Doc Team/2010-02-24

Transcript

[13:01]	Napanickg Halderman:	i loves me some viewer 2
[13:01]	Torley Linden:	Kate and Jeremy in tha hizzouse, represent!
[13:01]	Torley Linden	has pinged you.
[13:01]	Gnome Inkpen:	HELLLLO Jeremy!
[13:01]	Gnome Inkpen	has pinged you.
[13:01]	Jeremy Linden:	Whassup?
[13:01]	Neroelite Braun:	Who is on viewer 2?
[13:01]	Neroelite Braun:	and how
[13:01]	Napanickg Halderman:	i am
[13:01]	Jeremy Linden:	I'm on Viewer 2!
[13:01]	Kate Linden:	Neroelite, this is a weapons free zone :)
[13:01]	Daniel Voyager:	its been a interesting 24 hours of viewer 2.0 public beta :D
[13:01]	Niky Zenovka:	Hi everyone
[13:01]	Nathan Adored:	grrrrrr..... I've gone bald and can't do anything about it. I'm way to young to be losing my hair... oO
[13:01]	Neroelite Braun:	Hello lindens :)
[13:01]	Jeremy Linden:	Kate, that may be a bad choice of words.
[13:01]	Niky Zenovka:	<--- on Viewer 2
[13:01]	Torley Linden:	We've done quality in quantity for our Viewer 2 help, so yeah, if you need an easy link (which you can access in the in-Viewer browser) to all the help goodness, check out https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Viewer_2_Help
[13:02]	Torley Linden:	But yeah, CLICK THOSE ? buttons!
[13:02]	Neroelite Braun:	is viewer 2 in beta or something?
[13:02]	Nathan Adored:	Ah, NOW my hair finally rezzes.
[13:02]	Torley Linden:	Neroelite, yes.
[13:02]	Elite Runner:	Hi Jeremy and Kate and Torley Linden?
[13:02]	Elite Runner	has pinged you.
[13:02]	Neroelite Braun:	I should get some of that
[13:02]	Napanickg Halderman:	i heard it was in meta, neroelite :P
[13:02]	Nathan Adored:	meta? you mean beta?
[13:02]	Napanickg Halderman:	it's a joke
[13:02]	Kate Linden:	Hey Elite!
[13:02]	Gnome Inkpen:	DUN taze me bro!
[13:02]	Neroelite Braun:	Torley. Quick question. Does viewer 2 deal with the alpha sorting problem?
[13:02]	Neroelite Braun:	last question I have about that
[13:03]	Marianne McCann:	Neroelite - alpha sorting is an OpenGL issue, not an SL issue
[13:03]	Neroelite Braun:	okay thankyou
[13:03]	Marianne McCann:	Hiya
[13:03]	Niky Zenovka:	Viewer 2 is great, though I couldn't find some things
[13:03]	Nathan Adored:	I guess now that Viewer2.0b is out.,... some of the NDA stuff that was tying Torley's hands earlier are no longer under NDA?
[13:03]	Daniel Voyager:	how do you turn off tips? you can turn on land tips...
[13:03]	Allison Widdershins:	I found it slowing me down a lot but that's the learning curve.
[13:04]	Allison Widdershins:	En ツ
[13:04]	Napanickg Halderman:	i set up a twitter for my lkinden homes place, harpsichord a few minutes ago :P http://twitter.com/lhharpsichord in case anyone waqnts to follow
[13:04]	Kate Linden:	How many of you have clicked the "?" in the V2 windows?
[13:04]	Jeremy Linden:	It took me awhile to get used to Viewer 2, but it's really grown on me. There's just so much cool new stuff :-)
[13:04]	Torley Linden:	Nathan, basically, yes!
[13:04]	Neroelite Braun:	never seen more than 1 linden in one place at a time
[13:04]	Marianne McCann:	Many times
[13:04]	Napanickg Halderman:	jeremy, it took me about half an hour
[13:04]	Napanickg Halderman	has pinged you.
[13:04]	Enigma Bombay:	lol Neroelite
[13:04]	Neroelite Braun:	Wonderful to see you all exist XD
[13:04]	Nathan Adored:	Torley: Kewlness! :D
[13:04]	Torley Linden:	Napanickg, cool, I'm gonna have a look now...
[13:04]	Napanickg Halderman:	cool
[13:05]	Daniel Voyager:	tons of times
[13:05]	Elite Runner:	I'm on viewer 2!
[13:05]	Niky Zenovka:	What happened to mini-map in V2>
[13:05]	Torley Linden:	Gnome, I dig those cel-shaded ears.
[13:05]	Niky Zenovka:	?
[13:05]	Neroelite Braun:	I'm downloading right now
[13:05]	Enigma Bombay:	I can remember when Lindens walked among us... ;)
[13:05]	Napanickg Halderman:	quite simply, viewer 2 rules
[13:05]	Torley Linden:	Niky, it's still around! World menu.
[13:05]	Napanickg Halderman:	this is my first time meeting any lindens
[13:05]	Kate Linden:	We didn't think you wanted the mini-map any longer...
[13:05]	Kate Linden:	<kidding>
[13:05]	Torley Linden:	If any of you have questions about what went where and soforth, you're with a trio of experts right now... so feel free to ask.
[13:05]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:05]	Daniel Voyager:	Why are events hidden in search? I liked the search button on the bottom toolbar
[13:05]	Allison Widdershins:	I use the mini all the time
[13:05]	Niky Zenovka:	It's my compass,,, lol
[13:05]	Kate Linden:	It's under the World menu
[13:05]	Gnome Inkpen:	Viewer 2 haz revived tha intial AWW, like when I first joined Second Life. Y'know, that feeling of "OMG YOU CAN DO THAT!".
[13:05]	Elite Runner:	me too
[13:06]	Napanickg Halderman:	i love the favriotes LM bar thing
[13:06]	Jorge Erin:	yes
[13:06]	Gnome Inkpen:	Followed by a HAPPEH dance.
[13:06]	Kate Linden:	Me too Napanickg!
[13:06]	Jorge Erin:	really well done
[13:06]	Gnome Inkpen:	:D
[13:06]	Elite Runner:	I always use the mini map
[13:06]	Napanickg Halderman:	i think the Ims are a ton better too
[13:06]	CPU Core:	the minimap is important
[13:06]	Daniel Voyager:	star to add landmarks is AWESOME
[13:06]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	May I warn everyone that I am in a bloody fould mood today.
[13:06]	Torley Linden:	Daniel, essentially clicking the question mark in the search bar in the upper-right does the same thing (to open search).
[13:06]	Kate Linden:	I was joking abou the mini-map lol
[13:06]	Napanickg Halderman:	please, guys, call me nick. it's easier that way lol
[13:06]	Kate Linden:	Thanks Nick. :)
[13:06]	Torley Linden:	Ctrl-F is still shortcut to open search. One thing I'd like is a longer chatbar, some RPGers have griped about it and I understand.
[13:06]	Napanickg Halderman:	yw :)
[13:06]	SLB Wirefly:	hello
[13:07]	Niky Zenovka:	I loved the idea of tattoo layer and alpha layer... that was so great...
[13:07]	Torley Linden:	After all, a text chat message can be over 4,000 characters!
[13:07]	Napanickg Halderman:	damn. i did not know that
[13:07]	Kate Linden:	Who loves shared media?
[13:07]	Napanickg Halderman:	i do
[13:07]	Jeremy Linden:	I love shared media :-D
[13:07]	Niky Zenovka:	Me
[13:07]	Gnome Inkpen:	At first I waz like. "OMG WHERE iz that MINI map thinger!".
[13:07]	Torley Linden:	A LOT of the big stuff with Viewer 2 is about "AT LAST. YES." Like the invisiprim eliminator (in many cases) Niky mentioned, and WEB ON A PRIm. AT LAST.
[13:07]	Neroelite Braun:	Make phillip come too
[13:07]	Enigma Bombay:	as long as it's not stolen IP ;)
[13:07]	Napanickg Halderman:	that is how i updated the harpsichord twitter
[13:07]	Marianne McCann:	Liking Shared Media
[13:07]	Napanickg Halderman:	i set i9t up via that method too
[13:07]	Neroelite Braun:	yI've never met phillip before
[13:07]	Torley Linden:	Shared Media = web on a prim (as it was colloquially known).
[13:07]	Daniel Voyager:	Torley, Search is cool but you have to type something in to get the events tab etc under that..
[13:07]	Elite Runner:	I like the shared media
[13:08]	Torley Linden:	Really, Daniel? I see an Events tab that can be clicked...
[13:08]	Niky Zenovka:	The V2 look is so great... loved it...
[13:08]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	I found that you can click the magnifying glass icon
[13:08]	Kate Linden:	One cool thing (among many) about shared media is you no longer have to parcel media.
[13:08]	Torley Linden:	Oh, that's *after* doing a search, I mean, Daniel.
[13:08]	Neroelite Braun:	Will viewer 2 let my fwap at things XD
[13:08]	Neroelite Braun:	me*
[13:08]	Napanickg Halderman:	i even have a gmail address too , set up at my linden home on the prim
[13:08]	Marianne McCann:	I love Crap Mariner's idea of making the time int he upper right corner clickable for events
[13:08]	Kate Linden:	object@gmail.com?
[13:08]	Niky Zenovka:	Oh, didn't check this web on prim... coool
[13:08]	Kate Linden:	lol
[13:08]	Torley Linden:	There are some design aspects like that, Daniel, which we should examine closer... there was earlier discussion about optimizing events further but I'm not terribly close to that.
[13:09]	Napanickg Halderman:	n icksslhome@gmail.com but that was funny kate
[13:09]	lonetorus Habilis:	hello ppl
[13:09]	Elite Runner:	I like to access Twitter on the prim board
[13:09]	Torley Linden:	Mari, there's a thought!
[13:09]	Allison Widdershins:	yeah the events thing has been MUCH needed
[13:09]	Daniel Voyager:	Oh right torley. I see this (bottom snapshot) > http://www.flickr.com/photos/danielvoyager/4384869723/sizes/o/
[13:09]	Niky Zenovka:	That would be great to have like news feed and so from outer world
[13:09]	Elite Runner:	BTW My twitter is @Elite3000
[13:09]	Torley Linden:	Expect to see Doc Team using Shared Media ourselves to teach stuff inworld. I was freaking out over showing Flash inworld; it opens up tons of possibilities for video tutorials. :D
[13:09]	Napanickg Halderman:	yeah. i also think it should be closer to real time, so you dont have things showing up at noon when it's 3 :P
[13:09]	Neroelite Braun:	At some point will viewer 2 be required to be on SL? Or a version of Veiwer 2 for like emerald and what not
[13:09]	Nathan Adored:	So, any idea how long it'll be before Emerald encorperates this changes and new features?
[13:09]	CPU Core:	Every time i see the word "twitter" i die a little inside
[13:09]	Marianne McCann:	Ya, he suggested it an I was like "Brilliant!" like in those commercials
[13:09]	Neroelite Braun:	yI imagine there are aspects of viewer 2 which are more secure
[13:09]	Torley Linden:	Neroelite, eventually Viewer 2 will be required. We have a generous transition period.
[13:10]	Torley Linden:	Ah yes I see, Daniel.
[13:10]	Neroelite Braun:	Believe me I'm not complaining at all I was just curious :)
[13:10]	Daniel Voyager:	:)
[13:10]	Napanickg Halderman:	when will viewer 2 skins be out? the black can be annoying :P
[13:10]	Niky Zenovka:	How about the server end? I see is still on v1... will it get to 2 any soon>
[13:10]	Marianne McCann:	Hopefuly, very generous, given it does not work for PPC macs
[13:10]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	I don't bloody care about viewer 2.0!!!!!!!
[13:10]	Kate Linden:	For those of you who have been to my Friday office hour and asked me about 2.0 (when it wasn't public info, I really was bursting inside wanting to talk about these cool features. lol
[13:10]	Daniel Voyager:	Loves the new Destination Guide. Good work with that :)
[13:10]	Enigma Bombay:	Did Viewer 2 close the hole that allows people to copy avatars? That's one of the main reasons I use Emerald.
[13:10]	Torley Linden:	Yeah, we want to give people PLENTY of time to get used to Viewer 2... because some of the "WTF" reactions right now may turn into "OK... I can tolerate this..." to "Hey, DON'T CHANGE IT" by the time Viewer 3 is out. ;) But you know how that goes!
[13:10]	CPU Core:	there is some good stuff about viewer 2 but i think the bad stuff has the edge
[13:11]	Napanickg Halderman:	personally i think people are freaking out about change and they dont like change
[13:11]	Enigma Bombay:	Plus, I still prefer Emerald's built-in radar.
[13:11]	Marianne McCann:	Not gonna pass up an opportunity to bring up a couple JIRAs for possible votes... https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-17102 and https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-17094
[13:11]	Torley Linden:	If some of you have watched Battlestar Galactica, you know it's all happened before and will happen again.
[13:11]	Nathan Adored:	Yeah, and I've gotten so used to Emerald's double-cklick TPs
[13:11]	Enigma Bombay:	lol Marianne
[13:11]	Neroelite Braun:	And torley because I can't seem to make any of babbage's sessions. Is LSL3 out of the question now? We just getting C#. I feel like that is a basic enough question
[13:11]	CPU Core:	people are freaking out about valid points like wasted space.. the chat is eating up way too much space by default
[13:11]	Enigma Bombay:	me too, Nathan.
[13:11]	Laurent Bechir:	when is it suppposed to be final release ?
[13:12]	lonetorus Habilis:	when its done
[13:12]	lonetorus Habilis:	;)
[13:12]	Torley Linden:	Neroelite, I don't know.
[13:12]	Laurent Bechir:	:)
[13:12]	CPU Core:	the die bar invades your world
[13:12]	Elite Runner:	Torley, I like your video tutorials on viewer 2!
[13:12]	CPU Core:	side*
[13:12]	Neroelite Braun:	okay thankyou anyways
[13:12]	Niky Zenovka:	Are there plans for 64-bit versions of the viewer? And Mac tuned versions as well?
[13:12]	Torley Linden:	Laurent, we're going to have the beta out for estimated several weeks while we consider design adjustments and fix bugs.
[13:12]	Torley Linden:	Thanks Elite!
[13:12]	Kate Linden:	Have any of you taken the Viewer 2 beta survey?
[13:12]	Niky Zenovka:	Not yet
[13:12]	Arawn Spitteler:	Survey?
[13:12]	Jeremy Linden:	Hi Carl!
[13:12]	Cisop Sixpence:	I have
[13:12]	Napanickg Halderman:	not yet. didnt even know there was one lol
[13:12]	Elite Runner:	not yet
[13:12]	Torley Linden:	I'd like better performance on Mac relative to Windows, too. 64-bit *seems* eventual given the way things are headed, but I won't speculate for sure.
[13:12]	Daniel Voyager:	same here, viewer 2.0 video tutorials on the SL youtube channel is great to watch.
[13:13]	Napanickg Halderman:	but i have posted on the forums
[13:13]	Marianne McCann:	Not yet
[13:13]	Daniel Voyager:	great tips
[13:13]	Marianne McCann:	Hey Carl
[13:13]	Enigma Bombay:	I haven't used Viewer 2 yet since for reasons stated, I prefer Emerald.
[13:13]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	I waiting till I've used it a little bit longer before I go to the survey
[13:13]	Cisop Sixpence:	I like 2.0 so far.
[13:13]	Torley Linden:	So yeah, my future video tutorials will appear on both http://secondlife.com/video and http://youtube.com/secondlife take your pick :)
[13:13]	Jorge Erin:	not yet for survei i wait again some days :)
[13:13]	Napanickg Halderman:	i've noticed very little lag at the linden homes, thanks for that :P
[13:13]	bigjay Loon:	Will LSL functions be available to take advantage of Shared media features
[13:13]	Torley Linden:	But I think in many cases, yes, more people need time to sleep and absorb changes and figure out it fits into their everyday Second Life.
[13:13]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	I'd like to know how to do the web-on-a-prim and give that a try first
[13:13]	Jorge Erin:	true
[13:13]	Jeremy Linden:	bigjay, they already are! I'll grab the wiki link
[13:13]	Kate Linden:	Survey: http://new.qualtrics.com/SE/?SID=SV_dg7TbxOQkvamrtO&SVID=Prod&Preview=Survey&BrandID=secondlife
[13:14]	bigjay Loon:	ok great thanks ive been looking for it
[13:14]	Marianne McCann:	Entrepeneur - it is all under the build menu, in texture
[13:14]	Laurent Bechir:	french version should follow slowly after. There is already a presentation of viewer 2.0 in french
[13:14]	Torley Linden:	Entrepreneur, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wv20U7rJuwU video tutorial :)
[13:14]	Arawn Spitteler:	That NDA Idea was the worst feature, because it left al others to be sorted out at once. Not even speaking of its betrayal of the Tao of Linden
[13:14]	Carl Linden:	there is a help video about using web on a prim.
[13:14]	Carl Linden:	torley's got it! ^
[13:14]	Nathan Adored:	/me wodners how long it'll be before some of thise new functionality propogates out to the OpenSim grids
[13:14]	Torley Linden:	Heya Carl!
[13:14]	Enigma Bombay:	lol @ Tao of Linden, Arawn.
[13:14]	Gnome Inkpen:	OH hai THAR Carl!
[13:14]	Jeremy Linden:	http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlSetPrimMediaParams -- They were written by Strife before Viewer 2 was released, to they may not be 100% accurate, but they're pretty good
[13:14]	Kate Linden:	Lets watch it on a prim
[13:14]	Torley Linden:	HOLY CRAP CPU did I just see hit points fly out of your head?!
[13:14]	Laurent Bechir:	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_oWNI2XahY
[13:14]	Arawn Spitteler:	Tao of Linden, Transparency, are these both requiring Torley Tuts?
[13:14]	bigjay Loon:	very nice thanks
[13:15]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	Thanks, Torley
[13:15]	Adamburp Adamczyk:	hi all
[13:15]	1Time Daehlie:	Hi, how do we change to show ourselves as invisible to select users like we used to be able to
[13:15]	1Time Daehlie:	there was a check box with an eye
[13:15]	Torley Linden:	Thank Jeremy for taking the lead on Shared Media docs, he was one of the first people to play with it... ever... I think :)
[13:15]	Torley Linden	has pinged you.
[13:15]	lonetorus Habilis:	torley, and dont forget ppl will always have the option to run snowglobe and snowglobe derived clients, esp now with the new client registry (btw, the wb page cant make up its mind if its viewver registry or vieew
[13:15]	Jeremy Linden:	Pretty much. I'd still like to put together a brief Shared Media guide on the wiki, similar to the Quick Start Guide.
[13:15]	Gnome Inkpen:	1Time, thata be under a users profile and "Private & Notez", I beleive itz alled.
[13:15]	lonetorus Habilis:	...directory
[13:15]	Niky Zenovka:	quick question, the features on V2 are seen on V1? If I make a part of me invisible, others will see? From other viewers?
[13:15]	Torley Linden:	1Time, that's moved. Go to your friends list in the sidebar and click the -> arrow.
[13:16]	Gnome Inkpen:	called*
[13:16]	Torley Linden:	Then click NOTES & PRIVACY tab. Shows "Allow this person to:" under there.
[13:16]	Gnome Inkpen:	I could be WRANG tho.
[13:16]	Carl Linden:	Niky: yes
[13:16]	Elite Runner:	Torley, has Here island been revamped?
[13:16]	1Time Daehlie:	ok, I'll look there
[13:16]	Daniel Voyager:	done survey :D
[13:16]	Gnome Inkpen:	I KNEW it! I be wrang. :P
[13:16]	Torley Linden:	Kate's been rounding up what-moved-where.
[13:16]	Jeremy Linden:	Niky, yes. If you use an alpha mask in Viewer 2, Residents on 1.23 will view you correctly.
[13:16]	Carl Linden:	Alpha masks can be seen by all viewers, but only used by Viewer 2-based viewers.
[13:16]	lonetorus Habilis:	elite , its always being rewamped XD
[13:16]	Torley Linden:	Elite, yes, largely thanks to my wife, we're rebuilding.
[13:16]	Kate Linden:	yes we have some inworld goodness coming soon
[13:17]	Nathan Adored:	Will some of that in-world goodness include meshes?
[13:17]	Niky Zenovka:	OMG... these new layers will so expand the possibilities
[13:17]	Kate Linden:	Nathan, it will include info for the beta 2.0
[13:17]	lonetorus Habilis:	t, a dark sinister cave with a locked door, behind the dor you find the heart of sl all locked up in a strongbox inside a inverted iron maiden
[13:17]	Torley Linden:	By the way, if NEARBY CHAT display takes up too much space, go to Me > Preferences, click Chat tab and check "Enable plain text chat history"
[13:17]	Daniel Voyager:	In profile showing sl avatar and rl pic I don't like that much.
[13:17]	Kate Linden:	Yeah you can apply alpha layers to body parts and be invisible too lol
[13:17]	Torley Linden:	Hahaha lonetorus, that sounds like a heavy metal album I'd rock out to!
[13:18]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:18]	Arawn Spitteler:	Do Alpha Layers come in as textures to upload?
[13:18]	Carl Linden:	yes. they start as fully invisible.
[13:18]	Jeremy Linden:	You can upload custom alpha masks, Arawn, yes.
[13:18]	Kate Linden:	I think there are default textures in the Library...checking..
[13:18]	Carl Linden:	i've been using alpha layers for a while now. my avatar doesn't have any visible body parts.
[13:18]	Gnome Inkpen:	Oh GET OUTTA heare. I CAN MAKE MYSELF INVISIBLE naow? With alpha layerz.
[13:18]	Carl Linden:	look ma, no head!
[13:18]	Gnome Inkpen:	Funnnnn!
[13:19]	Jeremy Linden:	Yep! And "highlight transparent" reveals invisible parts now, too.
[13:19]	Kate Linden:	yeah there is an alpha maska folder under Body Parts in the Library
[13:19]	Kate Linden:	*Masks
[13:19]	Nathan Adored:	hmmmmm....... could be useful in, say, Predator-vs-Aliens RP.... if someone ever starts one of those
[13:19]	Neroelite Braun:	ididn't control alt T show transparents anyways?
[13:19]	Marianne McCann:	Ouch
[13:19]	Torley Linden:	"Alpha Maska" sounds like a fierce luchador!
[13:19]	Neroelite Braun:	or just that it can be done by click of button
[13:19]	Winter Ventura:	How would you suggest content creators deal with the customer need for multiple alpha layers? ie: if a prim corset required invisiprims before, and they switch over to using an alpha mask, and the same person wants to wear shoes that require an alpha mask, right now they're forced to choose ONE alpha mask. what would the Lindens suggest as a way that content creators can address this?
[13:19]	Torley Linden:	I saw this hilarious video of Predators exercising.
[13:20]	lonetorus Habilis:	torley, hmm, might be, but it was me desribing the secret cave of here island or at least as i imagine it (had a breif convo with rav last night, thus the diggin tools)
[13:20]	Nathan Adored:	Jeremy: What sort of invisible parts?
[13:20]	Nathan Adored	has pinged you.
[13:20]	Arawn Spitteler:	/me looks hungrily at the Lunchador
[13:20]	Jeremy Linden:	Anything covered by an alpha mask is invisible -- And much better for Avatar Rendering Cost than invisiprims :-)
[13:20]	Torley Linden:	lonetorus, ahhhh heh heh yeah, she mentioned that to me, we gotta put some cool animals. You contributed paint tubes didn't you?
[13:20]	lonetorus Habilis:	i haz paint tubes also
[13:21]	Winter Ventura:	But if the alpha mask that comes with the shoes only cuts off the feet, and the alpha mask that comes with the corset only cuts off the belly.. what is the customer to do?
[13:21]	CPU Core:	I think you need an intall which automatii look forward to the upgrade of my avatar with alpha masks :)
[13:21]	Torley Linden:	Winter, I personally don't have a suggestion for that yet. I need to use alpha masks more firsthand.
[13:21]	CPU Core:	err.. messed up 2 lines
[13:21]	Nathan Adored:	Can these alpha masks make a person semi-transperent instea of totally invisible? Would be useful for stuff like... ghosts...
[13:21]	Torley Linden:	Ghosts or holograms!
[13:21]	Carl Linden:	winter: there are alpha masks for lower and upper body.
[13:21]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	I'm noticing I'm getting a lot more crashes on 2.0I'm getting a lot of crashes
[13:21]	Jeremy Linden:	Winter, there are several different areas that can be covered by different alpha masks, sort of like the "shirt" vs. "pants" areas of clotihng
[13:21]	Carl Linden:	if clothing requires alpha masks for the same part of the body, though...
[13:21]	Torley Linden:	Thanks Carl and Jeremy! =)
[13:21]	Torley Linden	has pinged you.
[13:22]	Carl Linden:	then yeah, you might still be stuck using invisiprisms.
[13:22]	Elite Runner:	I like to keep the sidebar open when I'm on Second Lifedisplaying on a widescreen monitor
[13:22]	Arawn Spitteler:	/me doesn't know how to bring SL2 back up
[13:22]	Winter Ventura:	yes buyt the end user can't easily create an alpha mask (there are no sliders). so it's up to the content creators, the people selling the shoes, corsets, cybernetic arms, etc.. to provide the matching alpha masks.
[13:22]	Carl Linden:	yes. just as they'd provide invisiprisms before.
[13:22]	Torley Linden:	lonetorus, dance! I gotta take a pic.
[13:22]	Nathan Adored:	What would it take to have in-world means of making and adjusting alpha masks? A hud maybe?
[13:22]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	Sp ypou havent avoied theold alpha mask problems, jyst added ne ways o havethem. j joy!
[13:23]	Elite Runner:	lol
[13:23]	Winter Ventura:	so how does one wear their shoes from creator A, with their cyber arms from creator B?
[13:23]	lonetorus Habilis:	winter, your avatars would benefit from a propper alpha mask, will you issue updates? (can you?)
[13:23]	Neroelite Braun:	does the invisprim texture work as a clothing option to invisiblize avatars?
[13:23]	Carl Linden:	winter: lower and upper body are two different masks
[13:23]	Neroelite Braun:	or only on objects
[13:23]	Kate Linden:	lone great tube of paint!
[13:23]	Carl Linden:	there are 5 masks total.
[13:23]	Carl Linden:	lower, upper, head, eye, and hair.
[13:23]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:24]	Winter Ventura:	(personal) when Viewer 2.0 leaves beta, I will update my products with that option, and will send updates to the previous owners I have on file (about 85% of previous owners)
[13:24]	Nathan Adored:	]Hello Carl Linden. Nice old-school robot av! :D
[13:24]	Winter Ventura:	Carl, but there's only one clothing item
[13:24]	Napanickg Halderman:	awsome av carl
[13:24]	lonetorus Habilis:	there ya go
[13:24]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	All the same UP mapping as any other texture then.
[13:24]	Kate Linden:	Thanks!!
[13:24]	Winter Ventura:	it's 5 textures on one alpha mask item
[13:24]	Carl Linden:	ah, i see what you mean.
[13:24]	Carl Linden:	you can't mix and match alpha ITEMS.
[13:24]	Carl Linden:	you might be right about that.
[13:24]	Winter Ventura:	so how does the end user deal with the problem of perhaps needing to "mix masks"?
[13:24]	Laurent Bechir:	is there a doc on alpha masks ? I confess I understand nothing on that matter :)
[13:25]	Carl Linden:	by providing individual alpha textures, i'd assume. but i don't know anything further.
[13:25]	Winter Ventura:	Is there a way we could be provided with sliders?
[13:25]	Jeremy Linden:	There's a little bit in the context sensitive help, but I'm not sure there's a comprehensive doc in the KB yet :-/
[13:25]	Marianne McCann:	Torley - will there be a vidtut on the proper and safe use of shift-control-alt-H?
[13:25]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	Where have the functions of the Network tab in Preferences been moved to?
[13:25]	Elite Runner:	And Torley, I like the dream journal music
[13:25]	Arawn Spitteler:	/me doesn't confess to not knowing, but accuses others of knowing more
[13:25]	Nathan Adored:	I'm lost..... what would these sliders be for?
[13:25]	Torley Linden:	Mari, tell me more about what you mean by "proper and safe use"? Hahaha.
[13:25]	Laurent Bechir:	Arawn : :))
[13:25]	Nathan Adored:	What would the sliders control, I mean.
[13:26]	Arawn Spitteler:	What's the H for?
[13:26]	Carl Linden:	entrepreneur: first place i'd look would be Setup
[13:26]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	History?
[13:26]	Jeremy Linden:	Network settings have been moved to the Setup tab, yes.
[13:26]	Marianne McCann:	Well, you never know what could happen when you bring up hippos!
[13:26]	Carl Linden:	I see a Network subsection in there.
[13:26]	Arawn Spitteler:	I know Shift Control H, but not Shift Control Alt H
[13:26]	Niky Zenovka:	And on tattoos? Can they be applied to any of the 5 masks too? @Carl
[13:26]	Carl Linden:	Tattoos are a different layer than masks.
[13:26]	Neroelite Braun:	TORLY: whats teh square root of a slice of strawberry rhubarb pie?
[13:26]	Torley Linden:	Mari, there was a funny version of the Three Wolf Moon shirt I saw recently that was effectively Three Hippo Moon.
[13:26]	Carl Linden:	If you're using Viewer 2, you can look in your Library for some tattoos and try applying them.
[13:26]	Marianne McCann:	Oh awesome.
[13:26]	Torley Linden:	Neroelite, I have no clue. I'm a watermelon person.
[13:26]	Winter Ventura:	(sliders would be for the procedural editing of moddable alpha "skins" (I don't know what to call them).. allowing a customer to perhaps "adjust the sliders" if they also wanted to cut off the feet. The only solution I can see right now is providing alpha masks as textures with product packages, and providing instructions for customers to insert them
[13:26]	Carl Linden:	I don't know if they work on individual body parts.
[13:27]	Nathan Adored:	(ah)
[13:27]	Kate Linden:	brb
[13:27]	Torley Linden:	http://www.popculturetees.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/Hippopoticorn-420x420.jpg oh my gosh they're unicorns
[13:27]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:27]	Niky Zenovka:	I was think more on like using tattoos to make polished nails (and still keep gloves available...)...
[13:27]	Arawn Spitteler:	/me tries to recall a recipe for Watermelon Pi
[13:27]	Marianne McCann:	That's bizarre and wonderful
[13:27]	Allison Widdershins:	that nails idea is great
[13:27]	Nathan Adored:	Are watermelon pi squared?
[13:27]	Jeremy Linden:	Carl, I think I see what Winter is saying. It could be neat to have editable alpha mask parts, the same way you can edit the length and shape of a default shirt.
[13:28]	Carl Linden:	Yeah.
[13:28]	Neroelite Braun:	I can't just cover the feet
[13:28]	Neroelite Braun:	I see what winter means
[13:28]	Neroelite Braun:	i see what winter means
[13:28]	Carl Linden:	Although... with the abundant use of textures rather than sliders like "eyebrows" and "lips" I'm not sure how many people would make use of it.
[13:28]	Carl Linden:	Better than nothing at all, though!
[13:28]	Neroelite Braun:	It has to be the whole bottom
[13:28]	Jeremy Linden:	Neroelite, you could cover just your feet currently, with the right mask textures.
[13:29]	Winter Ventura:	That would make it very easy for customers to "add shoe support" to an otherwise custom alpha layer.. and would make it very easy for the shoe makers to adapt, since they could make a quick alpha inviewer just by "trimming back" from the toes up to the ankles
[13:29]	Marianne McCann:	Could be a useful avenue, though
[13:29]	Neroelite Braun:	But like winter said. If there was a slider to just cover as much as we need
[13:29]	Neroelite Braun:	Just sayin
[13:29]	Neroelite Braun:	And an instant Pie button would be nice as well
[13:29]	Carl Linden:	It would be cool to see yourself gradually disappear from top to bottom.
[13:29]	Carl Linden:	And scary.
[13:29]	Jeremy Linden:	Heh!
[13:29]	Nathan Adored:	/me smiles.
[13:29]	Napanickg Halderman:	the alpha masks would be great for shirts and skyes it would carl
[13:29]	Elite Runner:	However, I used shared media (media on a prim) on a vehicle, like the upcoming release of the 2010 Shark v2.2 multi-use vehcile, the 2010 Rex v2.0 and the 2010 Raptor v2.0 land vehicles
[13:29]	Marianne McCann:	"Help me! I'm melting! What a world what a world...."
[13:30]	Kate Linden:	back
[13:30]	Napanickg Halderman:	shared media rules BTW thanks for including it :P
[13:30]	lonetorus Habilis:	carl, it is possible with scriptable inventory
[13:30]	Gnome Inkpen:	WELCOME BACK! dude.
[13:30]	Winter Ventura:	(btw, I love that "Show Invisibles" shows the fully textured avatar.. it was so funny seeing my avatar appear when I pressed that"
[13:30]	Napanickg Halderman:	wb kate
[13:30]	Arawn Spitteler:	Disappearing in parts is best in a smiling cat avatar
[13:30]	Kate Linden:	ty :)
[13:30]	Napanickg Halderman:	yw
[13:30]	Gnome Inkpen:	dudette, rather. :D
[13:30]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:30]	Elite Runner:	:D
[13:30]	Neroelite Braun:	where is that button winter?
[13:30]	Nathan Adored:	/me lols at Arawn
[13:30]	Niky Zenovka:	Smiling Cat.... reminds me of the coming movie of Alice....
[13:30]	Kate Linden:	If your taking pics please submit them to our doc team flickr page
[13:30]	Kate Linden:	We'd love to share them
[13:30]	Winter Ventura:	Ctrl-Alt-T where it's always been
[13:31]	Laurent Bechir:	shared medias is the possibility to have several prims with medias on your parcel, it's that ?
[13:31]	Neroelite Braun:	I'm confused whats different
[13:31]	Elite Runner:	/me smiles
[13:31]	Carl Linden:	Laurent: yes.
[13:31]	Gnome Inkpen:	I gotta reale niice, greay laggy goodnezz. Pic. Lolz.
[13:31]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:31]	Thriller Dancer:	Say 'on' or 'off'to turn me on or off, or 'help' for more commands
[13:31]	Daniel123 Eddingham:	hey
[13:31]	Winter Ventura:	I've made a few jira posts recently regarding bugs and buglike things in 2.0, so I hope someone is looking
[13:31]	Torley Linden:	http://www.flickr.com/groups/docteam/
[13:31]	Carl Linden:	Shared media has nothing to do with parcels, actually. It's specific to prims.
[13:31]	Jeremy Linden:	Shared media is per-prim, instead of per-parcel. So yes, you can have several media objects playing different media at the same time, on the same parcel :-)
[13:31]	Kate Linden:	Thanks Torley :)
[13:32]	Marianne McCann:	I'll look em up Winter. I've a few as well
[13:32]	lonetorus Habilis:	@doc team, i would still like to see some documented "best practices" for content creators ie. not using too large textures etc
[13:32]	Neroelite Braun:	DO you have to be land owner to use shared media for others to see it ?
[13:32]	Laurent Bechir:	nice :)
[13:32]	Neroelite Braun:	or is it a permissions thing
[13:32]	Jeremy Linden:	Also, shared media is interactive. You can click links on webpages, scroll webpages, rewind a video, etc.
[13:32]	Winter Ventura:	<- WinterVentura on twitter, I posted links there
[13:32]	Napanickg Halderman:	BTW, whyen are the control panels on linden homes going be activated? :P
[13:32]	Flight Band:	All Go
[13:32]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	When will we see the new script limit indicators?
[13:32]	Niky Zenovka:	Now..Sharing media will give the option to add 3D effects... imagine something going on a prim and then you do some particles and glow effects... lol
[13:32]	Kate Linden:	Torley don't you have a video about inworld performance?
[13:32]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	Right, gentlemen, Linden Lab have managed to change so many things in the last week that I have lost track of what is going on. I don't know why I'm lagging. But until you sort out the non-beta stuff, I am not going to touch the new viewer with a bargepole. Texture download times can be measured in geological time, and you're enthusing about new textures. The web is inundated with malicious web pages, and you plan to bypass routine web browser security systems. From where I sit, you look insane. What are you smoking, boys?
[13:32]	Neroelite Braun:	lol someone is using old time flight band awesome
[13:32]	Nathan Adored:	What I'd love to see is a something I saw someone showing being done experementally in a different VR world (that wasn't an SL or OPenSim-based syste,): they created what amounted to a magic doorway prim you could look thought into another place, and walk right through to that other place.
[13:32]	Torley Linden:	lonetorus, that was something Pastrami, Runitai and others hoped to work on awhile back but it was shelved. I agree it's great to know... maybe like other wiki pages I'll need to compile over time and encourage others to join in...
[13:33]	Arawn Spitteler:	For Control Panel Activation on Linden Homes, I'd suggest Michael Hour at 3PM, in Shamon
[13:33]	Napanickg Halderman:	ok
[13:33]	Torley Linden:	Kate, different ones, I didn't do a texture one a la what lonetorus is asking for .
[13:33]	Kate Linden:	Control Panel is not yet out
[13:33]	Kate Linden:	but its very cool ; )
[13:34]	Torley Linden:	Gentle reminder that we're the Documentation Team and we're best equipped to answer questions you have about Viewer help and such; if we know more we can share, we shall, but we can't guarantee it. ;) Carl brings his web experience and beyond too! AWWW YEAHHH.
[13:34]	Carl Linden:	Is everyone fiding new Search to be usable?
[13:34]	lonetorus Habilis:	torley, yeah though farming it out to the community could lead to inacurate information, im thinking the ppl that know often are too busy making linden dollars XD
[13:34]	Elite Runner:	I just recently took a pic
[13:34]	Nathan Adored:	*could look through into
[13:34]	Marianne McCann:	Carl - I find it harder to search events
[13:34]	Torley Linden:	lonetorus, have you seen the wiki system we already have in place? Articles in the "Knowledge Base" must be reviewed by us or a qualified Resident Reviewer. So if there's crap I'd throw it out.
[13:34]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	It was difficult to get used to at first, but its ok now, yes.
[13:35]	Marianne McCann:	(And again, I mention Crap Mariner's possible solution)
[13:35]	Niky Zenovka:	haven't tried much yet
[13:35]	Carl Linden:	The largest change in search is that you must search generally before drilling down to events.
[13:35]	Carl Linden:	In a week we'll be enabling some sorting that we had to disable temporarily.
[13:35]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	/me facepalms.
[13:35]	bigjay Loon:	I tend to think Search places ordered by Traffic seemed more useful than the default using google relevance to find places
[13:35]	Winter Ventura:	I'll be honest, most everyting is FAIRLY easy to find in the new viewer, I mean a lot has changed, but it's still discoverable (to use a term) I am concerned about the removal of "Create" (now "Build" from the context menu when you click on a prim.. so much of SL is skyboxes, platforms and whatnot.. it's kind of jarring not to have access to it.
[13:35]	Elite Runner:	why is it disabled?
[13:35]	Carl Linden:	bigjay: traffic is a big problem. It's highly gamed.
[13:36]	CPU Core:	new search tool hasnt been that great for me.. it was failing to find land when i last tried it
[13:36]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	That part is a little bit inconvenient; requiring the general search. Doesn't it have to parse through a lot more data that way?
[13:36]	Marianne McCann:	Agreed, winter. Seen a JIRA at all on that? It's a major pain
[13:36]	Torley Linden:	And for anyone who hasn't bookmarked https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Viewer_2_Help but would like to keep up-to-date with the evolution of our help resources, please do! We hope to have FAQs to hot questions and much more soon.
[13:36]	Winter Ventura:	yeah I wrote one.. lol
[13:36]	Neroelite Braun:	SO are you guys actually already working on viewer 3?
[13:36]	Marianne McCann:	Drop me a link?
[13:36]	Winter Ventura:	https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-17130
[13:36]	Napanickg Halderman:	hopefully you guys will launch viewer 2 skins next release :P
[13:36]	bigjay Loon:	thats true but we usually weed out the gamers by looking at the map to see who is running bot farms
[13:36]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	Does 2.0 have a way to bookmark web url's?
[13:36]	Flight Band:	All Go
[13:37]	Nathan Adored:	what's a bot farm?
[13:37]	Neroelite Braun:	Are lindens already working on viewer 3.0?
[13:37]	Torley Linden:	For those of you not comfortable with using camera controls, remember you can right-click on an avatar or object and choose Zoom In. There are related features in the Build menu, "Focus on Selection" and "Zoom to Selection".
[13:37]	Winter Ventura:	Oh yes something that's counterintuitive. I can create a folder inside the "favourites" folder.. but it doesn't create a menu in the favourites bar (like firefox would).
[13:37]	CPU Core:	i have been finding it inconventient opening the build menu
[13:37]	Marianne McCann:	I would doubt it, Neroelite
[13:37]	Torley Linden:	Hmmm that's a good Q, Entrepreneur! I haven't seen one.
[13:37]	Carl Linden:	Highly highly suggest watching Torley's vids on http://secondlife.com/youtube. I've been using Viewer 2 for months, and I still learned a lot.
[13:37]	Torley Linden:	=^_^=
[13:37]	Carl Linden:	er...
[13:37]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	Thanks, Torley
[13:38]	Carl Linden:	i'm dyslexic...
[13:38]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:38]	Carl Linden:	http://youtube.com/secondlife
[13:38]	Carl Linden:	not the other way around.
[13:38]	bigjay Loon:	lol
[13:38]	Napanickg Halderman:	yeah thanks torley the vid tutorials helped me too :P
[13:38]	Carl Linden:	although we could definitely make a redirect link. :P
[13:38]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:38]	CPU Core:	i never used camera controls when i was newbie.. never have found a use for them.. and the movement controls??
[13:38]	Winter Ventura:	(how about just video.secondlife.com? lol
[13:38]	Torley Linden:	Napanickg, re: skinnability and other alternative customization, remember that we're continuing to encourage open source development efforts so alternate viewers will flourish.
[13:38]	Napanickg Halderman:	bgut carl,l i like the first link better :P
[13:38]	Torley Linden:	Winter, http://secondlife.com/video  :) Close enough?
[13:38]	Winter Ventura:	sure
[13:38]	Napanickg Halderman:	ok
[13:39]	Niky Zenovka:	Would be nice if V2 kept a log of non-read conversations even after a logoff... Like I logged to try V2 first time yesterday (had some 15 messages), but then I crashed... ended up not knowing what the messages were...
[13:39]	Jeremy Linden:	Uh oh. Someone found my shared media prim
[13:39]	Neroelite Braun:	Is shared media a personal thing. When I click on a link will website change for everhyone else oo?
[13:39]	Napanickg Halderman:	lol
[13:39]	Lionel Oliva:	hi everyone, please forgive my lurking, i'm just getting back up to speed after an absence from SL.
[13:39]	CPU Core:	its fun playing games on a prim
[13:39]	CPU Core:	flash games
[13:39]	Marianne McCann:	Voted, Winter
[13:39]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	Oh, Torley's videos are well made, but I'm one of those old fogeys who prefers to read tech instructions.
[13:39]	Arawn Spitteler:	http://video.secondlife.com has a certain grace, if the domain is free
[13:39]	Elite Runner:	BTW I subscribed to the Second Life Youtube channel
[13:39]	Winter Ventura:	Oh hey there's something that hasn't been shown in any of the videos that I wanted to ask about shared media
[13:39]	Carl Linden:	The only thing that's really "shared" about Shared Media is the URL.
[13:40]	Winter Ventura:	if I set up a shared media prim, and someone navigates using it, will I see their navigation changes? or will it remain at the starting url?
[13:40]	Carl Linden:	Whatever URL is currently displayed on the prim is what everyone else sees. But not the content itself.
[13:40]	Jeremy Linden:	With shared media, if the URL changes, it changes for everyone else. They won't see you scrolling the page or typing text, though, unless the page would normally do that with multiple visitors.
[13:40]	Neroelite Braun:	What do they see then carl?
[13:40]	bigjay Loon:	does it depend on the land owner?
[13:40]	Neroelite Braun:	or is just just up to the other people to click the link
[13:40]	Carl Linden:	Pretend that you're running Firefox on your home machine. When you scroll everyone else looking at the same page isn't going to scroll.
[13:40]	Carl Linden:	But the difference is, everyone is going to be on the same page.
[13:40]	bigjay Loon:	will a shared media prim need to be deeded on group land for eveyone to see it ?
[13:40]	Carl Linden:	No, it has nothing to do with land.
[13:41]	Neroelite Braun:	So if I change the page the page will change for everyone else?
[13:41]	Jeremy Linden:	Nope, bigjay. It's totally per-prim
[13:41]	1Time Daehlie:	wow I just checked the notes and privacy
[13:41]	bigjay Loon:	ahh ok
[13:41]	Torley Linden:	Hmm none of my postcards seem to be making it to the outside world in Viewer 2. Will have to check on that later, anyone else notice the same?
[13:41]	1Time Daehlie:	this is more time consuming
[13:41]	Carl Linden:	Neroelite: yes.
[13:41]	Marianne McCann:	Torley - that is a server bug
[13:41]	Neroelite Braun:	okaythankyou
[13:41]	1Time Daehlie:	since you have to visit each profile
[13:41]	Torley Linden:	Sounds like we need to clearly emphasize the difference between old-skool parcel media and new Shared Media (tm). :D
[13:41]	bigjay Loon:	awesome tks
[13:41]	Arawn Spitteler:	So, in Scripting Class, I should be able to post my script, somewhere?
[13:41]	Carl Linden:	For prims you create, you can whitelist specific pages and domains.
[13:41]	Napanickg Halderman:	yeah
[13:41]	Winter Ventura:	okay so each user has to click "play" on the video in order to see it, so it's not synced between viewers. that's a little disappointing, but woraroundable
[13:41]	Marianne McCann:	And seems to be oddly intermittant. I'll get you the JIRA
[13:41]	1Time Daehlie:	to mark yourself visible or not
[13:41]	Carl Linden:	So you can restrict people from navigating away from the page it's on if you own the prim.
[13:41]	Neroelite Braun:	Oh I see
[13:41]	Marianne McCann:	Here oyu go, Torley: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-5387
[13:42]	Napanickg Halderman:	i was able to imput a t4exture for a group fine :P
[13:42]	Carl Linden:	One feature I'm a little hazy on is what happens with sites you log into...
[13:42]	Neroelite Braun:	lol
[13:42]	Jeremy Linden:	Winter, you can enable auto-play to approximate shared movie viewing, but it's not perfect.
[13:42]	Kate Linden:	And you can also limit the URLs loaded by that prim. Is that right Carl?
[13:42]	Carl Linden:	Kate: right
[13:42]	Winter Ventura:	yeah I played with that, I was able to lock a prim to just my website domain, and they could browse anywhere they wanted within the site, but not to a linked site
[13:42]	Niky Zenovka:	Shared Media allows to have multiple medias in land? Inside different prims? Like land media wouldn't?
[13:42]	Neroelite Braun:	Can you forward and rewind videos now?
[13:42]	Carl Linden:	Such as - when you go to Gmail.com on a prim, and you log in, people will NOT be seeing your logged-in stuff... but what WILL they see?
[13:42]	Jeremy Linden:	Correct, Niky.
[13:42]	Elite Runner:	Someone just searched Youtube Torley Linden Naked on the mediaprim
[13:42]	Torley Linden:	Mari, here's the odd thing: I saw a similar issue reported much further back by Fake Fitzgerald. I *always* get that message but my postcards are almost always delivered. So I'm wondering if what I see now with Viewer 2 is different.
[13:42]	Carl Linden:	will they see a login page of their own? Wouldn't that change the other person's URL around?
[13:42]	Torley Linden:	:O
[13:42]	CPU Core:	how can you have a trade mark for "Shared Media"?
[13:42]	Carl Linden:	I would need to test it out.
[13:43]	Winter Ventura:	*eclectic-randomness.com* seems though that it doesn't like forward slashes or http in there.. so http://www.eclectic-randomness.com/* didn't work.
[13:43]	Torley Linden:	Mari, http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2283
[13:43]	Kate Linden:	If you load a youtube video on a prim, you would use the youtube video controls as you would in your browser to forward or rewind, pause etc.
[13:43]	Napanickg Halderman:	carl, i have a prim set up in my linden home if you wanted to check it out and stuff :P
[13:43]	Neroelite Braun:	How secure is this shared media. If I go to facebook and login. Will other peopel hae an opportunity to copy my password?
[13:43]	Neroelite Braun:	While I'm logging in
[13:43]	Marianne McCann:	Thanks, Torley! Clearly relatable
[13:43]	Carl Linden:	no. no one can see that you're typing anything in to a shared media url.
[13:43]	Gnome Inkpen:	Eh, searching fore Torley Linden Nekkid iz not a new endeavor. LOLz.
[13:43]	1Time Daehlie:	my work calls ,but I will need to stay logged in here ... just so I have a log of all the good information.
[13:43]	Neroelite Braun:	Okay
[13:44]	Laurent Bechir:	Torley : I've just tried and nothing is still arrived
[13:44]	Carl Linden:	hmm. i just logged into my email using that prim.
[13:44]	Carl Linden:	but it looks like it keeps reloading when everyone else tries logging in as well.
[13:44]	Niky Zenovka:	geez, but is it good to watch your personal things inworld anyways?
[13:44]	Jeremy Linden:	I still see the login page :-)
[13:44]	Carl Linden:	so... there are some problems with using logged-in sites. no security hazards, though.
[13:44]	lonetorus Habilis:	torley, would a best practice docu project fall under docu team?
[13:44]	Wut Moorlord:	only hazard i can guess is you might reveal your IP if you automatically allowed your client to connect to a server that was logging it
[13:45]	Marianne McCann:	Hmn. That JIRA is for 1.34 and earlier. May need an update to reflect 1.36.0 specific trouble
[13:45]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	Carl, I don't trust you on that, just on general principles.
[13:45]	Neroelite Braun:	Can I make a suggestion. Have a feature to see who changed a webpage. SO you know when someone is screwing around.
[13:45]	Arawn Spitteler:	That already happens with Streaming Media
[13:45]	Carl Linden:	WolfBaginski: how so?
[13:45]	Neroelite Braun:	Say you're having an open jira seminar and someone changes it to a porn site
[13:45]	Neroelite Braun:	so you know who to ban
[13:45]	CPU Core:	webcams work great on a prim
[13:45]	Winter Ventura:	Another odd thing in the viewer.. might be worth mentioning in a tutorial.. Me > My Dashboard.. opens an inviewer webbrowser, which asks me to log in to second life;s website. That seems really bizarre, since I'm already logged into Second Life. is there a fix coming for that down the line? because otherwise I'd consider that something that needs explaining that it's "safe" to do so.
[13:45]	Torley Linden:	We sure have lively chat today.
[13:45]	Wut Moorlord:	Arawn: right, only now anyone can do it without being the parcel owner
[13:45]	Carl Linden:	Unless your credentials are stored as query arguments in a GET request, no one should be able to see the interaction between your viewer and the server.
[13:46]	Jeremy Linden:	Neroelite, the owner of a shared media prim can lock it down so only certain people can use it.
[13:46]	Jeremy Linden:	Er, change it
[13:46]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	I don't ewven know which company wrote the code which displays web content.
[13:46]	Carl Linden:	That would be Apple
[13:46]	Wut Moorlord:	WebKit?
[13:46]	Carl Linden:	Yes
[13:46]	Carl Linden:	With help from Nokia, since it's an implementation of QtWebKit
[13:46]	Torley Linden:	*nods* WebKit's been mentioned in press info and other sources. Please see http://blogs.secondlife.com for more. :)
[13:46]	Elite Runner:	I have to get the latest news
[13:46]	Gnome Inkpen:	YAYZERAMA fore WebKit.
[13:47]	Wut Moorlord:	thanks :)
[13:47]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	There are these things called hyperlinks which you can use in your web pages, you know.
[13:47]	Carl Linden:	agreed :)
[13:47]	Napanickg Halderman:	i got to do some running around. nice to meet you all and i'll see ya around :P
[13:47]	Nathan Adored:	l8r nick
[13:47]	Winter Ventura:	(ps, why isn't the tattoo layer tintable?)
[13:47]	Gnome Inkpen:	Seeee yaz Nick!
[13:47]	Kate Linden:	Thanks for joining us Nick
[13:47]	Torley Linden:	Did you know you can also drag-and-drop URLs from another desktop app like your web browser onto Shared Media? :)
[13:47]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	"Webkit", as a label, is a word I am only vaguely aware of.
[13:47]	bigjay Loon:	so we can use webkit to play direct mp4 videos links on group land without deeding
[13:48]	Neroelite Braun:	Welcome Timeless
[13:48]	Carl Linden:	WolfBaginski: http://webkit.org
[13:48]	Marianne McCann:	Gotta scoot - have fun, all!
[13:48]	Elite Runner:	Have u heard about the seaworld trainer in which he was killed by a killer whale?
[13:48]	Nathan Adored:	hello Timeless
[13:48]	Carl Linden:	It's the rendering engine that Safari and Chrome use.
[13:48]	Timeless Prototype:	hiyas
[13:48]	Marianne McCann:	Bye Bye!!
[13:48]	Wut Moorlord:	WebKit started out as Konqourer's html layout engine, was adopted by apple for safari, and is generally all round okay
[13:48]	Nathan Adored:	I love the nick! ;D
[13:48]	Gnome Inkpen:	WolfBaginski, fore more info: http://webkit.org/
[13:48]	Timeless Prototype:	oh no, we have webkit in SLV2?
[13:49]	Wut Moorlord:	xD
[13:49]	Carl Linden:	Yes. The Home sidebar and Search floater are full webkit pages.
[13:49]	Nathan Adored:	l8r Mari
[13:49]	Carl Linden:	(HTML, JS, CSS)
[13:49]	Tensai Hilra:	so i guess, I may be late in this, but can shared media be split? so each person sees different things? I know collaboration is the end-goal, but personalized data is useful too
[13:49]	CPU Core:	it would be good if the client automatically logged into SL using the password we allready intered to logged into the world. I mean when we put SL on a prim its going to be really easy to make a mistake and type a password out in chat
[13:49]	Torley Linden:	Mari, have you gotten postcards to work at all in Viewer 2? I wonder if the problem I'm having is with this Viewer (it sends me that same server error message). I'll compare later.
[13:49]	Carl Linden:	Tensai: in some ways. Via JavaScript, Flash, and other things.
[13:49]	Carl Linden:	But everyone must be seeing the same HTTP URL.
[13:49]	Carl Linden:	It gets a bit complicated, unfortunately.
[13:49]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	/me chuckles at Timeless. "I still don't know enough to decide, but at least I know where to look."
[13:50]	Laurent Bechir:	Torley : my postcard is arrived :)
[13:50]	Nathan Adored:	/me gives a lopsided smile.
[13:50]	Niky Zenovka:	How about location streaming restrictions? Some websites restrict the countries a media can be streamed to... if I implement a media on a prim, how these sites will see about the location of the stream request to block it or not?
[13:50]	CPU Core:	i allready logged into my SL account on a prim :)
[13:50]	Wut Moorlord:	has anyone tried to load a java applet on a prim? XD
[13:50]	Arawn Spitteler:	/me wonder is Textbox is implementable
[13:50]	Torley Linden:	Having webkit also means that when using the in-Viewer web browser to look at wiki.secondlife.com and other sites, embedded Flash video will work. At last. YESSSS.
[13:50]	Tensai Hilra:	okay, is there an api or other set that we can use to pass data to the scripts, etc? and on that note, without revealing too much about the viewer?
[13:50]	Neroelite Braun:	shouts: bug triage office hours starts in ten minutes will you lindens be tehre too?
[13:50]	Torley Linden:	Laurent, you sent it to your email address?
[13:50]	Laurent Bechir:	yes
[13:50]	Carl Linden:	If you were to load a region-restricted video on YouTube, only people from that region would be able to see the video.
[13:50]	Winter Ventura:	Torley, the issue was intermittent and seemed to have no OS or video card relevance, I'm thinking it might have been some kind of connection issue or asset server issue)
[13:50]	Carl Linden:	Others would see a "this video can't be displayed in your region" message.
[13:50]	Arawn Spitteler:	Kate and Torley have little Lindens to attend Triage on their behalf
[13:51]	Tensai Hilra:	my thing would be, me checking email on a prim, and not having someone cam over to me and read my data
[13:51]	Neroelite Braun:	Torley i loaded that web page for you :)
[13:51]	Nathan Adored:	little Lindesns.... izzat sorta like little Indians?
[13:51]	Tensai Hilra:	i've considered, and succeeded in using logmein to remote pc's via a prim sofar
[13:51]	Elite Runner:	Who's controling the mediaprim?
[13:51]	Carl Linden:	Lol, rogaine
[13:51]	Carl Linden:	Elite: anyone can control the media prim right now.
[13:51]	Jorge Erin:	:)
[13:51]	Carl Linden:	...maybe i shouldn't have mentioned that...
[13:52]	Wut Moorlord:	Tensai: :D
[13:52]	Niky Zenovka:	So the requesting IP will be the resident's IP not the Linden servers IP? @Carl
[13:52]	Carl Linden:	Oh man, did you guys hear that YouTube took down the original RickRoll'd video?!?!
[13:52]	Neroelite Braun:	nnnnnoooooooo
[13:52]	Carl Linden:	it's only available on Rick Astley's official channel now...
[13:52]	Neroelite Braun:	please!
[13:52]	Carl Linden:	...and a few other hundred videos.
[13:52]	Neroelite Braun:	Carl hold an SL funeral
[13:52]	Multi Gadget	HUD Lite v4.0.12: /me by Timeless Prototype
[13:52]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	Javascript? Is it ISO/IEC 16262 compliant?
[13:52]	Torley Linden:	What an indignity to a meme!
[13:52]	Carl Linden:	WolfBaginski: it uses Qt's javascript interpreter.
[13:52]	Allison Widdershins:	memecide
[13:53]	Torley Linden:	First time I heard that portmanteau but I kinda like it, Allison!
[13:53]	Tensai Hilra:	one thing I've started is loading seperate environments into VirtualBox machines, then logmeining to them via terminals in my 'lab'
[13:53]	Winter Ventura:	oh also interesting "tip" here.. when you create a web prim, whatever was on that face before you placed media there, will still be visible to people with shared media disabled or in older viewers.. so UNLIKE the land media screens which use a special texture, this new system will still show plywood or whatever texture you applied
[13:53]	Allison Widdershins:	it's all plywood to me
[13:53]	lonetorus Habilis:	carl, i suppose he wants to cash in on the rick rollin, though im not sure there is much cash to be had directly from the anon/*chan crowd
[13:53]	Wut Moorlord:	WolfBaginski: it'll be ECMA262 revision 3 compliant, since it's basically the same javascript engine in chrome/safari
[13:53]	Torley Linden:	Maybe some of those placeholder textures should call out "Can't see this awesomeness? Upgrade to Viewer 2!"
[13:54]	Winter Ventura:	so it might be handy to have a texture that says "please enable shared media to view this" applied on any face you're gonna use media
[13:54]	bigjay Loon:	lol
[13:54]	Tensai Hilra:	good point ventura, is there any plans to 'back-port any web functionality into the pre 2.0 viewers? or is that too much work?
[13:54]	Torley Linden:	GMTA, Winter... ;D
[13:54]	Neroelite Braun:	shouts: Please install a feature that tells who teh last person to interact with the media prim is. That way we know when someone is doing somethign they shouldn't
[13:54]	Kate Linden:	haha Torley
[13:54]	Torley Linden:	shouts: OH MY GOSH SHOUTYNESS IS BOLD LOL
[13:54]	Winter Ventura:	(we used to do the same for the media texture on tv's and movie screens)
[13:54]	lonetorus Habilis:	nero, no, you will only know who was the last to use it
[13:54]	Arawn Spitteler:	I'd expect a change of shared media to be an edit of a prim
[13:54]	Carl Linden:	WolfBaginski: I actually don't know which JS interpreter/compiler our QtWebkit implementation uses. But I would assume it's JavaScriptCore
[13:54]	Winter Ventura:	Oh hey, where did "whisper" and "shout" go?
[13:54]	Torley Linden:	Winter, I had a similar experience, I made a texture called "ON YES PLAY" to show how to use parcel media... ahhh...
[13:55]	Carl Linden:	which means... if it's ISO compliant in Safari/Chrome, then it's ISO compliant here.
[13:55]	Winter Ventura:	(or does Linden Lab not want us whispering and or shouting anymore?)
[13:55]	Kate Linden:	Have you guys enabled the LM coordinates in your nav bar?
[13:55]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	shouts: shout test!
[13:55]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	Yeah, well, Chrome stopped working with the forum upgrade. I really hope you test Viewer 2 web handling with your own website.
[13:55]	Jeremy Linden:	shouts: Testing shouting in Viewer 2...
[13:55]	Arawn Spitteler:	/me whispers: Just use /me whispers: or /me shouts: and chat normally
[13:55]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	lol
[13:55]	Jeremy Linden:	Well, ctrl+enter still shouts :-)
[13:56]	Winter Ventura:	I enabled it.. I think the "about this land" icons (no script, no push, whatever) really should be enabled by default tho
[13:56]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	is there a shortcut for shisper?
[13:56]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	whisper*
[13:56]	Kate Linden:	They are also listed in the Places Profile
[13:56]	Jeremy Linden:	I'm not sure I know the keyboard shortcut for whispering, actually :-O
[13:56]	Gnome Inkpen:	Shit + Enter = Whisper. WRITE?
[13:56]	Kate Linden:	lots of good info about a parcel there
[13:56]	Gnome Inkpen:	OOP!
[13:56]	Gnome Inkpen:	Shift*
[13:56]	Torley Linden:	One problem we already foresee is people trying to rez stuff on no-build land... like new shoppers who just bought something from Xstreet. Plus, the error message doesn't link to our help page yet. It should. I gotta report that.
[13:57]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	whisper test (nope)
[13:57]	Wut Moorlord:	Gnome: remind me not to let you near my keyboard :)
[13:57]	Carl Linden:	I just made this media prim "Full Bright" - make sure you do that on your own prims or else the web will be affected by lighting...
[13:57]	Winter Ventura:	And uhm.. the minimap is opaque.
[13:57]	Gnome Inkpen:	Sowwie! :P
[13:57]	Jeremy Linden:	Uh oh, it looks like Carl is getting absorbed by the fake Jon.
[13:57]	Torley Linden:	lonetorus, it's been a long time since I ventured into Infocom.
[13:57]	Tensai Hilra:	oh hehe, BTW, if you put a media page on a HUD prim, then click on it, your viewer tends to try and zoom in on it perpetually... it's an interesting glitch
[13:57]	lonetorus Habilis:	infocom, blah
[13:58]	lonetorus Habilis:	or did they make cave adventrure
[13:58]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	Torley, it's easy to forget to change to the correct group for building on group land. You need to get those error messages working properly.
[13:58]	Torley Linden:	lonetorus, they did Zork, which was influenced...
[13:58]	lonetorus Habilis:	i only ever played nethack
[13:58]	Carl Linden:	oh man, media on HUDs. i think we're working on HUDs a lot right now for before the release.
[13:58]	Kate Linden:	Did you uncheck the Zoom option?
[13:58]	Wut Moorlord:	lonetorus, they made zork and such with grues, cave adventure was way back when
[13:58]	Carl Linden:	People have been filing reports about missing HUDs and things like that.
[13:58]	Elite Runner:	take a lok at the mediaprim now!
[13:58]	Tensai Hilra:	good good, and what about shared and SYNCHED media?
[13:58]	Torley Linden:	Nice to know we have some other old-skool gamers in the midst!
[13:58]	Elite Runner:	Meeps!
[13:59]	Carl Linden:	tensai: that would require running WebKit server-side.
[13:59]	Winter Ventura:	yeah there's something weirdish going on with "hud drift" and it relates to the right-tray, I just haven't been able to put my finger on what is causing it to happen, but sometimes my huds end up off the screen.
[13:59]	lonetorus Habilis:	i belive nethack was ported to sl
[13:59]	Carl Linden:	That's a bit ambitious for what we're doing...
[13:59]	Tensai Hilra:	true or a skip ahead funtion in streams
[13:59]	lonetorus Habilis:	as a prim/lsl game
[13:59]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	lonetorus, "The graphics are better in ASCII" scans to the tune of "My Bonny..."
[13:59]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	the screen size is shrinking when the side bars are open
[13:59]	Wut Moorlord:	lone: hmm, i think liandra was working on something like that
[13:59]	CPU Core:	media on HUDs would be great.. only problem is the UI eats so much space there is no room for the huds they get buried
[13:59]	Wut Moorlord:	or some equal retro thingie
[13:59]	lonetorus Habilis:	yeh
[14:00]	Tensai Hilra:	it's okay, I can probably link it through flash into a server control
[14:00]	Time Minder:	You have been online for 1 hours.
[14:00]	Kate Linden:	I was playing with thincbooks the other day which can be read as a HUD. I loaded URLs on the book pages. The book didn't recognize the pages without graphics. I left off there, but I think if I toss some images onto the book to create pages, I can get media HUD working.
[14:00]	lonetorus Habilis:	ascii is still king, but some polygons are nice too
[14:00]	Niky Zenovka:	Got to go... nice chat everyone (though I will have to re-read.... got lost on the chatlines..... very fast... lol)
[14:00]	Torley Linden:	You can also hide some things... right-click the top bar or bottom bar, you can hide the navigation and location bar... and some buttons...
[14:00]	lonetorus Habilis:	now when can we haz AAlib renderng in client?
[14:00]	Wut Moorlord:	we could write AAlib in javascript
[14:00]	Winter Ventura:	oh I was messing around with shared media, and I've been having problems making a nonsquare media window. Is there a trick to doing that? if I make a 3x4 window, it seems that it just stretches the displayed page
[14:00]	Wut Moorlord:	and put it on a side with media on a prim xD
[14:00]	Entrepreneur Mistwood:	Thanks for all the great info :)
[14:01]	Neroelite Braun:	videos and sound are off balance :/ limp bizket is making noise before their lips move
[14:01]	Carl Linden:	You cn hide navigation and location. Helpful for those who want more space - but you can't see the location without it.
[14:01]	Carl Linden:	Search bar also goes away - so if you've hidden the navigation bar, access search via Ctrl+F
[14:01]	WolfBaginski Bearsfoot:	/me collapses into helpless giggling.
[14:01]	Torley Linden:	In "the old 1.23 days" I sometimes just hid the whole UI to get more immersion for sights. I know doing that doesn't entirely work in Viewer 2. We're aware (esp. from passionate machinimatographers).
[14:01]	Torley Linden:	(aka Ctrl-Alt-F1)
[14:02]	Timeless Prototype:	/me is missing Ctrl T
[14:02]	Tensai Hilra:	ah, yea, that'll need to be worked out
[14:02]	Winter Ventura:	(what did ctrl T do?
[14:02]	Torley Linden:	Timeless, I was so used to that too... it was like a phantom limb for me.
[14:02]	CPU Core:	the new UI needs a lot of improving
[14:02]	Timeless Prototype:	brought up conversations window
[14:02]	Allison Widdershins:	gotta go, folks. Good seeing so many of you again
[14:02]	Torley Linden:	But again, this is a beta. And now that it's in the open, lots of churn and gel to come.
[14:02]	Winter Ventura:	(mine was always open, so lol
[14:02]	Kate Linden:	Thanks for joining us Allison!
[14:03]	Tensai Hilra:	course, a proper editor knows to overshoot a frame *smiles*
[14:03]	Torley Linden:	I've got to go too, it's been f un doing our first Viewer 2-focused office hour! Thanks each & all for being with us Lindeny peeps.
[14:03]	Carl Linden:	Specific suggestions about the UI are highly appreciated via Jira.
[14:03]	Allison Widdershins:	learned a lot
[14:03]	Arawn Spitteler:	<ctrl>t for Talk

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