User:Andrew Linden/Office Hours/2010 02 19

Transcript

[16:00]	Ardy Lay:	Hi Simon, Andrew
[16:01]	Andrew Linden:	hello
[16:01]	Simon Linden:	Hello
[16:01]	Erinyse Planer:	hey andrew :)
[16:01]	Jonathan Yap:	Those deadlock issues will migrate into V2.0 and make life so much better for the general users
[16:01]	Jonathan Yap:	*fixed deadlock issues
[16:01]	Simon Linden:	Are those viewer deadlocks?
[16:01]	Techwolf Lupindo:	Yes.
[16:01]	Jonathan Yap:	Yes, in the graphics pipeline I think
[16:02]	Techwolf Lupindo:	Texture pipeline I think.
[16:02]	Jonathan Yap:	We're talking about Snowglobe
[16:02]	Andrew Linden:	HTTP texture pipeline either works in Viewer 2.0, or works in a branch of it. However it won't actually *work* until the server support is out.
[16:02]	Techwolf Lupindo:	With all the server rollouts and rollbacks, i'be bit the devolopers was keep buzy.
[16:03]	Andrew Linden:	The server stuff works (supposedly) but is currently in the QA queue -- under testing.
[16:03]	Simon Linden:	This has been a _really_ busy week
[16:03]	Ardy Lay:	Don't forget the SFO Datacenter vacate.
[16:03]	Erinyse Planer:	honestly the more snowglobe goes along the more i like it over the "main" viewer. it simply runs better and cleaner on my remaing machine
[16:03]	Jonathan Yap:	Hmmm, I have http texture loading turned on in SG and seem to get about a 2X performance increase
[16:04]	Simon Linden:	The 'main' viewer has definitely lagged far behind ... all the internal attention is on 2.0
[16:04]	Liisa Runo:	any news about the 100 minions your should get soon?
[16:04]	Techwolf Lupindo:	I got to test and play with the one exploit. That was pretty bad, but not as bad as the post made it to be. It was fixed wtih the full no-test rollout.
[16:04]	Jonathan Yap:	Not clear what needs to be done server-side
[16:04]	Simon Linden:	I think the http textures are also outside the normal bandwidth cap ... so you should see the textures faster, and have more bandwidth avaialble for other data
[16:05]	Andrew Linden:	oh right -- there is a confusion between HTTP map textures and HTTP for general textures
[16:05]	Techwolf Lupindo:	I hope so. I have a 6Meg link and like to use it.
[16:05]	Arawn Spitteler:	Hi,m Erinyse
[16:05]	Andrew Linden:	I don't think the general HTTP texture pipeline is working yet.
[16:06]	Simon Linden:	ah, good point. I forgot about that
[16:06]	Arawn Spitteler:	It's occured, to me, that if we can load textures, by http, why not unscripted objecct attachments.
[16:07]	Erinyse Planer:	hew arawn *smiles then turns back to andrew* that would be wonderful, but only if we can keep stuff secure and uncopyable
[16:07]	Rex Cronon:	hello everybody
[16:07]	Techwolf Lupindo:	The sim still needs to track objects I think.
[16:07]	Arawn Spitteler:	They'd be phantom, visible only viewer side, if they don't have scripts in them
[16:07]	Andrew Linden:	at the moment object attachments "live" in simulator memory, much like any other object
[16:07]	Simon Linden:	There may be some things that can go via http, but it would also have to be things that don't change - even position in-world
[16:07]	Andrew Linden:	so the updates for them only come through the simulator
[16:07]	Arawn Spitteler:	Uncopyable, is not an option, except for scripts, and that's temporary
[16:07]	Simon Linden:	If it has any kind of dynamic attribute, the sim would have to send the info
[16:08]	Andrew Linden:	but... unscripted objects info could be moved out....
[16:08]	Andrew Linden:	hrm..
[16:08]	Arawn Spitteler:	I've got to go politely chastise CG, for his build, for a copy violation
[16:08]	Erinyse Planer:	oh?
[16:08]	Andrew Linden:	also, you can select the attachment and perform operations on it
[16:08]	Andrew Linden:	in order for all that to work well it is probably easier to just keep them as they are
[16:09]	Andrew Linden:	what you really want is a much better "object data transport" protocol between the SL servers and client
[16:09]	Arawn Spitteler:	Has everybody the approved Noob Collection? My Philip Linden is illegal, and I got caught at Burning Life
[16:09]	Techwolf Lupindo:	Objects can be non scripted and still be set to sell.
[16:09]	Andrew Linden:	that is, I'd rather work on improving the general data transport system
[16:09]	Arawn Spitteler:	If they're non-scripted, the whole thing can be copied with a hacked client
[16:10]	Arawn Spitteler:	Scripts are the only thing not loaded to client
[16:10]	Erinyse Planer:	so basically youre saying move everything that can be securly moved to http so as to allow the rest of the bandwidth to be better used for things like movement updates etc?
[16:10]	Andrew Linden:	I'm not necessarily saying HTTP -- just that the system needs work
[16:10]	Liisa Runo:	and before the server update at new year, also scrpts were copyable and full perms
[16:11]	Andrew Linden:	and if it got the work it needs then you wouldn't need to special case non-scripted attachments
[16:12]	Andrew Linden:	I don't think I've got any announcements....
[16:12]	Andrew Linden	tries to remember what he did this week.
[16:12]	Techwolf Lupindo:	Fix exploits? ;-)
[16:12]	Jonathan Yap:	Oskar couldn't remember all he did, either
[16:13]	Simon Linden:	I've been buried in the Linden Homes release and fallout
[16:13]	Andrew Linden:	There's a lot of work that is "done" but needed to be wrapped up and pushed down the pipeline. Most of what I did this week was that kinda of stuff.
[16:13]	A group	member named Nydia Tungsten owned by the group 'Sunweavers' gave you "The Three Angels Beach Club".
[16:13]	Andrew Linden:	I've got a branch of changes that is almost done but needs some unit tests, so I've been working on that on the side.
[16:13]	Erinyse Planer:	hows that going simon? im debating whether to up my tier on erinyse or buy a premium for one of my alts... (cost to do either are almsot the same)
[16:13]	Andrew Linden:	I wrote a bunch of testplans, updated various internal jira items.
[16:14]	Arawn Spitteler	imagines a pipeline of good peristaltic pressure
[16:14]	Andrew Linden:	Just thinking out loud here. Nothing too interesting.
[16:14]	Erinyse Planer:	what kinda tests you need andrew? anything we can help with?
[16:15]	Simon Linden:	Linden Homes has been really popular ... we're scrambling to bring up more land
[16:15]	Andrew Linden:	No, I need to unit test code that I wrote a few weeks ago.
[16:15]	Techwolf Lupindo:	wow...I didn't expect that.
[16:15]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, it works quite well too!
[16:15]	Rex Cronon:	i would like to suggest to everybody here to see this movie: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbYz0tD9g2M&feature=player_embedded
[16:15]	Jonathan Yap:	On rollout day it was thrilling to see so many green dots on a zoomed out map
[16:15]	Simon Linden:	yeah, that map was great :)
[16:15]	Rex Cronon:	it is very "educational"
[16:15]	Andrew Linden:	I was just cleaning up some code that I want to overhaul, and I can't overahuaul it until I've got it bracketed by unit tests.
[16:15]	Techwolf Lupindo:	did anyone get a snapshot of that?
[16:16]	Erinyse Planer:	lol i need to figure out how im gonna get one. up tiers or make an alt a preimum member
[16:16]	Andrew Linden:	(all this relates to the llSensor() code)
[16:16]	Rex Cronon:	it shows what a hacked viewer can do:)
[16:16]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, btw. could you give a shout to web folks, they broke the linden home selection page
[16:17]	Simon Linden:	Latif -what happened?
[16:18]	Latif Khalifa:	https://land.secondlife.com/en-US/lindenhomes/land-selection.php 1) select theme works, 2) lists no homes
[16:18]	Latif Khalifa:	under 2) i should be able to select a house
[16:18]	Simon Linden:	are you picking Meadowbrook?
[16:18]	Latif Khalifa:	yes
[16:18]	Simon Linden:	Pick another ... that is a bug, we ran out of that theme
[16:19]	Erinyse Planer:	wow.....
[16:19]	Latif Khalifa:	ah I see, perhaps then remove the theme altogether?
[16:19]	Simon Linden:	Some more should come online soon ... I'm not sure of the schedule
[16:19]	Erinyse Planer:	are there gonna be more houses of that theme?
[16:19]	Simon Linden:	yeah, it's supposed to do that, but there's a bug in the web code
[16:19]	CPU Core:	what does meadowbrook theme look like?
[16:19]	Simon Linden:	Yes, we're adding more as fast as we can
[16:19]	Latif Khalifa:	hehe
[16:20]	Erinyse Planer:	kk cuase thats the one i intended to buy once i came up with the money and decided which route i was going -_-
[16:20]	Simon Linden:	It's a basic modern style ... I'm actually surpised it's so popular compared to the others
[16:20]	Simon Linden:	I picked out a Japanese themed one myself
[16:20]	CPU Core:	i been to look at all the houses
[16:20]	Latif Khalifa:	I am not, I wanted one :)
[16:20]	CPU Core:	and would guess that they would sell best.. they have more space inside
[16:20]	Simon Linden:	We were wondering if the popularity was due to how it looked, or just because it's always at the top of the list
[16:20]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, it works very well, with abandoning, and claiming, really impressive how nice it works :)
[16:21]	CPU Core:	people want big houses
[16:21]	Erinyse Planer:	thought about the japanese bt none of them really appealed to me. and the so called fantasy theme no offense but they didnt look as nice quaility wise or design wise
[16:21]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, my guess is look
[16:21]	Jonathan Yap:	Maybe people want tall ceilings
[16:21]	Simon Linden:	The size is probably it ... there's one type called 'Skylight' which is the same size as the others, but the snapshot makes it look smaller. It's by far the least popular in that type
[16:21]	Erinyse Planer:	salso i think it has the only twostory house in the medowbrook theme
[16:22]	Latif Khalifa:	I hope it also translates to more premium accounts.
[16:22]	Erinyse Planer:	*wishes she had $70 to blow right now... *
[16:23]	Erinyse Planer:	actually ive seen many of my friends with preimums up their tiers to get one of those... some use them as a getaway or extra room, two use them to house all their servers, and one uses it as a private design studio
[16:24]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, was the linden home project the sekrit thing you were working on? :) I have not been around for a while
[16:24]	Andrew Linden:	Wow, this is the first time I've visited the "SL Homes" web pages.
[16:24]	Latif Khalifa:	hehe
[16:24]	Erinyse Planer:	the whole project (includignthe homes webpage) came out much nicer then i expected
[16:25]	Andrew Linden:	Simon's sekret project from a few months ago?
[16:25]	Latif Khalifa:	yeah it's nice
[16:25]	Latif Khalifa:	Andrew, yeah
[16:25]	CPU Core:	i clicked on one of the control panels in a home.. it seems they will have future ability to modify the houses from webpages
[16:25]	Simon Linden:	Yes, we're going to add a system so you can change the floor, walls, etc a bit
[16:26]	Erinyse Planer:	nice.... but even if not.... already exceded my expectations. i expected something like the axe's first home series. very boxy and noobish
[16:26]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, the only little tiny thing I thing could improve experience is allow home to be bought directly :)
[16:27]	Simon Linden:	Yeah, it would be great if people could request a specific empty parcel
[16:27]	Liisa Runo:	.... since LL fails to close the grid while they fix permission exploits.. maybe i should, takes only 120 seconds to shut down a continent
[16:27]	Simon Linden:	The back-end system is there to do that, but would require some more web development work
[16:27]	Arawn Spitteler:	Wha'd you find, Liisa
[16:27]	Latif Khalifa:	I had some friends who wanted to get a few parcels nearby to make 4-5 of them a small neighbourhood
[16:28]	Simon Linden:	We're actually really overloaded on web development jobs .... it's hard to get anyone for new projects
[16:28]	Arawn Spitteler:	I think that's a major problem, with Mainland; you wind up with neighbors that are expensive to move from.
[16:28]	Simon Linden:	Yeah, it would be nice if groups could get together
[16:28]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, how hard would it be to allow "buy" in viewer?
[16:28]	Liisa Runo:	i find that when everything, including scripts, was full pems and free to copy, it took 10 months for LL to fix it, and LL didnt even bother to warn us about the threat
[16:28]	Erinyse Planer:	hmmm..... thought about farming out maybe? lots of small time web devs out there between jobs
[16:29]	CPU Core:	is it possible for people to swap their Linden homes with someone else if they wanted by selling to the other person?
[16:29]	Simon Linden:	No, you can't sell them -- just abandon, which puts them back in the pool of available parcels
[16:29]	Erinyse Planer:	can support override and give you a specific parcel, say the empty one next to your sl partner's?
[16:30]	Latif Khalifa:	yeah, I had to try it :) worked perfect, auto return objects. parcel reverts name and settings, nicely done
[16:30]	Simon Linden:	Erinyse - no, not normally.
[16:30]	CPU Core:	is all this functionality done with scripts?
[16:30]	Erinyse Planer:	hmm thats a downside then -_-
[16:31]	Arawn Spitteler:	Is it possible to share perms, with a partner?
[16:31]	Simon Linden:	Not LSL scripts ... there are a lot of parts, but the main one is a set of databases that manage all the parcels and can assign, abandon, etc
[16:31]	CPU Core:	will you make it possible for islands to do similar things you have on Linden Homes in future then?
[16:31]	Simon Linden:	Arawn - if you're the owner, you have control over most of the usual parcel permissions
[16:32]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, I'd thing the best way to implement would be to allow people to "buy" the parcel directy. The sale would fail if they are not premium, or already have a linden home, or don't have enough tier
[16:32]	Erinyse Planer:	on the other hand i really really like the system... perhaps later it can expand to do 1024 and 2048 homes as well?
[16:32]	Latif Khalifa:	Arawn, only thing you cannot do is sell, deed to group or make available in search as far as I could see
[16:33]	Simon Linden:	Yeah, I was careful to make sure there's no size restriction on the system
[16:33]	Latif Khalifa:	allowing bigger sizes would more of a politial problem...
[16:33]	CPU Core:	it cant expand its would not be fair on those who rent out
[16:33]	Erinyse Planer:	you might also look at expanding the system to allow for shops instead. for those that want to stat a business venture
[16:34]	CPU Core:	it would be wrong to allow them to do the same with shops
[16:34]	Simon Linden:	Well, we're trying to make it really simple for first-time land owners ... we don't want to compete directly with other land, but make it really easy to get a plot and house
[16:35]	Erinyse Planer:	why cpu?
[16:35]	Simon Linden:	If we start getting larger plots and allow sales, it's pushing into other businesses
[16:35]	Arawn Spitteler:	Anything that favors Premiums has to be examined for what it does to Island Owners
[16:35]	Simon Linden:	exactly
[16:35]	CPU Core:	because They sell land to what would also be their competitiors
[16:35]	Erinyse Planer:	many many island owners are no longer allowing commerical land
[16:35]	CPU Core:	ll cant compete with its own user base
[16:36]	Simon Linden:	We talked with a bunch of land owners about this project, and the were mostly in favor of it ... they don't deal with 512 parcels very much, but did want to see more people getting into land ownership
[16:36]	Simon Linden:	So it's the first step down the slippery slope :)
[16:36]	Latif Khalifa:	yes, nicely done all in all, both policy and technology wise )
[16:37]	Liisa Runo:	there is a way to get land and no need to pay tier, i wonder how popular that trick is
[16:37]	CPU Core:	really the Linden homes arent the great value people imagine lol
[16:37]	Rex Cronon:	at high altitude:)
[16:37]	Techwolf Lupindo:	And i will be waiting down at the bottom of that slope. I will be well feed with newbies. LOL
[16:38]	Erinyse Planer:	*shrugs* i own a quarter what i used to, mainly cuase both island owners i rented from decided to make their islands strictly residential or decided to double the tiers...
[16:38]	CPU Core:	$9.99 premium - free L$s value means you are paying $5.30 for 512 land
[16:39]	CPU Core:	although the 512 land is worth about as much as 1024 land
[16:39]	Erinyse Planer:	it is more then i was paying for a 1024 plot on an island and keep in mind i wasn't getting a free building or that many more prims
[16:39]	Latif Khalifa:	We also met some new server team members, Falcon Linden seems to be a very competent guy when it comes to havok, you must be happy to have enhanced server team :)
[16:40]	CPU Core:	55 homes on each sim paying $5.30 a month each for their homes earns $291 per sim
[16:40]	CPU Core:	which is only $4 short of an island
[16:40]	CPU Core:	carefully worked out prices
[16:40]	Jonathan Yap:	If you pay by the year then you get more savings
[16:41]	Arawn Spitteler:	Short of an Island? That's quite a discount
[16:41]	CPU Core:	they are getting a good deal.. but Island owners could compete but little or no profit for them
[16:42]	Latif Khalifa:	omg simon fell asleep :)
[16:42]	Erinyse Planer:	if there were first land stores as well, i think it would help, really help boost the ecconomy. as i said some are already using thier linden homes for that anyways... even if that is against official use
[16:42]	Simon Linden:	IM AWAKE !
[16:42]	Latif Khalifa	passes some coffee :D
[16:42]	Arawn Spitteler:	Luna used to have a competition, for free shops
[16:42]	Andrew Linden:	You can't sell anything in a "linden home"?
[16:43]	Andrew Linden:	I wonder why they are called "Linden Homes" instead fo "SL Homes".
[16:43]	Erinyse Planer:	sure you can.... you sue servers
[16:43]	Erinyse Planer:	*use
[16:43]	Andrew Linden:	Do we call them "Linden Homes" on the web pages anywhere?
[16:43]	Simon Linden:	Yeah, it's going to be interesting to see how all the neighbors get along. We've said there is supposed to be 'no skyboxes' but I'm not sure how that's going to wokr
[16:43]	CPU Core:	I think they call them Linden Homes because really all homes in SL are SL homes :)
[16:43]	Simon Linden:	I think they're called Linden Homes all over
[16:44]	Andrew Linden:	Ok. Shrug.
[16:44]	Liisa Runo:	i think skyboxes are fine, if they are high enough, and not visible from ground
[16:44]	CPU Core:	i like the Linden Homes
[16:44]	CPU Core:	but i want a space Linden Home
[16:45]	Simon Linden:	Yeah, there was some spirited debate about them.
[16:45]	CPU Core:	Or a Linden Sandbox :)
[16:45]	Simon Linden:	I hope we can release some more themes like that ... space, etc
[16:45]	Latif Khalifa:	is havok7 scheduled for 1.40-ish server?
[16:45]	Arawn Spitteler:	Does CPU want to sponsor a sandbox?
[16:45]	Andrew Linden:	Yeah Havok7 won't be in server-1.38 for sure.
[16:45]	CPU Core:	I cant afford to sponsor a sandbox
[16:46]	Jonathan Yap:	Oskar thought it would be in 1.40
[16:46]	Andrew Linden:	Falcon is finding and fixing bugs now. I think more have popped up than he expected.
[16:46]	Andrew Linden:	He was too zealous about optimizations in a few places
[16:46]	Latif Khalifa:	with the amount of sl content out there, i am ot surprised
[16:46]	Andrew Linden:	broke VolumeDetect all over.
[16:46]	Latif Khalifa:	hehe
[16:46]	Latif Khalifa:	do you plan to get some havok7 sandbox regions on aditi?
[16:46]	s Key	doesn't need to be wound yet
[16:47]	CPU Core:	she looks like she does need winding
[16:47]	CPU Core:	nvm :)
[16:47]	Andrew Linden:	The Havok7 regions won't show up until we deploy 1.40 to aditi, I think.
[16:47]	Xugu Madison	raises an eyebrow
[16:47]	Liisa Runo:	you broke volumedetect? tell us more, should we be worried?
[16:48]	Erinyse Planer	pulls on the key, dragging the poor doll all over the place.
[16:49]	Latif Khalifa:	hm... considering how physics engine updates tend to break stuff, and especially with the amount of changes to ground vehicles Falcon described, perhaps having an early havo7 region would be befinitial
[16:49]	Erinyse Planer	tries turning the key in the wrong direction.
[16:49]	Arawn Spitteler	rubs the key with a soft cloth, shining it, as a nice gesture.
[16:50]	Erinyse Planer:	and no simon im NOT giving names
[16:50]	Erinyse Planer	pulls the doll in closely, giving it a kiss on the forehead.
[16:50]	Andrew Linden:	He already fixed VolumeDetect again.
[16:50]	Simon Linden:	Yeah, we had a lot of testing for the Havok 4 change ... this isn't nearly as big, but more testing would be good
[16:50]	Liisa Runo:	about SVC-1253: What ever you do with damage, i dont care, LL damage system been a joke since day 1. But if you fiddle with it, _make sure we still have a way to keep avatar completely phantom_. This is very important to huge amount of content, vehicles, teleporters, seats, and the list goes on and on. Dont break tons of content just to get the crappy damage system working. Anyone who want fair combat in SL uses resident made damage thingies anyway, not LL damage.
[16:50]	users sitting	on prims, which are set to phantom are not affected by damage.
[16:50]	Xugu Madison:	You can play with my key once the meeting is over :)
[16:50]	Techwolf Lupindo:	They say H1 was the best. H4 broke a lot of content.
[16:51]
[16:51]	Latif Khalifa:	h4 crashes a lot less though ;)
[16:51]	Xugu Madison:	They say H1 is best because they were used to the bugs. H4 was a lot stabler...
[16:51]	Simon Linden:	It was really easy to crash a sim with H1
[16:51]	Arawn Spitteler:	Could we have the Luna Dore Trulley tested, in Aditi?
[16:52]	Liisa Runo:	still really easy to crash a sim, takes only 1 prim
[16:52]	Andrew Linden:	Arawn, yes it would probably be possible to get special content up on Havok7 when the time comes.
[16:52]	Andrew Linden:	The person to talk to about that would be Oskar Linden, I think.
[16:52]	Arawn Spitteler:	Rails and Roads have to be tested adross boundaries.
[16:53]	Arawn Spitteler:	There aren't a lot of trains running, in world.
[16:53]	Arawn Spitteler:	It's been a while, since sim-crossings have been a problem, fo r the Luna Dore Trolley
[16:53]	And the	doll gets a mallet and waits for the next person to mess with her keys:)
[16:54]	Andrew Linden:	Falcon and I were talking about some ideas on how to fix some of the problems on region crossings.
[16:54]	Andrew Linden:	I don't think we could get that stuff into 1.40 though.
[16:54]	Xugu Madison	wonders how megaprims are doing...
[16:54]	Andrew Linden:	I wanted to do a sprint on region crossings, but I think I'm going to try to sprint on some teleport bugs next week first, then try region crossings.
[16:55]	Arawn Spitteler:	It's been a challenge for some time, but the Luna Trolley just doesnt' quite reach the sim crosing
[16:55]	Andrew Linden:	Whatever I get done now won't get into 1.38 anyway. The door for changes there is closing very soon
[16:55]	Andrew Linden:	only stuff that has passed QA can get in. The untested queue is all for 1.40 or later.
[16:55]	Latif Khalifa:	any progress on sim freezes for 1.38?
[16:56]	Liisa Runo:	Babbage said that "partial fix" goes to 1.38
[16:56]	Arawn Spitteler:	Is H7 even ready for 1.40?
[16:56]	Andrew Linden:	yeah babbage has a partial fix already done. I think Simon is working on another possible partial fix
[16:57]	Simon Linden:	I've been wokring on attachments slowing things down when arriving in a region
[16:57]	Erinyse Planer:	nice. any luck so far?
[16:57]	Latif Khalifa:	needs to be timesliced to hell :P or threaded, pick your poison xD
[16:58]	Andrew Linden:	Latif wins the prize. I think Simon is looking into threading fixes.
[16:58]	Latif Khalifa:	I still think there is more to it than just sripts. Regions progressivelly slow down and freezes get longer and longer with uptime
[16:59]	Liisa Runo:	we still have ghost scripts?
[16:59]	Simon Linden:	That one has been a mystery ... we definitely can notice that effect, but I don't know if anyone has a good theory yet about why it gets slowly worse
[16:59]	Andrew Linden:	Besides memory fragmentation Simon? I thought that theory explained some of it.
[17:00]	Erinyse Planer:	okay all. i gotta bail. good seeing yall again. ty simon and andrew for as always a great office hour
[17:00]	Latif Khalifa:	some hard to trace resource leak? memory fragmentation (alloc taking longer and longer)?
[17:00]	Simon Linden:	FWIW we just brought up some of the Meadowbrook Linden Homes, so there are a few available right now
[17:00]	Xugu Madison:	See ya Erinyse!
[17:00]	Andrew Linden:	Bye Erinyse.
[17:00]	CPU Core:	bye Erinyse
[17:00]	Simon Linden:	Bye
[17:00]	Jonathan Yap:	Bye Erinyse
[17:00]	Latif Khalifa:	Simon, thanks, me goes grabs one :)
[17:00]	Rex Cronon:	tc
[17:00]	Andrew Linden:	Yup, time to wrap it up. I think I'm supposed to go drinking.;
[17:00]	Latif Khalifa:	mmm
[17:01]	Liisa Runo:	if mainland goes offline, dont try to fix the methods used to close the mainland, there is 4 different methods, more easy to fix the perms exploit, and mainland stays online
[17:01]	Simon Linden:	Thanks everyone for coming
[17:01]	Ardy Lay:	Andrew, don't kill the braincells we are using.
[17:01]	Latif Khalifa:	thank you for your time Simon and Andrew :)
[17:01]	Xugu Madison:	Thanks for hosting Simon & Andrew
[17:01]	Jonathan Yap:	take care Simon & Andrew
[17:01]	Xugu Madison:	the key is now back on, for the bored..
[17:01]	Rex Cronon:	tc everybody
[17:01]	Xugu Madison:	You too Rex!
[17:02]	Simon Linden:	Bye
[17:02]	Andrew Linden:	Thanks for coming everyone.

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