Bug triage/2008-06-11/Transcript

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[15:03] Bridie Linden: I think we can get started!
[15:03] Bridie Linden: Latest/current RC is 1.20 RC9....
[15:03] Bridie Linden: We expect to make RC10 available RSN...(likely tomorrow)...we're in the home stretch
[15:03] Alexa Linden: yay!
[15:04] Bridie Linden: Let's see what's on the list for today!
[15:04] Bridie Linden: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Bug_triage/Wednesday_Agenda
[15:04] norritt Xi: Will some of the crashes be fixed in RC10?
[15:04] Bridie Linden: We hope so, norritt
[15:04] Bridie Linden: First up, VWR-7406[c
[15:04] norritt Xi: Okay very good, they increased dramatically with the introduction of RC9
[15:04] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7406
[15:05] Bridie Linden: norritt, which OS/video card?
[15:05] norritt Xi: Windows XP SP2 nVidia GeForce 9800GTX
[15:05] Bridie Linden: Matias brings us 7406, but I wondered if there might be an existing issue....
[15:05] Torley Linden: Nice card! XD
[15:05] Alexa Linden: waves at Harleen
[15:05] Bridie Linden: Torley does 7406 ring a bell?
[15:05] Torley Linden: *looks*
[15:05] Bridie Linden: Welcom Harleen
[15:05] norritt Xi: Yeah I got it as replacement for the 8800GTX after my 2nd one fried
[15:06] Harleen Gretzky: ty :)
[15:06] Matias Carter: yes, well, when using the off sim bots you get a strange camera movement, it only happens on the RC viewer
[15:06] Cummere Mayo: we saw we asked for mroe info they gave it and its up again?
[15:06] Torley Linden: Matias, are you able to capture video?
[15:06] Bridie Linden: left and right movement is sorta bouncy, right Matias?
[15:06] Matias Carter: i wanted to, but i cant find the option on the RC viewer, someone moved it?
[15:06] Torley Linden: camera bugs are a great candidate (pun intended) for recording what may be hard to describe in words... i'm not familiar with this one from the looks of it
[15:07] Torley Linden: Matias, we removed the built-in recorder because it was very buggy but there are free apps that can do it much better
[15:07] Bridie Linden: Let's import, but I'll dig around a bit...
[15:07] Alexa Linden: ok
[15:07] Alexa Linden: triage?
[15:07] Bridie Linden: yes, please alexa
[15:07] Alexa Linden: noted
[15:07] Torley Linden: [1]
[15:07] Torley Linden: lists lot of alternatives
[15:07] Torley Linden: (i use Camtasia, which has a 30-day free trial)
[15:07] Bridie Linden: there was a camera issue related to camera controls and left/right movement...
[15:07] Matias Carter: ok, i'll capture video and post it on JIRA
[15:08] Torley Linden: thanks Matias, it's a good opportunity to show what you're seeing
[15:08] Matias Carter: :)
[15:08] Al Sonic: returns from RC9 crashing.
[15:08] norritt Xi: WB Al.
[15:08] Al Sonic: ^_^
[15:08] Matias Carter: i can provide you the off sim bot so you can also see it for yourself
[15:08] Bridie Linden: And Torley, thx for plug in video tutorial! [2]
[15:08] Bridie Linden: wb Al
[15:08] Torley Linden: you're welcome Bridie :D you're a fine example hehe
[15:08] Pastrami Linden: back in a jiff
[15:08] Torley Linden: (/me thinks on a tangent in Preferences > Input & Camera, those Camera Options should be explained better... hmmm)
[15:09] Bridie Linden: Next up...
[15:09] Bridie Linden: - Votes: 3 - Render Axes renders at the Sim corner
[15:09] Bridie Linden: # VWR-6852[c]
[15:09] Torley Linden: wow i haven't used Render Axes in awhile
[15:09] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-6852
[15:09] Torley Linden: it's a debug option so priority is likely Small
[15:09] Torley Linden: great repro by McCabe
[15:09] Pastrami Linden: back
[15:09] Bridie Linden: wb Pastrami
[15:09] Bridie Linden: yes, on debug...
[15:10] Al Sonic: Hm, they're right though, it does.
[15:10] Bridie Linden: let's import
[15:10] Torley Linden: repros for me too
[15:10] Alexa Linden: will do
[15:10] Torley Linden: and by the way, some of our usability gurus are increasingly considering making the most helpful/broadly used Advanced stuff more accessible in the normal Preferences or other places
[15:10] Torley Linden: that way, it also indicates they're officially supported
[15:10] Bridie Linden: nods
[15:11] norritt Xi: Yes same problem here too
[15:11] Torley Linden: Bridie, that safari outfit is grrreat
[15:11] Bridie Linden: Debug options are not high priority...
[15:11] Bridie Linden: is a bug hunter!
[15:11] Torley Linden: HAHA
[15:11] Torley Linden: appropriate
[15:11] Bridie Linden: or butterfly catcher...:0
[15:11] Battery Street: Irregulars whispers: Thanks for your interest in the Battery Street Irregulars. We'll be contacting you soon!
[15:11] Alexa Linden: fierce hunter ;)
[15:11] Bridie Linden: OH!
[15:11] Bridie Linden: Speaking of Advanced options..
[15:11] Alquimista Praga: GG Linden, poderia me esplicar porque todos esto reunidos aqui?
[15:11] Alquimista's translator: GG Linden, I could esplicar this meeting because we all here?
[15:12] Cummere Mayo: that owuld be nice torley can they also make mroe of them SAVE the settings so its not a 5 min ordeal anytiime you log in?
[15:12] Bridie Linden: Has anyone tried the lip sync option/feature?
[15:12] Torley Linden: [3]
[15:12] Torley Linden: info info!
[15:12] Bridie Linden: :)
[15:12] Drew Dwi: yes I have :D
[15:12] Torley Linden: i've only tried it briefly thus far but would like to do more with it
[15:12] Alexa Linden: and???
[15:12] Alexa Linden: lol
[15:12] Drew Dwi: its cool, but your mouth makes alot of :O like motions
[15:12] Gellan Glenelg: yeah - but tbh, I rarely focus on someone's face when speaking to them in voice
[15:12] Bridie Linden: Advanced > Character >Enable Lip sync
[15:12] Alexa Linden: LOL
[15:12] Torley Linden: it'll be great for machinimators -- not an endpoint as Drew alludes to, but "better than nothing"
[15:12] Bridie Linden: :)
[15:12] norritt Xi: Guess that wouldn't work for me ;)
[15:12] Cummere Mayo: honeslty one more way to overtax us more basic systems so i wont be using it
[15:13] Bambers Linden: my real mouth makes lots of O shapes when I talk too - I think it's my accent
[15:13] Drew Dwi: yea xD its kinda interesting
[15:13] Alquimista Praga: CG Linden... pode me ajudar?
[15:13] Alquimista's translator: CG Linden ... help me?
[15:13] Bridie Linden: ha!
[15:13] Torley Linden: Cummere, that depends on the options: some of them are best to NOT persist because they're confusing to people who accidentally turn them on. but yeah, over time, we've made some of them "sticky" across sessions like Disable Camera Constraints.
[15:13] Battery Street: Irregulars whispers: Thanks for your interest in the Battery Street Irregulars. We'll be contacting you soon!
[15:13] Bridie Linden: Next up...
[15:13] norritt Xi: /nick Silent Bob
[15:13] Bridie Linden: VWR-6702[c
[15:13] norritt Xi: Okay it was a try ;)
[15:13] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-6702
[15:13] Cummere Mayo: how about ones like animated textures or praticles?
[15:14] Torley Linden: Cummere: if you'd prefer particles to be hidden then Preferences > Graphics tab, turn down the Particles slider
[15:14] norritt Xi: This memory leak is totally nothing new ;)
[15:14] norritt Xi: And I'm pretty sure there is more than one. But there is a better report of that IIRC
[15:14] Torley Linden: yeah, these memory leaks seem to all belong to the same "family" that Steve & Co. were collating
[15:14] Bridie Linden: I'm not sure what we can do with 6702...
[15:14] Cummere Mayo: memory leaks in sl? I dun believe it! *sarcasm*
[15:14] norritt Xi: Let me look
[15:14] Alexa Linden: it's got to be a dup
[15:14] Torley Linden: i'd be in favor of resolving 6702 as dupe
[15:15] Alexa Linden: yes
[15:15] Bridie Linden: Steve and Co. will be investigating...
[15:15] Torley Linden: and linking to older issue, even the original reporter (Eren) sez so
[15:15] Bridie Linden: nods
[15:15] norritt Xi: Yeah 2997 adresses the same issues
[15:15] Torley Linden: memory leaks are particularly noticed if you stay inworld awhile; it's tough because we want to encourage spending more t ime inworld but if you have memory leakies, ya gotta relog or crash (and that can be very disruptive if you're in the middle of something, like an event)
[15:16] Cummere Mayo: is anything bein done to seak and destroy?
[15:16] norritt Xi: 6851 as well, this one is also pretty new and more informative
[15:17] Torley Linden: last i checked, i think the memory leaks/improving stability fall into the "Crash Hunters" project but i don't know precisely, at latest
[15:17] Bridie Linden: Steve talked about the viewer plans a bit here: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Viewer_Roadmap
[15:17] norritt Xi: There seems to be some connection between the nVidia drivers and the crashes
[15:17] Torley Linden: oh yeah, that page has gotta be broadcast more
[15:17] Torley Linden: that's a useful one
[15:17] Drew Dwi: is the thread monitering still disabled in RC9?
[15:17] Bridie Linden: Crashes were/are (usually) more straightforward to squash
[15:18] norritt Xi: In RC9 the crashes increased dramatically as I said before, after installing GeForce 175.xx it got a bit better
[15:18] norritt Xi: Though there is one problem
[15:18] Bridie Linden: the watchdog is turned on in RC9
[15:18] McCabe Maxsted: agreed norritt; I now crash when opening inventory or preferences if I've been logged in for a few hours
[15:18] norritt Xi: The newest GeForce driver releases are not recommended for G80 based Geforce 8 cards so users who have a 8800GTX or an older 8800GTS will still have to use 169.21
[15:18] Bridie Linden: We'll be turning it off soon
[15:19] Drew Dwi: RC only feature?
[15:19] norritt Xi: I believe the older drivers are not considered in QA
[15:19] Bridie Linden: Currently Drew
[15:19] Cummere Mayo: those crashes are ntoed and included (i thik) in soemthing alexa and i discussed ealeir
[15:19] Bridie Linden: Back to the agenda...
[15:19] Bridie Linden: VWR-7600[c
[15:20] Bridie Linden: skipping the fonts issue that we've discussed before
[15:20] Esoteric Paine: gave you Bottled Imp Folder.
[15:20] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7600
[15:20] Esoteric Paine: gave you Bottled Imp Folder.
[15:20] norritt Xi: Hmm okay never tried that...
[15:20] Battery Street: Irregulars whispers: Thanks for your interest in the Battery Street Irregulars. We'll be contacting you soon!
[15:20] Bridie Linden: hmms
[15:21] Torley Linden: i wonder if this changed due to some new user-oriented tweaks? i think it should persist.
[15:21] Bridie Linden: Is this more of a request? do other floaters stay open?
[15:21] Cummere Mayo: its suppsoed to stay open
[15:21] Torley Linden: they don't consistently, Bridie... some stay open but most do not AFAIK
[15:21] Torley Linden: movement controls stays open for example
[15:21] Torley Linden: but not Search
[15:21] Bridie Linden: oh right
[15:22] Cummere Mayo: the minimap always did for me till recently
[15:22] Bridie Linden: I'm not sure what we do in 1.19.1
[15:22] Torley Linden: Inventory should (i hope it does still)
[15:22] Bridie Linden: in the 1.20 series Cummere?
[15:22] Cummere Mayo: yeah
[15:22] Bridie Linden: let's import then, thx
[15:22] Alexa Linden: ok
[15:22] Torley Linden: sounds good
[15:22] Bridie Linden: add any comments Cummere if you ahve time
[15:22] Torley Linden: please leave a note for Rx to verify this makes sense
[15:23] Cummere Mayo: lol ok
[15:23] Torley Linden: (it seems pretty obvious, but it may've been changed deliberately due to other considerations)
[15:23] Bridie Linden: good point torley
[15:23] Alexa Linden: will do :)
[15:23] Torley Linden: =)
[15:23] norritt Xi: I cant repro the minimap bug
[15:23] Bridie Linden: Next up...
[15:23] Infinity Linden: ditto
[15:23] Infinity Linden: on linux
[15:24] norritt Xi: Win XP here
[15:24] Bridie Linden: Add your comments too noritt/INfinity?
[15:24] Bridie Linden: RC9?
[15:24] Bridie Linden: # VWR-7483[c
[15:24] Bambers Linden: ahmmm
[15:24] Cummere Mayo: ok comment added and i dropepd the bit about wanting rx to verify in my comment
[15:24] norritt Xi: Yes in RC9
[15:24] Torley Linden: oh that sounds like the... "rock star 80s pants" bug
[15:24] McCabe Maxsted: in rc 9's release notes: * Fixed: Default the mini-map to off for new users. Related?
[15:24] Torley Linden: except in reverse
[15:24] Alexa Linden: yup
[15:24] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7483
[15:24] Torley Linden: i believe a couple workarounds for VWR-7483 are: (1) modify pants in Appearance and save or (2) rebake textures
[15:24] Bridie Linden: perhaps McCabe
[15:24] Alexa Linden: if I go into edit, it normally gets rid of it for me
[15:24] Alexa Linden: jinx :P
[15:24] Bridie Linden: it is supposed to be off for new users
[15:24] Torley Linden: McCabe, that's what i was thinking, good spotting
[15:25] Infinity Linden: maybe if there's no ~/.secondlife preesnt?
[15:25] Bridie Linden: Gold Sarts to McCabe!
[15:25] Alexa Linden: weee!
[15:25] Dirk Talamasca: lol
[15:25] Torley Linden: i have definitely seen VWR-7483 on occasion but the workarounds have always worked for me; i think this is supposed to be fixed by better texture compositing but that's still (likely) a ways off
[15:25] Torley Linden: (improved texture pipeline should remove the need for "rebake textures"... somewhere down the road)
[15:25] Bridie Linden: if (Flare 0) {
Bellbottom = True;
[15:25] Bridie Linden: ha
[15:26] Torley Linden: hahahaha
[15:26] Torley Linden: geeky humor
[15:26] Bri Gufler: thats great
[15:26] Alexa Linden: so, should I suggest the appearance/bake fixes?
[15:26] Bridie Linden: Yes, pls, Alexa
[15:26] Torley Linden: Alexa, looks like rebaking didn't work for her
[15:26] Alexa Linden: will do
[15:26] Torley Linden: but the appearance one did
[15:26] Torley Linden: but there are no-mod clothes too... hmm
[15:26] Gellan Glenelg: this isn't new ... I remember seeing it maybe a year ago
[15:26] Bridie Linden: I had the opposite problem where all of my jeans were 'skinny' jeans
[15:26] Bridie Linden: until I rebaked
[15:26] Torley Linden: yeah Bridie that's the old rock star one haha
[15:26] Alexa Linden: I get it every week or so
[15:27] norritt Xi: Well sometimes the clothes bugs are pretty rebellious.
[15:27] Alexa Linden: ya
[15:27] Bridie Linden: lol
[15:27] Bambers Linden: my mother goes through that every 10 years
[15:27] Alexa Linden: LMAO
[15:27] Dirk Talamasca: That is why you always wear clean underwear
[15:27] Cummere Mayo: LOL bambers
[15:27] Alexa Linden: hahahahaha!
[15:27] Alexa Linden: TMI
[15:27] norritt Xi: I once saw the UI on skirt bug going to appearance and rebaking did help, till the UI popped up un the skirt 5 seconds later
[15:27] McCabe Maxsted: hehehe
[15:27] Bambers Linden: did I say that out LOUD?
[15:28] Alexa Linden: mmhmmm
[15:28] Bridie Linden: Next...
[15:28] Cummere Mayo: what abotu thsoe of us that dont like wearing any dirk?
[15:28] Bridie Linden: VWR-7489[c
[15:28] Gellan Glenelg: This is similar to a lot of others previously discussed (some - e.g. [4] already imported). There's a new meta issue which ties all the snapshot ones together: [5]
[15:28] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7489
[15:28] Pastrami Linden: ahh snapshots
[15:28] Dimitrio Lewis: those black lines are frustrating
[15:29] Torley Linden: my wife sometimes gets totally black snapshots to hd... it's a pain when you look at them later and realize all your shots are ruined
[15:29] Pastrami Linden: assign to me for further inspection if no one else claims it
[15:29] Bridie Linden: is sad about snapshots
[15:29] Alexa Linden: done!
[15:29] Squirrel Wood: printscreen key ^^
[15:29] Alexa Linden: it's all yours XD
[15:29] Bridie Linden: Bao was doing some work on them, I believe Pastrami
[15:29] Bridie Linden: ty
[15:29] Pastrami Linden: indeed
[15:29] Bambers Linden: there are similar ones under investimuhgation now
[15:29] Torley Linden: snapshots have long been a tough area to deal with because of (1) many UI subtleties and (2) not hot enough priority because they're "cosmetic" and "nonessential" but people love saving and sharing their Second Lives
[15:29] norritt Xi: My snapshots look good on RC9 just made one
[15:29] Bridie Linden: loves Bambers spelling
[15:29] Alexa Linden: ya, I've seen white lines, black lines, total grid lines
[15:29] Torley Linden: haha Bambers i like saying "edumacation"
[15:30] Alexa Linden: thereare a few out there right now
[15:30] Cummere Mayo: /m,e rases her hand about to say soemthign sacriliegious to sl but maybe nees to be said?
[15:30] Bridie Linden: I think we talkded about the next one...right alexa?
[15:30] Bridie Linden: # VWR-7264[c
[15:30] Sheet Spotter: I started looking at the source code for snapshots, but no conclusions yet.
[15:31] Alexa Linden: looks
[15:31] Bridie Linden: looks @ Cummere
[15:31] Al Sonic: Hm, didn't expect to crash doing that little... but maybe loading a webpage isn't a small thing?
[15:31] Bridie Linden: rut row
[15:31] Bambers Linden: Cummere?
[15:31] CG Linden: Don't hold back on my account, Cummere :)
[15:31] Alexa Linden: yes, bridie we did yesterday
[15:31] Cummere Mayo: um maybe jsut cuase those of you that work for linden labs see hem as cosmetic and low priority, doesnt mean that soemtimes they are mroe then cosmetic?
[15:31] Infinity Linden: covers her ears
[15:31] Bambers Linden: flips open notepad and licks pencil
[15:31] Alexa Linden: waiting for a response
[15:31] Bridie Linden: listens
[15:32] Bambers Linden: then readies the hounds just in case...
[15:32] Cummere Mayo: *arent
[15:32] Bridie Linden: puts on Viking hat
[15:32] Cummere Mayo: i mean i can see a dozen ways soemthign cosmetic and seemingly innocent can be a symptom of soemthing thats crashing other users?
[15:32] Bambers Linden: I think a lot of bugs that are seen as cosmetic are actually more in depth
[15:33] Cummere Mayo: votes for kicking the lines issue up higher cuase soemthing tells her that that bug is allot mroe then meets the eye
[15:33] Torley Linden: Cummere: my philosophy here has long been that stuff that "looks" bad may have deeper/intense emotional impact, so it's more harmful than it seems at first to someone's experience. humans don't always use logic.
[15:33] Bridie Linden: nods
[15:34] Dirk Talamasca: Thanks Spock
[15:34] Infinity Linden: might want to try to kill a few stones at the same time... if you're spending a fair amount of time taking snapshots, try sending some of them as postcards
[15:34] Torley Linden: Infinity, that's my bane! i'm taking notes of every time that happens to me
[15:34] Torley Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2283
[15:34] Bridie Linden: ah yes, Infinity was looking into another issue....related to sim performance
[15:34] Bridie Linden: and postcards
[15:34] Infinity Linden: it might be interesting to find out if it happens before or after saving to disk or sending to the sim for postcard delivery
[15:34] Dirk Talamasca: we need a Spock Linden
[15:34] norritt Xi: Okay I just uploaded a texture seems I'm still there
[15:34] Cummere Mayo: I cant send snaps as postcards at all
[15:35] Gellan Glenelg: VWR-7672 is the same (I think), is already imported, and critical. How do you want to go higher than that, Cummere?
[15:35] Infinity Linden: and it might help uncover some of the postcard issues
[15:35] Torley Linden: Infinity, i've never noticed it when saving to disk; just after sending the postcard form off. thanks for your help on that earlier.
[15:35] Infinity Linden: @torley.. yup... I'm surprised you haven't attached a postcard pager to me
[15:35] Bridie Linden: Cummere, you're concerned that more may be 'broken' than meets the eye?
[15:35] Alexa Linden: that's illogical Dirk
[15:35] Gellan Glenelg: VWR-6240 might be the same issue, and is "fix pending"
[15:35] Bambers Linden: it's a valid concern
[15:36] Dirk Talamasca: Damn it Alexa, I'm mesh, not a Vulcan
[15:36] Alexa Linden: laughs
[15:36] Cummere Mayo: yes bridie
[15:36] Cummere Mayo: sorry my comp locked for a moment
[15:36] Bridie Linden: nods
[15:37] Bridie Linden: So, we will import /VWR-7489 and Pastrami will check into, yes?
[15:37] Alexa Linden: yup!
[15:37] Pastrami Linden: yes
[15:37] Bridie Linden: We can move on past VWR-7264, since Alexa already posted a comment there
[15:38] Alexa Linden: and thanks to Norritt for the comment too :)
[15:38] Alexa Linden: I can't repro either
[15:38] Bridie Linden: Same for the next one too...Alexa did you want to resolve those as "needs more info"?
[15:38] Alexa Linden: 6246?
[15:38] Bridie Linden: That brings us to ...
[15:38] Alexa Linden: looking
[15:38] Cummere Mayo: i can but i think i know wht the issue is
[15:38] Bridie Linden: yes
[15:38] Bridie Linden: # VWR-7314[c
[15:39] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7314
[15:39] Cummere Mayo: my desktop will do that if the graphics card overheats
[15:39] Bridie Linden: looks @ Pastrami
[15:39] Pastrami Linden: thinking
[15:39] Torley Linden: yeah i'd check for hardware defects/failure first and make sure up-to-date drivers are installed, that card (8800 GTS) should be just fine
[15:39] Torley Linden: under healthy conditions
[15:39] Pastrami Linden: agreed
[15:39] Torley Linden: (disclaimer: i have a 8800 GTS)
[15:39] Pastrami Linden: can't imagine what it would be
[15:40] norritt Xi: LOL I guess I just found a new crash bug
[15:40] Bridie Linden: agreed
[15:40] Bridie Linden: wasn't agreeing w/norritt :)
[15:40] Bambers Linden: lol
[15:40] Bridie Linden: what happened norritt?
[15:40] norritt Xi: Has anyone nView on 1280x1024 running with an nVidia card?
[15:40] norritt Xi: Okay Go to File menu and pick "Take snapshot"
[15:40] Bridie Linden: uh oh
[15:41] norritt Xi: Then Open the "More" options
[15:41] norritt Xi: enter a custom hight / width of 1600 x 1200 and click refresh Snapshot
[15:41] Alexa Linden: ok.....
[15:41] Squirrel Wood: drops a live bug in Bambers' net
[15:41] Alexa Linden: so far, so good....
[15:42] Bridie Linden: get it bambers
[15:42] norritt Xi: If you're running 1600x1200 natively you might have to pick an even higer resolution
[15:42] Vanilla Sola: my safest way to crash is a funny one, i build something and when i attach it from the floor it wents into the libary, if i try to move it then into the objects or anywhere else i know each time before i'll crash within 2 seconds
[15:42] Bambers Linden: oh no!
[15:42] norritt Xi: Oh yes and I had "Save snapshot to hard drive activated"
[15:42] Torley Linden: Vanilla, i've seen that on odd occasions. haven't been able to repro it solidly every time tho.
[15:42] Vanilla Sola: after i relog its anyways at objects
[15:42] Bambers Linden: got it
[15:42] Alexa Linden: 1800 x 1400 - still here
[15:42] Alexa Linden: screen goes wonky for a sec....
[15:42] Bridie Linden: asks for PJIRA reports with repros, please
[15:42] Bridie Linden: :)
[15:42] Vanilla Sola: but onlyy if i try moving it before
[15:42] Drew Dwi: ouch, I did File > Screenshot and boom
[15:42] Cummere Mayo: testing now on my laptop
[15:42] Vanilla Sola: otherwise i can vanish completely
[15:43] norritt Xi: Trying again
[15:43] Alexa Linden: will do bridie
[15:43] Vanilla Sola: so i still prefer crashing lol
[15:43] Bridie Linden: TY!
[15:43] Bridie Linden: looks @ Vanilla
[15:43] Bridie Linden: Next up...
[15:43] Bridie Linden: # VWR-7380[c
[15:43] Dirk Talamasca: No problems for me but I am running the GT not the GTS
[15:43] Squirrel Wood: Yep. I see that one happen
[15:43] Vanilla Sola: it not me can vanish completely sorry typo
[15:43] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7380
[15:44] Squirrel Wood: SL definitely sometimes forgets it was maximized
[15:44] norritt Xi: Humm okay don't get a repro myself again, so maybe it was just again the "usual" out of memory error just that moment I hit the "Refresh snapshot" button.
[15:44] Bridie Linden: even with RC9 Squirrel?
[15:44] Squirrel Wood: Yes
[15:44] Matias Carter: yes, i noticed that too
[15:44] Torley Linden: i've noticed VWR-7380 too
[15:44] Bridie Linden: looks @ Bambers
[15:44] Alexa Linden: me 3
[15:44] Bridie Linden: dang
[15:44] Bambers Linden: gaah
[15:44] Bridie Linden: let's import, pls
[15:44] Squirrel Wood: typically happens to me after the client crashed
[15:44] Alexa Linden: will do
[15:45] Cummere Mayo: yeah i can repo that one
[15:45] Dimitrio Lewis: when I close preferences it often changes to windowed
[15:45] Torley Linden: thanks, that would be a nice annoyance to fix
[15:46] Bridie Linden: Skipping space nav issues...
[15:46] Bridie Linden: NExt
[15:46] Bridie Linden: VWR-7389[c
[15:46] Bridie Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7389
[15:46] Alexa Linden: yes, I am gathering all the space nav jiras to have them looked at
[15:46] Torley Linden: awhile back Rx discussed about having better notifications for the muted, related to... oh i see VWR-1735 is linked
[15:46] Gellan Glenelg: it notifies you in the main chat window
[15:47] Gellan Glenelg: but in IM window would make more sense
[15:47] Bridie Linden: Let's import and send to Rx, but the suggestion makes sense to me...
[15:47] Alexa Linden: ok
[15:47] Squirrel Wood: While you are at it add a "Never tell anyone your password" message too ^^
[15:48] Torley Linden: yes, and Lindens will never ask for your password!
[15:48] Bridie Linden: But there is a larger project with folks looking @ notifications in the viewer
[15:48] Bri Gufler: actually 1735 is a bit different Gellan
[15:48] norritt Xi: Yes they know it already
[15:48] norritt Xi: ;)
[15:48] Bri Gufler: If you try to IM someone that is muted it puts a blank line and the message doesnt appear in either place for me
[15:49] Bridie Linden: Alexa did we already discuss7316?
[15:49] Alexa Linden: looking....
[15:49] norritt Xi: Lindens don't use the SL viewer they look at the matrix in coded form =)
[15:49] Bridie Linden: ha
[15:49] Alexa Linden: not me!
[15:49] Alexa Linden: lol
[15:50] Alexa Linden: I'm sooo not that Linden :p
[15:50] Bridie Linden: rethinks 7389 and thinks it should go to Triage, Alexa
[15:50] CasperVan Dibou: 6439
[15:50] Alexa Linden: ok
[15:50] Alexa Linden: and the other one, I don't recall bridie
[15:50] norritt Xi: Alexa, nobody is perfect I'll send you X Linden to pimp your SL viewer ;)
[15:50] Alexa Linden: 7316
[15:50] Alexa Linden: hahahaha
[15:51] Bridie Linden: Ok, next up
[15:51] Bridie Linden: VWR-7421[c
[15:51] Squirrel Wood: Now that would be a contest! *Pimp Your SL*
[15:51] Torley Linden: ohh another camera movement one!
[15:51] Alexa Linden: LOL
[15:51] Matias Carter: haha
[15:51] Torley Linden: yeah, i'm pretty sure this is very similar/dupe of older ones
[15:51] Bridie Linden: I think this may be a dupe...
[15:51] Alexa Linden: would bling me + or - points?
[15:51] Bridie Linden: jinx
[15:51] norritt Xi: I think we should do Linden facts like Chuck Norris facts
[15:51] Torley Linden: it's like https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1286
[15:52] Alexa Linden: misses her Chukc Norris SL shrine :(
[15:52] Franziska Bosatsu: evening all
[15:52] Dirk Talamasca: 3D Sepiatone viewer with bling and kung fu grip
[15:52] Squirrel Wood: wants to see "Woooooooooooooosh" again when teleporting :p
[15:52] Torley Linden: prolly closer to https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-98 tho which sounds like the same thing, only it's more about inworld objects than attachments
[15:52] Torley Linden: <3 Chuck Norris facts
[15:52] Torley Linden: my favorite one is... Chuck Norris' tears cure cancer. but Chuck Norris has never cried.
[15:52] Alexa Linden: you can buy in inworld shrine with sayings, glow and a pic :D
[15:53] Cummere Mayo: hmmms ahead at 7178 and noticed that she has that issue too
[15:53] norritt Xi: Everytime the boogie man goes to bed he looks into his closet ... for Chuck Norris
[15:53] Torley Linden: another one is "Ozzy Ozbourne bit the head off a bat. not to be outdone, Chuck Norris bit the head off of Batman."
[15:53] Bridie Linden: is looking for other camera issue..
[15:53] McCabe Maxsted: "superman wears chuck norris pajamas" is my fav
[15:53] Torley Linden: Bridie, they weren't the ones i pasted links to earlier?
[15:53] Torley Linden: VWR-1286 and VWR-98?
[15:53] Bridie Linden: no, there's another one...
[15:53] Torley Linden: hmmm
[15:54] Alexa Linden: I only seem to see this if my camera gets lock on an invisprim
[15:54] Bridie Linden: I'll look later
[15:54] Alexa Linden: and then shoots me off while building
[15:54] norritt Xi: If Chuck Norris jumps into water he doesn't get wet water gets Chuck Norris
[15:54] Bridie Linden: Let's finish up with 7178 per Cummere's suggestion...
[15:54] Bridie Linden: VWR-7178[c
[15:54] Pastrami Linden: who loves screenshot iisues?
[15:54] Bridie Linden: WWJBD? (what would Jack Bauer do??)
[15:54] Pastrami Linden: I do I do
[15:55] Torley Linden: Pastrami: !@#$
[15:55] Bridie Linden: He'd shoot 'em.
[15:55] Cummere Mayo: not really a bug, but i vote we hang the linden that changed that
[15:55] Alexa Linden: for the inworld pics?
[15:55] Bridie Linden: I think that is on the internal list already, Bambers do you know?
[15:55] norritt Xi: Bride: And what if he shoots Arnie?
[15:55] Torley Linden: Neferon is not explaining this well -- Cummere, then you gotta hang me for being partially responsible.
[15:55] Alexa Linden: ya, this kind of bugs me too
[15:55] Torley Linden: here's some of the usability background:
[15:55] McCabe Maxsted: very annoying
[15:55] Cummere Mayo: i cant even get ti to fullscreen tdoing a snap to disk
[15:55] Torley Linden: people are confused by the powers-of-2 sizing of textures.
[15:55] norritt Xi: He'll get problems caus Arnie will be back ;)
[15:56] Torley Linden: so earlier, we had complaints that uploaded snapshots were being stretched/squished.
[15:56] Bridie Linden: right Torley
[15:56] Torley Linden: generally, power-of-2 is *not* intuitive unless you're already a geek at heart.
[15:56] Dirk Talamasca: Powers of 2 is fine if the images taken retain aspect ratio but they do not
[15:57] Torley Linden: but, you should all know: we're doing a VERY careful documentation of the snapshot floater...
[15:57] Torley Linden: which should be published in the future not too long from now... on the wiki
[15:57] Torley Linden: making easier to understand what all the finer things do, and improve them
[15:57] Sheet Spotter: I use the custom image size to create 256x256 or 512x512 images before uploading.
[15:57] McCabe Maxsted: hm found a bug in rc 9 I think: 1. open shapshot preview 2. select upload snapshot 3. select more 4 select less 5 upload button grayed out
[15:57] norritt Xi: Well to be honest I think this one is misfiled...
[15:58] Torley Linden: it's ALSO confusing that powers-of-2-compatible aspect ratios are often NOT used for profile pictures, places, etc.
[15:58] Sheet Spotter: Upload button is only greyed out until you "Refresh Snapshot"
[15:58] norritt Xi: Of course a full screen snapshot is not square
[15:58] Cummere Mayo: its hard to take some needed snapshots or make some things with only being able to make snapshots square
[15:58] norritt Xi: Because usually you have a 4:3 or 16:10 or 16:9 resolution
[15:58] Dirk Talamasca: Yes Torley.. That has always been something residents have complained about
[15:58] Torley Linden: for maximum image editing ability, i still recommend bringing things offline...
[15:58] McCabe Maxsted: so, bug then
[15:58] Squirrel Wood: UI suggestion: add links to the wiki info in the place where it makes sense...?
[15:59] norritt Xi: Which is not a bug at all
[15:59] Alexa Linden: or you have to save to desktop and then import to get a full screen
[15:59] Torley Linden: don't crop them inworld for crying out loud, use [6] if you can't afford Photoshop
[15:59] Cummere Mayo: even saving to desktop i cant get fullscreen
[15:59] Torley Linden: (or GIMP if you're into that :) )
[15:59] norritt Xi: Well just use GIMP
[15:59] Bridie Linden: But spinners work for custom sizes, no torley?
[15:59] norritt Xi: ;)
[15:59] Dirk Talamasca: or Paint.net
[15:59] Torley Linden: Bridie, yes, saving to disk, they do
[15:59] Alexa Linden: I can if I save to hard drive
[15:59] Bridie Linden: nods
[16:00] Alexa Linden: I get full screen
[16:00] Alexa Linden: it's just when saving inworld I get a square
[16:00] Torley Linden: context: i highly recommend using [7] for people who a new to graphic design because it requires no download and is extremely intuitive and fast... it's an online image editor.
[16:00] Dirk Talamasca: groovy filters in Paint.net
[16:00] Squirrel Wood: just uses printscreen and pastes the image into irfanview for saving :p
[16:00] Drew Dwi: adobe just put out a lite version that you can use, all flashed based to touch up photo's
[16:00] Pastrami Linden: yeah but it sux
[16:00] Pastrami Linden: :)
[16:00] Cummere Mayo: I get 512 squares on going to desktop but anywyas... soemthing i noticed which is annoyig? mute no longer works in group chat?
[16:00] Pastrami Linden: I tried it
[16:00] Sheet Spotter: Bridie, I mentioned that I updated VWR-6994 with the cause of the problem. https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-6994
[16:00] Torley Linden: Pastrami, what sucks?
[16:00] Sheet Spotter: Is there a Linden I need to "poke" to follow up on my comments?
[16:01] Bridie Linden: Alrighty everyone, it's 4pm...thx for your help! Look for a new RC tomorrow...
[16:01] Sheet Spotter: Or is there a more appropriate forum to raise the question?
[16:01] Pastrami Linden: the online version of PShop

Bug triage/2008-06-11/Transcript

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