User:Babbage Linden/Office Hours/2008 10 01

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Transcript of Babbage Linden's office hours:

[8:19] Cale Flanagan: oh i smell him:)

[8:19] Twisted Laws: yeah

[8:19] Nock Forager: :)

[8:19] Nock Forager: Hi Babbage

[8:19] Babbage Linden: sorry i'm late

[8:20] Babbage Linden: hi all

[8:20] Babbage Linden: i'm using SL over wifi from JAOO

[8:20] Fake Fitzgerald: hi Babbage

[8:20] Cale Flanagan: hi, coffee trouble?:)

[8:20] Babbage Linden: and needed to steel a PSU from someone before i could run SL

[8:20] Twisted Laws: cool

[8:20] Cale Flanagan: not steel, organize

[8:21] Babbage Linden: how are things?

[8:21] Babbage Linden: (i'm actually a bit out of the loop having spent the last few days at a conference with no laptop power)

[8:21] Babbage Linden: at least here

[8:22] Babbage Linden: it looks like 1.24.7 has been rolled out

[8:22] Twisted Laws: you got voice on, babbage?

[8:22] Babbage Linden: which contains a fix for touching with the 1.21. viewer

[8:22] Twisted Laws: garbled noises

[8:22] Babbage Linden: no, no voice

[8:22] Babbage Linden: let me turn it off in preferences though

[8:22] Babbage Linden: that better?

[8:22] Twisted Laws: might speed up now on wifi :) yes

[8:23] Babbage Linden: ok, good

[8:23] Babbage Linden: thanks for the tip

[8:23] Babbage Linden: so, we were hoping that we wouldn't need 1.24.7

[8:23] Twisted Laws: /btw, i'm a sandbox scripter and just here to listen to what happens in this meeting. all is well with me.

[8:23] Babbage Linden: and that we could fix the remaining mono bugs in 1.22

[8:24] Babbage Linden: sorry 1.25

[8:24] Babbage Linden: are there any outstanding bugs that any of you think we need to fix more urgently?

[8:25] Nock Forager: I'm not sure it is related to them but since last rolling restart I saw SIM FPS dropping sometime.

[8:26] Nock Forager: for while. in some unrelated regions.

[8:26] Babbage Linden: i think there was an issue where our security fixes confused some bots

[8:27] Babbage Linden: that may have been what you were seeing

[8:27] Babbage Linden: which ended up spamming regions

[8:27] Nock Forager: hmhm

[8:27] Babbage Linden: if you find a simple repro please let us know

[8:27] Nock Forager: Yes I will.

[8:27] Nock Forager: thanks

[8:27] Babbage Linden: thanks for that

[8:28] Babbage Linden: i got your invitation too nock

[8:28] Nock Forager: ah :)

[8:28] Babbage Linden: i'll check my schedule when i get back home

[8:28] Nock Forager: I forgot to mention about timezone difference bitween UK and Japan.

[8:29] Babbage Linden: one issue that we're aware of is that our mono updates have caused problems with some opensim lsl extensions

[8:30] Babbage Linden: which is a symptom of opensim and linden extending scripting independently

[8:30] Twisted Laws: but their scripts are server side only anyway

[8:30] Babbage Linden: i've been talking to tedd maa and melanie milland about the future of scripting unofficially

[8:31] Babbage Linden: and talking internally about how we can start talking officially about the future of scripting

[8:31] Hidenori Glushenko: interesting

[8:31] Babbage Linden: the last thing i want to see is the two platforms diverging needlessly

[8:31] Babbage Linden: i'd like to see the steering wheels stay the same

[8:31] Babbage Linden: even if the engines underneath are different

[8:32] Twisted Laws: :)

[8:32] Babbage Linden: so hopefully we can sort out a process to talk about these things

[8:32] Babbage Linden: it's becoming more important with us starting to think about c#

[8:32] Babbage Linden: which we both have an interface for

[8:32] Babbage Linden: but we haven't made our interface public yet

[8:33] Babbage Linden: which makes it particularly hard for the interfaces to be compatible

[8:33] Babbage Linden: it's slow progress, but hopefully we can make our c# interface public ahead of making it available

[8:33] Babbage Linden: so we can at least discuss it in the open

[8:34] Babbage Linden: and talk about how to make it compatible

[8:34] Cale Flanagan: babbage, i put the topscript-thingie now into a jira entry, which u can catch if u wanto (svc-3140)

[8:34] Babbage Linden: before we do all the work needed to support c#

[8:34] Babbage Linden: great, thanks cale

[8:34] Twisted Laws: good thinking :)

[8:35] Babbage Linden: i will do a triage with periapse when i'm back in blighty

[8:35] Babbage Linden: to see where were are and what needs doing next

[8:36] Babbage Linden: so, that's where i think we are at the moment

[8:36] Babbage Linden: i will have more news next week when i get back

[8:36] Arawn Spitteler: How different is C# from C++? I've only had an intro course in the latter

[8:36] Babbage Linden: and have a chance to go through the issues

[8:37] Babbage Linden: c# is very close to Java

[8:37] Twisted Laws: easier to learn as a new language arawn

[8:37] Babbage Linden: simpler than C++

[8:37] Babbage Linden: but with some of the same concepts

[8:37] Babbage Linden: classes, objects, inheritance, composition etc

[8:37] Arawn Spitteler: I never got a handle on the User Defined Libraries

[8:37] Babbage Linden: plus some useful basic features missing from lsl like arrays

[8:38] Arawn Spitteler: So, if we're playing frequently, with Position and Rotation, we should be able to make our own data type?

[8:39] Cale Flanagan: are there pointers in c# (i am c man:) ) ?

[8:39] Babbage Linden: arawn, yes, you might want to make a class called LinkedPrim which keeps track of the linked prim index

[8:39] Babbage Linden: and passes it to llSetLinked* functions

[8:40] Babbage Linden: or you might want to make a RemotePrim object which defines a SetPosition method and remembers a chat channel

[8:40] Babbage Linden: which it uses to send messages to a Remote scripted object

[8:40] Arawn Spitteler: It's usually Primatars getting juggled, but LinkedPrim would also include the prim's current link number

[8:41] Babbage Linden: so your script can just call methods on an object

[8:41] Babbage Linden: instead of having to send messages an build strings

[8:41] Twisted Laws: / sounds excellent :) 2 months, 6 months, .... ?

[8:41] Babbage Linden: which is done by the RemotePrim class

[8:41] Babbage Linden: or whatever

[8:42] Babbage Linden: well, my team is working on a stability project next

[8:42] Babbage Linden: which will probably take until the end of the year

[8:42] Babbage Linden: and also we need to get a new version of our server os

[8:42] Babbage Linden: to get us a newer version of mono

[8:42] Babbage Linden: then we can start on it

[8:42] Babbage Linden: hopefully early next year

[8:43] Babbage Linden: and get it done by next summer

[8:43] Arawn Spitteler: Andrew's playing with 64 bit servers, if that's what you mean

[8:43] Babbage Linden: but we haven't decided on this yet

[8:43] Babbage Linden: yes, part of the reason that the os upgrade is taking a while

[8:43] Babbage Linden: is that we're moving the simulator to be a 64 bit app at the same time

[8:44] Babbage Linden: currently it's a 32 bit app on a 64 bit host

[8:44] Twisted Laws: understand, it would be great tho but i also wonder what will happen to servers when really powerful scripts/programs get to run on them.

[8:44] Arawn Spitteler: Is there a Wiki, on 64 v 32 bit apps?

[8:44] Babbage Linden: which works, but adds complications

[8:45] Babbage Linden: you can probably find stuff on it on wikipedia

[8:45] Babbage Linden: it's an implementation detail really

[8:45] Arawn Spitteler: Last night, someone had a script malfunction, that had llResetSCript() as the first command of state_entry()

[8:45] Babbage Linden: but moving everything to 64 bit will make development easier

[8:45] Babbage Linden: oh? what happened arawn? is it in jira?

[8:46] Arawn Spitteler just thinks that's a powerful application, that might test the system: It was just mentioned in a NCI Scripters debug session

[8:47] Arawn Spitteler: It might be interesting, to see how that script would lag a sim

[8:47] Babbage Linden: yes

[8:47] Babbage Linden: it should work in theory

[8:47] Babbage Linden: but it might be a strange edge case

[8:48] Arawn Spitteler: Noirmal sort of bug.

[8:48] Nock Forager: I wonder Script time is what standing for especially in such heavy load situatinon.

[8:50] Nock Forager: it seems showing different depend on situatioin.

[8:50] Babbage Linden: it sounds like we need to look in to it

[8:50] Babbage Linden: there are a number of issues which talk about strange script time

[8:50] Babbage Linden: we need to check it's reporting the correct times

[8:51] Babbage Linden: to find out whether the bug is in the scripts or in the measuring tools

[8:51] Babbage Linden: ok, i've had the PSU i borrowed stolen back

[8:51] Nock Forager: hehe

[8:51] Babbage Linden: and people are packing up here

[8:52] Cale Flanagan: maybe we get a profiler for scripts? (i know im dreaming)

[8:52] Babbage Linden: so i'm going to have to go

[8:52] Babbage Linden: thanks again for coming everyone

[8:52] Nock Forager: have a safe trip!!

[8:52] Arawn Spitteler: Does anyone know, how to find the instructions for adding Mono to legacy Clients?

[8:52] Twisted Laws: bye, have fun!

[8:52] Babbage Linden: and hopefully i'll see you all with power and a wired net connection next week

[8:53] Babbage Linden: bye

[8:53] Babbage Linden: thanks everyone

[8:53] Fake Fitzgerald: bye

[8:53] Cale Flanagan: bye