Open Development User Group/Archive/2011-02-14

From Second Life Wiki
Jump to navigation Jump to search
07:01  Oz Linden  So ... we have a few items on our agenda today ....
07:02  Jonathan
  Oz Linden  # Open Development Jira Project Workflow
    I just wanted to comment briefly on this and see if there is any discussion....
07:03    I'm using the same workflow that we use in the STORM project, except that contributors can create issues
    so the flowchart on the Snowstorm documentation applies
07:04    whether or not we'll change that depends on how well it works
  Jonathan  It might be nice to be able to close issues
  Oz Linden  If we take an item as a STORM work item, it will be moved there (because that makes the sprint tracking better)
07:05    The Reporter should be able to close an issue
    or the Assignee
  Lestat Demain  wont that result in false closures?
07:06  Oz Linden  If someone would like to take up an issue here, that's ok... most of you should, I think, be able to Assign an issue to yourself and Start Progress on it
  Lestat Demain  as in they think they got the bug when its in an entirely different section?
  Oz Linden  Lestat... if it does, we can re-open them, but I don't expect much of that
    This project will have a smaller and more committed user base than most
07:08    so... that's pretty much what I had to say on that... if something is not working the way you think it should, let me know
  Wolfpup  that is true as it concernd building in an open source environment
  Oz Linden  Status of VWR-24487
  Office Orb

VWR-24487 llurlentry_stub.cpp:196: error: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'

07:09  Oz Linden  The "right" answer to this one is that we need to put in place a process for updating the message template file and its conversion script so that it matches the one in the released simulator code
    the whole point of that file is compatibility between the two
07:10    at the moment, there's only one minor difference
  Lestat Demain  ive noticed a small problem with that in vc2010...something to do with utf code
  Jonathan  Did you manually push out a new version yet?
  Oz Linden  not yet...
  Jonathan  Let me know if/when you do; it is going to be listed as an impediment in my report today
07:11  Oz Linden  We actually need to apply the fix for the converter to the simulator tree so that it is compatible with newer compilers, then clone both back to the viewer
    To clear the impediment, I'm going to temporarily check in the fix on the issue, but not close the issue
07:12    until we've also solved the simulator compatibility issue
  Jonathan  oh, sorry, I think we might be talking about 2 diferent things; is this about the packet protocol file?
  Oz Linden  which I expect to do by the beginning of next week, after we've done the VS 2010 hackathon (more on that at the end of our agenda... forgot to add it)
07:13    well, it's the packet protocol file and the c++ file generated from it
  Jonathan  message_template.msg
  Oz Linden  I'm just going to fix the generated file for now, the template and process next week
07:14    Autobuild merge to viewer-development
07:15  Wolfpup  Oz i would not sugest doing a merg till Merov gets open-4 fixed
  Office Orb

OPEN-4 As an Open Source Developer, I would like to use Fmod in the autobuild system if i have the needed files already

  Oz Linden  The new configuration in my viewer-autobuildvs8 repo is ok... open-1
  Office Orb

OPEN-1 autobuild does not support use with Visual Studio Express

  Jonathan  I would think about getting open-30 fixed too
  Office Orb


  Oz Linden  so I'm going to merge that to the main viewer-autobuild repo
07:16    I had not seen that yet... let's leave it for a bit and come back to it
    on open-4
07:17    Merov should be able to start on that today, since I'm taking over the Merge Monkey chores
  Wolfpup  my autobuild viewer has no sound at all
  Jonathan  Wolfpup, I just dropped fmod into the right places
  Oz Linden  I think it will be pretty quick
    But I agree - fixing it is a blocker for the merge of autobuild into viewer-development
  Jonathan  not a showstopped, but it should be handled in an automated way
07:18  Oz Linden  dropping it in by hand is not good enough... I want a packaged automated solution
  Wolfpup  i tried that and edited the xml to forsce -DFMOD=TRUE and it also Forced -DPRIVATEBUILD=TRUE and failed to even configure
  Oz Linden  this business of having dozens of manual finicky steps to be able to build is bogus, and we're just going to fix it
07:19  Lestat Demain  oh good to hear...can we also phase out boost as well?
  Jonathan  The other drop-in issue (msvc* on Express) is handled by a switch; I think it will be easier to automate in vs2010
  Oz Linden  I don't think so... we use it for several things, but the new packaging makes it pretty easy (or should)
07:20  Wolfpup  Oz with Nicky's help via irc i got autobuild to finaly work and give the output like he is getting but i think i may have intrduced another bug
  Siana Gearz  lestat, if it was a joke it wasn't funny -.-
  Oz Linden  did you put the analysis into the issue?
    forgets which one that was...
  Lestat Demain  u kidding? from what i hear boost is the biggest problem there is
07:21  Siana Gearz  lestat, it's the biggest help there is too.
  Wolfpup  Nicky is running a full autobuild as we speak
    the bug is a python error in llsdmesage test
07:22    one of the things nicky had me do was switch the type of pythion im useing
07:23  Oz Linden  Ok... this afternoon, I'm going to draft a new environment setup page for Windows building with autobuild
  Wolfpup  if there are any merges to virewer development tonight ill know if it is on the autobuild system or my python in the morning
  Oz Linden  I'll need you all to help me debug it
07:24  Wolfpup  Oz one thing you will ned is some Vista/7 specific configuration setting for the cmd window
  Oz Linden  make sure it is in the jira, and I'll collect it from there
  Wolfpup  ill get the graphics for those
  Oz Linden  great
  Wolfpup  ok ill put them in open-4
07:25    along with what has to be set and how
  Oz Linden  I'd like to do some OPEN issue triage, but first I want to talk a bit about the hackathon for VS 2010
  Wolfpup  what days are that?
  Oz Linden  I'll post something more detailed on the list later this week...
    The big days are Thursday and Friday this week
07:26  Wolfpup  might be able to help on thursday but friday i work RL
07:27  Oz Linden  Lots of Lindens will wall themselves into a room or two in Battery, disconnect from distractions, and try to upgrade everything we build so that it 1) builds in VS 2010, and 2) builds on TeamCity
    I'm not going to be in the room, because I'll be in Cambridge (aka "Boston")
  Jonathan  so it is a work meeting, not a planning session
07:28  Oz Linden  but we'll have a sattelite room there
    absolutely Jonathan
  Jonathan  and they can't leave on friday night until it is all done? :)
  Wolfpup  so how would an os dev get in on this?
07:29  Oz Linden  There will be a big spreadsheet that tracks who is doing what and what works
  Jonathan  will someone be testing 2010 Express builds?
  Oz Linden  I'm going to make a public version of that, and will keep the two in sync
07:30    nice leading question, Jonathan - yes, and it's you
  Jonathan  hmmm, where do I get my plane ticket?
  Oz Linden  that is, the open developers will have to be the ones figuring out whether or not we have broken things for you
    same place I'll get mine
07:31  Jonathan  will we be testing in real-time or after the friday session is over?
  Oz Linden  all the open components will be worked on in open repos... which will all have been created by then
    it would clearly be better if it was happening in real time
  Jonathan  Will there be a list of software requirements? Obviously vs2010 Express + corresponding vcredist file
07:32  Wolfpup  Oz Nicky just finished a run but i do not thing he ran it righ as he did not get the error i get
  Oz Linden  well, that's the sort of details that we need to make sure we have worked out before Thursday
07:33    so... as I said, I'm going to write something up for the list, probably tomorrow morning (today is filling up fast)
    and we'll see how much we can do in parallel
07:34    hopefully, not too much will be badly broken by this, but if it is we'll get it fixed ASAP together
  Wolfpup  Oz one thing i can tel you is that they will have to make a system that adds the need configuration to the project for the exe, lib and includes paths that are normaly se in the options for VS2010
  Oz Linden  before then (the plan is today), viewer-development will be branched to viewer-beta, so that none of this will disrupt the 2.6 beta cycle (v-d will become 2.7)
07:35    don't tell me anything here... put it in the appropriate jira issue
  Jonathan  Will the hack-a-thoners be using autobuild?
07:36  Oz Linden  yes
    Every component will be built with autobuild, so getting that configuration done will also be a goal
07:37    (many are already done with current tools)
07:38    So... get psyched up....
  Jonathan  Does advance testing need to be done with vs2010 express + autobuild? Will that xml file needs additions?
  Oz Linden  I _hope_ that we will have merged that into viewer-development before Thursday
07:39  Lestat Demain  so your going with express and not standard vs2010? need to know so i dont install wrong 1 and run into unforseen probs
  Jonathan  I thought there were issues with 2010 express -- no msbuild.exe or something
  Oz Linden  LIndens use the Pro version, and that's what TeamCity does
  Wolfpup  merov are you going to get open-2 merged into the autobuild system today?
  Office Orb

OPEN-2 autobuild configure does not show any progress messages

07:40  Wolfpup  soryy ment OZ
  Jonathan  there has to be some way to tell autobuild which compiler to use, right?
  Oz Linden  Right now, the only way is to create a new configuration in autobuild.xml, which is not very satisfactory
  Wolfpup  Jonathan that is done when you configure your auto build window
07:41  Oz Linden  but is good enough to unblock merging into v-d
    Ideally, I'd like autobuild to have an abstraction for that and auto-detect which to use
    but we may have to develop that in the community because Lindens don't need it
07:42  Wolfpup  IE... %%comspec%% /k ""c:\Program Files\Microsoft Visual Studio X\VC\vcvarsall.bat"" x86 where X is the version of VS you are useing (8,9,10)
  Oz Linden  Wolfpup... _NOT_HERE_
07:43    Let's look at the OPEN issues ...
  Wolfpup  sorry Oz, Jonathan was asking how autobuild would know which compiler to use
07:44  Jonathan  not know which one to use, but to specify which one to use--that is an important distinction
  Oz Linden  (besides, I'm told that is not the right answer, Wolfpup, and I'm not going to break my own rule by going into it here)
07:45  Jonathan
  Office Orb  OPEN-30 LL_RELEASE_FOR_DOWNLOAD is not set to TRUE
  Oz Linden  Jonathan... I'm going to pick on you a bit... that is a _terrible_ issue summary
  Ima Mechanique  I need to relog. brb
  Oz Linden  it does not describe the user visible problem
07:46  Jonathan  good point
    That's what happens when I am rushing
  Oz Linden  there's no way someone reading the list would recognize that this is in any way related to debug console windows
    don't rush
    taking time to write good problem reports is Important
  Jonathan  I will amend it
  Oz Linden  and Jonathan is by no means the only or the worst offender in this regard
07:47    Issue summaries and Descriptions are about the problem - the symptoms, not the cures
  Jonathan  Constructive criticism is appreciated
07:48  Cummere Mayo  you mean on the jira or?
  Oz Linden
    Read it
    Then go back and read it again
07:49    Really .... I mean it.
07:50    and that applies even more to developers ... if we can't write exemplary bug reports, how do we expect users to give us decent ones?
    I have been for years and fully intend to continue being a pain about this
07:51    anyway... enough berating... back to the issue
07:52  Jonathan  I don't autobuild to see how to fix this
  Oz Linden  I don't see why this rates as Severe
    does it prevent the viewer from running, or damage data?
07:53  Jonathan  Someone testing a viewer compiled this way will not be testing a viewer a user will be running
  Oz Linden  ugly is not Severe, nor is inconvenient
    It is not a goal to be able to create a Release viewer with Express
  Jonathan  downgrade to major or minor?
07:54  Oz Linden  (and when I get a TeamCity instance up that you can use, you'll have access to Pro)
    at most Major, I think, probably Minor
  Jonathan  done
07:55  Oz Linden  also, please specify what sort of variable LL_RELEASE_FOR_DOWNLOAD is... autobuild, cmake, compiler define, gobal C++ variable... what?
    (there, not here)
07:56    What do people think about OPEN-11 ?
  Office Orb

OPEN-11 Change STANDALONE to something better.

  Oz Linden  that exists for open devs, so if you all agree it should be changed and on what it should be changed to and will do that work, we can certainly change it
07:57  Ima Mechanique  yes to change, to what, no idea
  Cummere Mayo  reads the issue fast
  Wolfpup  maybe NonDL ?
  Jonathan  notes that this summary could also be slightly clearer
07:58  Oz Linden  Well, that's the sort of thing that I think should be thrashed out on the list, but unless a discussion takes place there within a week and appears to be making progress, I will close it
    I'm going to try to keep the open issues list in OPEN manageable....
  Cummere Mayo  err yeah um as a non dev it gets confusing to us what is meant when people say standalone viewer ... just fyi
  Oz Linden  yes, I can imaging, Cummere
  Wolfpup  Honestly StandAlone seems right for that as that is how the viewer is being build
07:59  Oz Linden  it confused me... conceptually I agree it's a problem
    let's take that to the list
  Office Orb

OPEN-6 Add support to autobuild for local archives as dependencies and as targets

    Your timer has expired!
08:00  Oz Linden  I've been told that in fact dependencies already work... you can specify a file: url, that fact just isn't documented
  Wolfpup  that one would help with things like fmod by creating a storage system for all localy build 3p libs
  Oz Linden  so I'm going to fix that, and we may not need the support for targets (and that may work too), so I expect to close this very soon
    yes, exactly
08:01  Jonathan  Will you send an email to the os list when you have done a push to autobuild?
  Oz Linden  The only bother will be that you'll have to modify the autobuild configuration (the recommended way to do that is going to be to copy it so that you don't risk checking in a local reference accidentally)
08:02    yes - should be doing that today
    waiting on 2 more reviews, but I"m going to pester people
  Office Orb

OPEN-5 Viewer build fails on Linux due to parallel test execution

08:03  Oz Linden  This only happens if you have a multi-core system, and it timing sensitive.
  Wolfpup  there should be a way to have the autobuild system check to see if it is in a LL ie TC or OS build env and then work according ly
08:04  Oz Linden  I prefer solutions that just detect the technology issue that's relevant, not arbitrary things like "I am in LL".
    it happens that our build servers have lots of cores, so this happens there often
08:05    but that doesn't mean we should detect that it's on our build server
  Wolfpup  sorry on that i was trying to be more general
  Jonathan  Oz, will you have time to post the chat log ina timely fashion so people not here can see what was said about the hackathon and have some time to prepare?
  Ima Mechanique  plus what happens to OS dev with multi cores?
  Oz Linden  no need to apologize
  Jonathan  I could try to do it if you are booked
  Oz Linden  yes... in fact, I've semi-automated chat log formatting now....
  Wolfpup  i was just meaning check arch, os and wheither private or publick build system
  Oz Linden  the only step I can't do from the command line is to actually post it to the wiki
08:07    My Orb here even emails me the command line ! :-)
    Speaking of which ... we're over time... we'll pick up on the list and on Wednesday
08:08    Thanks for a useful session
  Jonathan  good meeting
  Cummere Mayo  oz quick question?
    about jira
  Dil Spitz  Thank You and preserve You power of fun! :)