User:Andrew Linden/Office Hours/2009 03 03

Transcript of Andrew Linden's office hours:

[11:03]	Moon Metty:	hi Simon :D
[11:03]	Asterion Coen:	hello simon ^^
[11:03]	Simon Linden:	Hello .
[11:03]	Kitto Flora:	Hello
[11:03]	Asterion Coen:	and hello andrew ^^
[11:03]	xstorm Radek:	hi Andrew
[11:03]	Moon Metty:	hey Andrew
[11:03]	Andrew Linden:	Hi
[11:03]	Asterion Coen:	kitto, how is the train business actualy ?
[11:04]	Kitto Flora:	Train sales are very slow
[11:04]	Andrew Linden:	I'm using the linux client today, but an old one.
[11:04]	xstorm Radek:	hi rex
[11:04]	Rex Cronon:	hi xstorm
[11:04]	Rex Cronon:	hi everybody
[11:04]	Asterion Coen:	oh, im happy(sic) to see im not the one to have some sale probs :)
[11:04]	Moon Metty:	hi Rex :)
[11:04]	Andrew Linden:	Hrm... my sound doesn't work, and I've had one short block already.
[11:04]	Rex Cronon:	hi:)
[11:04]	Asterion Coen:	hello rex ^^
[11:05]	Rex Cronon:	if there was a way to advertise:)
[11:05]	Rex Cronon:	hi
[11:05]	Rex Cronon:	i mean like buying space on the loginpage:)
[11:05]	Andrew Linden:	The slow sales are attributed to the down economy?
[11:06]	Asterion Coen:	andrew i dunno. about me, (for gov projects) i think that's due to both economy and the new gov teams
[11:06]	Andrew Linden:	Oy, adspace in the login. I'm sure we'd see some pitchforks if we tried that.
[11:06]	Asterion Coen:	but i noticed the shops r working bad too
[11:06]	Asterion Coen:	estates orders r still fine
[11:06]	Kitto Flora:	Yes, down economy - slowed all
[11:06]	Andrew Linden:	"new gov teams"? What do you mean by that?
[11:06]	Kitto Flora:	More Avs in SL, but lot less money
[11:07]	Asterion Coen:	andrew the new president, with the new heads in the administrations
[11:07]	Asterion Coen:	and the new budgets
[11:07]	Rex Cronon:	or maybe adds in public sandboxes:)
[11:07]	Andrew Linden:	Oh, I see US government. I thought you were talking about LL governance teams.
[11:07]	Eata Kitty:	I don't like adspace because it's only the fashion people who can afford the top slots so any ad you see... it's skins, fashion....
[11:08]	Asterion Coen:	like EPA (us environmental protection agency) that came on SL stoped activities, i dunno until when
[11:08]	Andrew Linden:	Lessee... I wonder if I have any announcements....
[11:08]	Moon Metty:	well, there's plenty of room for ads on xstreet
[11:09]	xstorm Radek:	xstreet needs inworld vending system
[11:09]	Andrew Linden:	I meant to inquire about pending fixes to some inventory problems, but the meeting where I was going to ask was moved from this morning to tomorrow, so nothing to report about that.
[11:09]	Moon Metty:	oh
[11:09]	xstorm Radek:	by killing my onrez i have no inworld venders
[11:09]	Andrew Linden:	All of our simulator hosts and other SL grid servers have been etchified (upgraded to debian etch operating system (4.0))
[11:10]	Andrew Linden:	There should be no noticable changes there, the simulator is still in 32 bit mode.
[11:10]	xstorm Radek:	oh thats sounds great
[11:10]	xstorm Radek:	when will it be 64 bit ?
[11:10]	Andrew Linden:	server-1.26 will be 64bit mode
[11:11]	Eata Kitty:	Sims only have 3gb of ram?
[11:11]	Andrew Linden:	1.26 is gearing up for its big QA tests
[11:11]	Andrew Linden:	hopefully that will only take a week or two
[11:12]	Andrew Linden:	dunno when server-1.26 will be out... maybe before the end of the month if we're lucky
[11:12]	Andrew Linden:	sometime in April if we're not
[11:12]	xstorm Radek:	there are still a number of problems with textures on AV's will that be taken care of first ?
[11:12]	Andrew Linden:	xstorm, what "textures on AV's" problems are you talking about?
[11:12]	Asterion Coen:	mystic u r not that thin :)
[11:13]	Eata Kitty:	I assume you mean about it only downloading the full baked and not individuals?
[11:13]	Andrew Linden:	Perhaps we need a new table where the empty seat is a different color
[11:13]	Asterion Coen:	an things rezzing faster ;)
[11:13]	Asterion Coen:	and*
[11:13]	xstorm Radek:	well the bottom half is a grid for me and white fome some other people
[11:13]	Arawn Spitteler:	It's night, and rezzing is slow, so a brighter color might do.
[11:13]	xstorm Radek:	for
[11:13]	Andrew Linden:	Ah, here is a rumor... I heard from another LL dev that he was able to do much cleanup of how the SL client uses textures
[11:14]	Gellan Glenelg:	VWR-7957 ... it should be fixed in 1.22 client
[11:14]	Asterion Coen:	that's a good news
[11:14]	Andrew Linden:	so not only do we have some pending fixes for texture downloads in the server (1.27) but also in the viewer
[11:14]	Kitto Flora:	Is this the Nvida driver and Palletised Textures thing?
[11:14]	Gellan Glenelg:	yep
[11:14]	Kitto Flora:	Then use the later RC client - problem fixed
[11:14]	Andrew Linden:	Yes, Bao Linden says he was able to reduce texture memory footprint by 50%. That is the rumor.
[11:15]	xstorm Radek:	will it not be better to make a Server just for textures ?
[11:15]	Kitto Flora:	LL should do a regular client update
[11:15]	xstorm Radek:	that way it can handle the load faster ?
[11:15]	Asterion Coen:	i like rumors :)
[11:15]	Eata Kitty:	I thought they already were on a Squid cache
[11:15]	Andrew Linden:	Also, Babbage Linden was making a case in internal email to go forward with our HTTP texture download work (which has been partially finished but not shipped for a long time).
[11:16]	xstorm Radek:	it seems not to do any better
[11:16]	Andrew Linden:	So I'd expect some good changes in the texture pipeline this year.
[11:16]	Moon Metty:	excellent!
[11:16]	xstorm Radek:	oh ok
[11:16]	xstorm Radek:	it will help
[11:16]	Kitto Flora 's toes thank you.
[11:16]	Andrew Linden:	At the moment textures go through our legacy UDP packet system.
[11:17]	Andrew Linden:	We've been wanting to move it to HTTP for a while
[11:17]	Andrew Linden:	work has been done, but it is not yet complete.
[11:17]	Eata Kitty:	I would imagine texture loading is probably the biggest customer issue really
[11:17]	xstorm Radek:	that i did know its been around back from beta i think *GIGGLES* :)Andrew Linden 20:49, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
[11:17]	Andrew Linden:	I'd expect it to complete this year, but I won't speculate when exactly.
[11:17]	Andrew Linden:	Hrm... texture download or lost inventory? Anyone want to vote?
[11:18]	Moon Metty:	that's a tough one
[11:18]	Kitto Flora:	Inventory loss seems to be getting worse
[11:18]	Gellan Glenelg:	I donwload textures every day; have never lost inventory - so work on texures :)
[11:18]	xstorm Radek:	make backups of inventory i do
[11:18]	Eata Kitty:	Textures because when you stand around surrounded by grey objects and people you dont' really care about your inventory
[11:18]	Kitto Flora:	Cases of 'Auto-return' actually deleting no-copy items
[11:18]	xstorm Radek:	i do close to 100 or 300 textures a day
[11:19]	Moon Metty:	yes Eata, that's a point lol
[11:19]	Moon Metty:	i lost my grey blob
[11:19]	Andrew Linden:	Ok, so texture problems might push inventory loss off of our unofficial top-problem at these hours.
[11:20]	Kitto Flora:	Right now I have worse : https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-3917
[11:20]	Andrew Linden:	I don't have any other announcements. So I guess the table is open.
[11:20]	Kitto Flora:	OK - theres the item
[11:20]	Kitto Flora:	'Share with group' failing.
[11:20]	Asterion Coen:	/about sl client (nothing to do with texture) when it will be possible to re-connect after a disconnexion without to have to load again the client ?
[11:20]	Arawn Spitteler doesn't object to dealling with grey People, or people of other colors, but unrezzed alpha is an example of unwise architecture.
[11:21]	Andrew Linden:	SVC-3917 Old objects set 'Share With Group' no longer editable
[11:21]	xstorm Radek:	oh Kitto its made that way
[11:21]	Arawn Spitteler:	That Client Reconnect should be a no brainer, so there must be a reason
[11:21]	Andrew Linden:	I've got a little story about Client Reconnect...
[11:21]	Eata Kitty:	I assume it was just designed the easier way
[11:21]	Kitto Flora:	Client reconnect is a client problem, not a Simulator problem.
[11:22]	Andrew Linden:	Years ago we hired a young dev fresh out of MIT...
[11:22]	xstorm Radek:	if a owner gives the item to group why do you need it back ?
[11:22]	Andrew Linden:	and he was offended that there was no Client Reconnect
[11:22]	xstorm Radek:	just return it and then do edit
[11:22]	Andrew Linden:	and he said, "Within a year I'm going to get Client Reconnect done."
[11:22]	Rex Cronon:	that was how many years ago:)
[11:23]	Arawn Spitteler:	Sounds like a month's work
[11:23]	Andrew Linden:	Every once in a while when I want to goad him I ask him how that project is coming along ;-)
[11:23]	Gellan Glenelg:	https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1607 - july 07, not yet assigned
[11:23]	Andrew Linden:	He took a look at the startup code of the SL viewer and blanched.
[11:23]	Twisted Laws:	too many globals and stuff in the client that would need to be reset to be able to reconnect
[11:23]	Andrew Linden:	It might be cleaner these days. I'll ask around to see what other LL dev's think.
[11:23]	Eata Kitty:	I assume it would be if its open source
[11:24]	Twisted Laws:	it is getting better :)
[11:24]	Andrew Linden:	I'm trying to remember when was the last internal conversation about that... less than a year ago someone was declaring that it should get done.
[11:24]	Rex Cronon:	if u make it all one big superclass it might work:)
[11:24]	Kitto Flora notes that other clients havenot got a reconnect option yet, so it must be very difficult to do.
[11:24]	Asterion Coen:	maybe your guy could contact rhe AWG ;)
[11:24]	Simon Linden:	It's telling that nobody in the open source community hasn't fixed it ... the cleanup to get back to the start is pretty ugly
[11:25]	Twisted Laws:	its been worked on a lot, lots closer to being clean now
[11:25]	Rex Cronon:	awg is just 4 protocol
[11:25]	Kitto Flora:	SO about https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-3917?
[11:25]	Asterion Coen:	i noticed the client needed some time after the 'quit' to cleanup the memory
[11:25]	Andrew Linden takes notes to ask about Client Reconnect...
[11:25]	Eata Kitty:	POKE!
[11:25]	Eata Kitty:	damn function keys
[11:26]	Eata Kitty:	I think 3917 is something for the bug triage
[11:26]	Andrew Linden:	I don't know much about SVC-3917... when did it first appear?
[11:26]	Kitto Flora:	First noticed on Sunday
[11:26]	Andrew Linden:	Did it correlate with server-1.25 or something else?
[11:27]	Kitto Flora:	Maybe. Or maybe the Etch upgrade
[11:27]	Andrew Linden:	Hrm... might be related to the etchification of the grid
[11:27]	Andrew Linden:	that is the only thing that has changed recently
[11:27]	Kitto Flora:	Right
[11:27]	Simon Linden:	There was also the latest RC viewer release
[11:27]	Kitto Flora:	It looks like many objects in sims have gotten slightly corrupted
[11:27]	Kitto Flora:	Problem happens with both RC and standard clients
[11:28]	Andrew Linden:	I'll have to ask around to see what others think. That feature must not go through the simulator code (since that has not changed), but must go through some webservice.
[11:28]	Andrew Linden:	Objects have been "corrupted"? More details please.
[11:28]	Andrew Linden:	Corrupted in appearance, or internals (contents, permissions)?
[11:28]	Kitto Flora:	the 'share with group flag is no lonnger operative
[11:29]	Kitto Flora:	Its all about the 'Share with group' setting
[11:29]	Kitto Flora:	Objects are set share
[11:29]	Kitto Flora:	But cannot be edited
[11:29]	Kitto Flora:	by other group members
[11:29]	Andrew Linden:	ok
[11:29]	xstorm Radek:	if you no longer have permisions that will stop group option
[11:30]	Kitto Flora:	Obviously, xstorm, but that is not the case.
[11:30]	xstorm Radek:	the items must be full perm for group
[11:30]	xstorm Radek:	did you try sending it back to the owner ?
[11:30]	User not online - inventory has been saved.
[11:31]	xstorm Radek:	so it can be relog in to the assets under the owner name ?
[11:31]	Asterion Coen:	hehe i can easely imagine sending back to the owner a building like a world trade center :)
[11:31]	Kitto Flora:	I can send items back to owner, but that is because I also have return permission. This is not the problem.
[11:31]	xstorm Radek:	yes but it may be a work around
[11:31]	Moon Metty:	welcome back Simon
[11:31]	Simon Linden:	Hint : don't select "Show Collision Skeleton" in the RC viewer :(
[11:31]	xstorm Radek:	wb Simon
[11:31]	Moon Metty:	lol
[11:32]	Asterion Coen:	wb
[11:32]	Kitto Flora:	Yes - returning and rez fresh items is a work around.
[11:32]	Rex Cronon:	wb
[11:32]	Arawn Spitteler:	Did you have to reconnect, after the crash?
[11:32]	Kitto Flora:	That does not mean the problem should be ignored?
[11:32]	xstorm Radek:	true
[11:32]	Simon Linden:	yeah, that was a complete crash
[11:32]	Andrew Linden:	Ok, I took note of SVC-3917, but don't know much about it right now.
[11:32]	Arawn Spitteler:	The problem should be tracked down, to see how the change wasn't anticipated.
[11:32]	Andrew Linden:	Anybody have something else?
[11:32]	xstorm Radek:	but i know the assets server has lost data such as makers names and owners names at times
[11:32]	Eata Kitty:	https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2667 This is my feature request but I still don't know why every day passes without it considering how search has always had a big deal made about it :P
[11:33]	Eata Kitty:	Search with no metadata is like... pants without any holes to put your legs in
[11:33]	xstorm Radek:	it may be a bug that is deeper then just the group problem its self
[11:33]	Kitto Flora:	Ah - sad Andrew.. .I thought you knew about the Group Permisiions stuff.
[11:34]	xstorm Radek:	i have been doing a work around for over 2 years
[11:34]	Andrew Linden:	Object metadata for inventory items...
[11:34]	Andrew Linden:	That would be hard. I don't think it is currently possible to change the inventory db schema
[11:34]	xstorm Radek:	thats why the work around
[11:34]	Eata Kitty:	Maybe but I think our current situation is pretty crazy. It's so damn hard to find anything
[11:35]	Andrew Linden:	Who would enter the metadata and where would it be stored?
[11:35]	Arawn Spitteler:	Eata's issue points to a difference, between how Objects adn Agents are allowed to search inventory.
[11:35]	Eata Kitty:	I imagine it would be locked depending on the object modify perms
[11:37]	Arawn Spitteler:	The art of simplifying Second Life Software, should become a product, on a par with OOD and Structured Programming.
[11:37]	Eata Kitty:	Not really sure where you are going
[11:37]	Andrew Linden:	We'll connect the complexity to a slider. That should simplify things.
[11:37]	Andrew Linden:	Except when you slide it the wrong direction.
[11:38]	Squirrel Wood:	whatever you do, make it fool proof.
[11:38]	Arawn Spitteler:	With the right lubrications, complexity is all downhill.
[11:38]	Rex Cronon:	a slider for what?
[11:38]	Arawn Spitteler:	Open Grid should be Linden Proof
[11:38]	Andrew Linden:	In short Eata... the metadata feature is an interesting idea but I don't foresee it happening anytime soon.
[11:39]	Eata Kitty:	Shame :(
[11:39]	Eata Kitty:	So hard to find only tshirts in my inventory
[11:39]	Squirrel Wood:	off, almost off, mostly off, halfway off, a little bit on, mostly on, on.
[11:39]	Arawn Spitteler:	Is it possible for a client side inventory search?
[11:39]	Andrew Linden:	It is worth kicking around and thinking about.
[11:40]	Twisted Laws:	yes arawn
[11:40]	Andrew Linden:	But from what I know about our db inflexibilities and sheer number and size of our inventory databases... it would be quite hard to implement.
[11:40]	Eata Kitty:	I wonder if you could have a second DB and just connect the line between them via the UUID rather than trying to add it on
[11:40]	Eata Kitty:	Because I imagine metadata as a property of everything, textures, objects, sounds, animations... those all have UUIDs
[11:40]	Andrew Linden:	er... I was referring to the metadata idea. As to client-side inventory search...
[11:40]	Twisted Laws:	filters help a lot eata
[11:41]	Andrew Linden:	With software you can make it do just about anything... it might be possible to add meta-data to client-side inventory data... but then you couldn't trasnport that metadata when you give inventory items to people.
[11:41]	Arawn Spitteler:	Filters exist, for clothing only. Meta data might expand to Physical Vehicles created by Others...
[11:41]	Eata Kitty:	Well think of something like textures
[11:41]	Eata Kitty:	Very hard to find those
[11:42]	Asterion Coen:	lunch/dinner time :)
[11:42]	Eata Kitty:	Tough to do wall / concrete / dark
[11:42]	Arawn Spitteler:	That would call for a naming convention.
[11:42]	Kitto Flora:	Items in Inventory are easy to find if you use a good naming system.
[11:42]	Eata Kitty:	How many items do you have that follow one?
[11:42]	Rex Cronon:	is there an OR between them?
[11:43]	Eata Kitty:	I meant an AND
[11:43]	Eata Kitty:	But meta data it could be an OR or a NOT :P
[11:43]	Andrew Linden:	inventory items have a "description" field I believe
[11:43]	Andrew Linden:	but I'm not sure it is searchable yet
[11:43]	xstorm Radek:	yes
[11:43]	Arawn Spitteler:	Organize the Eata Naming Convention, and publish, then use it for all products.
[11:43]	xstorm Radek:	no its not
[11:43]	Andrew Linden:	most inv items don't use description field
[11:43]	Andrew Linden:	but if we made it searchable then more would
[11:43]	Squirrel Wood:	Aren't like 99.9% of all prims named "Object" ?
[11:43]	Eata Kitty:	I can only find one Plane in my inventory when I have about five.... the only one I can find is called "Plane" heh
[11:44]	Andrew Linden:	sounds like that is a place where meta data could go, or good names
[11:44]	Eata Kitty:	Probably
[11:44]	Andrew Linden:	and the description column already exists in the inventory db schema, I believe
[11:44]	Arawn Spitteler:	What would it take, for an object to read Inventory Descriptions?
[11:44]	Andrew Linden:	so I guess it comes down to just a search feature
[11:44]	Twisted Laws:	searching descriptions would be a client mod, does look like its possible
[11:45]	Eata Kitty:	Some people use that field for strange scripting purposes
[11:45]	Andrew Linden:	LSL scripts don't have many good features for scanning strings already
[11:45]	Andrew Linden:	but in order to scan/parse description fields of object contents... several new LSL functions would have to be added
[11:46]	Rex Cronon:	sadlly is one of the few places u can store data:(
[11:46]	Andrew Linden:	LSL needs some regex capabilities, right?
[11:46]	xstorm Radek:	yes
[11:46]	Kitto Flora:	You can fake regex in LSL
[11:46]	Andrew Linden:	but I wonder if Babbage Linden would rather just make a new LSL syntax (based on C# or pytyon?) rather than do it in the old legacy LSL
[11:47]	Eata Kitty:	That sounds like a good idea really
[11:47]	Andrew Linden:	but it isn't very fast, is it Kitto?
[11:47]	Kitto Flora:	Probably not
[11:47]	xstorm Radek:	pytyon be better
[11:47]	Eata Kitty:	Now there is a new VM a new syntax would be neat
[11:47]	Twisted Laws:	CSV to list works now pretty well...
[11:47]	Squirrel Wood craves arrays :p
[11:47]	xstorm Radek:	crap spelling
[11:47]	Eata Kitty:	Case statements :D
[11:48]	Andrew Linden:	yes, we've kicked that idea around for a long time. Dunno where it sits on the MONO team's project list
[11:48]	Kitto Flora:	I'm always dubious that yet another layer of high-level language will actually speed things up.
[11:48]	Arawn Spitteler:	Case wuld save on Elif
[11:48]	Rex Cronon:	arrays. now that would be something:)
[11:48]	Andrew Linden:	well, it isn't so much about speeding things up as making some things possible that are currently impossible, or very hard
[11:48]	Eata Kitty:	It wouldnt effect things would it? Considering they are all common language, once its compiled it doesnt matter?
[11:48]	Andrew Linden:	Optimizations in the script engine have more to do with overhauling the C++ implementation underneath
[11:49]	Arawn Spitteler:	I don't think Content Descriptions would be that dificult, or need any new command, through llGetObjectDetails.
[11:49]	xstorm Radek:	will not the old LSL be taken out and shot when every thing is Mono ?
[11:49]	Kitto Flora:	The equivalent of regex is currently possible in LSL. I use it a lot
[11:49]	Moon Metty:	shared data between scripts would be awesome
[11:49]	Eata Kitty:	Only having more VMs would slow things down but we don't need more VMs now we have common language via mono
[11:49]	Simon Linden:	I don't think we're considering adding new VMs, but possibly a different langauge that would compile to mono bytecode
[11:49]	Arawn Spitteler:	LSL won't be taken out and shot, but left on the ice for the next enterprising polar bear
[11:50]	Andrew Linden:	Ah yes, shared data between scripts. That reminds me of one of my favorite feature ideas... which I won't get into because it will just make me sad that I've no time to work on it.
[11:50]	xstorm Radek:	*GIGGLES* :)Andrew Linden 20:49, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
[11:50]	Moon Metty:	ok Andrew lol
[11:50]	Eata Kitty:	Needs more arms
[11:50]	Simon Linden:	The LSL bytecode interpreter may go away someday ... require LSL scripts to compile to mono. That would help stability a bunch
[11:50]	Squirrel Wood:	include files ?
[11:51]	Arawn Spitteler:	I forget where I jiraed this, if I did, but scripts that respond to other scripts, rather than to event engine, would be nice.
[11:51]	Squirrel Wood:	"public" functions per object that can be used by all scripts in the object?
[11:51]	Kitto Flora:	LinkMessages
[11:51]	Arawn Spitteler:	User Defined Library?
[11:51]	Andrew Linden:	How would one script respond to another? I understand the notion of one script calling a function from another.
[11:51]	Eata Kitty:	I had a crazy idea of instead of having seperate scripts... like... every object would be it's own local enviroment, the equivalent of a tiny partition if you will. So you had your own file system and you could do all kinds of crazy like write/ready files, have sockets etc..
[11:51]	xstorm Radek:	hhhmmmmm recompile my tails and ears that may be hard
[11:52]	Andrew Linden:	So Eata... each object has an IP address and sockets? And they all live on one big switch?
[11:53]	Asterion Coen:	is a script can be based on timer for operations ?
[11:53]	Eata Kitty:	I thought they would all be seperate but thats an idea... you could virtualise it even further as if they were all minature computers. Low power computers obviously as you'd have to run hundreds on a sim
[11:53]	Twisted Laws:	if they all had an ip, we'd be working on ip-v8......
[11:53]	Asterion Coen:	like for 2 objet, using a timer to synchronize the move instear the regular following the other one, and try to adpat the speed
[11:53]	Eata Kitty:	IP6 is pretty huge...
[11:54]	Andrew Linden:	I think ipv6 has enough addresses
[11:54]	Squirrel Wood:	mayhaps.
[11:54]	Squirrel Wood:	but what about collisions with real life IPs ?
[11:54]	Eata Kitty:	We'll run out of UUIDs!
[11:54]	Simon Linden:	What are you really after? Better messaging between scripts?
[11:54]	Squirrel Wood:	if I want to navigate to a website using IPv6 ?
[11:55]	xstorm Radek:	ok to recompile is not hard at all
[11:55]	xstorm Radek:	why not just every one recompile to mono ?
[11:55]	Squirrel Wood:	I'd reference via UUID or script name if its in the same prim
[11:55]	Asterion Coen:	(i will love pinging a website without using a dns server with ipv6)
[11:55]	Arawn Spitteler:	It's cumbersome to send lists between scripts, using CSV, if they contain vectors
[11:56]	Andrew Linden:	Squirrel, the IPV6 address space is big enough. It has room for a whole UUID for each individual connection event.
[11:56]	Kitto Flora:	I see people wanting 'new features
[11:56]	Squirrel Wood:	IPvLinden? ^^
[11:56]	Kitto Flora:	in scripts, because they do not yet understdan how to do whhat they want with LSL
[11:56]	Eata Kitty:	I don't know really. It's not so much that it was more like turning scripts from being single entities into minature enviroments so you could use full power operations like file writes. It would be crazy complex to do
[11:57]	Eata Kitty:	Everyone loves features
[11:57]	Eata Kitty:	Except the people who implement them
[11:57]	Moon Metty:	:)
[11:57]	Simon Linden:	We all like features more than bugs ... much more interesting work :)
[11:57]	Andrew Linden:	I like features too, but not all.
[11:58]	Twisted Laws:	i use database scripts in some stuff i've written... no problems yet
[11:58]	Andrew Linden:	Yes that is true Simon.
[11:58]	Simon Linden:	True, there are some features I don't want to work on as well
[11:58]	Eata Kitty:	Speaking of features, any further thoughts on ray casting Andrew?
[11:58]	Asterion Coen:	/(adding new prims shapes) ==
[11:58]	Asterion Coen:	^^
[11:58]	Andrew Linden:	I'm going to have to run soon. I've got another meeting at 12:00
[11:59]	Squirrel Wood:	file writes... zero once gave a very good explaination as to why writing to notecards is not likely to happen
[11:59]	Andrew Linden:	No, no new thoughts on ray-casting. I think I've got about 10 LSL features I'd put on my list before LSL ray-casting events.
[12:00]	Kitto Flora:	The inability to write on notecards is an expensive one.
[12:00]	Twisted Laws:	you can store to a simple script and get 64k of storage...
[12:00]	Eata Kitty:	No worries
[12:00]	Andrew Linden:	Writeable notecards... currently not possible because of how our asset system works.
[12:00]	Asterion Coen:	ok, i have to run :) nice to meet/see you folks
[12:00]	Asterion Coen:	take care :)
[12:00]	Rex Cronon:	tc
[12:00]	Squirrel Wood:	have a great day ^^
[12:01]	Kitto Flora:	Time for lunch!
[12:01]	Andrew Linden:	We currently never change an asset... ust add new ones. So a writeable notecard would require a new asset for every change.
[12:01]	Twisted Laws:	i wonder where the script storage is kept.....
[12:01]	Twisted Laws:	why couldn't a notecard have the same ability
[12:01]	Andrew Linden:	script storage is storred in the asset when it is taken
[12:01]	Asterion Coen:	;)
[12:01]	xstorm Radek:	?? a note card converter ?
[12:02]	Andrew Linden:	so when you rez a copy it picks up wherever it was saved
[12:02]	Arawn Spitteler wonders, if scripts are compiled on Servers, how trusted open grid servers will be, for script compilations?
[12:02]	Twisted Laws:	yes, but huds are updated, script state is saved
[12:02]	Eata Kitty:	Later
[12:02]	Kitto Flora sees Awawn get a clue :)
[12:02]	Eata Kitty:	Thanks for the meeting
[12:02]	xstorm Radek:	bye eata
[12:02]	Squirrel Wood:	humm... notecard upload to SL.... text file import.... pleeeeease ^^
[12:02]	Andrew Linden:	Arawn, we just recently moved to server-compiled scripts, they used to be compiled on the client.
[12:02]	Andrew Linden:	Ok, thanks for coming. Gotta run.
[12:03]	Twisted Laws:	bye
[12:03]	Squirrel Wood:	Run, Andrew, ruuuun! ^^
[12:03]	Eata Kitty:	Compiled on the client always sounded like a recipe for disaster
[12:03]	Moon Metty:	see you soon Andrew, Simon
[12:03]	Arawn Spitteler:	I'm wondering of the consistency of that decision
[12:03]	Rex Cronon:	bye everybody