User:Azwaldo Villota/CHAT LOG: Wave Users (Dec19)

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Event: Second Life Wave Users Meet-Up
Date: Dec 19, 2009

This document contains text chat recorded from users who acknowledged permission.

Wave links and other information can be found at this event announcement.
Section Index headings were added for reference, since times were not recorded. (Next time!)

Chat log

Section Index 1
Azwaldo Villota: test log
Mystical Demina: i hear you good
Azwaldo Villota: on first chatting users are prompted to allow logging of voice chat
Azwaldo Villota: the device is saving text with colorizing tags for each user (i hope); for posting later
LOM Runner: it will post in the wave?
LOM Runner: oh, I got it
Dharivs Hax: Azwaldo, I guess the logger works against a PHP script
Azwaldo Villota: Thank you jfor coming everyone
Azwaldo Villota: we are listening to Mystical Demina in voice, does anyone not have ability to hear voice?
Morgaine Dinova: Is this the same talk as announced here?
Morgaine Dinova: [17:43] Azwaldo Villota: I was encouraged to announce the following here: Google Wave users are meeting in world tomorrow at 11 AM SLT to discuss the potential in integrating XMPP with SL applications. Please contact me for a notecard if you are interested. (This is NOT a Google promotion.)
Section Index 2
LOM Runner: lost mine
Opensource Obscure: I don't : |
Dharivs Hax: oops sorry, I always have it turned off
Opensource Obscure: yeah morgaine
Morgaine Dinova: Azwaldo -- is this the same talk as you announced for 11am SLT?
Dharivs Hax: I'm in
Azwaldo Villota: Morgaine, glad you could be here. This is a separate part of this event; the XMPP Discussion will be in 48 minutes (roughly, as I imagine one will blend into the other)
Opensource Obscure: ( oops )
Morgaine Dinova: Aha, thanks
Morgaine Dinova: It's white on white
Royer Pessoa: yeah, kinda transparent
Royer Pessoa: gotit
Mystical Demina: xrts bevanwhitfield
Section Index 3
Morgaine Dinova: Hint -- make bots multi-coloured, then it doesn't matter what colour the backgbround is :-)
Mystical Demina: [10:17] Enki Wonder: Received: xrts bevanwhitfield from Mystical Demina [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield NOW - Uthango Virtual Africa benefit - live music until 7PM SL (more on Dec 20
Section Index 4
Mystical Demina: nsible Virtual Worlds Workshop #secondlife #virtualworlds 12/18/2009 2:16:53 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield Mobile internet to eat world, apparently - Attack of the 50-foot MID 12/18/2009 2:06:05 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield Engineering in Virtual Worlds - #secondlife 12/18/2009 1:55:02 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield Virtual Worlds Value Proposition #virtualworlds 12/18/2009 1:51:28 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield The Latest Educational Trend is Social Media #education #secondlife #sled 12/18/2009 1:46:00 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield Virtual Worlds, Simulations, and Games for Education: A Unifying View #virtualworlds 12/18/2009 1:43:54 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield (WSJ) How the Internet Came of Age and Changed Our Lives for Good 12/18/2009 1:28:04 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield 6:00 pm SLT - Economist Dean Baker author of Plunder and Blunder @Virtually Speaking #secondlife 12/17/200
Section Index 5
Mystical Demina: :04 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield 6:00 pm SLT - Economist Dean Baker author of Plunder and Blunder @Virtually Speaking #secondlife 12/17/2009 8:56:34 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield This Train for Success "powerpoint karaoke" is hysterical fun! 12/17/2009 12:59:59 PM [10:17] Enki Wonder: BevanWhitfield Dec 13 9:30AM PST Tools.jam: Extreme Reality
Section Index 6
Morgaine Dinova: Mystical: the benefit to web-2.0 sites is easy to see. What's the benefit for SL users though?
Morgaine Dinova: Mystical: but using LL's IM interface is a *disadvantage*, surely.
Morgaine Dinova: Mysti is bugged
Morgaine Dinova: Mysti seems to be running ALICE
LOM Runner: ok
Morgaine Dinova: I didn't say the commandline was a disadvantage --- done well, the commandline is hugely powerful. But the viewer's IM line is hugely crappy, that's the problem.
Dzonatas Sol: how about instead of a slurl, use a wave based query to rez objects... instead of a slurl returned, return a object that can be rezzed. very general idea, but basically my curiosity
Dzonatas Sol: incremental builds
Flimsey Freenote: excuse me work calls
Section Index 7
Azwaldo Villota: glad you could make it, Flimsey
Morgaine Dinova: One of the problems with LL's IM line is that it's not a rich stream, which is why it needs URL parsing for example, and can't transfer objects by UUI. Replacing the plain text by an XML stream (eg. XMPP) would remove those limitations.
LOM Runner: so augmented reality. Can I use SL as my GUI for smart-grid
Dzonatas Sol: there are 'wiki builders' that allow the builder to edit structures like objects, i think since the wiki-style objects tools could be used in a wave interface. it's a fuzzy idea without the actual wiki-architecture being demonstrated to find if ideas get inspired
Morgaine Dinova: Yep, as Azwaldo says, that's the "we need more than plain text" argument
LOM Runner: I never used sketch-up, so is it similar to wiki-tree
Morgaine Dinova: What worries me is when people talk about ADDING more stuff to the existing viewer. What's needed is to DECOUPLE subsystems from the viewer, which would be much more powerful and less of a monolithic disaster.
Section Index 8
LOM Runner: that would be completely replace the commuication box with wave
LOM Runner: using the llmedia variable?
Dzonatas Sol: MediaPlugin just renders to a texture or plays sounds, for now. It could be expanded to more than that.
Dzonatas Sol: Gtk can be rendered to a texture, and then the texture shown in-world, but there is no key-events being captured to make the texture usable like one would directly use gtk.
Morgaine Dinova: I think people are confusing world integration and client integration. If you can integrate other "worlds" (including the 2D "worlds" of web-2.0) into SL then everyone in the world can benefit, but if all you're doing is making web-2.0 stuff appear in your viewer then very little is being achieved.
Azwaldo Villota:
Morgaine Dinova: Azwaldo: that's client integration, not world integration. All it does is let a SINGLE client at a time to participate in the wave. If does not allow various people present in the SL environment to contribute to the wave. It's very weak.
Section Index 9
LOM Runner: if you want to blip someone in particular from the wave, isn't that the same as sending a private IM in-world?
Dzonatas Sol: /me hints at AWG chatter about scalable group talk. I doubt "group" chat and "group" can stay in the same context.
Dzonatas Sol: "group" chat and "group" wave
Dharivs Hax: yes
Zen Paine: Mystical your mic is way too close to you
Zen Paine: please back up from it a few inches
Morgaine Dinova: Azwaldo: I'm interested in that too --- the Wave concept is very powerful (unlike the Google implementation in the browser, which is dreadful). I'm hoping that Wave can be integrated in a powerful way, not superficially one person at a time.
Zen Paine: oh not mystical, sorry whoever was talking last.
LOM Runner: hi
Section Index 10
Thinkerer Melville: Using wave in separate browser will let us find out more about what we want for integration
LOM Runner: Oh that was me
Azwaldo Villota: i may have just lost voice
Azwaldo Villota: relog
Morgaine Dinova: Mystical -- got a list of use cases somewhere? I'd be very interested in what ideas are around so far.
Thinkerer Melville: I favor using wave in parallel (separate window) for exploration of what we can do.
Dzonatas Sol: I can see a LLMediaPlug that puts the dropin wave-chat to a texture would be good. When someone types in the local chat or on the web, the texture gets updated.
Morgaine Dinova: Mystical: talking about disaster planning, I bet that radio amateurs would have a disaster response angle too -- they're always active in that, as hit the news in Katrina.
Section Index 11
Omei Turnbull: I'm using the built in media object as a dynamic display. It is working now, bit I don't know for how long.
Zen Paine: who had just talked before Mystical?
Thinkerer Melville: in cairo?
Zen Paine: For some reason voice isn't picking up which avatar that is. I need to turn the volume down.
Morgaine Dinova: Somebody's got their mic on, and it's echoing Mystical
Zen Paine: who's talking right now?
Dharivs Hax: Zen, LOM is talking
Zen Paine: LOM thanks
Zen Paine: I'm doing the audio recording for the event, sorry for the bother.
LOM Runner: it's ok
Thinkerer Melville: The United States Department of State to host panel discussion for international audience: Architectural Design and International Collaboration in Virtual Worlds
Section Index 12
Dzonatas Sol: Indeed, being able to take a copy of a prim with a wave-context attached and pass it on would be a great social network builder
Thinkerer Melville:
Morgaine Dinova: Thanks Mystical, good talk :-)
Dharivs Hax: Thanks Mystical
Dzonatas Sol: Right now we hand out notecards as the main market tool (besides XSL), the next one is to join groups, but there is limits on groups that make notecards better than groups. I can see how a wave-context enabled prim would be even a better usecase solution. Pass out the prim like the notecard, and be able to chat like in group.
LOM Runner: good idea
Dzonatas Sol: /me notes chat would be thread limited instead of how global chat works now)
LOM Runner: so first, we can replace the group limit with wave is the fist objective?
Section Index 13
LOM Runner: first*
Dzonatas Sol: /me whispers to LOM that it wouldn't replace group limit, but it would be a use-case for marketing that want to avoid that limit
Morgaine Dinova: Are we meant to be seeing something?
Morgaine Dinova: "The display" meaning the SL-screen-like thing with the bridge shjowing on it, right?
Royer Pessoa: /find omei
Royer Pessoa: /find off
CodeWarrior Carling: click play morgaine
CodeWarrior Carling: yes Dahlia
Morgaine Dinova: Oh! It's video, lol. You said "land stream", nobody mentioned video, lol
Dahlia Trimble: voice here?
Dharivs Hax: Indeed it's a HTTP texture, isn't it?
Dahlia Trimble: video? I'm using linux, no videl :(
Section Index 14
Dharivs Hax: Dahlia, try it, it is not a video
CodeWarrior Carling: it's not a video stream.. it's a web page media stream
Morgaine Dinova: Dahlia: works on Imprudence on 32-bit Linux. You'll probably be toast on 64-bit though
Dharivs Hax: I'm on linux too
Dzonatas Sol: I see the text when i camera close enough
CodeWarrior Carling: the little image on the play button looks different
Charlette Proto: ha another great Linux thing
Azwaldo Villota: remote channel 9283
Azwaldo Villota: Omei's object is monitoring remote channel 9283
Dahlia Trimble: i see some text on a board
Omei Turnbull:!w%2BwLoEZs_6B.1
Dzonatas Sol: ty
Section Index 15
Morgaine Dinova: Dahlia: I think that's all it is, the text on the board.
Dahlia Trimble: is that from a wave? is there a url for it?
Dzonatas Sol: I just tried that link and it gave me :
Charlette Proto: I can't see the content in wave yet - ah diff URL?
Dharivs Hax: can somebody give the URL, please?
CodeWarrior Carling: didn
CodeWarrior Carling: t see the link spammed
Dzonatas Sol: I suppose I need to be logged in to wave?
Azwaldo Villota: Quick Event Survey
Azwaldo Villota: Please respond in Public Chat with a "V" if you use voice in SL; please respond with "NV" if you do not use voice
Charlette Proto: says my account hasn't been activated for Google Wave, but I'm looking at two Waves, my own and the Integration one
Section Index 16
Dharivs Hax: V
Royer Pessoa: V
Royer Pessoa: I cant enter anything in the wave
Charlette Proto: but the URL you gave is incomplete
Morgaine Dinova: I can see the wave in the browser, but it doesn't allow me to reply.
hynesyte Harbour: NV
CodeWarrior Carling: what is the link for the wave?
Dharivs Hax: good one
Dahlia Trimble: voice isnt working for me and I don't know the wave url :(
Dharivs Hax:!w%2BwLoEZs_6B
LOM Runner: having problems having SL and wave open at once. will be upgrading my speed
Dharivs Hax: that's the URL
Dzonatas Sol: Sorry, I'm still getting " Google Wave is currently in a limited preview. Request an invitation. "
Section Index 17
Mystical Demina: what is the wave title again?
Charlette Proto: could we stick to discussion inworld for now?
Dzonatas Sol: "wave connected to second life"
Dharivs Hax: "Wave connected to Second Life"
Omei Turnbull: Wave connected to Second Life
Charlette Proto: I don't think so
LOM Runner: I can't reply on the wave
Mystical Demina: weird, i can find it in search
Morgaine Dinova: How does one reply to the public wave? The Reply button does nothing, and you can't click on people's contributions. I think it's Public but read-only
Thinkerer Melville: paste it again
Omei Turnbull:!w%2BwLoEZs_6B
Dahlia Trimble: ok I have the wave but it wont len me post anything
Section Index 18
LOM Runner: having same problem Morgane
Dharivs Hax: by the way, it works
Morgaine Dinova: Omei, how did you write to the wave from the browser end?
Dharivs Hax: ok Omei, thanks
Azwaldo Villota: Dzonatas, I can send an invite to you if you have a Gmail account
Charlette Proto: BTW if anyone is interested in Wave incorporating 3D (reverse scenario I suppose) please read and contribute to!w%2BXfIgCTq6A
Dzonatas Sol: Even going to "" gives me the " Google Wave is currently in a limited preview. Request an invitation. "... sooo.... I think it is just coincidence
Dzonatas Sol:
Omei Turnbull: Do you have a Wave account, Dzon?
Dzonatas Sol: not yet, sorry
Section Index 19
Azwaldo Villota: Dzonatas, it take some time for Google to send the invite
Graham Mills: I can issue a Private Reply only
Dharivs Hax: I think that if Wave allowed to "impersonate" accounts like in e-mail, it would allow a better integration
Charlette Proto: OK it works for me
Dzonatas Sol: ah ok, misunderstood public
Mystical Demina: do i havew to have Omei in my contacts to see his public waves?
Dharivs Hax: no, you don't, mystical
Morgaine Dinova: Dahlia, how did you add yourself to the wave?
Dharivs Hax: if you search "with:public wave connected second life" you can see and reply the wave
Mystical Demina: i don't see it when i search
Dharivs Hax: did you try with "with:public" keyword, Mystical?
Section Index 20
Royer Pessoa: we can see the wave... can someone add me in it?
Mystical Demina: ooh have to use the search in the nagivation
Azwaldo Villota:,minimized:contact,restored:search:with%3Apublic wave connected to second life,!w%2BwLoEZs_6B
Mystical Demina: oh, actualy i just see what i typed as a search title
Azwaldo Villota: that URL should open the Wave client
Dharivs Hax: Royer, you are in
LOM Runner: the link you posted worked for me
Charlette Proto: yup i was able to find it and it is like other waves except I can't post to it
Mystical Demina: when i use that URL i get New Wave link in the right
Charlette Proto: the URL works
Section Index 21
Graham Mills: Agreed -- worked for me
LOM Runner: but I can't reply to the wav
Charlette Proto: same here LOM
Charlette Proto: can't edit or post
Charlette Proto: yes
LOM Runner: right
Charlette Proto: I did
Dharivs Hax: mmmm try refreshing wave
Charlette Proto: volume please
Royer Pessoa: Omei, I think when you give everyone acces to the wave it's only at that time... so try doing it again to integrate all
Charlette Proto: you overloading really bad
Zen Paine: whoever that is please turn your mic down
Charlette Proto: OMG
Zen Paine: You're completely incomprehensable.
Section Index 22
Royer Pessoa: TOO HIGH
Morgaine Dinova: LOM, you're unintelligible as overloaded
LOM Runner: sorry
Zen Paine: It was like Donald Duck in a blender
Dharivs Hax: lol zen
Mystical Demina: maybe someone can add me as contact to the wave,
LOM Runner: lol
Dharivs Hax: you are in, Mystical
Mystical Demina: oooh i see it now
Dharivs Hax: nice
Azwaldo Villota: is anyone here NOT listening to the Voice conversation?
Morgaine Dinova: Well any implementation of Wave that is different to Google's in-browser one would be an improvement. A team of blindfold monkeys would probably do better.
Dharivs Hax: it's a preview, so they are testing "usability" beyond its geeky minds
Section Index 23
Charlette Proto: hehe Morgaine
Dharivs Hax: their*
Morgaine Dinova: Dharivs: I think they're testign our patience more than usability
Charlette Proto: but I kind of agree, the linear presentation of Wave isn't an innovation in comms
Dharivs Hax: Morgaine: that is usability too haha
Royer Pessoa: lol
Morgaine Dinova: :-)
Dzonatas Sol: Is it possible now to use google app to act as a gateway from a prim to a wave context such that the prim would not need an "invite" or any session based login info to gather current context?
Zen Paine: it's suddenly very quiet.
Zen Paine: Did we lose voice over here or is it actually quiet?
Dharivs Hax: it is quiet
Morgaine Dinova: Dharivs' voice light isn't even lighting up, it's so quiet
Section Index 24
Dharivs Hax: indeed, I just listen :)
Morgaine Dinova: Pity that LL hasn't head of Automatic Gain Control
Dharivs Hax: how did the image appeared?
Dharivs Hax: haha azwaldo, are you testing HTML injection?
Dzonatas Sol: So, it does sound like you could go from in-world to google as it is now, and back, from google to in-world. In other words, the robot could display (text only) here instead of only using /channel to post
Dharivs Hax: it losts all previous text, I guess it can work as a "prompter"
Dzonatas Sol: Ah, but it's displaying it graphically for now through parcel media, while I meant through chat like with llSay. Sorry for that confuion.
Azwaldo Villota: Hello everyone, Welcome if you have just arrived. We are using voice AND public chat, and we are looking at a demonstration using parcel media. If you see the Sunset image, that is the Parcel Media Display (click play)
Section Index 25
Charlette Proto: all I get on your media screen is "Bipping in wave"
Dahlia Trimble: no voice for me at all, could be on my end
Dharivs Hax: did you try to stop and start again the media, charlette?
Dzonatas Sol: Ok. I ask because from a marketing standpoint I doubt having to login to wave is going to be seen as lucrative, but the robot would solve that and make it lucrative again.
Azwaldo Villota: Charlette: toggling Parcel Media clears much of the document
Azwaldo Villota: Dahlia, I am hearing Omei
Charlette Proto: ah thanks
Mystical Demina: pretty cool
Morgaine Dinova: Link didn't get through :-)
Maggie Darwin: Unfortunately I missed the Wave ID
Morgaine Dinova: Maggie:,minimized:contact,restored:search:with%3Apublic wave connected to second life,!w%2BwLoEZs_6B
Section Index 26
Maggie Darwin: Thanks
Azwaldo Villota: Maggie: effectively, we are seeing an HTML document in world (parcel media), the content being submitted in a Google Wave wave
Dahlia Trimble: sorry I can't get voice to work at all so I'm not going to stick around. If anyone is interested in integrating XMPP with *any* SL viewer, please contact me or take a peek at
Morgaine Dinova: Not quite "whiteboard", but it's worth noting that Google has just open-sourced Etherpad.
Charlette Proto: Azwaldo, I guess Wave contributions (once they work) could be brought inworld as chat as an alternative to SLIM, is that correct?
Dahlia Trimble: /me waves and poofs... happy holidays all :)
Mystical Demina: cya dahlia!
Morgaine Dinova: Merry Xmas Dahlia :-)
Section Index 27
Charlette Proto: I'm thinking of Wave as a bridge to Second Lifeâ„¢
Charlette Proto: the way AjaxLife and SLIM can communicate with Second Lifeâ„¢ users from outside
Charlette Proto: eg using a Droid (Android) or similar low bandwidth means
Zen Paine: voice go out?
Dharivs Hax: it is an interesting idea
Dharivs Hax: anyway, Wave is a bit heavyweight already for mobile devices
Charlette Proto: sorry but I can't hear Azwaldo any more, yet some chat noises are getting through
Azwaldo Villota: Does anyone here have recent news or murmurings about the development of true HTML on a prim?
Dzonatas Sol: It would be heavyweight for prims, too, yet the robot being demonstrated here is one step to solve that.
LOM Runner: It can be limited to 5-10 msgs at a time or something for smartphones
Section Index 28
CodeWarrior Carling: mobile devices are rapidly developing more lifting capacity.. and Google is converging themselves into being a mobile oriented company
Charlette Proto: Wave client is too heavy for mobile devices? isn't it just a web page
Charlette Proto: typing in chat
Charlette Proto: sorry I was confused by silence
CodeWarrior Carling: it seems to me they have developed wave entirely around the idea that mobile devices will be able to take part in it. if not now.. then within the next few years
Dharivs Hax: Charlette: a heavy one :) even the first days of the preview was hard to load it in a PC
Charlette Proto: OK, I didn't realise, but I've never experienced it
Maggie Darwin: I see charlette in public chat
Charlette Proto: yeah I've been asking questions in Second Lifeâ„¢ Local Chat
Section Index 29
Omei Turnbull: Interesting. I don't.
LOM Runner: I can't run wave and SL too well. My computer is runninghard
Maggie Darwin: [11:42] Charlette Proto: Wave client is too heavy for mobile devices? isn't it just a web page [11:42] Charlette Proto: typing in chat [11:43] Charlette Proto: sorry I was confused by silence
Thinkerer Melville: char has glitches
Graham Mills: I'm interested in using it alongside a "serious game" in SL without entering SL/managing avatars etc, giving students the opportunity to theorise on what the current status might mean going forward, etc. Maybe influencing the development as well
Charlette Proto: maybe we are not in the same chat space - the 10m distance
Maggie Darwin: I pasted them
Dzonatas Sol: I mentioned wiki-architecture fuzzy ideas earlier: here is a URL (movie) to watch later to understand this more:
Section Index 30
wilson Huckleberry: lag
Royer Pessoa: dont try to run Wave inside SL.. they crash.
Charlette Proto: I'll step forward a bit
Royer Pessoa: use external browser
Morgaine Dinova: !It could be SL --- Time Dilation is dropping to 0.7 or so.
Graham Mills: @Dzon, yes
Azwaldo Villota:
LOM Runner: no, I'm in google chrome, but still having problems
Charlette Proto: I'm following the wave, actually 3 waves
Azwaldo Villota:
Maggie Darwin: Now there's a surpise.
Graham Mills:
Section Index 31
Dharivs Hax: I think my mic doesn't work, lol
Graham Mills: Just repeating
Charlette Proto: the split screen while a natural solution seems to be a bit limiting especially for portable devices
Graham Mills: Good point @Charlette
Graham Mills: Separate app?
Charlette Proto: but I understand a tabbed layout could improve the use of screen real estate
Dharivs Hax: what about the timeline layout?
Charlette Proto: have you considered collapsable outlines for Wave presentation, I think Wave should use something for 'overview' of larger Waves
Dharivs Hax: yes
Charlette Proto: collapsable outlines seem a natural choice to me
Dharivs Hax: instead of a tabbed interface, as said by charlette
Section Index 32
Dharivs Hax: it seems more natural to have mixed in a timeline both public chat and wave
Dharivs Hax: I know that nowadays it would be hard to implement
Maggie Darwin: "Hide all replies" is supposed to do something like that; apparently still broken in Wave
Dharivs Hax: (and sorry I would say it in voice but my mic is broken :P)
Dzonatas Sol: CYGWIN: Darwin: Linux:
Dzonatas Sol: sorry, wrong window
Mystical Demina: take care guys, need to to run
Morgaine Dinova: Cyu Mystical
Section Index 33
Thinkerer Melville: collapsable outlines in wave would be very valuable to writers
Dharivs Hax: nice to meet you, Mystical
Azwaldo Villota: cheers Myst
Mystical Demina: same here
Graham Mills: Is there a repository of gadgets like that mindmap tool? Guess I'm so new to all this
Azwaldo Villota: I plan to review my chat log, probably several times, and will be likely to comment further myself in the Second Life Wave Users Meet-Up
Omei Turnbull: What mindmap tool are you referring to?
Charlette Proto: my first impressions of Wave immediately focused me on the fact that the linear page is very limited for content overview
Azwaldo Villota: I will also look for the ongoing discussion at this wave "Wave-SL integration" (linked from the Meet-Up wave)
Section Index 34
Omei Turnbull: That's more a limitation of the Wave client, as opposed to Wave infrastructure.
Dharivs Hax: ok azwaldo
Graham Mills: At the end of the original wave
Thinkerer Melville: I am using wave to make a briefing
Thinkerer Melville: in collaboration
Azwaldo Villota: Meet-Up wave link is in the Event Info notecard if you have that; if you do NOT have the NC please holler "Gimme" now and i will pass it to you
Morgaine Dinova: If I didn't know that the underlying model of Wave is so powerful, I'd be totally dismissing it as a pile of crap based on the browser implementation. Wouldn't be here :-) But the model is quite exceptional.
Thinkerer Melville: Collapsable outline would be great
Morgaine Dinova: It can onloy get better :-)
Section Index 35
LOM Runner: Gimme
Dharivs Hax: It can only get better as long as third parties can develop over it and interact with wave main server
Maggie Darwin: May I conclude the dearth of Wave invites has abated? I have bunches.
Azwaldo Villota: Morgaine: my impression is that - as an alpha release - Google has nudged this into our laps to say "here, see what YOU can do with this"
Omei Turnbull: I agree totally, Morhaine
Dharivs Hax: I agree, Azwaldo
Charlette Proto: I also see a lot of room for alternate UI in Wave - a 3D tree of threads paradigm
wilson Huckleberry: Azwaldo going back to your split screen and mobile devices
Graham Mills: Thanks for organising this, Az, Omei, everone
Charlette Proto: if anyone is interested in Wave incorporating 3D (reverse scenario I suppose) please also read and contribute to!w%2BXfIgCTq6A
Section Index 36
Graham Mills: 'fraid I have to go
wilson Huckleberry: video could be in the background and the updated text could be inlayed @ 50% tranparency
Charlette Proto: this is true Azwaldo; Google expect user development and we can't treat the current state as public release, but I see what Morgaine is concerned about too
Morgaine Dinova: Dzon gave a lovely use case at the start of this talk, I hope it doesn't get lost --- being able to give out objects in-world, which are Wave endpoints that people can use to join a wave.
Maggie Darwin: Project Wonderland (another VW implementation, open-source Java) Information Center in SL:
Charlette Proto: what about the Local Chat integration for inworld use?
wilson Huckleberry: instead of beginning and endpoint of a wave and a wave branch out like a tree ?
Section Index 37
Morgaine Dinova: Maggie: are the PW people talking about Wave integration at all?
Maggie Darwin: Yes.
Morgaine Dinova: Cool!
Charlette Proto: Wave has a binary tree structure but linear display wilson
Maggie Darwin: Of course, PW has full-blown shared browser capability
Morgaine Dinova: Wave doesn't need to have a linear display, that's just the browser making it appear so
wilson Huckleberry: layers?
Azwaldo Villota: I want to encourage everyone to stay tuned to either of the waves: Wave-SL integration and Second Life Wave Users Meet-Up
Charlette Proto: tree like threads is what I feel 3D presentation of Wave would acomplish in the best way
Thinkerer Melville: Can show alternative organisations?
Section Index 38
Azwaldo Villota: There are several SL rezidents who - if they had been here - are likely to have much to contribute to the dialog
Maggie Darwin: <-- shows Wave HTML interface in PW
wilson Huckleberry: weaved
Morgaine Dinova: Azwaldo -- it's too painful. You'd be better off using Jabber.
Omei Turnbull: I'll have to check out PW.
Charlette Proto: BTW - does anyone have a contact inside Google or know what their attitude is to the Second Lifeâ„¢ bridge
Azwaldo Villota: Maggie, is that a Screenshot of the Wave client?
Maggie Darwin: Omei: Hop over to and check out the slides
Morgaine Dinova: I'm in
Maggie Darwin: It's just a shared Firefox with a Wvae loaded.
Section Index 39
Omei Turnbull: Does it use a custom media plugin?
Royer Pessoa: thats firefox in Wonderland.
Morgaine Dinova: Jabber is at least 1,000 times as fast as Wave in the browser ...
Charlette Proto: just asking about Google attitude because Google Earth/SL connection as a metaverse wasn't well received at Google
Akeeba Tomorrow: If this has been answered already, just let me know, but I'm confused as to why folks in Second Life would need to use Google Wave within Second Life? Thanks.
Morgaine Dinova: Charlette: that means they haven't figured out how to sell advertising in SL yet :-)
Charlette Proto: to connect to people outsude and collaborate Akeeba
Maggie Darwin: Google Earth probably wants to focus on RL Earth/Moon/Mars
Maggie Darwin: Google Maps not so much
Section Index 40
Charlette Proto: haha Morgaine
Dharivs Hax: Charlette: and they had its own metaverse but it was a fail
Maggie Darwin: I was able to build
Charlette Proto: Google were in dev for Lively then, but the attitude to Second Lifeâ„¢ may have changed since they failed with that so badly
Akeeba Tomorrow: Charlette, why would someone want to use SL to connect and collaborate with folks "outside" SL? I'm just curious.
Dharivs Hax: I agree with Morgaine, they didn't know how to make revenue from SL
Charlette Proto: to design etc Akeeba, 3D paradigm has lots of advantages, but Second Lifeâ„¢ documentation is very poor
Charlette Proto: basically collaboration in Second Lifeâ„¢ isn't sufficient to document design and its process
Section Index 41
Maggie Darwin: Ah! Grace Hopper finally showed up!
Maggie Darwin: Google isn;t done with 3D....
Morgaine Dinova: We've been discussing in AW Groupies many different integration mechanisms, and one idea that popped up was to allow each group owner to specify a group comms service to use, defaulting to LL's group IM service. IRC and Jabber services are clear candidates for that, but so is Wave.
Azwaldo Villota: Thank you, all of you, for showing up and for being patient with the event. If you are curious what the result is...I HAVE LEARNED THE MOST!
Azwaldo Villota: hehe
Charlette Proto: there are other concerns relating to security etc, but OpenSim servers using Second Lifeâ„¢ technology can address those shortcomings
Morgaine Dinova: Charlette
Dzonatas Sol: Yes i do think the ability to attach a wave-context to a prim is a unique idea, especiall if the wave-thread splits as each copy is made. Then ultimately, the end-points become the tree that point back to the main context. That would solve many scalable issues where context is mainly one-way (or where corrsepondence doesn't need to be sent to everybody at once in full duplex). Being sent to just the thread means the splits will limit the wave-context to just that "branch" and not the entire tree unless really needed for some odd reason.
Section Index 42
Charlette Proto: thanks Azwaldo, I feel the meeting was productive despite some tech teething along the way
Azwaldo Villota: i am now going to begin to help set up the musical entertainment; if you have not experienced the ALL OUT GLAMFEST that is Friendly Fire...Please turn on your music in a few minutes, and join me on the dancefloor. I need to cut loose.
Omei Turnbull: Yes, kudos to Azwaldo for putting this together!
Dharivs Hax: Thanks Azwaldo
Azwaldo Villota: (No need to leave, just watch out for my flying elbows)
Dzonatas Sol: Thank you Azwaldo and Omei for the presentation.
Morgaine Dinova: What Charlette is saying is that we don't have to wait for Linden Lab to do things server side, which can take years. The Opensim platform can be evolved as required, and fast.
Maggie Darwin: Thanks Azwaldo
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Case Munro: woot Azwaldo!
Morgaine Dinova: Good event Azwaldo, thanks :-)
Ajay McDowwll: YOu're welcome to grab a ride on my chim, Azwaldo -- left hip :)
wilson Huckleberry: great job az
Dharivs Hax: I must leave, nice to meet you all and I hope to meet again in some interesting wave-sl integration
Dharivs Hax: bye!
Ajay McDowwll: Key there, Krakov!
Morgaine Dinova: Cyu Dhar
Krakov Letov: hey :)
Azwaldo Villota: Show will start at 12:30 SLT, Bottom of this hour
Morgaine Dinova: Who's playing?
Charlette Proto: precisely Morgaine, there may be issues with logging alternative viewers too and the fact that Waves open comms to permanent record outside LL servers, unlike inworld comms
Section Index 44
Krakov Letov: hey mac :)
Krakov Letov: ill come back in 10 min
MacKenzie Rasmuson: hey krakov!
Ajay McDowwll: see ya then, Krakov :)
Morgaine Dinova: Hah, I'll change outfit and sit next to Santa :P
Morgaine Dinova: Oh, Santa's leavingm bah
MacKenzie Rasmuson: Bah humbug!
wilson Huckleberry: no im not
wilson Huckleberry: i would miss this for the world
wilson Huckleberry: wouldnt
Charlette Proto: BYEE everyone - bed time for me (the sun is up again) but enjoy the show and have some fun on my behalf too
Morgaine Dinova: Cyu Charlette, tc :-)
Charlette Proto: keep good and keep Waving when you can't sleep
Section Index 45
MacKenzie Rasmuson: Hehehehehehe!