User:Zero Linden/Office Hours/2007 May 17

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Transcript of Zero Linden's office hours, as hosted by Which Linden:

[7:36] Which Linden: As always, this is public, it'll go on the wiki
[7:36] Wyn Galbraith use to get up at 5am to be at work at 6:30am, "So this is sleeping in for me."
[7:36] Which Linden: Assuming I can figure that out. :-)
[7:37] Which Linden: Today I thought it'd be cool to talk about the heterogeneous grid
[7:37] Which Linden: Hi Nounouch, welcome to zero's office hours, wihch I'm guest-hosting
[7:37] Zha Ewry: Heterogenous? In which way?
[7:38] Nounouch Hapmouche: (Hello. ;) )
[7:38] Which Linden: Heterogeneous in terms of what version of software the sim hosts are running
[7:38] Zha Ewry: You've already got three classes of sims.. and several bits of kit that's special, like the asset servers. OOOH.
[7:38] Zha Ewry: Post liberacion!
[7:39] Nounouch Hapmouche: As in being able to stop only part of the grid for a rolling maintenance ?
[7:39] Which Linden: Post-liberaction, indeed
[7:39] Zha Ewry: As in being able to put new code up on single sims and let real folks pound on it!
[7:39] Which Linden: Faster maintenance is a goal
[7:39] Which Linden: Testing beta code in the main grid is another!
[7:40] Which Linden: It's funny how much more useful the main grid is
[7:40] Wyn Galbraith: I would so love that.
[7:40] Squirrel Wood: size matters in this case I'd say
[7:40] Wyn Galbraith: It has always been true that the users are the best testers.
[7:41] Wyn Galbraith: It's hard to reproduce real usage on a test grid.
[7:41] Zha Ewry: Access, too. I try, now, to leave copies of key work in asset at all times so I can rez them on sandboxes in beta, and test
[7:41] Zha Ewry: But.. It would be much nicer to not have the 2-3 week window when I can't get new code into the beta grid
[7:41] Which Linden: I think since SL is promarily a communication medium, it's hard to get people to leave aside their main second life to do some testing.
[7:42] Wyn Galbraith: That's true too.
[7:42] Zha Ewry: Asset lag is killer too.
[7:42] Zha Ewry: I end up re-doing bug fixes to code to artifacts in the beta me.
[7:42] Which Linden: My avatar isn't as pretty in the beta
[7:42] Zha Ewry: Cut scripts from grid copy with fix.
[7:42] Zha Ewry: Past to beta copy
[7:42] Zha Ewry: Ick
[7:43] Wyn Galbraith: Would be nice if we could send current objects to the beta grid for certain testing.
[7:43] Which Linden: I wonder, would you all be more interested in the beta if the asset lag were shorter?
[7:43] Wyn Galbraith: Yes
[7:43] Zha Ewry: Helps a little.
[7:43] Which Linden: I guess my question is, how much shorter?
[7:43] Wyn Galbraith: Yesterday
[7:43] Wyn Galbraith is joking.
[7:44] Zha Ewry: Well. zero would be idea. Realistically... once or twice a week (and on a schedule) would be helpful.
[7:44] Zha Ewry: I also.. make a point to go log on and see what state my Ave is in the beta grid after each snapshot
[7:44] Which Linden: I don't know how much effort it takes to do a sync -- presumably a lot
[7:44] Nounouch Hapmouche: A "send to Beta" warping object ?
[7:45] Wyn Galbraith: Something like that Nounouch.
[7:45] Zha Ewry: I use the beta for demos when main is down.. and once or twice.. when I didn't do that.. was bemused that the snapshot had clearly been taken late at night, with the Ave not in work clothing.
[7:46] Wyn Galbraith: That can be embarassing.
[7:46] Which Linden: One thing about the het grid is that as simulator versions advance, they might want a newer viewer version as well
[7:47] Which Linden: For features like sculpties, for example
[7:47] Which Linden: The new viewer wouldn't be *required*, but you probably would want it
[7:47] Wyn Galbraith: So have a separate viewer for the Beta grid?
[7:48] Squirrel Wood: Mayhaps another series of FirstLook viewers?
[7:48] Khamon Fate claps for first look
[7:48] Which Linden: First Look is awesome
[7:48] Zha Ewry: First look.. is a really good strategy
[7:48] Nounouch Hapmouche: FirstLook was great, yup. But we are talking of collapsing 5-6 different Firstlooks at once
[7:48] Zha Ewry: Optional.. is not so good.
[7:48] Wyn Galbraith: Only then you're not testing with the exisiting viewer, so how would viewer related issues be tested then.
[7:49] Zha Ewry: I had to back off the optional update.. which is only easy becasue I'm very careful to keep the current install at all times
[7:49] Khamon Fate: Which have you guys considered opening an Icehouse chat group that we could join and y'all could use to bounce ideas off us?
[7:49] Zha Ewry: Finally got the grpahics drivers fixed.. so that I can run the optional. But.. it is painful, when the update takes your machine straight to lockup
[7:49] Wyn Galbraith is all out of groups
[7:50] Which Linden: Khamon: you mean like office hours?
[7:50] Zha Ewry is as well
[7:50] Zha Ewry: 25 groups. Heh.
[7:50] Khamon Fate: Yeah but a group where we could chat about this stuff anytime
[7:50] Zha Ewry: Thoughts, too. We'd be glad to discuss ideas you have, at random
[7:50] Khamon Fate: Zha are you linux-based?
[7:51] Zha Ewry: XP
[7:51] Wyn Galbraith: I mean I could drop some educational ones, I've done almost all the free classes available for the those groups I'm a part of, but would hate to.
[7:51] Khamon Fate: Or do you eat AIX for breakfast ha ha ha
[7:51] Zha Ewry: The linux version was fine. But.. we have silly corporate apps which (sighs) like XP
[7:51] Khamon Fate: I'd drop a group to be a sounding board and idea pusher for Icehouse
[7:51] Which Linden: I think the problem with an always-running group chat would be that I'd rarely get any work done!
[7:51] Khamon Fate: You'd have to control your growth
[7:51] Wyn Galbraith: I could drop a scripting group.
[7:52] Khamon Fate: I mean chat
[7:52] Khamon Fate: Are you non-invasive bamboo?
[7:52] Wyn Galbraith: Which is contained in a pot, I think that's the cure for invasive bamboo, correct ;)
[7:52] Zha Ewry: Alas.. my laptop (and main machine) is XP, and ATI.. So.. drivers are tricky. We *do* have a new family which is nvidia based... just out. I *so* badly want one of those
[7:52] Nounouch Hapmouche: A "let's drop an idea and wait return" schema is what I use to call a Wiki or a board. Aka Web stuff
[7:53] Which Linden: Um, I heard that the species of plant that is sold as "lucky bamboo" is not a bamboo, it's a geranium or somthing
[7:53] Wyn Galbraith is XP, Dual Core and unsupported graphic chip set.
[7:53] Wyn Galbraith: On a Tablet PC.
[7:53] Zha Ewry: Well, a number of us, who are here a lot... chat about what Zero talks about.. between meetings. Having a formal group
[7:53] Khamon Fate: Geraniums taste funny to me.
[7:53] Zha Ewry: would be nice. Lindens could dump notices and proposals at the group.. and we'd be able to discuss it at random
[7:55] Khamon Fate: Maybe I'm thinking more like a forum.
[7:55] Which Linden: You guys should probably ask Zero when he gets back -- I hardly feel qualified to discourse, since this is, after all, my first office hour!
[7:55] Which Linden: (that I've run)
[7:55] Zha Ewry: We'll tell anyone anything :-)
[7:55] Which Linden: :-)
[7:55] Which Linden: Back to het grid:
[7:55] Zha Ewry: Speaking of which.. How is zero, and his expected arrival?
[7:56] Which Linden: If there's sculpties in one sim, and some other new viewer-sim feature in a neighboring sim, what then? Have to switch viewer versions when you regious cross?
[7:56] Wyn Galbraith: You're right it's Dracaena sanderana. Which is fake bamboo.
[7:56] Nounouch Hapmouche: Dynamic loading sections of client
[7:56] Khamon Fate: Fake Bamboo ha ha ha
[7:56] Zha Ewry: Gah. Don't make it worse.
[7:57] Zha Ewry: Just use the front level browser..
[7:57] Zha Ewry: Hopefully.. you keep things forward compatible most of the time
[7:57] Khamon Fate: Whole sections such as the menu bar, and when the client is logged in?
[7:57] Nounouch Hapmouche: Aka Quarl toy with the sculpty code, updating the three versions, rebooting the zone, people reconnect, DL needed code and load it ?
[7:57] Khamon Fate: Aren't we sposed to talk about a browser plugin?
[7:57] Khamon Fate: Oh no that's Benjamin at 10
[7:58] Which Linden: Initially at least, we don't have dynamically-loading viewers that are loaded piecemeal
[7:58] Khamon Fate: I wonder how optional rendering sculpties is gonna be.
[7:59] Which Linden: In any case, any beta branch tends to change a vast swath of code, so you'd be reloading everything.
[7:59] Nounouch Hapmouche: Who do you expect it to work ? A viewer per server familly ? A sculpty-on-work one, a browser-on-work-one, a whatever-on-work one ?
[7:59] Zha Ewry: Given that one could build an open source client that doesn't render whole swaths of the world.. I'd think totally optional at some leval Khamon.
[8:00] Nounouch Hapmouche: Or a single client being updated several times a day ?
[8:00] Wyn Galbraith: Morning Chaley.
[8:00] Zha Ewry: How often would you imagine deploying new code to sims, Which?
[8:00] Which Linden: Client updates should always be optional after liberacion
[8:00] Wyn Galbraith: Jarod.
[8:00] Zha Ewry: Morning Jarod
[8:00] Chaley May: mrning :)
[8:00] Jarod Godel: hi
[8:00] Which Linden: Morning folks
[8:00] Entering god mode, level 200
[8:01] Which Linden: Welcome to Zero's office hours
[8:01] Wyn Galbraith: Zero's office hours where Zero is zero.
[8:01] Khamon Fate: So new features can be plugged into the download piecemeal, but downloads will still be whole clients?
[8:01] Jarod Godel: optional because there will finally be a set protocol in place?
[8:01] Which Linden: Well, so there's two things to separaate
[8:01] Nounouch Hapmouche: You can expect people to do some work like an optionnal upgrade to get into "Quarl's crazy sculpty land"
[8:01] Wyn Galbraith: Interesting idea Khamon.
[8:02] Which Linden: There's the "dynamic loading viewer" which we don't have any plans to biuld
[8:02] Which Linden: (but would be cool)
[8:02] Which Linden: And the het grid itself, on a liberated message template
[8:02] Zha Ewry: I'd agree, NN. Since mosty people won't be hitting oddball beta sims, it would be reasaonbel to say "If you want to test X you need the new browser"
[8:03] Nounouch Hapmouche: Oh, BTW, it takes a whole process first of fail-safe and power back-up ;))
[8:03] Squirrel Wood: what about splitting functionality into different dllls that share the same interface and can be loaded/unloaded on demand?
[8:03] Jarod Godel: like Mozilla>
[8:03] Jarod Godel: ?
[8:03] Nounouch Hapmouche: That's the idea, but it is what Which just refused ;))
[8:03] Which Linden: Mozilla's plugins aren't dlls
[8:03] Jarod Godel: right... xpi, iirc
[8:03] Which Linden: I didn't refuse it, I just said we have no plans to build it
[8:03] Nounouch Hapmouche: My bad
[8:03] Zha Ewry: And.. cross platform plugins are challenging
[8:04] Jarod Godel: So, the SL client needs, what, COM access?
[8:04] Zha Ewry: State and windows behavior when loading/unlaoding .dlls is icky
[8:04] Wyn Galbraith: Unless we lived in Linux land.
[8:04] Nounouch Hapmouche: Honestly, I fear "less used" platforms will be left on the side during live-beta sessions if the builds aren"t automated and frequent.
[8:04] Khamon Fate: On the other hand, Benjamin's going to talk about an SL browser plugin at his office hours.
[8:05] Which Linden: Even Mozilla, with its non-compiled plugins, often needs to restart when you add a new plugin
[8:05] Jarod Godel: Is true.
[8:05] Khamon Fate: Where'd Eric go? Is he articlizing Icehouse?
[8:05] Nounouch Hapmouche: A sliced client isn't a hack, it's a major redesign
[8:05] Which Linden: So, at least initially, if you wanted to try a new feature, you'd have to install a viewer
[8:06] Jarod Godel: But, by modularizing the backend, as icehouse has done, such things are possible.
[8:06] Jarod Godel: which is exciting
[8:06] Khamon Fate: It's at least platformish
[8:06] Nounouch Hapmouche: How do you see it Which ? I dowload a client to test Scuplties, another to test the browser on prisms, etc... ?
[8:06] Which Linden: I don't know, that seems like the most straightforward thing.
[8:07] Which Linden: We can only work on so many betas at once, so the number of clients outstanding would be limited.
[8:07] Jarod Godel still wants a Tk-ish language for designing dialog boxes via LSL.
[8:07] Squirrel Wood: hmm. Have one download which has all different executables included and pops up a dialog on startup where you choose which one you want to run?
[8:08] Which Linden: Hmmm.... a meta-viewer?
[8:08] Nounouch Hapmouche: Differential patches on the fly ?
[8:08] Squirrel Wood: that may just work out?
[8:08] Wyn Galbraith hrms.
[8:08] Which Linden: Patch the viewer, then restart it?
[8:08] Nounouch Hapmouche: Only drawback, you need to relog between each different beta
[8:09] Nounouch Hapmouche: BTW, I expect at least 4-5 different betas to runs at the same time.
[8:09] Nounouch Hapmouche: Not a couple
[8:10] Which Linden: Well, we're probably going to ramp up to that many, if at all.
[8:10] Wyn Galbraith: Oh boy, choose your beta...LOL
[8:10] Nounouch Hapmouche: Refrain in liberty ? ;)
[8:11] Squirrel Wood: would be interesting to see which of the betas is chosen most :)
[8:11] Nounouch Hapmouche: Visual candies ;)
[8:11] Nounouch Hapmouche: The "asset usage reduced by 50%" won't be very popular
[8:12] Zha Ewry: Lag reduced by 10%, that one.
[8:12] Nounouch Hapmouche: Nah, might get some builders, but not the rush
[8:12] Which Linden: I'd expect a bunch of betas to have backend changes that don't require a new viewer
[8:13] Nounouch Hapmouche: Imagine putting a live sculpty on main right now, it will soon be capped for days
[8:13] Squirrel Wood: All hail the great wondrous sculptie! ^^
[8:14] Which Linden: Ha ha, yeah, would landowners be eager to have such a beta software for their land?
[8:14] Zha Ewry: Gah. Gotta go deal with RL.
[8:14] Nounouch Hapmouche: And there will be "transgender", Sculptie 3.0, Browser on face 2.0, Sculpty 2.2 + Browser 1.1
[8:14] Zha Ewry: I would. I have islands where I'd gladly go load a test version
[8:14] Zha Ewry: Better to find bugs early.. than be hit hard.. when they go live
[8:14] Nounouch Hapmouche: I believe Beta sims should be kept under full Lindens control
[8:14] Wyn Galbraith: I would,
[8:14] Zha Ewry: Depends what you're testing
[8:15] Zha Ewry: Sooner or later. you want wide exposure
[8:15] Zha Ewry: So you find out what's broken
[8:15] Nounouch Hapmouche: If your whole inventory and money is wiped by a Beta bug, what will you do ?
[8:15] Zha Ewry: The same thing that you do, if it happens on the live grid
[8:15] Wyn Galbraith: Call the Lindens.
[8:15] Nounouch Hapmouche: Even worst, one of your visitor
[8:16] Nounouch Hapmouche: But I expect such failures to happen in a Beta
[8:16] Zha Ewry: Its a fair point.. But... I've not seen that stuff happen on the beta grid, so I'm not sure you'd expect it in the live grid
[8:16] Wyn Galbraith: I'm sure it would be reported which lands were doing beta testing.
[8:16] Zha Ewry: I'd also think.. you'd do roll outs.
[8:16] Khamon Fate: We never had that problem using First Look that I remember.
[8:16] Zha Ewry: Put beta code up in a few sims..t hen slowly grow the use
[8:16] Nounouch Hapmouche: So you will have Lindens doing extra Concierge stuff, splitting Beta problems from "usual" problems
[8:17] Khamon Fate: Maybe a few sims with group access only so people going there would definitely know the risks.
[8:17] Zha Ewry: the time you'd offer it up to the broader community. hopefully, you're looking for load and edge case bugs
[8:17] Wyn Galbraith: Need a new Linden group maybe. I'm free ;)
[8:17] Squirrel Wood: How about changing the ground texture on any "beta" sims? to one that clearly reads "BETA" ?
[8:17] Khamon Fate: Well LL pays Concierge staff to handle things like that.
[8:17] Which Linden: Ooof, yeah, we would have to have some sort of obvious visual indicator in the viewer that says you're in a beta sim
[8:17] Wyn Galbraith: Sky writing.
[8:17] Khamon Fate: Or a preteleport message maybe
[8:17] Nounouch Hapmouche: A preference setup "Allow access to Beta sims" too
[8:18] Zha Ewry: or warn on entry
[8:18] Khamon Fate loves preference options
[8:18] Wyn Galbraith: You are entering the twilight zone, beware of strangeness.
[8:18] Zha Ewry: But.. The whole benefit of beta is to get real residents and real objects in real us
[8:18] Zha Ewry: *use
[8:18] Zha Ewry: So.. you need to get it out there and used
[8:18] Zha Ewry: Else you're back to the beta grid
[8:18] Jarod Godel: The future of the metaverse are those "this website is IE5 friendly" messages. :-(
[8:18] Zha Ewry: Which.. as we saw last update.. doesn't drive loads
[8:19] Khamon Fate: We don't warn people when they sign into the production grid that all of their inventory and money might disappear at any moment.
[8:19] Zha Ewry: I was on the beta.. before the major meltdown.. and the beta was fine
[8:19] Khamon Fate: Why should we have to do that for a beta sim?
[8:19] Zha Ewry: It was only when it hit production loads that it melted
[8:19] Nounouch Hapmouche: Merge Beta in to Live, several steps ? Full Beta, Beta but real stuff copied at each entrance, Live asset changes ?
[8:19] Nounouch Hapmouche: Khamon : The TOS does
[8:19] Zha Ewry: Well.. I think.. that once you get to really early code.. I'd want to be warned
[8:20] Wyn Galbraith would want to be warned too.
[8:20] Zha Ewry: Assets.. I'm having a hard time imaginign assets getting eaten because of a sim/client bug I suppose a few could
[8:20] Which Linden: Seems like there are varying degrees of "beta"
[8:20] Zha Ewry: but.. your whole inventory? Seems hard to imagine
[8:20] Which Linden: Maybe we should use some more greek letters
[8:20] Khamon Fate: Well if the beta sim message is as long and complex as the TOS we might as well skip it altogether
[8:20] Zha Ewry: Definitel multiple levels
[8:21] Khamon Fate: No wait, I mean if they've read the TOS and know that they might lose anything at any time anyway, why do we need to warn them especially on entrance to a beta sim?
[8:21] Which Linden: It'd have to pass at least a certain level of stability to make it on the live grid at all
[8:21] Nounouch Hapmouche: First step could be the withdraw the need for a different grid
[8:21] Zha Ewry: Everythign from "totally new stuff, untested" to "Just about to go live"
[8:21] Nounouch Hapmouche: Khamon: Because people don't know how to read, but how to whine ?
[8:22] Khamon Fate: True but you've twice invalidated the need to publish anything for them to read.
[8:22] Nounouch Hapmouche: Keep them safe by default, even if them not knowing it
[8:22] Zha Ewry: hey all gotta run. Which.. thanks.. Pas a hello on to Zero... if you get a chance.
[8:22] Which Linden: Thanks Zha, I will!
[8:22] Wyn Galbraith: People come and go so quickly here. :)
[8:23] Gery Bury: hello
[8:23] Khamon Fate: I had to do that at Tuesday's meeting
[8:23] Squirrel Wood: Have the client render everything in greyscale in a beta sim... like an old movie. I think that's be an obvious indicator that something's going on ^^
[8:23] Which Linden: Hi Gery, welcometo the tail end of Zero's office hours
[8:23] Wyn Galbraith had a interview Tuesday, "So I couldn't make that meeting."
[8:23] Khamon Fate: Make it all wireframe ha ha
[8:23] Khamon Fate: We're not helping are we?
[8:23] Which Linden: Ha ha, with little phosphor flickers.... it could be done. :-)
[8:23] Gery Bury: my english ist not so good
[8:23] Nounouch Hapmouche: A simple icon + a preference in setup "I acknoledge to enter Beta sims at stage XXX"
[8:23] Khamon Fate: Is there anything else you wanted to talk about seriously Which?
[8:24] Wyn Galbraith: Would be like the old days, when VR was a baby, wireframes ;)
[8:24] Which Linden: I had no other topics in mind, Khamon
[8:24] Khamon Fate: yeah I agree that checking a preference box would cover it well enough. Then only people who checked it would be accessing the sims anyway with full knowledge of what they were doing.
[8:25] Jarod Godel: i refuse to be on a beta list!!1!
[8:25] Khamon Fate: Have y'all implemented LLSD anywhere yet?
[8:25] Which Linden: Caps are LLSD
[8:25] Jarod Godel: (kidding)
[8:25] Khamon Fate: We must verify that eveyone on the beta list has green hair.
[8:25] Khamon Fate claps for caps
[8:26] Wyn Galbraith: No problem, I love green and have a lot of green hair ;)
[8:26] Which Linden: How about if the whole grid has two "main" versions?
[8:26] Nounouch Hapmouche: Two ? Main and a Main + Betas-access-open ?
[8:26] Which Linden: Two versions of Havok is a use case
[8:27] Khamon Fate: Yes that'd be wholly necessary if upgrading an engine.
[8:27] Squirrel Wood: havok.. yum.
[8:27] Nounouch Hapmouche: That's just more advocacy for the load-on-fly client
[8:27] Which Linden: That one would probably work best as one viewer, no notification needed when you region cross
[8:28] Which Linden: (because all the changes are sim-side)
[8:28] Squirrel Wood: hmm.
[8:28] Squirrel Wood: I guess I have the perfect thing to stress test just about any physics engine ^^
[8:28] Nounouch Hapmouche: Except people might whine there airplane just changed way of flying because they changed sim and don't understand what happened
[8:28] Wyn Galbraith: How do people send you IM's when you're not on any group with them?
[8:29] Wyn Galbraith is getting IM SPAM.
[8:29] Which Linden: Hmmm...yeah, Nounouch, that would be troublesome
[8:30] Nounouch Hapmouche: For them and for helpers
[8:30] Nounouch Hapmouche: Might no be any risk asset-wide, but can be hard to troubleshoot
[8:30] Squirrel Wood: hmm. how about a flag for objects that defines which physics engine was active when they were rezzed and on sim crossing enable the appropriate engine for those?
[8:31] Which Linden: I don't think we can technically achieve that, Squirrel
[8:31] Squirrel Wood: hmm
[8:31] Nounouch Hapmouche: Collapsing two physics engines on a single sim, seems quite hard ;)
[8:32] Nounouch Hapmouche: And you need to have developpers keeping busy with upward compatibility
[8:32] Nounouch Hapmouche: *not to
[8:32] Which Linden: It seems that many problems could be ameliorated by making it obvious in the UI
[8:32] Wyn Galbraith: I bet a lot of users don't even know what the physics engine is nor care.
[8:32] Which Linden: Wow, is it really 8:30? The time flew by.
[8:32] Jarod Godel: I'd be interested know just how many people use the physics engine.
[8:32] Nounouch Hapmouche: Flag the beta on several levels and let each user define is accepted level, with the lowest one acknoledge by default ?
[8:33] Wyn Galbraith needs coffee.
[8:33] Jarod Godel: aside from avatars
[8:33] Which Linden: Jarod: Me too, I wonder if we can catalog e.g. how many objects are physical
[8:33] Wyn Galbraith: Alot of users aren't techies, just here for the fun.
[8:33] Jarod Godel: It should be queriabe
[8:34] Jarod Godel: queryable
[8:34] Which Linden: But that's a story for another time. :-)
[8:34] Squirrel Wood: Well, I do have one thing that milks the physics engine for what its worth :)
[8:34] Nounouch Hapmouche: When my hairs are floating in the air, I don't mind using a physical engine, but I do
[8:34] Jarod Godel: Second Life is fun?
[8:34] Jarod Godel: huh.
[8:34] Wyn Galbraith: Yes it is.
[8:34] Which Linden: Does Zero have something he does to wrap up?
[8:34] Wyn Galbraith: otherwise why are we here? ;)
[8:34] Jarod Godel: he leaves. :)
[8:34] Khamon Fate: He tells us that everything we say will be posted on the wiki
[8:35] Wyn Galbraith: Seyalaterbye.
[8:35] Jarod Godel: Wyn, the tech.
[8:35] Nounouch Hapmouche heard something about plushies ? ;)
[8:35] Khamon Fate: Oh and he drinks coffee.
[8:35] Wyn Galbraith: Linden Bears?
[8:35] Which Linden: Oh, yes, all your transcript are belong to the wiki
[8:35] Squirrel Wood: ^^
[8:35] Khamon Fate: ha ha
[8:35] Jarod Godel: some one set us up a web 2.0
[8:35] Khamon Fate: Talk as Yoda we must
[8:35] Wyn Galbraith: lindens have bears, not plushies. Plushies are TUI ;)
[8:35] Khamon Fate: Annoys some people it does.
[8:35] Which Linden: All right, thanks everyone, you were an awesome crowd today