Bug triage/2007-07-27/Transcript

Agenda

The following transcript is slightly reordered and typo-corrected for easy reading.

Opening

Greetings

Alissa Sabre: Hi, Iridium
Nock Forager: Hi
Iridium Linden: Hello!
Gudmund Shepherd: hey
Iridium Linden: I'm just loading.
Iridium Linden: How is everyone?
Iridium Linden: Thanks so much for being here.
Gudmund Shepherd: a bit pensive, havent a clue what'll happen :)
Iridium Linden: Let's just wait for the other Lindens to arrive.
Iridium Linden: Then we can get started.
Daedalus Young: I see 4 green dots on the minimap, but you're rezzing slow...
Daedalus Young: ah there we are
Iridium Linden: Hiya, Daedalus!
Daedalus Young: hello :)
Iridium Linden: Hello, Aric!
Iridium Linden: Thanks for coming.
Daedalus Young: hi
Gudmund Shepherd: hi
Torley Linden: Helloooo!
Alissa Sabre: Hi Aric
Iridium Linden: Torley!
Iridium Linden: Wow, I didn't expect you.
Aric Linden: Hi Iridium
Torley Linden: Yeah, no Blacklight meeting... Bridie will be here shortly too. :)
Torley Linden: Hee hee.
Iridium Linden: Nice.
Aric Linden: hi torley
Iridium Linden: Aric, I love your hair.
Iridium Linden: hehe
Aric Linden: /grins
Aric Linden: thanks
Daedalus Young: how's the restart doing?
Torley Linden: Aric's got da 'hawk!
Iridium Linden: Hey, Kona.
Kona Linden: hello my pretties!
Aric Linden: well, I'm sort of jealous of the melon head look
Daedalus Young: hi
Aric Linden: I have an idea for my next av
Aric Linden: a very sneaky idea
Torley Linden: Ooooh.
Daedalus Young: sneaky or Snaky?
Torley Linden: So presumably we won't find out until you're ready to unveil it?
Torley Linden: Yo Kona!
Kona Linden: 'ello!
Kona Linden: hiya Bridie
Torley Linden: Heya Ben!
Torley Linden: What's up Bridie!
Benjamin Linden: hey guys
Torley Linden: Heyo Jaime!
Bridie Linden: Hola!
Iridium Linden: Hiya, Benjamin.
Kona Linden: hiya Jaime!
Jaime Linden: Hi!!
Iridium Linden: Hey Bridie!
Torley Linden shouts: We be getting lots of Lindens in da hizzouse.
Iridium Linden: Hi Jaime.
Benjamin Linden: hey Alissa, glad you could make it
Bridie Linden: hey Alissa
Alissa Sabre: Hmm. So many Lindens!
Iridium Linden: Jaime, I don't know if you wanted to make some comments before we started ...
Torley Linden: Stephany too! What a jamboree!
Iridium Linden: Hiya, Stephany.
Alissa Sabre: Hi Benjamin
Aric Linden: sorry, sidetracked
Stephany Linden: hello
Daedalus Young: hi
Gudmund Shepherd: hey, all :)
Nock Forager: I never met so many Lindens lol
Torley Linden: Socrates at the door!
Torley Linden: (Pseudo-door.)
Socrates Linden: Hi everyone
Jaime Linden: Iridium- feel free to rock it
Kona Linden: hmmm
Iridium Linden: Hi Socrates.
Iridium Linden: Jeez, I've never seen so many Lindens, lol.
Kona Linden: hiya, Socrates
Stephany Linden: lol
Daedalus Young: I've only seen more at the Linden Dunk
Boroondas Gupte: oops, sorry socrates
Iridium Linden: lol
Boroondas Gupte shouldn't fly while still rezzing
Bridie Linden: Like that?
Bridie Linden: :)

Adgenda and process

Iridium Linden: Okay, so does everyone know how a triage works?
Stephany Linden: iridium: please review :)
Iridium Linden: kk.
Iridium Linden: Here's the agenda.
Iridium Linden: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Bug_triage/Internationalization_Agenda
Stephany Linden: we start the bug on its LL life...
Iridium Linden: We examine the bugs in order.
Bridie Linden: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Bug_triage#Process_notes
Iridium Linden: And we decide what to do with them ... resolve, import, etc.
Iridium Linden: Thanks, Bridie!
Iridium Linden: Now, we have lots of patches to look through, so I suggest we start there.
Iridium Linden: Agreed?
Stephany Linden: yes
Alissa Sabre: I'm slightly afraid that we have just a few issues with patches.

Bugfix Patches

VWR-943: en_US.utf8 is not guaranteed to be a compiled locale

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-943
Jaime Linden: yup
Iridium Linden: Votes: 2 - en_US.utf8 is not guaranteed to be a compiled locale
Alissa Sabre: 943 is a tough one.
Alissa Sabre: The original issue stated that SL viewer should not rely on the existance of en_US.utf8 locale on Linux
Stephany Linden: alissa: you have great comments in that task btw - thanks.
Alissa Sabre: but the real issue here, IMHO, is that the viewer uses the OS's setlocale
Alissa Sabre: in a not suitable manner.
Alissa Sabre: TBBle wants to use the OS's default locale, that is one specified by LANG environment variable
Stephany Linden: you can assign this one to me (still reading)
Alissa Sabre: and I counter proposed "C" locale
Alissa Sabre: but the real solution will be,
Stephany Linden: we can assess the proposed "handle all UTF-8"
Alissa Sabre: just avoid using OS's setlocale function at all.
Stephany Linden: regardless of locale
Stephany Linden: I will take this one for the studio
Stephany Linden: sounds like it would be a viewer change
Alissa Sabre: at this moment, SL viewer has its own way to control the UI language.
Stephany Linden: yes
Gudmund Shepherd: mhmm
Alissa Sabre: so, I don't think use of OS setlocale is a good idea.
Kona Linden: Alissa, good point
Boroondas Gupte agrees
Iridium Linden: Looks like it's already been imported.
Stephany Linden: it's an astute observation - thank you.
Stephany Linden: ok next! thanks again alissa
Stephany Linden: :)
Alissa Sabre: my pleasure
Bridie Linden: brb

VWR-1874: Some locales incorrectly use Kbps to mean kbps

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1874
Iridium Linden: Votes: 1 - Some locales incorrectly use Kbps to mean kbps
Daedalus Young: I've done some more research on that
Torley Linden: Oh, this sounds familiar.
Alissa Sabre: I don't care about that! lol
Stephany Linden: lol
Aric Linden: This is a dup
Daedalus Young: devs will have to answer the question what the number really means
Gudmund Shepherd: its not a dupe
Aric Linden: We've already taken this in
Daedalus Young: if it is meant 1000 bits per second or 1024 bits per second
Stephany Linden: go aric and QA ;)
Gudmund Shepherd: the other issue relates to generated strings from the viewer, this is just from the locale files.
Iridium Linden: Do we have an internal ID for it?
Aric Linden: But the solution will apply to both, Gudmund
Alissa Sabre: locale files? do you mean XUI files?
Gudmund Shepherd: yes, Alissa
Alissa Sabre: Ok.
Aric Linden: Iridium, you can import this and assign it to me,
Indigo Mertel: is this discussion limited to issues related to the client or anything that has to do with internationalization?
Iridium Linden: Great, will do, Aric.
Aric Linden: I'll link them and make sure that the bug fix for one resolves both
Gudmund Shepherd: Aric: the entries occur in the preference pages, iirc
Daedalus Young: Indigo, these issues: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Bug_triage/Internationalization_Agenda
Stephany Linden: indigo:
Stephany Linden: yes :)
Daedalus Young: :)
Stephany Linden: we found that a lot of int'l issues
Stephany Linden: were coming up in UI bug triage
Stephany Linden: so iridium founded this one too :)
Indigo Mertel: ok... thanks :)
Stephany Linden: np
Aric Linden: Gudmund, please annotate the bug and we'll do our best to accomodate your concerns
Iridium Linden: Imported and assigned.
Aric Linden: Ty
Torley Linden: WB Bridie.
Gudmund Shepherd: ok
Bridie Linden: ty

VWR-1873: Typos in en-us locale file

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1873
Iridium Linden: That's the next one.
Alissa Sabre: It's a simple one
Daedalus Young: that's imported already
Daedalus Young: so Torley said
Aric Linden: please assign it to triage
Gudmund Shepherd: not really intel. either, hmm
Vito Arguello: how's it going, is thisa private meeting?
Jaime Linden: 1873 is assigned to me right now
Stephany Linden: vito: come on it
Jaime Linden: should i reassign to traige?
Daedalus Young: not private, it's an open meeting :)
Stephany Linden: international bug triage
Vito Arguello: ah thanks
Aric Linden: yes please Jaime
Torley Linden: Welcome aboard Vito!
Vito Arguello: thanks
Iridium Linden: Okay, so shall we move onto Feature Request Patches?
Torley Linden: Vito, in case you missed it earlier, we're going through these issues -- http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Bug_triage/Internationalization_Agenda
Stephany Linden: sure
Vito Arguello: thanks torley
Jaime Linden: aric- done
Jaime Linden: unfortunately

Feature Request Patches

VWR-774: First draft of Swedish translation

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-774
Alissa Sabre: I've already commented
Stephany Linden: jaime: I think you can take this and
Jaime Linden: we're currently not accepting translations
Alissa Sabre: VWR-774 looks not ready
Jaime Linden: for new languages
Jaime Linden: that aren't currently in the viewer
Jaime Linden: for the time being
Stephany Linden: we are however
Alissa Sabre: What is your plan, then?
Stephany Linden: (I am in the studio that works on the viewer)
Stephany Linden: we ARE working on what we call a "skinning" project
Alissa Sabre: Hmm.
Indigo Mertel: oh my, I have never seen so many Lindens in one go... :)
Stephany Linden: that will make XUI translations better and NOT overwrite
Stephany Linden: changes
Stephany Linden: so if someone translates the viewer in any language, and we update the viewer
Stephany Linden: right now, we overwrite some changes
Alissa Sabre: That sounds good, but there are some residents already working on their own translation
Vito Arguello: hehe tell about it indigo, i've never even talked to a linden before, except pluxor yesterday when i asked about employment =D
Stephany Linden: we are changing that
Alissa Sabre: Ok. My opinion is as follows:
Stephany Linden: I can note to do a blog post on this
Alissa Sabre: (1) just keep those translations in JIRA for a while
Stephany Linden: we presented to SL DEV group
Stephany Linden: the details of how this will work
Stephany Linden: go ahead alissa sorry :)
Alissa Sabre: (2) you should announce your skinning project to residents so that their effort on translating current XUI files
Alissa Sabre: doesn't go out
Jaime Linden: stephany- lets catch up on this later today
Jaime Linden: b/c jean was talking about this too
Jaime Linden: alissa- we will do our best to address your suggestions
Gudmund Shepherd is going to be maintaining his translation in JIRA even if it isn't accepted, just to keep it fresh.
Stephany Linden: alissa - we will consider a formal announcement - no reason not to since we presented it to SLDEV residents.
Stephany Linden: :)
Kona Linden: Gudmund, TY
Aric Linden: gudmund, i think that's a great idea
Alissa Sabre: I believe this Sweedish one is OK, since it is not completed yet
Iridium Linden: Shall I comment in the JIRA that even though we aren't accepting translations, we'll have more info on what's called a "skinning" project soon?
Stephany Linden: yes

VWR-1293: Traditional Chinese UI for Second Life Viewer

Alissa Sabre: but Chinese one, 1293 is already done.
Alissa Sabre: and I have a feeling that the contributor very much wants his translation to go into the viewer distribution
Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1293
Iridium Linden: Right, there it is.
Jaime Linden: can i ask-
Jaime Linden: we have a chinese viewer now
Alissa Sabre: Yes
Jaime Linden: how is this person claiming its the "first public availability of a Traditional Chinese UI"
Jaime Linden: ?
Alissa Sabre: I don't think it is complete, but you already have a choice
Alissa Sabre: Ok.
Alissa Sabre: Today, we have two different Chinese orthography on this small planet
Stephany Linden: yes indeed :)
Alissa Sabre: One is used in main land China and is called Simplified
Iridium Linden: So shall we mark this as won't fix?
Alissa Sabre: Another is used in Taiwan, Hong Kong and Macao and called Traditional
Gudmund Shepherd: and SL Chinese is simplified?
Alissa Sabre: Yes.
Jaime Linden: iridium-
Alissa Sabre: The current Chinese in Viewer is Simplified one.
Jaime Linden: assign it to me
Iridium Linden: kk
Jaime Linden: and let me get someone to take a look
Kona Linden: Alissa, do you think that would be the better choice, simplified?
Alissa Sabre: We need both.
Stephany Linden: kona: ideally both but most likely simplified for now
Iridium Linden: I think we should drop the priority to normal though, yes?
Nock Forager: That's two are completely different.
Stephany Linden: nock: yes.
Alissa Sabre: I suggest "Chinese (Simplefied)" and "Chinese (Traditional)"
Jaime Linden: right, since that's in line with our not accepting new languages- for now
Alissa Sabre: and their RFC 3066 codes are zh-cn and zh-tw
Stephany Linden: yes
Gudmund Shepherd: should the current Chinese translation have a different name in the picker?
Alissa Sabre: As long as viewer has one Chinese, we can simply call it Chinese
Jaime Linden: iridium- yes
Stephany Linden: so to jaime - next?

Chaley May: this isnt an office hour?
Stephany Linden: chaley: no, international bug triage
Stephany Linden: :)
Chaley May: ok

VWR-1822: First draft of English (British) translation

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1822
Iridium Linden: Ready for this one?
Gudmund Shepherd: Alissa, comment in JIRA?
Daedalus Young: same thing, different language
Daedalus Young: British English vs US English
Stephany Linden: my mom lives in UK... maybe I can enlist her ;)
Stephany Linden: lol
Alissa Sabre: I'm not sure 1822 is complete, though ...
Gudmund Shepherd: heh
Kittie Munro: we're in the UK
Jaime Linden: right- same thing different language
Gudmund Shepherd: It's mostly complete, I would like to continue working on it for a bit though.
Vito Arguello: british and US english? haha, similar
Jaime Linden: can't do anything about it for now
Alissa Sabre: Tofu Linden commented that 1822 uses "Color" as opposed to "colour"
Daedalus Young: my Resident Bear speaks of colour too
Stephany Linden: I really just need to post the XUI forhtcoming changes :)
Gudmund Shepherd: Alissa: an accident :)
Daedalus Young: yes please :)
Stephany Linden: it will make it so much easier
Jaime Linden: stephany- yea
Stephany Linden: so - what jaime said - new language, next?
Gudmund Shepherd: next
Alissa Sabre: I forgot who, but I read a mail in sldev
Stephany Linden: :)
Kona Linden: I refuse to call aluminum "aluminium"
Stephany Linden: lol
Kona Linden: lol
Stephany Linden: al-you-miny-yum
Stephany Linden: :)
Iridium Linden: So shall we import this one or mark as won't fix?
Iridium Linden: lol
Alissa Sabre: asking the process translating XUI files ... current XUI files
Alissa Sabre: and I pointed out that there is a wiki page to explain it.
Stephany Linden: wont' fix but jaime can comment
Jaime Linden: what did we do for the swedish?
Iridium Linden: kk
Stephany Linden: assigned to jaime
Stephany Linden: for swedish I think
Jaime Linden: should do same thing
Alissa Sabre: we need to put a comment on that page not to do it now!

Other Bug Reports

VWR-250: Preedit (composition) strings are shown poorly when typing Japanese text on Windows

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-250
Alissa Sabre: 250 is mine.
Alissa Sabre: I'm working on it.
Jaime Linden: ok- so need more info
Alissa Sabre: I submitted a patch set, but it is not complete yet.
Aric Linden: I think this should be imported
Stephany Linden: yes
Alissa Sabre: imported as an issue, yes. but the patch is not ready for import
Aric Linden: Alissa, how far away is your patch?
Alissa Sabre: It works already. I'm now using the patched version.
Iridium Linden: It's already been imported.
Stephany Linden: great - thanks alissa
Alissa Sabre: however, the patch lacks some stable behaviour on exceptional conditions
Stephany Linden: :)
Aric Linden: please assign it to triage
Stephany Linden: dare I say... what in SL does not from time to time?
Stephany Linden: :o
Alissa Sabre: I'm very happy to keep working on it
Aric Linden: /sighs
Iridium Linden: assigned
Aric Linden: ok. i'd suggest that we import this, assign it to triage and note that a patch will be coming
Stephany Linden: yes
Iridium Linden: Okay, onto bugs.
Aric Linden: Alissa, you can send me a note directly when you
Stephany Linden: woot
Iridium Linden: Imported, assigned, and making a note.
Aric Linden: finish your patch
Alissa Sabre: Ok. To Aric. Fine.
Aric Linden: ty

VWR-721: Dates are not displayed in the local date format

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-721
Stephany Linden: I will take this
Stephany Linden: we could just do the international "standard" which I think is 2007-07-26 style?
Jaime Linden: yup
Alissa Sabre: Please note that your date format should be that of the viewer's language selection, but the OS's selection
Gudmund Shepherd: that's it
Stephany Linden: give it to meeeee
Jaime Linden: next
Aric Linden: thanks stephany
Stephany Linden: np

VWR-1563: Profile Mute button should display muted state (confuses international Residents)

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1563
Iridium Linden: Imported and assigned.
Aric Linden: I'd suggest that this go to the RX group
Aric Linden: /grins at Benjamin
Benjamin Linden: :-)
Stephany Linden: yes! to Ben!
Kona Linden: snicker
Torley Linden: Yeah, I had already imported that.
Torley Linden: It's currently "been triaged" internally...
Stephany Linden: next?
Torley Linden: See Ben's last comment internally. :)
Iridium Linden: kk

VWR-593: Better display of UTF characters

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-593
Stephany Linden: jaime and I are "next"y
Aric Linden: ok torley
Aric Linden: torley, we should have a follow up talk about process here
Torley Linden: Sure thing Aric.
Stephany Linden: I'm tempted to say, "We need better UTF-8 handling overall"
Stephany Linden: not just russian
Iridium Linden: This has an internal id.
Kona Linden: /second that
Alissa Sabre: Yes, but this issue is speciically on Russian letters
Stephany Linden: yes
Iridium Linden: It's unassigned.
Alissa Sabre: I have a feeling that this is simply a font issue
Alissa Sabre: unfortunately, we can't read the repro...
Iridium Linden: Hmm, shall we mark as needs more info?
Stephany Linden: see, but I could say "we don't support russian now" and say "close, "new language", but it may have otehr implications
Stephany Linden: yes
Stephany Linden: yes to iridium
Aric Linden: Well, we test for cyrilic now
Stephany Linden: true
Alissa Sabre: not support Russian? what does it mean?
Aric Linden: in our smoke test, but that's to make sure it doesn't break anything
Stephany Linden: that's just functional testing though
Alissa Sabre: SL viewer doesn't support Russian UI, but this issue is on the residents' language, e.g., IM or Chat
Stephany Linden: iridium: more info
Stephany Linden: alissa; yes

VWR-87: Inappropriate texts in About floater translations

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-87
Stephany Linden: jaime I think this is you?
Gudmund Shepherd: seems that a localiser has touched the licence text *shrug*
Stephany Linden: we can share it :)
Alissa Sabre: Ah, it's an old one submitted by me...
Torley Linden: Gudmund, good stuff keeping track of those easter egg messages. :)
Jaime Linden: k
Alissa Sabre: I'm sorry I did it as half a joke...
Iridium Linden: It's been assigned.
Alissa Sabre: easter egg is OK, but the problem is the copyright related message
Iridium Linden: Shall we reassign?
Iridium Linden: Hmm
Aric Linden: yep, please assign it to me
Aric Linden: if it's still a problem, we'll repro it and fix it
Iridium Linden: done
Alissa Sabre: even after the viewer code has been distributed under GPL
Aric Linden: if not, we'll punt it to oblivion
Aric Linden: Thanks!
Alissa Sabre: the Japanese message stated no-copy, no-modify policy
Gudmund Shepherd: heh, sorry, I missed that Alissa :)

VWR-112: Arabic language needs to be displayed right to left rather than left to right

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-112
Jaime Linden: this one is new to me
Alissa Sabre: and it's Rob Linden who files this!
Alissa Sabre: filed
Iridium Linden: And the note from CrystalShard that we need to do this for Hebrew too.
Alissa Sabre: For this one, I'd like to say "I'm sorry but the current viewer doesn't support right-to-left writing..."
Jaime Linden: but its something to think about for the future
Alissa Sabre: Yes. Arabic and Hebrew are two major right-to-left texts today.
Aric Linden: I think we should import it but note that we're not likely to fix it in the near future
Alissa Sabre: Yes. I have a plan how to implement it
Iridium Linden: So we'll leave this open though.
Iridium Linden: Great.
Gudmund Shepherd: I'd agree, it's a lot of work to add rtl support easily
Alissa Sabre: but it definitly need some more time.
Iridium Linden: It has an issue id.
Stephany Linden: yes - major effort.
Aric Linden: I think we should recognize that this is an outstanding issue, but it's a someday
Iridium Linden: Cory is the reporter on that one.
Jaime Linden: agreed
Stephany Linden: oh lord
Stephany Linden: :)
Alissa Sabre: I have sent my plan to Jean Linden, several months ago...
Aric Linden: laughs
Stephany Linden: that cory *shakes fist* :)
Aric Linden: looks over his shoulder at cory
Iridium Linden: So we'll leave this unassigned?
Stephany Linden: ok
Stephany Linden: we can assign and comment as someday
Stephany Linden: but we know it will be a while
Stephany Linden: so not sure we should leave it hanging
Iridium Linden: Who wants the assignment then?
Iridium Linden: lol
Iridium Linden: kk, perhaps we should move onto the next one.

VWR-298: Practically impossible to enter Japanese text when viewer is running full-screen on MacOS

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-298
Alissa Sabre: It's mine.
Alissa Sabre: I have a feeling that we have discussed this on the last UI triage?
Iridium Linden: This also has an ID.
Stephany Linden: I'll take 298
Iridium Linden: We did.
Stephany Linden: if it is unassigned
Stephany Linden: or steve
Stephany Linden: both of us are on rendering
Alissa Sabre: On the UI triage I said that my patch to VWR-250 will hopefully solve this 298 too
Iridium Linden: Hmm, it's assigned.
Iridium Linden: So, we'll leave it and assign to WorkingOnItLinden.

VWR-1676: Cmd+A causes the viewer to quit with french keyboards (Mac OS)

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1676
Stephany Linden: ok
Stephany Linden: wow
Stephany Linden: wonder what to do about this one ;)
Stephany Linden: if we can...
Stephany Linden: hmmm
Torley Linden: At least now there's a confirmation before quitting. :)
Stephany Linden: LOL
Aric Linden: Need to import it and work on solving it with a keyboard mapping file
Gudmund Shepherd: heh
Torley Linden: I guess those are AZERTY keyboards eh?
Stephany Linden: but only in french
Alissa Sabre: yes
Stephany Linden: torely: probably
Daedalus Young: guess so yes
Alissa Sabre: Don't you have a similar problem if a user has a Dvorak one?
Aric Linden: Alissa, i'm sure you're right
Iridium Linden: kk, so we'll import and assign to triage, Aric?
Stephany Linden: ok
Aric Linden: Yes please Iridium
Stephany Linden: next?
Alissa Sabre: I'm not sure why this happens, but we need a fundamental solution to it, not just azerty hack
Stephany Linden: sounds like the other
Stephany Linden: ...
Boroondas Gupte: key combos shouldn depend on the position of a key
Aric Linden: Alissa, we'll do the best we can. I'd suspect that we'll eventually allow customized shortcuts or keyboard maps

VWR-335: Needs two Chinese on Language selection

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-335
Gudmund Shepherd: We spoke about that just now
Jaime Linden: right
Alissa Sabre: This states Simplefied vs Traditional one.
Alissa Sabre: Yes
Jaime Linden: dup?
Stephany Linden: dupe
Alissa Sabre: No dup as an issue. Just related
Daedalus Young: no dupe I think, the other was a patch, right?
Iridium Linden: Yes.
Stephany Linden: true
Jaime Linden: ah
Iridium Linden: It was, Daedalus.
Aric Linden: I think they should be linked
Jaime Linden: agreed
Stephany Linden: yes
Gudmund Shepherd: is linked already.
Kona Linden: what number was the patch?
Alissa Sabre: I believe they are already linked
Daedalus Young: they're linked already
Jaime Linden: cool
Iridium Linden: 1293
Aric Linden: then import and lets go on
Kona Linden: yep, linked already

VWR-1742: Unicode problem when using Turkish alphabet characters in viewer

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1742
Jaime Linden: seems like same problem as with russian
Alissa Sabre: not exactly
Alissa Sabre: Turkish is written using Latin alphabets
Alissa Sabre: but it requires some special characters not in Latin-1
Alissa Sabre: you distribute Metabook fonts with viewer
Gudmund Shepherd: is it just a combining issue?
Aric Linden: very very thoughtful comments Alissa
Alissa Sabre: and the metabook font only contain latin-1
Alissa Sabre: as a result, when writing Turkish,
Alissa Sabre: Latin-1 characters are taken from teh metabook font, and some missing letters are taken from fallback font.
Aric Linden: I think we should import this and discuss this as part of the skinning project
Torley Linden: That sounds like it relates to the requests to have a proper, non-restrictive Unicode font shipped with the viewer.
Alissa Sabre: and the bold text looks very poor, since thereare no bold fallback fonts
Aric Linden: Maybe encourage someone to really undertake a patch
Stephany Linden: aric: yes
Aric Linden: looks at Alissa thoughtfully
Stephany Linden: lol
Gudmund Shepherd: heh
Iridium Linden: lol
Stephany Linden: aric: as the PM on skinning I say let's discuss
Stephany Linden: ;)
Alissa Sabre: If you can shipt full Unicode font with the viewer, it's great, but I expect such font is extremely expensive
Iridium Linden: Shall I assign to triage?
Iridium Linden: Or to you, Stephany>?
Aric Linden: We should discuss the cost
Stephany Linden: me please
Aric Linden: Thanks Stephany
Torley Linden: There are some open-source Unicode fonts, aren't there? But I know for awhile, the most popular solution has been Arial Unicode from Microsoft, which costs.
Gudmund Shepherd: Alissa: best to see if such fonts as Deja Vu could be included
Alissa Sabre: Unfortunately not...
Alissa Sabre: Deja Vu is just a collecton of fonts
Aric Linden: Let's move on. I trust Stephany to drive the details

VWR-1629: Hebrew is not usable in the Viewer since 1.11/1.12 unless you have once installed at least 1.10

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1629
Iridium Linden: Smiley is a teen. Very smart.
Iridium Linden: Too bad he's not here.
Alissa Sabre: this is the Hebrew version o fthe Arabic issue we discussed already
Stephany Linden: yes
Iridium Linden: There's a patch here.
Iridium Linden: And it's linked.
Stephany Linden: aric: I wll detail dive like you won't believe
Alissa Sabre: A patch?
Iridium Linden: That's what it says.
Alissa Sabre: for 1629?
Iridium Linden: Let me open it.
Alissa Sabre: Ah, that's *MY* patch.
Iridium Linden: lol
Iridium Linden: Yeah, I just looked at it.
Alissa Sabre: It's not a solution but a temporary workaround...
Stephany Linden: alissa: want to run these meetings? lol
Iridium Linden: I know, huh.
Iridium Linden: So shall we import this one or leave it open as it's linked.
Alissa Sabre: moreover it workaround just one issue out of two.
Alissa Sabre: I suggest just link to Arabic one and make it a future issue
Aric Linden: import it so that we're sure it's being assigned and monitored
Aric Linden: I agree with Alissa
Aric Linden: mostly. import it, link it and assign it to whomever is holding the arabic one
Stephany Linden: agreed
Stephany Linden: yes
Stephany Linden: next?
Aric Linden: uno mas?

VWR-1593: Improve localisation ability of Second Life

Iridium Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1593
Stephany Linden: me
Alissa Sabre: That filing contains several issues in one
Stephany Linden: yes it does
Aric Linden: This seems like a big usability request
Gudmund Shepherd: that's a large feature request
Stephany Linden: but I would consider it part of evaluating localizatin features
Aric Linden: not really a bug or series of bugs
Stephany Linden: which we ARE doing
Alissa Sabre: Essentially, it says two things.
Aric Linden: I agree, but it's not a bug per se
Alissa Sabre: One is the date-time format that we already discussed
Gudmund Shepherd: support changing things like "meter" replacement with locale strings
Alissa Sabre: another is some language strings that are not in XUI files
Stephany Linden: no but I can take it as a feature request (which we like)
Aric Linden: Stephany, you may want to include it in the dialog for upcoming dev support for INTL
Alissa Sabre: Hi, Gudmund! You are here!
Stephany Linden: yes
Gudmund Shepherd: been here all the while ;)

Closing

Stephany Linden: can you tell west coast lunchtime approaches?
Iridium Linden: OH, it's 12 already.
Iridium Linden: Stephany, there is also an issue with First Look further down, but we can do that at the next meeting.
Iridium Linden: lol
Stephany Linden: ok - I think we are wrapping up
Stephany Linden: rolling restart to finish here :)
Iridium Linden: Yes, thanks so much for coming all of you.
Phli Foxchase: Sorry but when will be the next Internationalization bug triage ? I forgot to put a french bug on Jira for today
Stephany Linden: thank you everyone!
Kona Linden: there is absolutely nothing wrong with First Look...just don't look too closely is all
Stephany Linden: every friday
Gudmund Shepherd: hah, ok. thanks peeps.
Phli Foxchase: ok
Torley Linden: :)
Stephany Linden: 11 AM PST
Stephany Linden: :)
Iridium Linden: I'll schedule it on the wiki page.
Aric Linden: thanks everyone
Aric Linden: I've never seen so many lindens.
Kona Linden: brilliant folks
Iridium Linden: We don't have very many bugs in pJIRA for international issues yet, so I don't think we need to have weekly meetings.
Daedalus Young: well so much for my genius ideas today :P
Stephany Linden: you guys help so much
Vito Arguello: take care, nice meeting all you lindens heh
Torley Linden: Good to see y'all.
Alissa Sabre: are we finishing now?
Stephany Linden: bye!
Gudmund Shepherd: /wave
Stephany Linden: we are - one hour ::/
Torley Linden: T'care!
Iridium Linden: Yes, Alissa.
Boroondas Gupte: good bye all
Kona Linden: Thanks everybody...you residents rocked it!
Iridium Linden: Bye, Gundman.
Iridium Linden: Gudmund*
Kona Linden: *now Kona is even more confused than ever...*
Kona Linden: lol
Daedalus Young: w00t! you Lindens rocked it too!
Felexcia Taurog: May I ask a question please
Gudmund Shepherd: cya everyone
Jaime Linden: thanks!
Stephany Linden: thanks! happy weekend
Kona Linden: Felexcia, sure
Phli Foxchase: have a good wek end
Alissa Sabre: Ok. I need to sleep now!
Phli Foxchase: week*
Felexcia Taurog: thank you :)
Iridium Linden: Alissa, we'll have this meeting at a more convenient time next time.
Iridium Linden: :)
Alissa Sabre: It's 4 am here in Japan
Stephany Linden: :o
Daedalus Young: come visit Torley's Office Hour at 2pm!
Gudmund Shepherd: Alissa, ooh, sorry to hear that
Stephany Linden: alissa - THANK YOU for comin
Felexcia Taurog: I'm not very good with getting around in here and don't have a technical mind AT ALL but.....
Alissa Sabre: bye
Indigo Mertel: too bad... it's perfect for me... :(
Alissa Sabre: and see you all next time too
Iridium Linden: Nye!
Iridium Linden: Yes.