User:Brooke Linden/Maturity User Group 2 10 2011

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Here are the transcripts from the Maturity Office Hours. Note that the link has been removed as it's no longer public.

The mock added a drop down maturity selector between the category drop down and the keyword search box. It has the following values:

   * General
   * General, Moderate
   * General, Moderate, Adult
   * Adult 

[14:59] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): hopefuly this will run smoother than last time with some real answers

[15:00] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): Qwik... do you always look like that or is that a means to scare Brooke? hee hee

[15:00] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): hi Brooke!

[15:00] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): lmao

[15:00] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): i been stuck like this since halloween

[15:00] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): hi there

[15:00] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): hey brooke

[15:00] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): just getting a demo going

[15:00] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): hi Brooke

[15:00] Nyteshade Vesperia (nyteshade.vesperia): Greetings

[15:00] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): Hi brooke

[15:00] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): give me a sec

[15:00] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): hi brooke

[15:00] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): mmm, web on a prim

[15:00] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar) runs to get popcorn :)

[15:01] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): do we need to be on v2 to see web on a prim?

[15:02] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): yes

[15:02] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): o dear

[15:02] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): any 2.x compatible viewer, that is

[15:02] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): well then, guess I won't be seeing it. lol

[15:02] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): oh, so we need to relog using v2 Brooke?

[15:02] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): oh, sorry, didn't realize there was a viewer limitation

[15:02] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): if you can, that would be great

[15:03] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): kk

[15:03] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): I don't even have it installed. lol

[15:03] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): dose phenix support that?

[15:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i can mostly explain this

[15:03] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): , hopefully I am not wearing something from 6 months ago

[15:03] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): peonix*

[15:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): :)

[15:03] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): no, phoenix users would have to move to their firestorm viewer

[15:03] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): the firestorm demo might, Qwik. but I don't have that installed either.

[15:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): hold on

[15:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): let me get this sorted

[15:04] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i'll get the url shared

[15:04] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): oh cool! thanks brooke!

[15:04] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): tyvm

[15:04] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): yeah, ppl could put the URL in a standalone viewer and access :)

[15:05] Loki Dancer (loki.dancer): Hello everyone :)

[15:05] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): hi loki

[15:05] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): hi

[15:05] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): hi Loki, hi Terrence

[15:06] Terrence Linden (terrence.linden): hello :)

[15:06] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): okay

[15:06] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): that took a bit of fiddling :)

[15:06] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so here's what i wanted to do for this meeting

[15:06] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): show you the next set of changes

[15:06] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and have a chance to have a discussion about maturity

[15:07] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): with a group who have given a lot of recent feedback on this topic or fit into one of the economic groups we've identified

[15:07] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): does that sound reasonable?

[15:07] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): yep

[15:07] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yes it does

[15:07] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower) nods

[15:07] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): okay

[15:07] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): still not sure I'm comfortable with these smaller groups. But I can understand the rationale behind them

[15:07] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so i have mentioned improved maturity filtering

[15:08] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): yes, i know

[15:08] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): like a 5 cousre meal loving you dont want it all on the table at once ;)

[15:08] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): if you look at the document i have shared

[15:08] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): is everyone able to access?

[15:09] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): or you can look at the web behind me

[15:09] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): yes, thank you

[15:09] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): yesw

[15:09] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): yes, thanks

[15:09] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): yup

[15:09] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yes

[15:09] Loki Dancer (loki.dancer): yes

[15:09] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): as you can see

[15:09] Geo (geo.linden): can you post link again, brooke?

[15:09] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we have added a drop down

[15:10] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): the proposed values of this drop down are

[15:10] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): general

[15:10] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): general + moderate

[15:10] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): general + moderate + adult

[15:10] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and adult

[15:10] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): as in, adult but filtering out the general and moderate content?

[15:10] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): yes

[15:10] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): ok

[15:10] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): so no option for moderate only?

[15:11] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): why not consider checkboxes for each of the three maturity ratings, as we currently choose in the viewer?

[15:11] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we talked about that

[15:11] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): but people often miss the current box

[15:11] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): tiing them in with the view would seem to make more sense

[15:12] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): this puts it right in front of the search term

[15:12] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): so would checkboxes, if placed there

[15:12] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): anyone can check that box to allow mature content, so who does this really protect?

[15:12] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): and it will remain enabled for extended periods, yes?

[15:12] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): there's one really simple solution... a front page splash with under 18/over 18 buttons to clic before entering the site... you could even sell advertising space on it... and it gives you an area to promote whatever you want... Having asked quite a few customers if they remember to enable adult content, most of them say they forget....

[15:13] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so, on the checkboxes in the same location as the drop down

[15:13] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): that might be confusing to users

[15:13] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): in the current location, people are just missing it

[15:13] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): I don't think it would be any more confusing than a multipe choice drop-down

[15:13] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): this ui will force people to choose a maturity level

[15:14] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): far simpler...

[15:14] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): but usually they wont forget to enable it in the viewer as this allows them to teleport to places they wish to go and you have to be age verified to get to adult sims so it would seem more appropriate and convienant if it where tied in to the viewer setting somehow

[15:14] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): especially considering that SL residents are already familiar with the checkbox system from the SL viewer

[15:14] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): well, technically the only way to force them to is to prevent them from seeing anything before they search. I assume as it stands now, the default is general, no?

[15:14] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): back to the moderate only option

[15:14] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): that is not currently planned, but is something that could be done

[15:15] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): on moderate only, do you all think there is a need?

[15:15] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): if it was a checkbox system, that's easily allowed

[15:15] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): personally, I don't even see the point of the moderate category.

[15:15] Nyteshade Vesperia (nyteshade.vesperia): I should think that maximizing flexibility in the settings would be most desirable.

[15:15] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): if there is an adult only and gernal only it makes sense to have a moderate only

[15:15] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): for most uses, I don't think it is, but people like to use search in a lot of ways

[15:15] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I dont either

[15:15] Loki Dancer (loki.dancer): Don't think it;s needed.

[15:15] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so one thing we can do by having it, is collect data

[15:16] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and if it's not being used, deprecate it

[15:16] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): would it not be eaiser to just have a level system that rises brooke so if adult is enabled the lower ratings are also enabled?

[15:16] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): makes sense. but I still don't see how this forces people to choose a maturity rating. I still say the only way to do that is to either make them log in or select it before they are shown any content.

[15:16] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): on the default values of the check box

[15:17] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): Qwik... with search returning all the clutter it does, I can certainly see someone wanting to search adult and filter out general and moderate

[15:17] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): I agree with loving Clarity....

[15:17] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we will be pulling people's default setting from the viewer

[15:17] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I agree Loving, simply disallow content to be viewed until they make a choice as to content they wish to see

[15:17] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): perhaps you could get in touch with Sea Linden and get an idea how frequently the various checkbox options are being used for in-world search

[15:17] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): well, so if we disallow viewing content

[15:18] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): what if i am considering joining secondlife

[15:18] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and want to check out some general content items?

[15:18] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): that system has been in use for over a year and a half

[15:18] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): but to tie into what they are allowed to view in world I think is a mistake, many people can not get age verified for one reason or another in world, and should not as adults be completely blocked from content on the MP due to that

[15:18] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): then you select "general" and enter the page

[15:18] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): it could be a good way to bring in new people to purchase your items

[15:19] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): okay, so i'm trying to keep up

[15:19] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): 1. i've got, add moderate as an option

[15:19] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): atm my sales are plunging with this new system... I don't see these tweaks really changing that trend...

[15:19] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): 2. questions about possibly going back to checkboxes

[15:20] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so on checkboxes

[15:20] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): this has caused a disjointed experience in the viewer

[15:20] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): it has

[15:20] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): what has?

[15:20] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and we were working on having a more consistent solution

[15:20] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): the checkboxes and the default viewer settings

[15:21] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): wouldn't using a checkbox system similar (or identical) to what's in the viewer be more consistent?

[15:21] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): there have been a lot of customer service questions on this

[15:21] Brooke's box: Xstreet SL - Delivered item Brooke's Bear.

[15:21] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): you mean tying the inworld prefs to MP or that the system itself is causing issues inworld?

[15:21] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): using the viewer rating settings to act as default settings on MP would work

[15:22] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so, someone sets their default preferences

[15:22] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): then someone gets search results

[15:22] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): sees 3 boxes

[15:22] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and can't check them all

[15:22] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): why not?

[15:22] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): and with this the age verification makes more sense as minors would not be allowed to see adult radted stuff in PM

[15:22] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): because you have to be age verified to check adult.

[15:22] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): if they don't have their viewer settings set to allow

[15:22] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): you can in the viewer, it works really well

[15:23] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): i disagree, my sims are mature but on the MP all my product has been forced to adult, if only people allowed to adult sims can shop my MP my sales would crash, as would many others

[15:23] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): vert true...

[15:23] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): lionna, do you think there is a market for people who are just looking for adult goods?

[15:23] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): i think thats what brooke meant with more consistency lionna

[15:23] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): if a resident is not age verified they can't check adult on in-world search either

[15:24] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): no I dont Brooke, I think people who are looking for adult often look for cuddle items aswelll

[15:24] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): but Brooke, on MP it wouldn't matter what preferences were. it would just reflect their settings on MP. so the issue with checkboxes on MP wouldn't exist cause there's no preference tab in MP

[15:24] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): and they dont want the adult items tied in every time, and dont want to wade through the mess

[15:24] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): I believe there is, Brooke, yes. Even if it's just purchase-specific. Sometimes when looking for, say a grown up sexbed they want to weed out the normal ones

[15:24] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): true

[15:25] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): those checkboxes are not what we are copying

[15:25] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): if your searching for an item lionnna you search by term yes? so with restriced search words and reduction of spamming search words you would get more relevant results instead of the rubbish

[15:25] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): but as you know, people learn to play the system and would figure out quickly how to use the same item in mature only, and adult only, even G only

[15:25] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we will be using the default viewer settings

[15:25] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): not so, Qwik. typing in Red Shoe will get you everything with red or shoe listed

[15:26] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): many also just browse the featured items, or new releases

[15:26] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): not searching at all

[15:26] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and so pulling default settings from the viewer

[15:26] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): will provide them with a similar experience

[15:26] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): bad Idea Brooke, imho

[15:26] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): ok. so how does the check boxes vs. drop down change if people who aren't adult verified can't check the box? does that keep it from showing in the dropdown as well?

[15:26] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): then the order in which the items are displayed are by relevance wen you search by term lionna

[15:27] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): and letting them choose their settings via checkboxes (similar to in-world search)

[15:27] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): it will all show in the drop down

[15:27] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): more consistent, reduced learning curve

[15:27] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): agreed trilo

[15:27] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): (btw, ctrl-f to open the find/search box and see what we're talking about)

[15:27] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): no they aren't qwik. they're sorted by best selling. Trust me, I spent a month trying to figure out search rankings when MP went live. Relevance is less important to search than past sales.

[15:27] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so my question is, why would they notice that more than the current checkbox?

[15:28] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we hear that people miss that and are not able to view adult content

[15:28] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): then it should be a popup on log in brooke

[15:28] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): also this takes up less vertical real estate

[15:28] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): with chk boxes

[15:28] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): good idea Qwik

[15:28] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): allowing more screen space for showing your products

[15:28] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): people have missed it in the past because XStreet and the Marketplace reset it at every session

[15:28] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): my honest opinion is neither is very noticable and people are still going to miss that. I can't count how many times I just type in my search term without selecting a category or enabling mature.

[15:29] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so, we will be storing the last search setting you used

[15:29] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): me too

[15:29] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): every time you logged into the site, it defaulted you to general only. It didn't inherit viewer maturity prefs or last session prefs

[15:29] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): that works Brooke

[15:29] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): that will be a HUGE help

[15:30] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so you'll see the same default from any computer you log into

[15:30] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): yes a way to save your prefs wen logged in is the best way to use mp once you have it set to your general needs you wouldnt have to mess with it again

[15:30] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): excellent

[15:30] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): That sounds good. but I still think a popup when you enter would be best. even if it were temporary to get people into the habit of selecting it. Or at least to get their default preference recorded

[15:30] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): great

[15:30] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): it would mean you'd need to be careful if you log in at work

[15:30] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): after searching for adult content :)

[15:30] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): lol

[15:30] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez):  .:・.。*・Giggles ・*。.・:.

[15:30] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): is that a concern?

[15:30] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): currently, on the general setting, on the first page of 'furniture, there are 4 sex beds out of the 12 boxes... all heve been flagged, but all are still there. therefore any one looking at the page currently would assume they were on adult setting.

[15:30] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): imo, if you're logging on to MP at work, you're probably already worried someone will see. lol

[15:31] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): lmao

[15:31] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I doubt it

[15:31] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): just worth thinking about

[15:31] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I think it will work

[15:31] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): if your loggin in from your work pc you should be xtra careful not about the setting but more about the boss seein ya aint workin

[15:31] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): okay, so we've got the feedback on checkboxes

[15:31] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): well, I've never worked a job where it was permitted to play online. most offices block social sites these days anyhow

[15:31] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we'll discuss here

[15:32] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): true Loving

[15:32] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and see if that makes sense--considering the other search options we'd like to add with this formate

[15:32] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): *format

[15:32] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): you'd be surprised how many SL ppl shop during work hours :)

[15:33] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): any other comments on this mock or what i've communicated about storing options?

[15:33] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): ok

[15:33] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): I guess just if you could replace the current "here's how to gift" note with a note about setting their preferences

[15:33] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): yes, we would definitely do that

[15:33] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): yeah, true.. at least while ppl are still getting used to that

[15:34] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): other options include a pop up or something the first time someone logs in

[15:34] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): my main concern is that most don't log in EVERY time they search MP. so even a stored setting wouldn't be effective in those cases

[15:34] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): and maybe put the gifting video link on the view cart page (if it's not already there)

[15:34] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): well, one option is to alert people if there are results not included based upon their current maturity setting

[15:34] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and prompting them to log in

[15:34] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): that definately needs to be there Brooke

[15:34] Loki Dancer (loki.dancer): agreed

[15:35] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): yeah. that was nice about SLX. There was always the big red text saying "there's more!"

[15:35] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): :-)

[15:35] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): "log in to see all results" type of msg

[15:35] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): yup

[15:35] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yep

[15:36] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): ok, so there are some things i'm sure i've missed in local chat

[15:36] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): can people please bring up things i've missed or new topics?

[15:36] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): and the more I think about it, the more I would be interested in a moderate only button.

[15:36] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): great

[15:36] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i don't see any reason why we couldn't do that

[15:36] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): since the word gorean automatically makes an item moderate, if I were looking for a gorean chair or house but didn't want anything adult, that'd be nice to have that option

[15:37] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): I use that with in-world searches from time to time, in cases where my search term gives me much more than I'm looking for etc

[15:37] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): 1 thing i will say brooke will this be tested on a small scale or test server b4 its implemented on the main MP to avaiod the fiasco of last time?

[15:37] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so here's what we'll be doing

[15:37] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we'll pull from the viewer statistics on moderate only searches

[15:37] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): if this is significant, we'll look at adding it

[15:37] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): I still think that automatically making one of the marketplaces' communities ALL MODERATE is a monumentally bad idea

[15:38] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): you wont be blocking adult content from anyone who is not age veirified in world will you Brooke?

[15:38] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): if there's an auto-filter in place that's fundamentally flawed, it makes the whole checkbox system less effective

[15:38] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): lionna, i'll adress quickly

[15:38] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): then come back to gorean

[15:39] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so in world, you must be age verified to view adult content

[15:39] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): right

[15:39] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yes, but adult content in world is much harsher than adult content on the MP

[15:39] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we are going to reach parity with the viewer on this in marketplace

[15:40] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): but i think it makes sense to have it coincide with displaying that people could see more results if they were age verified

[15:40] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so we make sure people know

[15:40] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): my content in world is all mature, where as on the MP it has been forced adult, so that would block most of my shoppers

[15:40] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): you will watch sales on the MP plummit Brooke, and I mean plummit

[15:41] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): agreed. my items inworld are acceptable on a mature sim but on MP they're adult.

[15:41] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): bit of background info, brooke... age verification seems easy enough, but apparently doesn't actually work so well for the 60+% of SL residents outside the US

[15:41] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): BDSM is adult, not sex, sex is mature, but on the MP it has been forced adult

[15:41] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): if the 2 rating systems are brought into line then thneso should the terms that govern them brooke

[15:41] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we are aware of this inconsistency

[15:41] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): are you aware that there isn't even a guideline for what "moderate" clothing would be on MP? it implies that all clothing on MP is either general or adult with no middle ground.

[15:41] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and this is on the radar for things that will need to be addressed

[15:42] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): oh, on clothing

[15:42] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so explain to me what your interpretation is, please

[15:42] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I hope so, because I think age verification was a nightmare enough in world, let alone on the MP

[15:42] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): according to the guidelines, most clothing should easily fit under general

[15:42] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): it should Trilo

[15:43] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): that's true

[15:43] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): What about a censored photo of an outfit that shows female nipples? Inworld, that outfit would be mature. but on MP there's no guideline for it. it just says if the inworld item shows them, it can't be general.

[15:43] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): pulling up the guidelines

[15:43] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): so does that mean the outfit could be in moderate if censored and adult if not?

[15:43] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): though if customers that shop in your store are part of the gorean community and you got on board colossus' Community Tagging program, your goods are now all moderate

[15:44] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i also don't want to ignore the gorean comment

[15:44] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): note that when we move to using viewer defaults

[15:44] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): that is what most everyone in second life chooses to see

[15:44] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): yes. they are all moderate. even my kitchen which isn't animated and my couch that doesn't even have any kisses in it.

[15:45] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): i think its more of a bug loving a "cocktail dress" has been rated adult due to the cocktail word

[15:45] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): I've learned to live with the moderate ratings. I'm too fed up to argue about it. But the guidelines are vague to say the least.

[15:45] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): or a pirate outfit that got flagged adult because I'd misspelled sleeves as sleves

[15:45] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): so the words in the description and searchwords are whats tripping most of the flaggin

[15:46] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so, as i mentioned, we are looking at making changes in the way we apply our ratings

[15:46] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): yes - title, keywords, features, and long descriptions are all being auto-filtered

[15:46] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): to make the merchant experience better, but still filter for people who are shopping

[15:46] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): sounds excellent

[15:46] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we are currently in the planning phase of this

[15:47] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): so not only do we now have to reword our products to get them from adult to mature, now we also have to deal with most of our shoppers be allowed due to their maturity rating?

[15:47] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): brooke can i ask is all this going to tested b4 its implemented on the main mp mayb on a test server or such?

[15:47] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): lionna, most of our users are over 18 and most of them choose to view adult content

[15:48] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): sorry, make that moderate

[15:48] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): NOT adult

[15:48] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): sigh

[15:48] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): when they remember...

[15:48] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yes, but if you re planning on tying it all to their verification in world, then they wont be

[15:48] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so we are currently working on getting test server set up

[15:48] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): yeah, the lack of testing made all this even more frustrating, since there's already a team for that

[15:48] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): lionna if the MP and in-word ratings are brought into line which is what brooke is saying ithink then your moderate stuff on MP will = mature in world

[15:48] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): are they actually choosing it, Brooke? are they remembering to?

[15:48] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we dont' have current publicly available test servers

[15:49] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): ok thx brooke im glad of that as it was the mass of bugs that angerd most ppl and the amount of inapproprate flaggin due to these bugs

[15:49] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): ok

[15:49] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I hope so

[15:49] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): is there a rough estimate to when the MP guidelines will better match inworld ones?

[15:49] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): as it stands now I have cuddle items marked moderate

[15:49] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): hopefully it shouldn't be that difficult to add some folks to the existing setup, all you really need are some people to go in and actively bang on things

[15:50] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): the MP guidelines are not changing

[15:50] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): thats what I thought

[15:50] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): so moderate inworld will continue to be adult on MP?

[15:50] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): there is evaluation of consistencies bewteen viewer and mp

[15:50] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I think one is not the other Brooke and should be kept seperate

[15:51] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i cannot give you a date on this

[15:51] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): well, didn't hurt to ask. lol

[15:51] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): there is a big difference between being allowed into and adult sim to do things.... verses just seing product on the MP that is adult

[15:51] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so we're getting to 10 min left

[15:52] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): damballah is no longer public

[15:52] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): Do you have overall sales figures for the Mp sice you introduced these recent changes? are they up or down?

[15:52] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we have another system we are working to get set up

[15:52] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): why lionna? if you have to be18+ in-world surley you should have to be 18+ on MP to view the same items

[15:52] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): its not that simple

[15:52] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): legally it is

[15:53] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): many people do not have a way to age verify even though they may be 50

[15:53] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): overall sales are up

[15:53] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): ooo... must just be me then...

[15:53] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): yes, Qwik. but the issue is, I can have a sex bed on a mature sim in SL so long as I'm not naked when I'm using it. But on MP, even if the images aren't adult in nature, the bed is still adult.

[15:53] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): lol tilly your not alone ;)

[15:53] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): lol

[15:53] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): and me, Tilly

[15:53] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yep

[15:53] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): tilly, can you drop me a notecard with what you've tried?

[15:54] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): how do yopu mean?

[15:54] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i can make sure it gets passed onto the people who manage age verification

[15:54] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): what have you tried to get age verified

[15:54] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): just list it out

[15:54] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): i think she means sales brooke

[15:54] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): oh

[15:54] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): I am age verified....

[15:54] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): mine are also down

[15:54] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): got it

[15:54] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): misunderstood

[15:54] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): lol, ok

[15:54] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): since 70 of my items were de listed

[15:54] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): 70% of mine were

[15:55] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): I'm hopeful that things will be better this week (I pull/tabulate my reports weekly, on Mondays)

[15:55] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): wow, okay

[15:55] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): yea lionna but you mention gorean and thats kinda in the sex catagory mine are sim surrounds not even close to adult

[15:55] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): none of mine are delisted. I just have to sit and test out which is more effective for selling. Marketing PG items to goreans or marketing them where they'll be seen by the PG audience. and until the maturity issue is sorted out, I really don't see how I can monitor that at all.

[15:56] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): true, but a cuddle campfire with sensual cuddles is hardly adult

[15:56] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): lol nods i know its buggy thats why i asked about test servers

[15:56] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so qwik and lionna

[15:56] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and to let people know

[15:56] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): yeah, the rating should be based on the item, not the community it's being marketed to

[15:57] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yes, or goth will be next on the hit list

[15:57] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): we will require an NDA on file for accessing test servers--just want to get that out there

[15:57] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): that's fair

[15:57] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): ok

[15:57] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): well, they suck blood. that's violence and thus moderate. *laughs dryly*

[15:58] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): also, allowing public testing does delay changes--i'm saying it's a good idea

[15:58] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): but there should be awareness of that as well

[15:58] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): better to delay and find the issues without so much hassle than release and have a mess

[15:58] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): if the changes wen implemented are more effetive im sure the merchant community wont complain about a delay

[15:58] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): should be able to bang on things/break things/try new things without it turning up on blogs

[15:58] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): +1 Lionna

[15:58] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i completely agree

[15:59] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): so we're at the end of the hour

[15:59] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): do people feel this format is helpful?

[15:59] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): yup much more informative and effective than the last office hours debacle

[15:59] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i think i was actually able to keep up

[15:59] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): Yes, I think so

[16:00] Nyteshade Vesperia (nyteshade.vesperia): Yes, though a litle more than a couple hours' notice would be helpful.

[16:00] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): yes, much more so than trying to keep up with too many people, and I think more got accomplished

[16:00] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): yes, i don't think that effective for a lot of us

[16:00] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i'm looking at ways to make the larger meetings more effective

[16:00] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): I would like to ask that, when sharing info that pertains to all marketplace merchants/users, consider using the main SL blog system

[16:00] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): I got the email last night.

[16:01] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i'm working with our current system now

[16:01] LФVIИG (loving.clarity): and there was some upset in SLCM group that you should post invitees and agenda publicly before the meeting.

[16:01] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): as you all saw, we are moving to a new blog/forum system

[16:01] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): the commerce blog/forums are fun, but I don't think the majority of us are involved in it

[16:01] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): with that i'm looking to make communication changes

[16:01] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i don't want to make changes and then have to change again...

[16:01] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): agrees

[16:01] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i'm happy to post the list before hand

[16:02] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): that's why i'm cross posting to twitter

[16:02] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): linking to posts is great, thanks for doing that

[16:02] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): I appreciate the invite today, I have tried to stay quiet and listen, it has been nice to have some input for a change

[16:02] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): our tools are going to improve

[16:02] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): which will help our communication

[16:02] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): and i'm looking at things like surveys, etc

[16:02] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): Me too... thanks for the invite Brooke...

[16:02] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): thanks all

[16:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i got some very constructive feedback

[16:03] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): i dont use twitter or the forums much but a group somehow like the old slx merchant round table that always worked well

[16:03] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): Thanks for the meeting, and for sharing the mockups

[16:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): i'll be posting these in a bit

[16:03] Nyteshade Vesperia (nyteshade.vesperia): Thank you.

[16:03] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): kk ty

[16:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): fyi, i'll need to unshare the mocks

[16:03] Brooke Linden (brooke.linden): bye!

[16:03] Qwik Skytower (qwik.skytower): tc brooke

[16:03] Lionna Dumouriez (lionna.dumouriez): bye Brooke

[16:03] TriloByte Zanzibar (trilobyte.zanzibar): right

[16:03] Loki Dancer (loki.dancer): Thanks and bye Brooke :)

[16:04] tilly Kiranov (tilly.kiranov): byee