Beta Server Office Hours/Minutes/2014-02-27

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[2014/02/27 15:02]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): um...
[2014/02/27 15:03]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): [15:02] Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden) is offline.
[2014/02/27 15:03]  Rex Cronon: the big yello bird is here:)
[2014/02/27 15:03]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): goofball :P
[2014/02/27 15:03]  Baker Linden: hello everyone
[2014/02/27 15:03]  Rex Cronon: hi baker
[2014/02/27 15:03]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Hi guys
[2014/02/27 15:03]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): heya baker!
[2014/02/27 15:03]  Rex Cronon: hi maestro
[2014/02/27 15:03]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): wb mestro!
[2014/02/27 15:03]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Hm, somebody messed with the environment settings in this region
[2014/02/27 15:03]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): lol
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): it's supposed to be darker than this -__-
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Jenna Felton: hello Baker and Maestro
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Jenna Felton: and All
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Rex Cronon: hi jenna
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Inara Breen: Hi, Maestro, Baker
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Zenith Subchair final p: whispers: Hi Jenna Felton! Touch me for Menu. Say /1a to Adjust.
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): So, we have two main topics today
[2014/02/27 15:04]  Whirly Fizzle: Its dark for me on estate settings
[2014/02/27 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): hm, I chose 'use region settings' and it's sunset
[2014/02/27 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): anyway, the two topics are..
[2014/02/27 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 1) usual weekly updates
[2014/02/27 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 2) group ban talk
[2014/02/27 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): I'll get (1) out of the way first
[2014/02/27 15:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Server_Beta_User_Group#Updates
[2014/02/27 15:06]  Nal (nalates.urriah): What stuck to me? ...
[2014/02/27 15:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Jenna's ball?
[2014/02/27 15:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): the main channel received the maintenance server that was on all 3 RCs last week
[2014/02/27 15:06]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): 3) BUG-5222
[2014/02/27 15:06]  Jenna Felton: sorry that are balls created at position the mat is collided with :)
[2014/02/27 15:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Ok Tankmaster
[2014/02/27 15:07]  Nal (nalates.urriah): OK... thx
[2014/02/27 15:07]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): hehe
[2014/02/27 15:07]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): :D
[2014/02/27 15:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): the most visible bug that was addressed with the main channel update was BUG-5034 - the 'log out when region is about to restart' issue that Whirly was having
[2014/02/27 15:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): There were some crash fixes too, which are always nice
[2014/02/27 15:08]  Whirly Fizzle: \o/
[2014/02/27 15:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Whirly, have you had a chance to try more region restarts since Tuesday?
[2014/02/27 15:08]  Whirly Fizzle: No I havnt actually. Ill try later
[2014/02/27 15:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Oh, okay
[2014/02/27 15:09]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): BlueSteel and LeTigre got a new version, which just has 'infrastructure updates'
[2014/02/27 15:09]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): descriptive...
[2014/02/27 15:09]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): There were some system image changes to make the sims easier to manage
[2014/02/27 15:09]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): no actual change to simulator code..
[2014/02/27 15:10]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): so there's not much to talk about there
[2014/02/27 15:11]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Magnum also got this 'infrastructure update', but also got a visible change
[2014/02/27 15:11]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): which was enabling AISv3
[2014/02/27 15:11]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): this is a new version of the inventory API
[2014/02/27 15:11]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): thought you need a AIS3 enabled viewer to use it
[2014/02/27 15:11]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): thougyh*
[2014/02/27 15:11]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): though*
[2014/02/27 15:11]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): yes, only the Sunshine viewer supports it, so far: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_Project_Sunshine/3.7.1.286565伸Ԟ걏㉟�
[2014/02/27 15:12]  Whirly Fizzle: lol you're on a mac ;)
[2014/02/27 15:12]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): the main advantage is that outfit changing is done more intelligently with a single big message instead of many small ones
[2014/02/27 15:12]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): yes I am!
[2014/02/27 15:12]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_Project_Sunshine/3.7.1.286565
[2014/02/27 15:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Here's a pretty verbose description of the API (which is probably only useful if you're writing custom inventory functions) : https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Inventory_API_v3
[2014/02/27 15:13]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): /me makes note maestro is a mac person :P
[2014/02/27 15:13]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Linux too - I'm pretty happy as long as I can avoid Windows :)
[2014/02/27 15:13]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): lol
[2014/02/27 15:14]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): my understanding is that AISv3 has been discussed at the viewer user groups
[2014/02/27 15:14]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): it has
[2014/02/27 15:14]  Rex Cronon: so we could access our inventory from a web browser?
[2014/02/27 15:14]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): weve known about it sence about novmber i think
[2014/02/27 15:15]  Jenna Felton: is this API rather for viewer developers or for viewer users?
[2014/02/27 15:15]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Do any of you have questions? I can't answer most of them directly, but I can ask Don (who's sitting near me)
[2014/02/27 15:15]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): the api is for the viewer itsellf
[2014/02/27 15:15]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): that API documentation is for developers, really
[2014/02/27 15:15]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): the sunshine viewer uses the new AISv3 interface to do inventory operations
[2014/02/27 15:15]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): its the protocal for transfering your inventory from the server to the cache file on your hard drive
[2014/02/27 15:15]  Jenna Felton: ok :) because i not really understood a word in that page :)
[2014/02/27 15:16]  Jenna Felton: ok, thank you
[2014/02/27 15:16]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Yeah.. it's pretty technical and dry.  But I thought I'd throw it in in case somebody wanted more details :)
[2014/02/27 15:16]  Whirly Fizzle: Is there still the limit of ~10k items that will load per inventory folder (where a subfolder counts as 1 item) on AISv3?
[2014/02/27 15:17]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): /me asks
[2014/02/27 15:17]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): th next relase of firestorm will not have this, it wasnt finished in time before we started our latest release processes
[2014/02/27 15:17]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Whirly: "that limit has not changed"
[2014/02/27 15:17]  Whirly Fizzle: Ok ta
[2014/02/27 15:18]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): The Sunshine viewer is still in testing, of course
[2014/02/27 15:19]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): it should make it into RC soon though! :D
[2014/02/27 15:19]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Neat
[2014/02/27 15:19]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): this week or next i believe
[2014/02/27 15:20]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): So the next topic is group ban
[2014/02/27 15:20]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): baker!
[2014/02/27 15:20]  Baker Linden: uh oh
[2014/02/27 15:20]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): \o/
[2014/02/27 15:20]  Baker Linden: now I gotta type
[2014/02/27 15:20]  Baker Linden: ok
[2014/02/27 15:20]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): which will probably be on aditi by this time next week
[2014/02/27 15:20]  Baker Linden: well, I've gotten the backend almost ready for release (I'm waiting on some builds at the moment)
[2014/02/27 15:21]  Jenna Felton: will it make possible to define new inventory types, or to denote a mesh or prim item as a piece of clothing?
[2014/02/27 15:21]  Jenna Felton: just asking
[2014/02/27 15:21]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): will what?
[2014/02/27 15:21]  Jenna Felton: this API
[2014/02/27 15:21]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): no
[2014/02/27 15:22]  Jenna Felton: ok
[2014/02/27 15:22]  Baker Linden: no, it's not anything different, Jenna
[2014/02/27 15:22]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): theres no changeto the user, only for transfering the inventory
[2014/02/27 15:22]  Baker Linden: it's a change that makes that process more reliable
[2014/02/27 15:22]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): (im assumong jenna is still talking about AIS3)
[2014/02/27 15:22]  Baker Linden: yeah
[2014/02/27 15:22]  Jenna Felton: ok, thank you :)
[2014/02/27 15:22]  Jenna Felton: yes i did
[2014/02/27 15:23]  Jenna Felton: its because since we can wear prims as clothing, the logical step wil be to make visible that this box is actually a shoe and that one is a jaket
[2014/02/27 15:23]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): only thing you may notice is that your inventory might load faster
[2014/02/27 15:23]  Jenna Felton: that is also good :)
[2014/02/27 15:24]  Whirly Fizzle: Will there be a group banz viewer available this time next week then? :D
[2014/02/27 15:24]  Baker Linden: I sure hope so, though it'll be a dev viewer, not a release candiatae
[2014/02/27 15:24]  Baker Linden: candidate*
[2014/02/27 15:24]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): whirly wants t break it
[2014/02/27 15:25]  Baker Linden: I know she does
[2014/02/27 15:25]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): But still it will be plenty to test against
[2014/02/27 15:25]  Whirly Fizzle: Yussssss
[2014/02/27 15:25]  Baker Linden: I've talked many previous times about group bans, and now that it's finally boarding the release train, I'd like to just do a quick overview of what known issues are and what it can do
[2014/02/27 15:25]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): We'll compile a list of known issues too
[2014/02/27 15:25]  Baker Linden: So, to recap the many times I've talked about it
[2014/02/27 15:25]  Jenna Felton: you cant type while gigling loudly
[2014/02/27 15:26]  Baker Linden: Group Ban provides the ability to permanently prevent a resident from joining your group.  Currently, the limit will be set to 500 bans per group
[2014/02/27 15:26]  Baker Linden: By default, only Owners will have this ability set
[2014/02/27 15:26]  Baker Linden: Owners must then grant the ability to the roles they want to have manage the ban list
[2014/02/27 15:27]  Baker Linden: You can ban members from the "Members" tab of the group panel, and preemptively ban residents through the new "Banned Agents" tab
[2014/02/27 15:28]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Will someone exhibit the group ban list of recommendation?
[2014/02/27 15:28]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): the intent behind this is to disallow certain residents from joining an otherwise open enrollment group
[2014/02/27 15:28]  Baker Linden: The "Roles" tab will allow you to grant the "Manage Ban List" ability to a role.  when doing this, keep in mind that allowing this ability will also automatically grand the "Eject Memebers from the Group" and "Remove Roles from MEmbers" ability
[2014/02/27 15:29]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Yuzuru: do you mean a list of spammers?
[2014/02/27 15:29]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Yes..
[2014/02/27 15:29]  Whirly Fizzle: Can you right click a PITA user's name who is speaking in group chat & ban from a right click on their name?
[2014/02/27 15:29]  Baker Linden: You will NOT be allowed to disable the "Eject" and "Remove Roles" ability while "Manage Ban List" is allowed.
[2014/02/27 15:29]  Baker Linden: no, Whirly
[2014/02/27 15:29]  Baker Linden: not at the moment
[2014/02/27 15:29]  Rex Cronon: to get a better idea of how this group banning works a diagram would be really helpful:)
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Yuzuru, I don't think Linden Lab will have that list..  but somebody else could make one
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Baker Linden: Rex: select a member of the group, click the ban button -> Banned!
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Thank you, Maestro.
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Baker Linden: sorry that I don't have a diagram
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Baker Linden: :P
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Baker Linden: it'll be very straightforward once you play with it
[2014/02/27 15:30]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): make a diagram of the button!
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Rex Cronon: ok
[2014/02/27 15:30]  Baker Linden: shouts: +=======+
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: whoops
[2014/02/27 15:31]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): lol
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: +=====+
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Jonathan Yap: Ban him!
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: | Ban |
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: +=====+
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: there
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: :P
[2014/02/27 15:31]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): thx!
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: lol
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: anyway
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Rex Cronon: u seem a "little" stressed baker;)
[2014/02/27 15:31]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): he's been working on this for what, 4 months?
[2014/02/27 15:31]  Baker Linden: try like 10
[2014/02/27 15:32]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): im sure he's ready for soemthign different
[2014/02/27 15:32]  Baker Linden: though 6 of it was figuring out code
[2014/02/27 15:32]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Whirly: the initial release won't have a right click -> Ban button, but that would be easy to add later on
[2014/02/27 15:32]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): like fixing group chat lag :P
[2014/02/27 15:32]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): wow, where has th time gone? 10??
[2014/02/27 15:32]  Baker Linden: and figuring out how to run things locally and crap
[2014/02/27 15:32]  Baker Linden: yeah, I learned a lot of things somewhat unrelated to group ban stuff
[2014/02/27 15:32]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): ㋡
[2014/02/27 15:33]  arton Rotaru: crap
[2014/02/27 15:33]  Baker Linden: and more about how the services and stuff run on the backend in general
[2014/02/27 15:33]  Baker Linden: I also refactored a lot of code
[2014/02/27 15:33]  Baker Linden: viewer and server side
[2014/02/27 15:33]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): so you could fix chat lag then, waa hoo!
[2014/02/27 15:33]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): hehe :P
[2014/02/27 15:33]  Baker Linden: no, we got other people working on that
[2014/02/27 15:33]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): oh good
[2014/02/27 15:33]  Baker Linden: WorkingOnItLinden I think is working on it
[2014/02/27 15:34]  Baker Linden: :)
[2014/02/27 15:34]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): I always feel sorry for that guy
[2014/02/27 15:34]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): oh, then itll for sure get fixed... never
[2014/02/27 15:34]  Baker Linden: lol
[2014/02/27 15:34]  Caleb Linden: at least he's working on it
[2014/02/27 15:34]  Lucia Nightfire: Itwillgetdonewhenitgetsdone Linden
[2014/02/27 15:34]  Caleb Linden: haha
[2014/02/27 15:34]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): he's working on a lot of things atm, not one has he ever finishd himself :P
[2014/02/27 15:35]  Whirly Fizzle: Oh, will the group banz code include your avatar picker fixes and the fix for not being able to remove certain objects/avatars from your block list?
[2014/02/27 15:35]  Jenna Felton: speaking of 10. not sure i begged for that already, but i'd love to see the limit of avaiable roles increased from 10 to about 16 please
[2014/02/27 15:35]  Baker Linden: so, 500 bans per group, you get extra abilities when enabling manage ban list, you'll be able to sort by name and by date banned
[2014/02/27 15:35]  Baker Linden: umm,
[2014/02/27 15:35]  Baker Linden: oh
[2014/02/27 15:35]  Baker Linden: when this gets deployed
[2014/02/27 15:36]  Baker Linden: there will be known issues where banning someone may not actually prevent them from rejoining the group
[2014/02/27 15:36]  Lucia Nightfire: lol
[2014/02/27 15:36]  Baker Linden: however, this is because the old sim code won't have the necessary checks to see if someone is banned
[2014/02/27 15:36]  Jonathan Yap: Can you ban a Linden?
[2014/02/27 15:36]  Baker Linden: uhh, prolly
[2014/02/27 15:36]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): ^ this is for the case where group ban is just in RC
[2014/02/27 15:36]  Jonathan Yap: You cannot mute one
[2014/02/27 15:37]  Baker Linden: I don't check too carefully
[2014/02/27 15:37]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): yeah, you can ban a Linden
[2014/02/27 15:37]  Baker Linden: We'll just go in god mode and join the group
[2014/02/27 15:37]  Whirly Fizzle: lol
[2014/02/27 15:37]  Baker Linden: so no, you can't, but you can have a linden's name on the ban list
[2014/02/27 15:37]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): god mode FTW!
[2014/02/27 15:38]  Baker Linden: when you ban someone, they should be automatically ejected from the group
[2014/02/27 15:38]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): the only people you can't add to the ban list are the current group owners
[2014/02/27 15:38]  Baker Linden: as a side effect of me adding this
[2014/02/27 15:38]  Baker Linden: I made the eject code a bit smarter
[2014/02/27 15:38]  Whirly Fizzle: Ejects even if they are on a griffy viewer that can bypass being ejected now?
[2014/02/27 15:39]  Whirly Fizzle: :D
[2014/02/27 15:39]  Baker Linden: so now if you have the appropriate roles enabled, you will automatically eject anyone from the group
[2014/02/27 15:39]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Hm, Whirly: you mean that they leave the group list but don't actually exit group chat, right?
[2014/02/27 15:39]  Baker Linden: so for example, the way it is currently, if you try to ban someone in a role other than "Everyone," you have to first have the "remove roles from members" power, remove all their roles until they're only in the "everyone" role, and then eject them
[2014/02/27 15:40]  Baker Linden: that was a pain, so I made that process automatic, but only if you have both "Eject" and "Remove roles" abilities enabled
[2014/02/27 15:40]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): no, the enforcement for eject is done viewer side
[2014/02/27 15:40]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): so a griffy viewer would just ignore that request
[2014/02/27 15:40]  Baker Linden: which is the reason why I enable both of of these abilities when you enable the ban ability
[2014/02/27 15:41]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): ㋡
[2014/02/27 15:41]  Baker Linden: these abilities will be disabled in the viewer, so you can't have the ban ability without either of these roles
[2014/02/27 15:42]  Baker Linden: it is enforced server-side as well
[2014/02/27 15:42]  Baker Linden: attempitng to add a 501st entry will not be allowed, and does not automatically remove someone from the ban list -- that's up to the banner to remove someone from the list frist
[2014/02/27 15:42]  Baker Linden: first
[2014/02/27 15:43]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): makes sense
[2014/02/27 15:43]  Baker Linden: you will also be able to (hopefully) batch up bans in groups of 100 at a time (through the "Banned Agents" tab)
[2014/02/27 15:43]  Baker Linden: same as inviting residents
[2014/02/27 15:43]  Baker Linden: it's the same code, I just refactored it so I could use it for bans too
[2014/02/27 15:44]  Baker Linden: how reliable banning 100 peeps at a time is going to be another story
[2014/02/27 15:44]  Baker Linden: but let's hoep that doesn't happen too often
[2014/02/27 15:45]  Jonathan Yap: What happens if agent A bans 5 people and at the same time agent B is banning 5 people, and there is some overlap of who is being banned?
[2014/02/27 15:45]  Baker Linden: I don't think duplicates will be possible
[2014/02/27 15:45]  Baker Linden: but
[2014/02/27 15:45]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): itll just crash the chat server is all
[2014/02/27 15:45]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): :P
[2014/02/27 15:46]  Baker Linden: what doesn't :P
[2014/02/27 15:46]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): LOL
[2014/02/27 15:46]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): point
[2014/02/27 15:46]  Baker Linden: it'll be extremely unlikely that a duplicate will be added
[2014/02/27 15:46]  Jonathan Yap: There are several steps to being banned, so I hope there is not a race condition
[2014/02/27 15:46]  Baker Linden: both connections would have to be adding the duplicate at the exact same time, and I think even then our databases are smart enough to lock tables when writing
[2014/02/27 15:46]  Baker Linden: or whatever databases do to do atomic operation
[2014/02/27 15:47]  Baker Linden: I don't know enough about that to know what happens
[2014/02/27 15:47]  Baker Linden: anyway
[2014/02/27 15:47]  Baker Linden: ban lists do not automatically refresh
[2014/02/27 15:47]  Baker Linden: well, that's similar to everytrhing else
[2014/02/27 15:47]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): you don't actually need perfect timing to test that case
[2014/02/27 15:47]  Baker Linden: but I mean, if Alice bans 5 people, and Bob bans 5 other poeple, Alice will see her 5 people on her ban list, Bob will see his 5, but Alice won't see Bob's until she refreshes the list
[2014/02/27 15:48]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 1) UserA bans UserC and UserD
[2014/02/27 15:48]  Baker Linden: I've added a button on the "Banned Agents" tab to refresh only the ban list.  This way, you don't have to refresh the entire group every time you want to see an updated list
[2014/02/27 15:48]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 2) UserB (who has a stale version of  the ban list) bans UserD and UserE
[2014/02/27 15:48]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): 3 ) Does UserE get banned?  Hopefully so.
[2014/02/27 15:49]  Whirly Fizzle: User D is unbanned :D
[2014/02/27 15:49]  Jonathan Yap: and does B get a message "D is already banned" ?
[2014/02/27 15:49]  Baker Linden: Currently, no, but I'm working on trying to get that to happen Jonathan
[2014/02/27 15:49]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): actually that's one of the known issues, Jonathan, "No visual feedback if you try to ban an already banned agent"
[2014/02/27 15:49]  Lucia Nightfire: you don't even get that with land banlists, lol
[2014/02/27 15:49]  Baker Linden: I don't yet know if I can send the viewer a message from the service easily
[2014/02/27 15:49]  Jonathan Yap: Because if you see that message you will know to refresh you list
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Lucia Nightfire: and with prim return lists the latter person will have any open list die
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): I'm not sure how necessary that is, though.. as long as the user remains banned, of course
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Jenna Felton: Also interesting to know. when A bans B, and B bans A at same time, than one of the bans comes first to the server, will the second ban be ejected by the server or also registered?
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Jonathan Yap: yes, it is an edge case
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Baker Linden: Good case, Jenna
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Baker Linden: I hope that never happens
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Baker Linden: but
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Baker Linden: both requests happening closely may cause both to get banned
[2014/02/27 15:50]  Baker Linden: however
[2014/02/27 15:51]  Baker Linden: I argue that if you have two people belonging to roles and both of them want to ban each other, you have bigger issues than worrying about who will get banned :P
[2014/02/27 15:51]  Jenna Felton: that is also true
[2014/02/27 15:52]  Baker Linden: Banning is no joke -- anyone with the ban ability can ban ANYONE ELSE IN THE GROUP, except owners
[2014/02/27 15:52]  Baker Linden: so a senior officer can ban other senior officers
[2014/02/27 15:52]  Lucia Nightfire: not too happy about that one, heh
[2014/02/27 15:52]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): when we have some regions up on Aditi, we can try out these questions
[2014/02/27 15:53]  Jenna Felton: there ar often dramas in SL, even between good friends turned in enemies forever... so that case could happen i think
[2014/02/27 15:53]  arton Rotaru: certainly lol
[2014/02/27 15:53]  Lucia Nightfire: group -infighting is more common than you think
[2014/02/27 15:53]  Lucia Nightfire: drama is everywhere
[2014/02/27 15:53]  Baker Linden: I mean, I figure if you're going to let someone permaban someone from your group, you should have enough trust in them to not do stupid crap like banning all other officers "for funsies"
[2014/02/27 15:53]  Baker Linden: I know drama is everywhere -- I played WoW for 5 years
[2014/02/27 15:53]  Baker Linden: lol
[2014/02/27 15:53]  Jenna Felton: hehe
[2014/02/27 15:54]  Baker Linden: the solution is to simply make a new role that only has manage ban list (and the two prerequisite abilities) enabled, and grant it slowly to people
[2014/02/27 15:54]  Baker Linden: if you don't trust them completely with your group, do NOT grant them ban permissions
[2014/02/27 15:54]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): for reference, I added information about group ban basics here: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Server_Beta_User_Group#Group_Ban_FAQ
[2014/02/27 15:54]  Baker Linden: they will cause you to have a bad day
[2014/02/27 15:54]  Baker Linden: Additionally
[2014/02/27 15:55]  Baker Linden: If you revoke the ban ability, the other two abilities will remain enabled, and it is up to the person changing the role to revoke those abilities as well
[2014/02/27 15:55]  Baker Linden: I display a popup explaining this when you enable AND disable the ban ability
[2014/02/27 15:56]  Baker Linden: when you enable it, a popup will appear saying "You are also about to grant these other two roles"
[2014/02/27 15:56]  Jenna Felton: that makes sence, yes
[2014/02/27 15:56]  Baker Linden: and when you disable it, it says "Don't forget to revoke the other roles if you don't want them for this role"
[2014/02/27 15:57]  Baker Linden: Tank said he has another topic for discussion, so I'm going to let him go ahead and ask
[2014/02/27 15:57]  Baker Linden: since there's only a couple more minutes left
[2014/02/27 15:57]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): yes
[2014/02/27 15:57]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): regarding BUG-5222 "Feature Request: Add option to region/parcel to allow intra region/parcel TP when a landing point exists."
[2014/02/27 15:58]  Lucia Nightfire: and hopefully you can make taht work for mainland as well, not make it an estate only privledge
[2014/02/27 15:58]  Whirly Fizzle: Id love that :) Landing points are a PITA
[2014/02/27 15:58]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): oh, yeah, so i have been meaning to file for that several months now, finally got around to it a few days ago
[2014/02/27 15:58]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Tank's request came in two parts
[2014/02/27 15:58]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): one for parcel-level landing point rules
[2014/02/27 15:58]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): one for region (or estate?) level
[2014/02/27 16:00]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): For the parcel options, we figure the "Teleport Routing" in parcel option could have a new option
[2014/02/27 16:00]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): yeah, the main change will be, if added, is that the owner of the estate/region can deside if the want to allow intra TPs (like double click to tp) to work or not
[2014/02/27 16:00]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): same with the parcle owner
[2014/02/27 16:01]  Jonathan Yap: Would this also work for going to a LM within the parcel, or via the world map?
[2014/02/27 16:01]  Jenna Felton: i am not a fan of landing points, especially if you are using a landmark and have to search for the place it was meaning because a landing point brought you somewhere else. So i'd like to add a possibility for a landmark to override the landing point. And when it was possible to make the llTeleportAgent() functions override the landing point, it was quite great.
[2014/02/27 16:01]  Whirly Fizzle: If a Linden is in god mode, do they get to bypass a forced LP for intra region TPs after 1st landing?
[2014/02/27 16:02]  Lucia Nightfire: they should
[2014/02/27 16:02]  Lucia Nightfire: I've seen it enough
[2014/02/27 16:02]  Jonathan Yap: Jenna, do you see a beacon and red arrow when you arrive ?
[2014/02/27 16:03]  Jenna Felton: yes, prinipally i do, but its sometimes 2000m away
[2014/02/27 16:03]  Jenna Felton: and you have to use a teleporter or something
[2014/02/27 16:03]  Jonathan Yap: yeah, and go way up
[2014/02/27 16:04]  Rex Cronon: tc everybody . i got 2 go.bye
[2014/02/27 16:04]  rcdsQueChatLog: Rex Cronon, you can read the log here:
 http://rcds.nfshost.com/ques_view_chatLog.php?queOwner=llsl%3ARex+Cronon&queName=chatLog&pg=1
[2014/02/27 16:04]  Jonathan Yap: Beacon display have (or will?) change soon--they will extend all the way down
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Jonathan Yap: I think we lost the Lindens
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Jenna Felton: so probably there should be some way to make the landing points weaker than the LM and the teleport-agent functions
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Oops, I had a disconnect
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Jenna Felton: WB Maestro
[2014/02/27 16:05]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): wb maestro
[2014/02/27 16:05]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): thats what you get for uing untested viewers! :P
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Whirly Fizzle: Wb!
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Jenna Felton: hehe
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): Thank you, Maestro.
[2014/02/27 16:05]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): like im one to talk though
[2014/02/27 16:05]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): sadly, this was the release viewer
[2014/02/27 16:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): but I was being bad and using wifi
[2014/02/27 16:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): somebody must've used the microwave :)
[2014/02/27 16:06]  Jenna Felton: ah
[2014/02/27 16:06]  Whirly Fizzle: UNSUPPORTED! :P
[2014/02/27 16:06]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): haha yeah, thatll do it
[2014/02/27 16:06]  arton Rotaru: it's what you get for using non Windows viewer :p
[2014/02/27 16:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): well, I guess it was good timing
[2014/02/27 16:06]  Jenna Felton: wifi is good when you go lay in the living room on the sofa and listen to the fire and go into internet :)
[2014/02/27 16:06]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): since we're out of time
[2014/02/27 16:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): hopefully we'll have group ban viewer links for next week's SBUG
[2014/02/27 16:07]  Whirly Fizzle: Yay!
[2014/02/27 16:07]  Baker Linden: :)
[2014/02/27 16:07]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): we can do a field trip to a test region and try banning each other
[2014/02/27 16:07]  Jenna Felton: wil be probably fun meeting
[2014/02/27 16:07]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): i do want to thank you maestro for quicking taking in my request for the TP jira ㋡
[2014/02/27 16:07]  arton Rotaru: happy banning then
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): sure thing, tankmaster
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Baker Linden: Thanks for coming everyone!  Have a fantastic weekend!
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): What is SBUG?
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): thanks for coming, everybody!
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Caleb Linden: thanks maestro
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): Server Beta User Group, yuzuru :)
[2014/02/27 16:08]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): have a great weekend, meastro, caleb, and baker!
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): this meeting
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Jonathan Yap: Yuzuru, SBUG is this meeting
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Mæstro Linden (maestro.linden): you too!
[2014/02/27 16:08]  And all I got was this lousy DN (tankmaster.finesmith): Super BUG!
[2014/02/27 16:08]  Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell): I see! Thank you!