Simulator User Group/Transcripts/2012.03.13

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Simulator_User_Group

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List of Speakers

Ashiri Andrew Linden ANSI Soderstrom
Davido Chrome Draconis Neurocam Fancy Detector
Flip Idlemind Kallista Destiny Liisa Runo
Melvin Starbrook Motor Loon Nalates Urriah
NeoBokrug Elytis Qie Niangao Rex Cronon
Sahkolihaa Contepomi Sera Lok Simon Linden
Squirrel Wood Talarus Luan Vincent Nacon
Wuf Shirabyoshi

Transcript

[12:02] Melvin Starbrook: hi andew :)

[12:02] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Hey Andrew.

[12:02] Kallista Destiny: Ave Andrew

[12:02] Melvin Starbrook: andrew hihi

[12:02] Andrew Linden: hello

[12:02] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Oh.

[12:02] Ashiri: hiya

[12:02] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: It worked from that distance. o_O

[12:02] Fancy Detector: Kelly Linden has arrived!

[12:02] Vincent Nacon: yup, it has sit target

[12:02] Talarus Luan: You don't want to know what's in the cheeseburgers here. <.<

[12:02] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Ah.

[12:03] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Hey Kelly.

[12:03] Melvin Starbrook: tala kelly :)

[12:03] Simon Linden notes the missing Meeroos

[12:04] Vincent Nacon: oh wait, I do have meals

[12:04] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: lol..

[12:04] Talarus Luan: They've been missing for weeks now :P

[12:04] Talarus Luan: I think someone ate them.

[12:04] Donut-PDM: Let's eat!

[12:05] Andrew Linden: Ok news...

[12:05] Andrew Linden: I did write a script that can enable encroachment returnability on the mainland

[12:05] Andrew Linden: but I haven't run it yet

[12:05] Rex Cronon: hello everybody

[12:05] Talarus Luan: woot!

[12:06] Vincent Nacon: feel free to join us

[12:06] Talarus Luan: I have some megas encroaching that I need to return. :P

[12:06] Andrew Linden: I'm going to try to run it either tomorrow morning (afer all rolls) or Thursday morning

[12:06] Vincent Nacon: Andrew: ...but?

[12:06] Vincent Nacon: ah ok

[12:06] Talarus Luan: (I'm going to just stand here behind Simon and make him nervous)

[12:07] Andrew Linden: but I'm going to give the #support team a chance to pick the day.

[12:07] Vincent Nacon: but do you think it'll work as intended?

[12:07] Andrew Linden: Well, the feature works last time we tested it.

[12:08] Andrew Linden: But you need a viewer that won't prevent you from trying to return things via the UI.

[12:08] Talarus Luan: Well, as long as it doesn't allow non-encroaching prims to be returned, it will be fine.

[12:08] Andrew Linden: I believe the official viewer has had the correct UI state for months now

[12:08] Qie Niangao: It would be important that Linden and Mole owned content be "estate" content so it can't be returned if encroaching.

[12:08] Vincent Nacon: would it deal with any packet loss while trying to switch most of the estate's on?

[12:08] Talarus Luan: Good point, Qie

[12:09] Andrew Linden: Qie, if the Linden and Mole content is set correctly it shouldn't be returnable.

[12:09] Qie Niangao: (maybe all Mole content is Linden-owned anyway) Okay, cool.

[12:09] Andrew Linden: Michael Linden knows about it

[12:09] Vincent Nacon: hmm

[12:09] Andrew Linden: and he thinks most of the content is set correctly.

[12:09] Qie Niangao: great. thanks.

[12:09] Vincent Nacon: one way to find out

[12:09] Kallista Destiny: lols

[12:09] Talarus Luan: Not the optimal way. :-/

[12:09] Andrew Linden: There are two groups that count as "Linden Content" in the mainland: Dept of Public Works (DPPW)

[12:10] Kallista Destiny: Get a hammer?

[12:10] Liisa Runo: is the exeption still in place for LL trees? many of them have lot bigger BB compared to the visual size.

[12:10] Andrew Linden: and some other group... the Maintenance group, I think.

[12:10] Liisa Runo: yet in place*

[12:10] Qie Niangao: ah, by group, makes sense.

[12:10] Rex Cronon: it might be possible that suddenly roads r returned if encroaching?

[12:10] Vincent Nacon: not if owned by lindens I think

[12:10] Andrew Linden: Good question Liisa. I don't know what is going to happen to the trees.

[12:10] Kallista Destiny: Stress test of lost+found

[12:11] Andrew Linden: I *think* the trees use their "collision shape" which is quite a bit smaller than their visible shape.

[12:11] Andrew Linden: A long time ago trees didn't have collidable shapes, but I added shapes in the Havok4 update...

[12:12] Andrew Linden: with the hope that we could enable collisions with tree trunks someday (so for the meantime they were set collisionless, but the shapes were in the collision system)

[12:12] Vincent Nacon: so tree are returnable if encroaching?

[12:12] Andrew Linden: but I think Falcon may have removed the tree shapes again

[12:12] Andrew Linden: but I can't remember where that work was done

[12:12] Talarus Luan: One way to find out.. fly into one. <.<

[12:12] Vincent Nacon: muhaha! lovely... maybe return via bounding box instead of physic mesh?

[12:13] Andrew Linden: so dunno if it is part of the pathfinding work, or something else already released

[12:13] Andrew Linden: I guess I should test tree return today so I know what is going to happen

[12:13] Melvin Starbrook: pathfinding things looks fun :)

[12:13] Kallista Destiny: Om nom nom nom

[12:13] Nalates Urriah: Wait for the surprise...

[12:13] Rex Cronon: i guess all those that have big villas encroaching on others land will have a nice surprise:)

[12:14] Ashiri: deforestation of sl?

[12:14] Vincent Nacon: muhaha!

[12:14] Andrew Linden: That's all the news I've got. I didn't get to the LSL keywords stuff for the LSL Editor yet.

[12:14] Qie Niangao: Most of those Linden trees could stand with a dose of Agent Orange, IMHO.

[12:14] Vincent Nacon: alrighty... SImon?

[12:15] Draconis Neurocam: i always thought that would be a good name for a soda qie

[12:15] Qie Niangao: :D

[12:15] Simon Linden: Let's see ... Kelly and I have been working on some code that should be in RC next week. It's internal, low-level fixes for some networking code, so there will be no visible effect except (hopefully) things working a bit better

[12:15] Vincent Nacon: doesn't Agent Orange kill people, not plants?

[12:16] Rex Cronon: there is only a limited nr of keywords, but lots of constants and function names

[12:16] Qie Niangao: Vincent: not by design

[12:16] Nalates Urriah: What things?

[12:16] Simon Linden: I don't think there are any new RC releases scheduled for tomorrow

[12:16] Draconis Neurocam: yay, i know theres been some networking issue

[12:16] Draconis Neurocam: s*

[12:16] Simon Linden: "Things" as in the server ... there were some edge cases that could tip it over

[12:17] Nalates Urriah: thx

[12:17] Simon Linden: It should fix some of the regions that get stuck where you can't TP or cross in or out

[12:17] Liisa Runo: (tip it over^^ me imagines domino effect in server room)

[12:18] Davido Chrome: Sorry I'm late.

[12:18] Vincent Nacon: most servers are bolted down to the floor

[12:18] Vincent Nacon: walls and ceiling sometimes

[12:18] Simon Linden: I'm not familiar with the details, but I heard that the "Recieved Items" folder feature is getting an overhaul before it moves forward

[12:18] Kallista Destiny: I thought they were rackmounted.

[12:18] Vincent Nacon: they are

[12:19] Draconis Neurocam: that is good news

[12:19] Vincent Nacon: I meant the rackmounts itself

[12:19] Vincent Nacon: muhaha!

[12:19] Melvin Starbrook: maybe make more it flexible... only working when not in world :)

[12:20] Melvin Starbrook: then it doesnt break RLV or pre packaged things :)

[12:20] Kallista Destiny: There was much cursing and moaning about breaking llGiveInventoryList() inparticular to #RLV~folder name

[12:20] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Hum, Runitai needs to check his code - Debug GL just caught an error.

[12:20] Kallista Destiny: sorry #ROL/_foldername

[12:20] Simon Linden: That's all the news I have

[12:20] Simon Linden: I need to go AFK for a few minutes...

[12:20] Vincent Nacon: alrighty

[12:21] Kallista Destiny: Thank you Smion.

[12:21] Kallista Destiny: Simon...

[12:21] Melvin Starbrook: but think recieve items tab and using the filters stil works great too

[12:21] Kallista Destiny looks for a can of air to clean her keyboard

[12:22] Andrew Linden: The table is open.

[12:22] Nalates Urriah: Andrew, anything you can say about what u r doing with pathfinding?

[12:22] Vincent Nacon: open with free meals

[12:23] Andrew Linden: No I can't say much. I'm just trying to get it ready for release.

[12:23] Nalates Urriah: :( k

[12:23] Qie Niangao: So... there seems a lot of confusion about the Professional Creators Program, at a very basic level... is there a follow-up blog post or other communication coming soon?

[12:23] Andrew Linden: The pathfinding stuff relies on a "navigation mesh" chunk of data

[12:23] Vincent Nacon: isn't pathfinding in Falcon's department/work?

[12:23] Andrew Linden: which is a connectivity graph + geometry of the navigable zones

[12:23] Rex Cronon: i have a question. is it possible for the compiler to specify that a 0x0101 is in binary and not hex?

[12:24] Andrew Linden: The navigation mesh takes a while to compute... tens of seconds.

[12:24] Andrew Linden: So I've been working on helping to make sure its computation doesn't block the simulator

[12:24] Kallista Destiny: Will the code for creating the Nav mesh be OPen source? that is will it be available for TPV?

[12:24] Andrew Linden: and that it can be downloaded to the viewer

[12:25] Vincent Nacon whispers: I think Nav mesh is part of Havok's source.... isn't it?

[12:25] Andrew Linden: The server computes the navmesh

[12:25] Andrew Linden: the viewer downloads a chunk of data and then renders it

[12:26] Andrew Linden: however, the chunk of data is in some havok-proprietary format... the TPV's will have to link to some binary library to interpret the data, I think.

[12:26] Talarus Luan: Computing navmeshes... ugh.. (shades of horror from Skyrim *shudder*)

[12:26] Andrew Linden: Rex, 0x0101 is in hex format... the "0x" indicates hex

[12:27] Andrew Linden: binary has a different format, but I forget what it is

[12:27] Andrew Linden: I'd have to google it...

[12:27] Talarus Luan: Some compilers use 0b for binary, but it isn't standard.

[12:27] Vincent Nacon: isn't binary something like 1010001110100010101?

[12:27] Rex Cronon: i am interested in lsl

[12:27] Vincent Nacon: muhaha!

[12:27] Rex Cronon: how do i tell it to read it as binary not hex

[12:27] Rex Cronon: ?

[12:27] Andrew Linden: sure Vincent, but 101 could be one hundred and one (decimal) for five (binary)

[12:28] Talarus Luan: You don't, probably. :P

[12:28] Talarus Luan: Write a conversion function

[12:28] Andrew Linden: you need some unambigous way to express that it is binary

[12:28] Andrew Linden: it looks like some systems use 101b

[12:28] Andrew Linden: but if it starts with 0x then it means it is in hex

[12:28] Rex Cronon: oh like 100f for loat

[12:28] Andrew Linden: so 0x101 would be... 257 I think

[12:29] Rex Cronon: 101 is 5 in binary

[12:29] Kallista Destiny: %100101 (a prefix indicating binary format)

0b100101 (a prefix indicating binary format, common in programming languages)

[12:29] Draconis Neurocam: string s_toBin(integer x)

{

string out;

while(x)

{

out = (string)(x&1) + out;

x=x>>1;

}

return out;

}

[12:29] Talarus Luan: "There is no support binary notation in either C or C++." so likely there was no support for it put into LSL.<.<

[12:29] Andrew Linden: so yeah, it looks like Telarus is right. some compilers use 101b

[12:29] Vincent Nacon: yeah

[12:30] Andrew Linden: but there is no need for binary format when you have hex

[12:30] Kallista Destiny: I agree

[12:30] Kallista Destiny: hex is just compressed Binary

[12:30] Andrew Linden: hex is much more terse, and its binary equivalent isn't hard to figure out

[12:30] Rex Cronon: thank draconis, but i thought i could do it without writing a function

[12:30] Kallista Destiny: or you could use octla

[12:30] Draconis Neurocam: octal support was dropped from lsl years ago

[12:31] Kallista Destiny: 07777 is 4095

[12:31] Talarus Luan: Did you miss Qie's question earlier?

[12:31] Andrew Linden: probably... I'll read back

[12:31] Davido Chrome: Draconis, did you set your display name AND tag to the same as your name? Or is my viewer bugging out?

[12:31] Talarus Luan: [12:23] Qie (qie.niangao): So... there seems a lot of confusion about the Professional Creators Program, at a very basic level... is there a follow-up blog post or other communication coming soon?

[12:31] Talarus Luan: He set his display name and group tag to his name :P

[12:32] Qie Niangao: (this may not be the right place to ask, but dunno where else to ask that)

[12:32] Draconis Neurocam smiles, "username, display name, and group tag are the same thing"

[12:32] Vincent Nacon: I would anwser but I'm behind a NDA now

[12:32] Andrew Linden: I don't know the answer to that.

[12:32] Talarus Luan: So, how do we get behind a NDA too? :P

[12:32] Davido Chrome: Fuck, i need a Printer!

[12:33] Vincent Nacon: you can't, you get picked

[12:33] Talarus Luan: I'm not a nose.

[12:33] Qie Niangao: Thanks. And, no, if it takes an NDA, I'd prefer not to know. I always decline those.

[12:33] Vincent Nacon: not sure why there's a NDA now because Charlar wasn't keeping secret at the time

[12:33] Nalates Urriah: Me too. You might try contacting Mercille Linden is your interested.

[12:33] Kallista Destiny: I've signed so many NDAs, it 30+ years in the buisness.

[12:34] Vincent Nacon: but change of plan I guess

[12:34] Talarus Luan: Eh well.. likely won't find anything out until it is released, then.

[12:35] Nalates Urriah: I'll wait for the open beta phase

[12:35] Davido Chrome: I mailed her and asked for time. I need to get to a computer with a printer to be able to sign that thing, I don't own a printer. XD

[12:35] Vincent Nacon: could be 3 months or so. a gut feeling it would take that long when there's a NDA in the process

[12:35] Andrew Linden: I've never owned a printer.

[12:35] Nalates Urriah: Sign it in Photoshop...

[12:36] Talarus Luan: Doesn't work.

[12:36] Talarus Luan: You have to snail-mail it back. :P

[12:36] Kallista Destiny: Really, never owned a printer?

[12:36] Nalates Urriah: Will they take a fax?

[12:36] Motor Loon: You can scan it and send my email too

[12:36] Kallista Destiny: How strange, I canlt work w/o aeveral printers

[12:36] Liisa Runo: last time i signed NDA to LL they took it back in with e-mail

[12:37] Vincent Nacon: I've signed in Illustrator

[12:37] Vincent Nacon: muhaha!

[12:37] Vincent Nacon: make my writing look clean

[12:37] Rex Cronon: if all communications r digital, and storage is too, a printer isnot really needed

[12:37] Motor Loon: I think for legal papers like NDA a RL handwritten signature is needed?

[12:37] Talarus Luan: Generally, that is the case

[12:37] Vincent Nacon: yup, you can sign with digital tablet if you got one

[12:38] Talarus Luan: Digital sigs are still a bit of a gray area in court

[12:38] Andrew Linden: Perhaps the relevant laws are just too old?

[12:38] Qie Niangao: heh. NDAs are a gray area in court, especially in California.

[12:38] Melvin Starbrook: dont know for usa laws.. but here a email will do allready i think

[12:38] Davido Chrome: Andrew, I have a Wacom tablet, would it work if I signed it in GIMP?

[12:38] Vincent Nacon: old and grey

[12:38] Kallista Destiny: Laws rarely keep up with the technology .

[12:38] Andrew Linden: IANAL

[12:38] Melvin Starbrook: lol

[12:38] Davido Chrome: Huh?

[12:38] Draconis Neurocam: i am not a lawyer

[12:39] Ashiri: Should be able to use a digital signature, but the laws arre old

[12:39] Nalates Urriah: I understand PDF's with digitial signatures are binding in California.

[12:39] Talarus Luan: Digital sig technology is still a bit immature.

[12:39] Davido Chrome: If I can even import a PDF to GIMP...

[12:39] Vincent Nacon: you can use digital, I've signed a few that way

[12:39] Draconis Neurocam: if not gimp davido i imagine you could in inkscape

[12:39] Vincent Nacon: not limited to SL but other companies

[12:39] Davido Chrome: I better ask Mercille about it.

[12:40] Davido Chrome: Inkscape is Ubuntu compatible?

[12:40] Talarus Luan: Well, sure, you can; and the presenting party can accept them. They can even accept them if you sign them "Mickey Mouse". Doesn't make them any more likely to stand up in court, though. :P

[12:40] Simon Linden: PDF digital signitures are a whole different story, having to deal with keys and such. It's best to just follow the instrutions if they're clear *coughs* or ask Mercille about it

[12:40] Draconis Neurocam: it should be, its open source software

[12:40] Vincent Nacon: I don't think it's a "ask and get joined" case

[12:41] Vincent Nacon: I think they're picking out tester carefully

[12:41] Talarus Luan: So is there some kind of list that one can get on to be picked from, or is it pretty much preferential resident sampling from some other metric?

[12:41] Rex Cronon: btw. additional details r needed asp, otherwise is possible that rumors will start...

[12:42] Vincent Nacon: just do your best, pretty much

[12:42] Rex Cronon: about "Professional Creators Program"

[12:42] Qie Niangao: I think they should include a few griefers in the test group. otherwise, how will they know? :p

[12:42] Liisa Runo: they are? last time LL picked my ALT, she is pretty mental and im sure she was not any help

[12:42] Vincent Nacon: kinda like trying to get a job in interview but there's no interview room

[12:42] Talarus Luan: Do my best? O.o At what? :P

[12:43] Talarus Luan: I always "do my best". :P

[12:43] Vincent Nacon: programming and solving problems?

[12:43] Talarus Luan: Ya, and?

[12:43] Vincent Nacon: I dunno

[12:43] Ashiri: professional creation i guess

[12:43] Vincent Nacon: I don't even know what made me get picked

[12:43] Andrew Linden: I'll see if I can get the word to whoever is in charge of the Prof Creator's Program that you're all looking for a blog post update.

[12:44] Talarus Luan: I just want to avoid going back to the old FIC crap. That is just a disaster waiting to happen.

[12:44] Qie Niangao: that would be excellent, Andrew. Thanks.

[12:44] Andrew Linden: You can state the questions you'd like answered here for the record, but I'm sure I don't know the answers.

[12:44] Vincent Nacon: I dunno Andrew... you might not be allowed to explain how

[12:44] Squirrel Wood: beta testing? I still have that nda collecting dust somewhere..

[12:44] Nalates Urriah: I suspect they pick from those attending UG meetings and those they know from the meetings.

[12:44] Vincent Nacon: could be something what Charlar done wrong?

[12:45] Sahkolihaa Contepomi only has the v2 NDA.

[12:45] Qie Niangao: (My main puzzle about PCP is whether the vetting is of the creator of *scripts* or the creator of *experiences* -- which may use scripts from anywhere, but get permissions because the experience creator owns the permission-getting thing)

[12:46] Simon Linden: I'm not sure Qie, but you all have enough imagination to think of the ways the new functions could be abused. That has to be prevented

[12:47] Andrew Linden: Huh... that is actually a technical question, but I don't know the answer.

[12:47] Andrew Linden: I would guess that it would be the owner of the script, not the creator. But that is just a guess.

[12:47] Vincent Nacon: I'm sure people will be disappointed with the agent teleport function

[12:47] Vincent Nacon: like it might get capped or something

[12:47] Qie Niangao: Right, that would make sense to me, and seems more effective at controlling the bad effects, but... anyway, eager to learn more, when it's ready to be posted.

[12:47] Andrew Linden: Oy right. If someone gave a malicious script to the experience owner then michief may occur.

[12:48] Talarus Luan: I'm wondering how Caleb is getting along with SVC-7556

[12:48] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7556

[#SVC-7556] Objects with llSetKeyframedMotion() stop running after region restarts

[12:48] Rex Cronon: it could be an obfuscated script:)

[12:48] Andrew Linden: Telarus, last I heard Caleb was having trouble reproducing it, but Maestro may have come up with a reliable repro case.

[12:49] Simon Linden: I don't think we've been able to reproduce that one, Talarus

[12:49] Talarus Luan: I'm able to repro it every time.

[12:49] Andrew Linden: That is rumor, based on something Maestro was telling me the other day.

[12:49] Vincent Nacon: or even a script that was sleeping till pinged to have a mass teleport, forcing more than 100k people to teleport into the same sim

[12:49] Qie Niangao: Last week, 7556 hit me on the sim where it hadn't hit me before.

[12:49] Talarus Luan: I can start that object moving, restart the sim, and it stops moving

[12:49] Andrew Linden: We need to get that repro case to Falcon. I'm sure he could fix it in short order.

[12:49] Vincent Nacon: err... 100k people?

[12:49] Kallista Destiny: Well it's much more difficult to really obfuscate LSL than say C or PL\1

[12:49] Talarus Luan: They got a copy already

[12:50] Vincent Nacon: SL doesn't even have that many people online yet...

[12:50] Vincent Nacon: muhaha! my bad

[12:50] Andrew Linden: Ok. I'll ask Falcon about it today.

[12:50] Talarus Luan: One of my tenants said "A Linden!!" the other day after I updated the case to tell them to come get a copy. :P

[12:50] Davido Chrome: Oh, now I remembered my question!

[12:50] Rex Cronon: i don't know if u can fit 100k users in sl?

[12:50] Simon Linden: I'd love to find out, Rex :)

[12:50] ANSI Soderstrom: Simon Linden is talking about "love"

[12:50] Vincent Nacon: we might

[12:50] Kallista Destiny: Oh sure thet are some 30K regions. easy enought

[12:51] Vincent Nacon: just don't expect to see them in their fancy outfit

[12:51] Qie Niangao: everybody bring in their alts simultaneously for April 1... see what we can do.

[12:51] Rex Cronon: i think the max ever recorded was around 90k, simon:)

[12:51] Vincent Nacon: nor your own outfit

[12:51] Andrew Linden: I think our old concurrency record was 85k or 90k.

[12:51] Wuf Shirabyoshi nods

[12:51] Andrew Linden: I'd bet that SL could handle 100k.

[12:51] Vincent Nacon: 80k was the record but....

[12:51] Wuf Shirabyoshi: 90k or so

[12:51] Davido Chrome: When you put a cube to Convex hull to make use the LI system, do you turn the collision object into a Mesh cube with 16 triangle faces? Or is it still recognized as a Havoc primitive?

[12:52] Vincent Nacon: that 80k count was actually a bug

[12:52] Simon Linden: Right, I had 88k in my head ... back in the days of growing pains, it usually wasn't the regions in trouble, but back-end systesm

[12:52] Vincent Nacon: the counter wasn't subtracting the people who logged out

[12:52] Vincent Nacon: or something

[12:52] Wuf Shirabyoshi: hihihi

[12:52] Vincent Nacon: think it was like... 3 or 4 years ago?

[12:52] Wuf Shirabyoshi: so it might as well have been 50k...

[12:52] Andrew Linden: Hrm... dunno if the convex hull of a cube stays a cube.

[12:52] Flip Idlemind: So guize, SVC-7742 and SVC-7743

[12:52] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7742

[#SVC-7742] Per-Parcel Avatar Limits

[12:53] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7743

[#SVC-7743] Better Administrative Control over who can Speak on Voice

[12:53] Andrew Linden: er... a box

[12:53] Vincent Nacon: it does unless you have another cube in link

[12:53] Davido Chrome: Yes, sorry, Box.

[12:53] Andrew Linden: Flip, I was thinking about 7742 the other day...

[12:53] Melvin Starbrook: there are mostly about 66000 in world i think these days :)

[12:53] Talarus Luan: 57.6k atm

[12:53] NeoBokrug Elytis: Per parcel avatar limits won't change server load.

[12:54] Vincent Nacon: 57,551 people online right now

[12:54] Melvin's Windup key TO: Melvin Starbrook's windup key has run out.

[12:54] Davido Chrome: Andrew, do you think you could find out? It's very relevant for keeping simball ramps as efficient as possible.

[12:54] Andrew Linden: and was wondering, if we were to reduce the per-avatar lag so that you could fit 100+ avatars in your parcel and in your view with no appreciable lag... would you still want the per-parcel avtar limit?

[12:54] Andrew Linden: That is... is your motiviation purely to do with lag?

[12:54] Rex Cronon: there was a time when lindens wanted to be able to support arount 1000000 concurent users:)

[12:54] Rex Cronon: around*

[12:54] Melvin Starbrook: YAY!

[12:55] ANSI Soderstrom: yay

[12:55] Melvin Starbrook giggles

[12:55] Sera Lok: you're making me drool Andrew^^

[12:55] Andrew Linden: Sure Davido, I'll ask Falcon about the convex hull of a box.

[12:55] Davido Chrome: Thanks!

[12:56] Nalates Urriah: If we could get a load of avatars in, I can't see where the parcel limit would be needed

[12:56] Flip Idlemind: Well, the sim that I work / hang out at, does a class every week that starts out as 1 big class and breaks off into a few smaller classes. Basically we want it to be more or less evenly distributed, so we don't end up with 45 people at 1 class and 5 at the other

[12:56] Squirrel Wood: there definitely is no need for a per parcel or per sim Squirrel limit :p

[12:56] Flip Idlemind: So we had the idea of putting each class on a parcel, and limiting how many people could be on each parcel

[12:56] Talarus Luan: Yus, one is more than enough :P

[12:56] Andrew Linden: I see, as an easy enforcement for class size.

[12:57] Wuf Shirabyoshi: good reason to make a per parcel avatar limit then?

[12:57] Flip Idlemind: That's also my motivation for 7743, so we don't have people being disruptive on voice during said classes

[12:57] Andrew Linden: Well, I'm not that motivated to add per-parcel avatar limits... the implementation of that just sounds messy.

[12:58] xxx: Hello, Avatar!

[12:58] ANSI Soderstrom: Hello xxx with the UUID of 8fb412cc-5eff-ab21-ca18-ce1d396950f6

[12:58] Flip Idlemind: We want people to talk, but if they spam music over mic or something we'd like to shut them off

[12:58] Avatar: hello xxx

[12:58] Squirrel Wood: put the students into groups and allow access for the groups only

[12:58] Draconis Neurocam: flip why not automate the parcel allowed list

[12:58] Squirrel Wood: as an intermediate solution

[12:58] Andrew Linden: We'd have to keep a new per-parcel tally, and check the many ways in which you can enter a parcel...

[12:58] Talarus Luan: yeah, passes

[12:58] Draconis Neurocam: llAddToLandPassList etc

[12:58] Andrew Linden: login, TP, walk-in, drive-vehicle-in, unseat-into, etc

[12:58] Talarus Luan: That would work

[12:59] Andrew Linden: hrm... yes Draconis is right

[12:59] Talarus Luan: Won't solve the voice problem, but you can figure out who is spamming voice and ask them to stop or get the boot.

[12:59] Flip Idlemind: Points taken. I still think SVC-7743 is a good idea though

[12:59] Flip Idlemind: (The voice control one)

[12:59] Melvin's Windup key TO: Melvin Starbrook's windup key has run out.

[12:59] Squirrel Wood: voice spammers can be easily muted anyway

[13:00] Melvin Starbrook: Eep!

[13:00] Draconis Neurocam: yeah i think more voice features would be neat though

[13:00] Wuf Shirabyoshi: not by the owner of the parcel

[13:00] Kallista Destiny: Andrew, Messy? Great understatement.

[13:00] Draconis Neurocam: but who even handles the vivox interface at LL?

[13:00] Sera Lok: yes i like that one too, there are so many cases where only one or two people should be allowed to talk and constant interruption ruins things, even tho you can mute people etc

[13:00] Talarus Luan: yeah, that's voice for ya. :P

[13:00] Meeter: Welcome to the Server User Group

[13:01] Talarus Luan: O.o

[13:01] Davido Chrome: Huh?

[13:01] Andrew Linden: I agee that 7743 would be nice. Technically possible, I believe. Our voice provider offers some API for control that we are not yet taking full advantage of.

[13:01] Talarus Luan: Must be on GMT :P

[13:01] Davido Chrome: Is that thing going backwards?

[13:01] Nalates Urriah: Daylight Saving unaware script?

[13:01] Qie Niangao: Daylight Savings Time escaped the Meeter

[13:01] Vincent Nacon: muhaha!

[13:01] Talarus Luan: Cool! We get to keep Andrew and Simon another hour! :D

[13:01] Andrew Linden: Ha!

[13:01] Davido Chrome: XD

[13:01] Simon Linden: oh yeah, it's time to fix that script

[13:01] Vincent Nacon: must be set on UNIX time

[13:01] Simon Linden: Twice a year :)

[13:01] Andrew Linden: No, I've got to eat something or die.

[13:02] Vincent Nacon: go eat!

[13:02] Wuf Shirabyoshi: ehm

[13:02] Talarus Luan: There's food right in front of you. <.<

[13:02] Squirrel Wood: eat pixels :p

[13:02] Flip Idlemind: Yeah I had wondered if it were even possible to, on the server end, allow people to hear voice but not speak

[13:02] Wuf Shirabyoshi: you don't die when you don't eat every hour...

[13:02] Rex Cronon: eating code keeps u nice an fit:)

[13:02] Flip Idlemind: If it is, that would be great!

[13:02] Vincent Nacon: don't ask what it is... I found something on google image search and pasted it

[13:02] Sera Lok: don't die please^^

[13:02] Davido Chrome: We would miss you!

[13:02] Squirrel Wood: Mmm. Copy Pasta :)

[13:02] Talarus Luan: Though don't tell Squirrel that it is stir-fried arboreal nut-hoarder...

[13:03] Wuf Shirabyoshi: a what?

[13:03] Talarus Luan: Oops... /snoutpalm

[13:03] Meeter: Meeter is Running

[13:03] Simon Linden: ok, we're good until the fall

[13:03] Wuf Shirabyoshi looks around, but doesn't see a meeter running

[13:03] Sahkolihaa Contepomi keeps forgetting it's not called Autumn over there.

[13:04] Talarus Luan: I call it Autumn

[13:04] Flip Idlemind: It is but not as much as it's called fall

[13:04] Davido Chrome: Which is American and Which is british again?

[13:04] Wuf Shirabyoshi calls it herfst

[13:04] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: I'm British and 'fall' is unheard of.

[13:04] Davido Chrome: Ok.

[13:05] Andrew Linden: Thanks for coming everyone.

[13:05] Melvin's Windup key TO: Melvin Starbrook's windup key has run out.

[13:05] Vincent Nacon: it is called Autumn... we just call it Fall because we're lazy

[13:05] Davido Chrome: Thanks!

[13:05] Rex Cronon: tc andrew

[13:05] Liisa Runo: thanks everybody

[13:05] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: See you Andrew, Simon & Kelly.

[13:05] Sera Lok: happy eating!

[13:05] Vincent Nacon: take care

[13:05] Sera Lok: thanks Lindens

[13:05] Nalates Urriah: Thx Andrew and Lindens

[13:05] Squirrel Wood: http://www.lolhome.com/img_big/anglo-eu-translation-guide.jpg

[13:05] Talarus Luan: Ciao.

[13:05] Rex Cronon: tc simon

[13:05] Melvin Starbrook: thank you :))



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