User:Nock Forager/Sandbox/Office Hour logs

Transcript of Linden's office hours:

[8:01]	Babbage Linden:	hi nick
[8:01]	Babbage Linden:	hi becky
[8:01]	Nock Forager:	Hi Babbaage
[8:01]	Babbage Linden:	nock, sorry
[8:01]	Nock Forager:	NP, everybody misspelled at first. :)
[8:02]	Babbage Linden:	thanks for coming
[8:02]	Nock Forager:	hmm, acctually I'm not a good scripter. Here to listen some update infor about Mono...
[8:03]	Babbage Linden:	that's fine
[8:03]	Nock Forager:	Bugs differences bitween LSL2 and Mono.
[8:03]	Babbage Linden:	i'll wait a few minutes for people to turn up, then give an overview of where we are
[8:04]	Fake Fitzgerald:	hi
[8:04]	Babbage Linden:	hi fake
[8:04]	Nock Forager:	lol everybody fall
[8:04]	Becky Pippen:	wheeee
[8:04]	Babbage Linden:	it's possible to make it across if you're lucky
[8:04]	Fake Fitzgerald:	I didn't fall
[8:05]	Babbage Linden:	hi miya
[8:05]	Creem Pye:	thanks
[8:05]	Miya Watanabe:	hello
[8:05]	Creem Pye:	howdy
[8:06]	Babbage Linden:	hi creem
[8:06]	Nock Forager:	Hi
[8:06]	Fake Fitzgerald:	hi
[8:06]	Babbage Linden:	let's give people a couple more minutes, then i'll start
[8:06]	Babbage Linden:	i'll ping the Mono groups too
[8:08]	Babbage Linden:	so, here's where we are with 1.24
[8:09]	Babbage Linden:	we had some problems initially with a debug server build, which was causing problems with 1.24.1
[8:09]	Babbage Linden:	then 1.24.2 fixed a number of crash bugs with features other than mono
[8:09]	Babbage Linden:	and 1.24.3
[8:10]	Babbage Linden:	after looking at the crash bugs, the next priority was issues that affect both LSL and Mono scripts
[8:10]	Babbage Linden:	as these affect existing content
[8:11]	Babbage Linden:	1.24.4 which we're rolling out now fixed a problem with LSL script scheduling that was causing state_exit events to run slowly
[8:11]	Babbage Linden:	as well as state changes
[8:11]	Babbage Linden:	with scripting running on the original scripting engine
[8:11]	Creem Pye:	ah, so there will no longer be a 22ms delay for state changes?
[8:11]	Babbage Linden:	as well as in some cases the order of timer events vs state_exit and state_entry events
[8:11]	Babbage Linden:	correct creem
[8:12]	Babbage Linden:	what was happening in 1.24.1-3 is that scripts were yielding when a state change was pending
[8:12]	Babbage Linden:	so, you could only do 1 state change per time slice and so per frame
[8:13]	Babbage Linden:	also, because scripts were yielding all the time when state changes were pending, that slowed down state entry a lot
[8:13]	Babbage Linden:	as a sim running at 45 hz has a frame time of 22ms, that made it look like state changes were taking longer
[8:13]	Babbage Linden:	they weren't, they were just being gated by the frame rate
[8:13]	Creem Pye nods
[8:14]	Babbage Linden:	also, the event ordering was changing as previously state_exit and state_entry events were being run immediately
[8:14]	Babbage Linden:	in 1.23 and before
[8:14]	Babbage Linden:	when the script was yielding on state change pending, it gave a timer event the chance to sneak in before the state_entry/exit event
[8:15]	Babbage Linden:	1.24.4 also fixes a problem with llEmail
[8:15]	Babbage Linden:	that caused email to not be delivered to a script under some circumstances
[8:16]	Babbage Linden:	and fixed a problem with prepending to a list having side effects
[8:16]	Babbage Linden:	we're now moving on to looking at problems which only affect Mono scripts
[8:16]	Creem Pye:	will scripts need to be reset to take advantage of these fixes?
[8:17]	Babbage Linden:	we'd really like to be able to get a good repro for http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2908
[8:17]	Babbage Linden:	which i think is actually a number of separate issues
[8:17]	Babbage Linden:	but we haven't been able to repro any of them yet
[8:18]	Babbage Linden:	we're currentlly looking at http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2751
[8:18]	Babbage Linden:	which has a good repro
[8:18]	Babbage Linden:	and then will probably tackle the other Mono specific bugs in http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-1276
[8:18]	Babbage Linden:	if nothing else comes up in the meantime
[8:18]	Babbage Linden:	creem, no you don't need to reset scripts to see the fixes to the scheduler
[8:19]	Babbage Linden:	the changes are in the simulator code
[8:19]	Babbage Linden:	and will take effect on running scripts
[8:19]	Creem Pye:	hm the svc-2751 repro could use some llSleeop functions I think
[8:20]	Creem Pye:	sometimes chat arrives out of order, even within the same event
[8:20]	Babbage Linden:	yes, agreed
[8:20]	Creem Pye:	(but I guess if you had another object in the same sim listening, it should always receive messages in the correct order)
[8:20]	Babbage Linden:	moon metty tried it with llSleep(3) calls and still saw the problem
[8:21]	Babbage Linden:	and http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2365 suggests there are other problems with scripts being reset
[8:21]	Babbage Linden:	so that's where we are now
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	new crash bugs seem to have been fixed
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	LSL2 is mostly working as it was
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	and we're going to look at the Mono only issues next
[8:22]	Babbage Linden:	sound reasonable?
[8:22]	Creem Pye:	sure
[8:23]	Creem Pye:	I have a question - will the state change fixes in 1.24 affect the execution speed of on_rez at all?
[8:23]	Creem Pye:	oops 1.24.4
[8:23]	Babbage Linden:	no
[8:23]	Becky Pippen:	sounds like you've accomplished a lot of fixes already! Those reset issues are nasty.... hope they are easy to find and fix.
[8:23]	Babbage Linden:	are you seeing rez behave more slowly for scripts running on the original scripting engine creem?
[8:24]	Babbage Linden:	(Mono scripts rez more slowly as they do more work)
[8:24]	Creem Pye:	yeah, running slightly more slowly (~1 frame), and also using up slightly more script time than LSL2
[8:25]	Babbage Linden:	hi zena
[8:25]	Creem Pye:	the application I was looking at was scripted bullets, and they "initialize" on rez to become enabled. And with their speed, the execution speed of on_rez affects the minimum range
[8:25]	Zena Juran:	hiyas everyone :-)
[8:25]	Babbage Linden:	the on_rez handler should run fine
[8:26]	Creem Pye:	I'm using llSetName() in that function, so maybe the UTF16 being used in Mon ois causing the slight slowdown
[8:26]	Babbage Linden:	but Mono has to check a digital signature when it first rezes an assembly which takes longer
[8:26]	Creem Pye:	er llSetObjectName
[8:26]	Babbage Linden:	but with bullets you are probably rezzing the same script repeatedly, so should only see that hit the first time
[8:26]	Babbage Linden:	Mono also has to do more set up of objects than LSL
[8:27]	Creem Pye:	ah I see
[8:27]	Babbage Linden:	so rezzing can take slightly longer
[8:27]	Becky Pippen:	are there any tricks to minimize that setup time?
[8:27]	Babbage Linden:	make sure you do as much script sharing as possible
[8:28]	Babbage Linden:	it minimises the time the simulator spends checking signatures
[8:28]	Babbage Linden:	and saves memory too
[8:28]	Babbage Linden:	so, if you have a display with lots of XYText scripts for example
[8:28]	Babbage Linden:	copy the same compiled script in to the object many times
[8:29]	Babbage Linden:	instead of using recompile scripts in selection
[8:29]	Creem Pye:	in terestsing
[8:29]	Babbage Linden:	which will create a new XYText assembly for each script
[8:29]	Nock Forager:	hmhm
[8:29]	Babbage Linden:	if everyone takes copies of the same script when they use popular scripts
[8:30]	Babbage Linden:	sharing will happen between objects too
[8:30]	Babbage Linden wants to see only one XYText assembly per simulator
[8:30]	Creem Pye:	btw since it seems that scripts in an avatar's inventory remember if they were compiled as LSL2 or Mono, it might be nice to have a UI option in the script editor, when the script is in avatar inventory
[8:30]	Creem Pye:	(the same "Mono" checkbox, I guess)
[8:31]	Babbage Linden:	that's tricky, as the simulator populates the checkbox by examining the bytecode
[8:31]	Babbage Linden:	the dataserver doesn't know if a script in your inventory is mono or lsl
[8:32]	Babbage Linden:	we could extend the database to store that information
[8:32]	Creem Pye:	but the script in your inventory has its bytecode attached?
[8:32]	Babbage Linden:	but it would be considerably more work
[8:33]	Babbage Linden:	also, knowing whether nested objects contain mono scripts is even harder
[8:33]	Babbage Linden:	so showing a mono checkbox for objects is really hard
[8:33]	Babbage Linden:	you would have to recurse through the object checking the information for all scripts
[8:34]	Becky Pippen:	makes sense
[8:34]	Babbage Linden:	so, it would be nice to have
[8:34]	Creem Pye:	hm yeah, nested objects also often don't reflect the true permissions
[8:34]	Babbage Linden:	but a lot of work
[8:34]	Babbage Linden:	hi tegg
[8:34]	Tegg Bode:	Hi All
[8:35]	Creem Pye:	hello
[8:35]	Babbage Linden:	any other questions?
[8:35]	Nock Forager:	Hi Tegg, Imaze, Keimar
[8:35]	Babbage Linden:	how have peoples experiences with mono been?
[8:35]	Babbage Linden:	hi imaze
[8:35]	Keimar Kuhn:	Hi
[8:35]	Imaze Rhiano:	hi
[8:35]	Creem Pye:	very smooth sailing so far. my only annoyance was that batch-converting scripts would enable scripts that were disabled
[8:36]	Babbage Linden:	ah, interesting
[8:36]	Babbage Linden:	could you file that as a bug please?
[8:36]	Creem Pye:	sure
[8:36]	Babbage Linden:	if it's not already in jira
[8:36]	Babbage Linden:	i haven't seen that yet
[8:37]	Creem Pye:	sure thing
[8:37]	Babbage Linden:	hi gabriel
[8:37]	Gabriel Linden:	hiya
[8:37]	Gabriel Linden:	hows it going?
[8:38]	Imaze Rhiano:	there has been also some negetive noise about Mono in scripter groups
[8:38]	Imaze Rhiano:	saying that mono is crashing sim, consuming more processor time, etc...
[8:39]	Babbage Linden:	i'm not aware of any mono crash bugs at this point
[8:39]	Babbage Linden:	i'd be interested in seeing mono using more processor time too
[8:39]	Gabriel Linden:	yeah
[8:39]	Babbage Linden:	it may use slightly more when scripts are doing nothing
[8:39]	Babbage Linden:	as mono scripts check whether they need to migrate when they're run
[8:40]	Imaze Rhiano:	I tried to ask from them what they are talking about - but no one didn't provide list of crash bugs or examples
[8:40]	Tegg Bode:	I am getting a lot more crashing this week on both RC and 1.20, and not using mono scripts yet :)
[8:40]	Babbage Linden:	there have been problems with the web services this week
[8:40]	Babbage Linden:	that have caused concurrency drops
[8:40]	Creem Pye:	heavy text processing could be slower with mono, right?
[8:41]	Babbage Linden:	but we're seeing a pretty low crash rate with 1.24.4.95600
[8:41]	Creem Pye:	like llList2CSV(llCSV2List()) of something really long
[8:41]	Gabriel Linden:	so these might be coincidence, as many people are thinking about mono atm
[8:41]	Babbage Linden:	mono has to convert strings to utf-8 when passing them to library calls implemented in C++
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	that could take longer
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	which is the common case
[8:42]	Babbage Linden:	but in generally Marshalling data from Mono to C++ is very fast
[8:42]	Imaze Rhiano:	what about those reports about using more cpu time? could it be that all SIM monitor tools are not yet optimized for Mono?
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	some of the library calls have been reimplemented in managed code and should run much faster there
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	lists are now implemented as ArrayLists for Mono scripts
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	so indexing in to them should be constant time instead of requiring a search
[8:43]	Babbage Linden:	for example
[8:44]	Babbage Linden:	i'd like to see examples where running Mono scripts use more time than LSL"
[8:44]	Babbage Linden:	i haven't seen any examples yet
[8:44]	Gabriel Linden:	its very unlikely you'd see a huge jump in cpu time imho
[8:44]	Babbage Linden:	just idle scripts using up slightly more time
[8:45]	Creem Pye:	maybe the performance hit adds up if there are thousands of idle scripts in a sim
[8:45]	Christos Atlantis:	does that idle time affect the sim, if there are alot of idle scripts , like in a furniture store that has poseballs in almost every piece
[8:45]	Bartlee Arai:	It would be nice if you had a suite where you could do compartive analysis of mono to lsl and track local maxima
[8:46]	Babbage Linden:	imaze, most of those are now fixed in 1.24.4
[8:46]	Babbage Linden:	see the mono meta issue in jira for the status
[8:46]	Bartlee Arai:	comparative*
[8:46]	Imaze Rhiano:	ok - that was list I received last night
[8:46]	Imaze Rhiano:	so - it was bit outdated info then
[8:46]	Babbage Linden:	creem, long term, idle scripts shouldn't consume any CPU time
[8:47]	Jam Meili:	do thousand idle scripts contribute then more to sim lag then before?
[8:47]	Babbage Linden:	they should be moved to a non-running scripts list
[8:47]	Babbage Linden:	and only become runnable when they have pending events
[8:47]	Babbage Linden:	we have plans to address that
[8:47]	Babbage Linden:	but it may not be for a while
[8:48]	Babbage Linden:	in the meantime, i doubt the extra work mono scripts do would have a noticable effect
[8:48]	Babbage Linden:	even with 1000s of them in a sim
[8:49]	Christos Atlantis:	I heard mono scripts taste like chicken
[8:49]	Christos Atlantis:	to many rumours
[8:49]	Babbage Linden:	yes, agreed
[8:50]	Babbage Linden:	mono was the biggest change in 1.24
[8:50]	Nock Forager:	yes, many rumours :)
[8:50]	Christos Atlantis:	most are saying we should not recomplie
[8:50]	Babbage Linden:	so is being cited as the cause of many things
[8:50]	Bartlee Arai:	How long before Mono is where you think it needs to be, ball park?
[8:50]	Babbage Linden:	but mostly, if you're not running mono scripts, your problem is unlikely to be mono
[8:50]	Babbage Linden:	and for most people, most of the time, mono scripts will work fine
[8:51]	Bartlee Arai:	the good old 90 10
[8:51]	Jam Meili:	why it seems mono affects also old scripts? is that mono-related or just bugs that happened in modified servercode?
[8:51]	Christos Atlantis:	one small thing I did notice, is that the speed of the scripts is a bit faster when running a swarm script, it made the pet move faster
[8:51]	Gabriel Linden:	we need good reproducable cases if issues are found, if everyone avoids recompilation we wont get them
[8:52]	Babbage Linden:	we left the original scripting engine alone as much as possible
[8:52]	Babbage Linden:	but we needed to make a few changes to allow mono to run alongside it
[8:52]	Babbage Linden:	the state change problems are a good example
[8:52]	Babbage Linden:	the old scripting engine interpretted 1 instruction at a time
[8:53]	Babbage Linden:	Mono executes small pieces of code at once
[8:53]	Babbage Linden:	so we had to change the script scheduling code to cope with both engines
[8:53]	Christos Atlantis:	one more dumb question, if I am the owner of a script and recompile it, will all others using my script have a there items recompiled also?
[8:53]	Babbage Linden:	and managed to subtly change script execution behaviour in the process
[8:54]	Babbage Linden:	christos, no
[8:54]	Babbage Linden:	only the copy you recompile
[8:54]	Jam Meili:	ok, so that "eps" in the statistics is referred to that pieces of code that run at once? or how should we interpret that?
[8:54]	Babbage Linden:	it's like saving a script to produce a new script
[8:54]	Jam Meili:	are that library calls in c# or something?
[8:54]	Christos Atlantis:	so we have to recompile every single script in our stores?
[8:54]	Babbage Linden:	other objects still reference the old bytecode asset and so don't change
[8:55]	Babbage Linden:	christos, if you want to create new versions of all of them yes
[8:55]	Babbage Linden:	if they share scripts, the better way is to recompile 1
[8:55]	Babbage Linden:	then copy the new scripts in to the others
[8:55]	Babbage Linden:	to get more bytecode sharing
[8:55]	Babbage Linden:	you'll also want to test all the objects to make sure they work after conversion too
[8:56]	Christos Atlantis:	I have 7000 pieces of furniture in 5 stores, that is a very big task
[8:56]	Babbage Linden:	christos, agreed
[8:56]	Creem Pye:	ko Babbage, I've created a Jira item for the batch script conversion bug: SVC-2987
[8:56]	Babbage Linden:	you need to decide whether converting the scripts inside makes sense
[8:56]	Babbage Linden:	thanks creem
[8:57]	Babbage Linden:	jam, the eps change was due to Mono running small pieces of code at once
[8:57]	Babbage Linden:	we have no way of counting instructions with Mono easily
[8:57]	Christos Atlantis:	ok, so if I do not convert, will the furniture ie (pose balls) stop working
[8:57]	Jam Meili:	each recompile creates a new c# assembly, so i guess it uses also more memory if we compile same scripts in each prims over and over, is that right?
[8:57]	Babbage Linden:	so, instead we count how many events the script it executing
[8:58]	Babbage Linden:	which can be compared between Mono scripts and scripts running on the original scripting engine (OSE from now on)
[8:58]	Babbage Linden:	christos, if you don't convert your scripts they will continue to run as before
[8:59]	Christos Atlantis:	ok, ty those where my main concerns, I can now make logical choices
[8:59]	Babbage Linden:	jam, if you keep compiling scripts over and over
[8:59]	Babbage Linden:	eventually Mono unloads them if they're not being referenced by a script
[9:00]	Babbage Linden:	so, you don't need to worry about that
[9:00]	Babbage Linden:	but, you should try to have as many objects reference each assembly as possible
[9:00]	Babbage Linden:	to minimise the numbers of assemblies that mono needs to keep around
[9:00]	Jam Meili:	hum i said it maybe wrong. i mean if i use the same script like in hudred prims and isntead of copying one compiled in all, if i would create a script in each and recompile the source, it would use like hundred times more memory?
[9:00]	Babbage Linden:	it doesn't know that scripts are the same just because they have the same source
[9:01]	Babbage Linden:	but if you drag compiled scripts in to objects, it knows that they are sharing
[9:01]	Jam Meili:	so we could tune our scripts in that way, what wasnt possible in the old engine?
[9:01]	Babbage Linden:	and only needs to keep 1 assembly in memory
[9:01]	Creem Pye:	it would be nice if the scripts had a checksum on the bytecode to check if they're identical
[9:01]	Babbage Linden:	the OSE didn't do any sharing
[9:01]	Becky Pippen:	Is OSE the new term for the LSL VM back end? It's the term that replaces awkward names like LS2VM, or LSL-LSO, or LSL2LSOVM... ?
[9:01]	Babbage Linden:	so, if you had 1000 bullets flying around
[9:01]	Babbage Linden:	each would use 16K
[9:02]	Babbage Linden:	with Mono, they might use 1K shared between them
[9:02]	Babbage Linden:	if all the guns contained copies of the same compiled script
[9:02]	Christos Atlantis:	will mono allow for you to implement use of other scripting and programing choices in SL?
[9:02]	Creem Pye:	creating the UUID of a script based on its sha-160 checksum would be nice =)
[9:02]	Babbage Linden:	christos, yest
[9:02]	Christos Atlantis:	:)
[9:02]	Jam Meili:	ok, thats great and hopefully will make combat sims and such to work better. is there another mono-related impriovement we could use to tune the usage of resources on a sim?
[9:02]	Babbage Linden:	it will allow us to enable other languages to script SL in the long term
[9:03]	Babbage Linden:	we have been careful to keep that option open while working on LSL on Mono
[9:03]	Babbage Linden:	but there is still more work to be done before we get there
[9:03]	Christos Atlantis:	well, my dream would be if I could see a game engine running inside SL
[9:04]	Babbage Linden:	jam, bytecode sharing is the big thing that you can do to help Mono work effeciently
[9:04]	Christos Atlantis:	that would make the possibilities endless, mini games inside SL like a WoW
[9:04]	Babbage Linden:	Christos, SL is like a game engine in many ways
[9:05]	Babbage Linden:	lots of game engines have scripting engines and physics engines like SL
[9:05]	Babbage Linden:	games like dark life have been WoW like games in SL for a long time
[9:05]	Christos Atlantis:	yes, but it lacks the tools to make a good platform for developing game play
[9:05]	Creem Pye:	one thing you'd need to do is give estate managers much more control over what avatars can do
[9:05]	Babbage Linden:	there are some missing features, agreed
[9:06]	Creem Pye:	like forbid external attachments, and maybe force an avatar to have a certain style of appearance
[9:06]	Babbage Linden:	and many people are building things other than games
[9:06]	Babbage Linden:	so, we need to be careful to keep the platform neutral
[9:06]	Christos Atlantis:	like being able to control movement of props in non linear routes
[9:06]	Babbage Linden:	and make extensions where they are most useful to the most people
[9:06]	Imaze Rhiano:	if you want game development for SL - then you need also better controls for texture usage and model/prim usage for SIM owners
[9:06]	Creem Pye:	yep
[9:07]	Imaze Rhiano:	but that is bit offtopic
[9:07]	Babbage Linden:	we want to enable the widest array of applications possible in SL
[9:07]	Babbage Linden:	but we have limited resources
[9:07]	Babbage Linden:	so have to be smart about prioritizing improvements
[9:07]	Creem Pye:	megasims would be a nice start :D
[9:08]	Creem Pye is a vehicle creator
[9:08]	Christos Atlantis:	I think the number 1 with residents is stability, so I will agree with you, you need to keep it stable for a long period and understand it before adding more features
[9:09]	Babbage Linden:	and most of the effort at linden is working on stability
[9:09]	Jam Meili:	hehe megasims would require changes in alot of parts of the server- and viewercode as also to expect owners would use server resources wisely, i guess we should not expect that any time soon, it's not very realistically right now
[9:09]	Babbage Linden:	which is why the scripting improvements are relatively slow in coming
[9:09]	Christos Atlantis:	and scaleability is also something I would think will help
[9:09]	Babbage Linden:	Mono was mostly me working on my own until near the end of the project
[9:09]	Christos Atlantis:	wow
[9:09]	Christos Atlantis:	great job!
[9:09]	Bartlee Arai:	Nice
[9:09]	Nock Forager:	yup!
[9:09]	Babbage Linden:	help! i'm being beaten with a car
[9:09]	Creem Pye:	yep, it's working quite smoothly so far =)
[9:10]	Creem Pye:	Babbage, do you expect the script memory limit wil be raised in teh future?
[9:10]	Creem Pye:	it would be nice if objects could consolidate their functions to a single script
[9:10]	Babbage Linden:	gabriel, si, daveh, vektor and periapse did a lot of work over the last year too
[9:10]	Christos Atlantis:	I think I have skid marks on my forehead
[9:10]	Tegg Bode:	I think games would hae a better chance of working if we could reduce our continual downloading of textures by perhaps having a basic default texture set for walls & floors on our hard drives
[9:10]	Creem Pye:	(I imagine that without link messages etc, efficiency could be greatly improved)
[9:10]	Babbage Linden:	creem pye, that is also on our wish list
[9:10]	Babbage Linden:	proper script libraries
[9:11]	Babbage Linden:	so you can share code between scripts
[9:11]	Babbage Linden:	and develop general purpose libraries that can be used by other scripts
[9:11]	Babbage Linden:	instead of having to send them link messages
[9:11]	Babbage Linden:	or chat messages
[9:11]	Creem Pye:	even functions like llLinkParticleSystem() to set a particle system centered around a link in the object would be nice
[9:12]	Creem Pye:	instead of having to have a separate script in a child prim for particles, commanded by the main script through link messages
[9:12]	Christos Atlantis:	I have tried 5 times in my life to learn programing this is the closest to heaven for me, and for that I would like to thank you guys and the people that help in groups, like Jam and co
[9:12]	Babbage Linden:	glad to hear it christos!
[9:12]	Jam Meili:	uuh .. thank you :)
[9:12]	Babbage Linden:	:-)
[9:13]	Bartlee Arai:	will the old scripting engine be replaced eventually once transparency has been acheived?
[9:13]	Gabriel Linden:	teaching the world to code
[9:13]	Christos Atlantis:	your both welcome, its amazing to see what can be done
[9:13]	Jam Meili:	and yes, mono is a great improvement even it has some beginning problems (that will sure be fixed)
[9:13]	Babbage Linden:	ok, we should wrap up there i think
[9:13]	Babbage Linden:	so gabriel and i can get back to fixing bugs
[9:14]	Christos Atlantis:	ty for for your time
[9:14]	Babbage Linden:	if you find any problems, please file them in to jira
[9:14]	Imaze Rhiano:	ya...and I need to go shopping new clothes... :P
[9:14]	Babbage Linden:	and we'll get on them as soon as possible
[9:14]	Nock Forager:	Thanks for very interestin meeting :)
[9:14]	Babbage Linden:	and if you see a repro for http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2908
[9:14]	Babbage Linden:	please let us know
[9:14]	Christos Atlantis:	nice seeing you all here
[9:14]	Miya Watanabe:	thank you for the meeting
[9:14]	Babbage Linden:	hopefully i'll see you all here next week
[9:14]	Babbage Linden:	thanks for coming
[9:14]	Gabriel Linden:	thanks, and cya'all around
[9:15]	Tegg Bode:	Thanks both of you for your efforts :)
[9:15]	Creem Pye:	thanks for your help!
[9:16]	Imaze Rhiano:	does Mono have metaobject in Jita?
[9:17]	Babbage Linden:	yes
[9:17]	Nock Forager:	ah Babbage, Don't you mind if I put this office hour log on your wiki profile page?
[9:17]	Babbage Linden:	http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-1276
[9:17]	Babbage Linden:	is the beta jira
[9:17]	Babbage Linden:	nock, that's fine
[9:17]	Babbage Linden:	it will save me a job :-)
[9:17]	Babbage Linden:	i'll leave my bear here
[9:17]	Nock Forager:	:)
[9:17]	Babbage Linden:	to auto return in 15 minutes
[9:17]	Christos Atlantis:	:)
[9:18]	Babbage Linden:	there you go
[9:18]	Babbage Linden:	should be copyable
[9:18]	Babbage Linden:	or you can buy it for 0L$
[9:18]	Christos Atlantis:	AWSOME
[9:18]	Christos Atlantis:	ty :)
[9:18]	Babbage Linden:	ok, see you all next week
[9:19]	Imaze Rhiano:	bye
[9:19]	Keimar Kuhn:	bye