	I just hold it to the top and the bottom and then it still scrolls :o
[15:54]	Ryozu Kojima:	You can still move the cursor to the top/bottom of the window and it will scroll, but much much slower
[15:54]	Roof Doors:	greendayrox Beck is at the door.
[15:54]	Benjamin Linden:	yeah that doesn't seem to work
[15:55]	Benjamin Linden:	I'll ask around to see if something changed
[15:55]	Ryozu Kojima:	What I'm talking about is, while still moving an inventory item, the scrollbar would move as if you had clicked and dragged it
[15:55]	Ryozu Kojima:	Yeah
[15:55]	Ryozu Kojima:	It made sorting long inventory lists easier
[15:55]	Ryozu Kojima:	Faster anyways
[15:55]	Very Susanti:	are the mvolume controls and mute voice buttons disabled atm?
[15:55]	Benjamin Linden:	that's a bug
[15:55]	Very Susanti:	voice volume controls
[15:55]	Benjamin Linden:	in the communicate window?
[15:55]	Ryozu Kojima:	Yeah
[15:55]	Very Susanti:	yes
[15:55]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, it's a bug
[15:56]	Very Susanti:	ia it scheduled to be fixed soon?
[15:56]	Very Susanti:	or is it more involved?
[15:56]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, before launch
[15:56]	Benjamin Linden:	very soon
[15:56]	Very Susanti:	when is launch?
[15:56]	Very Susanti:	lots of islands aren't voice ready yet
[15:56]	Benjamin Linden:	it was supposed to be next week but it may get pushed out
[15:57]	Very Susanti:	will there be a large number of new voice eanbled sims too?
[15:58]	Benjamin Linden:	wow Nice, awesome particles!
[15:58]	Benjamin Linden:	where did you get that?
[15:58]	Benjamin Linden:	Very, I believe voice is still being rolled out across the grid
[15:58]	Benjamin Linden:	new regions come online every day
[15:58]	Benja Kepler:	Ctrll Alt Shift =
[15:58]	Nice Slade:	hab ich durch spielen gewonnen._)
[15:58]	Babbler3.17: I through to play won. _)
[15:58]	Very Susanti:	haha yeah I know
[15:59]	Very Susanti:	but not mine yet :((
[15:59]	Squirrel Wood:	Oh. Ben. Voice is enabled here. I see who has voice on but I can't hear a thing nor talk through voice.
[15:59]	Benjamin Linden:	sorry about that, I don't actually own the schedule
[15:59]	Very Susanti:	I know
[15:59]	Benjamin Linden:	hmm, that's odd Squirrel
[15:59]	Ryozu Kojima:	Well, I haven't heard anyone talking
[15:59]	Ryozu Kojima:	But I figured that's because no one was talking
[16:00]	Very Susanti:	I had to diable it earlier cause I couldn't shut some idiots up
[16:00]	Ryozu Kojima:	Hear the occasional mic static
[16:00]	Wyn Galbraith doesn't have a headset yet.
[16:00]	Nice Slade:	war frei haa
[16:00]	Babbler3.17: was free haa
[16:00]	Benjamin Linden:	I don't use voice during office hours, it's too distracting
[16:00]	Benjamin Linden:	I have a hard enough time keeping up with the conversation in chat :-)
[16:00]	Ryozu Kojima:	Also: No logs
[16:00]	Benjamin Linden:	that too Ryozu
[16:00]	Benja Kepler:	good point
[16:00]	Kitty Barnett:	office hour podcasts :p
[16:00]	Squirrel Wood:	I saw the dot above me emit waves but very faint and white ones.
[16:01]	Ryozu Kojima:	So I avoid it
[16:01]	Very Susanti:	well that can be positive too :)
[16:01]	Benja Kepler:	it'd have to be a podcast?
[16:01]	Benjamin Linden:	hmm podcasts, interesting idea
[16:01]	Benja Kepler:	;)
[16:01]	Benjamin Linden:	ok folks we're out of time
[16:01]	Benja Kepler:	thx Benjamin
[16:01]	Ryozu Kojima:	Heh
[16:02]	Squirrel Wood:	Oh My.
[16:02]	Benjamin Linden:	you can stay here and hang out with the protestors if you like :-)
[16:02]	Wyn Galbraith:	Closer people the little dot gets green )) around it.
[16:02]	Kitty Barnett:	can I nag for a bear quick? :)
[16:02]	Ryozu Kojima:	=P
[16:02]	Very Susanti:	haha
[16:02]	Wyn Galbraith:	Ah... na, thanks Benjamin.
[16:02]	Squirrel Wood:	Bears! ^^
[16:02]	Benjamin Linden:	sure Kitty if I can find you in the crowd
[16:02]	Kitty Barnett:	hehe in front of you :o
[16:02]	Nice Slade gave you Atom Spinner Orbital, blue, multicolor particles v.1.0.
[16:02]	Wyn Galbraith doesn't know if she has a Benjamin bear. "I'll have to check then get one if I don't.
[16:02]	Wyn Galbraith needs to carry a list.
[16:02]	JayR Cela:	bye-Byee every one / give the Nicholaz SL client a try heres the address again in case you missed it // http://nicholaz-beresford.blogspot.com/
[16:03]	Benjamin Linden:	I'm sure you must Wyn
[16:03]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks again for the link JayR, I'll let you know what I think
[16:03]	Ryozu Kojima hugs her MichaelFrancis Bear =)
[16:03]	JayR Cela:	ok Benjamin / see yaz all
[16:03]	Wyn Galbraith:	Ah..
[16:03]	Kitty Barnett:	hehe Linden bears should be snuggle bears too! :)
[16:03]	Kitty Barnett:	yay thankies Benjamin :)
[16:04]	Ryozu Kojima is stabbed by her bear: Silly Mech parts
[16:04]	Wyn Galbraith:	I don't have one of those, MIchaelFranics. Should have asked Enus for his too.
[16:04]	Benjamin Linden:	you're welcome! my bear is sort of spikey though :-)
[16:04]	Kitty Barnett:	won't be snuggling it then :o lol
[16:04]	Wyn Galbraith needs to make a Wyn Bear.
[16:04]	Benjamin Linden:	bye everyone, see you Tuesday!