User:Benjamin Linden/Office Hours/2007 May 24

Transcript of Benjamin Linden's office hours:

[10:07]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	have you seen Mr Linden?
[10:07]	Wyn Galbraith:	I didn't notice that. I'll have to go in and see.
[10:07]	Wyn Galbraith:	No Benjamin yet.
[10:07]	Rex Cronon:	look out he is behind u:)
[10:07]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	Ok. Thankyou for your time :)
[10:07]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	eh?
[10:07]	Benjamin Linden:	good morning everyone
[10:07]	Rex Cronon:	hello
[10:07]	Wyn Galbraith:	np
[10:07]	Wyn Galbraith:	Goodmorning Bejamin.
[10:07]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	hello
[10:07]	Wyn Galbraith adds a n to that.
[10:07]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	Hope you don't mind me dropping in :)
[10:07]	Benjamin Linden:	is this sim really laggy for everyone else?
[10:07]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	Yes
[10:07]	Wyn Galbraith:	I'm fine.
[10:07]	Rex Cronon:	for me it is
[10:07]	Benjamin Linden:	I'm getting 1-2 fps. I'm going to relog, brb
[10:07]	-- End of Log ---
[10:07]	Sloog HUD v0.2: Sloog HUD active, listening to Benjamin Linden
[10:07]	OmniPhaze v1.5.5:	Main Systems initialized.
[10:07]	OmniPhaze v1.5.5:	Controls initialized.
[10:07]	OmniPhaze v1.5.5:	Main Systems initialized.
[10:07]	Sloog HUD v0.2: You're currently running the newest version
[10:07]	OmniPhaze v1.5.5:	Checking for Updates...
[10:07]	OmniPhaze v1.5.5:	OmniPhaze is Up to date
[10:07]	Wyn Galbraith comes in on DSL from SF bay area through Earthlink.
[10:08]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	wb
[10:08]	Wyn Galbraith:	Wb.
[10:08]	Rex Cronon:	u very close to the source wyn:)
[10:08]	Rex Cronon:	wb
[10:08]	Wyn Galbraith:	Depends on if Benjamin is in the SF office.
[10:08]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	well i'm getting red bars here too
[10:09]	Alpha Zaius:	Im not
[10:09]	Benjamin Linden:	this is still really bad for me but I don't think it's the sim
[10:09]	Rex Cronon:	i see script errors
[10:09]	Benjamin Linden:	well I'll just have to deal with it! :-)
[10:09]	Wyn Galbraith:	Are you in the SF office Benjamin?
[10:09]	Alpha Zaius:	I see dead scripts
[10:09]	Benjamin Linden:	no I'm in Seattle
[10:09]	Wyn Galbraith:	Better than seeing dead people
[10:09]	Alpha Zaius:	yes, much better
[10:09]	Rex Cronon:	are they moving:)
[10:09]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	Sorry to appear somewhat noobish but are you all SL developers?
[10:09]	Wyn Galbraith:	So maybe I'm fine because I am closer.
[10:10]	Benjamin Linden:	I'm just going to sit here because it willtake all day to walk over there :-)
[10:10]	Alpha Zaius:	I wonder if LL ever thought about incorporating live lindex data in the UI.. like a dialog with graphs and such
[10:10]	Rex Cronon:	that depends of what u mean by "sl developers"
[10:10]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	hmm...
[10:10]	Alpha Zaius looks at Benhamin
[10:10]	Alpha Zaius:	Benjamin :P
[10:11]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	perhaps you maintain the grid?
[10:11]	Benjamin Linden:	that's an interesting idea Alpha
[10:11]	Benjamin Linden:	would it be for informational purposes or do you trade on th elindex?
[10:11]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	pure self interest :)
[10:11]	Alpha Zaius:	and you can sell L$ in the GUI as well, instead of opening a browser
[10:12]	Alpha Zaius:	both, really :P
[10:12]	Alpha Zaius:	Im a statistics monkey
[10:12]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, I do think that would be good to have
[10:12]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	Kind of like a linden stock exchange?
[10:12]	Benjamin Linden:	you'd love chatting with our datamining team , Alpha
[10:12]	Alpha Zaius:	you have a datamining team? :P
[10:13]	Alpha Zaius:	I didnt know that :P
[10:13]	Benjamin Linden:	sure do!
[10:13]	Alpha Zaius:	Squirl, check out secondlife.com/currency
[10:13]	Alpha Zaius:	you can purchase L$ with USD and sell your L$ for USD
[10:13]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	GBP ;)
[10:13]	Alpha Zaius:	you can use paypal to convert
[10:14]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	on that note I think i'll leave you be!
[10:14]	Squirrelytiger Chengpang:	cheerio all!
[10:14]	Alpha Zaius:	later
[10:14]	Rex Cronon:	bye
[10:14]	Benjamin Linden:	cya!
[10:14]	Benjamin Linden:	guys I'm really sorry, I don't think this is going to be a productive conversation with my viewer issues
[10:15]	Benjamin Linden:	how about I just open up the floor to questions and we can have a short session today
[10:15]	Wyn Galbraith ponders becoming a data miner.
[10:15]	Alpha Zaius:	that must be a fun job, especially if you like math and stats
[10:15]	Rex Cronon:	ok i have request
[10:15]	Benjamin Linden:	sure, go ahead Rex
[10:15]	Wyn Galbraith loves researching.
[10:16]	Rex Cronon:	please don't bring the history window from beta to maingrid
[10:16]	Alpha Zaius:	I have to agree with that
[10:16]	Rex Cronon:	is tooooo big
[10:16]	Alpha Zaius:	its confusing
[10:16]	Alpha Zaius:	and big
[10:16]	Benjamin Linden:	are you talking about the new chat window?
[10:16]	Alpha Zaius:	the communicate window
[10:17]	Rex Cronon:	when u click on history button the history window shows up
[10:17]	Benjamin Linden:	right
[10:17]	Benjamin Linden:	Rex, can you elaborate a little more when you say it's confusing?
[10:17]	Rex Cronon:	it takes toooo much space on the screen
[10:18]	Alpha Zaius:	I was the one that said it was confusing.. especially the friends list part.
[10:18]	Rex Cronon:	i didn't say is confussing, alpha said that
[10:18]	Benjamin Linden:	oh sorry!
[10:18]	Benjamin Linden:	this lag is killing me ! :-)
[10:18]	Alpha Zaius:	Im having bad lag as well
[10:18]	Rex Cronon:	and why does it a textfield in it?
[10:19]	Benjamin Linden:	so I'll make a full disclosure here. I designed the new communicate window. the idea we had was to consolidate several redundant windows
[10:19]	Benjamin Linden:	freinds, groups, im, history
[10:19]	Benjamin Linden:	and include the new voice chat functions
[10:19]	Benjamin Linden:	sor calling firneds and groups
[10:19]	Rex Cronon:	u endup with two textfields that do the same thing, the one in history takes extra space
[10:19]	Benjamin Linden:	yikes sorry
[10:19]	Alpha Zaius:	Its a good idea
[10:19]	Benjamin Linden:	for calling friends and groups
[10:19]	Alpha Zaius:	it just needs tweaking
[10:19]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, I'd love to hear your feedback
[10:20]	Benjamin Linden:	I haven't seen the latest version since it's been built
[10:20]	Benjamin Linden:	sounds like it might be too large for one thing
[10:20]	Alpha Zaius:	it is big, and the "IM / Call" button gives you the IM window, but there is no information on voice yet
[10:20]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, that's the danger of using beta products :-)
[10:20]	Benjamin Linden:	the voice stuff hasn't been built in yet
[10:20]	Benjamin Linden:	there will be a call button on the IM window that opens
[10:20]	Benjamin Linden:	it will let you initiate a voice call with your friend
[10:21]	Alpha Zaius:	I think it would be better if you avoid using the buttons, and maybe incorporate a drop down list, or icons
[10:21]	Benjamin Linden:	hey Khamon
[10:21]	Alpha Zaius:	I dunno
[10:21]	Khamon Fate:	hallo
[10:21]	Benjamin Linden:	which buttons Alpha
[10:21]	Alpha Zaius:	on the friends tab
[10:21]	Alpha Zaius:	there is a set of buttons on the right
[10:21]	Benjamin Linden:	the ones on the right-hand side?
[10:21]	Alpha Zaius:	it seems redundant to select, then click what you want to do
[10:22]	Benjamin Linden:	doubleclicking should initiate an action
[10:22]	Benjamin Linden:	I think it opens a chat window
[10:22]	Rex Cronon:	i just like the history window to be very clean, no extra buttons, no additional frams
[10:22]	Benjamin Linden:	or should
[10:22]	Rex Cronon:	frames*
[10:22]	Alpha Zaius:	maybe use a right click menu on the list items
[10:23]	Alpha Zaius:	just get rid of the buttons, I have to agree it needs to be more simplistic
[10:23]	Benjamin Linden:	Rex, you can still "tear-out" the history window if you'd like
[10:23]	Alpha Zaius:	double click does the default IM action
[10:23]	Rex Cronon:	no i can't i tried that
[10:23]	Benjamin Linden:	hmm, that should work
[10:23]	Benjamin Linden:	I'll need to go look at the latest build
[10:23]	Alpha Zaius:	right click will give you more advanced stuff: profile, show on map, offer teleport, voice call
[10:23]	Benjamin Linden:	I know there's still a lot to be done
[10:24]	Benjamin Linden:	in fact I think the latest version was so buggy it would crash if you left the window open
[10:24]	Benjamin Linden:	so clearly it's a work in progress :-)
[10:24]	Rex Cronon:	i usually like to open the history windwo on the right side of the screen, at full height
[10:24]	Alpha Zaius:	lol
[10:24]	Wyn Galbraith:	I do that too.
[10:24]	Benjamin Linden:	Rex, I'll make sure the tear-off function works
[10:24]	Benjamin Linden:	that's definitely suppose to be there
[10:25]	Benjamin Linden:	interesting that you put your history over there
[10:25]	Benjamin Linden:	where do you put your inventory?
[10:25]	Alpha Zaius:	ooh, you know what would be cool? on the far left of your screen, incorporate a small dragger that will let you scroll through chat as well
[10:25]	Wyn Galbraith:	Under the history window.
[10:25]	Rex Cronon:	i shrink the height of the history:)
[10:25]	Rex Cronon:	:)
[10:25]	Wyn Galbraith:	Overlapping so I can switch back and forth.
[10:25]	Benjamin Linden:	so that they stack?
[10:25]	Benjamin Linden:	oh I see
[10:25]	Wyn Galbraith nods.
[10:25]	Rex Cronon:	and overlapping too:)
[10:26]	Benjamin Linden:	we're working on a ability to "dock" windows to the side
[10:26]	Benjamin Linden:	so that they don't overlap with the world view
[10:26]	Alpha Zaius:	oh nice
[10:26]	Benjamin Linden:	it wounds like that would work well with the way you use the windows
[10:26]	Wyn Galbraith:	From doing so many classes, I have the build window on the left, IM's across the top, History and Inventory open full hight overlapping on the right.
[10:26]	Rex Cronon:	not really
[10:26]	Rex Cronon:	now the history is semitrapsparent, so i can see through it
[10:26]	Wyn Galbraith:	Center of the screen is open.
[10:27]	Alpha Zaius:	making a dock/tab system, like in visual studio
[10:27]	Benjamin Linden:	how loarge is your monitor Wyn? :-)
[10:27]	Alpha Zaius:	and sorta lke photoshop
[10:27]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, Alpha
[10:27]	Alpha Zaius:	:D
[10:27]	Benjamin Linden:	like VS
[10:28]	Benjamin Linden:	so I'd like to hear more about the communicate window
[10:28]	Benjamin Linden:	have others used it besides Rex and Alpha?
[10:29]	Khamon Fate:	how do we access it?
[10:29]	Alpha Zaius:	its on beta
[10:29]	Benjamin Linden:	it's in the beta viewer
[10:29]	Benjamin Linden:	for the beta grid
[10:29]	Rex Cronon:	benjamin u ever read what peole post on the blogs?
[10:29]	Benjamin Linden:	I try to when I have time
[10:29]	Benjamin Linden:	but there are lots of comments :-)
[10:30]	Khamon Fate:	oh, i'll have a look next time i'm there. i only ever just talk to people directly in beta
[10:30]	Benjamin Linden:	is there discussion there about the new window?
[10:30]	Rex Cronon:	i know
[10:30]	Rex Cronon:	i think i have seen there some people making comments about it
[10:31]	Benjamin Linden:	ok I'll check that out after this meeting
[10:31]	Benjamin Linden:	Alpha, back to your comment that the firneds window is too complicated
[10:31]	Benjamin Linden:	*friends
[10:32]	Benjamin Linden:	do you think it's more complicated than the current window?
[10:32]	Alpha Zaius:	Try to make the entire thing one column
[10:32]	Benjamin Linden:	current friends I mean
[10:32]	Benjamin Linden:	what do you mean, one column?
[10:32]	Alpha Zaius:	on the beta grid, its set up in two columns
[10:33]	Alpha Zaius:	the left has a list of friends, and the right is a verticle tower of buttons
[10:33]	Benjamin Linden:	you mean the list of friends and then the buttons?
[10:33]	Benjamin Linden:	and this is confusing?
[10:34]	Rex Cronon:	if u really want to see what people think about the interface, u could make a new blog entry asking that, and allow more than 100 comments. i really think that it won't hurt trying this at least once
[10:34]	Alpha Zaius:	no, its not confusing really.. I chose my words wrong.. It doesnt feel right when I use it. I guess Im used to that
[10:34]	Wyn Galbraith:	Sorry Benjamin, RL interruptus. It's a 14" tablet pc.
[10:35]	Benjamin Linden:	wow I'm impressed you fit all that on a 14" screen, Wyn
[10:35]	Benjamin Linden:	Rex, I've considered that
[10:35]	Alpha Zaius:	I would like to get rid of the buttons, and use right click menus
[10:35]	Benjamin Linden:	but I'm not sure the responses would be manageable
[10:35]	Benjamin Linden:	there was a similar discussion on sldev (the developer's mailing list)
[10:35]	Rex Cronon:	try it at least once, lets see what will happen:)
[10:36]	Wyn Galbraith squeezes them as skinny as she can get them. "I tend to operate my systems with a lot of windows arranged around the screen. Do that with SL as well."
[10:36]	Benjamin Linden:	so Alpha, you think it's just that you're used to the buttons being on the bottom?
[10:37]	Alpha Zaius:	well, yea, and I never use those buttons
[10:37]	Benjamin Linden:	Rex, I've been planning to do an intro on the blog so maybe I'll request feedback then
[10:37]	Benjamin Linden:	maybe you don't use them because they're at the bottom :-)
[10:37]	Alpha Zaius:	I actually offer teleport by double clicking their name to open the profile
[10:37]	Alpha Zaius:	and then offer
[10:38]	Rex Cronon:	ok
[10:38]	Alpha Zaius:	I dunno why
[10:38]	Alpha Zaius:	but Im an old user, Im used to the good old days
[10:38]	Benjamin Linden:	we are creatures of habit
[10:38]	Benjamin Linden:	I do the same thing; I learn a particular way and stick with it even if it's not the most efficient
[10:38]	Alpha Zaius:	I would love a right click menu, just like an operating system
[10:39]	Benjamin Linden:	yes, I agree
[10:39]	Alpha Zaius:	instead of buttons
[10:39]	Alpha Zaius:	or do both
[10:39]	Rex Cronon:	ohh, and for title use something like "do u really care how SL looks like? if u do, than your input is required!" :)
[10:39]	Benjamin Linden:	there are many places we should have context menus
[10:39]	Alpha Zaius:	I just wont use the buttons :P
[10:39]	Benjamin Linden:	lol @ Rex
[10:39]	Benjamin Linden:	that's great input Alpha
[10:40]	Benjamin Linden:	have you guys played with Voice much?
[10:40]	Alpha Zaius:	I have, I love it :P
[10:40]	Rex Cronon:	voice not good for me. eats more badwidth:(
[10:41]	Benjamin Linden:	what kind of connection are you running on Rex?
[10:41]	Benjamin Linden:	glad to hear it Alpha
[10:41]	Alpha Zaius:	I have to run off, good talking to you :)
[10:41]	Rex Cronon:	dsl
[10:41]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks for stopping by, Alpha
[10:41]	Benjamin Linden:	I appreciate your feedback
[10:42]	Benjamin Linden:	DSL should support voice ok, Rex
[10:42]	Benjamin Linden:	but it's thought to know your particular situation
[10:42]	Wyn Galbraith gave you Wyn Galbraith's normal screen arrangement_001.
[10:42]	Benjamin Linden:	thought=tought
[10:43]	Benjamin Linden:	tought=though
[10:43]	Wyn Galbraith:	I'll go check out beta later.
[10:43]	Benjamin Linden:	though=tough
[10:43]	Benjamin Linden:	jeeze!
[10:43]	Benjamin Linden:	I can't type
[10:43]	Benjamin Linden:	thanks for the screenshot Wyn
[10:43]	Wyn Galbraith:	Np. One picture you know...
[10:44]	Benjamin Linden:	I do want to get a more formal user research program going, so we can better understand how people use the program
[10:44]	Rex Cronon:	i don't really belive that there is a person that never made a typo:)
[10:44]	Benjamin Linden:	arrange their screens, etc.
[10:44]	Benjamin Linden:	so you use bubble chat Wyn?
[10:44]	Wyn Galbraith:	I'm a software tester in RL what specializes in the user end of things, so I'd be happy to be part of the user test. Yes I do.
[10:45]	Wyn Galbraith:	Sometimes it's quicker. I use History if I miss something.
[10:45]	Rex Cronon:	i really don't like bubbles
[10:45]	Wyn Galbraith:	And in a crowd you have an idea who's saying what.
[10:45]	Benjamin Linden:	there have been some thoughts for improving bubble chat
[10:45]	Rex Cronon:	gets very confusing who is saying what
[10:45]	Wyn Galbraith was more confused reading History.
[10:45]	Wyn Galbraith:	They fade away pretty quickly.
[10:46]	Benjamin Linden:	this is what makes designing UI so tricky - everyone has their own way of doing things :-)
[10:46]	Rex Cronon:	each bubble should have the name of the user that it belong to
[10:46]	Benjamin Linden:	I think it does Rex
[10:46]	Benjamin Linden:	hi Lobo
[10:46]	Wyn Galbraith:	It does.
[10:46]	lobo123p Boa:	hi dale/hola dale
[10:46]	lobo123p Boa:	hi/hola
[10:47]	Wyn Galbraith:	Hola, Hello ;)
[10:47]	Rex Cronon:	oh it does?
[10:47]	lobo123p Boa:	quen habla español
[10:47]	Rex Cronon:	hi
[10:47]	Benjamin Linden:	ok guys I think I'm goingto wrap this up a little early
[10:47]	Benjamin Linden:	I need to troubleshoot why I'm getting 1fps
[10:47]	lobo123p Boa:	what happens?
[10:48]	Benjamin Linden:	I really appreciate everyone's time and feedback, as always
[10:48]	lobo123p Boa:	ok
[10:48]	lobo123p Boa:	bye
[10:48]	Rex Cronon:	i have 1.1 fps, is that really better?
[10:48]	Wyn Galbraith shakes her head, "No, en pico entendo. Thanks Benjamin.
[10:49]	Benjamin Linden:	have a great weekend everybody. see you next Tuesday!
[10:49]	Rex Cronon:	bye
[10:49]	Wyn Galbraith:	You too. Seatle is a nice place.