User:Benjamin Linden/Office Hours/2008-08-21

Transcript of Benjamin Linden's office hours:

[15:04]	Grant Linden:	today Rheta Shan agreed to present her winning design from Dusan Writer's contest to design a "newbie-friendly" version of the Second Life client.
[15:04]	Erica Linden:	yay
[15:04]	Kippie Friedkin:	awesome!
[15:04]	Dakota Schwade:	Ah, I saw that.
[15:05]	Rheta Shan:	Srry, all, I’m on rather flaky connection — eveyrthing si still rezzing :)
[15:05]	Grant Linden:	We ahve been very excited about the contest and it has been great to see such interest
[15:06]	Lars Donardson:	oops..the flake has just poofed
[15:06]	Jacek Antonelli:	Hi Mudflap the Mighty!
[15:06]	Squirrel Wood:	[15:06] Male AO *Shapes by Kira*: Could not find animation 'standing_13'.
[15:07]	Charlette Proto:	oops AO problems here
[15:07]	Grant Linden:	I think Ben might be in meetings today, not sure if he will make it today
[15:07]	Squirrel Wood:	please fix your ao by editing the configuration and removing the missing animations
[15:07]	Rheta Shan:	Grant has asked me to present my entry to Dusan Writer’s User interface Contest tonight. You can find that entry on my blog (http://rhetasworld.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/big-makeover.pdf) ; Dusan also has been an absolute sweetheart and turned my rather lame presentation before the judges into a cute Flash mock-up (http://www.dusanwriter.com/contests/ui_winner.html).
[15:07]	devon Lemon:	hi
[15:07]	Charlette Proto:	just turn it off, we are talking noob again I yhink anyway
[15:08]	Grant Linden:	I loved that mock up
[15:08]	devon Lemon:	hi all
[15:08]	Rheta Shan:	LOL
[15:08]	Rheta Shan:	Lag hell
[15:08]	Charlette Proto:	that is not a sim but your end I think
[15:08]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehe welcome to ben's office :)
[15:09]	Jacek Antonelli:	Office usability FAIL xD
[15:09]	Grant Linden:	what inspired your approach, Rheta?
[15:09]	Rheta Shan:	Absolutely my end. Underpowered laptop, bad connection :)
[15:10]	Rheta Shan:	So I’ll aplogise right away for anyfurther accidents :)
[15:10]	Rheta Shan:	My approach ?
[15:10]	Grant Linden:	for thos who just arrived, Rheta is presenting her winning contest design at (http://www.dusanwriter.com/contests/ui_winner.html).
[15:10]	Charlette Proto:	AO
[15:10]	Rheta Shan:	When i started to think about the question Dusan put to us, i.e., how to create a viewer UI that would be more intuitive to new users than the current one is, I put the following question first : **what** do we interface with exactly.
[15:11]	Rheta Shan:	The answer is : a world.
[15:11]	Rheta Shan:	And the challenge is to give new entrants into this world both the tools to get to grips with it, and to sharpen their awareness of what they are interfacing with.
[15:11]	Charlette Proto:	SL web browser is just great uhg
[15:11]	Rheta Shan:	So muhc for the abstract part making me look as if I knew what i am talking about :)
[15:11]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:12]	Rheta Shan:	Basically, I have tried to turn my major handicap into a strength, viz. that i couldn’t code a line of software for the life of me.
[15:12]	Grant Linden is in that camp as well
[15:12]	Rheta Shan:	Which means I could not think about what you can really *do* with the client in software term, and had to focus instead on what I *would like the software to do* in usage terms.
[15:13]	Grant Linden:	the design is very elegant
[15:14]	Rheta Shan:	Thank you.
[15:14]	Kippie Friedkin:	That's actually a rather refreshing way of approaching UI...not stifling creativity by focusing on the limitations on the technology-side.
[15:14]	Rheta Shan:	Or astuopid one, but the only one I could avail myself of :)
[15:14]	Rheta Shan:	I have tried to keep in mind what the current client *can* do, though :)
[15:15]	Rheta Shan:	And I think you will find I do not propose anything that does not exist yet, feature wise.
[15:15]	Charlette Proto:	is this a viewer for newbies only? I just can't see how the rest of the UI features would be accessed in that
[15:16]	Rheta Shan:	The proposal is piecemal.
[15:16]	Rheta Shan:	The entry itself outliens the areas I have no mockups for.
[15:16]	Rheta Shan:	communication (chat, IM, and an inbox for off-line messages, group IMs etc., allowing for asynchronous reading)
[15:17]	Rheta Shan:	world browsers, basically entry points to what the world has to offer. From left to right : places (combines the places search with the map), events, people (combines people search and group search), marketplace (combines classifieds, search for objects on sale and land sales)
[15:17]	Rheta Shan:	personal browsers, basically your entry vector to the part of the world your avatar owns : looks (anything placed into outfit folders or in the body parts and clothing system folders), actions (animations, gestures, sounds, scripts), gallery (snapshots and textures, with visual browsing) and property (L$ balance including LindeX buy and sale and links to account history, land owned, objects)
[15:17]	Grant Linden:	what UI features are you thinking of that may not be able to be addressed?
[15:17]	Grant Linden:	for those who just arrived, Rheta is presenting her winning contest design at http://www.dusanwriter.com/contests/ui_winner.html .
[15:17]	Charlette Proto:	is this AO so important now???
[15:17]	Rheta Shan:	Also, teher would be more workbenches than the one shown
[15:17]	Rheta Shan:	Building. Terraforming. Appearance.
[15:18]	Rheta Shan:	And I never got aroudn to touhc the main menu or preferences,
[15:18]	Rheta Shan:	…which would not go away, of course.
[15:19]	Jacek Antonelli waves to @Malbers
[15:19]	Grant Linden:	hello Malbers
[15:19]	McCabe Maxsted:	ahoy malbers!
[15:19]	Kippie Friedkin:	Hi Malbers :)
[15:19]	Grant Linden:	Rheta is presenting her winning contest design at http://www.dusanwriter.com/contests/ui_winner.html .
[15:19]	Malbers Linden:	howdy all, sorry for being so late
[15:19]	Erica Linden:	Ribbit.
[15:19]	Rheta Shan:	Howdy :)
[15:20]	Dizzy Banjo:	here i need to go, you can take my seat Malbers.. not that you need one.. lol
[15:20]	Jacek Antonelli:	bye Dizzy
[15:20]	Malbers Linden:	thanks dizzy
[15:20]	Rheta Shan:	Bye, Dizzy :)
[15:20]	Charlette Proto:	no effort standing in SL haha
[15:20]	Kippie Friedkin:	Cya Dizzy
[15:20]	Grant Linden:	Rheta, did you consider having workbenches slide out in a manner similiar to the way the bottom navigation slides up?
[15:20]	Dizzy Banjo:	bai ! great design btw Rheta, congrats :)
[15:20]	Rheta Shan:	Ta a lot :)
[15:21]	Aimee Trescothick:	(Maybe ben should provide a tank for Malbers, as a regular?) :D
[15:21]	Malbers Linden:	i have been looking around at aquariums...
[15:21]	Charlette Proto:	I second the tank
[15:21]	Aimee Trescothick:	:)
[15:21]	Lars Donardson:	not a mentor friendly viewer..click on the icon that looks like..ummm...... but hopefully mentors would be needed less ...but personally I have issues with icons only navigation
[15:22]	Lars Donardson:	but that's pure personal pref
[15:22]	Aimee Trescothick:	tooltips?
[15:22]	Rheta Shan:	I am great fan of hints and help texts, but there was n o ime to outline thhat.
[15:22]	Charlette Proto:	you are kidding a newbie would have to hover over everything all the time
[15:22]	Rheta Shan:	One could also consider optionally captioning the cions, whica dvance users would be able to disable then.
[15:22]	Charlette Proto:	I wnt to school
[15:23]	Charlette Proto:	went
[15:23]	Grant Linden:	designing a new set of icons with tooltips is quite a task
[15:23]	Aimee Trescothick shrugs, just like most applications then :D
[15:23]	Rheta Shan:	Exactly.
[15:23]	Aimee Trescothick agrees with Rheta
[15:23]	Rheta Shan:	Keep in mind this is bits and pieces, please.
[15:23]	Lars Donardson:	that is always a battle symbol based icons vs text labelled ones...
[15:23]	Charlette Proto:	icons are just not enough
[15:23]	Rheta Shan:	I have designed most of this in two nights.
[15:24]	Charlette Proto:	no way find me a theory that would support that
[15:24]	Charlette Proto:	AO PLEASE
[15:24]	Aimee Trescothick nods, generally optional text is a good thing
[15:24]	Rheta Shan:	And toolbar options simply were beyond the scope of what I had time to do.
[15:24]	Grant Linden:	some users would have setting that used Icons only and others could choose text only or text and icons
[15:24]	Geneko Nemeth:	Icons need to be logical metaphors and recognizable.
[15:24]	Aimee Trescothick:	Iconic
[15:24]	Dakota Schwade:	And tool tips could be language localized easily, yes?
[15:24]	Rheta Shan:	But as I said, captioning permanently, as in Cocoa toolbars, would be a godow ay to solve this.
[15:24]	Lars Donardson:	that would be perfect Grant
[15:25]	Rheta Shan:	Exactly, Grant.
[15:25]	Aimee Trescothick:	yes, Cocoa is what I had in mind
[15:25]	Rheta Shan:	Nothing of what i propose is set in stone. especially not the aesthetic element.
[15:26]	Rheta Shan:	You will ahve noticed the icons are in fact dingbat smybols
[15:26]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehe
[15:26]	Rheta Shan:	which is simply due to me having neither the time nor the talent required to design real icons
[15:26]	Grant Linden:	I thought the treatment of the "walking" and "flying" indicators was interesting
[15:26]	Rheta Shan:	Thank you, Grant.
[15:27]	Grant Linden:	our movement UI is not terribly well thought out
[15:27]	Grant Linden:	users who are not gamers often find this a challenge
[15:27]	Rheta Shan:	I agree
[15:27]	Geneko Nemeth doubt if even gamers would find this initutive.
[15:28]	Rheta Shan:	I have no gaming background myself, and still fail at moving at tiems after over a year in SL.
[15:28]	Charlette Proto:	???
[15:28]	Lars Donardson:	huh???
[15:29]	Rheta Shan:	What I mean is that if you do not excercise this skill in 3D games, the whole thing never gets very intuitive, even after a time.
[15:29]	Rheta Shan:	At least to dorks like me, which are a growing part of the SL poulation :)
[15:29]	Dakota Schwade:	We're "pragmatists" -- the big guy said so.
[15:30]	Malbers Linden:	evan at that, few games have so many degrees of control for both avatar AND camera movement independently
[15:30]	Grant Linden:	if "dorks" means non technical and non gmaers, then yes that is our growing user base
[15:30]	Rheta Shan smiles
[15:30]	Rheta Shan:	Only talking of me :)
[15:30]	Gabby Panacek cops to being a dork :D
[15:30]	Rheta Shan:	…and Gabby :)
[15:30]	Rheta Shan giggles
[15:31]	Charlette Proto:	sorry but I know many housewives ets who have no trouble moving at all
[15:31]	Rheta Shan:	Of course there are.
[15:31]	Charlette Proto:	this is perhaps an exageration of the problem
[15:31]	Charlette Proto:	nothing simpler that using arrow keys???
[15:31]	Malbers Linden:	it can be learned but many future possible residents won't have that level of determination
[15:32]	Rheta Shan:	I don’t propose changing that.
[15:32]	Rheta Shan:	Arrow keys are fine.
[15:32]	Geneko Nemeth:	Well, many Korean / Japanese games are click to walk...
[15:32]	Lars Donardson:	has anyone checked the "other" virtual world - twincrappy - I found their approach by far worse
[15:33]	Rheta Shan:	Personally, I think both should be possible.
[15:33]	Charlette Proto:	precisely
[15:33]	Geneko Nemeth:	"Twincrappy"?
[15:33]	Lars Donardson:	Twinity
[15:33]	Rheta Shan:	Clikc « go here » and move with arrow keys.
[15:33]	Grant Linden:	I remember that I was most challenged when I had to follow a person in SL - having to "steer" myself and watch someone else took some learning the first week
[15:33]	Kippie Friedkin:	Yeah..I'm on Twinity
[15:33]	Gabby Panacek chuckles
[15:33]	Malbers Linden:	click to walk is interesting -- moving it to flying and camera control is hard
[15:33]	Rheta Shan nods
[15:33]	Kippie Friedkin:	But it's way harder to navigate there than it is in SL.
[15:33]	Lars Donardson:	exactly
[15:33]	Rheta Shan nods
[15:34]	Malbers Linden:	already so many damn modifier keys
[15:34]	Rheta Shan:	A follow function would be useful.
[15:34]	Charlette Proto:	point to poin navigation may be of some practical use but tht is an extra feature yet to be added to the interface
[15:34]	Geneko Nemeth:	Yay party!
[15:34]	Rheta Shan:	But I don’t advocate deprecating arrow movement.
[15:34]	Grant Linden:	a follow function that allowed for trees :)
[15:34]	Geneko Nemeth:	/no.
[15:34]	McCabe Maxsted:	(would like to hear what you think of https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/MISC-375 grant)
[15:34]	Rheta Shan:	LOL
[15:35]	Lars Donardson:	nooo follow function...I gots enuf stalkers already
[15:35]	Lars Donardson:	:D
[15:35]	Rheta Shan smiles
[15:35]	Malbers Linden thinks McCabes entire brain is embedded in JIRA -- in a good way
[15:35]	Lars Donardson:	follow avatar ONLY if orbiting gets allowed
[15:35]	Jacek Antonelli:	lol
[15:35]	Rheta Shan grins
[15:35]	Pier Jaecies:	invite to follow?
[15:35]	Grant Linden:	I think it would be handy, but I hcan just hear someone telling me how impossible it would be to code
[15:35]	Pier Jaecies:	like invite to teleport
[15:35]	Lars Donardson:	yup
[15:35]	Charlette Proto:	good idea
[15:36]	Malbers Linden:	hmmmmm... invite to follow
[15:36]	Rheta Shan:	Yes.
[15:36]	Lars Donardson:	that's acceptable
[15:36]	Charlette Proto:	but hardly important
[15:36]	McCabe Maxsted:	hehehe
[15:36]	Rheta Shan:	Which is why I didn’t propose anything along that lines.
[15:36]	Charlette Proto:	consider having to decline the idiots that would do it for a joke though
[15:36]	Rheta Shan:	There are no new functions in my proposal.
[15:37]	Rheta Shan:	Just a restructuring of the existing ones.
[15:37]	Lars Donardson:	I hope we haven't shelved the ideas of the franken-viewer yet - some of the ideas about inventory management are really desirable
[15:37]	Rheta Shan:	I agree.
[15:37]	Charlette Proto:	the user being followed should not be involved this way but rather invite the other to follw!!!!!!
[15:37]	Aimee Trescothick:	20 people and invite them all to follow could be fun
[15:37]	Charlette Proto:	follow
[15:37]	Grant Linden ponders lemmings
[15:37]	Aimee Trescothick:	especially if the last follows the first
[15:37]	Kippie Friedkin:	LOL
[15:37]	Rheta Shan giggles
[15:37]	Pier Jaecies:	lol
[15:37]	Charlette Proto:	sheep
[15:37]	Aimee Trescothick:	instant group hug
[15:37]	Charlette Proto:	great
[15:37]	Pier Jaecies:	pied piper
[15:38]	Charlette Proto:	love the hug
[15:38]	Gabby Panacek hands Aimee a flute
[15:38]	Charlette Proto:	did you see what I said about having to decline
[15:38]	Aimee Trescothick giggles thank you, I do play the flute :D
[15:38]	Charlette Proto:	consider the jokers trying to follow
[15:39]	Charlette Proto:	I'd be declining all day going by my experience
[15:39]	Lars Donardson:	what I like about your approach is the unobstrusiveness
[15:39]	Charlette Proto:	sorry
[15:39]	Charlette Proto:	as I said the leader has to invite not the other way around
[15:39]	McCabe Maxsted:	read the comments, charlette, but that's off topic anyway
[15:39]	Grant Linden:	I am just curious if the audience here thinks that two viewers - one for new people and one for advanced users sounds like a reasonable approach to the SL complexity challenge?
[15:40]	Rheta Shan:	Personally, I disagree.
[15:40]	Charlette Proto:	whae would you switch??
[15:40]	Geneko Nemeth:	Not really.
[15:40]	Charlette Proto:	when
[15:40]	Kippie Friedkin:	Perhaps a more modular Viewer if that is the direction thigns are heading..
[15:40]	Rheta Shan:	Exactyl, Charlette
[15:40]	Aimee Trescothick:	that's the thing, when do you make the jump?
[15:40]	Pier Jaecies:	i agree modular
[15:40]	Charlette Proto:	a skin perhaps
[15:40]	Lars Donardson:	yes...
[15:40]	Lars Donardson:	when building for example the priorities change dramatically
[15:40]	Aimee Trescothick:	and keeping the two in sync and not diverging could be a nightmare
[15:40]	Pier Jaecies:	like choosing levels of difficulty for a game
[15:40]	McCabe Maxsted:	I think there are too many things intertwined for it to be a realistic alternative
[15:40]	Charlette Proto:	or hide some functions as an option
[15:40]	Grant Linden loves asking questions like this
[15:41]	Dakota Schwade:	A single viewer, with a different kind of "advanced" mode perhaps?
[15:41]	Lars Donardson:	you need/want some stuff on your screen readily available
[15:41]	Kippie Friedkin:	ha
[15:41]	Rheta Shan:	I’m no great fan of that.
[15:41]	Charlette Proto:	yes
[15:41]	Rheta Shan:	Hiding.
[15:41]	Charlette Proto:	two modes
[15:41]	Rheta Shan:	The office menus are a nightmare.
[15:41]	Grant Linden:	same viewer two modes?
[15:41]	Pier Jaecies:	two or three or customizable
[15:41]	Charlette Proto:	creatind and exploring modes
[15:41]	Pier Jaecies:	there are so many different uses of SL
[15:41]	Rheta Shan:	Yes.
[15:41]	Jacek Antonelli:	A more modular approach would be good -- instead of just having "simple" and "advanced" as one option affecting the whole viewer, have each part have two modes
[15:41]	Dakota Schwade:	Like Advanced mode, but it makes more complex things appear it desired.
[15:41]	Rheta Shan:	But any mode emans many users will never discover all their options.
[15:41]	Pier Jaecies:	business people are doing different things than gamers and social neetworkers
[15:41]	Aimee Trescothick:	I wouldn't go for task orientated modes
[15:41]	Charlette Proto:	just two really building and exploring
[15:42]	Kippie Friedkin:	I still really like the Eclipse-like approach
[15:42]	Aimee Trescothick:	I switch too fast and do many simultaneously
[15:42]	Grant Linden:	personally, I would liek to be able to save the menus I use
[15:42]	Rheta Shan:	I'd rather advocate offering customisation — let people tailor the viewer to their needs once they understand what tehy are doing.
[15:42]	Aimee Trescothick:	yes
[15:42]	Grant Linden:	program a toolbar
[15:43]	Kippie Friedkin:	Yep...just like with Eclipse.
[15:43]	Grant Linden:	and spell check would be in there
[15:43]	Aimee Trescothick:	like setting up workspaces in photoshop etc. too
[15:43]	Kippie Friedkin:	You could even customize views based on the activities you are involved in.
[15:43]	Gabby Panacek:	agrees
[15:43]	Rheta Shan:	But offer a set of logical and extensive defaults.
[15:43]	Erica Linden:	and a pony.
[15:43]	Rheta Shan laughs
[15:43]	Jacek Antonelli wants a pony too!
[15:43]	Charlette Proto:	how about the paper clip then
[15:43]	Lars Donardson:	and a button "check availability of user brain - click on avatar to check"
[15:43]	Rheta Shan giggles
[15:43]	McCabe Maxsted:	we need the ability to set different profiles and easily swithc between them for preferences; tasks would be a natural extension of that
[15:43]	Charlette Proto:	AO PLEASE
[15:43]	Frans Charming:	I think the workspaces idea is a good analogy
[15:44]	Rheta Shan is not sure
[15:44]	Rheta Shan:	Eclipse is not exactly newbie friendly
[15:44]	Rheta Shan:	I know I don’t even udnerstand how it works, beyond that it is used to code.
[15:44]	Charlette Proto:	SL for dummies
[15:44]	Kippie Friedkin:	Well, a default view could be very simple using an Eclipse-like approach.
[15:45]	Kippie Friedkin:	It's just about customization, views, and workspaces - all of which can be saved.
[15:45]	Rheta Shan:	I have been mentoring, and sometimes fighting, a lot fo people using computers in day to day work without being computer people.
[15:45]	Rheta Shan:	For years.
[15:45]	Rheta Shan:	And I have seen diferent approaches.
[15:45]	Rheta Shan:	Function hding ones, like oiffice smart menus…
[15:46]	Rheta Shan:	…and assitant type ones work worst, in my experience.
[15:46]	Charlette Proto:	office is basically a typewriter not a 3D environment
[15:46]	Rheta Shan:	People ned to understand easily what happens, not to be led, or constricted.
[15:46]	Grant Linden:	no "SL Clippy?"
[15:46]	Lars Donardson:	an UI that allows users to progressively customize as he/she advances is the best imho
[15:46]	Rheta Shan:	Excel is a bit mroe than a typewiter
[15:46]	Kippie Friedkin:	No.
[15:46]	Charlette Proto:	paperclip
[15:46]	Geneko Nemeth:	Hey! Listen! Hey! Listen! Hey! Listen!
[15:47]	Rheta Shan agress with Lars
[15:47]	Dakota Schwade:	Understanding ... another of Rheta's key points is improved access to help, via web or in-world.
[15:47]	Charlette Proto:	whaere do you want to go today???
[15:47]	Rheta Shan agrees even
[15:47]	Rheta Shan:	Yes.
[15:47]	Aimee Trescothick wrote a raytracer in Excel
[15:47]	Rheta Shan:	Starting with hints and ending with agood help document.
[15:47]	Jacek Antonelli:	"I see you're trying to wear a shoppic bag on your head. Would you like me to find someone to laugh at you?"
[15:47]	Aimee Trescothick:	with no code :)
[15:47]	Rheta Shan:	LOL
[15:47]	Kippie Friedkin:	ROFL
[15:47]	Gabby Panacek:	lol
[15:47]	Lars Donardson:	hehe
[15:48]	Charlette Proto:	where are we going with that???
[15:48]	Charlette Proto:	get MS people on the job next
[15:48]	Lars Donardson:	the help side is something that is heavily depending on what LL allows us..the current approach is "patchy" at best
[15:48]	Charlette Proto:	mass of ass
[15:48]	McCabe Maxsted:	right click clippy > delete
[15:48]	Lars Donardson:	not interacting at all
[15:48]	Charlette Proto:	yep agreed on that
[15:48]	Rheta Shan nods
[15:48]	Rheta Shan:	AFK a mo
[15:49]	Grant Linden:	Currently we do not have a topic for next weeks Rx Office hours, other than creating a fish tank for Malbers.
[15:49]	Charlette Proto:	good idea
[15:49]	Rheta Shan:	Back. That went faster than expected.
[15:49]	Malbers Linden:	Awesome!
[15:49]	Charlette Proto:	fishtanks look nice
[15:49]	Grant Linden:	if you have any ideas please fire away or drop me an IM or notecard later
[15:49]	Geneko Nemeth:	... so we need this office to be set temp-rezzable, no?
[15:49]	Charlette Proto:	but we may need better fluid dynamics
[15:49]	Charlette Proto:	build please
[15:50]	McCabe Maxsted:	I'm sure something will come up on slux
[15:50]	Charlette Proto:	can we be informed
[15:50]	Aimee Trescothick:	ooh, fluid dynamics would be nice
[15:50]	Charlette Proto:	yes please FDs
[15:50]	Lars Donardson:	that's a different office though...hehe
[15:50]	Aimee Trescothick:	better get a second GPU to run it on though :D
[15:50]	Grant Linden:	Thank you Rheta for sharing your design with us and for answering our questions.
[15:50]	Rheta Shan:	My pleasure, really :)
[15:50]	Charlette Proto:	how about inworld 3D interface
[15:50]	Kippie Friedkin:	Yes, thanks Rheta! :)
[15:50]	Pier Jaecies:	yes, thank you and congrats!
[15:51]	Charlette Proto:	or the radial menu
[15:51]	Jacek Antonelli:	Thanks Rheta :)
[15:51]	Grant Linden:	radial menu?
[15:51]	Lars Donardson:	uggh...inworld...do you want to kill the hamsters driving the LL servers?
[15:51]	Charlette Proto:	good try Rheta
[15:51]	Gabby Panacek:	Thank you, Rheta :)
[15:51]	Charlette Proto:	good luck extending it
[15:51]	Rheta Shan:	Ta everybody.
[15:51]	Aimee Trescothick:	radil menu, hamster wheel then?
[15:51]	Aimee Trescothick:	*radial
[15:51]	Lars Donardson:	rofl
[15:51]	Charlette Proto:	swarms
[15:51]	Charlette Proto:	flocks
[15:52]	Jacek Antonelli:	Radial hamster menu? *rubs her chin* BRILLIANT!
[15:52]	Charlette Proto:	hamster is a good idea
[15:52]	Gabby Panacek:	get to work on that one, Cuddlefishy
[15:52]	Charlette Proto:	a stage for me
[15:52]	Charlette Proto:	and a mirror
[15:52]	Charlette Proto:	I want a mirror
[15:52]	Charlette Proto:	please
[15:52]	Jacek Antonelli:	I still want my pony.
[15:52]	Charlette Proto:	so vain
[15:53]	Aimee Trescothick:	bdamn, beat me to the pony *pouts*
[15:53]	Gabby Panacek will buy Jacek a pony
[15:53]	Malbers Linden:	pegasus-unicorn-pony
[15:53]	Charlette Proto:	ponny would look stupid and this is all about image
[15:53]	Rheta Shan smiles
[15:53]	Charlette Proto:	stage
[15:53]	Grant Linden:	but you could *be* the pony that every one wants!
[15:53]	Charlette Proto:	revolving so all can see
[15:53]	Jacek Antonelli:	:o
[15:54]	Charlette Proto:	no AOs that don't work next week pleas
[15:54]	Malbers Linden:	found my niche -- i'm already the jellyfish eveyone wants
[15:54]	Jacek Antonelli:	hehehe
[15:54]	Kippie Friedkin:	Ah....Jellyfish....good band too
[15:54]	Gabby Panacek:	just keep your tentacles to yourself, Malbers
[15:55]	Grant Linden:	and so, it seems we have mananged to wrap up the Rx office hours early this week :)
[15:55]	Geneko Nemeth:	Is there any reason to prefer a flat menu over a pie menu?
[15:55]	Charlette Proto:	could you [please turn it off just so we can see you will have fixed it by next week AO
[15:55]	Charlette Proto:	PIe
[15:55]	Charlette Proto:	LETS TALK ABOUT THAT
[15:55]	Charlette Proto:	LOOK AT mAYA VIDEOS
[15:55]	Charlette Proto:	sorry acps
[15:55]	Charlette Proto:	caps
[15:55]	Charlette Proto:	(been up all night 8am here)
[15:56]	Rheta Shan:	Ouch
[15:56]	Charlette Proto:	I love it
[15:56]	Charlette Proto:	10 to 12 hour a day
[15:56]	Grant Linden:	Thank you again, Rheta. Take care everyone :)
[15:56]	Charlette Proto:	night that is
[15:56]	Jacek Antonelli:	Take care everyone
[15:56]	Erica Linden:	bye all!
[15:56]	Kippie Friedkin:	Thanks Grant...cya next week!