User:Benjamin Linden/Office Hours/2008-06-19

Transcript of Benjamin Linden's office hours:

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[15:01]	Benjamin Linden:	hi all
[15:01]	Squirrel Wood:	Hello Benjamin
[15:01]	Grant Linden:	hello lya
[15:01]	Grant Linden:	hello Ben!
[15:01]	Benjamin Linden:	how is everyone?
[15:01]	lya Parx:	hello
[15:01]	Dusan Writer:	hi ben, good thanks
[15:01]	Dunan Wilder:	waouhn spiky benjamin ^.^
[15:01]	Benjamin Linden:	Dusan, thanks for joining us.
[15:01]	Argos Dreamscape:	benjamen
[15:01]	Benjamin Linden:	it's nice meeting you, I enjoy reading your blog :-)
[15:01]	Dusan Writer:	aww sure my pleasure Grant held a great session last week
[15:02]	Argos Dreamscape:	your avatar is amazing
[15:02]	lya Parx:	Ican espanish
[15:02]	Squirrel Wood:	a full sim is too expensive, an openspace sim is out of question (need to own a full sim to be able to order one) and a parcel is either too small or too pricey
[15:02]	Jacek Antonelli:	heya Kippie!
[15:02]	Dunan Wilder:	well you can always buy an open space to a landlord, you'll pay a bit more but you won't need to won a regular island
[15:02]	Grant Linden:	so, we have not created the best land offering for you yet, Squirrel?
[15:02]	lya Parx:	i can espanish?
[15:02]	Squirrel Wood:	Not yet ^^
[15:02]	Grant Linden:	hello Kippie
[15:03]	Kippie Friedkin:	HI everybody!
[15:03]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks Argos :-)
[15:03]	Echo Seigo:	hi kippers
[15:03]	Benjamin Linden:	Hi there Kippie
[15:03]	Argos Dreamscape:	you are welcome
[15:03]	Argos Dreamscape:	lindens get the best avs
[15:03]	lya Parx:	merci
[15:03]	Squirrel Wood:	besides I'd have to add 20% VAT to it
[15:03]	lya Parx:	Hey!
[15:03]	lya Parx:	Hey!
[15:03]	Benjamin Linden:	glad to hear things went well last week. I actually just have a couple things to discuss then I'm going to let Grant run with the rest of the meeting again since I have to take off at 3:30
[15:04]	Grant Linden:	we just know how to shop :)
[15:04]	Benjamin Linden:	the main thing I wanted to bring up was that we have a user experience mailing list now
[15:04]	Argos Dreamscape:	oh yea and u have money too
[15:04]	Benjamin Linden:	as requested :-)
[15:04]	Argos Dreamscape:	*GIGGLES* :)Grant Linden 16:02, 23 June 2008 (PDT)
[15:04]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yay, mailing list! o/
[15:04]	Benjamin Linden:	so I'd like to encourage everyone to sign up for the list
[15:04]	Benjamin Linden:	we will being using it to announce topics for office hours
[15:05]	Benjamin Linden:	Jacek also reminded me to send an announcement of the list to SLdev
[15:05]	Benjamin Linden:	which I'll do shortly
[15:05]	Benjamin Linden:	but I was wondering if there are other places you think we should post an announcement
[15:05]	Benjamin Linden:	perhaps on the blog?
[15:05]	Argos Dreamscape:	blog would be a good idea
[15:05]	Dunan Wilder:	great :)
[15:06]	Dunan Wilder:	blog is defintely a good place to put it
[15:06]	Squirrel Wood:	sl forums, blog, other sl mailing lists, ...
[15:06]	Bridie Linden is Offline
[15:06]	Benjamin Linden:	good call on the forums, Squirrel
[15:06]	Benjamin Linden:	are there specific ones we should look at?
[15:06]	Argos Dreamscape:	oh! to jump off topic for just a second i have to say i love alt ctr h'
[15:07]	Argos Dreamscape:	sorrry the hippos one
[15:07]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:07]	Argos Dreamscape:	so cool
[15:08]	Squirrel Wood:	specific forums? the SL forums.... whereever it fits in
[15:08]	Benjamin Linden:	what is alt ctr h
[15:08]	Argos Dreamscape:	shift
[15:08]	Benjamin Linden:	ok squirrel I'll have a look
[15:08]	Argos Dreamscape:	too
[15:08]	Grant Linden is looking
[15:08]	Benjamin Linden:	lol
[15:08]	Argos Dreamscape:	alt ctr shift h'
[15:08]	Benjamin Linden:	oh jeeze
[15:08]	Argos Dreamscape:	hippos!
	[15:09]  hippos!
[15:09]	Jacek Antonelli:	:D
[15:09]	Echo Seigo:	lol
[15:09]	Grant Linden laughs
[15:09]	Benjamin Linden:	does everyone here know how to subscribe to the list?
[15:09]	Benjamin Linden:	or has already subscribed
[15:09]	Argos Dreamscape:	no i dont
[15:09]	Dusan Writer:	i think i'm on it but havent seen anything posted yet
[15:09]	Jacek Antonelli:	https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sl-ux ^_^
[15:10]	Argos Dreamscape:	ty
[15:10]	Argos Dreamscape:	ill do it in a bit
[15:10]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks Jacek
[15:10]	Argos Dreamscape:	im lagging fierce
[15:10]	Benjamin Linden:	another thing I was discussing with the team was creating a user experience page on the public wiki
[15:10]	Dusan Writer:	yay
[15:10]	Benjamin Linden:	where we could have info like the mailing list, office hours, transcripts, links to projects, etc.
[15:10]	Jacek Antonelli:	That's a good idea
[15:11]	Squirrel Wood:	an agenda mayhaps?
[15:11]	Kippie Friedkin:	I like that
[15:11]	Dusan Writer:	which actually brings up a question now that you mention the Wiki - is there some way of understanding the broader road map for UX?
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	yes good idea squirrel
[15:11]	Squirrel Wood:	like http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Bug_triage/Wednesday_Agenda
[15:11]	Grant Linden:	agendas and maybe suggested agendas
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	Dusan, there is a roadmap on the wiki for development work on the client, but I fear it's rather out of date
[15:11]	Benjamin Linden:	we do need a user experience roadmap, and that's something we're working on currently
[15:11]	Dusan Writer:	ya, was kind of scouting around but thanks
[15:12]	Dusan Writer:	wonderful
[15:12]	Benjamin Linden:	it would be great if the user experience page could start to get a little community support and maintenance, such as posting transcripts
[15:12]	Benjamin Linden:	you may have noticed I tend to fall behind on keeping the transcripts up to date :-)
[15:13]	Dunan Wilder:	hi hi :)
[15:13]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:13]	Grant Linden will pitch in and help
[15:13]	Benjamin Linden:	cool, thanks Grant
[15:13]	Echo Seigo will offer moral support :)
[15:13]	Dusan Writer will correct typos
[15:13]	Benjamin Linden:	I would love to start harnessing all the creative energy in the community around improving the UI
[15:13]	Benjamin Linden:	that's why I love Dusan's contest
[15:14]	Benjamin Linden:	Dusan, how has the response been?
[15:14]	Dusan Writer:	hmmmm
[15:14]	Dusan Writer:	well, it's all anecdotal really....i have no clue how many entries we'll get
[15:14]	Dusan Writer:	i have a feeling people are being sort of guarded about it
[15:14]	Kippie Friedkin:	Dusan, what was the deadline for that contest again?
[15:14]	Jacek Antonelli needs to sit down and work on that. Too much stuff keeps popping up :(
[15:15]	Dusan Writer:	but the response has been really positive, have had lots of people say they're looking at it, etc
[15:15]	Dusan Writer:	hmm 29th
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	make sure McCabe Maxstead knows about it
[15:15]	Dusan Writer:	good judges i think, should make some good discussion
[15:15]	Dusan Writer:	will do
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	I'm sure he'll have some ideas :-
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	:-)
[15:15]	Harleen Gretzky:	what contest?
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	how are you planning to run the judging Dusan?
[15:15]	Benjamin Linden:	will it be an in-world discussion?
[15:16]	Dusan Writer:	http://dusanwriter.com/?p=557
[15:16]	Dusan Writer:	depending on how many entries, we'll narrow it down to 10 or so, and then hold an in world discussion
[15:16]	Dusan Writer:	each entrant will be allowed to present their ideas and field questions
[15:16]	Grant Linden:	it would be great to sit in the audience for that
[15:16]	Kippie Friedkin:	nice
[15:17]	Dusan Writer:	Linden's are welcome with open arms Grant :)
[15:17]	Grant Linden needs a "fly on the wall" avie
[15:17]	Dusan Writer:	hahaha
[15:17]	Benjamin Linden:	that's great Dusan
[15:17]	Dusan Writer:	we'll make appropriate disclaimers for you if you like grant
[15:17]	Alwa Voight:	hello everyone
[15:17]	Benjamin Linden:	if you could let Grant know when you schedule it, that'd be great
[15:17]	Jacek Antonelli thinks Dusan forgot to close an tag :D
[15:17]	Grant Linden:	hello Alwa
[15:17]	Dusan Writer:	haha oops
[15:18]	McCabe Maxsted:	ahoy!
[15:18]	Dusan Writer:	ah yeah updated the entry and made a mistake
[15:18]	Dusan Writer goes to close tag
[15:18]	Benjamin Linden:	hi McCabe
[15:18]	Grant Linden:	hello McCabe
[15:18]	McCabe Maxsted:	what're we talking about today?
[15:18]	Dunan Wilder:	i had a little question about the UI, well two really but they're related :p May i ?
[15:18]	Benjamin Linden:	ok well those were the main things I wanted to bring up
[15:18]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hey McCabe :)
[15:19]	Dusan Writer:	you McCabe
[15:19]	Dusan Writer:	haha
[15:19]	Dunan Wilder:	i wanted to know if it was possible to get a shortcut back for the environment editor ? And something else too : how about being able to load automaticly spy presets at startup ? i tried to change the default but it still loads the sim preset and i have to to the changes manually every time i login (which can happen quite often)
[15:19]	Benjamin Linden:	McCabe, I just reminded folks about the user experience mailing list, the possibility of creating a UX page on the wiki, and we briefly discussed Dusan's contest
[15:19]	Benjamin Linden:	which you should enter :-)
[15:19]	Dusan Writer:	yes, i was wondering about the windlight presets good question
[15:20]	Jacek Antonelli:	Dunan, what are "spy presets"? Oh, sky?
[15:20]	McCabe Maxsted:	adding a shortcut yourself: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Skinning_How_To/Edit_the_menu
[15:20]	Benjamin Linden:	Grant or Kippie, did you have specific things you wanted to discuss with the group today?
[15:20]	McCabe Maxsted:	and yes, I plan to!
[15:20]	Dunan Wilder:	sky sorry, i have two left paws ^.~
[15:20]	Grant Linden:	I have some topics about the profile that I would like to offer up for brainstorming
[15:20]	Kippie Friedkin:	Nothing specific from me. The team is busily working on the latest build.
[15:21]	Benjamin Linden:	alright Grant, fire away!
[15:21]	McCabe Maxsted:	if you find a good shortcut let me know and i'll add it to my viewer skin: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Viewer_Skins/Dazzle_MC
[15:21]	Grant Linden:	thanks McCabe
[15:22]	Grant Linden:	so, as the "newbie Linden" I might be asking quesitons that have been asked before
[15:22]	Dunan Wilder:	well the environment editor had ctrl alt E sortcurt for a short period and then it disapeared and never came back
[15:22]	Grant Linden:	but I am looking at the ways that residents already use SL
[15:22]	Dunan Wilder:	shortcut *
[15:22]	Squirrel Wood:	ctrl-alt-e is used for the '80 symbol on german keyboards.
[15:23]	Dunan Wilder:	aah that's why
[15:23]	Squirrel Wood:	so its a no-no shortcut
[15:23]	Alwa Voight:	yup
[15:23]	Jacek Antonelli wonders about Grant's "newbie Linden" questions. "How I wear this box?" "Where I get free L$?"
[15:23]	McCabe Maxsted:	reminds me: need to file a jira for changing the ctrl-n shortcut for beacons. It's just too darn easy to press
[15:24]	Grant Linden:	I was hoping to invite people to talk about the "Picks" tab on the profile
[15:24]	Squirrel Wood:	ctrl-alt-shift-k-e-f9-N ?
[15:24]	Alwa Voight:	I do have a question about UI usability on the Mac
[15:24]	Dusan Writer:	ah picks
[15:24]	Jacek Antonelli:	Let's focus on Grant's topic for a while
[15:24]	McCabe Maxsted:	picks, interesting topic :)
[15:24]	Kippie Friedkin:	Picks....fun
[15:24]	Grant Linden:	what was your quesiton, Alwa?
[15:24]	McCabe Maxsted:	have you browsed a lot of user's picks, grant?
[15:24]	Grant Linden:	I have browsed many
[15:24]	Alwa Voight:	I was on a PC before and flying around with the PAge keys was a lot of fun
[15:25]	Dunan Wilder:	picks ? what about them ?They're fun and i have no problems at all with this tab, looks fine :)
[15:25]	Grant Linden:	and I have noticed that most are not places
[15:25]	Alwa Voight:	on the Mac you cannot do that continuously
[15:25]	Dusan Writer nods
[15:25]	Alwa Voight:	that is, is I am flying around using the regular arrow keys
[15:25]	Dunan Wilder:	yes, that's what i like about it, it's very flexible
[15:25]	Dusan Writer:	it's because people find workarounds for the scarcity of proper social networking tools
[15:25]	Alwa Voight:	I need to lift my finger from those keys
[15:25]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehe mine are funny quotes and friends
[15:25]	Alwa Voight:	then hit the FN key
[15:25]	Grant Linden:	yes, Alwa?
[15:25]	Alwa Voight:	before proceeding
[15:26]	Alwa Voight:	that means I cannot change my flight altitude
[15:26]	Kippie Friedkin:	Dusan..exactly. It's become a mini-social networking tool
[15:26]	Alwa Voight:	without interrupting it
[15:26]	Dusan Writer:	yup....but dont picks also influence search results?
[15:26]	Alwa Voight:	it's quite a drag
[15:26]	Jacek Antonelli:	Alwa: Ah, because Pg Up / Dn are the Fn key + arrows?
[15:26]	Alwa Voight:	yes
[15:26]	McCabe Maxsted:	we've converted the picks into our own little myspace pages
[15:26]	Dunan Wilder:	they do ?
[15:26]	Jacek Antonelli has that on her lappy
[15:26]	Dusan Writer:	so they're being used for places maybe for search, and for people, and as a little personal bookmark list
[15:26]	Kippie Friedkin:	I believe it does affect search.
[15:26]	Kippie Friedkin:	Isn't that way stores and clubs are always asking you to add them to your Picks in return for money?
[15:27]	Dusan Writer:	and the information isn't aggregated at all visibly anyways
[15:27]	Alwa Voight:	but you cannot just hit FN while pressing the arrow keys
[15:27]	McCabe Maxsted:	wasn't that changed? I know searching for a person's name used to bring up quotes of theirs in other people's picks
[15:27]	Grant Linden:	I notice a great deal of cutomization of Pics and very little use of "Interests"
[15:27]	Alwa Voight:	you must lift your fingers off of those keys, therfore interrupting your flight
[15:27]	Jacek Antonelli:	the interests tab is too limited / limiting
[15:27]	Grant Linden:	that is an interesting feature, McCabe
[15:27]	Kippie Friedkin:	I don't think Interests is encompassing enough
[15:27]	Grant Linden:	that one is new to me
[15:27]	Dusan Writer:	interests arent searchable except on an individual's profile
[15:28]	Dunan Wilder:	well interests you can only check some subjects and you have one free line
[15:28]	Alwa Voight:	on the PC you can hold the arrow keys while simultaneously pressing the PageUp or PageDown ones
[15:28]	Grant Linden:	if you could look at a resident's picks and then comment on them, would you want to?
[15:28]	McCabe Maxsted:	it's not very visual either, just a series of checkbox; there's little appeal
[15:28]	Dunan Wilder:	in picks you can put in longer texts and even choose your pic
[15:28]	Alwa Voight:	anyway, I thought that might be of your interest
[15:28]	Grant Linden:	thank you Alwa
[15:28]	Dusan Writer:	yes, or look at places and see what the pick comments are
[15:28]	Dunan Wilder:	exactly
[15:28]	Dusan Writer:	so before i teleport somewhere, see if people have picked that place and see what the comments are
[15:29]	McCabe Maxsted:	so comments tied to a particular place, or comments tied to a particular profile?
[15:29]	Kippie Friedkin:	One thing that came out of the NAV project, was a Resident desire to be able to create a landmark from someone's Picks
[15:29]	Grant Linden:	do you thing that being able to copy a person's pick might be interesting?
[15:29]	Echo Seigo:	how does a person control the comments on his/her/its picks?
[15:29]	Grant Linden:	you could control the comments on your profile
[15:29]	Dunan Wilder:	you just go ahea and write
[15:29]	Dunan Wilder:	ahead *
[15:29]	Grant Linden:	they would not be visible unless you approved them
[15:30]	Dunan Wilder:	aaah i see
[15:30]	Grant Linden:	in that way it might be a social reputation system
[15:30]	Jacek Antonelli imagines having thousands of spam comments on her picks to moderate.... ~_~
[15:30]	Echo Seigo:	exactly lol
[15:30]	Kippie Friedkin:	heh...scary thought
[15:30]	Echo Seigo:	a new place to spam lol
[15:30]	Grant Linden:	that could happen, Jacek
[15:30]	McCabe Maxsted:	I would like that; it'd turn into the rating system again, prolly
[15:30]	Dunan Wilder:	a bit like comments people leave on flickr, that would be very interesting yes
[15:30]	Kippie Friedkin:	Has anyone played around with Plurk?
[15:31]	Grant Linden:	we could limit how many comments you could make in 24 hours
[15:31]	Grant Linden:	what is Plurk?
[15:31]	Echo Seigo:	and since picks seem to be mostly people, it;s be comments on a person in a lot of cases
[15:31]	Kippie Friedkin:	Their Karma ratings are kind of interesting - based on your activity with the tool. I was wondering how that might work with Second Life.
[15:31]	Dunan Wilder:	wouldn't that add some load to the server ? downloading many comments ?
[15:31]	Grant Linden:	ahh
[15:31]	Kippie Friedkin:	Plurk is a new, shinier Twitter.
[15:31]	Grant Linden:	interesting
[15:31]	Kippie Friedkin:	http://www.plurk.com
[15:31]	Dusan Writer doesnt twitter, hears it's addictive
[15:32]	Kippie Friedkin:	Basically another micro-blogging platform.
[15:32]	Kippie Friedkin Twitters too much ;)
[15:32]	Grant Linden:	so, consider if you could drag a "pick" out of your profile
[15:32]	Dunan Wilder:	i don't dare start :p
[15:32]	Echo Seigo:	i posed my first twinter in a month today ;)
[15:32]	Grant Linden:	and rezz it
[15:32]	Jacek Antonelli loves Plurk :D
[15:32]	Dusan Writer:	rezz the pick?
[15:32]	McCabe Maxsted:	I don't think people would like being able to comment on picks; they'd be used too easily for adding somoene's name then bad mouthing them; but profiles would be good
[15:32]	Dunan Wilder:	that would be great !
[15:32]	Kippie Friedkin:	So with Plurk, you get Karma points for different activities. It would be an interesting to think about a karma point system in SL. (Anyway, back to comments in Picks) I digress :)
[15:33]	Echo Seigo:	well I wouldnt want someone commenting on me in someone elses profile
[15:33]	McCabe Maxsted:	that sounds really cool
[15:33]	Grant Linden:	your store could have a Best picks comments"
[15:33]	Grant Linden:	like reviews
[15:33]	Dusan Writer:	yeah
[15:33]	Grant Linden:	and they could be copied
[15:33]	Dusan Writer:	the whole concept of what i talked about last time - some sort of Amazon-type "other people also liked" idea
[15:33]	Grant Linden:	consider a pick that is not a place - like"Torley Vidoes Rock"
[15:33]	Geneko Nemeth:	XD
[15:34]	Dunan Wilder:	this would create a sort of giant landmark web
[15:34]	Dunan Wilder:	sounds good :p
[15:34]	Grant Linden:	and then the system knew that 66600 residents had comiped that pick
[15:34]	Kippie Friedkin:	Very interesting
[15:34]	Kippie Friedkin:	I like that
[15:34]	Grant Linden:	copied that pick
[15:34]	Squirrel Wood:	Do I use picks? not really. Do I use landmarks? Hardly ever :p
[15:34]	Ellla McMahon:	I think there would need to be a no comments allowed options .. I have no wish for anyone to comment on my picks
[15:34]	Grant Linden:	it becomes a review and a meme
[15:34]	Grant Linden:	that is good feedback, Ella
[15:35]	Dusan Writer:	mmmmm memes
[15:35]	Dunan Wilder:	i like to vuiew profiles and visit the places they have put in picks when it looks interesting
[15:35]	McCabe Maxsted:	so you'd have a sort of traffic metric... for things that are basically classifieds....
[15:35]	Grant Linden:	so I pick couls be a new SL feature idea
[15:35]	Echo Seigo:	See I wouldnt want anyone to comment on me in someone elses pick
[15:35]	Grant Linden can't type
[15:35]	Grant Linden:	that is an excellent point, Echo
[15:35]	Kippie Friedkin:	What if you could designate different types of picks
[15:35]	Grant Linden:	I arrived in that space, too :)
[15:36]	Kippie Friedkin:	Shout-out to Friends, Favorite Places, Memorials, Learning...that sort of thing
[15:36]	Grant Linden:	yes, catagorized picks
[15:36]	McCabe Maxsted plots adding a "Grant Linden" pick
[15:36]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:36]	Dunan Wilder:	well perhaps you could just check a box to allow comments and jsut leave it unchecked squirrel :)
[15:36]	Grant Linden:	heh
[15:36]	Kippie Friedkin:	lol
[15:36]	Grant Linden:	so, are comments valuable?
[15:37]	Echo Seigo:	or I put a pick for Jacek's bubbles in my picks.. and a competitor posts comments trashing it...
[15:37]	Echo Seigo:	it would be great, but it could also be abused
[15:37]	Jacek Antonelli:	Optional comments on picks is an interesting idea.... but not (IMO) needed or particularly valuable
[15:37]	McCabe Maxsted:	I'd like to see the profile page completely redone, first
[15:37]	Dunan Wilder:	being able to copy picks would be very nice and the comments, well, the idea is interesting to say the least
[15:37]	Grant Linden:	you could control the coments on your own profile - but others could trash you on thiers
[15:37]	Alwa Voight:	agreed McCabe
[15:37]	Jacek Antonelli:	There are other changes to Picks that would we more useful, and require less infrastructure
[15:38]	Echo Seigo:	I really like the Amazon idea. Of you like Kippie? You might also enjoy Grant!
[15:38]	Grant Linden:	would you like to suggest some, Jacek?
[15:38]	Grant Linden likes small changes too
[15:39]	Jacek Antonelli:	Having the picks be generalized so they're not just places -- be able to attach any item (permissions allowing)
[15:39]	Echo Seigo:	It's be nice to set the location to anywhere, easier
[15:39]	Grant Linden:	nice
[15:39]	Squirrel Wood:	picks.... allow "categories" like "private", "business", "cool places", ..
[15:39]	Alwa Voight:	Echo, that would also be awesome if applied to "places" as well as people
[15:39]	Grant Linden:	very good
[15:39]	Jacek Antonelli:	Or be able to make a pick about a person, and select them from your friends list / people search
[15:39]	Jacek Antonelli:	And then have a "Profile for this person" button
[15:39]	Kippie Friedkin:	Nice.
[15:39]	McCabe Maxsted:	categories would be a great start; so would more picks; I don't like the differentiation between classifieds and picks, either; I'd like to see those combined so I don't have to post something twice in my profile, with an unlimited classified space, and the ability to show one classified on the front of my profile when first viewed
[15:39]	Grant Linden:	all excellent ideas
[15:39]	Echo Seigo:	I like that. like a button similar to see a pertners profile
[15:40]	Grant Linden:	I would love to be able to pick a builder's store out easier
[15:40]	Echo Seigo:	custom skining my profile - so other people see my color scheme :)
[15:40]	Alwa Voight:	how about having an option so that people can know who you are friends with? in esse,ce replicating facebook :)
[15:40]	Jacek Antonelli:	Yeah, categories would be good. And different colored labels
[15:40]	Grant Linden:	that could be powerful!
[15:40]	Jacek Antonelli:	Like how Gmail lets you pick a different background color for the label
[15:41]	Echo Seigo:	profile customization would be awesome
[15:41]	Dunan Wilder:	using different colors for the categories would be a help
[15:41]	Grant Linden:	on Facbook I can set a small statut - what I am doing now - would that be helpful?
[15:41]	Grant Linden:	satus
[15:41]	Echo Seigo:	i'll make my profile like some teenagers myspace!
[15:41]	Grant Linden:	status
[15:41]	Kippie Friedkin:	A status would be very cool.
[15:41]	Echo Seigo:	a status in the friends list might e helpful
[15:41]	McCabe Maxsted:	that would be tying into the social networking thing again: customized profile layouts people could choose from. Skinning would provide that
[15:41]	Squirrel Wood:	status: permanently afk.
[15:42]	Alwa Voight:	yes, status is very NICE thing
[15:42]	Kippie Friedkin:	lol
[15:42]	Dunan Wilder giggles
[15:42]	McCabe Maxsted:	something that shows up on other people's friends list
[15:42]	Alwa Voight:	people can know what you are up to in RL even while offline
[15:42]	Echo Seigo:	I imagine looking at all my friends online, and in a glace seeing whos doing what (if they share)
[15:42]	Alwa Voight:	that is a great idea Grant
[15:42]	Grant Linden:	I was thinking of two kinds of status - one as used in IM that is "this second" and another that is "this week"
[15:42]	Dunan Wilder:	in contacts then this time
[15:42]	McCabe Maxsted:	that could be cool, scrolling through looking at what everyone's doing; it'd be like a twitter in contacts
[15:43]	Alwa Voight:	hmmm..that might be overly complicated Grant
[15:43]	Grant Linden:	true, "too many pixels"
[15:43]	Dunan Wilder:	i'm not sure if many would use that status for anything else than busy or afk / building though
[15:43]	Alwa Voight:	lol, maybe
[15:43]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hrmm. I know people put some big status things in their profile description -- "On vacation from SL until July", etc.
[15:43]	Grant Linden:	well, I can see "rollplaying"
[15:44]	Echo Seigo:	I think seeing if someone is "at a club" or "roleplaying"
[15:44]	McCabe Maxsted:	"slexing, bbl"
[15:44]	Grant Linden:	yes
[15:44]	Dunan Wilder:	yes, very true
[15:44]	Dunan Wilder giggles
[15:44]	Jacek Antonelli:	lol McCabe
[15:44]	Grant Linden:	"with my family"
[15:44]	Echo Seigo:	"naked. go away."
[15:44]	McCabe Maxsted:	haha
[15:44]	Dusan Writer:	if you could group friends better, and have a status like Gmail does something like that?
[15:44]	Dusan Writer:	problem is you can't be busy to just SOME people
[15:44]	Grant Linden:	does Gmail have status?
[15:44]	Kippie Friedkin:	Grouping friends...ooooo...
[15:44]	Dusan Writer:	yeah
[15:44]	Kippie Friedkin:	Gmail has status via Google Talk
[15:44]	Echo Seigo:	i'd like to be able to catagorize my friends list
[15:44]	Dusan Writer:	gchat or whatever it is
[15:44]	Jacek Antonelli:	Gtalk has statuses. Yeah.
[15:44]	McCabe Maxsted:	yeah, you can set customizable statuses
[15:45]	Jacek Antonelli:	"AFK, getting some food"
[15:45]	Alwa Voight:	yes, it does
[15:45]	Dusan Writer:	if you could categorize friends and have toggles, then a global status is less relevant
[15:45]	Grant Linden:	Grouping Friends is in the public Jira now
[15:45]	McCabe Maxsted:	mine is "I'm here, really"
[15:45]	Grant Linden:	(go vote)
[15:45]	Dusan Writer runs, sprints to vote
[15:45]	Grant Linden:	that would be handy, Dusan
[15:45]	McCabe Maxsted:	oh speaking of jiras! http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-7827
[15:45]	Echo Seigo:	flickr stype tagging on peoples profile picks :)
[15:45]	Squirrel Wood:	friends... I would like to see names shown in different colors on my friend list... like, those that have not logged on in six months show up on a red background... to make cleaning up that list easier?
[15:45]	Kippie Friedkin rushes off to vote
[15:45]	Dunan Wilder:	like making conference chat easier ? that would be nice also
[15:46]	Echo Seigo:	i didnt know it was hard now?
[15:46]	McCabe Maxsted:	I wanted to ask you guys what name I should pick for doing profile cuts for boxes, since it's a bitawkward to clal it that; I was thinking "slice"
[15:46]	Grant Linden:	is there anything that is compelling about "Interests?"
[15:46]	McCabe Maxsted:	sorry, off topic
[15:46]	Kippie Friedkin:	Anyone have a link to that PJIRA for grouping friends?
[15:46]	Geneko Nemeth wonders how to tranlsate that "slice"
[15:46]	Grant Linden:	humm
[15:47]	Grant Linden:	the jira was in last weeks transcripts
[15:47]	Jacek Antonelli:	Interests would be more useful if it was just a big block of text that you could put whatever you want in it, hehe
[15:47]	Kippie Friedkin:	okay, cool...I can dig it up :)
[15:47]	Echo Seigo:	http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-890
[15:47]	Jacek Antonelli:	The checkboxes are... meh.
[15:47]	Echo Seigo:	i think
[15:47]	Kippie Friedkin:	I agree. The interest section is very limited now
[15:47]	Geneko Nemeth:	Checkboxes has one good thing,
[15:47]	Alwa Voight:	ya, the checkboxes are too inflexible
[15:47]	Geneko Nemeth:	that is they can be translated.
[15:47]	Dunan Wilder:	well hard no, but if a friend hadn't showed how to do it i wouldn't have guessed how to. Dragging the calling cards in a folder...
[15:47]	Kippie Friedkin:	Thanks, Echo
[15:48]	Squirrel Wood:	interests, yes. not searchable either
[15:48]	McCabe Maxsted:	thanks echo
[15:48]	Kippie Friedkin:	I'd like to be able to search People by interests now that you mention it
[15:48]	Alwa Voight:	me too
[15:48]	Geneko Nemeth:	If someone types in, like, French and I only know Chinese, I won't be able to read it.
[15:48]	Grant Linden:	for skills?
[15:48]	Echo Seigo:	as well as languages
[15:48]	Squirrel Wood:	no way to search for a scripter who seeks to be hored
[15:48]	Squirrel Wood:	hired even
[15:48]	McCabe Maxsted:	that's a really good point squirrel
[15:48]	Kippie Friedkin:	exactly
[15:49]	Dunan Wilder:	oh yes, that would be nice, especially when you want to hire people for certain skills
[15:49]	Grant Linden:	languages seems to need to be checkboxes and free text
[15:49]	Alwa Voight:	yp
[15:49]	Geneko Nemeth:	Maybe listboxes instead of checkboxes.
[15:49]	Geneko Nemeth:	With hundreds of languages out there...
[15:49]	Echo Seigo:	need an "rss" tab, where people see my rss feeds whem tehy look at my profile! :)
[15:49]	McCabe Maxsted:	there's a few outside websites for hiring people like contractors but something inworld that the whole population could use as a resource for stuff like finding scriptors/builders or staff would be great
[15:50]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hrmm. "Seaching for [X] Scripting [X] Wants to be hired... 25,521 results found."
[15:50]	Grant Linden:	what do you use the "web" tab for?
[15:50]	McCabe Maxsted:	haha
[15:50]	McCabe Maxsted:	don't click mine if yo uhave default loading enabled
[15:50]	Kippie Friedkin:	I use it for nothing at the moment
[15:50]	Geneko Nemeth:	My weblog? A personal page of mine?
[15:50]	Jacek Antonelli:	I have my blog
[15:50]	Echo Seigo:	oh hey i have my blog too
[15:50]	Echo Seigo:	i didnt know that!
[15:51]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:51]	Grant Linden:	heh
[15:51]	Alwa Voight:	i am not using it
[15:51]	Jacek Antonelli:	Having the link is kinda useful, but the profile window is so tiny...
[15:51]	Geneko Nemeth:	Poser anim in Blender! Whoa!
[15:51]	Squirrel Wood:	too bad that the rating system has been taken out... it could be of use with skills....
[15:51]	McCabe Maxsted:	somethign I've been wondering: what if we made all profiles part of the web, and could access/edit them outside of SL'99
[15:51]	Grant Linden:	we could populate that with your own SL web page of some kind
[15:51]	Echo Seigo:	and add bling to them!
[15:51]	Echo Seigo:	:)
[15:51]	Grant Linden:	yes, McCabe
[15:51]	McCabe Maxsted:	could have a second life social networking site out of world that ties to in
[15:52]	Kippie Friedkin:	yes!
[15:52]	Jacek Antonelli:	embedding the actual web page in the profile is not so useful. I'd rather just have a button to open up the link in the regular web browser window
[15:52]	Grant Linden:	or links to your avies flirk
[15:52]	Squirrel Wood:	Yes! Profiles need Bling! Pimp My Profile!
[15:52]	Grant Linden:	flikr
[15:52]	Grant Linden:	yes
[15:52]	Echo Seigo:	yes! Primp of Profile :)
[15:52]	Alwa Voight:	I would love to see a snpshot of my webpage on the Web tab
[15:52]	Jacek Antonelli:	That would be cool -- have a list of URLs intead of just the one. And maybe have some presets. Flickr / Twitter / Blog / Email ?
[15:52]	Jacek Antonelli:	MySpace, etc
[15:52]	Kippie Friedkin:	That's a great idea.
[15:53]	Dusan Writer:	i'd like to see 3D avatars in facebook like Spore has :)
[15:53]	Kippie Friedkin:	I use my 1st Life tab for that now
[15:53]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe, Spores pictures are so cool. I love how they embed the creature data right in the PNG! So clever
[15:53]	Dusan Writer nods
[15:53]	Dusan Writer:	we need that here, avatar creation ahead of entering the Grid, but i'm a broken record on that :P
[15:54]	McCabe Maxsted:	and decent avatar creation UIs
[15:54]	Echo Seigo:	I wish my profile had an option to show a rendering of my avatar at that very moment, in motion :)
[15:54]	Dusan Writer nods
[15:54]	Jacek Antonelli:	Borrow Spore's creature creator to make avatars in SL >:D
[15:54]	McCabe Maxsted:	you can't even change the layout from xml, and the presets are so so horrible
[15:54]	Squirrel Wood:	spore? Isn't there an inofficial contest going on atm as to who makes the biggest penis spore creature ?
[15:54]	Jacek Antonelli:	lol Squirrel
[15:54]	Echo Seigo:	lol
[15:54]	Geneko Nemeth:	Sounds like Mabinogi ^_^
[15:54]	Dusan Writer:	see? user engagement!
[15:54]	Grant Linden:	I have another crazy Idea
[15:54]	Bridie Linden is Online
[15:54]	Dusan Writer:	attracts newbies too haha
[15:55]	Grant Linden:	if under your profiel picture there was a button that took your picture
[15:55]	Squirrel Wood:	crazy ideas? file a ticket with me and I'll get back to you with one asap ^^
[15:55]	Grant Linden:	it spun the camera around to face you
[15:55]	Dusan Writer:	uh oh, photo studios wont like you grant
[15:55]	Echo Seigo:	i dont like it.
[15:55]	Grant Linden:	and the photo upload was free
[15:55]	Alwa Voight:	good idea Grant, right now you donwload and you upload/pay 10L$
[15:55]	Dusan Writer nods
[15:55]	Dusan Writer:	good idea
[15:55]	Echo Seigo:	But some people night
[15:55]	Jacek Antonelli:	Free is good... easy for newbies is good....
[15:56]	Echo Seigo:	yup
[15:56]	Char Linden is Online
[15:56]	Jacek Antonelli:	The rest I am not so enthusiastic about, lol
[15:56]	Kippie Friedkin nods
[15:56]	Grant Linden:	most newbies don't understand the whole "turn the camera aound" idea
[15:56]	McCabe Maxsted:	people would like that; people would like that even more if we had better camera presets and controls *coughs and beats a dead horse about it*
[15:56]	Squirrel Wood:	Oh! Oh! With the current UI there is one thing I absolutely dislike - focus your camera anywhere with your avatar still visible. then click your avatar where there is no "touch" event script active and the camera immediately "resets"
[15:56]	Echo Seigo:	I think the best idea i've heard was profile skinning
[15:56]	McCabe Maxsted:	I'd lov eto be able to actually set my camera
[15:56]	McCabe Maxsted:	so that when I move through SL'99 my camera *stays*
[15:57]	Grant Linden:	interesting
[15:57]	Echo Seigo:	yeah, having locked in camera positions
[15:57]	Squirrel Wood:	if you click anywhere in the environment or any attachment part with a touch handler - camera stays.
[15:57]	Jacek Antonelli:	I think it would be okay if it was limited -- it'd take a snapshot of your face/shoulders automatically, and upload it and put it in your profile
[15:57]	Echo Seigo:	like a built in follow cam sort of
[15:57]	McCabe Maxsted:	camera lock: a serious feature we've been missing
[15:57]	Grant Linden:	yes, I am thinking limited
[15:57]	Alwa Voight:	agree Echo, I'd like to see myself from a different perspective while flying
[15:58]	Kippie Friedkin:	LImited head and shoulders is good. The postcard/snapshot method is too clunky now
[15:58]	Echo Seigo:	yeah every other game has that
[15:58]	Geneko Nemeth:	Joystick Flycam is kinda like camera lock if yo udon't move the camera.
[15:58]	McCabe Maxsted:	but how would it tell what's the head and shoulders?
[15:58]	McCabe Maxsted:	I don't think it's doable, considering the variety of avs
[15:58]	Grant Linden:	we are coming to a close, are there any other ideas that need to be brought up to this fine group?
[15:58]	Geneko Nemeth:	But per Alwa, it's a good idea to only lock the angle and still let the camera move with you.
[15:58]	Echo Seigo:	i'd be curious to see what percentabe it woulf work for
[15:58]	Alwa Voight:	that is what i meant Geneko
[15:59]	McCabe Maxsted:	yes; are people posting to the mailing list? because I haven't gotten anything this week
[15:59]	Geneko Nemeth:	That's why I said "per Alwa".
[15:59]	Squirrel Wood:	Give us time till next week to cook up more crazy ideas? ^^
[15:59]	Alwa Voight:	:)
[15:59]	Kippie Friedkin:	The list has been pretty quiet
[15:59]	McCabe Maxsted:	so I was wondering if I should send some ideas out or not I have
[15:59]	Jacek Antonelli:	It probably woludn't work for the really unusual avatars (giant mechs, etc.), but for the majority you'd be able to figure out where the head is based on the avatar skeleton
[15:59]	McCabe Maxsted:	nobody replied to my skinning group question, made me sad
[15:59]	Kippie Friedkin:	I would love to see some of these topics continue on teh list
[15:59]	Dusan Writer:	yeah get the mailing list going!
[16:00]	Geneko Nemeth will have his head cut out from the avatar picture if this gets implemented
[16:00]	Jacek Antonelli:	McCabe: please do send out ideas. We need to get the motor running I think
[16:00]	Dusan Writer:	i just joined i'll try to say something um half relevant
[16:00]	Grant Linden:	good feedback, more use of the mailing list
[16:00]	McCabe Maxsted:	grant: your mission is to post on the list now! I will join you
[16:00]	Jacek Antonelli:	Also, I didn't even know that the mailing list was up until McCabe IMed me asking why no one was replying, lol
[16:00]	Grant Linden:	thanks to everyone for coming!
[16:00]	Dusan Writer:	send the skinning question again maybe :)
[16:00]	Jacek Antonelli:	Thanks for hosting, Grant and Ben!
[16:00]	Dusan Writer:	thanks grant and ben
[16:00]	Squirrel Wood:	Thanks for having us ^^
[16:00]	Alwa Voight:	thanks Grant and Ben
[16:00]	Kippie Friedkin:	Thanks everybody!
[16:00]	Jacek Antonelli:	Dusan, you should start a discussion about your contest :D
[16:00]	Grant Linden:	see you all next week :)
[16:00]	McCabe Maxsted:	take care. Say hi to malbers!
[16:01]	Grant Linden:	I will
[16:01]	Dunan Wilder:	thank you :)}