User:Andrew Linden/Office Hours/2010 09 17

Transcript

[16:00]	Moon Metty:	hi there Andrew :)
[16:00]	Siobhan McCallen:	hey andrew
[16:00]	Andrew Linden:	hello
[16:00]	Latif Khalifa:	hello Andrew
[16:00]	Morgaine Dinova:	Hi Andrew: :-)
[16:01]	Maggie Darwin:	Happy Friday, Andrew. :-)
[16:01]	Andrew Linden:	Simon will be late. He's picking up his car from the shop.
[16:01]	DogWomble Dollinger:	hey val :)
[16:01]	Moon Metty:	did they make his car slower?
[16:01]	Latif Khalifa:	lol
[16:01]	DogWomble Dollinger:	you should get him to upgrade it to a TARDIS
[16:01]	Morgaine Dinova:	Hey Andrew, talk about good things, not restrictions. We've had a rough afternoon in Groupies :-(
[16:01]	DogWomble Dollinger:	would cut down on his travel tim
[16:01]	DogWomble Dollinger:	*tie
[16:01]	Latif Khalifa:	Does his car have trouble region crossing? :P
[16:02]	DogWomble Dollinger:	nah it has trouble because it's more than 32 prims
[16:02]	Andrew Linden:	What was so rough about this afternoon in Groupies? (Is that a region?)
[16:02]	Siobhan McCallen:	it's a yugo
[16:02]	Siobhan McCallen:	yugo this way, yugo that way
[16:02]	Latif Khalifa:	hey don't diss yugo ;)
[16:02]	Maggie Darwin:	AWGroupies group chat
[16:02]	DogWomble Dollinger:	yugo in any direction you want, unless it's the direction you want to go in....
[16:03]	Morgaine Dinova:	Uh oh. Andrew doesn't know about Groupies. Sai has failed us! ;-)
[16:03]	Jonathan Yap:	Andrew, new policy on tpvs not being able to use llkdu.dll
[16:03]	Siobhan McCallen:	i wouldn't know, I'm not in groupies
[16:03]	Jonathan Yap:	Also, tpv developers have to register their name in order for the tpv to be listed
[16:03]	Siobhan McCallen:	i'm a groupie denier
[16:03]	Maggie Darwin:	Saij is too busy formulating tax policy.
[16:03]	Morgaine Dinova:	lol
[16:03]	Andrew Linden:	oh hrm. I thought there was an image library that was being used instead.
[16:03]	Ardy Lay:	Kakadu's product, they define the license, not Linden Lab.
[16:03]	Latif Khalifa:	I think I can invite to groupies too
[16:04]	Andrew Linden:	wow, the kakadu lib was written ten years ago
[16:04]	Maggie Darwin:	Psi has a Kaylee outfit on today. :-)
[16:05]	Morgaine Dinova:	From Firefly?
[16:05]	Ardy Lay:	LL is negotiating with Kakadu for a licence for a current version.
[16:05]	Maggie Darwin:	/me nods. Yeppers.
[16:05]	Andrew Linden:	I'm surprised there is no comparable open source alternative.
[16:05]	Morgaine Dinova:	Hehe
[16:05]	Siobhan McCallen:	well, ain't that cunning?
[16:05]	Morgaine Dinova:	I identified with Kaylee. She was an enginner :-)
[16:05]	Maggie Darwin:	Lets you know how much demand therr is for it.
[16:06]	Andrew Linden:	Ok so I should try to only talk about good news...
[16:06]	Maggie Darwin:	Kaylee was known for being aroused by powerful engines.
[16:06]	Morgaine Dinova:	o/
[16:06]	Andrew Linden:	well, I dunno if I've got much news regardless
[16:06]	Latif Khalifa:	You found a 1 liner fix for lag? :D
[16:06]	DogWomble Dollinger:	andrew, should we start with something positive?
[16:06]	DogWomble Dollinger:	latif, i believe he has
[16:06]	DogWomble Dollinger:	i think it starts with 'kill -9'
[16:06]	DogWomble Dollinger:	:P
[16:06]	Maggie Darwin:	Heck, Andrew, I'm still trying to figureout this new server lifecycle.
[16:06]	Andrew Linden:	I've been working on fixing some anti-griefing code that I inherited from someone. It is supposed to fix one of the remaining simulator crashers.
[16:07]	DogWomble Dollinger:	aaah nice andrew :)
[16:07]	Andrew Linden:	Maggie, I too am trying to figure out this new simulator lifecycle.
[16:07]	Morgaine Dinova:	Oh, that's a good topic. How about you give us a general rundown on Bluesteel, Andrew?
[16:07]	Siobhan McCallen:	keep pedaling
[16:07]	Andrew Linden:	In fact, I've got a chunk of finished code that needs to go out.
[16:07]	Andrew Linden:	If only I could fix this last bug.
[16:08]	Morgaine Dinova:	There is no "last bug" <grin>
[16:08]	Maggie Darwin:	If i understand it, there will be parallel lines of development in separate server channels. But when one is released gridwide, do the others rebuild to pickup the new features?
[16:08]	Moon Metty:	the omega bug O_O
[16:08]	Andrew Linden:	Bluesteel is just a codename for "server-1.42 + some bug fixes" I think.
[16:08]	Ardy Lay:	The three RC channel names are arbitrary. Watch _Zoolander_. They are his pose names.
[16:08]	Andrew Linden:	I don't think I've got any code in it.
[16:09]	Moon Metty:	the release notes of bluesteel just mentions "crashfixes"
[16:09]	Moon Metty:	nothing more
[16:09]	Andrew Linden:	Yeah, I think I heard that too. BlueSteele will be recycled later. Zoolander is another channel that will be updated at alternate times.
[16:09]	Ardy Lay:	Yeah, ten crash modes fixed, hopefully.
[16:09]	Andrew Linden:	But, I'm still trying to figure it out.
[16:09]	Maggie Darwin:	Standard LL release notes...."TBA"
[16:09]	Andrew Linden:	I'll understand it better when I follow some of my own code changes through the system.
[16:09]	Patnad Babii:	ive heard from a linden, that there might be a console mode in the viewer inplemented like in quake, where we could use some kind of power command over sims. got any idea what im talking about?!
[16:09]	Ardy Lay:	Not :released: yet. ;-)
[16:09]	Psi Merlin:	/me catches up with chat and smiles
[16:09]	Morgaine Dinova:	Which channel are your latest fixes in Andrew?
[16:10]	Andrew Linden:	Patnad, that is true. We're calling it the "simconsole" but it will be for internal LL-debugging purposes first.
[16:10]	Jonathan Yap:	I don't think you get a channel release on the grid until it has first been tested and stable on aditi
[16:10]	Morgaine Dinova:	Patnad: yeah, Falcon is implementing "/equip FBG; /load meganuukes"
[16:10]	Patnad Babii:	cool it seem a good way to go i think
[16:10]	Andrew Linden:	Morgaine, my work isn't in any channel yet. I haven't got it that far yet.
[16:10]	Andrew Linden:	But I'm close.
[16:10]	Morgaine Dinova:	kk
[16:11]	DogWomble Dollinger:	meganukes .... sounds like an explosive griefer tool ;P
[16:11]	Morgaine Dinova:	Well Falcon is a griefer at heart :P
[16:11]	Maggie Darwin:	I'd think it would be less work to make it an HTTP/HTML interface, but maybe somebody likes writing console code in C++
[16:11]	Andrew Linden:	it isn't a true shell
[16:11]	Jonathan Yap:	Maggie, the web team is backlogged until Q2 of next year
[16:12]	Andrew Linden:	it will only accept a few custom commands for the time being.
[16:12]	Morgaine Dinova:	Agreed, Maggie. SNOW-375 even supplies the patch for it.
[16:12]
[16:12]	Side Scripting:	REST/HTTP based API -- "thinking outside the box"
[16:12]	Maggie Darwin:	The "web team". Yeah, right.
[16:12]	Maggie Darwin:	Exotic stuff that.
[16:12]	Latif Khalifa:	Maggie, you'll get your wish soon. LL is determined to fix viewer2 UI by replacing floaters with html windows.
[16:12]	Andrew Linden:	but it has a prompt! Command Line FTW!
[16:12]	Latif Khalifa:	Andrew++
[16:12]	DogWomble Dollinger:	real sysadmins don't use GUIS?
[16:12]	Andrew Linden:	Not for sysadmining.
[16:13]	Andrew Linden:	But watching Youtube? Yes.
[16:13]	Youri Ashton:	ello
[16:13]	Patnad Babii:	is there any plan to accept HTML5 in the viewer someday? it seem firefox support it rather well right now
[16:13]	Maggie Darwin:	Real sysadmins can't be trusted to install browsers, you'll end up with IE6.
[16:13]	DogWomble Dollinger:	*giggle* maggi
[16:13]	Andrew Linden:	I haven't heard any plans about HTML5 support.
[16:13]	Morgaine Dinova:	I agree with commandline FTW, but I don't think there's an actual command API behind Falcon's commandline, just some hacked-in calls.
[16:13]	Latif Khalifa:	there are two commadns to begin with ;)
[16:13]	Latif Khalifa:	but it's a start :)
[16:13]	Andrew Linden:	Morgaine is correct. But it looks kinda like a a command line interface.
[16:14]	DogWomble Dollinger:	well what can people expect to see with the initial commandline?
[16:14]	Patnad Babii:	i think it could be pretty neat to have html5 new interactive *stuff* could be made in-world ㋡
[16:14]	Maggie Darwin:	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wRxASytPuQ "Web Server Is Down"
[16:14]	Patnad Babii:	but yea first you guys need to fix v2...
[16:14]	Siobhan McCallen:	sorry I've been so far behind, but what are the chances of someday having standard inputs for accessibility? Dragon Naturally Speaking 11 works *better* with SL, but it still considers it an unsupported input type.
[16:14]	Latif Khalifa:	Falcon mentioned something about setting different options for ground collisions
[16:14]	Andrew Linden:	Hrm... we should add a command for logging yourself out.
[16:14]	reddot99 Republic:	well, its not like we can expect him to open up a command line for havok
[16:14]	Andrew Linden:	It would be a sort of long-winded CTRL+Q
[16:15]	DogWomble Dollinger:	andrew, are you talking about users being able to log themselves out if their avatar gets stuck in world?
[16:15]	Maggie Darwin:	I wouldn;t be pushing LL towards HTML5 anything. They hneed to do some catching up first
[16:15]	Youri Ashton:	heya simon
[16:15]	DogWomble Dollinger:	hi simon
[16:15]	Latif Khalifa:	hey Simon
[16:15]	Moon Metty:	hi Simon :)
[16:15]	Maggie Darwin:	Hey Simon, LTNS
[16:15]	Patnad Babii:	hello Simon ㋡
[16:15]	Andrew Linden:	Oh no DogWomble, that persistent precense inworld has been fixed... just needs to get through the QA and deploy pipeline.
[16:15]	Andrew Linden:	*presence*
[16:15]	DogWomble Dollinger:	aaah nice :)
[16:16]	Simon Linden:	Hello
[16:16]	DogWomble Dollinger:	glad to see that's been fixed, on one of the SIMS i visit i do occasionally come across stuck avatars
[16:16]	Jonathan Yap:	Andrew, is that a server only fix, or will it also take care of "stuck" names signed on to secondlife.com web pages?
[16:16]	Andrew Linden:	Yes, it is server-only.
[16:17]	Andrew Linden:	No, I don't think it will affect secondlife.com web pages.
[16:17]	Maggie Darwin:	if they didn't get stuck in the first place, no unstickification UI is needed.
[16:18]	DogWomble Dollinger:	andrew, on a side note, have there been problems with teleports recently?
[16:18]	Andrew Linden:	I haven't heard about any new problems with teleports yet.
[16:18]	DogWomble Dollinger:	aah cool, i just seemed to have some random problems yesterday
[16:19]	reddot99 Republic:	if you tp during a physlock, havok 7 may logg you out
[16:19]	Maggie Darwin:	He said "new problems".
[16:19]	reddot99 Republic:	instead of sending you home
[16:19]	DogWomble Dollinger:	wondering if something was up, or whether it was just one of those things :)
[16:19]	DogWomble Dollinger:	heh maggie :)
[16:19]	Youri Ashton:	wednesday there were a few minor problems with teleports, but that was just for 5 mins
[16:19]	Youri Ashton:	probably a glitch
[16:19]	Maggie Darwin:	I'm finding the new threading of avatar arrivals to have some interesting side effects on sim crossings
[16:20]	Jonathan Yap:	Andrew, are there going to be new scripting functions to go along with the mesh release?
[16:20]	Simon Linden:	we ran a test yesterday with theaded TPs and region crossings, and the overall stats on failures have looked normal
[16:20]	Andrew Linden:	What sort of intresting side effects Maggie?
[16:20]	reddot99 Republic:	wait, theres a release date for mesh now?
[16:20]	Maggie Darwin:	Used yto be, when you crossed, you rubberbanded into the sim while everybody froze. Then you snapped back to your original position
[16:20]	Youri Ashton:	next update most likely red
[16:20]	Maggie Darwin:	Now, you rubberband as before, while life goes on for the rest of the sim.
[16:21]	Moon Metty:	Simon, i noticed agent-time was very high during the test
[16:21]	Jonathan Yap:	reddot99, the NDA on mesh is lifted, there will be a blog post on it in just under 2 weeks
[16:21]	Maggie Darwin:	But when you snap back, you discover you've been in motion while you were gone, so to speak. You can end up penetrating walls, etc.
[16:21]	Mudslinger Ning:	I bet the walls fel violated from that...
[16:22]	Bronson Blackadder:	I been seeing some pretty high ping times immediatly after teleports
[16:22]	Mudslinger Ning:	*feel
[16:22]	reddot99 Republic:	maggie, that's always been an issue
[16:22]	Youri Ashton:	pretty much all lindens are talking about mesh lately, so you may espect it to come soon
[16:22]	Maggie Darwin:	You don;t snap back to the original point of freezing
[16:22]	Morgaine Dinova:	We've had some good OHs already explaining the ins and outs of meshes. Only some costs/constants remain to be decided.
[16:22]	reddot99 Republic:	we going to have to pay like a hundred lindens or something per mesh?
[16:22]	Bronson Blackadder:	and when I say high ping times Im talking about 30k ping to sim
[16:23]	Maggie Darwin:	Rubberbanding had always been an issiue, true. But the snap back in my experience was back to the point the rubberband started. No longer.
[16:23]	Latif Khalifa:	Maggie, I think I've always been able to cross into buildings through the walls on sim crossings too
[16:24]	reddot99 Republic:	maggie, the snapback has never been reliable, you can disable the 'rubberbanding'by disabling velocity interpolation under network
[16:24]	Maggie Darwin:	Seems worse now. And makes sense given the new threading.
[16:24]	Latif Khalifa:	well the threading has done next to nothing about the sim freezes unfortunatelyl
[16:24]	reddot99 Republic:	though, the sim still flings you to various distances depending on entry velocity
[16:24]	Morgaine Dinova:	I'm very worried about something re meshes. Creating objects in-world cost nothing. Meshes will in effect replace many prims, but the upload is likely to cost L$, and lots of them. This discriminates against builders who are not merchants, or who don't have a large bank balance.
[16:24]	Maggie Darwin:	Hmm. Worth a try I suppose. But this smells serversideish
[16:25]	Simon Linden:	It shouldn't be doing much, it's turned off now
[16:25]	reddot99 Republic:	morgaine, same thing can be said about sculpts
[16:25]	Simon Linden:	We ran a one hour test of it yesterday in the "BlueSteel" channel, but the rest of the grid isn't ready for it
[16:25]	Morgaine Dinova:	Scultps don't have a high prim upload cost associated with them
[16:26]	Youri Ashton:	its indeed discriminating against non-merchants or for that matter people that do not have money to get lindens
[16:26]	Maggie Darwin:	Of course, because I am using the Official Linden Labs Viewer, I no longer have a "Network Tab".
[16:26]	reddot99 Republic:	i'm using snowglobe, so yeah, cant help ya
[16:27]	Jonathan Yap:	I don't think the big issue is going to be mesh upload costs, but the high skill level required to create one in the first place.
[16:27]	Maggie Darwin:	Presumably there's a debug setting...
[16:27]	Andrew Linden:	yeah, we've created uploads and features with few obvious incentives to moderate
[16:27]	reddot99 Republic:	skill level is where the issue comes into play
[16:27]	Andrew Linden:	I think the new upload and prim-costs are from the mesh team trying to put some pressures to moderate content
[16:28]	Andrew Linden:	one of the things we've learned here at LL over the years
[16:28]	Maggie Darwin:	...without having a clear notion of what the actual cost will be like, it's hard to price
[16:28]	Andrew Linden:	is that if you give the Residents enough rope to hang themselves
[16:29]	Youri Ashton:	enough rope to hang on is one thing, taking too much advantage of that is another andrew ;)
[16:29]	Andrew Linden:	some will gladly tie themselves up, and everything else in sight
[16:29]	Latif Khalifa:	there need be incentive to make efficient content
[16:29]	Andrew Linden:	right
[16:30]	Maggie Darwin:	Making a system totally foolproof, and only a fool will use it, of course.
[16:30]	Moon Metty:	and tools to see how efficient a creation is
[16:30]	DogWomble Dollinger:	now that might atually be a good tool moon
[16:30]	reddot99 Republic:	cause uploads to fail if too manypoints in the same spot? or holes in the mesh?
[16:31]	Maggie Darwin:	Too often, that "too much rope" is also inadvertantly coated with superglue.
[16:31]	Andrew Linden:	I believe some such tools will be part of the mesh project
[16:31]	Moon Metty:	yes
[16:31]	Moon Metty:	i was also thinking about seeing script time in the script editor, for example
[16:31]	Maggie Darwin:	Ah, yes, tools. Like the script memory tools. :-)
[16:32]	Andrew Linden:	forcast script time? or real script time, when it is actually running?
[16:32]	DogWomble Dollinger:	moon, would it be worth putting this together as a JIRA?
[16:32]	DogWomble Dollinger:	andrew, either/or
[16:32]	Moon Metty:	a real time average, while it's running
[16:32]	Jonathan Yap:	Being able to see script time brings us back to the simconsole subject
[16:32]	Maggie Darwin:	"Tool' may be code for "feature somebody else will write"
[16:32]	DogWomble Dollinger:	i'm seeing the benefits here in that if this information is visible to creators, it might actually encourage them to be more efficient with their builds
[16:33]	DogWomble Dollinger:	at least where there is room for that sort of movement
[16:33]	Andrew Linden:	yes, content creators definitely need the feedback on costs
[16:33]	Andrew Linden:	there has been a call for such feedback indicators within LL
[16:33]	Jonathan Yap:	Who was it that was saying ARC is going to get a new/adjusted formula?
[16:34]	Maggie Darwin:	Emerald.
[16:34]	Latif Khalifa:	Nyx said that
[16:34]	Moon Metty:	or another example, the viewer-rendered encroachment walls, to let builders see what they are actually doing
[16:34]	Simon Linden:	There are a lot of different variables involved ... the viewer devs, for example, care about the number of triangles and textures to draw, while on the simulator the physics shape and scripts matter
[16:35]	Simon Linden:	Then there is behavior ... something that changes size or shape is more costly than a static object
[16:35]	Maggie Darwin:	Andrew, do you think having separate "viewer" and "sim" teams impedes communication?
[16:35]	Andrew Linden:	hrm...
[16:35]	Latif Khalifa:	I think they have several teams for each
[16:36]	Maggie Darwin:	Yeah, but still partitioned
[16:36]	Andrew Linden:	actually, our team (Engine Room) may be doing viewer work
[16:36]	Andrew Linden:	our focus right now is to improve performance
[16:36]	Moon Metty:	yes
[16:36]	Simon Linden:	Maggie - sometimes it does. The recent issues with the map being zoomed out and causing lag were a case of one side not understanding how the other system works
[16:36]	Andrew Linden:	and if some viewer work is necessary for that then we'll do it
[16:36]	DogWomble Dollinger:	well, the sort of statisics myself and moon were talking about might actually hove some relevance there
[16:37]	Maggie Darwin:	Yeah, that was a 35,000 foot question. Not tactical but strategic.
[16:37]	Andrew Linden:	Other teams... if they need server work done they can do it themselves.
[16:37]	Moon Metty:	alright Simon
[16:37]	Andrew Linden:	That said, teams can request help from others. We've had a few requests.
[16:37]	DogWomble Dollinger:	better visibility of these stats == (hopefully) more efficient builds == (hopefully) less lag caused by bad builds
[16:38]	Simon Linden:	The trends now are to break down those barriers ... our simulator team has been thinking about some of the viewer side changes we can make. Movement predictoin during region crossings is high on our list
[16:38]	Maggie Darwin:	That's a good thing, if it can be done without causing too much chaos otherwise.
[16:38]	Simon Linden:	... we might as well expect a delay of a few hundred ms and predict motion accordingly. That would help the rubber banding a bit
[16:38]	Patnad Babii:	is this will be worked out by the snowstorm team?
[16:39]	Andrew Linden:	Probably not Patnad. Engine Room would submit some build changes to SnowStorm.
[16:39]	Simon Linden:	Not sure yet ... I'm in a meeting next week to brainstorm ideas with some of the viewer devs
[16:39]	Patnad Babii:	thats great it should be part of their very next sprint
[16:39]	Maggie Darwin:	Oooooh! A snowstorm brainstorm.
[16:40]	Simon Linden:	Project Snowbrain!
[16:40]	Latif Khalifa:	well the mesh viewer alrady uses havok libs...
[16:40]	Patnad Babii:	i mean rubber banding has been there forever and it would help alot for the development of vehicules / road and stuff
[16:40]	Siobhan McCallen:	project brainfreeze!
[16:40]	Maggie Darwin:	"aka 'Hey, this viewer is flakey!'"
[16:41]	Mudslinger Ning:	hope our minds don't get a brain-freeze like you get with slushie drinks
[16:41]	Simon Linden:	Absolutlely Patnad - the viewer is pretty simple with it's prediction. It just calculates velocity and time to put you into the next position.
[16:41]	Youri Ashton:	yach get dressed please
[16:41]	Maggie Darwin:	Oh boy! A naked penisless noob!
[16:41]	Youri Ashton:	oh, griefer
[16:41]	Youri Ashton:	lol
[16:41]	Youri Ashton:	fast response :p
[16:41]	Simon Linden:	I can think of three things to do better:
[16:42]	Simon Linden:	a) Don't continue motion if it stops getting updates, so you don't sail off into mountains or the edge of the world
[16:42]	Simon Linden:	b) Expect a short delay during the region crossing
[16:42]	Latif Khalifa:	"if i don't hear from the sim in 1s stop" would solve a lot
[16:43]	Simon Linden:	c) When it does the rubber banding, don't snap back exactly to the new place. You're likely moving forward and will be going closer to the current viewer location anyway
[16:43]	Moon Metty:	yes
[16:43]	Maggie Darwin:	More complex would be to decrease the velocity N% everytime a watchdog expires.
[16:43]	Moon Metty:	that would make the rubberbanding more smooth
[16:43]	Jonathan Yap:	If you are going to do c) I think you'd also want to be doing a)
[16:44]	Simon Linden:	Right Maggie, tapering off speed when there are no updates makes sense and would be a lot smoother
[16:44]	Moon Metty:	i guess that would make it less uncomfortable
[16:44]	Morgaine Dinova:	Would be good for Engine Room devs to look at the viewer. Stuff like failed region crossings landing you at 0,0,0, or even at negative altitude, just shouldn't happen. Worst case you should just stay where you are and fail to cross.
[16:44]	Maggie Darwin:	Eventually to go to zero when wedged.
[16:45]	Moon Metty:	would it be possible to estimate the crossing-time in advance?
[16:46]	Latif Khalifa:	Yes the experience could be much improved with smarter viewer. But still, the issue of sim freezing for umpteen seconds at the time every time it has been up for a couple of days should be the highest priority for the server team if you ask me.
[16:46]	Andrew Linden:	brb...
[16:46]	Latif Khalifa:	It's getting impossible to use SL in popular sims
[16:46]	Moon Metty:	the freezes yeah
[16:47]	DogWomble Dollinger:	aprdon my possible ignorance, but has the reason for that been established yet?
[16:47]	Latif Khalifa:	DogWomble, not really
[16:47]	Patnad Babii:	have you heard about the testing Intel has been doing on Opensim, they were able to fit 1000+ avatar inside a sim using their super servers ehe
[16:47]	Maggie Darwin:	I have that lag histogram gadget and have been seeing an interesting sawtoooth patterm develop in what otherwise is a sim under stable load. I suppose it's *possible* some scripted objects are doing it... but it's odd.
[16:48]	Jonathan Yap:	I thought the fix was going to require an updated Mono plus some things Babbage was working on?
[16:48]	Patnad Babii:	i wonder if their code could be of any help to LL..
[16:48]	Bronson Blackadder:	all wearing the same clothing textures
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[16:48]	DogWomble Dollinger:	would it be useful to try some testing with a bunch of avatars jumping into a sim at the same time and running some performance tests?
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[16:48]	salt Mirror:	ⒷⒾⓉⒸⒽ  !
[16:48]	salt Mirror:	ⒷⒾⓉⒸⒽ  !
[16:48]	Mudslinger Ning:	but what's the magnitude of bandwidth to host them 1000 avvies?
[16:48]	Andrew Linden:	back
[16:48]	Moon Metty:	hmmm, cloudy day :)
[16:49]	Youri Ashton:	i wonder why griefers even bother trying...
[16:49]	DogWomble Dollinger:	:P
[16:49]	Latif Khalifa:	Jon, I doubt it's mono issue only. There is some resource leak that causes sims to slowdown to crawls over time. And nobody at LL seems to know why
[16:49]	Siobhan McCallen:	kind of like trying to rob a gun shop in broad daylight
[16:49]	Youri Ashton:	so much efford for that 1 second fame
[16:49]	Mudslinger Ning:	greifers love to f*** around - they crave an audience even for a few seconds of fame
[16:50]	DogWomble Dollinger:	well, i've had an idea re the SI teleport performance thing if you guys want to give it a try
[16:50]	Youri Ashton:	hello myla :)
[16:50]	Myla Aie:	oi
[16:50]	Simon Linden:	Guess I'll go see what it's like to file an AR :)
[16:50]	Youri Ashton:	welcome to SL
[16:50]	DogWomble Dollinger:	LOL
[16:50]	DogWomble Dollinger:	Simon LOL
[16:50]	Moon Metty:	hehe
[16:50]	Youri Ashton:	lol simon
[16:50]	Maggie Darwin:	What it's like? You fill out a form, and then you get an email.
[16:51]	Youri Ashton:	looking around a bit myla?
[16:51]	Maggie Darwin:	That's it. Nothing else happens.
[16:51]	DogWomble Dollinger:	but if it would help establish why it happens, we could put a performance monitor on a SIM and all teleport across at the same tie
[16:51]	DogWomble Dollinger:	that way we can try and get an idea of why it happen
[16:51]	Mudslinger Ning:	you get a warm fuzzy feeling that someone cares?
[16:51]	Morgaine Dinova:	Simon: don't bother sending in a support request, they'll ignore what you write and send you the newbie FAQ instead :-(
[16:52]	Myla Aie:	sou brasileira
[16:52]	Myla Aie:	algum brasileiro aqui?
[16:52]	Latif Khalifa:	I wonder how come LL hasn't really managed to figure out what's going on with the freezes, after more than a year of them being the major sim problem we have.
[16:52]	Jonathan Yap:	DogWomble, Oskar & crew were doing some stress tests on aditi yesterday and 2 weeks ago along those lines
[16:52]	Youri Ashton:	sorry myla, only English here
[16:52]	Myla Aie:	=(
[16:52]	Patnad Babii:	what if there were some sort of script throtelling when you rez in a new sim, it could load the script you were from a queue... very slowly so it shouldnt too much the performance of sims.. i heard it more quick to telelport naked
[16:52]	Myla Aie:	;)
[16:52]	DogWomble Dollinger:	aah cool jonathan
[16:53]	Andrew Linden:	I was working on one form of freeze problem today.
[16:53]	Andrew Linden:	I know quite a bit about that one, but am still working on the correct fix.
[16:53]	Maggie Darwin:	Eu não acho que há Brazinians aqui.
[16:53]	Siobhan McCallen:	só falantes de Inglês, sorry
[16:53]	Youri Ashton:	think ill be off to bed, tomorrow a busy day. tnx for the OH andrew and simon
[16:53]	Youri Ashton:	bye bye all
[16:53]	Myla Aie:	ok
[16:53]	Andrew Linden:	see you later Youri
[16:53]	Moon Metty:	bye Youri
[16:53]	Patnad Babii:	have a good night Youri
[16:53]	DogWomble Dollinger:	BYE! Fluffy Buns!!!
[16:53]	DogWomble Dollinger:	youri
[16:54]	Morgaine Dinova:	Cya Youri :-)
[16:54]	Youri Ashton:	tnx :p
[16:54]	Myla Aie:	bye
[16:54]	Simon Linden:	tc
[16:54]	Maggie Darwin:	laterz
[16:54]	Youri Ashton:	ill be posting pictures of tomorrow on ym flckr page tomorrow, steamtrain will be riding the whole weekend :p
[16:54]	Andrew Linden:	I'm using the Linux viewer today and I haven't crashed out yet.
[16:54]	Latif Khalifa:	Andrew, why not take a look at what's happeing in the busy sims, where after 3 days of uptime you get periods where sim doesn't say a peep for 30-60sec at the time
[16:54]	Mudslinger Ning:	M/YAYM/
[16:54]	Mudslinger Ning:	o/ for linux
[16:55]	Andrew Linden:	we've got some work in the pipeline that will help figure that stuff out
[16:55]	Morgaine Dinova:	I'm on Imprudence on Linux, and it simply never crashes. And I go to SL live music concerts with packed sims too.
[16:55]	Mudslinger Ning:	I been on linux since viewer2 launched - not had much problems since in comparisons to my windows counterparts
[16:55]	Andrew Linden:	unfortunately atm my time is best spent trying to get finished work delivered
[16:55]	Latif Khalifa:	heh, it's been 1.5 years since there will be some work done
[16:56]	Andrew Linden:	yeah. and 6 years for other work. sigh...
[16:56]	Latif Khalifa:	I think you underestimate how crippling this particular problem is
[16:57]	Siobhan McCallen:	svc-22?
[16:57]
[16:57]	Siobhan McCallen:	just mentioning it for nostalgia
[16:57]	Ardy Lay:	Vehicles crossing region borders aren't always treated as vehicles and can get incorrectly returned if the destination parcel is no-entry or parcel-full
[16:57]	Morgaine Dinova:	Oh and I never log out either, it stays up permenent until the end of the week when the new Imprudence comes out. So stability is exceptional.
[16:58]	Jonathan Yap:	Latif, note comment at 3:49 (you were there, too) http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Babbage_Linden/Office_Hours/2010_06_16
[16:58]	Morgaine Dinova:	Hiya lone
[16:59]	Andrew Linden:	I've got to head out right at 17:00 today. I've got to get on the road to visit someone.
[16:59]	Latif Khalifa:	take care and have fun Andrew
[16:59]	Morgaine Dinova:	Cya Andrew, have fun :-)
[16:59]	Maggie Darwin:	Have a good trip!
[16:59]	Patnad Babii:	enjoy your weekend Andrew ㋡
[16:59]	lonetorus Habilis:	a bit late :/
[16:59]	Jonathan Yap:	Thank you Andrew and Simon
[16:59]	Moon Metty:	have a nice weekend Andrew
[16:59]	Siobhan McCallen:	I think so
[16:59]	Simon Linden:	Thanks everyone for coming ... see you next time
[16:59]	lonetorus Habilis:	but take care andrew, simon
[16:59]	DogWomble Dollinger:	catch you round andrew and simon
[16:59]	Andrew Linden:	See you all later, and have a good weekend.
[16:59]	Siobhan McCallen:	later simon!
[16:59]	Moon Metty:	thanks Simon :)
[17:00]	Siobhan McCallen:	see you, andrew

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