Simulator User Group/Transcripts/2014.01.28

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List of Speakers

Adamburp Adamczyk Duckie Dickins Ima Mechanique
Jenna Felton Jonathan Yap Kallista Destiny
Kelly Linden Lexbot Sinister Lucia Nightfire
Mona Eberhardt Nalates Urriah Qie Niangao
Rex Cronon Skills Hak Tankmaster Finesmith
Whirly Fizzle Yuzuru Jewell Zozo Raven


[12:00] Yuzuru Jewell: Hello, Jenna.

[12:00] Yuzuru Jewell: Hello, Inara.

[12:01] Mona Eberhardt: Hi Kelly.

[12:01] Qie Niangao: Hi, Kelly.

[12:01] Yuzuru Jewell: Hello, Kelly.

[12:01] Kelly Linden: Hello, hello.

[12:01] Whirly Fizzle: Heya Kelly

[12:01] Adamburp Adamczyk: hello

[12:01] Kelly Linden: Simon is going to miss the meeting today.

[12:01] Kelly Linden: So, welcome. :)

[12:02] Jenna Felton: hello Kellie

[12:02] Mona Eberhardt: Tell him we said thanks for fixing the feed snapshot upload facility.

[12:02] Kelly Linden: Mona: I'll pass that on.

[12:02] Qie Niangao: Hope Simon is doing something more fun. *Even* more fun, that is. :p

[12:02] Kelly Linden: Here is the forum post about this weeks updates:

[12:03] Kelly Linden: The RC from last week that fixed a server crash has been promoted to the main channel today - which means it is on all servers right now.

[12:03] Kelly Linden: The RCs will be updated tomorrow with another crash fix, and a fix for llModifyLand

[12:04] Jenna Felton: was the main channel downgraded this week?

[12:04] Kelly Linden: No

[12:05] Kelly Linden: That is all the news I have. Table is open.

[12:05] Jenna Felton: because the history page for the main channel servers shows there is even the version

[12:05] Jenna Felton:

[12:06] Jenna Felton: ups sorry

[12:06] Jenna Felton: now i am reading right: has the history showing to blue steel

[12:06] Adamburp Adamczyk: when are we likel;y to see Baker's group-ban feature?

[12:08] Kelly Linden: Adamburp - I don't have any update on that right now. I know it will take both a server and a viewer release which does complicate things.

[12:08] Adamburp Adamczyk: ah, okay

[12:08] Mona Eberhardt: Kelly, are we ever going to see a structured, sensible and straightforward method for putting together menu and submenu structures?

[12:09] Jonathan Yap: What do you mean by menus?

[12:09] Qie Niangao: Jonathan: LSL, I presume

[12:09] Kelly Linden: Mona: In what context?

[12:10] Mona Eberhardt: Menus for controlling the various functions in a script.

[12:10] Mona Eberhardt: Or at the very least, we need some better documentation.

[12:10] Kelly Linden: There are no current plans or projects for improving script dialogs or similar that I am aware of right now.

[12:11] Mona Eberhardt: At least, we need better documentation.

[12:11] Jenna Felton: menus would make me very happy when i got a response for the user cliking the ignore button.

[12:12] Rex Cronon: hello

[12:12] Kelly Linden: Better documentation of what, exactly?

[12:12] Whirly Fizzle: Heya Rex

[12:12] Rex Cronon: hi whirly

[12:12] Qie Niangao: Jenna, the problem is, you still couldn't wait for that "Ignore" response, because it's just a special case of actually ignoring the dialog until something else replaces it or the user logs off.

[12:12] Rex Cronon: AFK...............................

[12:12] Rex Cronon: afk

[12:14] Mona Eberhardt: Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?

[12:14] Kallista Destiny: Exactly

[12:15] Lexbot Sinister: ?

[12:15] Kelly Linden: Any other topics or questions?

[12:15] Jonathan Yap: Kelly, has any thought ever been given to a script debug window?

[12:16] Jonathan Yap: It would let you input commands to trigger events etc

[12:16] Adamburp Adamczyk: yes

[12:16] LonelyShyBird (djrobbie): GPU NEw Crashor killing people of Korea sims

[12:16] Adamburp Adamczyk: is it Bakers' birthday today?

[12:16] LonelyShyBird (djrobbie): We Want an FIX

[12:16] LonelyShyBird (djrobbie): ")

[12:17] Adamburp Adamczyk: Kelly - open table?

[12:17] Kelly Linden: Jonathan: short answer is yes it has been thought about

[12:17] Lexbot Sinister: (is there a meeting log?)

[12:17] Qie Niangao: I'm curious if the eXperience Permissions feature is still being worked on.

[12:18] Kelly Linden: A lot of what you expect from a debugger is very difficult in LSL and harder in LSL-on-Mono, such as most of looking at the actual state of the script.

[12:18] Kelly Linden: Adamburp - it is.

[12:18] Kelly Linden: Qie: it is.

[12:18] Qie Niangao: Cool, thanks.

[12:18] Ima Mechanique: yup stil in seKrit

[12:19] Kelly Linden: Being able to trigger events is an interesting idea but I think it has some security concerns if not handled very carefully.

[12:19] Mona Eberhardt: LonelyShyBird, there are only a few things that can be done for this. First of all, what are the region permissions w.r.t. rezzing and scripting? What's the autoreturn time? Have you filed Abuse Reports?

[12:19] Adamburp Adamczyk: if you can, can you tell us are the rumours of Rod leavign true? If you can't say/comment either way, fair enough

[12:19] Mona Eberhardt: scripting = running scripts

[12:19] Jonathan Yap: You would have to be able to modify the script before the debugger could operate on it

[12:20] Adamburp Adamczyk: been a lot on the forums about it

[12:20] Kallista Destiny: He's nolonger on the LL web page

[12:20] Adamburp Adamczyk: yeah we know - s'why i asked

[12:20] Nalates Urriah: Adam, Rod says on his facebook page he is leaving. That is about as confirmed as it gets.

[12:21] Kelly Linden: I don't have any news or comments on that matter Adamburp.

[12:21] Qie Niangao: It would be quite a trick if he reappeared saying it was all just a big joke, ha, ha.

[12:21] Ima Mechanique: yeah, early April fools

[12:21] Duckie Dickins: Baker Linden for CEO. :) This company could use a twerking chicken who loves exploring the world to steer the ship. :)

[12:21] Whirly Fizzle: +1

[12:21] Ima Mechanique: a twerking chicken, thanks for that image

[12:21] Lexbot Sinister: i think if anything was permitted to be said on the matter, we would already hear it. i´m afraid there is no point in stressing the Lindens we got about it.

[12:22] Kallista Destiny: Or Oz

[12:22] Qie Niangao: With Simon not attending today, I figured it was his turn to be CEO today.

[12:22] Kallista Destiny snickers, serial CEO?

[12:24] Duckie Dickins: I came late. Was there any word on those possible changes to allow playing sounds in a linked prim without a script having to be in that prim..or the stuff about changing a sound's pitch....or is that still somewhere on the todo list behind other priorities?

[12:24] Mona Eberhardt: No mention so far, Duckie.

[12:25] Kelly Linden: Duckie: That is still in the todo list.

[12:26] Lexbot Sinister: is there any possibility that abandoned mainland could get automatic terraform and plants dropped on? Mainland is looking like arse :/

[12:26] Ima Mechanique: did llGetMaxScaleFactor(0 and friends get to the main grid yet? the Server/14 is very light on releases

[12:27] Kelly Linden: I don't think we have any plans along those lines Lex. We've tweaked the parameters around mainland release in the past though so it isn't unheard of.

[12:27] Kelly Linden: Ima: Yes that should be everywhere.

[12:27] Ima Mechanique: any idea what release? as I said the Server/14 page only has one entry

[12:28] Kelly Linden:

[12:28] Kelly Linden:

[12:28] Lexbot Sinister: Would a jira for something like this be looked at, or would you just gigglesnort and blow coffee out of your nose?

[12:28] Ima Mechanique: nm it was last release of 13

[12:29] Kelly Linden: It was on RC in 13 so made it into the 13 list, even though it didn't get to main channel until 14

[12:29] Kelly Linden: Lex: allowing plants to be dropped is pretty much out of the question for clutter and griefing reasons, and teraforming is not much better. I doubt it would get much traction.

[12:30] Qie Niangao: I thought abandoned parcels did get terraform reverted; maybe that was part of the old process that got them set for sale, too.

[12:30] Qie Niangao: (That is to say, they very well may not get reverted any more.)

[12:31] Duckie Dickins: doesn't each region have a default navmesh that was set up when the region was created? Returning the parcel to it's default state would probably be enough as far as terraforming was concerned and a nice linden bot dropping a plant rezzer could do the job.

[12:32] Qie Niangao: (Reverting the terrain would *usually* be better than not doing it.)

[12:32] Kelly Linden: well, assume a nice case where the parcels have been modified to be cohesive. Reverting the abandoned one would be ugly then.

[12:32] Qie Niangao: right... that could happen, too.

[12:32] Lexbot Sinister: i would rather see that it used a strong smoothing to fit with the borders of adjecent parcels. The default might not be doing that. And then plant rezzer on top.

[12:33] Adamburp Adamczyk: lex, try dropping guy a notecard with all that

[12:34] Adamburp Adamczyk: he handles mainland abanadeoned land

[12:34] Lexbot Sinister: I wonder though if it´s out of scope of what LL is willing to do with mainland.

[12:34] Adamburp Adamczyk: beer and typing don;t mix

[12:34] Qie Niangao: I think Arbor Project or somebody used to have a script that woke up occasionally and smooth terraformed the microparcels to match the neighbors

[12:36] Lexbot Sinister: It´s one thing that some places look bad , when it´s intended, and another when places look bad because they are left to rot. Smoothing out land and rezzing some plants would be IMO same as packaging an item for sale. Everyone wins.

[12:36] Adamburp Adamczyk: well the auto-settign for sale stopped

[12:37] Duckie Dickins: well most of the moles got whacked but I thought they were the ones sprucing the mainland up.

[12:37] Lexbot Sinister: yeah but there are always adjecent parcels still. Where people pay. Would you be more inclined to stay by a pit and landslide, or by a park?

[12:39] Skills Hak: sup

[12:40] Adamburp Adamczyk: support has a lot to do with it

[12:40] Adamburp Adamczyk: i dumped a full mainland sim cos of that

[12:41] Lexbot Sinister: i know mainland isn´t a moneymaker. It´s still a place that sets the tone of what SL is, to many newcommers (and oldbies too) and the less arsey it looks by default, the better.

[12:42] Kallista Destiny: Yes but that's a LOT of moderately skilled man hours to fix all that.

[12:42] Kallista Destiny: Unless the underlying origional map is available.

[12:42] Lexbot Sinister: eah, thats why i wonder if it could be feasibly automated

[12:43] Lexbot Sinister: even though i got the sensation that mainland is being phased out :/

[12:44] Qie Niangao: Of course, if instead they figure out a way to lure customers into buying all that abandoned land, then even better. (Assuming those customers aren't leaving from some more profitable arrangement.)

[12:44] Adamburp Adamczyk: no it will stay

[12:44] Adamburp Adamczyk: due to the amount of priovate sims going

[12:44] Adamburp Adamczyk: someday maindland may pick up again

[12:44] Duckie Dickins: there's landbots that sorta already do that for land barons....buys a plot..terraforms it..drops a sales info prim and sets it for sale. Just dress a few of them up in a gru minion avatar and unleash them. :)

[12:44] Adamburp Adamczyk: but a LOT of owrk needs doign to make it attractive again

[12:45] Adamburp Adamczyk: improve support, adn restore governnce

[12:45] Skills Hak: support and gov is expensive

[12:45] Lexbot Sinister: well, a lot of work was done with Zindra, so imo it´s not impossible- but it needs a different structure, good ideas from the start, and actual effort.

[12:46] Lexbot Sinister: hah, nm, that will never happen.

[12:46] Adamburp Adamczyk: support is cheap

[12:46] Adamburp Adamczyk: that;s why they use the scouts

[12:47] Adamburp Adamczyk: and puttign them on concierge - big maistake

[12:47] Adamburp Adamczyk: mistake*

[12:47] Lexbot Sinister: so in that case, it would be relative cheap to terraform abandoned plots.

[12:48] Adamburp Adamczyk: you kidding? 4 scouts and 2 hours jsut to get a region restarted

[12:48] Duckie Dickins: it's probably hard to monetize that though. It's hard to see the value in it when the big seller is estate tier

[12:48] Adamburp Adamczyk: terraforimg, give them a year

[12:48] Jenna Felton: what when allow the paying residents who have a parcell to use also the adjacent abandoned land?

[12:48] Jenna Felton: than they can do what they want and what match the parcel

[12:49] Duckie Dickins: abandoned land = sand box land for premium users = win

[12:49] Adamburp Adamczyk: premium sandboxes already exit

[12:49] Qie Niangao: Jenna, there's nothing stopping them now. Assuming they have the prims to spare on their own land (within 55m anyway)

[12:49] Duckie Dickins: yeah but i hate going to them.

[12:49] Duckie Dickins: my friends can't come with me

[12:49] Jenna Felton: they should be able to use prims of the abandoned parcel too

[12:50] Lexbot Sinister: Thats just wierd, Jenna.

[12:50] Skills Hak: ...What the HDD... H ti titi .. i can't even talk now

[12:51] Kelly Linden: hm?

[12:52] Skills Hak: JIRA™ there's a reason for it, it's a system and it does work.

[12:52] Qie Niangao: This ad brought to you by Atlassian.

[12:52] Whirly Fizzle: lol

[12:53] Whirly Fizzle: Can I have that gesture? :D

[12:53] Whirly Fizzle: Yay ty

[12:53] Skills Hak: That's why we do it, yanno - well.. that's why most of us do it: For the Thank Yous.

[12:54] Skills Hak: where's simon?

[12:54] Lucia Nightfire: having his tailor fit him for his new CEO suit, heh

[12:54] Skills Hak: haha

[12:54] Lucia Nightfire: first thing I said all meeting

[12:55] Duckie Dickins: he drew the short straw this week

[12:55] Rex Cronon: lol. jira doesn't, especially after "fixed" it so that only "special" people can see other jiras:)

[12:55] Lucia Nightfire: lol, duck

[12:55] Kelly Linden: Simon had some prior commitments for lunch today.

[12:55] Rex Cronon: jira doesn't work*

[12:55] Jenna Felton: make a jira post about jira not working :)

[12:55] Adamburp Adamczyk still reckon';s it;s baker's birthday and simon goen to lunch with him

[12:56] Lexbot Sinister: We should rebel, and demand a democracy from now on.

[12:56] Qie Niangao: NPC for CEO

[12:57] Skills Hak: Uhh wuell, to quote Linden Lab: Ur Wurld, ur Immerginashn

[12:57] Skills Hak: Ya, aaand bcausesomeofthepeeple seeitasa game or someting liekdatorsome gameenvironment..

[12:57] Skills Hak: uhhhh.. that's whereyou get griefers from!

[12:57] Skills Hak: hu/&3gebbudothink: Oh! if i'mallowedtodothis, i'mmaalloweddoit? because errrimalloweddodoit ..???

[12:57] Skills Hak: gegegames, and thats where so many griefers come from.

[12:57] Skills Hak: uhhh, the reason i mention this, because u kno.. some of the griefers out there - they not intentionally greefing

[12:57] Skills Hak: they just playing the game they think - and that's one of the problems secondlife has!

[12:57] Lexbot Sinister: and to also quote "it´s not a game... it´s a.. virtual country"

[12:57] Skills Hak: uhhh yeah err yea thats u kno..if u see greefers out there orsomethinglike that, youmightwanna edducatethemalilbitt!

[12:57] Lexbot Sinister: Country like Russia >.<

[12:57] Zozo Raven: mwahahahahaha ho ha ha ho *gasp* Pffft

[12:58] Rex Cronon: we should select u as the ceo skills. i think u would make life "interesting" around here:)

[12:58] Kelly Linden: Thank you everyone for coming.

[12:58] Skills Hak: oh my~

[12:58] Lexbot Sinister laughs

[12:58] Qie Niangao: Thanks Kelly.

[12:58] Kallista Destiny: Thank you Kelly

[12:58] Whirly Fizzle: Thanks Kelly

[12:58] Duckie Dickins: Thanks for enduring us this week Kelly

[12:58] Tankmaster Finesmith: have a good rest of the week, kelly

[12:58] Skills Hak: cya

[12:58] Yuzuru Jewell: Thank you, Kelly.

[12:58] Lucia Nightfire: still got 2 minutes left something important may come up

[12:59] Rex Cronon: tc kelly

[12:59] Lucia Nightfire: but thanks

[12:59] Duckie Dickins: Bacon needs to be on the agenda every week

[12:59] Nalates Urriah: Bye


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