Simulator User Group/Transcripts/2012.08.14
|Prev 2012.08.10||Next 2012.08.17|
List of Speakers
|Aeon Voom||Andrew Linden||Baker Linden|
|DrFran Babcock||Kallista Destiny||Kelly Linden|
|Kitto Flora||MartinRJ||Medhue Simoni|
|Motor Loon||Nalates Urriah||Qie Niangao|
|Rex Cronon||Sahkolihaa Contepomi||Siana Gearz|
|Simon Linden||Theresa Tennyson||Yuzuru Jewell|
[11:58] Simon Linden: Hi everyone
[11:58] Kitto Flora: Hello
[11:58] Kallista Destiny: Hi Simon
[11:59] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Good evening.
[11:59] Aeon Voom: hey simon
[11:59] Medhue Simoni: hey
[11:59] Kitto Flora: Any good news today
[11:59] Kitto Flora could do with some
[11:59] Kitto Flora: Wow
[11:59] Aeon Voom: the grid did not exploded yet?
[11:59] Aeon Voom: kidding
[12:00] Kitto Flora: Still works - one of the few things left?
[12:00] Simon Linden: Nope,no explosions with today's update
[12:00] Kitto Flora: What did todays update fix? Any of the bugs?
[12:00] Aeon Voom: none as far as i read
[12:00] Kitto Flora: Aditi grid seems to have imploded
[12:00] Simon Linden: I'm not sure what's in the release notes, but it was basically some system configuration changes
[12:01] Kitto Flora: So SL is becoming more and more broken?
[12:01] Aeon Voom: server releases more or less draws a blank
[12:01] Aeon Voom: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_Server/12
[12:02] Simon Linden: yeah, there's nothing interesting at all for bugs, performance, etc. The config changes are lower level and shouldn't have a visible effect on normally operating servers.
[12:02] Simon Linden: Tomorrow the RC channels should be updated again -- these are getting bug fixes for the various releases
[12:02] Kitto Flora: Well in the last few days my vendor has broken
[12:02] Kitto Flora: Old bug form years ago reappeared
[12:02] Nalates Urriah: Do sys config include changing out hardware? Or just OS versions and things?
[12:03] Andrew Linden: That was config only. No hardware updates this week.
[12:03] Kitto Flora: A week back llSetRegionPos() got a bug on the trun release
[12:03] Kitto Flora: trunk - not the RC one
[12:03] Simon Linden: These are just OS and low-level service settings, Nal. I'm pretty sure the OS version is exactly the same
[12:03] Nalates Urriah: Thx
[12:03] Kitto Flora: SL is now in a worse state than I seen it in years
[12:03] Andrew Linden: Kitto, what is the jira number for that llSetRegionPos() bug?
[12:04] Simon Linden: and no hardware changes are made with this update. We've been doing some hardware shuffling recently to balance the colos better, but that's not part of todays' update
[12:04] Kitto Flora: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-8118
[12:04] JIRA-helper: [#SVC-8118] llSetRegionPos() has 5 second client update delay in Second Life Server 12.07.31.262785
[12:04] Kitto Flora: SVC-8118
[12:04] Andrew Linden: huh.
[12:05] Simon Linden: The descriptoin says "Problem is not present in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.08.03.263047"
[12:05] Kitto Flora: Thats the llSetRegionPos() one - but I suspect for me it will become a moot point - as the app is diening - along with SL in general
[12:05] Simon Linden: That's further upstream - so is it fixed already?
[12:05] Kitto Flora: Right
[12:05] Object: Hello, Avatar!
[12:05] Kitto Flora: That bug appeared in 'trunk' - the thing still works right in RC Blue Steel
[12:06] Andrew Linden: BlueSteel has the big pile of bug fixes that were in the queue for a long time.
[12:06] Kitto Flora: BUT
[12:06] Kitto Flora: Blue STeel has this new llRezAtRoot() Bug that breaks my vendor
[12:06] Rex Cronon: hello everybody
[12:06] Kitto Flora: thats main -lin - current - breaks existing and serious content
[12:06] Kitto Flora: NO work-around
[12:06] Andrew Linden: Kitto, got a jira number for that one, for the record?
[12:06] Kitto Flora: Yes
[12:07] Object: Hello, Avatar!
[12:07] Kitto Flora: SVC-8146
[12:07] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-8146
[#SVC-8146] llRezAtRoot() does not set correct parameters (for sale) on rezzed object in Second Life RC BlueSteel 12.08.03.263047
[12:07] Andrew Linden: Ok thanks Kitto.
[12:07] Kitto Flora: The rezzed object has no for-sale parameter set
[12:07] Kitto Flora: so cstomers can no longer buy the product
[12:07] Andrew Linden: I'm working on maintenance for this week, so I'll try to look into that.
[12:08] Kelly Linden: kitto: I have a fix for that one. it is a rare corner case though: it requires that the last person to rez the object in world be different than the owner of the rezzer.
[12:08] Kitto Flora: thats SERIOUS
[12:08] Kelly Linden: For 8118 my test does not repro what you claim in that bug.
[12:08] Kitto Flora: NOpe - all belongs to me - rezzer - obkkects inside - activator - all me
[12:08] Kitto Flora: BROKEN in RC Blue Stele
[12:08] Kelly Linden: this box moves in client as soon as you click.
[12:08] Kitto Flora: as of 2 or 3 days ago
[12:09] Andrew Linden: That isn't a perms issue Kelly, but a "for sale" parameter getting lost.
[12:09] Kitto Flora: Works correct in TRUNK
[12:09] Kelly Linden: Andrew: yeah. I know.
[12:09] Qie Niangao: seems vaguely related to the fix for VWR-20320 (but that's rolled to release as of today)
[12:09] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-20320
[#VWR-20320] Show in search and set for sale remain enabled after owner changed
[12:09] Kitto Flora: Thats similar but a different thing
[12:09] Andrew Linden: But you're saying that changing the ownership before putting it into the rezzer will workaround the problem Kelly?
[12:10] Kelly Linden: Kitto: If you can help with a from-scratch (no previuosly existing objects) the demonstrate the bug it would help a lot. Also with 8118 - a script that shows the bug would help as a simple test doesn't show the error.
[12:10] Kelly Linden: Andrew: yes. Rezing the object in world, taking it, and then putting it in the vendor should fix it.
[12:10] Kitto Flora: OK - I keep forgetting Lindens have no clue how to build stuff inworld :)
[12:10] Andrew Linden: Other news...
[12:11] Andrew Linden: The parcel traffic calculation bug... we've found the problem.
[12:11] Aeon Voom: awesome
[12:11] Kelly Linden: Kitto: Or that your bugs don't repro.
[12:11] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Yay.
[12:11] Medhue Simoni: OMG
[12:11] Andrew Linden: I think a fix is going to be put into production today
[12:11] Andrew Linden: however...
[12:11] Andrew Linden: the results won't be visible until tomorrow
[12:11] Nalates Urriah: "production" meaning main channel?
[12:11] DrFran Babcock: great
[12:12] Aeon Voom: well thats expected i assume.
[12:12] Andrew Linden: and I don't think the fix was deployed frist thing today, so not all of today's traffic will be computed correclty
[12:12] Andrew Linden: in fact, I need to verify that the fix is on track for a deploy today
[12:12] Andrew Linden: this fix will not require a server update, it is to a backend system that is computing the dwell
[12:12] Object: Hello, Avatar!
[12:13] Andrew Linden: er... traffic
[12:13] Aeon Voom: ah. makes things even easier i assume
[12:13] Nalates Urriah: You've ruined Darrius' conspiracy plot...
[12:13] Andrew Linden: yeah, it is a little easier than a server deploy
[12:14] Simon Linden: This is just another phase of the plot, Nal
[12:14] Andrew Linden: I'm going to be working on SVC-8124 today
[12:14] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-8124
[#SVC-8124] Excessive "ParcelOverlay reliable" messages sent by regions since last rolling restart (2012-08-08)
[12:14] Nalates Urriah: :) Yikes very sneaky
[12:14] Andrew Linden: and a few other maintenance issues.
[12:14] Motor Loon: sure is an odd one
[12:14] MartinRJ: I cannot reproduce SVC-8124
[12:14] Andrew Linden: I'll try to look into some of Kitto's bugs.
[12:14] Motor Loon: I can on my magnum sim
[12:15] Theresa Tennyson: I'm not sure about the MESSAGES - the BANDWIDTH, that's easy.
[12:15] Andrew Linden: You know Martin, I looked at the code and couldn't see how it could be happening.
[12:15] Simon Linden: fwiw I'm working on SCR-372 today ... we'll cap the impulse at the max value and not spew errors
[12:15] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SCR-372
[#SCR-372] Invalid force in llApplyRotationalImpulse bug on Magnum (pathfinding)
[12:15] Qie Niangao: 8124 is messy to repro, but having a Magnum sim within draw distance seems to be a pre-req.
[12:15] Andrew Linden: I'm getting conflicting reports that it does happen on the main channel (Second Life Server) aka "trunk" as Kitto calls it.
[12:15] Siana Gearz: helloes
[12:16] Andrew Linden: And that it is not happening.
[12:16] Andrew Linden: I'm going to try to reproduce after this meeting.
[12:16] Baker Linden: I moved my group management code completely to WSGI, which will use HTTP to serve the data. This will mean no legacy viewer support for the new version. On the plus side, things are running splendidly, and I'll be getting it hooked up to the back-end via a cap later today. Then I'll be getting the viewer updated with the new data format.
[12:16] Rex Cronon: hi
[12:16] Andrew Linden: That's all the news I've got, I think.
[12:16] Motor Loon: good and bad Baker... but mostly good in my book °?°
[12:16] Nalates Urriah: Baker, if things go well then 2 to 3 weeks?
[12:17] Nalates Urriah: Andrew, Lorca/Falcon suggested I ask you when setting objects to Navmesh to Obstacle, does that affect pose balls that rez or move, if the parent is static?
[12:18] Baker Linden: Perhaps by then it'll be in an RC, ready for testing, so I don't know when it'll be released.
[12:18] Nalates Urriah: Thx Baker
[12:19] Andrew Linden: Nalates, yes I believe so. I think you can set a scripted object to be included in the navmesh calculation , but if they are then they cannot change shape or move around via script operations.
[12:19] Andrew Linden tries to remember what "obstacle" means in navmesh parlance... fires up the UI.
[12:20] Nalates Urriah: Yes Motor
[12:20] Theresa Tennyson: Region crossings seem to be worse under pathfinding for older vehicles but I'm not getting crashes.
[12:20] Andrew Linden: whoops I crashed out.
[12:20] Motor Loon: so the newly rezzed poseballs would not be part of navmesh
[12:21] Andrew Linden: I think I'm on an old version of the pathfinding viewer.
[12:21] Andrew Linden: I need to update
[12:21] Kelly Linden: There are a couple of features on BlueSteel that managed to miss the release notes. llHTTPRequest not accepts a new metadata option HTTP_CUSTOM_HEADER to set custom headers on outbound requests. I'll see about getting that into release notes and the wiki this week. Also if a remote server returns an application/json response to an llHTTPRequest the script will accept it instead of error.
[12:21] Kelly Linden: That should read llHTTPRequest now accepts
[12:21] Kelly Linden: Custom headers are most useful for auth to 3rd party APIs.
[12:21] Andrew Linden: Simon, could you copy the first half of the transcript for me? I think I lost most of it.
[12:22] Simon Linden: Sure Andrew, I'll send it in email
[12:22] Aeon Voom: i get alot of reports of crashes. more than average. the blake sea during the 3 week transition was almost unusable as well. this lead us to formulate SVC-8149
[12:22] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-8149
[#SVC-8149] Blake sea and greater Nautilus Area server proposal
[12:23] Motor Loon: it sure was a pain with all the magnums in blake sea during PF rc
[12:23] Aeon Voom: yes thats exactly the issue
[12:23] Kitto Flora: vehicles on GSLR And ONSR have been crossing borders about same as usual - EXCEPT theres been a TON of region outages, and of course the old bug thats broken GSLR - the miscalculation of region position during crossing
[12:23] Motor Loon: but
[12:24] Motor Loon: on the other hand... we're not paying per say for the blake sea sims °?°
[12:24] Aeon Voom: as mesh got rolled out. we had almost exactly the same issues. and i am very sure that in the future when the physics engine gets updated, which is inevitable. the region will suffer again from it
[12:24] Nalates Urriah: Andrew, so pose balls rezzed from a static obstacle will rez as movable objects and the parent can move them? Or they have to have a script to move their self?
[12:24] Kitto Flora: I see regions that seem to be down for hours (on mainland) - I am assuming theyy have been 'updated' but failed to start
[12:24] Andrew Linden: Nalates, pose balls rezzed from static obstacle do not inherit the navmesh properties of the rezzer.
[12:24] Aeon Voom: thats true motor. but it affects airports and business owners there in a very bad fashion. i know of allready two airport owners who consider to close their airports
[12:25] Motor Loon: nods
[12:25] Andrew Linden: So if they are movable normally, they should continue to rez such.
[12:25] Motor Loon: just mean Im glad we have them, even when it's not running as smooth as could be
[12:25] Andrew Linden: Oh... but the parent object tries to move them? What script call is used to do that?
[12:26] Aeon Voom: i know its alot asked for. but i'm just the messanger.
[12:26] Theresa Tennyson whispers: Part of the problem with the Blake Sea now is probably the excessive bandwidth issues on Magnum.
[12:26] Qie Niangao: if they're unlinked poseballs, merely rezzed from the object, it's just inter-object comms, and the poseballs move themselves accordingly
[12:26] Nalates Urriah: Andrew: I think the SetPos ... which is why I was wondering if parent objects like beds and couches have to stay moveable.
[12:26] Andrew Linden: Theresa, you only see that excessive bandwidth problem on Magnum regions today?
[12:27] Simon Linden: Aeon - I'm sure you've heard before that there's a lot going on with region crossings. I do know some regions have been shuffled around, I'll check to see if some may have been moved to different colos and made crossings worse
[12:27] Aeon Voom: that and people still got the three week "hell week" in their bones. that lasted 3 weeks and now the sim crossing issues didnt really got better, cept for the removal of the physics issue
[12:27] Theresa Tennyson: Personally I think it's more widespread. And the problem seems to be coming from ADJACENT sims.
[12:27] Theresa Tennyson: A Magnum private island seems completely normal.
[12:27] Andrew Linden: Nalates, I think that if the object that is being moved is NOT part of the navmesh, then it should be movable.
[12:27] Andrew Linden: If that is not the case I'd consider it a bug.
[12:27] Aeon Voom: you maean different server farms simon?
[12:28] Nalates Urriah: Andrw: I'll test it when I can take time
[12:28] Andrew Linden: oh interesting Theresa, that is a good clue -- coming from neighbor regions.
[12:28] Theresa Tennyson: There are lots of comments in the JIRA.
[12:29] Medhue Simoni: I have lots of things that interact on my sim and they are all movable, even the rezzers. Last I check. but now I crash every time I try to look.
[12:29] Theresa Tennyson: And it seems to be a problem when you approach the region to the SOUTH.
[12:29] Aeon Voom: well one reason for crashes is definatly that viewers often get locked up in the loading process. thats why many pilots try to fly 300m and higher. or else the "ground clutter" of the mainland sims makes them crash very quickly
[12:29] Simon Linden: Aeon - yes, one of the earlier changes that made crossings better was moving region servers so that they were geographically in the same place as neighbors. Thus there was less network lag between them
[12:30] Rex Cronon: if the interest list would work right then there should be no more crashes due to ground clutter
[12:30] Aeon Voom: yeah. it would be helpful if you'd look them up. you see the map in the jira. that would be a first step into the right direction. i have asked support to move my own sims in my estate all on the same server farm.
[12:30] Meeter: Timecheck : User Group is half over
[12:31] Theresa Tennyson: Full parcels are also still a problem with region crossings.
[12:31] Andrew Linden: You mean when crossing on a vehicle Theresa?
[12:32] Theresa Tennyson: Yes. It was SUPPOSED to be fixed a while ago but it's back.
[12:32] Aeon Voom: another reason for crashes as i found it out with airplanes is the ammount of torque the airplane has. i got no full way to reproduce it but when you have alot of torque while crossing you definatly have a higher risk at crashing. this increased with the latest version
[12:32] Kallista Destiny: Andrew could you put an update on SVC-8099 please?
[12:32] JIRA-helper: http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-8099
[#SVC-8099] The traffic on the land is not showing up correctly in search places
[12:33] Sahkolihaa Contepomi was not expecting such a big JIRA for that.
[12:33] Andrew Linden: Yes Kallista. After I verify whether the fix has been deployed yet or not, I'll comment on that issue.
[12:33] Kallista Destiny: THank you
[12:33] Aeon Voom: you'd be suprised. alot of people still use V1 based viewers which use the old search mechanism. with old traffic rules
[12:33] Simon Linden: hmm, that's a strange factor, Aeon
[12:34] Simon Linden: ... I mean about the torque (I assume you mean rotational velocity or impluses being applied)
[12:34] Kitto Flora: Is that torque as in --- omega?
[12:34] Aeon Voom: yes simon. but thats what i found out. and you can ask alot pilots too simon. rule of thump with pilots is to approach a sim to 90° with least torque as possible
[12:35] Aeon Voom: ever wondered why there are no angled runways in SL?
[12:35] Aeon Voom: ;_)
[12:35] Theresa Tennyson: Yes - hit region borders straight and try to avoid changing speed or direction when you're crossing.
[12:35] Rex Cronon: could it be possible to turn off all airplane scripts and to glide into the next sim?
[12:35] Andrew Linden: Interesting. I wonder why the angular acceleration of the vehicle would be a factor during region crossing.
[12:36] Andrew Linden: Aeon, does it crash the region where you're leaving or arriving? Or is it crashing the viewer?
[12:36] Simon Linden: I can imagine it making the predicted path wonky, but that usually just means worse rubber-banding
[12:36] Theresa Tennyson: Oh, and who ever laid out the Mainland roads? Does NOT use a land vehicle.
[12:37] Aeon Voom: it crashes the viewer in most cases. with pathfinding however there is alot of sim performance issues as you know. alot of sims crash since the release of pathfinding on the main grid. more than before definatly
[12:37] Siana Gearz: i'm back.
[12:37] Siana Gearz: sorry, what crashes the viewer?
[12:37] Siana Gearz: <- viewer dev
[12:37] Theresa Tennyson: Everything.
[12:37] Kitto Flora: The roads were decorations - builders didnt expect em to be used for anything except foot traffic
[12:37] Rex Cronon: airplane torque?
[12:38] Aeon Voom: i mean i am in alot of aviation groups. thats my business. and i see all the NOTAMs they send out on down regions, bad crossings etc. the aviation community shares those findings as soon as possinble among each other
[12:38] Andrew Linden: Crossing a region boundary on a vehicle that is changing direction quickly.
[12:38] Kitto Flora: airplane torque - helicopter? They use torqe to descibe power to rotor
[12:39] Siana Gearz: ah, probably interpolating motion into the region may cause the viewer to perform another region crossing. which is bad in case the prior one isn't complete yet.
[12:39] Siana Gearz: i'll need to check whether that can be the case at all though.
[12:39] Aeon Voom: that comes on top of it. but yes the interpolation with angular direction input might make the matter worse
[12:40] Kitto Flora: ONSR railcars cross region boundaies at oblique ange frequently - that on its own is not causing a particular problem
[12:40] Aeon Voom: i really appreciate that we can talk about this level headed. alot of the people in my community are right now not that level headed. alot of frustration as you can imagine
[12:40] Kitto Flora: They dont cross on a curve though - no curved track
[12:41] Kitto Flora: and - likely they are slow compared to airplane
[12:41] Siana Gearz: oh i'm an absolute noob. i cross a region when people tell me they have a trouble crossing the region, but not otherwise, simply too busy to travel :P
[12:41] Rex Cronon: do blimps have similar problems?
[12:42] Andrew Linden: Aeon, that viewer crash... that is an official SecondLife viewer? or a 3rd party viewer?
[12:42] Aeon Voom: recently even blimps have issues. the largest maker of blimps in SL is going bonkers right now. because his universe got turned upside down.
[12:42] Kallista Destiny: CAT? ask Mister Serapis.
[12:42] Theresa Tennyson: I find things that have throttles that will maintain a set speed cross much more smoothly than ones where you have to hold down an arrow key.
[12:43] Aeon Voom: all viewers are equally affected. some more some less.
[12:43] Andrew Linden: ok
[12:43] Siana Gearz: then... not exactly equally? which more and which less?
[12:43] Aeon Voom: i do not even want to start with the viewer discussion. there are so many these days
[12:43] Aeon Voom: thats really hard to nail down
[12:44] Siana Gearz: .oO(many is bad or many is good?)
[12:44] Kitto Flora: Aeon - are these aircraft that are having problems - are they using pure Vehicl Code, or physical + forces, or non-physical - r KFM, or llSetPos() ?
[12:44] Aeon Voom: but as a general consent. the general performance got worser.. alot
[12:44] Rex Cronon: if all lindens were required to spend at least one hour in-world each day...
[12:44] Motor Loon: aww widely
[12:44] Aeon Voom: as far as i know they do yes. kitto. pure physical. no nonphys vehicles
[12:45] Motor Loon throws peanuts on the ground
[12:45] Siana Gearz: then they'd spend this time pretending to be trees. cause their name is lindens.
[12:45] Aeon Voom: nonphys vehicles are not very popular in the aviation community.. they do not "feel" right
[12:45] Rex Cronon: :)
[12:45] Kitto Flora: OK _ Physical - use VEHICLE code? llSetVehiclexxxx() type stuff?
[12:45] Aeon Voom: yes they do
[12:46] Kitto Flora: Aeon - OK I will try my old planes, see what they do these days
[12:46] Kitto Flora: I quit flying long ago coaus of all the red cages in SL
[12:46] Aeon Voom: well if anyone wants a plane from me to try out. drop me an IM
[12:46] Aeon Voom: i am more than willing to try to help resolve these issues
[12:46] Aeon Voom: in any way possible
[12:46] Andrew Linden: If I get a chance I'll try to crash the viewer by clipping a region crossing on a plane.
[12:47] Theresa Tennyson: My plane crosses very smoothly most of the time? Motorcycle? Rubber band city.
[12:47] Simon Linden: fwiw I had a little in-house discussion about the region shuffling - it does look like that's a factor. We hope to get some of that cleaned up as the movement settles down
[12:47] Aeon Voom: thats funny too. ground vehicles often have alot harder time to cross a sim. might be the ground friction?
[12:47] Andrew Linden: If the crash is reliable - not dependent on a particular video card, then I'd expect it to be relatively easy to fix.
[12:47] Rex Cronon: theresa. the bike might have a harder time because it intereact with the ground
[12:47] Aeon Voom: thanks alot simon. you're awesome!
[12:48] Theresa Tennyson: My motorcycle is a really good example of how to NOT make a good sim crosser (It's not one of Motor's, BTW)
[12:48] Kitto Flora: How much a vehicle rubber-bands depends on how fast the object+scripts get transfered from one sim to the next, and that depends on how fast the sims are running and how much code there is in an object.
[12:48] Motor Loon: grins
[12:48] Kitto Flora: An av with no scripts attached is fast
[12:49] Aeon Voom: most pilots in SL descript. it became an iron rule among us
[12:49] Kitto Flora: A steam train with 48 scripts and 250uS cpu load - its slow
[12:49] Aeon Voom: some even strip down their avatar. no prim attachments
[12:49] Theresa Tennyson: If I bump my motorcycle across slooowly it crosses very well. At speed or changing direction? Look out.
[12:49] Kitto Flora: Auen - good move :)
[12:49] Rex Cronon: is kind of hard to take off all attachements. some of us would get naked:(
[12:50] Kitto Flora: Er - scripted attachments
[12:50] Motor Loon likes naked people
[12:50] Kitto Flora: 800-prim hair with a resize script with llListen in every prim
[12:51] Motor Loon: good to leave those inthere incase you head grows
[12:51] Rex Cronon: what is kind of weird is that bullets seem to cross sims quite well
[12:51] Kitto Flora: Maybe - but some clients are not seeing lludp object ypdate that has onls setscale, these days
[12:52] Kitto Flora: Thats a but I dfound that I have not Jira'd
[12:52] Kitto Flora: bug
[12:52] Favorites Drink Tray: You DO know there's no tea in this, don't you, DrFran Babcock?
[12:52] Kallista Destiny: Bullets are usually pretty simple objects
[12:53] Kitto Flora: Who wants the demo object for llRezAtROot() bug?
[12:53] Motor Loon: also bullet dont have avatars sitting on them
[12:53] Motor Loon: (thought that might be fun)
[12:53] Andrew Linden: I'll take it Kitto
[12:53] Medhue Simoni: Do we have a pathfinding viewer that doesn't crash loading Linksets?
[12:53] Qie Niangao has a Dr. Strangelove flash
[12:53] Kitto Flora: OK, Andrew - I built it but it works right here cause this sim is not Blue Steel
[12:54] Andrew Linden: ok
[12:54] Kallista Destiny: the PF linksets?
[12:54] Kitto Flora: I'll test it in Blue Steel - if it fails I'll drop it to you
[12:54] Medhue Simoni: yes
[12:54] Kallista Destiny: There is a pre beta Firestone that seems to work on them.
[12:54] Theresa Tennyson: Oh, and speaking of pathfinding viewers and vehicles?If you're driving cross country that dialog that comes up when you're given the option to rebake the region? Not. A. Good. Thing.
[12:55] Andrew Linden: Medhue, I crashed loading linksets today, but I think I'm on an old viewer: Second Life 3.3.2 (260239)
[12:55] Medhue Simoni: I crash loading linksets using the beta viewer on every computer i have
[12:55] Meeter: Timecheck : User Group is almost over
[12:55] Kallista Destiny: Firestorm 4.2.0 (29658)
[12:56] Medhue Simoni: Haven't been able to change anything since this beta viewer was released
[12:56] Rex Cronon: i am confused. how do u exactly crash when loading linked sets?
[12:56] Andrew Linden: Build Menu --> Pathfinding Sub Menu --> Linksets... Option
[12:57] Rex Cronon: oh. pathfinding. thanks:)
[12:57] Andrew Linden: Actually, I crashed when trying to select on of the objects listed.
[12:57] Medhue Simoni: I crash as soon as it all loads
[12:58] Medhue Simoni: on all 3 of my computers
[12:58] Sahkolihaa Contepomi hasn't had an issue with it on viewer-development.
[12:58] Rex Cronon: considering that sim can have 15k prims. is no wonder crashing is an option
[12:58] Motor Loon: I've been playing alot with the navmesh linkset list and haven't managed to crash yet at all
[12:58] Medhue Simoni: i only have like 11k on my sim
[12:59] Kallista Destiny: Is there a Jira on the linkset crash?
[12:59] Medhue Simoni: I didn't write 1 and haven't checked yet
[13:00] Rex Cronon: is very likely that the nr of prims, and the type of prims on a sim play a role in crashing the viewer
[13:00] Meeter: Thank you for coming to the Server User Group
[13:00] Simon Linden: True Rex, so if anyone writes up the reports, please put in the exact location when it happened
[13:00] Medhue Simoni: I do have alot of moving objects too, but the sim never lags
[13:01] Andrew Linden: Yeah but... the UI is just loading some XML data that it is downloading.... oh, except for the navmesh geometry data that comes down later.
[13:01] Andrew Linden: There is a "loading navmesh..." or some such text.
[13:01] Motor Loon: I belive it was mostly panic rumors medhue that caused people to state that sims would lag from it
[13:02] Andrew Linden: Medhue, do you crash after the list of objects show up or when the navemesh data download actually completes?
[13:02] Medhue Simoni: oh I know all about the lag from pf
[13:02] Rex Cronon: maybe the list/aray that holds all the prims has some memory allocation/deallocation problems?
[13:02] Medhue Simoni: I've had pathfinding for months now
[13:02] Aeon Voom: simon. can you update and comment on SVC-8149. maybe we can stay in touch through that jira as well?
[13:03] Andrew Linden: Ok, I've got a whole bunch of work to get done today, so I'm going to get back to it.
[13:03] Andrew Linden: Thanks for coming everyone.
[13:03] Rex Cronon: tc andrew
[13:03] Aeon Voom: tc andrew
[13:03] Medhue Simoni: I'll try and load it here and see if it is just my sim
[13:04] Medhue Simoni: by all
[13:04] Siana Gearz: thankies lindies ?
[13:04] Kallista Destiny: Thank you Andrew
[13:04] Rex Cronon: tc all those leaving
[13:04] Qie Niangao: Thanks Lindens... all have fun!
[13:04] Nalates Urriah: Thx Lindens
[13:04] Simon Linden: OK Aeon, I'll add something but it's going to be pretty vague -- I know better than to promise it's going to be fixed soon :P
[13:04] MartinRJ: goodbye
[13:04] Yuzuru Jewell: Thank you Lindens.
[13:04] Medhue Simoni: nope loads find here
[13:05] Aeon Voom: hey i don't ask for promises. just a statement would be enough. that motivates all the users. then they at least know someone cares.
[13:05] Aeon Voom: :)
[13:05] Kitto Flora is off to test llRezAtRoot() bug
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